Basically a keranos deck that wants him active, haven't played with it too much yet but it's fun. It has a midrangey angle that controls the board with my own presence with jace, keranos, and specter generating card advantage on their own
Standard/watered down version of cruel control, gameplan is to play a draw-go game with dictate of kruphix and then penalize the opponent for drawing cards with Brain Maggot, Fate Unraveler, and Rakdos's return. Opportunity can force the opponent to take damage for lethal with unravelers in play. My own creatures also survive Extinguish all Hope, while unraveler attacks the revelation decks/mbd meta.
Really just trying to find some synergy/tech for grixis and good reason for going grixis over esper or mbd, the main reasons being a form of synergy unique to these colors. Now that we can't complain (as much) about mana requirements as well as some new additions to our card pool, it's going to be fun to brainstorm again
I actually had a similar idea to your second list because of dictate. It would be like running that draw punishing Grixis EDH deck. The list I threw together went a little hard on the strategy. Ran 4 fate unraveler, 3 dakra mystic, 4 dictates, but instead of running simply hand attacking cards like thoughtsieze, maggot, or rakdos return(I thought running these with dictate/dakra may be counterintuitive), I am running cards that would punish the opponent for having a full hand. Reap intellect and toil trouble seem devestating against a full hand. I think I also ran a couple stormbreath for change of pace and further hand punishment.
Optimal plays would be eot rift into reap or toil trouble. Or finishing an opponent by having a fate unraveler out and castin toil and trouble against a full hand. Could take an opponent from double digits to 0. Other than combo pieces the deck would run removal for threats, with the objective being a burnout. It did manage to beat a matchup with mono b... So maybe at the least it could be a fun fnm deck. Seems like it would lose to R/W burn pretty easily. Regardless, other support cards could include opportunity, keranos, lightining strike, mogis, or master of the feast. Seems like the kind of deck to want to tap out.
Another card to use in conjunction with Fate Unraveler would be Master of the Feast.
I really like the ideas of those decks. I am also experimenting with a more midrangy grixis build. Using 2 Keranos, 1 Purphoros, 1 Thassa and supporting them with Frostburn Weirds, Ral Zarek, Chandra, Hammer of Purphoros, Stormbreath Dragon... ect.
I've won most games with Keranos; by his triggers and by attacking in with him. I've also won a few games with Purphoros as a creature.
I am interested in the Specters for their devotion to blue, but I don't really would have use for the black symbols. It kind of makes me want to play Mogis, that way I can curve T2 Weird, T3 Specter, T4 Mogis (active). With Weird and Specter you can play just about all the grixis colored gods (besides Erebos unless you play something like Connections) and have a good shot at making them creatures. I think the only thing keeping me from playing Specter is my 2 MB Anger of the Gods.
FNM went 2-2. I think problem was not having Doom Blade or Ultimate Price anywhere in my 75. I kept getting knocked around by mistcutter hydras.
Round 1 Won in 3, 1-0: R/U aggro. Was more like RDW. played a lot of cheap guys and madcap skills. Won first game easily. Just killed his creatures as they came out. Turned Keranos into a creature and bashed in for the win. Second game he got me with a creature with madcap skills, I didn't draw any removal for it and died. Game 3 went similar to game 2.
Round 2 Loss in 3, 1-1: G/R monsters/aggro. Didn't seem like monsters exactly, was a little faster than I remember the last few G/R monster decks I've played against. Game 1 he won by running me out of removal. Game 2 I win, T3 Ashiok, T4 steal his Courser and never miss a land drop. Killed him with Ral Zarek and Keranos burn. Game 3 he draws so many mistcutter hydras and fortunately I have the answers in my hand. Got chipped away by a mutavault and mana dork. He draws into 3 Ghor-clans to bloodrush onto whatever I didn't kill or block with my weirds.
Round 3 Loss in 3, 1-2: U/G flash. Played all the flash creatures and some counter. Don't really remember all that much from the games themselves because they all lasted awhile. I just remember he always was playing either Shambleshark, Skylasher, Boon Satyr, or Horizon Chimera at the end of my turn. The game I won I remember he was low on life. I play Purphoros then follow it up next turn with 2 frostburn weirds and swing in with purphoros for the win. Lost mainly due to Skylasher and Mistcutter Hydra.
Round 4 Won in 2, 2-2: U/B mill. Easy win. He was probably going with the Phenax route, but i never saw him get played. He ran Wall of Frost so I assume it would play Phenax as well. Used Mirko Vosk, Mind Drinker. Basically I killed everything he played and won with Keranos and Ral Zarek mainly.
I do not know how I let my deck check out with no Doom Blades at all. If I had them I'm sure my matches against those green deck would have been so much better and easier.
I really liked my deck how it matched up against these other decks. Being able to at least go to 3 games against these aggressive decks without playing doom blades or ultimate prices really gives me hope that now I have them in my 75 I should do a lot better and hopefully win those match ups. I loved Keranos, he did so much work. And Purphoros really did nice job when I was able to make him a creature after playing some weirds or stormbreaths and really surprise my opponent. Thassa worked well with Keranos making sure I had a lightning bolt on top of my deck. Ral really helped out tapping stuff down so I can swing through or dealing 3 damage to anything. My deck list is posted a page or two back, but the deck I ran today was slightly different because I could not get a hold of all the U/R scry lands. I actually tried a Mana Confluence. It didn't seem that bad. I used it about 2-3 times and that was about it. Once I had enough lands I just pushed it aside so I wouldn't take anymore unnecessary damage.
Can force yourself to destroy your permanents for destroy some cards on opponent control
If you can build around it (Thassa, God of the Sea/other indestructible permanents + Lotleth Troll/other regenerate creature) can be a single side sweeper but, even in this case, the high cmc and the sorcery speed can create some problem...
I will use Drown in Sorrow instead or a mix of the two if really necessary...
Just FYI, if your going to be using Drown in Sorrow. If you have Troll out, you won't be able to regen him if Drown in Sorrow kills him because of the -2/-2 effect. He would have to have a toughness of 3 to survive Drown in Sorrow.
I vote for 0 mana confluence, or if you do you should plan to recoup the life loss in some way. It is the difference between stabilizing at one life and being dead. Also ask yourself how rough a 2 lander with 1 mana confluence is.
I played a few matches against B/G aggro/midrange? deck. I threw Mogis out there and he really didn't do much. They just would take the 2 life then swing with their dudes, then I killed their creatures and followed it up with Keranos. They ended up dying to both of the gods' triggers.
Still trying to evaluate Mana Confluence, whether or not to try out 1-2 of them.
If you're going to run bad enchant removal to feed devotion, you should look at Claustrophobia.
Currently, I've been on Br aggro, even though I enjoy control more. It's occasionally nice to finish your matches in 20 minutes and rail bird your friends for the next 30.
However, I have run into some people running Mogis in control shells, usually Dega or BR control. Here's what happens when they cast it against me:
O: "I cast Mogis, Lord of ______"
Me: "Ok, upkeep - I take 2."
Me: "I cast Mogis Maurader?"
Me: "I swing for lethal?"
*opponent scoops cards
The card does little in a control shell outside of Christmas Land.
Mogis looks so cool though. So cool that he should be required to be played.
Did Mogis do anything during any of your matches with his trigger ability?
Just curious because I am playing a 1-of Mogis, but haven't been able to play a FNM with my deck yet since I just put it together. This friday will be the test.
In the back of my mind I knew it was instants only, but during the process of trying to think of all these sweet 3-1 cmc spells I play in my deck I had forgotten to take that into consideration.
That's probably the reason why I always overlooked it because I usually stick with sorcery spells since I prefer more of a tap out build.
Poisoned- Between thoughtsieze, rakdos return, and slaughter games there are enough opportunities to get information about their hand. Opportunity suffers from the same general drawback you are calling out as does revelation.
Usually casting Rev at least gives you another turn because of the life gain. If you still die the turn after Rev, then that just means you were going to die no matter if you casted Rev or not; but at the very least it gives you another turn to stabilize. Opportunity and Firemind's Foresight can't do that since they lack the life gain. You just end up tapping out to grab some cards then die.
Like what Outcryqq said,
A high CMC spell that grabs other spells won't save me in games where I find myself losing.
Pretty much sums up Opportunity and Firemind's Foresight for me.
I'm really liking Font of Fortunes right now. Like others have mentioned you can play it T2 then keep your mana open T3 for counter and if they do nothing you sac and draw your cards. I'm play 4 of them currently. What do you guys think of the card?
I don't really know how to feel about Firemind's Foresight. If you don't know what your opponent has in his hand and you cast this, your kind of just guessing what you might need later on in the game. If your casting this in response to something they are resolving, then it might be too late.
I think in America Control this card is awesome though.
3cmc can grab Rev, Dissolve, Counterflux, Anger of the Gods...
2cmc Negate, Gainsay,...
1cmc Dispel, Quicken...
Just the thought of them being able to get Rev + counters to make sure Rev resolves is crazy.
We can grab cards like
3cmc Counterflux, Dissolve, Anger,...
2cmc Negate, Gainsay, Doom Blade, Dreadbore, Rakdos's Return,...
1cmc Dispel, Quicken, Thoughtseize....
Getting those cards don't seem too bad, though Rev is better.
Kiora does a good job at winning. When I played her in my BUG deck, getting her to ultimate was fairly easy. The key is to have enough removal/counters that you can allow you opponent 1 creature on the battlefield while protecting Kiora from burn/Hero's Downfall.
Outside of that it looks like just Aetherling, or a gang of Courser beatdown lol.
As NicolBolas said, there's just no "I win" card that turns the game in your favor once you land it. I think that is why many BUG decks seem to go a bit more midrange because with Green you do have access to some sweet creatures like Polukranos.
I do like Mutavault, but why would we need it? U/W control runs it because they are limited to finishers (Aetherling and Elspeth usually). In Grixis we have some pretty decent finishers and do not think we need to take extra damage or mess with our 3-color mana base more to accommodate Mutavault. We need our colored mana a bit more than U/W control does.
You can try it out and see how it runs, maybe you will end up liking it. It could work in the right deck, working yourself more towards two colors and ever so slightly splashing the third.
I wouldn't be worried about the Voices.. Anger or Magma Spray takes care of it. If I was against a hexproof deck I would be siding in negates, anger, ratchet bomb; or even try out Nullify. Basically you will want to counter Advent, their enchantments, and creatures; OR wipe their creatures out with Anger before they can suit them up.
Whelming Waves seems like a good idea too, but you will need a way to follow up afterwards or else you will just be in the same situation again.
Instead of Opportunity (I don't really like it because of it's high cmc) try out Font of Fortunes. I have been using it and really love it as my draw.
Suggestions for the hyper fast deck, just add more cheap removal like the ones mentioned above, along with Doom Blade for non-black creatures and Ratchet Bomb
Far/Away is really good. Try using it fused if possible. Adding more cheap removal should help. I'd recommend side boarding removal like Doom Blade since it is situational. Those are all inexpensive cards that will help your aggro match ups .
Yeah that is the hard thing is if you want that T1 Thoughtseize, it requires 14 untapped black sources. Then for T3 Anger of the Gods you need 19 red sources. These are according to Frank Karsten from Channel Fireball. You can get away with less.
That is the link, it is pretty nice to use when making mana base if you haven't read it yet.
He also has examples of decks with good mana bases so you can something to compare to.
Another card to use in conjunction with Fate Unraveler would be Master of the Feast.
I've won most games with Keranos; by his triggers and by attacking in with him. I've also won a few games with Purphoros as a creature.
I am interested in the Specters for their devotion to blue, but I don't really would have use for the black symbols. It kind of makes me want to play Mogis, that way I can curve T2 Weird, T3 Specter, T4 Mogis (active). With Weird and Specter you can play just about all the grixis colored gods (besides Erebos unless you play something like Connections) and have a good shot at making them creatures. I think the only thing keeping me from playing Specter is my 2 MB Anger of the Gods.
EDIT: including link to my deck for reference and suggestions.
http://deckstats.net/decks/15682/89541-grixis-the-true-legion-of-doom
Round 1 Won in 3, 1-0: R/U aggro. Was more like RDW. played a lot of cheap guys and madcap skills. Won first game easily. Just killed his creatures as they came out. Turned Keranos into a creature and bashed in for the win. Second game he got me with a creature with madcap skills, I didn't draw any removal for it and died. Game 3 went similar to game 2.
Round 2 Loss in 3, 1-1: G/R monsters/aggro. Didn't seem like monsters exactly, was a little faster than I remember the last few G/R monster decks I've played against. Game 1 he won by running me out of removal. Game 2 I win, T3 Ashiok, T4 steal his Courser and never miss a land drop. Killed him with Ral Zarek and Keranos burn. Game 3 he draws so many mistcutter hydras and fortunately I have the answers in my hand. Got chipped away by a mutavault and mana dork. He draws into 3 Ghor-clans to bloodrush onto whatever I didn't kill or block with my weirds.
Round 3 Loss in 3, 1-2: U/G flash. Played all the flash creatures and some counter. Don't really remember all that much from the games themselves because they all lasted awhile. I just remember he always was playing either Shambleshark, Skylasher, Boon Satyr, or Horizon Chimera at the end of my turn. The game I won I remember he was low on life. I play Purphoros then follow it up next turn with 2 frostburn weirds and swing in with purphoros for the win. Lost mainly due to Skylasher and Mistcutter Hydra.
Round 4 Won in 2, 2-2: U/B mill. Easy win. He was probably going with the Phenax route, but i never saw him get played. He ran Wall of Frost so I assume it would play Phenax as well. Used Mirko Vosk, Mind Drinker. Basically I killed everything he played and won with Keranos and Ral Zarek mainly.
I do not know how I let my deck check out with no Doom Blades at all. If I had them I'm sure my matches against those green deck would have been so much better and easier.
I really liked my deck how it matched up against these other decks. Being able to at least go to 3 games against these aggressive decks without playing doom blades or ultimate prices really gives me hope that now I have them in my 75 I should do a lot better and hopefully win those match ups. I loved Keranos, he did so much work. And Purphoros really did nice job when I was able to make him a creature after playing some weirds or stormbreaths and really surprise my opponent. Thassa worked well with Keranos making sure I had a lightning bolt on top of my deck. Ral really helped out tapping stuff down so I can swing through or dealing 3 damage to anything. My deck list is posted a page or two back, but the deck I ran today was slightly different because I could not get a hold of all the U/R scry lands. I actually tried a Mana Confluence. It didn't seem that bad. I used it about 2-3 times and that was about it. Once I had enough lands I just pushed it aside so I wouldn't take anymore unnecessary damage.
Just FYI, if your going to be using Drown in Sorrow. If you have Troll out, you won't be able to regen him if Drown in Sorrow kills him because of the -2/-2 effect. He would have to have a toughness of 3 to survive Drown in Sorrow.
Now I'm going to have nightmares, thanks. lol
Still trying to evaluate Mana Confluence, whether or not to try out 1-2 of them.
Just curious because I am playing a 1-of Mogis, but haven't been able to play a FNM with my deck yet since I just put it together. This friday will be the test.
Whoops! lol.
In the back of my mind I knew it was instants only, but during the process of trying to think of all these sweet 3-1 cmc spells I play in my deck I had forgotten to take that into consideration.
That's probably the reason why I always overlooked it because I usually stick with sorcery spells since I prefer more of a tap out build.
Usually casting Rev at least gives you another turn because of the life gain. If you still die the turn after Rev, then that just means you were going to die no matter if you casted Rev or not; but at the very least it gives you another turn to stabilize. Opportunity and Firemind's Foresight can't do that since they lack the life gain. You just end up tapping out to grab some cards then die.
Like what Outcryqq said, Pretty much sums up Opportunity and Firemind's Foresight for me.
I'm really liking Font of Fortunes right now. Like others have mentioned you can play it T2 then keep your mana open T3 for counter and if they do nothing you sac and draw your cards. I'm play 4 of them currently. What do you guys think of the card?
I think in America Control this card is awesome though.
3cmc can grab Rev, Dissolve, Counterflux, Anger of the Gods...
2cmc Negate, Gainsay,...
1cmc Dispel, Quicken...
Just the thought of them being able to get Rev + counters to make sure Rev resolves is crazy.
We can grab cards like
3cmc Counterflux, Dissolve, Anger,...
2cmc Negate, Gainsay, Doom Blade, Dreadbore, Rakdos's Return,...
1cmc Dispel, Quicken, Thoughtseize....
Getting those cards don't seem too bad, though Rev is better.
Outside of that it looks like just Aetherling, or a gang of Courser beatdown lol.
As NicolBolas said, there's just no "I win" card that turns the game in your favor once you land it. I think that is why many BUG decks seem to go a bit more midrange because with Green you do have access to some sweet creatures like Polukranos.
You can try it out and see how it runs, maybe you will end up liking it. It could work in the right deck, working yourself more towards two colors and ever so slightly splashing the third.
Whelming Waves seems like a good idea too, but you will need a way to follow up afterwards or else you will just be in the same situation again.
Far/Away is really good. Try using it fused if possible. Adding more cheap removal should help. I'd recommend side boarding removal like Doom Blade since it is situational. Those are all inexpensive cards that will help your aggro match ups .
Also with your mana base, it might need some configuring. Use this for guidance.
http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/frank-analysis-how-many-colored-mana-sources-do-you-need-to-consistently-cast-your-spells/
http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/frank-analysis-how-many-colored-mana-sources-do-you-need-to-consistently-cast-your-spells/
That is the link, it is pretty nice to use when making mana base if you haven't read it yet.
He also has examples of decks with good mana bases so you can something to compare to.