I do agree on Mox Opal, it seems likely to be far too warping on the deck to be worth trying to support. The only point in it's favor I could see would be that something like Phyrexian Reclamation + Ornithopter could be run as a way to maintain the lock, but that's not much.
My current attempt at running Life would probably end up something like this:
Basically, I replaced the Chrome Moxes with Mox Diamonds, replaced the Inquisitions with Barren Moors, and threw in Life and Revoker for the Hymns. I don't really have much experience with Life, so I don't know if running more than two would be the better path to take.
Edit: Also, what are people's thoughts on sideboards atm? Obviously, in the example I listed I'd run the remaining two revokers in the side, but beyond that I'm not sure.
No, it would not go to the graveyard. If the equip ability fizzles, it simply means that the ability does not resolve. Nothing changes on the board, and if the equipment was already on a creature, it remains equipped to that creature.
I think figuring out the two color version first might be more effective, though I admit the extra removal/tutors could be useful. I feel like the more colors you add, the more likely you are to get screwed by your own contamination, if someone blows up your mox (of whatever stripe) or revokes it or whatever. And my main concern with Life from the Loam, even though I did suggest it, is that it doesn't exactly always synergize well with Deathrite, especially since we've got no way of ensuring that our opponents lands hit the graveyard.
With Revoker, the more I think about it, the more I like it. It might just be Death and Taxes talking, but I like the ability to shut off our opponents possible outs as they come up. I do think Mox Diamond might not be a terrible idea, but again, we'd have to up the land count to match, which might weaken our overall gameplan.
Yeah, Contamination's effect would override the newly granted ability of Riftstone Portal. Basically, Riftstone would grant the new ability, and then contamination would come in if you actually activated it, and say "nope, you only get B." If contamination was like blood moon and actually turned them into swamps, it'd be a different story.
Speaking of Riftstone and Mox Diamond, however, reminded me of another possible card advantage card... Life from the Loam. Could provide another way of consistently turning on bloodghast, too. However, it'd probably require a bit of a rehaul, as we don't really have enough lands to run it right now, I think. If you wanted to go that route, however, Raven's Crime could be a nice way to turn those extra lands into trouble for your opponent, and replacing Inquisition with a slightly weaker, but more repeatable effect.
Anyways, atm I assume we don't run Mox Diamond because of the low land count. Also, if we put revoker in, it'd be nice to be able to hit opposing moxes with it without turning off our own, and Mox Diamond is more commonly seen, at least for me.
Again, similarly to the thing with Stasis, at least to me, the difference lies in intention. No one throws MLD into a deck because it's a big splashy effect on a body, they throw it in because they want to blow up people's lands, and either annoy people or win the game. I have no problem with that idea, but the principle behind banning Iona would be more one of "this card causes people to hate themselves for playing with it" more than "it's too powerful of an effect to lock someone out of the game". It wouldn't be practical to ban all the ways of locking someone out of the game, but we can at least cut down on the number of 'accidental' lockouts.
I think the biggest distinction between Iona and Stasis effects is that when you put a Stasis in an EDH deck, you know exactly what you're doing to other people's games, and are okay with that. On the other hand, many players put Iona into their EDH decks because she's a giant angel that seems perfect for the format... only to realize during games that she makes for unfun gameplay for them much later. The point is that for many less experienced players, she's a trap, as Jivan was pointing out.
My suggestion would be to see how he feels about earthquake type effects. Those can usually be picked up on somewhat of a budget, and can help him figure out how good symmetrical damage effects are with Gisela.
I think a large part of the 'problem' with Sylvan Primordial has to do with play-styles more than anything having to do with power level. Namely, it encourages people who like to ramp to also be a dick (For clarification, this is referring to metas where LD for the sake of LD is discouraged), since it forces a destruction for each player, rather than allowing a choice.
Normally, this isn't a huge problem, as there's enough permanents to go around late game, but when someone ramps into it third turn, it leaves a bad taste in some people's mouths. And those are the games that stick out, not the one where it came down turn 15 and blew up that one really annoying enchantment, one of your equipment that you're sad to see go, but totally understand blowing up, and the fourth guy's utility land that was getting way too much value.
Basically, you tend to remember the worst case, not the normal one, so it seems more powerful/more dickish in people's memories than it might be in playing normally. At least, that's my thoughts.
I disagree on Death Cloud. Yes, at 3 mana it doesn't do anything, but that's like saying Mind Twist doesn't do anything if you cast it for one, so therefore it's terrible. Instead, I'd compare Death Cloud at X=1 to Fleshbag Marauder. For one extra mana, you get: 3 cards out of hand, 3 lands sac'd, and the ability to scale enough that with all the mana rocks in the list, you end up practically Armageddoning, with the added benefit of stripping their hands, so they can't just hold onto lands to rebuild.
I will admit, it helps that I've been playing this particular deck for several years, so my local meta knows approximately the power level of my Ghave deck, which is on the high end for one group, but not "must target with everybody" level, while probably middling to low in the other. While I don't quite get to claim there's no infinite combos (off the top of my head, the main ones are Mikaeus, the Unhallowed+Vish Kal, the Blood Arbiter, either by themselves for infinite creature wipe, or with a persist creature for infinite whatever the persist dude does, and a giant Vish Kal, and Yosei, the Morning Star+Nim Deathmantle+Sac Outlet+Tons of mana), I can say that none involve Ghave, and he's just there for the synergies.
My current attempt at running Life would probably end up something like this:
2 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Life from the Loam
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Dark Confidant
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Bloodghast
3 Bitterblossom
3 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Contamination
3 Mox Diamond
2 Ghost Town
1 Undiscovered Paradise
4 Bayou
2 Forest
2 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Windswept Heath
2 Polluted Delta
Basically, I replaced the Chrome Moxes with Mox Diamonds, replaced the Inquisitions with Barren Moors, and threw in Life and Revoker for the Hymns. I don't really have much experience with Life, so I don't know if running more than two would be the better path to take.
Edit: Also, what are people's thoughts on sideboards atm? Obviously, in the example I listed I'd run the remaining two revokers in the side, but beyond that I'm not sure.
With Revoker, the more I think about it, the more I like it. It might just be Death and Taxes talking, but I like the ability to shut off our opponents possible outs as they come up. I do think Mox Diamond might not be a terrible idea, but again, we'd have to up the land count to match, which might weaken our overall gameplan.
Speaking of Riftstone and Mox Diamond, however, reminded me of another possible card advantage card... Life from the Loam. Could provide another way of consistently turning on bloodghast, too. However, it'd probably require a bit of a rehaul, as we don't really have enough lands to run it right now, I think. If you wanted to go that route, however, Raven's Crime could be a nice way to turn those extra lands into trouble for your opponent, and replacing Inquisition with a slightly weaker, but more repeatable effect.
Anyways, atm I assume we don't run Mox Diamond because of the low land count. Also, if we put revoker in, it'd be nice to be able to hit opposing moxes with it without turning off our own, and Mox Diamond is more commonly seen, at least for me.
Twenty times.
Normally, this isn't a huge problem, as there's enough permanents to go around late game, but when someone ramps into it third turn, it leaves a bad taste in some people's mouths. And those are the games that stick out, not the one where it came down turn 15 and blew up that one really annoying enchantment, one of your equipment that you're sad to see go, but totally understand blowing up, and the fourth guy's utility land that was getting way too much value.
Basically, you tend to remember the worst case, not the normal one, so it seems more powerful/more dickish in people's memories than it might be in playing normally. At least, that's my thoughts.
- Mycoloth
- Martyr's Bond
- Reaper from the Abyss
- Vault of the Archangel
- Plains
+ Day of Judgment
+ Living Death
+ Life from the Loam
+ Tranquil Thicket
+ Barren Moor
Plus, I have a trustworthy face.