Would Laboratory Maniac be something to consider with Gitrog toad? It has the noted con of making you soft(er) to removal (most notably Bolt, Dismember, Decay) but can potentially allow you to go off and win at instant speed and can be searched with Traverse the Ulvenwald.
One thing I never got with the "power level will approach Legacy levels" argument is people seem to assume that Legacy itself would stay stagnant rather than rise in power as well. Legacy isn't just a fixed point on some scale, with Modern being variable; when something powerful is printed that makes its way to Legacy, Legacy's power level will increase; if something powerful gets printed that interacts with something legal in Legacy but not in other formats, Legacy's power level will increase; when something powerful is printed that makes its way into Modern and Legacy, both formats will increase.
The argument is not about the meta, its about the power of the decks. When there is a 60%+ port of cards from Legacy into Modern, that is an issue. If Wotc keeps the power level the same or at the 60% rate, how long before Modern has to have FOW or other Legacy policing cards?
Um...I don't really care I guess? I just want to play a fun format that I can almost kind of afford.
Also, if Modern is 60% Legacy's power level (is this number a real thing? I'm not going to read this whole thread) isn't that fine? What is the 'acceptable' Modern/Legacy power ratio?
50%? 10%? Just make it Standard with more cards?
TheNoob posted a few pages back a number of decks that share at least 60% of cards between comparabledecks in Modern and Legacy except for blue decks. Some feel that blue needs to be boosted to match the other percentages, I believe the other decks need to be lowered to the blue percentages.
As for your question, the format should not be able to port Standard decks into Modern and be competitive. On the same hand, I am not sure what percentage is the correct percentage, but 60% share between like competitive decks between Modern and Legacy is not good.
Again, its not a meta thing.
There is another solution Wotc could put into action, remove Legacy from the equation all together. Then Modern would be the top of the heap and nothing to base against. Power levels should rise naturally.
And that fixes what, exactly? You remove Legacy (piss off a whole 'nother sect of people) and then keep Modern legal cards from 8th edition to the current set? This *forces* the Legacy players to go to Vintage, Modern, or liquidate whatever they have and go to Standard, or some other format. That's even considering they would continue to play the game at all.
This makes absolutely no sense; you can't be serious. The mixing of cards within the formats is not a detriment to the game, but one of its beauties.
If they want to keep Goyf at Mythic, they'd have to release MM annually, rather than the biannual trend they're attempting to set, to create any significant or lasting reduction in its price. The "off" year allows too much time for growth and demand to outstrip supply leading to a terrible spike in price. It will be around $250 very soon, and may even go higher...
What would people feel like if nothing got unbanned? I wouldn't be surprised if Bloom takes a hit, but I'm more inclined to believe that Wizards will take the ultra conservative route and not unban anything. I say this because the last B&R change happened not too long ago, and they may feel that because Bloom is the only current offender of their perception of what the format should be, only that should be the change. Look at them last time; they unbanned GGT, but only because I'm sure they figured it would do little, if anything to change the format.
I don't know, I think they (Wizards) are trying really hard to make Modern succeed, but in the process are coddling it far too much and the invisible guiding hand is more like a vicegrip on the format.
P.S. I realize this isn't the B&R discussion, but it's been going on for the last few pages so I thought I'd post. If it needs to be changed or moved, I'd be sure to do so.
We will repeat t1 win isn't t1 kill. People scooping is their own doing. T1 kill requires; simian spirit guide, amulet, summer bloom, hive mind, green pact and bounce land... or simian spirit guide x2, amulet x2, summer bloom, bounce land and titan/green pact... that is some really magical hands.
Ok, that's well and good, but can you allow that a t1 permanent (i.e. doesn't go away at end of turn) titan is something degenerate? And it was on the play no less.
and @KTK
Yeah, I understand where you're coming from, but I believe their last Blue scare will keep them away from Ancestral Visions. I hope I'm wrong, but I fear they will see U: Draw 3 and think to themselves too soon. Sword of the Meek would be another good corner to look at, but if they like a thriving aggro portion of the metagame, they may, again, be put off by ThopterSword. I feel they will still want to play it conservatively and have a good few months where a break out deck doesn't do anything, and then re-evaluate.
I admit, these last round of changes have got me feeling quite pessimistic. I'm just not hopeful, unfortunately.
I'm sure Wizards feels the pressure to act, but that pressure could very well lead them to a no unban decision, just as well as it could lead them to one where they unban something. I hope they're not too scared of acting (and possibly getting it wrong) that the only thing that we see change next month is a ban from Amulet.
We will repeat t1 win isn't t1 kill. People scooping is their own doing. T1 kill requires; simian spirit guide, amulet, summer bloom, hive mind, green pact and bounce land... or simian spirit guide x2, amulet x2, summer bloom, bounce land and titan/green pact... that is some really magical hands.
Ok, that's well and good, but can you allow that a t1 permanent (i.e. doesn't go away at end of turn) titan is something degenerate? And it was on the play no less.
and @KTK
Yeah, I understand where you're coming from, but I believe their last Blue scare will keep them away from Ancestral Visions. I hope I'm wrong, but I fear they will see U: Draw 3 and think to themselves too soon. Sword of the Meek would be another good corner to look at, but if they like a thriving aggro portion of the metagame, they may, again, be put off by ThopterSword. I feel they will still want to play it conservatively and have a good few months where a break out deck doesn't do anything, and then re-evaluate.
I admit, these last round of changes have got me feeling quite pessimistic. I'm just not hopeful, unfortunately.
What would people feel like if nothing got unbanned? I wouldn't be surprised if Bloom takes a hit, but I'm more inclined to believe that Wizards will take the ultra conservative route and not unban anything. I say this because the last B&R change happened not too long ago, and they may feel that because Bloom is the only current offender of their perception of what the format should be, only that should be the change. Look at them last time; they unbanned GGT, but only because I'm sure they figured it would do little, if anything to change the format.
I don't know, I think they (Wizards) are trying really hard to make Modern succeed, but in the process are coddling it far too much and the invisible guiding hand is more like a vicegrip on the format.
P.S. I realize this isn't the B&R discussion, but it's been going on for the last few pages so I thought I'd post. If it needs to be changed or moved, I'd be sure to do so.
So I get that the banlist update is Monday but anyone have what time it will happen?
From the OP:
Next B&R Announcement:
January 19, 2015 - 11:00 AM EST
Anyway, wow, this thread has been moving insanely fast--too fast for me to keep up. Kudos to you all arguing fervently (on both anti- and pro- ban sides). Monday's going to be something.
"SO super exciting."
"This Eldrazi deck is so sweet!"
Commentators more of a broken record than Rubio was in the debate last night.
Drowned his hopes.
And that fixes what, exactly? You remove Legacy (piss off a whole 'nother sect of people) and then keep Modern legal cards from 8th edition to the current set? This *forces* the Legacy players to go to Vintage, Modern, or liquidate whatever they have and go to Standard, or some other format. That's even considering they would continue to play the game at all.
This makes absolutely no sense; you can't be serious. The mixing of cards within the formats is not a detriment to the game, but one of its beauties.
Have you got a list? I haven't been keeping up on things for the past month or so...
I'm sure Wizards feels the pressure to act, but that pressure could very well lead them to a no unban decision, just as well as it could lead them to one where they unban something. I hope they're not too scared of acting (and possibly getting it wrong) that the only thing that we see change next month is a ban from Amulet.
Ok, that's well and good, but can you allow that a t1 permanent (i.e. doesn't go away at end of turn) titan is something degenerate? And it was on the play no less.
and @KTK
Yeah, I understand where you're coming from, but I believe their last Blue scare will keep them away from Ancestral Visions. I hope I'm wrong, but I fear they will see U: Draw 3 and think to themselves too soon. Sword of the Meek would be another good corner to look at, but if they like a thriving aggro portion of the metagame, they may, again, be put off by ThopterSword. I feel they will still want to play it conservatively and have a good few months where a break out deck doesn't do anything, and then re-evaluate.
I admit, these last round of changes have got me feeling quite pessimistic. I'm just not hopeful, unfortunately.
I don't know, I think they (Wizards) are trying really hard to make Modern succeed, but in the process are coddling it far too much and the invisible guiding hand is more like a vicegrip on the format.
P.S. I realize this isn't the B&R discussion, but it's been going on for the last few pages so I thought I'd post. If it needs to be changed or moved, I'd be sure to do so.
From the OP:
Next B&R Announcement:
January 19, 2015 - 11:00 AM EST
Anyway, wow, this thread has been moving insanely fast--too fast for me to keep up. Kudos to you all arguing fervently (on both anti- and pro- ban sides). Monday's going to be something.