MTG Salvation

Quote from mapccu »

I honestly think GSZ is fine for the format. At 4 mana I would almost always rather cast a coco to get more value unless I'm digging for a sideboard card. The thing is the format doesn't have many "silver bullets" but it has speed bumps. Kataki isn't an auto scoop for affinity, dredge has tons of removal for all sorts of GY interaction (ravenous trap on the stack, rip is an enchantment, relic is an artifact, yixid jailer is a creature - dredge can beat ALL of them post board), tron can still cast spells even with a bloodmoon out. Boggles doesn't scoop to lili. Yeah sometimes you lose the game before you loosen the lock piece holding down your plan, but they aren't auto hardlocks unless you choose to ignore sideboards all together.

So what if GSZ ramps you. There are a handful of decks that would even care about that anyway. As a creature tutor it's powerful, but it's only green creatures.

As for pod, while I agree it does get progressively better, I tend to feel like people overevaluate strategy hosing cards. It does get better with every creature printed, but doesn't Jace get better as more control cards get printed? Why is this an argument for pod being banned but not for unbanning Jace? The issue with Jace is if a handful of cards like search for azcanta pop up, Jace CAN be very difficult to play against and he CAN be oppressive. He isn't now, I agree, but I don't think it'll be that way forever. If a control deck is able to create a scenario that is similar to the vaccum example, Jace is better then almost any other 4 drop in the format.

Quote from Dressedspring1 »

Ah yes, I'm sure people would have played UR Pyromancer or Kiki Combo in blue if only those cards had been printed when Twin was still legal...

Quote from Spsiegel1987 »

Ugh, I have to roll my eyes when people say k command would be enough to answer it

No, no it wouldn't. Pod was banned at the top of its peak, multiple gp wins, 20 percent meta shares

Every creature deck would become pod, it's laughable that company was even compared to this card. This is multiple uses with all upside and no rng. Silver bullets aren't reduced to just 3 mana or less. Multiple combo pieces and value.

This card would singlehandedly destroy every form of zoo, company, gbx deck. It'd get so bad people would root for tron to be tier 1.


Still a hard no on gsz, it's amazing at every turn, and it poses a risk to being too powerful for combo decks.


Sfm feels like the only realistic unban now. Suggestions like twin and dig through time are a joke

Quote from tronix »

pod is just dangerous because of its continuous use. which means that the majority of the deck consists of silver bullets to answer/invalidate any strategy they choose.

one-and-done tutors are fine because it places a burden on the player to make the best use of a limited resource.

GSZ is a plausible unban because it is sorcery speed and can only hit green creatures, so their is a ceiling on what you can accomplish with it.

Quote from Colt47 »

Quote from stonecrowe »

After the standard challenger deck lists, I was actually pretty happy and hopeful that WotC had turned the corner... until this utter garbage fire of a set was spoiled.

Now i'm back to my usual tired scepticism of them as a company.

To me they look like a failing company. I've got more faith in the force of will company than Wizards of the Coast.

Quote from SherriMayim »

Quote from axman »

Quote from methionine »

Imagine opening your box and finding your mythic is Tree of Redemption. Haha. Sad.

Not as bad as opening up original MMA and only finding dragons

Yeah but you had...

Cryptic Command, Pact of Negation, Doubling Season, Aether Vial, Engineered Explosives, Arcbound Ravager, Chalice of the Void, Tooth and Nail, Kira, and Blinkmoth Nexus held on for pack value, which at the time was 6.99$ MSRP

And... Path to Exile, Lightning Helix, Lava Spike, Eternal Witness, and Spell Snare, which even weeks after their printing maintained a 3-7$ price tag.

So while a box was around 160 to 180, you could recoup your investment pretty easy, and the set also provided TONS of playable cards.

Quote from Silver_Spellthief »

Quote from axman »

Quote from Silver_Spellthief »

Quote from axman »

I am not sure why people are so upset about 10$ premium pack.
It helps keep it from becoming another "Chronicals".

Honestly the thing I love about these "premium sets" is the draftability. It's like playing a mini-cube.
So far - it looks like it could be an insanely fun draft format.

Because no one wants to open a $10 pack to only see a bunch of chaff. If these sets were filled to the brim with value where a player would be guaranteed to get around $10 back in secondary market value, that price tag could be justified but we know that it costs just as much to print Masters packs as it does to print standard packs. This makes these sets stink of being $10 pack lotteries designed to make players hope to pull a Chalice of the Void, Imperial Recruiter or Jace the Mind Sculptor. WOTC is trying to serve two masters and it isn't working. Are these supposed to be value reprint sets or great limited environments? We've already examined how they're not doing so hot on the former and if it's the latter then why do they expect players to drop $10 on limited packs with an experience that as mostly been met with an "eh, it's okay" instead of spending $10 on Innistrad packs, a set widely thought of to be one of thr best limited environments of all time? And if the point of these sets is to offer affordable reprints to players then why are packs over double the normal price?

None of this would be as much of a problem of the packs were normally priced but at over double the normal pack msrp a lot of players do not feel like WOTC is producing a product that matches its price tag. I honestly wonder how sales of this set would look without invetsors and card stores busting hundreds of packs to sell the expensive singles.

See my first point. If packs were cheaper, they could easily become another Chronicles which would be terrible.
The whole purpose of the price point is to prevent another Chronicals. Over-printing (at cheap prices) is just as bad as not enough value.

So if they are just as bad you're telling me that these sets are already as bad chronicles because they don't contain enough value. But you're okay with this extreme but not the other?

Here's the thing, you're looking at this like the knob is only at either zero or eleven. WOTC doesn't have to print all of the best cards ever at common and sell the packs for $4 or sell packs for $10 and only include mostly chaff. They make these products and they can tune them to be reasonable for their price points. If a pack is over double the normal price of packs it should be equal to that in value and/or play experience. And that value should probably be scaled back a bit if the packs were $4. But honestly as it stands now with almost all of the value in these sets being found at mythic WOTC could sell Masters 25 for $4 a pack and I guarantee you we would not have the Chronicles effect because this set is not filled to the brim with value.

Quote from Silver_Spellthief »

Quote from axman »

I am not sure why people are so upset about 10$ premium pack.
It helps keep it from becoming another "Chronicals".

Honestly the thing I love about these "premium sets" is the draftability. It's like playing a mini-cube.
So far - it looks like it could be an insanely fun draft format.

Because no one wants to open a $10 pack to only see a bunch of chaff. If these sets were filled to the brim with value where a player would be guaranteed to get around $10 back in secondary market value, that price tag could be justified but we know that it costs just as much to print Masters packs as it does to print standard packs. This makes these sets stink of being $10 pack lotteries designed to make players hope to pull a Chalice of the Void, Imperial Recruiter or Jace the Mind Sculptor. WOTC is trying to serve two masters and it isn't working. Are these supposed to be value reprint sets or great limited environments? We've already examined how they're not doing so hot on the former and if it's the latter then why do they expect players to drop $10 on limited packs with an experience that as mostly been met with an "eh, it's okay" instead of spending $10 on Innistrad packs, a set widely thought of to be one of thr best limited environments of all time? And if the point of these sets is to offer affordable reprints to players then why are packs over double the normal price?

None of this would be as much of a problem of the packs were normally priced but at over double the normal pack msrp a lot of players do not feel like WOTC is producing a product that matches its price tag. I honestly wonder how sales of this set would look without invetsors and card stores busting hundreds of packs to sell the expensive singles.

• Adds BB to devotion without being a creature.
• Guarantees future land drops.
• Guarantees Pack Rat activations.
• Solid removal spell that can destroy gods.
• Randomly a game-ending pump spell.