MTG Salvation

I don't have much to add other than Delusions of Mediocrity and Venser, the Sojourner .
Delusions of Mediocrity is a solid way to gain 10 life if you're up against faster decks and is a great donation target as the owner is not likely to sacrifice it unlike some other cards zedruu player's inexplicably loveand if it does get destroyed then someone else loses the life. It doesn't require you to have a way to get rid of it immediately, is good on it's own, and doesn't make people angry at you but rather at the person who destroyed the enchantment.
Venser, the Sojourner is one of the few planeswalkers I think that are worth running. The important ability is the first one: Exile target permanent you own. Return it to the battlefield under your control at the beginning of the next end step. This lets you give away stuff that you might actually want back like a propaganda allowing you to play politics it also resets Parallax Wave, runed halo, copy enchantment, lets you re-use your come into play creatures, untaps a land, allows you to play aroun rule of law, and does rather nasty things with Delusions of Mediocrity. Finally since his ability is a +2 he requires a concerted effort to kill and of course his ultimate really is ultimate.

edit: Other cards worth mentioning are of course Gilded Drake and Faith's Fetters. Fist off both are abuse-able with venser. Secondly gilded drake is the strongest creature steal you can get (2 manna for a steal effect that is immune to enchantment and artifact removal? Yes, please.) and goes great with zedruu. Honestly i would never have a zedruu deck without it (okay, I lied. Mine actually doesn't have it but that's because I don't have sleeves for my zedruu deck so my gilded drake sits in my binder... Yes, I'm that cheap.). Faith's fetters is a harder call as it doesn't remove aura shards or anything else with a static or triggered ability unlike it's competition in oblivion ring, but it gains you 4 life and is great for crippling other player's generals.

Also karmic justice? they destroy all enchantments and you destroy all there lands. seems fair to me.

Oh, also great thread. It struck me the other day that I should make my zedruu into an enduring ideal deck and then I found this thread and all my prayer's were answered!

BG zombies is a bad deck because it's not very flexible and isn't fast enough to race RDW. I've had good success at FNM with Bu zombies and BR zombies is still pretty good. You just have to learn to play around rest in peace and terminus. That being said lotleth troll has been seeing play but in decks where they need the regenerating blocker and a way to ensure they get value out of unburial rites.

I think it could work well post innistrad with Hellraiser Goblin. they synergize pretty well with hellraiser having haste and granting haste to the angel and the angel clearing out blockers if necessary so Hellraiser's must attack ability doesn't ruin you. Right now it's only real place is maybey in the boros mirror but it's just nowhere near the power level of hellrider.

drop the paladin. there is just no way you can consistently drop paladin an five alarm fire. Replace it with Frontline Medic so that you can blindly swing at your opponent also it stops a bonfire blowout. Drop cleaver riots as well it's cute but 5 mana is an awful lot. Righteous charge is just bad... run Rally the Peasants if you have to run some sort of mass boost spell. While we're on the topic of bad cards Markov Blademaster is also bad. It functions as an overpriced fencing ace most of the time. If you want another 3 drop that will get counters on five alarm fire Attended Knight gives you two bodies which means it will put on just as many counters as blademaster but you get a 2/2 first striker instead of a 1/1 double striker so it's more useful for blocking. Assemble the legion is just too slow. It's good against control but it just takes too long to do anything for your deck. Boros charm is a MUST.

Quote from DarkRitual

That's what makes me want to hold back on him too. Because I'm thinking of the scenario where the opponent is at 8 and you can either play this or Aristocrat (and I mean hypothetically one or the other, not that they are both in your hand). Aristocrat is a 4/1 flying haste that has some resiliency in a deck with dudes in it. Seer is a 4/4 flying... no haste

I agree Aristocrat is a better card but their are some area's seer shines: if you're not in red but have blue mana already seer is better than trying to splash red, Seer draws you into more counter spells, removal or other tempo cards, seer doesn't die to morbid-less tragic slip or dead weight both of which are seeing more play, haste is irrelevant if your opponent is maining blind obedience. I guess what I'm saying is that in my experience the two cards play differently enough that Aristocrat isn't always an auto include over seer.

Well gatecrash changes the deck by changing the meta unfortunately we didn't really get any more toys.

Quote from RavynVT

I would run 4 Cloudshift since it is great for blinking anything with ETB, also it's nice for combat tricks. One Conjurer's Closet would be kind of cool. I would remove the Fiend Hunters and add 2 more Faithmenders. Also I know Loxodon Smiter is a really good card, but in this build I would run Centaur Healer instead.

Maybe check into Chalice of Life as an alternate wincon? Once it flips it's sooo hard to race it.

9 blink effects is too many with only 7 potential targets to get value out of.
I wouldn't get rid of the fiend hunter either because we need to be able to react to our opponents plus the 4 slot is already pretty heavy. Finally Loxodon smiter is better than Centaur healer. Healer will give you life but smiter Stone walls aggro. If you don't believe me look at the SCG Edison. Out of the top 3 midrange deck with access to green and white 2 ran smiter and 1 ran Boros Reckoner. I don't think I saw a single deck in the top 20 with a centaur healer. If a life-gain deck was the direction i was going with this I would consider it but not in this deck. Still thanks for the input and if someone did make the changes you suggested it would probably make a pretty sweet life gain deck.

I made a whole thread about a potential decklist for you on this topic right here. Go read it or i'll cry over the hour I just lost making that post.:(

A player in another part of the forum was asking about a blink token deck. This isn't quite a token deck but it makes good use of them and should be much more competitive than straight tokens. It is similar to TopiTop's list but i thought it was different enough to warrant its own thread. So without further ado I give you G/W Blink Midrange!



explanation:

Maindeck

Trostani, Selesnya's Voice- This hoses aggro with 5 thoughness and enough power to kill many of the early threats in the current meta. Late game populate gives you value off of 3/3 or larger tokens.

Loxodon Smiter- I hear red deck wins is a thing, well so is loxodon smither. 4 toughness means they have to run mizzium mortars to kill him and the 4 power lets him kill any creature rdw runs.

Rhox Faithmender- Our 4th trostani essentially. It serves the same purpose namely hosing aggro.

Thragtusk- We're running green, I think that's reason enough.

Avacyn's Pilgrim- What is there to say? It's ramp. It Lets us drop a turn 2 Smiter or turn 3 Trostani so that we can bring aggro to a swift halt.

Restoration Angel- The heart and soul of the deck. It's almost always a 2 for one if you play it right. Primary targets include Thragtusk, Armada Wurm, and fiend hunter.

Armada Wurm- This gives us 10 life with trostani and two very large bodies. It's good versus midrange.

Fiend Hunter-We need removal and Feind Hunter plays well with restoration angel. It is our only mainboard option for dealing with olivia.

Thalia, Guardian of Thraben- A good card versus aggro, tempo, bant enchantments, and slows down control. You generally drop it turn 2 if you don't have a farseek or avacyn's pilgrim so that you can get down a good blocker fast.

Farseek-It's ramp and color fixing. also it gets out turn 3 trostani.

Cloudshift-Our fifth blink effect. Saves important creatures and does dirty things when combined with fiend hunter (cast it in response to fiend hunter's enter the battlefield effect to remove one creature permanently and another until fiend hunter dies)

Selesnya Charm- It removes a lot of important threats, is a combat trick, and makes a token in a pinch.

Oblivion Ring- I have to run at least 1 of a "remove anything for 3" card mainboard.

Garruk, Primal Hunter- He makes tokens which can be populated, is great against control and generally a boss.

Gavony Township- Gavony is a great card, and allows you to keep building board presence without over extending. Too bad we have to hit GGWW consistently.

Sideboard

Knight of Glory- This doesn't die to most non red removal, cant be hit by Olivia Voldaren wand swings through vampire nighhawk and lotleth troll just a solid card.

Sigarda, Host of Herons- She swings over the top and is impossible to remove without boardwipes. Good against any deck that can't remove her.

Garruk, Primal Hunter- Garruk is needed for the control matchup. If he goes unansweed you win.

Garruk Relentless- same as the above except it fills a different mana slot.

Slayer of the Wicked-The only way to permanently kill olivia in our deck. Generally good versus Jund and with the ability to blink it i just couldn't pass it up.

Thalia, Guardian of Thraben- In case 2 isn't enough.

Sundering Growth A sort of catch all card that populates. Notable targets are Detention sphere, blind obedience, or any aura in bant enchantments.


Other notes: you could probably splash another color if the meta slows down but as it stands you can't afford to get mana screwed

Hope that's helpful.

Um... build naya midrange? Thats basically what the deck is. Huntamaster and thragtusk are your value creatures that you blink. Armada worm is just too win more in my opinion. You could probably run it as a 1 of with some success in the current meta as it is pretty strong versus midrange but it's too slow versus aggro and comes is relatively easy for control to deal with.

Quote from Novajoe

Legion loyalist, abrupt decay, and detention sphere are all cards that seem really bad for you that are seeing play right now. Also note that there is a lot of fast aggro between gruul sligh, naya humans, and boros red that have the ability to take full advantage of your higher curve.

but of all of those only detention sphere is good versus midrange and they should probably hitting more important targets(*cough*Garruk, Primal Hunter*cough*) than a couple of tokens. Just don't run lingering souls as your 3 drop and you will be good. Really the biggest issue with running Trostani selesnya's voice is that it invites over extending. If you are careful I think Trostani is actually very well positioned in the curent meta. So long as you don't try and run 3 colors you can easily drop her turn 3 and make use of that big ass and then stabilize quickly in a manner similar to Rhox Faithmender. The only reason she doesn't see much play is because of the 4 colored cost. You should just think of her populate ability as a perk rather than her primary purpose. If you are relying on her to populate you're building your deck wrong.

My worst trade was a foil NM thoughtsieze for $20 store credit when thoughtseize was at an one of it's lowest prices. Modern then became a format and it's now a $150 card. Still I don't really regret it that much because it wasn't that bad of a deal at the time and who would have thought it would ever be that much. the ones i regret are

my oblivionstone ($15) for their trash rares($3) I was just a kid and miss remembered the price of oblivionstone as $5

My stifle for their trash rares($4) I mixed up stifle and spell snare in my head and thought it was $5 (noticing a trend?)

My angelic destiny($20) for their greater gargadon and some other stuff($13) I again mixed up the prices of gargadon and gamble in my head so you can imagine my surprise when I went up to the store counter to buy a gamble for $3 and it was $10.


Best trades were
2x Gaea's Cradle at $20 each
Trading for 3x stoneforge mythic at $5 and then unloading them for swords a week before they were banned from standard.
Flagstones of Trokair from a 25 cent bin
Trading for 4xscalding tarn at $10 each
4x glimpse of nature at $10 each

My friend also picked up a foil mercadian masks brainstorm from an old player for a trash rare and then realized it was worth something when someone offered him over $100 in trades. He actually feels really bad about it because he accidentally made out like a bandit.

Quote from Archie

Remember that the black based aggro decks are switching to a bunch of tragic slips, which make a 1 toughness creature a liability. The only commonly played spells that kill Seer are Dreadbore, Mizzium Mortars, and Morbid Tragic Slip. And Dreadbore and Mortars aren't even seeing much play at all right now.

I have been testing him in UB zombies, and he has been a champ. He tops my curve and draws me more gas right when I need it to finish the opponent off. With Blood Artist, Diregraf Captain and Seer, there is a ton of non combat reach in the list. And when control starts seeing more play, I will add the last 2 copies to the mainboard. Like I initially said, this guy is really really good in a dedicated list.

This has been my experience exactly though (although seer also gets hit by detention sphere, though I can garentee they won't have one in hand against zombies because it will be exiling a geralf's messenger or gravecrawler). I almost always get to untap with seer save a boardwipe. Generally you can force the boardwipe before dropping seer and then they will have no solutions and have to just face the PAIN TRAIN. The biggest downside with seer is that he is very weak in the aggro match up and is just a 4/4 flyer for 4 that speeds up the clock. Against aggro you drop him, block and pray to god you flip a land.

Quote from Evenoire

Hence why some people have already stated that, for as long as INS exists, this guy won't see play. Now after INS rolls out, so long as wizards doesn't go bonkers again, this guy can very well see play. And the argument of "its a win more" card sounds JUST LIKE the argument people were making of hellrider when he was released and for the entirety of the INS/SCM season... Just saying.

[CARD]
Hellrider[/CARD] was always good. The reason it didn't see play was because red aggro wasn't good. Between Whipflare and Arc Trail there wasn't a whole lot of room for weenies. Hellrider competed with Koth of the Hammer in midrange for the 4 slot and didn't do enough evasive damage on to finish games. Rubblebelt Raiders still doesn't see play in a meta full of R/X aggro. The reason why is if you have enough creatures to make him large then you already are winning and you need to end the game before they stabilize. This is why hellrider is good. Hellrider allows you to finish games before over extending bites you in the ass. Rubblebelt Raiders is a grindy card meaning it doesn't end games but rather forces your opponent to block and thus gains you card advantage. Now that may sood good and all but you're not playing midrange, you're playing aggro and if you were playing midrange you wouldn't have enough creatures in play to make this better than Primordial Hydra .

Quote from TexRob

So, I'm sold after reading this, that this card has no place in my deck. Great article I think, about true casting cost.

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/25633_Limiting-Chance-Turn-Cost-And-Color.html

This makes the card like a turn 6 card on average if you don't factor shocklands, becomes better with shocklands. I need to look for something else I think.

That article is relevant for limited but not standard a standard with the best color fixing since lorwyn and shards. Plus the hybrid mana makes a huge difference. (what I'm saying is it's not like you're trying to cast Geralf's Messenger))

Quote from Evenoire

Has no trample or haste in colors that have a million and a half ways to give trample or haste... You also need to take into consideration of colors and other cards. Contrary to popular belief, we don't play in a vaccum.

You are exactly right about the whole vaccum thing however I think thats why raiders is bad. We're playing in a meta with very strong sorcery speed removal and some of the best weenie blockers ever printed(read Lingering Souls). So in order to run this guy you need another enabling card such as rancor in hand and still run the risk of having raider removed at socery speed during their turn which then begs the question: If you have rancor in hand and creatures without summoning sickness already out why on earth would you waste a turn tapping out to play a Rubblebelt Raiders when you could play rancor on one of them instead? That would leave mana open your removal or skullcrack to ensure you don't get shut down by a thragtusk, boros reckoner, or some other creature with a large board presence. An important thing to keep in mind is that aggro often doesn't hit 4 lands on turn 4 so your opponent will be casting high impact spells by the time you get raiders online.

the difference between casual and competetive is in casual you are trying to win. You focus on making good plays being prepared for your opponents plays and outwitting your opponent. That is what competitive players think is fun. Casual player focus more on silly shenanigans and interactions with their own cards and often enjoy playing very bad cards because of the flavor. These players hate playing competitive players because they often don't even run cards to disrupt the competitive players infinite combo, they just want to see their deck run. As long as that happens they could care less whether they win or lose, but when they lose before their deck gets off the ground or if anytime they try and pull off a cool interaction it gets disrupted they are going to get pissed.
An example of a casual deck would be Norin the wary or Marrow-Gnawer an example of a competetive deck would be Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed or Arcum Dagsson although in the end it depends on what you do with the generals. although i'd like to go out on a limb here and say mana vault, demonic tutor, and freinds are a good sign that your deck is competitive.

Edit: I thought bolding the above line would clear up any miss interpretetions of my post

I think the biggest problem is that both are creatures and therefore almost every deck is packing a solution to your combo in the maindeck. I would runJace, Architect of Thought and barter in blood as your 4 drops to help stabalize plus jace is great for digging. You need to wait until at least turn 5 to drop crypt ghast so you can have mana open for negate or some other spell to protect it. I think your ideal drop would be Griselbrand as it can win on it's own but also fills up your hand with cards to spend your mana on. Enter the Infinite could be an option but you won't have a chance at casting it without the combo so it's a bit iffy. Other than that Temporal Mastery is a great ramp card. If you topdeck it, it often functions as an explore at the very least. I would recommend reanimator as an alternate win-con that way you can at least mill yourself into a win condition if you don't have enough mana to mill out an opponent