So much has happened right here on these forums. The website has changed so much over the years, constantly adapting to the interests of its users, old and new. It helped shape and reinforce what it means to play and love Magic for thousands of people.
I've been here just two months short of seven years. Salvation has really shaped who I am as a player. I started in the Legacy forums talking about Stax, Burn and Reanimator, but thanks to the open nature of these forums and its users I slowly transformed into a Pauper and Commander player. If I look back at my first posts, I'm a completely different person.
Thank you.
Here's to the end of something great and the beginning of something new and interesting, created by the backbone of MtgSalvation.
I'm a huge fan of LD (I play Stax in Legacy), and I've been working for years tweaking several land destruction decks (I have one for every colour).
The most powerful dedicated LD deck (not Stax or Pox) is definitely Green. Access to Goyf and other midrange creatures to outclass the weak creatures resulting from a crumbling mana base (tempo!) makes Green a powerful contender.
4 Birds of Paradise
4 Utopia Sprawl
3 Arbor Elf
Land Destruction Spells (14)
4 Ice Storm
4 Winter's Grasp
4 Thermokarst
2 Mwonvuli Acid-Moss
4 Acidic Slime
3 Tarmogoyf
3 Deus of Calamity
Artifacts (3)
3 Engineered Explosives
Lands (22)
16 Forest
4 Wasteland
2 Treetop Village
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Tormod's Crypt
2 Oxidize
4 Firespout
2 Tsunami
3 Thrun, the Last Troll
I go positive against other midrange decks like Merfolk and Maverick, 50/50 against faster creature-based decks and get trampled by combo.
When people say that LD can't stand a chance in this meta, I can't help but disagree. The number of Fetches being run make an LD spell practically a 2-for-1. A deck like RUG has a hard time playing against this because it only runs 8 non-fetch lands. The chances of the deck seeing another land decreases dramatically.
Engineered Explosives is usually at 0,1 or 2 with the help of Utopia Sprawl or BoP. Arbor Elf can ramp up to 4 mana on turn 2 with Utopia Sprawl, leaving the opponent far behind while you land a LD spell followed by a fatty next turn.
This isn't really tournament-worthy, top-tier stuff, but it definitely gives other decks a run for their money! You can build a good Legacy LD deck!
Unless you're willing to bring out the big bucks, there aren't many other options to choose from. Maybe Foil, but that's only good in a few decks, and I don't think this is one of them. If you're that worried about mill (I don't think you should be), then use library replenishers or something (Elixir of Immortality). I've never given much thought to mill because it sucks so much, so it's hard to help you much.
No Vedalken Mastermind? I can't stress enough how sweet this card would be in your deck.
As for Reality Acid, don't be discouraged by non-believers! I built a very viable deck that used it alongside Vedalken Mastermind. Return the Acid to your hand, it triggers, the permanent is destroyed, play the acid, then repeat next turn. 4 mana to destroy a permanent every turn is very powerful.
You can use other ''Blink Effects'' alongside more permanents with ''enters the battlefield'' triggers to create a very annoying deck. mangara of Corondor, momentary blink, Flicker, Whitemane Lion, aven riftwatcher (good beater too), kitchen finks, Man-o'-War, conjurer's Closet etc. Mix in some counterspells with that...
I see some really powerful possibilities for this deck.
What do you mean, the meta? Like the top tier decks of this month? Building a deck should be done in regards of the local meta (which often doesn't reflect what's going on at the professional level)
I'm a Reanimator player, and let me tell you playing against a Stax deck is no walk in the park, especially when you're not expecting it. That chalice at 1... so frustrating. Stax has many tools to fight Reanimator, which makes it a decent match (although I'd still bet on Reanimator).
It's a 4/4 with no other abilities, yes, but it only costs 4 mana. Pumping this out 2nd turn is still a powerful play, especially when it protects your artifacts. Might be SB worthy, or maybe worth a md slot. Cool suggestion!
Well, I had made something somewhat similar to this idea before. I abused colour-changing effects like Distorting Lens and Tidal Visionary gain protection from the colour. Mixing in Story Circle to gain protection from that colour and Northen Paladin to destroy any permanent in play for 2 mana, and the deck was decent.
Here's my old list:
4 Tidal Visionary
4 Distorting Lens
1 Blind Seer
Other Creatures (19)
4 Mother of Runes
2 Beloved Chaplain
3 Obsidian Acolyte
4 Crimson Acolyte
2 Voice of All
1 Southern Paladin
1 Northern Paladin
4 Arcane Denial
1 Mana Leak
3 Disenchant
Enchantments/ Artifacts (4)
2 Story Circle
2 Phyrexian Splicer
Lands (20)
6 Island
10 Plains
4 Coastal Tower
Obviously, this deck is massively outdated. I would make many, many adjustments to this list.
I think Trading Post is better off in a Humility-style Stax, where churning out 1/1s is more relevant.
I think I'll probably stick to Flamebreak or Volcanic Fallout. Not sure which yet. Probably Flamebreak. I'll run it as a 3-of and add a 19th land.
Wolf_Cub82, I wish everyone gave such clear, well pondered answers as yours. Thanks so much!
I was considering running searing blaze because it still deals 3 damage while taking pressure off me. I do run a good number of fetchlands, but it's one of the reasons I'm worried: The more fetches you use, the less chance you have of drawing lands, the more useless Searing Blaze becomes when you topdeck it after turn 3. Unless you sandbag lands, or don't break a fetch. Would a card like Flamebreak be a good compromise (particularly if I'm not running GL)? Pyroclasm? Volcanic Fallout?
I'm more on the fishbowl side of life. I want my top 9 cards to be 3 lands, 4 bolt, Flame Rift and Fireblast as often as possible. I'm not running lavamancer and using a black splash because I want to be as consistent as possible. I don't want to up my land count, or even run a playset of Blazes. Unfortunately, even with 20 bolts I still need filler cards. That's where removal comes in.
Actually, maybe discard in the main might be a good idea. Testing shall tell.
Would it be too difficult to run Searing Blaze with only 19 lands, in your opinion?
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There are several different Pestilence decks you can build. First, let’s look at some basic cards to start building a traditional Pestilence deck.
Obviously, you’ll want to start with some Black. Here are some cards that have been used in Pestilence decks before:
Circle of Affliction: Sick of taking damage? You can choose Black and for every B you spend on the Pestilence, you can gain a life and make your opponent lose one.
Crypt Rats: I’ve personally never used this, but it could definitely fill the role of a one-time Pestilence for cheap.
Darkest Hour: With lots of Protection from Black Creatures, Darkest Hour makes your creatures immune to other creatures.
Death Pits of Rath: This rather expensive enchantment lets you take control of creatures definitively.
Dimir House Guard: This guy will fetch Pestilence for your fourth turn or be a 3-toughness evasive beatstick later on.
Last Laugh: Lots of fun in multiplayer, you can really make the world explode with this.
Nested Ghoul: If you keep responding with damage on the stack, you get a stack of tokens! It can be especially useful in the BG version with Rite of Passage.
Orzhov Euthanist: You will be running into creatures too big to kill with Pestilence sometimes. He helps with that.
Pestilence: I think there’s no getting around this one... or is there?
Plague Spitter: This guy is a free Pestilence every turn. Marginally useful. Good to get some combat damage through.
Stillmoon Cavalier: Excellent card. Has additional protection, pumps, gains flying first strike. Very customizable and a great finisher.
Syphon Soul: It and its’ variants in a multiplayer match guarantee a big life-swing in your favor, allowing you to go nuts with Pestilence.
Thrashing Wumpus: This Pestilence on a stick can be very good at clearing a board, or attacking. You can deal 2 damage a turn without killing it, or go on a blitz and raze the board.
Treacherous Link: This is one of the most important spells in the deck. You keep a creature on the battlefield, and you deal double damage to your opponent.
Withering Wisps: Building your deck with Snow-Covered Swamps to accommodate this Pestilence variant is very easy and rewarding. It costs one less mana too... Doubles up nicely with your Pestilence to avoid using tutors and things.
Obviously this list is far from exhaustive, but it shows the kind of synergy you look for in Pestilence.
3 Pestilence
4 Withering Wisps
4 Treacherous Link
3 Circle of Affliction
4 Cemetery Gate
4 Darksteel Myr
2 Dread
2 Orzhov Euthanist
3 Dark Ritual
3 Tribute to Hunger
Sorceries (5)
3 Syphon Soul
2 Vicious Hunger
23 Snow-Covered Swamp
Withering Wisps is a stronger card in this deck than Pestilence, and seven of them are plenty. You’ll notice the removal is also life-gain. Tribute to Hunger is especially good, because after a Pestilence effect, only the strongest creatures survive (therefore less choice for the opponent and more life for you). Syphon Soul is strong in multiplayer, but underwhelming in 1-on-1. More removal may be better instead. Darksteel Myr is an excellent blocker and keeps Pestilence alive.
The most popular version of Pestilence is without a doubt with its’ enemy colour: White. Why White? Because White hates on Black, of course! With all the Black-hosing cards available in White, the colour is well suited to protect yourself from your own Pestilence. Take a look at some White cards that can be found in B/W versions:
Blind Hunter: Nets you some life and deals plenty of damage. Haunt is a good mechanic in general for Pestilence.
Cho-Manno, Revolutionary: Rather expensive, but difficult to get rid of.
Crusading Knight: A good creature to have in a less budget-friendly deck that includes Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth.
Death Speakers: A decent 1 drop, but dies very easily. Not the best choice.
Enlightened Tutor: Now you can search up your pestilence, your Pariah, your Myr, your Treacherous Link. This tutor has plenty of targets.
Equal Treatment: Makes your Pestilence go for 2 a shot, or reduces damage from a fatty. I’m not a fan, as it only lasts one turn and you need lots of mana (and protection) to make it worth it.
Greater Auramancy: Protects your many frail enchantments. Could be worth a couple slots.
Guardian of the Guildpact: Not only is he immune to Pestilence, but he also immune to most things. An excellent choice, though expensive at 4 mana.
Hedron-Field Purists: You only pay for the first level, clearly. Might be a little on the mana-intensive side.
Pariah: I can hardly imagine a B/W version without this. Not only is it removal if you play it on your opponents, but if you slap this on one of your own Pro Black creatures, you become immune to Pestilence damage.
Protective Sphere: I’ve only recently discovered this and I have yet to try it, but it seems really good at saving you a ton of life.
Runed Halo: Protection from Pestilence (or anything bothersome really). This is a versatile card.
Samite Ministration: Gain some life for a change! Very nice in the late game when you have lots of mana to spend.
Soltari Monk: Good aggressive creature that keeps Pest alive. Remember that it can only block creatures with Shadow.
Sphere of Grace: Another very useful card to have. Immune to Pestilence now (and have I mentioned that this deck is favored against other black decks?).
Swans of Bryn Argoll: Draw a card for each B I spend? Yes please!
Tainted Sigil: Pretty decent card for B/W. I might give it a try sometime.
Voice of Grace: A good Pro Black creature. Flies for damage and keeps your pestilence alive.
Wall of Hope: This is my 1-drop of choice. You can take advantage in the beginning and gain some life, or clear the board of creatures with toughness 2 or less without any life loss. Not to be underestimated. I consider this a staple.
Wall of Light: A better Cemetery Gate, but in the enemy colour. I believe that when splashing white, there are better inclusions.
Wall of Resistance: I’ve never used it, but I’ve seen it suggested many times. Could be a very good blocker and prove to be quite strong with Pestilence.
Words of Worship: Sometimes life is more important than cards.
Worship: Fun with Darksteel Myr or anything hard to get rid of. You can’t be killed by your Pestilence and your opponents can’t kill you either.
4 Pestilence
3 Withering Wisps
4 Pariah
4 Treacherous Link
2 Sphere of Grace
2 Darkest Hour
3 Cemetery Gate
4 Darksteel Myr
2 Auriok Champion
2 Wall of Hope
Instants (7)
3 Tribute to Hunger
3 Dark Ritual
1 Enlightened Tutor
11 Snow-Covered Swamp
9 Snow-Covered Plains
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
In this deck, the original Pestilence is better than Withering Wispsbecause of the non-basic lands. You can also include things like Tainted Field, but then the use of Withering Wisps will be more difficult. There are less creatures in this particular build because it is mostly for multi-player, where creature are in abundance. As for tips and tricks: putting a Treacherous Link and a Pariah on an enemy creature makes you invulnerable to damage; it all goes to that player. A single black mana turns into a lightning bolt for them. Darkest Hour with Sphere of Grace is also quite amusing.
Here is another example of B/W Pestilence:
4 Pestilence
3 Withering Wisps
3 Sphere of Grace
4 Pariah
4 Treacherous Link
4 Wall of Hope
2 Order of the Stars
4 Perimeter Captain
4 Cemetery Gate
3 Stalwart Shield-Bearers
1 Enlightened Tutor
Lands (24)
10 Snow-Covered Swamp
9 Snow-Covered Plains
2 Tainted Field
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
This version shows how easy it can be to include Pestilence as a sub-theme into many decks. This highly defensive version can hold its’ own a lot better in 1 vs. 1. It requires more white sources however, so Tainted Field (or any B/W land) is necessary. Worship could easily have a place in this creature-heavy deck.
White is not the only enemy colour, as you well know. Green needs to have a chance to shine as well. Although much less popular, B/G Pestilence is a very powerful contender that hits with heavy creatures only Green can provide. In essence, the deck revolves around Rite of Passage making your creatures huge while killing off your opponents’ and then swinging in for the kill. It is the fastest of the Pestilence decks. I am basing this section almost wholly on personal experience, as I found very few other examples to compare with. Here are some cards I found to be excellent in B/G:
Beast Within: Kills absolutely anything, and a 3/3 is nothing to worry about with this deck. Perfect.
Commune With the Gods: This innocuous 2-mana spell digs deep for Pestilence or any creature or enchantment you might need. A very powerful spell to set up your game.
Fungusaur: An built-in Rite of Passage, he’s a workhorse in this deck.
Fungus Sliver: Although I wouldn't recommend having 8 copies of Fungusaur in your deck, These slivers can be potentially better than the original, as their ability stacks with multiple copies. It could make for an interesting Sliver sub-theme, as well.
Grazing Gladehart: This antelope will gain you life in the early game and stomp on your opponent later.
Hunted Troll: A cheap finisher with a non-existent drawback.
Magus of the Candelabra: This guy will tap your Forests to untap your Swamps to keep using Pestilence triggers. He also has 2 toughness, which can be important when playing with Rite of Passage.
Mercy Killing: Takes care of indestructible creatures and basically has no drawback, since the 1/1s will all just die.
Rite of Passage: I use cards exclusively with 2+ toughness, so that Pestilence doesn’t kill them.
Sprouting Phytohydra: An army of blockers that can suddenly go on the offence after being pumped up with Rite of Passage.
Tree of Redemption: He pumps up and then switches life with you (13+x, where x is the amount of life you lost with Pestilence). You then just use Pestilence again, pumping him up and switching when your life goes low.
Utopia Sprawl: Choose black. Goes quite well with Magus for some fast ramp.
Utopia Tree: Have you ever had the pleasure of killing someone with this tree? I have. A third turn Pestilence is what you’re aiming for, so it’s appropriate in this deck.
Vigor: A one-upped Rite of Passage that doubles as a great finisher.
Whirling Dervish: One of the few playable Pro-Black creatures in Green, the Dervish comes with the somewhat problematic double-G cost. If you build your mana base accordingly (with say, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and other mana-fixers), you should not have any problems casting him.
4 Pestilence
4 Rite of Passage
3 Utopia Sprawl
Creatures (25)
4 Magus of the Candelabra
4 Utopia Tree
4 Cemetery Gate
4 Fungusaur
2 Vigor
3 Tree of Redemption
2 Plague Spitter
2 Thrashing Wumpus
2 Beast Within
Lands (22)
9 Forest
9 Swamp
4 Tainted Wood
There’s too much green in this deck for Withering Wisps. Besides, Thrashing Wumpus is a much better option, as he pumps himself. There’s some ramp in the deck to get to the 4-5 mana early on and start smashing face. Putrefy is a budget friendly version of Maelstrom Pulse, but I suppose it could just as easily be Beast Within now. A 3/3 is nothing to worry about for this deck.
This covers the most common uses of Pestilence in casual play. But it’s not over. Red has access to Pyrohemia, the time-shifted version of Pestilence! Casual players everywhere rejoiced. Many tried to mix Pyrohemia and Pestilence in the same deck. It’s a terrible idea. I don't recommend it. You need to have access to an abundance of both Black and Red mana for it to work. Unless you decide to run 4 Badlands, 4 Blood Crypts and many fetchlands, good luck with that. I believe Red Pestilence is best left mono-coloured, or with a White splash.
Braid of Fire: The mana from this enchantment can only be used during your upkeep, since mana pools empty after each step and phase. This forces you to use Pyrohemia on your turn, and only on your upkeep. Hey, free mana comes at a price.
Deep-Slumber Titan: This guy will keep your Pyrohemia alive and swing for huge amounts of damage, and then untap to block. A great finisher for the deck.
Keeper of Kookus: An easy 1-drop to include to make sure you have a pro-red creature to keep Pyrohemia.
Pyrohemia: While there are no other red cards that do exactly what Pyrohemia does, Red packs plenty of damage-based board wipes (Pyroclasm) that help build synergy and control in a similar way.
Spitemare: Massive damage coming towards the opponent can put a lot of pressure on them early enough, and make combat situation very difficult.
Thick-Skinned Goblin: He costs you mana, but he's sure to live through a Pyrohemia wipe.
Vulshok Refugee: This pro-red also makes for an excellent attacker on an empty board. Probably the best option out there, as he sits perfectly on curve with Pyrohemia, and his extra point of toughness over the others makes him more appealing.
Over the years, Pyrohemia has received a surprising amount of support in the form of creatures, encouraging one especially to splash with White.
4 Pyrohemia
4 Manabarbs
4 Citadel of Pain
4 Braid of Fire
2 Flamewave Invoker
4 Goblin Balloon Brigade
4 Thick-Skinned Goblin
4 Wall of Fire
4 Chimeric Idol
4 Urza’s armor
Lands (22)
22 Mountain
The deck has lost much of its’ power since then, as Citadel of Pain now needs Manabarbs in order to do damage. Braid of Fire is only useful for Pyrohemia and paying for activated abilities. I used creatures with activated abilities to sink my excess mana to avoid mana burn. If any of you still play with mana burn, by all means, try this deck out. It can still be used, but I can’t abuse the rules like before.
Here is a more current version of mono-red Pyrohemia, this time abusing powerful creatures printed in the last few years:
4 Boros Reckoner
2 Darksteel Myr
4 Deep-Slumber Titan
2 Stuffy Doll
4 Pyrohemia
3 Dragon's Claw
Mass Burn (9)
4 Pyroclasm
3 Breath of Darigaaz
2 Blasphemous Act
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Arc Trail
2 Arc Lightning
Lands (23)
23 Mountain
Extremely efficient versus multiple opponents, it also has a remarkably smooth curve, keeping the 4-drop slot relatively uncrowded (compared to other Pestilence decks) and topping out at 5 with Stuffy Doll. Blasphemous Act typically costs around 4 mana and knocks out an opponent with Stuffy or Reckoner. Deep-Slumber Titan, although colliding with Pyrohemia in the 4-drop slot, is a fantastic finisher and blocker all at the same time. With Pyrohemia in play, he basically has Vigilance. Many cards untap him, and there's never been a situation yet where he's been uselessly tapped in play.
I'd just like to make a quick mention of potent artifact cards for Pestilence, as there are several worth mentioning. Not all of them made it into my decks, but could still be of interest in your own deck-building!
Chimeric Idol: Use its ability at the end of your turn, and Pestilence's ability will see it as a creature on the battlefield and not sacrifice itself. It's also a 3/3 beater that's hard to remove. Unfortunately, it prevents you from using any spells or abilities with mana on your opponents' turn.
Darksteel Myr: Obvious synergy by not dying to damage. An excellent blocker to boot. Watch out for Trample, though, as it doesn't do much good when blocking that.
Shield Sphere: an excellent early blocker at the affordable cost of 0. He stays relevant for a good portion of the game, and can usually withstand a good amount of Pestilence damage.
Steel Wall: This card has become mostly unused, thanks to the printing of Disowned Ancestor, which I consider to be a strict upgrade. Steel Wall can definitely still be used if you are running complex mana bases or just don't have your hands on the new spirit.
Stuffy Doll: Obviously used to double the damage dealt to the opponent, as well as being a fearsome defender. The mana cost is a bit high, but still quite playable and typically a game-ender.
Sun Droplet: If you are playing mostly 1-on-1 games, I would not recommend this card, as 2 life per turn is not a great deal. This card begins to shine when there are four or more players. I find this card too annoying to use as you have to remember to use it on everybody's turn, and it attracts a lot of attention to you gaining life all the time. Not exactly a card to help you remain inconspicuous at the table.
Urza's Armor: 6 mana is a lot to pay, but the effect prevents all damage dealt to you by Pestilence at a colourless cost. This makes it playable for any Pestilence deck not using White. The price is high, but the possibility is there for any colour.
Have I missed anything? If you think so, let me know in the comments, I’ll gladly discuss it and add it to the list. I will add a card that shows direct synergy with Pestilence, not just complimentary cards (ex. Unmake would be a decent card, but it has nothing to do with Pestilence).
I think it really depends on how you built your deck. With more 2-drops, you'll want to be looking at more stable mana sources (no ESG, not a playset of Quirion Ranger, maybe more land, mana elves). You don't want to have dead 2-drops in hand because you used up your resources in the first 2 turns of the game and only have 1 land in play.
In my opinion, the 1-drop slot has almost everything you need to build your deck to be as fast as possible. The 2-drop really needs to be massive to convince me of playing it. Sure, many of them won't have evasion, but Rancor is there for that. It feels like a shame to pay 2 for a smaller creature with evasion, when you can pay 1 for a bigger dude. Does your list have more pump then the average?
I am considering changing my deck to fit in Winter Orb though. That seems like a really dirty trick for XLS. Anyone have an Orb list I could compare with?
This is my deck, I concentrate on more 1-drops, with the occasional Talara's Battalion (great turn 1 card, when it comes up). I hate Llanowar Elves in this deck; they're puny and are often in excess for mana. I prefer the faster and more surprising Elvish Spirit Guide. Overall, the deck is much more explosive than most XLS I've seen. Any suggestions?
2 Nettle Sentinel
3 Talara's Battalion
4 Skarrgan Pit-Skulk
4 Dryad Militant
4 Mtenda Lion
4 Rogue Elephant
4 Jungle Lion
4 Rancor
4 Bounty of the Hunt
3 Giant Growth
3 Might of Old Krosa
Mana sources (21)
10 Forest
3 Quirion Ranger
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Land Grant
Also, I would recommend Propaganda. Not only is it very useful on its' own, but with a pumped up constable, you can return all their lands to their hand, making them unable to attack, and unable to play any spells. That gets rid of the creature problem. Add Pendrell Mists and you'll never have a creature problem again. You can look for other cards that have similar effects in the game (Crawlspace, Ensnaring Bridge, Web of inertia).
Get rid of your thinning! You can use useful cards instead, that don't lose you life. Counter backup like countersquall,counterspell, mana leak etc. are all available to you. If you mix in a good number of counter and discard, you'll drag into the late game, where you have the resources to back up your constable and really start damaging the board state. Swiftfoot boots is worse than Lightning Greaves. Whispersilk cloak protects and makes unblockable. Bonesplitter is a great equipment, early and late game. two-time spells like distortion strike are nice and all, but they won't let you control the board. You have more ways of winning than with just constable; don't rely on drawing him, diversify.
On a more fun note, Recoil is a Vindicate if they have an empty hand...
In your last rendition, I see no way to cast Manamorphose... I also think you need more land.
You need to be the control player. Don't worry about not having creature or creating a clock, worry about disrupting your opponent as much as possible.