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  • posted a message on Modern Esper Draw-Go
    Zach Allen's article is on CFB

    https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/reviving-esper-control-in-modern-2nd-place-at-scg-cleveland/?_ga=2.10658932.118116238.1555085752-854912191.1530046218

    apparently this version of esper crushes shadow and phoenix
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on Modern Esper Draw-Go
    An esper list got 2nd at the last SCG event

    www.starcitygames.com/decks/Star_City_Games_Open/2019-04-06_modern_Cleveland_OH_US/1/



    The interesting choices about the deck are:

    4 main deck grave hate cards with 3 spellbombs and 1 kaya.
    2 sweepers main (most people play 4?)
    4 snapcasters (most people 3, so i guess playing 4 isn't that big of a stretch)
    24 lands (seems like the range is 24-26)
    1 man land (seems like the most people play 3)

    Nassif played 74/75 of this list on stream the other day. He said 24 lands seemed low, and he switched an opt for a spellbomb, as he thought you should have 4 opts if you have 4 snapcasters. I believe he said if he wanted to add a land you'd probably cut push.

    Seems reasonable, but I don't know if this has better match ups compared to UW.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on UW Control
    Quote from saltysquid14 »
    I also stuggled to get UU on Turn 2 some games. So I'm going to cut 1 Plains for a Polluted Delta.

    Thoughts on my list?



    I think the only time you want the third plains is vs moon decks. Another fetch is fine since you're playing azcanta.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on BUG Wilderness Teachings Turns
    Quote from Be_lakor »
    I think I will try Gifts Ungiven in my further testings to look if it is a better game closer than the stuff that we have.

    I wondered why this card hasn't come up yet.

    There's a 4 color gifts deck, though not playing reclamation

    https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/established-modern/combo/220010-4c-gifts?page=160
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
  • posted a message on BUG Wilderness Teachings Turns
    No opts make snapcaster worse. But I like the chalice idea. You could probably play 1 dismember over a push or something. If you play 4x chalice would you play thirst for knowledge instead of illumination, or just put chalice in the board? Chalice main sounds spicy, but then what do you do if you have remand or growth spiral?


    The blue tron list that got 8th place in that mtgo challenge was playing 4x chalice main. However that list has slightly fewer 2 cmc cards than these bug lists.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
  • posted a message on Modern Esper Draw-Go
    I feel like terminus is where you want to be. But I guess if you're playing 4 path and 4 fatal push, you can not depend on getting the lucky miracle terminus on turns 2-3, and wait till turn 4 to cast your sweeper. But I think you probably should be playing 14 turn 1 black sources (Karsten's mana source math). The GP list only plays 12. I'd at least switch the drowned catacomb to a marsh flats.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on UW Control
    Quote from jayjayhooks »
    That list looks awful. There only non-reactive card that flips thing is Opt which means you'll have to use spot removal to flip the horror and if you're killing creatures to flip the bounce effect becomes less than stellar.

    I also agree the list looks bad, but the deck creator said it was a meta call. I would imagine that deck is probably better vs red aggro than the stock UW terminus lists.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on BUG Wilderness Teachings Turns
    Azcanta is nuts with reclamation. There are very few cards you can play in modern that work so well with reclamation, especially that use your mana every turn. Also man lands are great with reclamation. BSZ seems unplayable in modern, but i got to watch the vods i guess.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
  • posted a message on UW Control
    Revelation was great when people were playing rock decks with slow clocks and trying to combo with kitchen finks, now it's too slow. The UW decks do play some top end, but it's probably just a bad teferi.

    This 4 color deck went 5-2 in the modern challenge(it has 1 rev), but it just seems super greedy and could never beat a turn 1 goblin guide.

    My gut is that faerie macabre is a budget version of surgical for most people, it's comically cheaper in both paper and on mtgo. Surgical is the most expensive modern card on mtgo per some goatbot's metric (not counting special/low supply cards). I could see playing it to diversify your grave hate package, so it'd be your 4th or 5th graveyard hate card, but if you need that many graveyard hate cards, UW is probably not the deck you should be playing. Snapcaster is also really strong with surgical, when you don't have RIP.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on Bant Draw-Go Control
    I haven't played many games with the deck, but it seemed like bant is awesome when it curves out, and a bad UW deck when it doesn't. The lack of field of ruin was noticeable, and makes me wonder if going the Burkheart grixis build style where you play 25 lands with 4x field of ruin is worth trying. Though with that build you had to aggressively fetch shocks, where as with bant you only need to do that once.

    I also tested the reclamation version a tiny bit and I got to live the dream with azcanta, reclamation, and teferi. It seemed win more, but i have a small sample size.

    Delver is interesting, though I think i'd want to pair that with lightning bolt, so temur? I also wouldn't play 5 check lands with delver, i'd play 1-2, and zero fast lands (which you correctly play zero) with jace and cryptic in the deck. I don't understand how the jeskai diehards play that one spirebluff. A higher curve flash deck could be interesting, but i'm guessing that's probably too clunky.

    Temur doesn't seem like a good color combination. If i wanted to make temur work, i'd probably make it a tempo deck with goyf, and that's probably just a bad death shadow deck. Scapeshift is a turn 5 combo deck in a turn 3-4 format, it's just not playable unless people are playing kitchen finks decks (where anger of the gods is good) or rock decks (where you're not under a fast clock).

    Hoogland had a sultai deck when trophy was spoiled, but it was super midrangey, and could never beat the linear decks. I don't think it's on his website, I think you can only find it on his youtube video. It could be worth revisiting.

    I also posted about growth spiral in the 4c gifts thread. But people in that thread are stuck on trying to play lilianas. Trying to craft a more instant speed version, didn't really impress me just by looking at the list, as I think the mana is slightly too bad. And I also got a recent reminder why deathrite is still banned.

    I feel like UW is the best control deck, and Grixis death shadow is the best midrange deck. It seems hard not to make an inferior version of those two decks. The bant versions posted in this thread are closer to UW, and it's getting more refined as more testing and more ideas come. I could see that if they print more 1 mana cards that bant could surpass UW.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
  • posted a message on Bant Draw-Go Control
    Hydroid Krasis could be playable with Wilderness Reclamation, but reclamation makes a lot of clunky garbage seem playable, and it's not clear if reclamation is playable. If krasis had flash instead of trample, it would be worth testing.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
  • posted a message on Jeskai Control
    Tron crushes control. The one time that I did better than 50% vs tron was when I was playing UW with 4x spreading seas, 4x field of ruin, 1x ghost quarter and 2x gideon of the trials. You either suck up the loss to tron or play a different deck.

    Against mill, people were playing one eldrazi in the sideboard.
    Posted in: Control
  • posted a message on [Primer] 4C Gifts
    The card from the new set that interests me is growth spiral. It replaces itself and can potentially ramp you. My issue with 4 color gifts after the deathrite shaman ban was that it was too slow, and the other mana dorks/ramp weren't good enough. Now there's this potential card that acts as ramp that's playable in a control shell.

    Does anyone want to take a crack at it? I guess you'd probably want to play less sorcery speed cards.
    Posted in: Combo
  • posted a message on Bant Draw-Go Control
    The main issue with glittering wish is that it's too slow in a fair deck. Sideboard issues are ancillary. If you look at the decks where wish cards have been successful are combo decks, where they wish for a card that kills you. The most recent success with glittering with was when treasure cruise was legal with jeskai ascendancy.

    You can compare glittering wish to tool box cards like gifts ungiven and mystical teachings. Teachings is never going to be in meta again, and gifts ungiven is currently used in storm. In the past, Gifts was used in fair decks like UW tron and 4 color midrange/control (when deathrite shaman was legal), and played with unburial rites and Iona, Shield of Emeria and Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. It worked temporarily in those decks as they could cast gifts on turn 3, and turn 4 reanimate the fatty as they played mana dorks and mana rocks.

    With that said, glittering wish has potential as growth spiral lets you cast your wish cards sooner. And if you have Wilderness Reclamation, it allows you to wish for a card on your turn, and cast it on your opponent's turn (if it was an instant).

    With the speed issue is "mitigated," I think it's worth experimenting with glittering wish. Now I realize that you are only playing four growth spirals to ramp, and that may not be enough, but the 4 color mid range/control deck only played 4 deathrite shamans as ramp.

    The sideboard issue, maybe someone smarter than me can figure it out. I think the locked in choices are


    So you have ~7 spots to play with. I don't know how you'd build the main deck.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
  • posted a message on Bant Draw-Go Control
    You could probably figure out the math for how many lands you need, but it's above my knowledge.

    Some assumptions:

    1) You want to hit your first 4 land drops. Maybe even 6, as sometimes you just have to hard cast terminus to not die.
    2) You want growth spiral to ramp you in the first 3 turns.

    I also think cantripping on turn 1 is not what you want to do with these reactive control decks, because you don't know what cards you are looking for. But I guess if you have a "low" land count, you will probably just be scrying towards lands. Also with 3 colors, you might want to be playing shocks tapped a lot of the time. Using a cantrip on turn 1 isn't always a good play. I would say half the time (especially when you're on the play), you don't want to cantrip on turn 1 unless you are looking for lands.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
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