Agrus Kos, Wojek Veteran would like a word with all of you calling for more diversity. Not only was he a card, he was the main character for the original Ravnica story line, and was consequently a bad ass. Also, I'm still not entirely sure why we need diversity in this game. It does not effect what is actually printed on the card. Sure, I wouldn't mind if they printed different women or black people, whatever. However, what I do NOT want is people clamoring or protesting such things. The politics of feminism and equality are already subjects I've grown tired of as they've become increasingly over the top. I would like to keep magic free of such things.
I have played around with similar lists alot and have found That yes, you do need to be taking out the nobles. I'm not so sure about the waif's though, I think you want to be playing spells every turn and by game 2 your opponent will be doing the same just so they can race you. I have toyed around with the card Curse of Stalked Prey so that basically if you hit this on turn 2 all of your creatures become nobles and it really helps if they dont have that first turn pillar for your cackler because he as well as ash zealot get out of range. Since that is the only burn removal jund plays its pretty good. Besides I'd gladly cast an ash zealot t3 if I had one of those on the field because likely it would now be a 3/3 with first strike. Yeah, its a dead draw if you don't have any creatures but so is nightbird's clutches.
The reason I switched abrupt decay from the main board is that against reanimator or midrange decks it is absolutely useless. Also, against control it is useless 90% of the time unless they happen to have a detention sphere. Jace and Tamiyo are more and their deck doesn't even run many permanents. Its really only good against red aggro and zombie based decks which, while relevant, can be countered first game with murders until I can side in the decay if I feel the need.
I may add the nighthawks main but the main problem I see with that is that I will have to take out some kill spells which I believe are better because I would rather play a kill spell than play a creature with a kill spell attached (deathtouch) that can get both countered and killed by spells themselves. I do bring them in against the more aggressive decks though.
Im not sure on the sign in bloods and Im not totally sold on the whole underworld connections thing just yet. I can usually get a decent amount of card draw out of the Garruk in a pinch.
I can see some pretty funny situations arising where you cast bonfire from the top then instant cast Rakdos Charm for the last ability and end up dealing almost lethal while also wiping their board completely.
Still, I wish the first ability had been "Target player sacrifices a creature." as I think that graveyard hate cards are much too abundant at the moment.
Spoiler talk isn't permitted in the Standard main forum until the entire set has been spoiled, so your example is against the rules on top of being...well, pretty pointless. (Since these two cards won't even exist in Standard together.)
Tribal doesn't really matter in Standard anyway. Zombies is the only tribal deck to my knowledge, with that GW Elfwave deck being semi-tribal-mostly-comboish, and zombies only plays tribal because it has so many intrinsic synergies. The "humans" tribal has no real synergy for being based around humans, it just happens to have a lot of humans in it because they curve well.
Well, again, it was just an example that was readily available and the one that sparked the thought in the first place. Like I could see another two drop skeleton with a better effect being spoiled and then people would still hate on it for being a skeleton instead of a zombie. The card itself doesn't matter just the concept.
And I agree with your statement about tribal not mattering in standard which is why this was started. Although I think humans is probably the most tribal of all.
Why are we talking about Pod deck with Grim Roustabout? Pod will not be around then. Gravecrawler is why it matters without Cav or the lord.
Just using the card as an example, not saying it should be in a pod deck or will be in a pod deck. But yes I see the gravecrawler aspect. Im not trying to focus on the card Im just talking tribes in general.
Zombie tribal is, in fact a deck archetype, tier1.5.
gravecrawler, diregraf ghoul, diregraf captain (lord) cemetary reaper (lord) and geralf's messenger are all in the typical UB variant you see.
there is also the BR variant, the BG pod, and BGR pod. so, yeah i hope you now know why zombies matter.
Yes smartass. Thanks for avoiding the point of the thread entirely.
I know that but I dont see why it would really matter in a pod deck which is what Im saying. Of course if you build your deck around the tribal theme I guess it matters quite alot but if you build a deck without the lords why the hell does it matter if its not a zombie? People seem to undervalue skelletons most of the time just because they arent zombies and that really doesnt make too much sense to me.
I know in some regards it means alot what with lords and everything. A humans deck for sure. However, in some instances people seem to be putting too much emphasis on a card type. This may branch off into future card discussion but a good example of what I'm trying to get at is Grim Roustabout which was recently spoiled.
People really hate the card because it isn't a zombie and I really just dont get it. They say its a shame that it cant go in a zombie deck as a 2 drop just because it isnt a zombie. I mean I dont see too many zombie decks running zombie lords or caverns so why does it matter so much? I mean its certainly not as good as a blood artist but even that isn't a zombie. How much benefit would you really get if the Roustabout was a zombie? Maybe I'm missing something but I think sometimes people over value tribes.
And with that,
Do you guys try to build your standard decks with a tribal theme specifically in mind or do you just try to use the best cards? Why does it seem like sometimes tribes matter more than they should?
Strategy: The strategy for this deck is to come out with creatures that can easily be sacrificed, mostly for benefit or without a loss, via Infernal Plunge to bring out T2 Hellriders or Molten Dragons for early damage. If not then all of my creatures may easily be cast T4 or T5 at the latest. With low toughness creatures as well as Plunge Brimstone Volley can be cast (for free via Plunge) easily for its morbid effect making the <10 game easier or big creatures easier to kill.
Future changes?: The changes I am thinking about right now are removing both Oblivion Ring as well as Mimic Vat. They seem like they are just going to slow down my deck as they are more control cards and make a T3 blade splicer or T3 Riders/Dragon harder.
Faithless looting may become a maindeck in substitution for these as I can easily discard land cards or a myr/traveler by turn two just to pick up another pillar/volley or rider/dragon.
Cloudshift is another card that may do well, especially when combo'd with Blade Splicer for an extra golem at any time. Preferably when targeted by removal. Also saves my bigger guys from being killed by targeted removal.
Other: This is my first thread and first deck so any input would be very appreciated, especially in regards to the sideboard as I have no idea what Im really doing there....Divine would keep my moltensteel alive so that I could do extra damage with his effect after the wipe. Shocks are for more aggro based decks where I need to deal with threats as soon as they appear. That's really all I have for that.
I may add the nighthawks main but the main problem I see with that is that I will have to take out some kill spells which I believe are better because I would rather play a kill spell than play a creature with a kill spell attached (deathtouch) that can get both countered and killed by spells themselves. I do bring them in against the more aggressive decks though.
Im not sure on the sign in bloods and Im not totally sold on the whole underworld connections thing just yet. I can usually get a decent amount of card draw out of the Garruk in a pinch.
4x Thragtusk
2x Griselbrand
3x Deathrite Shaman
4x Golgari Keyrune
Spells: 18
3x Murder
2x Tribute to Hunger
3x Ultimate Price
4x Duress
4x Mutilate
2x Sign in Blood
2x Garruk Relentless
2x Garruk, Primal Hunter
1x Vraska the Unseen
Land: 24
4x Overgrown Tomb
4x Woodland Cemetery
16x Swamp
1x Tormod's Crypt
3x Vampire Nighthawk
2x Curse of Death's Hold
2x Ground Seal
3x Abrupt Decay
2x Barter In Blood
2x Sign In Blood
Still, I wish the first ability had been "Target player sacrifices a creature." as I think that graveyard hate cards are much too abundant at the moment.
Well, again, it was just an example that was readily available and the one that sparked the thought in the first place. Like I could see another two drop skeleton with a better effect being spoiled and then people would still hate on it for being a skeleton instead of a zombie. The card itself doesn't matter just the concept.
And I agree with your statement about tribal not mattering in standard which is why this was started. Although I think humans is probably the most tribal of all.
Just using the card as an example, not saying it should be in a pod deck or will be in a pod deck. But yes I see the gravecrawler aspect. Im not trying to focus on the card Im just talking tribes in general.
Yes smartass. Thanks for avoiding the point of the thread entirely.
I know that but I dont see why it would really matter in a pod deck which is what Im saying. Of course if you build your deck around the tribal theme I guess it matters quite alot but if you build a deck without the lords why the hell does it matter if its not a zombie? People seem to undervalue skelletons most of the time just because they arent zombies and that really doesnt make too much sense to me.
People really hate the card because it isn't a zombie and I really just dont get it. They say its a shame that it cant go in a zombie deck as a 2 drop just because it isnt a zombie. I mean I dont see too many zombie decks running zombie lords or caverns so why does it matter so much? I mean its certainly not as good as a blood artist but even that isn't a zombie. How much benefit would you really get if the Roustabout was a zombie? Maybe I'm missing something but I think sometimes people over value tribes.
And with that,
Do you guys try to build your standard decks with a tribal theme specifically in mind or do you just try to use the best cards? Why does it seem like sometimes tribes matter more than they should?
4 Clifftop Retreat
11 Mountain
9 Plains
Creatures
3 Blade Splicer
4 Doomed Traveler
4 Hellrider
4 Moltensteel Dragon
4 perilous Myr
4 Brimstone Volley
3 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Infernal Plunge
3 Pillar of Flame
2 Oblivion Ring (Cut This?)
Artifacts
1 Mimic Vat (Cut This?)
2 Divine Reckoning (DOJ?)
3 Shock
2 Faithless Looting
Strategy: The strategy for this deck is to come out with creatures that can easily be sacrificed, mostly for benefit or without a loss, via Infernal Plunge to bring out T2 Hellriders or Molten Dragons for early damage. If not then all of my creatures may easily be cast T4 or T5 at the latest. With low toughness creatures as well as Plunge Brimstone Volley can be cast (for free via Plunge) easily for its morbid effect making the <10 game easier or big creatures easier to kill.
Future changes?: The changes I am thinking about right now are removing both Oblivion Ring as well as Mimic Vat. They seem like they are just going to slow down my deck as they are more control cards and make a T3 blade splicer or T3 Riders/Dragon harder.
Faithless looting may become a maindeck in substitution for these as I can easily discard land cards or a myr/traveler by turn two just to pick up another pillar/volley or rider/dragon.
Cloudshift is another card that may do well, especially when combo'd with Blade Splicer for an extra golem at any time. Preferably when targeted by removal. Also saves my bigger guys from being killed by targeted removal.
Other: This is my first thread and first deck so any input would be very appreciated, especially in regards to the sideboard as I have no idea what Im really doing there....Divine would keep my moltensteel alive so that I could do extra damage with his effect after the wipe. Shocks are for more aggro based decks where I need to deal with threats as soon as they appear. That's really all I have for that.