MTG Salvation

Good SB card for Mono B to deal with gods, VoR, etc. Can allow you to skip to 6cmc. I see it being played in the B/W deck with Elspeth maybe. Its not nearly as good as Sever the Bloodline was though, and that wasn't in too many decks maindeck either.

"Card x is good against my deck, and I am sad. Card x must be broken."

Primeval Bounty, Clan Defiance, Gyre Sage, Duskmantle Seer, Ashiok, all cards I always want to make work in my decks, and all cards I end up cutting eventually

I do think out of all of them that Clan Defiance is just ridiculously underplayed, especially with Nykthos in the picture now. The anti-synergy with Garruk and Domri in Mono G or G/R keeps it low I feel.

Celestial flare is the best removal option in a mono white deck, IMO. You need something to deal with Stormbreath. Makes combat a massive pain for your opp. if they know you have it too.

Also Path of Bravery is an option if you want to go the Archangel of Thune route.

Quote from LewisCBR

Unless you can stick a Legion, black still wrecks this deck. Here is what my graveyard looked like after a game with black and then i'll post his graveyard, i.e. how he dealt with all my stuff.

My Graveyard: Xenogas, Xenogas, Chandra, Stormbreath, Elspeth
His Graveyard: Thoughtseize, Thoughtseize, Heros Downfall, Devour Flesh, Heroes Downfall

thats a total of 23 mana in my graveyard that he dealt with easily with 10 mana. He proceeded to play a couple Underworlds and then the game was over as he drew 3 cards per turn.

Thats some crap luck for you that he has (if its a stock list) 8 total outs to PWs in his deck, 4 of which have to be cast with the PW still in your hand, and he drew half of them to begin the game, then immediately stuck 2 CA engines on top of that. You know the odds of that happening are rough, right? Not unheard of, but not likely.

I'm 5-0 vs. Mono B in DEs with this list so far, and I think its the deck's best matchup and one of the main arguments for running this list. Not sure what the problem is, they're threat density is fairly low and you can answer everything with either mortars/chained/selesnya charm. After G1 I side out Angers for some mix of Last Breath Destructive Revelry and Assemble the Legion. Rarely goes to G3.

Quote from LewisCBR

I def like the first list you linked, not so much the list you posted. It is more to the point, with 3 and 4of's as opposed to trying to be cute with things like the keyrune, clan defiance, and primeval bounty. The first list has a goal and jams in the cards it needs to get there, the second list just doesnt feel as tight.

This deck is just a slight tweak to that one Brad Nelson Naya deck that won a GP (maybe it was a SCG Open). It kind of came out of no where, but was effective against the meta. Might be the time is right for that again?

EDIT: Here is the Brad Nelsom list from the end of October

http://www.starcitygames.com/events/coverage/deck_tech_naya_control_with_br.html

Ah, yeah, I do remember this thing.

This would pop up in DEs a while ago, but if I recall it was way more dependent on Assemble the Legion as its win con, and enchantment removal tended to wreck it.


I tested the first two lists, what they both lacked is late game inevitability that dodges removal, some way to gain life in grindy matchups, and something to do with all the mana you tend to build up. Hence the Bounty and the Defiance. I'm happy with both slots at the moment, but willing to tweak it.

Quote from AlexTomarelli

Guess you also have Defiance, and if they really become a problem you can use the new 5 mana walker stopper from BNG.

I guess my other question is if you know, vs most of the aggro metagame is anger really solid? is it working where say, Drown in Sorrow would fail?

I don't know if I would want to run anything with a 3 color requirement in this deck at all, 2 mana is hard enough, and the deck is skewed toward hitting a turn 3 AOTG more consistently.

Anger exiles, which is the biggest thing going for it. Against GW decks running VoR and the Xathrid Esper deck, its absolutely phenomenal. It also hits Sylvan caryatid, Reckoner, Fleecemane, etc. Ever since Anger of the Gods was spoiled, I assumed it would warp standard away from aggro. It hasn't done that at all, because its used mainly as a SB card rather than a MD sweeper. If more decks ran Anger MD, you would see this meta shift in a hurry. R/W devotion, G/R and that Esper deck wouldn't even be viable anymore, and Mono U would be fringe.

Anyway, that being said, I think drown in sorrow is a sweet card, but the place for it is in Jund. Right now, Jund midrange (which is fringe right now, admittedly) uses AOTG, but it has horrible synergy with Oooze, Caryatid, and even Reaper. Drown in Sorrow hits almost everything Jund wants to hit, doesn't kill their ramp sources, and doesn't exile GY food for the ooze.

Quote from AlexTomarelli

Really like this deck, and am kicking myself I didn't load up on Zenagos, Stormbreath and a few Chandra/Chained or I would probably play this at the PTQ this weekend.

If I was playing Orzhov, I would side in extra removal against this deck. Mainly a rachet bomb, blades, merciless eviction and my own walkers. What are your outs to opposing walkers such as Jace, Elspeth and even Ajani?

If there's a weakness to this deck (other than burn) its opposing PWs. To tell you the truth, so far in testing, most of them you really don't even worry about. Jace is a minor annoyance (hydras usually take him out), as is Ajani (stormbreaths usually take him out), but Elspeth in other midrange decks can obviously be a problem if the game gets to that point.

This would be another good reason to have a couple of Helix's available somewhere in the 75 to do some direct damage if needed.

Quote from DrewL217

The spike on Theros booster was a one-day thing (or, more accurately, a one time thing captured at the time that MTG Goldfish looked at prices): http://www.mtggoldfish.com/card/Theros+Booster+%5BTHS%5D

The price had been steady at around 3.0 for a while, was building up to 3.3 during the week and then suddenly shot up to 3.8 before dipping back down to the 3.0 range. This was not the result of a gradual buildup and the sudden decline, but it was a sudden rise and a sudden drop. Either the price went up to 3.8 and lots of people who had been sitting on THS boosters sold off and the price dropped again or (more likely), MTG Goldfish just happened to look at the prices at an odd time when some sort of fluctuation was going on. It is a very useful site, but it does only look at two bot chains and only once 24 hours, so there's bound to be the occasional blip.

You think the fact that every single Theros championship qualifier sealed has been full for the past week has had anything to do with that spike?

INTRODUCTION

This deck has popped up and begun putting up decent results on MTGO lately: http://www.mtgo-stats.com/decks/91045, http://www.mtgo-stats.com/decks/91183.

The deck is primarily a control deck which uses a large amount of removal, combined with token producing planeswalkers as well as few but highly efficient creatures.

Why run it? The main reason to run this deck in my eyes, is the removal suite. The deck runs 4x each of Anger of the Gods, Chained to the Rocks, Selesnya Charm, and Mizzium Mortars. Between the 4 of those spells, it has cheap answers to almost all major threats in the current standard meta.

THE DECK

Click on the above links to see different versions.

The deck I currently run is as follows:



I 3-1d a standard DE yesterday, with the above list. I beat Mono B devotion, Esper midrange, R aggro, and my loss was to Boros burn.

The deck is heavily favored vs. the #1 deck in the meta - Mono B. The matchup is incredibly favorable, especially after SB. The deck has solid matchups against most other decks in the meta as well, it does however, struggle vs. creature-light burn decks, which appear to be becoming more prevelant lately.

CARD CHOICES

The core of the deck is based around the following cards.

4x Loxodon Smiter - An uber efficent 3 drop, can't be countered, doesn't die to AOTG, solid stats.

Some mixture of Stormbreath/Polukranos - Both must answer creatures that often act as finishers. One of the above lists used Advent of the Wurm instead of Polukranos.

4x Chained to the Rocks - Only gets sided out vs. control. Answers nearly everything.

4x Mizzium Mortars - Only sided out vs. control again. Answers Blood Barons, Stormbreath, solid all-purpose removal.

4x Selesnya Charm - A great card in the meta, currently. I would consider dropping down to 2-3x MD depending on your meta. The decks it is phenomenal against are Mono B (DD), Monstrous Gruul (Polukranos, Colossus, lots of stuff) Esper midrange (Obzedat). It also exiles gods, and can be used as removal in the early game as a flash blocker for soldier of the pantheon or mutavault in a pinch.

4x Anger of the Gods - Sided out vs. Mono B. Every other matchup wants it. Having 4 in the MD allows you to just steal some G1s outright, especially against Esper mid, Boros, Mono U, and Gruul.

3x Xenagos - A really overlooked card, starting to pick up momentum though. He does exactly what this deck wants. Provides a token generating permanent with an option to ramp, which is used often in this build. The onyl matchup I side copies out is vs. Esper mid due to the fact that Soldier of the Pantheon and Lyev Skynights can take him out almost immediately with little resistance.

2x Elspeth - Solid finisher. Her -3 blows up all your creatures, so you usually don't use it too often in this build unless its desperate. She has solid synergy with Xenagos' +1 as well. I side her out vs, aggro, that's about it.

Swing slots:

Primeval Bounty, Chandra, Pyromaster, Keyrunes, Clan Defiance.

You can tailor the last 4 slots as you see fit.

I like a singleton bounty as primarily a way to gain life mid-late game, its a bit win-more, but you can sometimes ramp into it which can lock up games quick.

Chandra is primarily card draw in grindy games, as that's one thing this deck does not have. She can also do some work with her +1 vs, Esper midrange creatures.

The keyrune is some extra ramp for our 5 and 6 drops, and also can provide a solid blocker for late game mutavaults, etc. The manabase can be admittedly clunky, so it helps. Other lists use 2x.

I've been very happy with Clan Defiance here. We can generate a lot of mana in this deck, and its a great finisher or the occasional 2 for 1 if the opportunity presents itself.

SIDEBOARDING

(these are generalizations, obviously builds vary within an archetype and you should SB accordingly)

Mono B: -4x Anger of the Gods, -2 Polukranos, +2 Assemble the Legion, +2 Destructive Revelry, +2 Last Breath.

Mono U - -2 Elspeth, -1 Chandra, -4 Selesnya Charm, +4 Mistcutter Hydra, +3 Last Breath

RW Devotion - -4 Selesnya Charm, -1 Elspeth, +3 Last Breath, +2 Boros Reckoner

Esper midrange - +3 Destructive Revelry, -2 Xenagos, -1 Mizzium Mortars

UW Control/Esper Control - -4 Mizzium mortars, -4 Chained, -4 Anger of the Gods, +2 Boros Reckoner, +3 Destructive Revelry, +1 Chandra, +2 Assemble the Legion, +4 Mistcutter Hydra. Keep mortars in if Esper uses Blood Barons as finishers.




Going forward I would make room for a couple of Warleader's Helixs in the 75, probably bumping 1x seles charm into the SB. The deck struggles vs. creature-light burn decks, and could use some lifegain badly. Another option is to possibly put Centaur Healers in the SB, instead of Reckoners.

I sold my entire paper collection over a year ago to only play MTGO (aside from my pauper cube) and I haven't looked back. Best decision I ever made. So much cheaper, much better players, better payouts, you don't have to burn a day hanging out in a smelly LGS with random weird dudes if you want to play a tournament, all around a good idea for me, anyways.

Quote from DrewL217

I don't agree with this analysis. It's not really comparable to Angel of Serenity since a) two copies can't be chained together; b) there is no Unburial Rites in standard (which was a major factor in the Angel's price last year); c) it doesn't remove their creatures and in fact is pretty bad in creature match-ups; d) isn't really in a color combination that wants a five-drop which, like you said, already has another five-drop fighting for that slot. These are strikes against its potential in the future.

Actually, the price of 1.2 is a relatively new high for it (http://www.mtggoldfish.com/card/Underworld+Cerberus+%5BTHS%5D), and I imagine a lot of that is speculation because of Mogis, but, again, if B/R becomes a deck and if it even wanted a five-drop, I don't know if the Hound fits. The reality is that bulk type mythics from the fall set often do hover around 0.5 and do not rise (select any fall set mythic that was below a ticket in January and see how high they rise -- I have never seen one that had a big gain a year later).

Of course, speculation is more than just previous trends and I understand picking up this sort of card, but a lot of transactions with "negligible" loss add up quickly. Every set has bulk mythics and I think buying them just because they are cheap can be a trap.

I'm not super high on this card, but it has its upside vs. Stormbreath in one deck: Jund. I found a Jund midrange list I'm stoked on lately, and have been slightly underwhelmed by Stormbreath in there. His biggest positive is pro-white and haste obviously, but given the initial four toughness and the fact that he dies to doom blade/mortars/ultimate price, I wouldn't rule out Cerebrus for that slot. Cerebrus dodges all that removal, fights past DD, and if you run Oozes you can keep your opp from getting creatures back (if you remove them before Cerebrus hits). That new infest variant in BNG is gonna make Jund a bit more legit I think, as well.

Anyways, just saying Cerebrus might have some legs if Jund ever picks up steam. Stormbreath is better in every other deck that runs it though, for sure.

yeah, the only reason I like the ooze a bit better is they have to at least waste a removal spell on it or it becomes a threat (or at at the very least a blocker) on its own. Mana is really never an issue, this deck can often times drop an ooze turn 7 or so and gain 10 off it that turn alone.

The burn deck I'm running into the most runs exactly 8 creatures, so neither option works there anyway.

Quote from godovmischief

It's been going great for me. I've gone undefeated at FNM 3 weeks in a row. Here's the list I've been using:

DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
Creatures 3x Stormbreath Dragon 2x Polukranos, World Eater 3x Reaper of the Wilds 4x Sylvan Caryatid 3x Scavenging Ooze Spells 2x Rakdos's Return 4x Hero's Downfall 3x Read the Bones 4x Abrupt Decay 1x Dreadbore 1x Mizzium Mortars 3x Thoughtseize	Planeswalkers 2x Xenagos, the Reveler Lands 4x Overgrown Tomb 4x Blood Crypt 4x Stomping Grounds 4x Temple of Abandon 5x Swamp 3x Forest 1x Mountain	SB 1x Rakdos's Return 3x Mistcutter Hydra 2x Slaughter Games 4x Anger of the Gods 2x Golgari Charm 1x Doom Blade 2x Duress

The biggest difference between my list and most other lists is that I only run Anger of the Gods in the SB. I honestly hate how unsynergistic it is with Reaper of the Wilds, Sylvan Caryatid, and Scavenging Ooze and I don't think it's worth it MB when there's a lot of match-ups it's a dead card anyways. I would have a 4th Stormbreath Dragon but I don't have one. Also, Xenagos, the Reveler is great in here and definitely worth trying out if you haven't already.

I've been testing your list for the past two days, and I think its easily the best Jund list I've seen since rotation. My only swap is -1 Rakdos Return in the SB for another Mortars. This just beat out my RW deck as the deck I'm taking into DEs now, so thanks