Starting with Amonkhet, we're streamlining split cards a bit. This applies to all split cards, not just the aftermath cards.
Previously, we played a delicate dance when asking about converted mana cost. Sometimes Destined//Lead's CMC is most like 2: Goblin Dark-Dwellers can target it. Sometimes it's more like 4: Transgress the Mind can blorp it. Sometimes it's more like 6: Dark Confidant dings you for 6 if you reveal it.
This rewards players who dig into the rules and figure that out, but it baffles a lot of people, too. So now, it's simple: If Destined//Lead isn't on the stack, it has a converted mana cost of 6. Destined on the stack has a CMC of 2, and Lead on the stack has a CMC of 4, but Destined//Lead, any time it's not one or the other, has CMC 6.
(For the record, I'm not ignoring y'all - I'm working on a larger blurb for the website that'll answer more questions all in one place.)
Good. This is what most people would guess if they needed to know the CMC and didn't know the rules. They would assume when the spell is on the stack the CMC is whatever was cast, but otherwise in all other zones people would assume the CMC is everything combined. Now thats going to actually be true.
Huh. Suddenly that one copy of Far // Away in my Riddle of Lightning/Interpret the Signs deck will be a bit more useful. Not massively so, but it helps raise the average CMC of the deck without actually raising its curve.
It hurts the Expertises, but there are also a few positive interactions produced by this change in Standard: one interaction that might actually matter is that Dusk // Dawn will count as having a CMC of 9 if you flip it off of Sorin, Grim Nemesis. On a more janky note, Red's gotten a decent helping of CMC-matters cards over the last couple of blocks that I've always kind of hoped turned into a deck: Sin Prodder, Nahiri's Wrath, Combustible Gearhulk, and Spark of Creativity. It'd probably take more than one Constructed-playable Red Aftermath card for a deck taking advantage of that to have even a chance of working, but it's fun to think about.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"The true measure of all heroes is not what they achieve, but who they inspire." —Triumph of Gerrard
A couple years ago when I was still grinding this would have annoyed me, but I'm a filthy casual, now. This just makes the confusing, murky rulings on split cards cut and dry. It basically treats the split cards as one card, whereas before they were treated as two.
This rule change is intuitive, but pretty sad for a lot of decks. Breaking // Entering and Beck // Call decks were lighting up Modern and those decks are now 100% dead. Meanwhile it's been a long time since Fire // Ice on a Stick was a major force in any format but it was a fun casual deck that no longer works at all.
Good stuff in Standard though - Maybe if Red's "Aftermath" card is good we could see some sort of hyper-aggressive red deck with Sin Prodder and Nahiri's Wrath dishing out massive chunks of damage off of a playable card? Add more discard and milk that new Flameblade Adept for all he's worth alongside cards with low cycling costs and high CMCs.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Sufferer of EDHD
Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
I think this is a reasonable
Change. The rule before limits the design space for split cards (especially with a hugely different cmc). No more isochron or sunforger abuse, though.
This rule change is intuitive, but pretty sad for a lot of decks. Breaking // Entering and Beck // Call decks were lighting up Modern and those decks are now 100% dead. Meanwhile it's been a long time since Fire // Ice on a Stick was a major force in any format but it was a fun casual deck that no longer works at all.
Good stuff in Standard though - Maybe if Red's "Aftermath" card is good we could see some sort of hyper-aggressive red deck with Sin Prodder and Nahiri's Wrath dishing out massive chunks of damage off of a playable card? Add more discard and milk that new Flameblade Adept for all he's worth alongside cards with low cycling costs and high CMCs.
Define "lighting up Modern." Was there a single deck playing these cards at the top of GP this weekend?
This rule change is intuitive, but pretty sad for a lot of decks. Breaking // Entering and Beck // Call decks were lighting up Modern and those decks are now 100% dead. Meanwhile it's been a long time since Fire // Ice on a Stick was a major force in any format but it was a fun casual deck that no longer works at all.
Good stuff in Standard though - Maybe if Red's "Aftermath" card is good we could see some sort of hyper-aggressive red deck with Sin Prodder and Nahiri's Wrath dishing out massive chunks of damage off of a playable card? Add more discard and milk that new Flameblade Adept for all he's worth alongside cards with low cycling costs and high CMCs.
Define "lighting up Modern." Was there a single deck playing these cards at the top of GP this weekend?
This weekend was different because they were playing Team Unified Modern. Most smart teams played a BGx deck (DS/Abzan/Jund) a Colorless deck (Affinity/Tron/Eldrazi) and a Islands deck (UW/Grixis/Bant Eldrazi) because of the rules prohibiting sharing cards between teammates. The meta and deck choices have very little impact on the format as a whole because nobody else constructs based on these rules or has such a predictable meta to game for.
As for the clarification, I think it makes sense, but it sucks to see it nerf decks that weren't even doing amazingly in the first place.
should have been that way from the start, to be honest. sorry to see the weird combos go (since combo in general has seen better days), but it's not a thing that should have been in the first place.
Huh. Suddenly that one copy of Far // Away in my Riddle of Lightning/Interpret the Signs deck will be a bit more useful. Not massively so, but it helps raise the average CMC of the deck without actually raising its curve.
This functionality didn't actually change at all! It already counted as 5 for those cards. Just goes to show that this rules change was needed to make it simpler for everyone.
As fun as it was to cast expensive spells with the likes of Expertises, Brain in a Jar, and Isochron Scepter, this change makes a lot of sense, or, at least, more than one card having two CMCs. This does disrupt a handful of decks in Modern and Legacy, but it's not going to topple entire metagames.
A couple years ago when I was still grinding this would have annoyed me, but I'm a filthy casual, now. This just makes the confusing, murky rulings on split cards cut and dry. It basically treats the split cards as one card, whereas before they were treated as two.
All hail the Casual: the only logical outcome of Wizards' machinations
So in trying to make things simpler, they made it more complicated and ruined everyone's fun.
This is like the most arbitrary ruling change announcement ever, and should not be a thing. Yes I am slightly salty that I just finished building bird brain, but this goes beyond that. This is a big middle finger to johnnys everywhere. The logic is literally yes you found something interesting and cool, but we're going to take it away from you because it's confusing to people with the IQ of a goldfish. We're also going to make the new rules even more confusing and arbitrary.
Can WOTC just come off the "Too confusing for casual magic" BS. It's insulting more than anything. Casual players don't give a flying phelldagrif how things are ruled. They do whatever they want because they're casual players. It also feels like every time they say this, they affirm that they think casuals HAVE the collective IQ of a goldfish. They changed it because they didn't see the interaction, so they changed the ruling, functionally ERRATAing the cards, to cover their ass in case something broken happened, slapped the "Too confusing for casual magic" logo on it, and called it a day.
I don't get it. Were there really that many competitive players that didn't understand the interaction? Because I doubt the less competitive players would care about such a change anyways
it has nothing to do with "casuals" it has to do with logical, streamlined rules. The ENTIRE point of CMC is to give every card a singular numerical value that can be referenced by other cards. The old rule gave split cards 3 unique cmc's, the new rule gives them one. This is a completely logical rule change and fits with the goal of What CMC is supposed to be.
I sympathize with those who like jamming emrakul into play on turned 3 and modern, and I'm sorry it ruins your combo. But for the love of God don't be so disingenuous to say that this change was to appease the "casuals" because they're "too dumb."
Is it just me, or is Wizards trying to dumb down the game? Deck building is an attempt to be creative within the rules, doesn't mean rules should be made to usurp that creativity harder. It's not like expertise/fuse spells are dominating the league, they made this new rule to accommodate newer players, not unlike the planewalker decks (and they dumbed down the story to boot). Rather than making new rules to lessen creativity, Wizards should create new cards that could even the popularity, not killing something that's not remotely broken.
Is it just me, or is Wizards trying to dumb down the game? Deck building is an attempt to be creative within the rules, doesn't mean rules should be made to usurp that creativity harder. It's not like expertise/fuse spells are dominating the league, they made this new rule to accommodate newer players, not unlike the planewalker decks (and they dumbed down the story to boot). Rather than making new rules to lessen creativity, Wizards should create new cards that could even the popularity, not killing something that's not remotely broken.
Its not just you, but I wish it was. Wizards is not "dumbing down the game", the old rule was silly and it should have always been this way. Its fine to change CMC's when zones change, but a card in a zone should always have one CMC.
Is it just me, or is Wizards trying to dumb down the game? Deck building is an attempt to be creative within the rules, doesn't mean rules should be made to usurp that creativity harder. It's not like expertise/fuse spells are dominating the league, they made this new rule to accommodate newer players, not unlike the planewalker decks (and they dumbed down the story to boot). Rather than making new rules to lessen creativity, Wizards should create new cards that could even the popularity, not killing something that's not remotely broken.
No, they're not "dumbing" the game down. The point of CMC is to give every card a singular numerical value that can be referenced by other cards. This new rules means that split cards have exactly 1 CMC in every zone. This makes the rules more logically consistent. It dumbs nothing down. Casting a spell to put a 15/15 flying anihalator 6 into play on turn 3 isn't "smart." Neat, maybe, not not "smart."
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/638ws6/torrential_gearhulk_and_aftermath_ruling_from/dfsccuj/
Want to be a better Magic player? Read the rulings forum and check out the comprehensive rules!
Now where are all the actual spoilers? There's been nothing since the mothership articles.
It hurts the Expertises, but there are also a few positive interactions produced by this change in Standard: one interaction that might actually matter is that Dusk // Dawn will count as having a CMC of 9 if you flip it off of Sorin, Grim Nemesis. On a more janky note, Red's gotten a decent helping of CMC-matters cards over the last couple of blocks that I've always kind of hoped turned into a deck: Sin Prodder, Nahiri's Wrath, Combustible Gearhulk, and Spark of Creativity. It'd probably take more than one Constructed-playable Red Aftermath card for a deck taking advantage of that to have even a chance of working, but it's fun to think about.
http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/13649 - My all foil cube.
Good stuff in Standard though - Maybe if Red's "Aftermath" card is good we could see some sort of hyper-aggressive red deck with Sin Prodder and Nahiri's Wrath dishing out massive chunks of damage off of a playable card? Add more discard and milk that new Flameblade Adept for all he's worth alongside cards with low cycling costs and high CMCs.
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Change. The rule before limits the design space for split cards (especially with a hugely different cmc). No more isochron or sunforger abuse, though.
Define "lighting up Modern." Was there a single deck playing these cards at the top of GP this weekend?
Check out http://www.mtgbrodeals.com/author/john-murphy/ for my EDH articles!
This weekend was different because they were playing Team Unified Modern. Most smart teams played a BGx deck (DS/Abzan/Jund) a Colorless deck (Affinity/Tron/Eldrazi) and a Islands deck (UW/Grixis/Bant Eldrazi) because of the rules prohibiting sharing cards between teammates. The meta and deck choices have very little impact on the format as a whole because nobody else constructs based on these rules or has such a predictable meta to game for.
As for the clarification, I think it makes sense, but it sucks to see it nerf decks that weren't even doing amazingly in the first place.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
This functionality didn't actually change at all! It already counted as 5 for those cards. Just goes to show that this rules change was needed to make it simpler for everyone.
All hail the Casual: the only logical outcome of Wizards' machinations
The rule is good
This is like the most arbitrary ruling change announcement ever, and should not be a thing. Yes I am slightly salty that I just finished building bird brain, but this goes beyond that. This is a big middle finger to johnnys everywhere. The logic is literally yes you found something interesting and cool, but we're going to take it away from you because it's confusing to people with the IQ of a goldfish. We're also going to make the new rules even more confusing and arbitrary.
Can WOTC just come off the "Too confusing for casual magic" BS. It's insulting more than anything. Casual players don't give a flying phelldagrif how things are ruled. They do whatever they want because they're casual players. It also feels like every time they say this, they affirm that they think casuals HAVE the collective IQ of a goldfish. They changed it because they didn't see the interaction, so they changed the ruling, functionally ERRATAing the cards, to cover their ass in case something broken happened, slapped the "Too confusing for casual magic" logo on it, and called it a day.
I sympathize with those who like jamming emrakul into play on turned 3 and modern, and I'm sorry it ruins your combo. But for the love of God don't be so disingenuous to say that this change was to appease the "casuals" because they're "too dumb."
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Reality is but a perception of your being --
Visit my blog!!! - http://huffalump-magic.blogspot.com/
"The brain is wider than the sky,
For, put them side by side,
The one the other will include
With ease, and you beside."
—Emily Dickinson
For sales or trade, visit my blog or visit my ebay blog for my listings :http://myworld.ebay.com/arcane7828
881
Oooh Dicey:
[dice=1]100[/dice]
Its not just you, but I wish it was. Wizards is not "dumbing down the game", the old rule was silly and it should have always been this way. Its fine to change CMC's when zones change, but a card in a zone should always have one CMC.
No, they're not "dumbing" the game down. The point of CMC is to give every card a singular numerical value that can be referenced by other cards. This new rules means that split cards have exactly 1 CMC in every zone. This makes the rules more logically consistent. It dumbs nothing down. Casting a spell to put a 15/15 flying anihalator 6 into play on turn 3 isn't "smart." Neat, maybe, not not "smart."