MTG Salvation

Quote from wHITE SHADOW

You play null rod? doesn't that shut down all of our mana produces and swords? Doesn't seem very good but I suppose I could try it. Duplicant doesnt seem that good against fish as their biggest guy is a 4/4 (grunt). Razormane doesn't seem bad, but I have been playing Trikes and they work pretty well, except for all the yard hate from my opponents board welder tricks bad. I have also found the best way to beat fish is to resolve a chalice on 2 and protect it with spheres and wastelands.

Yes i play null rod in the board, you board out the swords for null rod. And grunt is not the biggest dude goyf is. Goyf is a impossible creature to kill without duplicant.

Would 1 copy of banefire fit in this deck at all?

Definitely not.

Please excuse what I think is a fairly ignorant question:

What is the major purpose of solemn simulacrum? I know that it gets you a land when he comes in and draws a card when he leaves (and is helped by Welder), but I feel like you just want a big beater in this slot rather than some sort of random utility. Why is he so ubiquitous to the lists? I feel like there has to be a better choice, unless I'm missing something.

IMO he is a nice creature because he is a good blocker, good attacker (especially with Sword of Fire and Ice), somewhat accelerates you and draw's you a card (which this deck lacks a good source of). With Welder active you can really take advantage of his abilities as you mentioned yourself. He is not mandatory to the deck, but I think I would miss him if I were to cut him out completely, but that may differ depending on what he gets replaced with.

I run Juggs, Trisk and Karn as my beaters and so-far they've been more than enough for me.

Is this the superior version over to MUD aggro? Is blue-based workshop aggro feasible (master of etherium, recall, time walk etc)

I know it is not official yet.

the new golem in worldwake should replace juggernaut in every version of this deck, assuming that it is printed as shown.

this deck now has access to 13 sphere effects.

Haha, came here to post that too. For those who didn't see:


Lodestone Golem 4
Artifact Creature - Golem
Non-artifact spells cost 1 more to cast.
5/3

Sphere + Juggernaut for no additional cost. Nice

Was on my way to post it to, this is awesome workshop agro and stax variants will love this guy

I love the comments I am seeing already:

He's not as good as Juggy - He can be BLOCKED by WALLS!

Clear leader for the best vintage card in the set so far. It's huge for this archetype.

Not really. He is a good replacement for Juggernaut, but he isn't the end all be all for the format, or even the archtype. Remember, LG does not slow down Moxen, Lotus, Key, Vault, Artifact Accelerants, etc. He is a decent player, but he might be put into a category with Ethersworn Canonist, which many people felt was going to be crazy good too.

IMO, its gonna be da bomb in MUD (in replacement over good ol juggs). Could see him in welder mud builds as well. This gives aggro shops the tool it needs to maybe pull in some top table finish. Why? because it gives you tempo and disruption in one big fat package. Of course its too bad it doesnt prevent opponents artifact accel, but its better than jugs because this guy at least does something other than being fat. If you pair this guy with Challice, Null Rod or any other sphere, you got a good thing going on. Especially with an active welder on your side.

but of course, only time can tell if its gonna be the new all-star. One thing is for sure, unless we see a whole lot of defenders and walls blocking the way. Its better than juggs.

Quote from returburken

Why is everyone talking about replacing Jugger? Ive played a non-colored workshop aggro for 6 years now and ive been eager to replace Su-Chi ever since I started it, but never found the creature.

For me, the deck will be the same as always except 4 additional wannabe-spheres, which makes it 13 spheres, 4 chalice, 4 tangle wire maindeck with same amount of beaters as always.

the reason they are talking about replacing juggs in this forum is that this is the mono red aggro stax forum. We do not run suchi, and the deck list are not mono brown.

Those who want to cut solemn, dont. You need a source to get red mana, this guy is an amazing draw engine late game, i block the same tarmagofy for 8 turns with 2 solemns and a welder. drawing cards and netting a land drop. This deck will be 13 spheres like the mud varients, it will still have it chalices, null rod and magus of the moons. This is not the bomb card for vintage, but it is a bomb card for this deck.

I play Mono Red Stax, but not an aggro build. Basically it's just Brown controlish Stax with red for Barb Ring and Welder as that enables you to pull some rather silly interactions with Bazaar.

I personally think that Loadstone Golem is amazing for a more traditional non-aggro Stax. Think of it this way, if your turn 1 Sphere gets FoWed, you're not going to recover fast enough by playing a turn 2 Sphere or something else as they probably already landed their moxens and other playables. However, with this Golem you put them in a position where if they counter your turn 1 Sphere they leave themselves open to a turn 2 semi-Sphere and serious beater. This makes the deck a lot harder to counter and play around as you can't simply counter turn 1 and more or less be way ahead.

Why didn't regular Juggernaut work in this fashion? He simply didn't fit into the build, sure he put them on a clock but he didn't have the ability to provide some self protection from something like Grudge and so forth. Worse yet he didn't block that Goyf when you really wished he did, or even the new Silkie. Not to mention by that point you'd rather Tangle Wire or Null Rod anyway and just hope to stall out until you drew a more serious answer. This guy allows you to get that so-so taxation affect while putting them on a clock and that's huge... He's basically your answer to their Turn 1 FoW, something that was highly needed.