MTG Salvation

what would you replace the wire with? Crucible? Also does a sundering titan belong in this deck? Its not impossible to cast, plus its awesome with welder tricks.

Running a few Gorilla Shaman isn't necessarily a bad idea... I love nuking SoLoMoxen.

Quote from huey366

what would you replace the wire with? Crucible? Also does a sundering titan belong in this deck? Its not impossible to cast, plus its awesome with welder tricks.

i don't know what do replace wire with you run less of everything that i do. I currently main deck leyline of the void. But gorrila shaman also work with in this deck.

Titan is over kill, it is horrible if it is in your opening hand.

You could drop the 3 tanglewires and opt for some 1 of's (e.g. pithing needle, enlightened tutor, Jitte).

I would just take out the wires and increase the numbers of welder/juggs/simulacrum. It should increase consistency.

I played the list as is on Saturday at a 10 proxy, unlimited walk event in Orange CA. I got to the top 8 and had to play against Ichorid in the first round of the top 8. I played a turn one sphere and magus and he dropped a bazaar and contagion on my magus...it was sick. I didnt have any problem with the wires...they actually won me a game against Grim Oath, and against UBW fish, allowing me to beat in with a sworded up magus/welder to win. I really need the most help with my board. My board looked like this.

• 3 REB
  
• 3 STP
  
• 4 Tormods crypt
  
• 2 Aeon Hub
  
• 3 shattering spree
  

I really have no idea what else I could be using. I really have found that Leyline is ineffective against Ichorid, and flash is not an issue.

I like to side Yixlid Jailer or Tsabo's Web vs. ichorid. It will pretty much shut that deck down. Though crypts are good too. You can also try Leyline of the Void

but aside from the web you would need to splash some kind of black... defeating the mono-red aspect. (though i guess you are already there with STP in SB)

Tsabo's Web seems very weak as well. I prefer Aeon Hub to keep the Ichorids in the bin instead of in play. Removing the bridges after dropping an Aeon hub is usually pretty easy with a Triskilion or with welder tricks. Adding a 3rd color for Jailer seems the best but at the same time the mana base is already pushed to the limit. But I do agree that Jailer with Magus backup is the best possible answer.

After checking out a couple ichorid deck discussions it seems that Yixlid Jailer and Leyline of the Void seem to cause the most disruption with tormod's crypt being fairly weak. you could also try sideboarding extirpate as that gets rid of ichorid for good and they can't respond to it.

I still think that main decking a second color is the wrong idea. This deck works because you drop lock pieces then moon. You are still able to cast everything you play and they can't. Oath is this deck worst matchup, you have to rely on duplicant and welder tricks. I main deck Leyline of the void. Yes sometimes you draw it and it is a dead card, but other times you drop it on turn zero and no one is ready for it. Hub is also a nice tough agianst oath. You should not be worried about ichorid with this deck.

It is usually not worth the effort to use leylines against oath. For this match-up it is best with Duplicant and Spawning Pit/Greater Garg

guys what do yuo think about grim poppet in this deck, instead of triskelion. It is a question before start jumping up and down.

Triskelion has a lot of things going for it over poppet. Most importantly, it can hit players, and going down rather than up. In this manner, trike is at least decent against creatureless decks whereas poppet is bad. Trike also does nice things like killing itself in certain circumstances (enabling all sorts of welding shenanigans ;)). Poppet also has that extra 1, which can matter a lot in many circumstances.

Poppet isn't bad, really, I just think that its outclassed in this regard.

I agree with Glix here that Trike is just better 90% of the time. But in a creature heavy meta, IE lots of fish, bomberman, GAT, and Goblins I wouldnt feel bad about boarding a couple.

Actually a friend of mine played my shop list at a recent time walk event and lost to fish due to a meddling mage naming trike...so in this case having 2 in the board to split with the trikes would have been very good.

I like this deck alot here is the build I was thinking of making:


What do you all think?

Why do you want two Karn? To make your moxen 0/0s?
In all seriousness, the only use they have would be making the Thorns/spheres/equipment into creatures.... which just makes them easier to remove. Is there something I'm missing?

It looks good. Karn seems a bit slow, I might consider replacing him with Trike. The sideboard is a bit odd, however. What is Jester's Scepter for? Eon hub is a bit expensive for what it answers (oath, fluxes), but that could be a meta call.

Quote from Glix

It looks good. Karn seems a bit slow, I might consider replacing him with Trike. The sideboard is a bit odd, however. What is Jester's Scepter for? Eon hub is a bit expensive for what it answers (oath, fluxes), but that could be a meta call.

Honestly I don't know enough about the format yet to make the sideboard, so I think I am going to remove that for the moment....

As for Karn, if I am reading him right, he is an added form of artifact removal for removing the opponents moxen and stuff like that if I am not mistaken, but I guess I could remove 1 Karn, and 1 Gorilla Shaman to add in 2 Triskelion?

No, you're reading it right. Karn is generally good in standardized stax for that reason. However, in this deck, he is a 5 mana shaman with minimal impact (your non-creature artifacts don't have an very high casting cost) that can't even effectively attack if your opponant has any creatures. Keep in mind that this deck, at its heart, isn't just stax, but AGGRO stax, and therefore what you want is to drop cheap effective artifacts like spheres while applying a lot of pressure before your opponent can stabilize. To this end, Karn can be ineffective. Trike, on the other hand, is a 4/4 that doesn't get turned off when blocked by a 1/1, removes problem creatures like opposing welders and confidants and does nasty things with an active welder, allowing you to kill most creatures and get in some extra damage (not insignificant).

As for your board, here are some options, depending on your meta:
Jester's Cap - Essentially game over against combo/oath
REB/Pyroblast - Strong against blue based decks, very strong against painter
Duplicant - Strong against creature decks. You may want to test Grim Poppet as well, but I can't really attest to that.
Shattering Spree - More artifact removal if neccessary.

Thank you Glix

Quote from Glix

It looks good. Karn seems a bit slow, I might consider replacing him with Trike. The sideboard is a bit odd, however. What is Jester's Scepter for? Eon hub is a bit expensive for what it answers (oath, fluxes), but that could be a meta call.

it is also very good against ichorid, keeping them in the bin and off your face. Its much harder for them to flashback a dread return if they have to do it off of narco's.

Well, they also have bridges + therapy to generate the creatures, and arbor in some versions. Shutting off ichorid seems like a rather round about way of hurting Ichorid (as opposed to the sb leyline), particularly at 5 mana (at which point Ichorid could very well have already won).

First post...whew here we go.


Recently threw together a build of this deck type and I'm just struggling over the use of two cards. Mana Crypt and Mana Vault. Aside from the wonderful mana curve they can throw you on with this type; i.e. First turn shop crypt mox trinisphere juggernaut ect. Are they worth the overall negative effects after that inital first turn win combo? Playing against a trinket mage p.dreadnaut deck I lost 12 life to crypt and lost to a 5th turn Goyf who I couldnt seem to answer. Any suggestions out there?

Decklist

Land:
6 Mountains
4 Workshops
2 Ancient Tomb
Tolarian Academy
4 Wastelands
1 Strip mine
Artifacts:
All moxen
Black Lotus
Mana Crypt
Mana Vault
Sol Ring
4 Juggernauts
4 Solemn Simulacrum
3 Triskelions
4 Sphere of Resistance
4 Thorns of Amethyst
1 Trinisphere
3 Swords of Fire and Ice
Creatures:
4 Goblin Welder
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Gorilla Shaman

SB:
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Void Chalice
2 Viashino Heretics
2 Duplicants
4 Red Elemental Blast

-Contemplate this on the Tree of Woe. Crucify Him. Thulsa Doom

That list looks good.

Usually crypt and vault are okay. The boost can really help early on, and then late game you weld/shaman them away, and vault you can untap once you are stabilized. I mean, yes they can be painful, but I think, and this is speculation, that more times than not the damage, if it occurs, will not be significant unless you are losing anyway. Granted there will be games like the one you mentioned, but 12 damage seems to indicate that you got pretty unlucky with either flips or draws or both.

Well guys Aggro stax wins at Blue Bell PA yesterday. I won a mishra's workshop for the effort. Here is the list that i ran for the day.



Everyone knows how the deeck plays out, MVP of the day Jester's Cap. I resolved 1 of these against painter and it was game over, same with flash.

I the only way i handle gofy is to chump block it if you have two, duplicant helps there. Also try to set of welder tricks with simulacrum.