This is by far my favorite deck, as it wins turn 1 75% of the time, and turn 2 the other 25%.
At least, in a vacuum. Any ideas on how to make it more hate-resistant without slowing it down? I tried Duress, but having to have 1 extra mana slowed it down dramatically, and having to use 2 cards for FoW sets the deck back a turn most of the time. Heres the list I'm currently running:
The reason I include Yawgmoth's Will as a tutor, is that it basically read "Search your library for a copy of each card in your graveyard and put it into your hand, whether is its there or not."
I was thinking about throwing 1 or 2 Auriok Salvagers and a single Pyrite Spellbomb into the build as a secondary win condition.
Are there any answers for Chalice of the Void that I don't know of? Or for that matter any of the cards that shut this deck down (Tangle wire, Null Rod, etc.)
Is this deck still viable in Vintage? Ive been out of the vintage scene for some time.
-2 Tendrils of Agony (you don't need 4, barely anyone runs more then 2)
+1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (if you want a first turn win, there is no question, this is the best card for that)
+1 Necropotence (second turn win anyone?)
-4 Sleight of Hand (There is better cards out there. Get something that puts all that mana acceleration to use)
+1 Time Walk (This will always be better then Sleight of Hand)
+1 Timetwister (Again card draw is nice in this deck)
+1 Windfall (Card Draw is invaluable in a deck like this)
+1 Imperial Seal (This card is especially useful in a Tendrils Deck)
Will Chromatic Star still draw a card even if you've played Will that turn? The wording says "When ~ is put into a GY from play", as opposed to Spheres including it as part of the sac effect.
Will Chromatic Star still draw a card even if you've played Will that turn? The wording says "When ~ is put into a GY from play", as opposed to Spheres including it as part of the sac effect.
I didn't even realize that use case. I just know Chromatic Star can be awesome with Goblin Welder and Tinker. In general it is a better card, however, I suppose that if you are really dependent on Yawgmoth's Will then Chromatic Sphere is better. On that note, you could probably change the amount of exchange chromatic sphere with chromatic star in my last post. The rest of it still holds true, such as that the deck should have Vampiric Tutor, Merchant Scroll, and Yawgmoth's Bargain.
You might also want to test out a couple Street Wraith. It certainly helps when goldfishing, however, it can disadvantageous in real games.
jhuni for the most part is right on in terms of commentary on this.
Here's a writeup for Meandeck Tendrils from this year - both of these articles were originally premium but should be able to be viewed by anyone - great reading.
Beralt the first article that you linked to is for a "new" (04/2009) Grim Long list, not the Eggs deck.
For the OP, I think that list is very outdated. If you want a glass cannon with no disruption I'd just use Belcher. If you want a storm deck then TPS, ANT or Drain Tendrils are all very good.
Well I think of the list in the first list as being an evolved Meandeck Tendrils - which we have come to know as Grim Long, but yes they are different decks, the eggs have passed out of favor and if they are played Chromatics seem superior.
The comparison to Belcher is very valid - these are both decks that seek to go off as soon as possible and have little defense or disruption. There is another thread currently featuring Channel Mirror, which I think also could be lumped into this category. These are decks that are capable of going off very fast, but often don't offer much in the way of protection or disruption.
This brings up what I consider one of the main issues of Vintage, how many cards your winning method takes up - Belcher for example often has 50ish cards devoted to winning the game and only a few spells that can disrupt the opponent, protect the winning condition or play defense of some sort. Meandeck Tendrils (at least the deck in the original post) is almost wholly devoted to winning, chosing to race most opponents, keeping many lines of victory available. I have seen other valid winning conditions such as Time Vault/Key and then the remainder of the deck devoted protection, disruption and utilty. It seems when people come up with new winning conditions and they are held up in comparison to Vault/Key they cannot offer the efficiency and/or utilty of many of the Tez decks that are in existence.
I love Tendrils/TPS/Grim Long/Meandeck Tendrils as a deck type, but it seems if your deck falters or your opponents deck is somehow faster you just simply lose - while if you have the potential to just delay your opponent, and have a reasonable amount of tutoring you can assemble your own winning conditions.
With that said, good luck playing it, it's a fun deck that has all sorts of potential, especially in the hands of a good pilot. If your looking for more protection, you are going to have to sacrifice speed or stability - but maybe the truth is out there - show us what it is.
One thing to consider is Trinisphere which completely destroys this deck and any Belcher build. This deck should at least have Force of Will for such an event.
The idea with Chain of Vapor is if you have three moxes in play and three lands you can sacrifice the lands and replay all the moxs, boosting your storm count by three.
Your 75% win percentage will go down 0 playing against a competitive vintage deck. Remove some of the tendrils and some of the lower class draws and replace with FoW or Pact of negation for a start.
Love the deck. How do you get around a Spoils of the Vault suicide? I've had that happen a few times, and it's been when there are still 4 of the card being searched for in the deck.
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At least, in a vacuum. Any ideas on how to make it more hate-resistant without slowing it down? I tried Duress, but having to have 1 extra mana slowed it down dramatically, and having to use 2 cards for FoW sets the deck back a turn most of the time. Heres the list I'm currently running:
4x Dark Ritual
4x Cabal Ritual
1x Lion's Eye Diamond
1x Black Lotus
1x Mox Pearl
1x Mox Sapphire
1x Mox Jet
1x Mox Ruby
1x Mox Emerald
1x Mana Crypt
1x Lotus Petal
1x Mana Vault
1x Sol Ring
4x Darkwater Egg
4x Chromatic Sphere
Draw/Tutor:
4x Night's Whisper
4x Spoils of the Vault
4x Land Grant
4x Repeal
4x Sleight of Hand
1x Ponder
1x Brainstorm
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Demonic Consultation
1x Ancestral Recall
1x Yawgmoth's Will
4x Tendril's of Agony
Land:
1x Bayou
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Tropical Island
The reason I include Yawgmoth's Will as a tutor, is that it basically read "Search your library for a copy of each card in your graveyard and put it into your hand, whether is its there or not."
I was thinking about throwing 1 or 2 Auriok Salvagers and a single Pyrite Spellbomb into the build as a secondary win condition.
Are there any answers for Chalice of the Void that I don't know of? Or for that matter any of the cards that shut this deck down (Tangle wire, Null Rod, etc.)
Is this deck still viable in Vintage? Ive been out of the vintage scene for some time.
Sales Lot
Chromatic Star > Chromatic Sphere > Darkwater Egg
Changes:
-4 Darkwater Egg
+4 Chromatic Star
-2 Chromatic Sphere
+1 Merchant Scroll (With ancestral it is 1UU draw three cards)
+1 Vampiric Tutor (Arguably the best tutor in the game)
-2 Tendrils of Agony (you don't need 4, barely anyone runs more then 2)
+1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (if you want a first turn win, there is no question, this is the best card for that)
+1 Necropotence (second turn win anyone?)
-4 Sleight of Hand (There is better cards out there. Get something that puts all that mana acceleration to use)
+1 Time Walk (This will always be better then Sleight of Hand)
+1 Timetwister (Again card draw is nice in this deck)
+1 Windfall (Card Draw is invaluable in a deck like this)
+1 Imperial Seal (This card is especially useful in a Tendrils Deck)
I didn't even realize that use case. I just know Chromatic Star can be awesome with Goblin Welder and Tinker. In general it is a better card, however, I suppose that if you are really dependent on Yawgmoth's Will then Chromatic Sphere is better. On that note, you could probably change the amount of exchange chromatic sphere with chromatic star in my last post. The rest of it still holds true, such as that the deck should have Vampiric Tutor, Merchant Scroll, and Yawgmoth's Bargain.
You might also want to test out a couple Street Wraith. It certainly helps when goldfishing, however, it can disadvantageous in real games.
Here's a writeup for Meandeck Tendrils from this year - both of these articles were originally premium but should be able to be viewed by anyone - great reading.
http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/vintage/17307_So_Many_Insane_Plays_The_Fastest_Deck_in_Vintage_Waterbury_Day_2.html
and a writeup that is quite a bit older but essentially trace the origins of this insane deck.
http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/vintage/5820_Burning_Through_Type_One_With_The_Fastest_Deck_In_Magic.html
There are three parts to this article if you're a real glutton for punishment.
Part 2: http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/expandnews.php?Article=5856
Part 3: http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/article/5950.html
For the OP, I think that list is very outdated. If you want a glass cannon with no disruption I'd just use Belcher. If you want a storm deck then TPS, ANT or Drain Tendrils are all very good.
Trade Thread
Modern
RWGBurnGWR
GUInfectUG
GRTronRG
UWGifts TronWU
URBGrixis DelverBRU
RGWZooWGR
Legacy
BUWTinFinsWUB
UROmniTellRU
BURTESRUB
GElves!G
GBPSIBG
RGBelcherGR
UBRGWDredgeWGRBU
UBAffinityBU
RBurnR
Vintage
UBGDoomsdayGBU
0Martello Shops0
GElves!G
UBTPSBU
UBelcherU
0Dredge0
The comparison to Belcher is very valid - these are both decks that seek to go off as soon as possible and have little defense or disruption. There is another thread currently featuring Channel Mirror, which I think also could be lumped into this category. These are decks that are capable of going off very fast, but often don't offer much in the way of protection or disruption.
This brings up what I consider one of the main issues of Vintage, how many cards your winning method takes up - Belcher for example often has 50ish cards devoted to winning the game and only a few spells that can disrupt the opponent, protect the winning condition or play defense of some sort. Meandeck Tendrils (at least the deck in the original post) is almost wholly devoted to winning, chosing to race most opponents, keeping many lines of victory available. I have seen other valid winning conditions such as Time Vault/Key and then the remainder of the deck devoted protection, disruption and utilty. It seems when people come up with new winning conditions and they are held up in comparison to Vault/Key they cannot offer the efficiency and/or utilty of many of the Tez decks that are in existence.
I love Tendrils/TPS/Grim Long/Meandeck Tendrils as a deck type, but it seems if your deck falters or your opponents deck is somehow faster you just simply lose - while if you have the potential to just delay your opponent, and have a reasonable amount of tutoring you can assemble your own winning conditions.
With that said, good luck playing it, it's a fun deck that has all sorts of potential, especially in the hands of a good pilot. If your looking for more protection, you are going to have to sacrifice speed or stability - but maybe the truth is out there - show us what it is.
Actually all you need is Sphere of Resistance, Chalice of the Void, Null Rod or any disruption and this deck is pretty much screwed. Which is a good reason to include 4x Force of Will and Merchant Scroll/Hurkyl's Recall. Chain of Vapor may also be invaluable for storm and for stopping things like Null Rod.
The idea with Chain of Vapor is if you have three moxes in play and three lands you can sacrifice the lands and replay all the moxs, boosting your storm count by three.
My Sale Thread