Can you share this list? I haven't seen a competitive Bob'Storm deck yet that runs 4x Tendrils of agony...even if that's a safe approuch I don't see the clearity on why you're doing so.
You're just missing out on 2 other slots that prove to have more use in the end result, and I think I stand with others when saying so.
For me 3 Bob's, 2 tendrils, and half dozen power threat cards mix well in tadem disruption/forces provide more then enough reasoning to add some other cards that work well in setting up your efforts.
Just food for thought;
S.M.
Soly played at Worlds with 3 Tendrils and 4 Bobs, so some others like more than 2. For who created the deck idea, someone on Team GWS (or a comination of effort from the team) definitely did. I mean the deck is called GWSx.
EDIT: Soly just posted about GWSx on The Mana Drain. Here's his suggested list:
Hey Doom? Can you find the last time mike placed first with a current build of {HIS} Bob'Storm? So far I have a nada on finding one, but I can find others that share different angles of the deck. I completely understand the meta so to speak, maybe a tourney report would help out some of the reasonings with his choices.... after WE {the readers} get past all his whining on his matchups reports it might shed some light.
Thanks for giving that info good member.
S.M.
Hey, I don't know whether he's played it in tournaments since Worlds, but he explains some of the choices in the GWSx thread in the Improvement section at TMD if you want to take a look.
Hey, I don't know whether he's played it in tournaments since Worlds, but he explains some of the choices in the GWSx thread in the Improvement section at TMD if you want to take a look.
Thanks Doom, and yeah I will take a fast peek to see where his logic lays yet again.
To speak more clearly, Soly or GWS or whomever created the deck first is of little bearing and any comments related to Mike or his team will not be tolerated. This isn't directed to anyone in particular, but let's keep these threads free of sarcasm and useless criticism.
Indeed a strong mold, and having those extra Hurkyl's could never be a bad option "Bomb Card" to have on hand. The deck makes alot of sense taking in the new era of Stax....I should note the lack of FoW's is a bit scary {think other match-ups}, but with those 5 ways of hand disruption it allows the whole deck to work off a basic core. I think this build has alot of things going for it in a positive manner, and I'm surely sleeving it later to VS Brown Waters tonight.
Thanks C-Pride,
S.M.
This just won the last Blue Bell, I think it had 47 players. Jeff Folinus and Steve Nowakowski put this together based on GWSx, but with Force of Will instead of Duress; the idea being that Duress is weak in our meta and is safe to move to the SB. Steve knocked Jeff out of contention, but if you back out that match the two of them (with identical 75/75) went 8-2. Steve went on to win the tournament.
This is the newest version, and I must add a worthy build to throw together and test. No Forces, 5 Duress effects, and it appears to sport every solid broken card a mage can pack. Oh...Bob
S.M.
The only differences between that and the list I use that Duncan Keijtzer (spelling?) posted on TMD is -1 Hurkyl's + 1 Ad Nauseum, and -1 Island + 1 Tolarian Academy. I don't think I'd make that change too quickly myself, there are a lot of shops running around. Though when shops go down in popularity again, I would probably put the Ad Naus. back in, and academy too.
Obviously wildly different from the list right above your post though.
This deck has really got my attention lately. I think I'll have to sleeve it up and see how it plays.
Is Jace v.2.0 needed in this archetype? If so, how many? I only got a japanese one
Jace isn't needed, but it's hard to tell someone not to run him. He's such a good walker.
I'm currenty playing the new version I posted, and it's what it's as for a storm deck. Monster hands, fast tempo releases lol, and ofcourse a steady flow of FU via the 5 ways to heart rip someone main...solid
S.M.
Don't get me wrong, playing Dredge is one of my guilty pleasures, along with eating chunky monkey ice cream and watching my Gilmore Girls DVDs in my underpants, but it's pretty much, in my opinion, the very last deck that I'd want anyone to start a career in Vintage with.
Basically, I'm wondering: Are 4 H Recalls too much? I understand that this has a terrible terrible MU against MUD, so I figured this many Recalls would keep you in the game. Then again, I fear the new Predator Tezz lists that run 3 Jace and go for the beats. I might be able to race them with Duress and Tinker/Robot, but hmmmmm..... I wanted 2 Spell Snare in the SB so I could hold them off, but I guess I'm asking do I really need to try and race anyone? I playtested this and had an absolutely fantastic turn two goldfish (*it was against a casual deck :rolleyes:*)
And I'm scared as hell of Dredge, so I put in a ton of hate.
P.S. I'm new to this, so I really hope I didn't screw up on posting / sorry if I did, y'all
And for the record, I'm not a Vintage mastermind by any means so I hope I don't go off the wall from what everyone else was talking about.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
CURRENTLY PLAYING
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
I was going to say that 4 Hurkyl's is way to much, but then I saw you had 2 MD and 2 SB which is definitely fine. You might want to trade one out for Rebuild to dodge Chalice.
CURRENTLY PLAYING
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
for your list, why run mind's desire when you've already cut Yawgmoth's Bargain for the potential life issue?
That is a good question, sirra. Mind's Desire is a complete finisher, and you try to have a ton of bombs to keep a high tempo. Besides, Desire for 3 brings your storm count up to 8, and the cards you flip can really really help. Plus, Yawgmoth's Broken, as you said, gobbles up life and in playtesting it didn't seem to work out too well.
So the short answer is, it's a finisher of the best kind that doesn't require paying life, which is a commodity in short order since you have 4 FOW, 1 MisD, 2 Jace, etc.
CURRENTLY PLAYING
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
By the way, against Noble Fish builds is Massacre or Slaughter Pact a better answer? I know that they all run Tundra and Bob Tendrils runs Underground Sea, so theoretically Massacre could wipe their supression (Meddling Mage, True Believer) in the longer games. However, Slaughter Pact seems to work better if you go off earlier because they only would have 1-2 creatures by that time, one of which would probably be a threat/supression.
Basically, what I'm asking is how long does it take to kill the opponent in the Fish MU?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
CURRENTLY PLAYING
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
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You're just missing out on 2 other slots that prove to have more use in the end result, and I think I stand with others when saying so.
For me 3 Bob's, 2 tendrils, and half dozen power threat cards mix well in tadem disruption/forces provide more then enough reasoning to add some other cards that work well in setting up your efforts.
Just food for thought;
S.M.
EDIT: Soly just posted about GWSx on The Mana Drain. Here's his suggested list:
3 Underground Sea
1 Badlands
1 Island
1 Swamp
4 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Scalding Tarn
Artifacts
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sensei's Divining Top
Creatures
4 Dark Confidant
Enchantments
1 Necropotence
Instants
4 Dark Ritual
3 Cabal Ritual
1 Brainstorm
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Rebuild
2 Chain of Vapor
1 Hurkyls Recall
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Timetwister
1 Time Walk
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Ponder
1 Minds Desire
3 Tendrils of Agony
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Imperial Seal
4 Duress
1 Thoughtseize
1 Bayou
3 Xantid Swarm
3 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Island
1 Rebuild
1 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Infest
2 Planar Void
1 Extirpate
Trade Thread
Modern
RWGBurnGWR
GUInfectUG
GRTronRG
UWGifts TronWU
URBGrixis DelverBRU
RGWZooWGR
Legacy
BUWTinFinsWUB
UROmniTellRU
BURTESRUB
GElves!G
GBPSIBG
RGBelcherGR
UBRGWDredgeWGRBU
UBAffinityBU
RBurnR
Vintage
UBGDoomsdayGBU
0Martello Shops0
GElves!G
UBTPSBU
UBelcherU
0Dredge0
Thanks for giving that info good member.
S.M.
Trade Thread
Modern
RWGBurnGWR
GUInfectUG
GRTronRG
UWGifts TronWU
URBGrixis DelverBRU
RGWZooWGR
Legacy
BUWTinFinsWUB
UROmniTellRU
BURTESRUB
GElves!G
GBPSIBG
RGBelcherGR
UBRGWDredgeWGRBU
UBAffinityBU
RBurnR
Vintage
UBGDoomsdayGBU
0Martello Shops0
GElves!G
UBTPSBU
UBelcherU
0Dredge0
Thanks Doom, and yeah I will take a fast peek to see where his logic lays yet again.
3 Tendrils of Agony
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Necropotence
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Mind's Desire
1 Timetwister
1 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Thoughtseize
1 Chain of Vapor
3 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Rebuild
4 Dark Ritual
3 Cabal Ritual
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
3 Underground Sea
3 Swamp
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Scalding Tarn
His explanation and report here: http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=40187.0
Personally, I think its the funnest deck to play at the moment.
Thanks C-Pride,
S.M.
4 Polluted Delta
2 Island
3 Swamp
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Dark Confidant
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lotus Petal
4 Force of Will
4 Dark Ritual
2 Cabal Ritual
3 Tendrils of Agony
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Rebuild
1 Necropotence
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Time Walk
1 Ponder
1 Jace the Mind Sculptor
1 Memory Jar
1 Tinker
1 Timetwister
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
1 Slaughter Pact
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind
1 Island
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Energy Flux
4 Duress
1 Extirpate
1 Yixlid Jailer
4 Leyline of the Void
Oh...Bob
S.M.
Obviously wildly different from the list right above your post though.
Is Jace v.2.0 needed in this archetype? If so, how many? I only got a japanese one
Jace isn't needed, but it's hard to tell someone not to run him. He's such a good walker.
I'm currenty playing the new version I posted, and it's what it's as for a storm deck. Monster hands, fast tempo releases lol, and ofcourse a steady flow of FU via the 5 ways to heart rip someone main...solid
S.M.
My Trade Thread
It's based off Matt Elias' list with a touch of Luis Scott-Vargas' SB.
2 Jace, The Mind Sculptor
2 Tendrils of Agony
2 Preordain
1 Chain of Vapor
2 Hurkyl’s Recall
4 Dark Ritual
1 Cabal Ritual
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Timetwister
1 Necropotence
1 Mind’s Desire
1 Yawgmoth’s Will
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection
3 Duress
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
5 Moxen
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
2 Island
2 Swamp
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Yixlid Jailer
1 Duress
1 Tinker
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 Slaughter Pact
2 Hurkyl’s Recall
2 Pithing Needle
Basically, I'm wondering: Are 4 H Recalls too much? I understand that this has a terrible terrible MU against MUD, so I figured this many Recalls would keep you in the game. Then again, I fear the new Predator Tezz lists that run 3 Jace and go for the beats. I might be able to race them with Duress and Tinker/Robot, but hmmmmm..... I wanted 2 Spell Snare in the SB so I could hold them off, but I guess I'm asking do I really need to try and race anyone? I playtested this and had an absolutely fantastic turn two goldfish (*it was against a casual deck :rolleyes:*)
And I'm scared as hell of Dredge, so I put in a ton of hate.
P.S. I'm new to this, so I really hope I didn't screw up on posting / sorry if I did, y'all
And for the record, I'm not a Vintage mastermind by any means so I hope I don't go off the wall from what everyone else was talking about.
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
Trade Thread
Modern
RWGBurnGWR
GUInfectUG
GRTronRG
UWGifts TronWU
URBGrixis DelverBRU
RGWZooWGR
Legacy
BUWTinFinsWUB
UROmniTellRU
BURTESRUB
GElves!G
GBPSIBG
RGBelcherGR
UBRGWDredgeWGRBU
UBAffinityBU
RBurnR
Vintage
UBGDoomsdayGBU
0Martello Shops0
GElves!G
UBTPSBU
UBelcherU
0Dredge0
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
i'm not a big player of bobstorm though so this is more of a question than some sort of criticism
That is a good question, sirra. Mind's Desire is a complete finisher, and you try to have a ton of bombs to keep a high tempo. Besides, Desire for 3 brings your storm count up to 8, and the cards you flip can really really help. Plus, Yawgmoth's Broken, as you said, gobbles up life and in playtesting it didn't seem to work out too well.
So the short answer is, it's a finisher of the best kind that doesn't require paying life, which is a commodity in short order since you have 4 FOW, 1 MisD, 2 Jace, etc.
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac
Basically, what I'm asking is how long does it take to kill the opponent in the Fish MU?
Standard: NAAAAAHHHHHT
Vintage: UB Bob Tendrils BU
EDH: UB Oona, Queen of the Fae BU
"Don't use the phone. People are never ready to answer it. Use poetry." - Jack Kerouac