As more and more cards, whcih care about +1/+1 counters get printed, I think I could be a good idea, to get an overview of what relevant cards we are dealing with right now.
Payoff:
Above Average/Average:
-Ainok Bond-Kin: First Strike is always a nice keyword to have and the creature itself is ok.
-Unbounded Potential: 6 mana is a lot for the full potential, but the trick is not the worst.
-Phantom Nomad: Pseudo Payoff. As long is you keep putting counters on this it basically becomes immune to damage.
-Knighted Myr: Pseudo Payoff. This can become a big threat really quickly.
-Star Pupil: Pseudo Payoff. It's a nice, low risk target for counters.
Above Average/Average:
-Helium Squirter: Spreading flying to multiple creatures is really powerful.
-Thrummingbird: Very powerful if left unanswered for 1 or 2 attacks.
Below Average:
-Contentious Plan/Steady Progress: Replacing itself is always nice, but you need a lot of counters for these to be worth the mana.
-Guildpact Informant: Proliferate can be powerful, but this is probably not good enough.
-Fuel for the Cause: 4 mana is a lot. You do get 2 effects in one card though.
-Kiora's Dambreaker: A 5/6 for 6 isn't the worst, but also not the best. It also doesn't have a counter itself.
Above Average/Average:
-Hagra Constrictor: If your plan is to make big creatures, Menace is a rally nice ability to have.
-Grim Affliction: Bascially an instant speed Dead Weight, which also profliferates. 3 mana isn't a small amount of mana for this effect, but instant speed proliferate is quite powerful.
Below Average:
-Promising Duskmage: Pretty meh without a counter, but really annoying to deal with, once it has one.
-Festercreep: If you can consistently put counters on this thing it can actually become a useful tool, but on it's own it's pretty meh.
-Volt Charge: The only payoff in red, but it might be one of the best among all colors.
Above Average/Average:
-Crowned Ceratok: A decent body on it's own and passively it provides trample across the board.
-Duskshell Crawler: A 1/4 for 2 is a decent defensive card. In addition this also proivdes some flexiblity and trample across the board.
-Aquastrand Spider: Reach isn't the most powerful keyword, but this is an ok card in a vacuum and Graft is really helpful to spread counters for proliferate.
-Fertilid: If you keep putting counters on this you can ramp a lot with this. It's also decent just the way it is.
Relevant non-payoff cards, that have/give +1/+1 counters: (No explanation, just cards, I think could be considerable for the archetype. The explanation is always: "Has something to do with counters.")
Conclusion:
Do I think this archetype is viable? In green maybe, but for the other colors it's rather thin with payoff. It could be a nice alternative to hexproof/auras for green though, to give that color at least some synergy.
Don't forget Persist, and the Creature - Spike. And to flesh it out further, Modular, Proliferate (with and without Poison),
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*cough* Cave of Temptation, Weapon Rack
I didnt check your lists, but yeah there is more synergy with +1+1 counters than just the phrase.
personally i havent seen anything that pulls me into the archetype. powerlevel is lacking and i dont think its that much of an interesting mechanic either. i might be wrong on the latter. the statgame is kinda boring though imo.
There is a ton of mechanics, which involve (can involve) +1/+1 counters and scryfall doesn't filter you cards where it's only written in the (rules text), like Bloodthirst or Unleash. Not sure if it's possible to search in rules texts aswell.
Yeah persist is also a pseudo payoff. From among the Spikes I think only Spike Colony could be considerable. I also forgot Megamorph, of which at least Ainok Survivalist is decent.
I think the most interesting part of this mechanic is instant speed Proliferate. Stuff like Outlast, Adapt and Graft is all pretty darn slow, but Proliferate can be insane if you have like 3-4 dudes with counters, especially mid combat.
I think this is mostly interesting if you really want something for green, which isn't hexproof/auras, a much more powerful, but also very uninteractive and boring archetype. Then you could have a few random payoff cards from other colors (not like there is much anyway) to pair with green.
unless you want a monogreen mechanic thats goes deeper than "low"ramp manaelf into 3drop, I would recommend building deep into the golgari graveyard theme.
I also wouldnt dismiss hexproof aura that much. edicts and deathtouch can interact with the archetype
On Scryfall you can use fo: to search full oracle text, which includes reminder text.
The main issue I found with trying to build +1/+1 counters was the build up. You need good creatures that start with counters to make the cards that proliferate work. I think with enough scrutiny you could make it work, but I'd be afraid it would require a drafter to gather all the cards. It was better played as tricks in the deck than an archetype.
for the record my cube is 540 in size so supporting the theme and making cuts for it isn't that hard as in a 360 one.
I don't consider it too be a fully fledged archetype but it's more of a theme which, when you draft into one of the pay-off cards early can be a rewarding goal. The payoff cards for me are Ainok bond kon, hagra constrictor, the three green trample enablers and spike colony. Moving around counters as an instant effect shouldn't be underestimated. On that note I should be adding helium grafter and perhaps vigeon hydropon.
@Hoojo - I'm not running any proliferate cards as I find them too conditional. I'm almost exclusively running cards that are solid in their own right.
Payoff:
-Ainok Bond-Kin: First Strike is always a nice keyword to have and the creature itself is ok.
-Unbounded Potential: 6 mana is a lot for the full potential, but the trick is not the worst.
-Phantom Nomad: Pseudo Payoff. As long is you keep putting counters on this it basically becomes immune to damage.
-Knighted Myr: Pseudo Payoff. This can become a big threat really quickly.
Below Average:
-Martyr for the Cause: A very unreliable source of Proliferate.
-Wanderer's Strike: 5 mana is likely too much.
-Star Pupil: Pseudo Payoff. It's a nice, low risk target for counters.
-Helium Squirter: Spreading flying to multiple creatures is really powerful.
-Thrummingbird: Very powerful if left unanswered for 1 or 2 attacks.
Below Average:
-Contentious Plan/Steady Progress: Replacing itself is always nice, but you need a lot of counters for these to be worth the mana.
-Guildpact Informant: Proliferate can be powerful, but this is probably not good enough.
-Fuel for the Cause: 4 mana is a lot. You do get 2 effects in one card though.
-Kiora's Dambreaker: A 5/6 for 6 isn't the worst, but also not the best. It also doesn't have a counter itself.
-Hagra Constrictor: If your plan is to make big creatures, Menace is a rally nice ability to have.
-Grim Affliction: Bascially an instant speed Dead Weight, which also profliferates. 3 mana isn't a small amount of mana for this effect, but instant speed proliferate is quite powerful.
Below Average:
-Promising Duskmage: Pretty meh without a counter, but really annoying to deal with, once it has one.
-Spread the Sickness: 5 mana sorcery speed is very likely too bad.
-Festercreep: If you can consistently put counters on this thing it can actually become a useful tool, but on it's own it's pretty meh.
-Crowned Ceratok: A decent body on it's own and passively it provides trample across the board.
-Duskshell Crawler: A 1/4 for 2 is a decent defensive card. In addition this also proivdes some flexiblity and trample across the board.
-Aquastrand Spider: Reach isn't the most powerful keyword, but this is an ok card in a vacuum and Graft is really helpful to spread counters for proliferate.
-Fertilid: If you keep putting counters on this you can ramp a lot with this. It's also decent just the way it is.
-Lifecrafter's Gift: Technically Feral Invocation with proliferate.
-Phantom Tiger: Pseudo Payoff. As long as you keep putting counters on it, it basically becomes immune to damage.
-Deepwood Denizen: Potentially very powerful with enough counters spread over the board.
-Sporeback Troll: Even though the body isn't the best, Regenerate is a really powerful perk.
-Bloom Hulk: A completely decent card on it's own with "free" proliferate on top.
-Pollenbright Druid: A very flexible 2 drop.
-Smell Fear: Getting Proliferate added to an effect for only 1 extra mana is really nice.
-Urban Daggertooth: Though not very reliable at proliferating the body is quite decent on it's own.
Below Average
-Longshot Squad: Reach isn't that important and I don't like the fact that you have to wait 2 turns, before this itself can block a flier.
-Gnarlid Colony: The 3rd trample giver. Booth bodies are sadly slightly underwhelming just on their own.
-Pridemalkin: Trample giver nr. 4. Not too exciting, but also not terrible.
-Courage in Crisis: With sorcery speed this is a lot worse thtan e.g. Lifecrafter's Gift.
-Servant of the Scale: Pseudo payoff. Simply a low risk target for counters.
Relevant non-payoff cards, that have/give +1/+1 counters: (No explanation, just cards, I think could be considerable for the archetype. The explanation is always: "Has something to do with counters.")
-Inspiring Roar
-Martyr's Soul
-Otherworldly Journey
-Anointer of Valor
-Basri's Acolyte
-Shoulder to Shoulder
-Expedition Raptor
-Glint-Sleeve Artisan
-Aven Eternal
-Dead Reveler
-Underworld Charger
-Carrion Feeder
-Sinuous Vermin
-Gluttonous Slug
-Lazotep Reaver
-Blood Ogre
-Splatter Thug
-Gore-House Chainwalker
-Thriving Grubs
-Spellgorger Weird
-Festerhide Boar
-Ivy Lane Denizen
-Ivy Elemental
-Jade Guardian
-Kujar Seedsculptor
-Scale the Heights
-Scrounging Bandar
-Snakeskin Veil
-Territorial Scythecat
-Thriving Rhino
-Peema Outrider
-Titanic Brawl
-Battering Krasis
-Lead by Example
-Trufflesnout
-Voracious Typhon
-Crocanura
-Bannerhide Krushok
-Baloth Gorger
-Aeromunculus
-Travel Preparations
-Quandrix Pledgemage
-Captured by Lagacs
-Vigean Hydropon
Conclusion:
Do I think this archetype is viable? In green maybe, but for the other colors it's rather thin with payoff. It could be a nice alternative to hexproof/auras for green though, to give that color at least some synergy.
Pauper Cube & Artifact Pauper Cube & Multiplayer Cube
Interested in building your own Pauper Cube? Take a look at some of the lists and the following project: The "Evaluate Everything" Project (updated to M21/JMP)
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*cough* Cave of Temptation, Weapon Rack
Loose Change Pauper Cube-cast
Pauper Cube Article #1
Pauper Cube Article #2
Personal Enjoyment Cube
personally i havent seen anything that pulls me into the archetype. powerlevel is lacking and i dont think its that much of an interesting mechanic either. i might be wrong on the latter. the statgame is kinda boring though imo.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Yeah persist is also a pseudo payoff. From among the Spikes I think only Spike Colony could be considerable. I also forgot Megamorph, of which at least Ainok Survivalist is decent.
I think the most interesting part of this mechanic is instant speed Proliferate. Stuff like Outlast, Adapt and Graft is all pretty darn slow, but Proliferate can be insane if you have like 3-4 dudes with counters, especially mid combat.
I think this is mostly interesting if you really want something for green, which isn't hexproof/auras, a much more powerful, but also very uninteractive and boring archetype. Then you could have a few random payoff cards from other colors (not like there is much anyway) to pair with green.
Pauper Cube & Artifact Pauper Cube & Multiplayer Cube
Interested in building your own Pauper Cube? Take a look at some of the lists and the following project: The "Evaluate Everything" Project (updated to M21/JMP)
I also wouldnt dismiss hexproof aura that much. edicts and deathtouch can interact with the archetype
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The main issue I found with trying to build +1/+1 counters was the build up. You need good creatures that start with counters to make the cards that proliferate work. I think with enough scrutiny you could make it work, but I'd be afraid it would require a drafter to gather all the cards. It was better played as tricks in the deck than an archetype.
I'll definitely be adding the green ones
And thinking about testing these as well
for the record my cube is 540 in size so supporting the theme and making cuts for it isn't that hard as in a 360 one.
I don't consider it too be a fully fledged archetype but it's more of a theme which, when you draft into one of the pay-off cards early can be a rewarding goal. The payoff cards for me are Ainok bond kon, hagra constrictor, the three green trample enablers and spike colony. Moving around counters as an instant effect shouldn't be underestimated. On that note I should be adding helium grafter and perhaps vigeon hydropon.
@Hoojo - I'm not running any proliferate cards as I find them too conditional. I'm almost exclusively running cards that are solid in their own right.
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