Forbidden Friendship is a strictly better Dragon Fodder outside tribal synergies. As long as you have support for tokens in red - and that cross-pollinates both Boros tokens and Rakdos Aristocrats so a lot of lists should have some role players doing that - it seems like a boring but welcome upgrade.
Savai Thunderlion could also be interesting for Boros if we get enough cycling support, given how solid some of the creatures in white have already been thus far.
Yup Forbidden Friendship is boring but it'll be replacing Dragon Fodder in my cube! Dragon fodder has been unexciting but a fine cog for a number of archetypes.
Savai Thunderlion makes me want to have a cycling theme in RW I don't think the archetype is quite there yet though. We will have to evaluate once all the spoilers are done!
Cunning Nightbonder is an okay card, but an awkward mana cost. If I tried it in my cube it would be for the purpose of helping Simic flash. I am pretty doubtful that it is high enough impact though.
I’m finding mutate hard to evaluate but one card that looks good to me is migratory greathorn. For three mana you get to ramp and essentially turn one of your other creatures into a 3/4. On turn three you’re likely to mutate into a 2/1, 2/2, 1/1, etc so the size boost will be a positive effect. And any important abilities from the mutated creature will remain, so it’ll be a strict upgrade. It seems like a good payoff for three mana.
When I see Healing Salve, I'm often like "Oh girl, I wish I could turn every card into this." Thanks they removed the gain life part, otherwise this would have been broken.
i initially thought greathorn was just ok but there is a lot to mutate lol. i like that you can mutate it on, say, llanowar elves, get the mutate trigger, and still have the elves' tap ability on the 3/4, which seems very strong to me. and considering this is turn 2 in this situation... yeah looks good. even in, for example, a simic deck. turn 2 welkin tern variant, turn 3 this as a 3/4 haste flying? that's pretty strong too. the more i think about this card the more i like it honestly, and this may ring true for other mutate creatures too honestly.
When I see Healing Salve, I'm often like "Oh girl, I wish I could turn every card into this." Thanks they removed the gain life part, otherwise this would have been broken.
Removal destroying both parts post mutate and making it impossible to mutate unless you curve 1-2-3 makes me skeptical that Migratory Greathorn is worthwhile over a more consistent option.
Lore Drakkis seems pretty solid considering it doesn't need a guild slot. It compares pretty favourably to similar blue effects and can also be played in non-blue red decks. Granted I have no clue how to evaluate mutate on this card. Is giving something a small stat buff worth the chance you don't get the trigger due to removal? Is not being able to cast it due to the non-human clause actually a concern? But there is also the potential you get major benefit on something like Looter Il-Kor or something with undying/persist (another ruling I had to look up, ugh).
Yeah, I like that you can mutate the Drakkis on a Young Pyro or Saheeli token, or Murmuring Mystic's in blue. Really would like to be able to make YP less squishy too though.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I wish all archetypes could be equally hated. Or loved, but the former better reflects the mindset of the vocal portion of the player base. My 540ish Peasant Cube on Cubetutor
Yeah, I like that you can mutate the Drakkis on a Young Pyro or Saheeli token, or Murmuring Mystic's in blue. Really would like to be able to make YP less squishy too though.
Yeah, I like that you can mutate the Drakkis on a Young Pyro or Saheeli token, or Murmuring Mystic's in blue. Really would like to be able to make YP less squishy too though.
Yeah, I like that you can mutate the Drakkis on a Young Pyro or Saheeli token, or Murmuring Mystic's in blue. Really would like to be able to make YP less squishy too though.
I think they were referring to a 'Young Pyro token'.
Yep, so a token from YP/Saheeli/MM, and finally I indicated precisely I wish it *could* increase YP's toughness by mutating onto it if necessary.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I wish all archetypes could be equally hated. Or loved, but the former better reflects the mindset of the vocal portion of the player base. My 540ish Peasant Cube on Cubetutor
When I see Healing Salve, I'm often like "Oh girl, I wish I could turn every card into this." Thanks they removed the gain life part, otherwise this would have been broken.
Cuz mutate kinda works like an enchantment. Welkin Tern can swing turn 3, so a mutated one can, too.
source? I’m seeing no evidence this is true.
From the mechanics article: 'The resolving mutating creature spell doesn't enter the battlefield. It simply makes the creature that was already on the battlefield change characteristics.'
I'm probably passing on all mutate cards especially because of the non-human clause being really frustrating.
Weaponize the Monsters is definitely going in my cube for testing! We all know how well Siege-Gang Commander's ability can make life a nightmare for you opponent or just finish off a game. The fact that this costs one mana to play initially means that you can sneak it in easily. Definitely don't think it's as good as Goblin Bombardment, but I think it will have a nice spot of it's own if you support red decks going wide or sacrifice decks.
I feel like it is more of a controlling counterpart to Goblin Bombardment more as a reach piece, with some cross-pollination between them since it can also provide reach in a pinch if you have extra mana around and especially if you have something like an active Goblin Assault or a Skyknight Vanguard for repeated tokens without a mana investment.
I love the idea of playing weaponize the monsters in a GR deck combo-ing it with persist guys and being able to throw mana dorks around once they are no longer helpful. And as you said RW has lots of ways to make tokens, and my black section does as well. Only color combo I don't ever see it getting played in is UR. Overall my favorite card of the set so far!
Oooh, I am really interested in today's spoilers. Joyous Skybonder is a really solid Azorius hybrid card which is one of the things with which I have not been all too happy thus far (the most pressing case still being Dimir from my perspective). I also like the designs of Parcelbeast and Hornbash Mentor. Though, the latter could easily end up being way too mana intensive to be worthwhile, even with its solid base stats.
Yeah I really like Hornbash Mentor. Kind of reminds me of Maulfist Revolutionary. It plays extraordinarily well with Bramblewood Paragon. I really wish that I had more creatures in the 4-5 mana range with trample though. Regardless though, it is a 3/3 for 3 with some very real upside so I think it is certainly worth a shot.
If you put a trample counter on a persist creature, it loses that counter when it dies, right?
I really don't like the [m]2[/m] cost for Weaponize the Monsters. Sure, it's a much better Blood Rites, but I think I might run Makeshift Munitions over Weaponize. I like my sac outlets as cheap on the individual sac as possible, and Munitions may do less damage, but it costs less (once in play) and can sac artifacts, too. Maybe I've just been spoiled by Goblin Bombardment.
As a modern peasant cube owner, goblin bombardment wasn't an option so I think Weaponize the Monsters looks great 2 damage is a lot more than 1, particularly since I deliberately don't have a lot of 1 toughness creatures.
Joyous Skybonder looks sweet, I think it is probably a lot more universally useful than Dovin I currently have in that slot.
Regarding makeshift munitions vs weaponize the monsters: The artifact clause of makeshift munitions is so rare in most peasant cubes so I don't really value that at all.
A great quote I saw on reddit was this:
"This is a clear winner over Makeshift Munitions. It does twice as much damage. The only way Makeshift Munitions is better is if you're regularly sacrificing artifacts.
Don't think of it as costing twice as much mana. Think of it as costing half as many creatures. The card is nuts."
Very much agreed on it being considerably better than Makeshift Munitions. The difference between Goblin Bombardment's 0 mana activation and its 1 mana activation is a much greater leap than the difference between 1 and 2 mana. And indeed, doing the same amount of damage with Munitions would take as much mana but twice the fodder, even if you can also get the occasional '1 mana 1 damage' shot slipped in if you already have extra mana in response to removal or extra fodder.
Hohoo. Heartless Act seems like a decent removal spell, too. Worth crunching the numbers to see how it compares, at least, and the counter removal can occasionally be useful, too.
Heartless Act is another playable 1B instant removal option. I have quite a lot of counters in my cube, so for me it's not better than what I already run.
Magma Charger seems like a pretty decent card, though Scrapper Champion is better and you probably don't need two of these at 4 cmc.
Savai Thunderlion could also be interesting for Boros if we get enough cycling support, given how solid some of the creatures in white have already been thus far.
Savai Thunderlion makes me want to have a cycling theme in RW I don't think the archetype is quite there yet though. We will have to evaluate once all the spoilers are done!
Cunning Nightbonder is an okay card, but an awkward mana cost. If I tried it in my cube it would be for the purpose of helping Simic flash. I am pretty doubtful that it is high enough impact though.
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/djredpeasant
Lore Drakkis seems pretty solid considering it doesn't need a guild slot. It compares pretty favourably to similar blue effects and can also be played in non-blue red decks. Granted I have no clue how to evaluate mutate on this card. Is giving something a small stat buff worth the chance you don't get the trigger due to removal? Is not being able to cast it due to the non-human clause actually a concern? But there is also the potential you get major benefit on something like Looter Il-Kor or something with undying/persist (another ruling I had to look up, ugh).
My 540ish Peasant Cube on Cubetutor
My C/Ube on Cube Cobra
I think they were referring to a 'Young Pyro token'.
Yep, so a token from YP/Saheeli/MM, and finally I indicated precisely I wish it *could* increase YP's toughness by mutating onto it if necessary.
My 540ish Peasant Cube on Cubetutor
Anyway, I am not really interested in any of the mutate cards so far although Lore Drakkis seems the best of the bunch.
My C/Ube on Cube Cobra
source? I’m seeing no evidence this is true.
From the mechanics article: 'The resolving mutating creature spell doesn't enter the battlefield. It simply makes the creature that was already on the battlefield change characteristics.'
Weaponize the Monsters is definitely going in my cube for testing! We all know how well Siege-Gang Commander's ability can make life a nightmare for you opponent or just finish off a game. The fact that this costs one mana to play initially means that you can sneak it in easily. Definitely don't think it's as good as Goblin Bombardment, but I think it will have a nice spot of it's own if you support red decks going wide or sacrifice decks.
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/djredpeasant
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/djredpeasant
If you put a trample counter on a persist creature, it loses that counter when it dies, right?
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/djredpeasant
Unless it has Skullbriar, the Walking Grave's ability, yes.
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
Joyous Skybonder looks sweet, I think it is probably a lot more universally useful than Dovin I currently have in that slot.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
A great quote I saw on reddit was this:
"This is a clear winner over Makeshift Munitions. It does twice as much damage. The only way Makeshift Munitions is better is if you're regularly sacrificing artifacts.
Don't think of it as costing twice as much mana. Think of it as costing half as many creatures. The card is nuts."
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/djredpeasant
Hohoo. Heartless Act seems like a decent removal spell, too. Worth crunching the numbers to see how it compares, at least, and the counter removal can occasionally be useful, too.
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
Heartless Act is another playable 1B instant removal option. I have quite a lot of counters in my cube, so for me it's not better than what I already run.
Magma Charger seems like a pretty decent card, though Scrapper Champion is better and you probably don't need two of these at 4 cmc.
My Old School Battlebox
My Premodern Battlebox