MTG Salvation

Argh so many great reprints and cards like Faerie seer but I don't have space arrrgh. my green and blue sections got such good stuff from recent sets.

Did we solve the Krosan Tusker vs Shefet Monitor question?

I keep thinking about using Sling-Gang Lieutenant even though its kind of meh just because there are so few "army in a can" options for black even when they want the sac and reanimate fodder.

As someone who owns (and cubes) with snow basics, I will honestly say there is not a super ton of upside prior to this set. I have 6 snow mana specific cards from Coldsnap and all of those cards are Cubable for sure, but nothing which is a Staple.

Gelid Shackles- Good aggro card to shut down blockers and, in a pinch, attackers.
Chilling Shade- Evasive creature with major threat of activation and a decent finished to pour mana into.
Zombie Musher- Expensive, unblockable, and hard to kill. Good combination for control decks.
Stalking Yeti- Some other variants of this, but I believe this to be 2nd best behind FTK
Skred- Comparable to Flame Slash. A little weaker early and stronger late. Also nice as an instant.
Mouth of Ronom- Creature removal on a land is very appreciated.

I am currently planning on adding four snow cards as of now, Icehide Golem, Abominable Treefolk, Frostwalk Bastion, and Arcum's Astrolabe. Icehide Golem is an obvious Staple going forward, and I think Treefolk may be too.

Quote from ahhabee »

Ephemerate solid replacement for cloudshift

Faerie Seer nice replacement for Omenspeaker, etc

Ephemerate is usually the better card, but I still have the dream of temporarily swiping someone's Pelakka Wurm and then Cloudshifting it permanently under my control, trigger and all.

And yes, I was trying to figure out what to swap for Faerie Seer, and I think I agree with Omenspeaker. Easier to kill the fairy, but it comes down faster and has evasion.

Quote from Narvuntien »

I keep thinking about using Sling-Gang Lieutenant even though its kind of meh just because there are so few "army in a can" options for black even when they want the sac and reanimate fodder.

I've been toying with the idea, too, but short of swapping it for Marsh Flitter, I can't figure out what to cut.

The hideaway guy is just really good, I think

Ephemerate is also on my definite list. The chance to steal something with cloudshift cant be worth the 2 triggers here.

I switched omenspeaker for the 2/1 version, and I think I'd keep it instead of the 1/1 flier.

Ooh, do we have our first downgrade for the set in Urza's Rage? Probably not cubable, given how edge many are on Fight with Fire but 10 damage burn spells are still fun in concept. Just not for 12 mana.

Quote from Leelue »

The hideaway guy is just really good, I think

Even though it comes into play tapped?



Huh - Soulherder probably isn't good enough, but I really like the repeatable flicker effect.

A lot of goodies today...

I will definitely play Soulherder, likely over Mistmeadow Witch

Rotwidow Pack seems promising and fits with my GB GY theme

Urza's Rage probably not for me, I like that it is an instant and can't be countered, but as said above 12 mana is just... not happening

Watcher for Tomorrow is sweet... definitely adding...

Side note, I wish Goblin Champion was battle cry instead of exalted

I think my list right now of possible cards are:
Rotwidow Pack - Seems solid, likely play/test in place of Glowspore Shaman
Soulherder - Seems solid, likely play/test in place of Mistmeadow Witch
Watcher for Tomorrow - In in place of Rise from the Tides
Ephemerate - In in place of Cloudshift
Faerie Seer - In in place of Omenspeaker
Throes of Chaos - Seems solid, likely play/test in place of Savage Alliance
Orcish Hellraiser - Seems solid, likely play/test in place of Burning Prophet
Goblin Oriflamme - In in place of Weapon Surge
Springbloom Druid - Probably not good enough
Mother Bear - Not sure yet, I like the idea and 2/2 bear for 2 is the "bear" pass for stats, the later graveyard ability seems good and works with my color pie ... probably test in place of Wall of Blossoms
Splicer's Skill - Probably not good enough, but may try
Ravenous Giant - I don't think this will be good enough, a lot of my red toppers are haste or deal damage, etc... this just is a 5/5 that gets blocked
Good-Fortune Unicorn - In in place of Trostani's Summoner (Will miss Summoner as one of the great reanimate targets, but really doesn't fit in this guild slot)
Pondering Mage - Probably not good enough, but I do like it may try in place of Tandem Lookout
Goblin War Party - In in place of Electrostatic Field
Martyr's Soul - Not sure about this card now, I was a little hyped, but the more I think about it I think the more its going to not perform...
Valiant Changeling - People are hyped about this, I don't see it happening

Moonblade Shinobi interests me. I've had a lot of fun with Ninja of the Deep Hours and Throat Slitter both for their triggers and their ability to bounce ETB creatures back to hand. This one is pretty good, too, netting an extra flying body and potentially boosting damage with its 3 power.

Ninja of the Deep Hours is awesome. I had Throat Slitter in at one point but found that the one hoop of getting through unblocked was one hoop too many, when I could (probably) just Ultimate Price or Skin Render etc instead. I encourage trying Okiba-Gang Shinobi as a 4drop. I love that card.

Soul Herder, Rotwidow Pack, Watcher for Tomorrow, and Nantuko Cultivator are includes for sure. Still contemplating on snowstuff.

Rotwidow Pack looks... horrendous?

Imagine trying to use it when your opponent is actually casting spells and you're casting Giant Spider into 5cmc single token activations

It'll win eventually on a stalled board, but that's not nearly enough for a 4-drop gold creature

Like, it's a great booster draft card... and wildly short of what I ever want to do in any cube deck

Soulherder seems strong, I'm keen for an actual payoff card for the flicker deck other than just value. Pretty easy include I think. Ephemerate is a pretty easy inclusion over cloudshift as well, the rebound is way better than the niche interactions.

I like moonblade shinobi, and I think it'll be great in tempo decks. Not sure if I have any good cuts for it though.

Watcher for tomorrow seems sweet. I'm a big fan of this boy.

Quote from _i0 »

Rotwidow Pack looks... horrendous?

You right.

*~*~*~*~

Alpine Guide looks nice. Worst case scenario, I go up to 4 lands, then immediately down to 3 again. But now my deck is a card thinner. Worth thinking about.

Watcher of tomorrow looks good but argh! no space. How does it compare with Azure Mage? I have clashing blue aggro decks atm. I have wizards, +1/+1 counters and unblockable rouges :/ I think to fit in more wizards I might have to just cut the rouges.

Soul Herder is a really good engine piece but my other U/W cards pack more punch, it just feels too slow that the opponent will just kill it before it gets value. Mistmeadow witch can perform shenanigans like blinking out blocker.

I really want to play springbloom druid do I just straight replace actual Harrow, I feel like I could almost just replace all non-creatures in green for thier creature equalivents at this point.

Your opponent killing your 3 drop is some sort of value, honestly. Soul herder seems like my kind of card.

Quote from Leelue »

Your opponent killing your 3 drop is some sort of value, honestly.

I think you're referring to your opponent using something like Lightning Bolt on Alpine Guide to thin your deck, ya?

The best thing about Harrow is that it functionally costs one mana -- on four mana you can cast Harrow into, idk, Oblivion Ring or something

Springbloom Druid misses that, obviously, so I'm pretty low on the Druid

Well dang it, I didnt' read the druid through, I figured it would just be Harrow on a stick. So yeah the lands etbt, I'm off it too.

It seems like full spoiler is up now. Let's see...

Some of the standouts from my perspective, spoilt in this last batch:

• Irregular Cohort
  
• Recruit the Worthy
  
• Rhox Veteran
  
• Cunning Evasion
  
• Smoke Shroud
  
• Azra Smokeshaper
  
• First-Sphere Gargantua
  
• Gluttonous Slug
  
• Viashino Sandsprinter
  
• Conifer Wurm
  
• Rime Tender
  
• Treetop Ambusher
  
• Trumpeting Herd
  

I am really baffled by how many more commons interest me in this set than uncommons.

Final thoughts:

Definite Include:
Valiant Changeling: I run double strikers as an archetype; easy to enable at a low price.
Watcher for Tomorrow: Despite its problems, it digs deep and you do not lose the card even if it gets exiled or bounced, making the delayed trigger much more manageable.
Treetop Ambusher: Dash is great; either attacks as a 3/2 itself or pumps something else.
Icehide Golem: Sigh. Adding those snow basics to my basic lands.
Frostwalk Bastion: A pretty good manland with easy access to snow mana.

Under Consideration:
Ephemerate: Definitely the best blink effect not on legs.
Recruit the Worthy: Buyback is always nice; a great card for Boros Pyromancer when that comes together. Probably still not worth it, even if you can also use it as terrible removal in a pinch thanks to instant speed. (Which also makes it a mana sink for more draw-go decks.)
Rhox Veteran: Strong combination of abilities on a decent body.
Splicer’s Skill: I like tokens. Unlikely to see much splicing, though, and the base version is hardly worth it. Can be persuaded to try.
Cunning Evasion: Easily gets value, assuming that your creatures would die when blocked by bigger creatures. May force damage through with value creatures.
Faerie Seer: Good blue 1-drop creatures are a premium thing.
Moonblade Shinobi: Creating flying tokens when it connects is more of a Rare effect. Just needs support to connect reliably.
First-Sphere Gargantua: That is a big value unearther that is not too shabby even when just cast.
Gluttonous Slug: Evolve can get out of hand, and it has a form of evasion which works well with its high toughness. Even if you usually want your Evolve creatures to have low initial stats.
Sling-Gang Lieutenant: I like this more than Marsh Flitter since this can just be a ‘Drain for 3+’ when needed as a quick finisher.
Goblin Champion: Exalted is always surprisingly good and this thing has rare late-game value for a 1-drop despite being sub-par by itself early on.
Goblin Oriflamme: I mean… Maybe?
Goblin War Party: Unlikely. The extra mana for the tokens – which is the main mode – is a bit much, and the entwined version seems unlikely to be enough at that point in the game.
Orcish Hellraiser: Despite the echo, I like its stats as an immediate blocker when needed, and nigh guaranteed damage is always good reach.
Ore-Scale Guardian: It can be a really nice deal with enough discard or self-mill.
Viashino Sand-Sprinter: I like these kinds of cards and the cycling is really nice given how it can get invalidated.
Mother Bear: I am a sucker for GY-value, and that is not a bad rate.
Rime Tender: Just assume that I would be getting Snow Basics to use.
Scale Up: Can still be a strong pump for just one mana; easily gets silly when overloaded. Mode with reduced mana cost is an upgrade over other Overrun variants.
Springbloom Druid: I support both multi-colour decks whenever I can and Worm Harvest. The body is nice to have but likely not enough of an upgrade over prior iterations.
Trumpeting Herd: That is a good value proposition, if a tad slow.
Arcum’s Astrolabe: Nice to have at 1 mana, assuming snow basics.

Like:
Face of Divinity: Too risky but an uncommon Daybreak Coronet of sorts.
Irregular Cohort: Probably not as good as the Knight versions but gets all the tribal benefits.
King of the Pride: Strong card for a bad tribe.
Martyr’s Soul: Not for me, given the slot it takes, but a strong design.
Vesperlark: Could get really strong cards if you have stuff like that in your CU/be pool. Cards with power that comes from effects or counters.
Stirring Address: Very decent two sides (if slightly overcosted); works with Isochron Scepter, too, in a pinch.
Everdream: More manageable splicing but less interesting effect.
Scour All Possibilities: Overcosted for a card that just replaces itself but I love flashback.
Smoke Shroud: Well, here’s a ninja enabler. If you decide to support the archetype.
Azra Smokeshaper: Speaking of supporting Ninjas… Very nice Ninjutsu cost for a good body even if the effect is somewhat more conditional. Potentially backbreaking, though.
Feaster of Fools: Excellent flavour but a fool’s gamble.
Rank Officer: Discard is nice when it is optional and gets value; has reach.
Ransack the Lab: Bad Impulse but a GY enabler and black.
Shatter Assumptions: Too niche and unreliable but fun concept.
Igneous Elemental: Bad FTK is still a FTK variant. Not strictly worse, either.
Ravenous Giant: I own a copy of Juzam Djinn, too, and it is a nice card in this format even if not a very interesting one.
Throes of Chaos: Unlikely to include this in the end; but it is really interesting design.
Urza’s Rage: About time this got downgraded, even if it is pretty subpar.
Conifer Wurm: If you use snow basics in the basics pool, this could get silly. Even if it provides no value as such.
Treefolk Umbra: I am a sucker for Totem Armor. Also another enabler for Toughness matters.
Lesser Masticore: My kind of jank. Actually playing this in EDH because Persist combo reanimator.

Whoo full spoiler ooooh boy I have a lot of changes since I have a modern only cube.

White
Battle Screech - Promise of Brunei
Valiant Changeling - not sure on the cut but it's interesting I have no double-strikers atm.
Ephemerate - best of its type but I already cut cloudshift
Rhox Veteran - I like battle-cry as a mechanic.

Goldnight Commander, Imperial Aerosaur and Sandsteppe Outcast are on the weaker side.

Blue
Fact or Fiction - Forbidden Alchemy
Faerie Seer - Siren Stormtamer
Watcher for Tomorrow - Jhessian Thief (I need to focus more on wizards and less on rouges unfortunetly which also means no ninja's)

Black
Carrion Feeder - Gnarled Scarhide
Crypt Rats - Plague Mare
Sling-Gang Lieutenant - Moan of the Unhallowed (low power high synergy particularly with red)
Warteye Witch - Vicera seerer last day gem.

Red
Goblin Oriflamme - Madcap Skills
Goblin War Party - thinking about it replacing rolling thunder
Ravenous Giant - Smoldering Werewolf Its big

Green
Krosan Tusker :/ I think Shefet monitor is still better... I think
Nantuko Cultivator - high synergistic with my cube but I just don't know what to cut
Nimble Mongoose - Blossoming Defence I couldn't find a creature cut.
Springbloom Druid - another synergy card but the etb tapped does make it worse, I prefer the creatures I have.
Wall of Blossoms - I feel like my green is too aggro for this card its better in white.
overall my green section is annoyingly too strong.

Multicoloured
Good-Fortune Unicorn - Juniper Order Ranger

Artifacts
a bunch of almosts but I don't think so

Lands
Cycle lands - Desert cycle lands
Cave of Temptation - this is really good Foundry of the consuls, rouges passage or Stalking stones all of them have low pick counts probably rouges passage I think

I have issues with finding the right cuts in a few cases particularly for white and green.
http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/51100

I will look at other peoples lists, but these are the cards I am interested in right now... will add more details and what I am likely going to switch out later...

Soulherder -> Mistmeadow Witch
Watcher for Tomorrow -> Errant Ephemeron
Ephemerate -> Cloudshift
Faerie Seer -> Omenspeaker
Throes of Chaos -> Electrostatic Field
Orcish Hellraiser -> Burning Prophet
Goblin Oriflamme -> Weapon Surge
Mother Bear -> Wall of Blossoms
Good-Fortune Unicorn -> Trostani's Summoner
Goblin War Party -> Savage Alliance
Recruit the worthy -> Aven Riftwatcher
Rhox Veteran -> Visionary Augmenter
Gluttonous Slug -> Fledgling Djinn
Ransack the Lab -> Read the Bones
Viashino Sandsprinter -> Splatter Thug
Winding Way -> Vessel of Nascency
Alpine Guide -> Monastery Swiftspear


I think this is my plan right now, will update if I see other changes

Quote from VariSami »

I am really baffled by how many more commons interest me in this set than uncommons.

I am really baffled by how powerful the rares and mythics are in this set compared to the commons and uncommons. Don't get me wrong, drafting this set looks like it will be a ton of fun, but from a cube standpoint rare cubes are getting 10-20 cards and we peasants seem to be getting 1-3 for tighter lists. I was really hoping to see some sweet downshifts or really pushed uncommons.

Is Valiant Changeling the best thing we got? Maybe Goblin Oriflamme?

I think Krosan Tusker is considerably better than Shefet Monitor -- the 3cmc vs 4cmc is just that important, even with Monitor providing a better mana cost on the creature side and also actually ramping.

Quote from calibretto »

Quote from VariSami »

I am really baffled by how many more commons interest me in this set than uncommons.

I am really baffled by how powerful the rares and mythics are in this set compared to the commons and uncommons. Don't get me wrong, drafting this set looks like it will be a ton of fun, but from a cube standpoint rare cubes are getting 10-20 cards and we peasants seem to be getting 1-3 for tighter lists. I was really hoping to see some sweet downshifts or really pushed uncommons.

Is Valiant Changeling the best thing we got? Maybe Goblin Oriflamme?

Icehide Golem is easily the best if you spend the time/money/errata to make it work

A pretty bad set for my cube. I dont like super parasitic mechanics like snow stuff, so all of that is out. I also don't support tribal which makes the slivers and changelings useless for me. I dont feel like there is any card that is a definite include, but I'll probably test a few.