It provides a somewhat powerful ability, but I try to avoid auras as much as I can. I don't think the ability is so powerful that it would warrant inclusion. I would probably run Hyena Umbra before it.
I've somehow emptied out all the "buff" auras from my white section. I didn't even feel like Griffin Guide was doing enough. It may be that I have a bit too much removal, but Griffin Guide just made players walk into removal. Hyena Umbra, much like Spider Umbra, just gives an effect that's too small for its cost. I'm not sure about your cubes, but in mine much of the non-red removal won't be stopped by Umbra. Exile, -1/-1 counters, pacifism, blue lockdown and mind control, bounce, all of these things still get rid of the bonuses for being an Umbra. Much for the same reason then, I don't really want to include Spirit Mantle. Sure it becomes unblockable and a virtually endless chump blocker unless they pop a removal spell, but that's already the weakness of an aura, right? You were bound to get 2-1'd sometime, so I'd still rather go for an Umbra or one of the Guides which has a potential to not have net card disadvantage.
@ "Un" cards: I like the idea of some of those cards, especially Booster Tutor. The thing is, I don't own any Un cards and I don't quite like the fact that some of them are really whacky and work un-Magic-like. I think it's definitely dependent on playgroup, and I honestly wouldn't mind testing Booster Tutor if I ever got my hands on one.
I'm glad that the cards you've tested have worked out well so far, especially Master Thief since you said you didn't include cards like Loxodon Warhammer and Skullclamp in your cube. I don't run mistmeadow witch myself, so Vampire Outcasts is safe from blink except from Flickerwisp, Glimmerpoint Stag, and Otherworldly Journey.
Spirit mantle's maiden voyage was underwhelming for me. It'll get another match to test, I suppose.
I recently shaved my removal down a little bit, which made a whole suite of cards better. But there is one card that just can't seem to perform in my cube, no matter what I do. Imperious perfect. It just hasn't performed as well as squirrel's nest or sprout swarm when it comes to token production. Jade mage might also be permanently taking over for it in that department. Yesterday was the best it has performed in months, and it made two creatures (one of which traded with something, the other of which had no real effect). Has anyone else been disappointed by this promising elf?
The problem I have with Imperious Perfect is that it only lets me create one dude per turn. So you put in the cube with false hopes of creating a token elf army and end up making three dudes and then getting Imperious Perfect blown up somehow. I believe that I like Jade Mage more because there's a higher potential to make an army.
Speaking of removal, I've had that same problem lately. During our last draft with my C/U cube, I drafted a RG ramp deck and one of my friends drafted a BW control deck. Our games were some of the most boring uneventful games ever simply because of the sheer amount of removal. I had a ton of red mass removal as well and several burn spells to act as spot removal. He had a ton of spot removal and all of my green and red guys were vulnerable to it. In one game I drew out simply because neither of us could make a creature stick and all of my mana ramp put me a lower card count.
Because of this, I'm thinking of taking out Last Gasp and Vendetta to make room for some reanimation spells in black. I'm a bit skeptical on this as well, though because there aren't really that many good reanimation targets at this rarity.
I'm also planning on removing Puncture Blast and Whipflare from red in favor of Crimson Mage and Stormblood Berserker.
Thoughts on that? Anyone else have this problem with black and red? It's tough because most of the useful black or red spells at this rarity are spot removal or burn. It's just the nature of the colors. But it makes for a fairly unfun drafting environment.
The problem I have with Imperious Perfect is that it only lets me create one dude per turn. So you put in the cube with false hopes of creating a token elf army and end up making three dudes and then getting Imperious Perfect blown up somehow. I believe that I like Jade Mage more because there's a higher potential to make an army.
I think it works best when you can use it draw removal away from your other critters. Your opponent knows they can't leave it unanswered for very long. I guess in that case it's a good card because it always dies?
Speaking of removal, I've had that same problem lately. During our last draft with my C/U cube, I drafted a RG ramp deck and one of my friends drafted a BW control deck. Our games were some of the most boring uneventful games ever simply because of the sheer amount of removal. I had a ton of red mass removal as well and several burn spells to act as spot removal. He had a ton of spot removal and all of my green and red guys were vulnerable to it. In one game I drew out simply because neither of us could make a creature stick and all of my mana ramp put me a lower card count.
This just reminded me of why Blastoderm is and always will be awesome.
Because of this, I'm thinking of taking out Last Gasp and Vendetta to make room for some reanimation spells in black. I'm a bit skeptical on this as well, though because there aren't really that many good reanimation targets at this rarity.[/card]
I think a lot of value from reanimation in C/U Cubes comes from getting a 2nd use out of a 187 critter. Sure, we may not have the huge, resilient finishers that typical Cubes have, but nothing's wrong with drawing 2 cards or offing another creature.
[quote]I'm also planning on removing Puncture Blast and Whipflare from red in favor of Crimson Mage and Stormblood Berserker.
I'm actually surprised you run Puncture Blast in a 360. Whipflare I can see, but the Blast seems really inefficient compared to the rest of Red's burn. I know it has its uses in shrinking larger creatures, but I think that's what splashing a color is for.
I'm all up for the idea of fitting more interesting creatures into Red's lineup. Just gotta make sure that there's still enough burn for everyone to take, so your aggro drafts aren't short on reach.
Thoughts on that? Anyone else have this problem with black and red? It's tough because most of the useful black or red spells at this rarity are spot removal or burn. It's just the nature of the colors. But it makes for a fairly unfun drafting environment.
This helps me to understand just how good efficiently costed, resilient creatures (Like the Soltari Brothers) are in this format. Creatures have gotten better over time, but the best ones tend to be rare. No Great Stable Stag or Jwar Isle Sphinx for us.
However, removal's gotten better too, but all of that falls right in our rarity range. Path to Exile, Doom Blade, Dismember, etc.
Until Wizards decides to hand us a few small, hard to answer creatures, we may need to consider putting a "cap" on how much removal C/U Cubes run, or else we'll find ourselves in a lot more situations similar to the one you described.
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My Black & Silver Cube [360/Peasant/Draft It! EDH Decks: - Reya Dawnbringer // - Mistform Ultimus // - Balthor the Defiled // - Urabrask the Hidden // - Mirri, Cat Warrior
I really want to like Imperious Perfect. She generates a 2/2 token for just G each turn, so it's really strong even if it's really slow. (Compare to Urza's Factory for the next best repeated 2/2 maker?) The issue is that once she is killed, all the 2/2s she made suddenly become wimpy little 1/1s again, and at that point I'd rather have any other token maker who could've made more guys every turn.
Thoughts on that? Anyone else have this problem with black and red? It's tough because most of the useful black or red spells at this rarity are spot removal or burn. It's just the nature of the colors. But it makes for a fairly unfun drafting environment.
I've had this exact same issue and I've thought about how to alleviate it. I don't think it's just an issue of having too much spot removal, even though that definitely does contribute to the problem. I've had games of Black and Red fighting each other where basically nothing sticks. I think it has to do with the efficiency of common/uncommon creatures and their bombiness, especially in the two colors with the most exploding removal. C/UC really limits our options for strong, resilient finishers. I did take out a few black removal spells to make room for Victimize and Diabolic Servitude a while ago.
The second key to the puzzle is pushing for more resistant creatures in the cube, such as Deadwood Treefolk and Eternal Witness. Both of these grind out a lot of card advantage against players who depend on removal. Blastoderm barely dies to anything but aggressive blocking. The Glasskites are hard to pick off. Creatures with persist, such as Kitchen Finks, also help. The thing is, not every color has access to these kind of critters. Red and Black are probably the two colors left most out in the dust, so it makes sense that the battlefield is a no man's land when it comes to a war of attrition.
calibretto, how experienced are the players you draft with? I try to make Black and Red removal as splashable as possible in my cube, so that players will steal removal from those two colors to prevent the critical mass that's necessary for the game to end up in such a degenerate state.
Thoughts on that? Anyone else have this problem with black and red? It's tough because most of the useful black or red spells at this rarity are spot removal or burn. It's just the nature of the colors. But it makes for a fairly unfun drafting environment.
Black has more diversity than red with things like Night's Whisper and reanimation spells. I also like the diversity within black's removal, -x/-x, sacrifice effects, destroy, etc.
The best red spells are aggressive creatures and efficient burn, which is good, but it doesn't really have a lot else.
Land destruction is a red strength, but they've nerfed that in recent years, and I'm not sure if Stone Rain is worth it. I already have Pillage and Molten Rain. Might be worth it though to give red more diversity, and it boosts more aggressive strategies. One bummer is that cheap burn helps out control and aggro, and I feel like aggro needs more support in my cube.
calibretto, how experienced are the players you draft with? I try to make Black and Red removal as splashable as possible in my cube, so that players will steal removal from those two colors to prevent the critical mass that's necessary for the game to end up in such a degenerate state.
Quite experienced, I would say. We all draft the cube on a regular basis. Almost all of us have been playing since the late 90's and playing limited since the early 00's. The one guy that hasn't been playing as long as the rest of us just recently won a limited event at one of the SCG Opens. So, I'm fairly confident that everyone is taking the cards correctly. In the case of my friend playing BW, he told me the first seven cards he picked were black removal spells. There's something wrong with that picture.
Creatures like the 'derms and other shroud guys are resistant to removal, but that's not really enough. One of my finishers in my RG deck was Cudgel Troll (a card that I love, btw) and even with his regeneration, I couldn't make him stick.
I think one of my problems comes from the fact that I look to my rare cube a lot of times for ideas and numbers. It looks like I'm running near the same amount of targeted black removal in my rare cube as I am in my C/U cube. That wouldn't be a bad thing except my rare cube is 175 cards larger. I think I'm going to do some contrasting with 360 rare lists to see how much black spot removal they're running. Peasant is definitely a different format than other cubes, but comparing numbers can be helpful.
EDIT: What do you guys think of this as a 50 card black section? Still too much removal? Not enough now? Too much reanimation for C/U? Anything missing that's blatantly obvious? Anything present that should not make the cut in a section this small?
EDIT: What do you guys think of this as a 50 card black section? Still too much removal? Not enough now? Too much reanimation for C/U? Anything missing that's blatantly obvious? Anything present that should not make the cut in a section this small?
you have more discard than I do, and since my cube runs 62 cards of each color I get some more cards, but a lot of it is similar. to beat the problem, you need more cards that don't just deplete the enemy resources and instead add to the total moving parts in the game. You know what is one of the most useful cards in my black section? Corpse connoisseur. Seriously.
The problem is that a lot of the "best" black cards push the game to a stalemate. You need to break that. Phyrexian gargantua, could help with that.
I don't like keening banshee enough to let it go without at least mentioning it. Thats a good spot for you to try vampire outcasts. And I prefer incremental blight over contagioun. I dropped Diabolic edict from my cube as well. Finally, there is no excuse for missing marsh flitter. She is bona fide amazing, and a remedy for the removal problem.
Also, don't apologize for cudgel troll. He's good.
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My cube has been optimized to work with a 2 man draft format of my own invention. Whether or not that changes some card evaluations or even my cube-theory is unknown.
you have more discard than I do, and since my cube runs 62 cards of each color I get some more cards, but a lot of it is similar. to beat the problem, you need more cards that don't just deplete the enemy resources and instead add to the total moving parts in the game. You know what is one of the most useful cards in my black section? Corpse connoisseur. Seriously.
I've never played Corpse Connoisseur, so I can't speak from experience, but it seems like he'll only be useful if I have some reanimation in hand. There aren't that many cards that I want to have in my graveyard without a way to bring them back. He seems like he could be good in the right situation, but he also seems quite narrow and probably not worthy of a spot in a 50 card section.
I don't like keening banshee enough to let it go without at least mentioning it. Thats a good spot for you to try vampire outcasts.
I may make that change. Why don't you like Keening Banshee? I think it's fine, but not amazing. It's like a mini Skinrender that trades a point of p/t and "damage" for evasion.
And I prefer incremental blight over contagioun. I dropped Diabolic edict from my cube as well.
That could be a possible change as well. I like that Contagion is free, though. But it falls into the same boat as FoW in this format. The free is much more detrimental than it is in a constructed deck.
And I can't imagine ever cutting Diabolic Edict. That's one of the best removal spells available, IMO.
Finally, there is no excuse for missing marsh flitter. She is bona fide amazing, and a remedy for the removal problem.
I really don't understand the love of this card and why I see it in so many lists. I love Cloudgoat Ranger, but Marsh Flitter just feels like a much much worse version of that card. It's only three power for four mana. It can only gain evasion twice (assuming I'm only sacrificing the goblins it makes). After that, I'm left with a 1/1 dork. I've never looked at that card and thought it was good. Tell me why this card is good and I'll certainly consider it.
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My cube has been optimized to work with a 2 man draft format of my own invention. Whether or not that changes some card evaluations or even my cube-theory is unknown.
It could very well affect some of your card evaluations and the way certain cards play. With that said, however, it doesn't seem to be affecting the advice you're giving. (Except for that whole bit about Diabolic Edict... but I'll look over that one. Once. :p)
I wouldn't cut diabolic edict either, it's really solid. There's a bunch of other removal spells I'd take out before it.
Regarding your card choices: I actually don't like Chainer's Edict. It's sorcery speed edict with grinding card advantage which contributes to the game slowing down. Other than that, I like your list. I run 72 black cards, so mine has a lot more fluff than yours.
I don't like Keening Banshee either, actually. Trading permanent Last Gasp for Disfigure is pretty terrible, although going from a 3/3 to a 2/2 flying is quite fine. However, against Skinrender most chumps look rather terrible so I guess it's forgivable. I do like Marsh Flitter, on the other hand, and I run it over Keening Banshee. I don't know why, but I had a soft spot for this card. It's splashable chump bodies which can be brought back a few times for a big force. It's no Cloudgoat Ranger, but it's good in black. I would not be opposed to cutting it for Vampire Outcasts, however.
Corpse Connoseur seems interesting, but his function is rather limited. He can't abuse chain Unearth, as there are very few unearth dudes (just him and hellspark) in the cube. It's good if you have a bunch of reanimation, for sure.
I love Skeletal Scrying. It's proved to be quite powerful at this rarity. It goes into basically any deck, but I've found that it's good as a refill for aggro decks that get pulled into the late game and have run out of steam and it's especially at home in black based control deck, specifically those without access to blue card advantage spells.
Child of Night is hit or miss. She's another aggro body that could come or go depending on what C/U weenies we see in Innistrad. She's good, not great, but she fills a niche that needs filling. I wish we would get a black Stormfront Pegasus.
I'm still not convinced on Marsh Flitter. I don't want to splash something just for chumps, so the splashable aspect of it doesn't really mean much to me. I also don't want to play something just for chumps. If it was "Tap two goblins, gain +2/+2 and flying" like Cloudgoat, then it'd be sweet as the black version. I guess if you can abuse find a way to chain it in and out of play and make a bunch of goblins, it's good, but on it's own, I'm just not seeing it.
I originally put Marsh Flitter in to synergize with other cards that interacted with etb abilities like Crystal Shard or Momentary Blink, but that hasn't panned out as well as I thought it would. So it will probably go.
Speaking of black, what do you guys think about Mesmeric Fiend and Faceless Butcher?
I think Faceless Butcher is fine as (yet another) ETB 187 guy. He'd be near the bottom of that list for me, so I wouldn't expect to see him unless the cube was at 500 or more cards (just guessing).
I don't like Mesmeric Fiend at all. It does let me look at their hand, but the most it ever did was take their best removal spell and die to their second best removal spell. Or a pinger. Or a wrath effect. Or combat because I had to block or die. Mesmeric Fiend was just too... I don't know... useless, I guess. He just didn't do much and what little he did do was more of a tempo hit than anything.
Yeah, that's how I feel about both Mesmeric Fiend and Faceless Butcher. I thought they would be good, but there's just too much good removal for fiend to be good and while butcher is okay, he's pricey for something that will probably just bite removal next turn.
I'll look over everything that was said in a second, but Ill say three things (in a rush)
Got Diabolic edict confused with cruel edict.
I run grixis slavedriver as my third 6 drop. That, and all the reanimation I run, makes the connoisseur good for me.
Marsh flitter is always evasive, it just isn't always a 3/3. It's better to say it's black's best imitation of spectral procession, rather than the impossible to match up with Cloudgoat ranger.
It's good because it pushes stalemates in your favor and makes combat flexible for you. Three toughness black creatures aren't too easy to dispatch, and It makes blink effects, reanimation, and equipment all look like allstars (more than usual).
edit
It seems as though my cube is the only one that isn't filled to the brim with kill spells. That makes mesmeric fiend happy in my cube.
It seems as though my cube is the only one that isn't filled to the brim with kill spells. That makes mesmeric fiend happy in my cube.
I think you gave a better argument for the inclusion of Marsh Flitter than I did. He's just in here to be abused for blink and reanimation shenanigans.
As for Mesmeric Fiend, I think I like him. He's an easy to cast Tidehollow Sculler that is bolt-bait. You can really turn a good hand into a terrible hand by casting him early on enough if it makes them shoot it with a spell they didn't want to just to get back the card they really wanted to play.
In that way, he's best thought of as a sorcery. He's practically duress, that can take other stuff if needed. or block. Mesmeric fiend just needs to be looked at properly to be understood properly. Then, if you don't like him, I won't fault you terribly. All I know is that he does a good job of slowing down the opponent, and a lot of matches are tilted in some way by that.
After playing in some M12 drafts, I've changed my tune on a few of the bloodthirst guys. Blood Ogre, Gorehorn Minotaurs, and Vampire Outcasts all seem pretty solid for me, and I put them in to test. I also put in some more black aggro, cut two red removal spells and made some more changes to try and push aggro a bit more.
I would like Mesmeric Fiend a lot more if he could attack for two while he was waiting to be blown up. His 1/1 stature is part of what keeps him out of my list.
Fair enough about mesmeric. I mean, he's not outstanding. He's also just not really terrible and he's disruptive. It's sad he can't swing for 2 for Tidehollow, but he's monoblack and he's really helpful for breaking control.
I managed to get a chance to cube today with 8 people, and here's what I can say about the M12 cards that got ran:
Azure Mage: My friend really liked this, and it net a lot of card advantage for otherwise unused mana. It saw play in a counterburn deck, where he could lay it down when he hit 6 mana.
Jade Mage: Produced many many tokens. Did really well for a 2-drop that functioned as a more specialized Selesnya Guildmage.
Hunter's Insight: Drew as many cards as harmonize if not more on most uses while being more aggressive.
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
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My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
540+, Peasant
Take your hybrids out of your gold section
Mana-math Article
@ "Un" cards: I like the idea of some of those cards, especially Booster Tutor. The thing is, I don't own any Un cards and I don't quite like the fact that some of them are really whacky and work un-Magic-like. I think it's definitely dependent on playgroup, and I honestly wouldn't mind testing Booster Tutor if I ever got my hands on one.
I'm glad that the cards you've tested have worked out well so far, especially Master Thief since you said you didn't include cards like Loxodon Warhammer and Skullclamp in your cube. I don't run mistmeadow witch myself, so Vampire Outcasts is safe from blink except from Flickerwisp, Glimmerpoint Stag, and Otherworldly Journey.
Cubetutor link - 380 Peasant Cube
I haven't, but if I'm going to use an aura, I'd rather have an Umbra or Guide to avoid the chance of being 2-for-1'ed.
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I recently shaved my removal down a little bit, which made a whole suite of cards better. But there is one card that just can't seem to perform in my cube, no matter what I do. Imperious perfect. It just hasn't performed as well as squirrel's nest or sprout swarm when it comes to token production. Jade mage might also be permanently taking over for it in that department. Yesterday was the best it has performed in months, and it made two creatures (one of which traded with something, the other of which had no real effect). Has anyone else been disappointed by this promising elf?
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
540+, Peasant
Take your hybrids out of your gold section
Mana-math Article
Speaking of removal, I've had that same problem lately. During our last draft with my C/U cube, I drafted a RG ramp deck and one of my friends drafted a BW control deck. Our games were some of the most boring uneventful games ever simply because of the sheer amount of removal. I had a ton of red mass removal as well and several burn spells to act as spot removal. He had a ton of spot removal and all of my green and red guys were vulnerable to it. In one game I drew out simply because neither of us could make a creature stick and all of my mana ramp put me a lower card count.
Because of this, I'm thinking of taking out Last Gasp and Vendetta to make room for some reanimation spells in black. I'm a bit skeptical on this as well, though because there aren't really that many good reanimation targets at this rarity.
I'm also planning on removing Puncture Blast and Whipflare from red in favor of Crimson Mage and Stormblood Berserker.
Thoughts on that? Anyone else have this problem with black and red? It's tough because most of the useful black or red spells at this rarity are spot removal or burn. It's just the nature of the colors. But it makes for a fairly unfun drafting environment.
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I think it works best when you can use it draw removal away from your other critters. Your opponent knows they can't leave it unanswered for very long. I guess in that case it's a good card because it always dies?
This just reminded me of why Blastoderm is and always will be awesome.
I'm actually surprised you run Puncture Blast in a 360. Whipflare I can see, but the Blast seems really inefficient compared to the rest of Red's burn. I know it has its uses in shrinking larger creatures, but I think that's what splashing a color is for.
I'm all up for the idea of fitting more interesting creatures into Red's lineup. Just gotta make sure that there's still enough burn for everyone to take, so your aggro drafts aren't short on reach.
This helps me to understand just how good efficiently costed, resilient creatures (Like the Soltari Brothers) are in this format. Creatures have gotten better over time, but the best ones tend to be rare. No Great Stable Stag or Jwar Isle Sphinx for us.
However, removal's gotten better too, but all of that falls right in our rarity range. Path to Exile, Doom Blade, Dismember, etc.
Until Wizards decides to hand us a few small, hard to answer creatures, we may need to consider putting a "cap" on how much removal C/U Cubes run, or else we'll find ourselves in a lot more situations similar to the one you described.
EDH Decks:
I've had this exact same issue and I've thought about how to alleviate it. I don't think it's just an issue of having too much spot removal, even though that definitely does contribute to the problem. I've had games of Black and Red fighting each other where basically nothing sticks. I think it has to do with the efficiency of common/uncommon creatures and their bombiness, especially in the two colors with the most exploding removal. C/UC really limits our options for strong, resilient finishers. I did take out a few black removal spells to make room for Victimize and Diabolic Servitude a while ago.
The second key to the puzzle is pushing for more resistant creatures in the cube, such as Deadwood Treefolk and Eternal Witness. Both of these grind out a lot of card advantage against players who depend on removal. Blastoderm barely dies to anything but aggressive blocking. The Glasskites are hard to pick off. Creatures with persist, such as Kitchen Finks, also help. The thing is, not every color has access to these kind of critters. Red and Black are probably the two colors left most out in the dust, so it makes sense that the battlefield is a no man's land when it comes to a war of attrition.
calibretto, how experienced are the players you draft with? I try to make Black and Red removal as splashable as possible in my cube, so that players will steal removal from those two colors to prevent the critical mass that's necessary for the game to end up in such a degenerate state.
Cubetutor link - 380 Peasant Cube
Black has more diversity than red with things like Night's Whisper and reanimation spells. I also like the diversity within black's removal, -x/-x, sacrifice effects, destroy, etc.
The best red spells are aggressive creatures and efficient burn, which is good, but it doesn't really have a lot else.
Land destruction is a red strength, but they've nerfed that in recent years, and I'm not sure if Stone Rain is worth it. I already have Pillage and Molten Rain. Might be worth it though to give red more diversity, and it boosts more aggressive strategies. One bummer is that cheap burn helps out control and aggro, and I feel like aggro needs more support in my cube.
Quite experienced, I would say. We all draft the cube on a regular basis. Almost all of us have been playing since the late 90's and playing limited since the early 00's. The one guy that hasn't been playing as long as the rest of us just recently won a limited event at one of the SCG Opens. So, I'm fairly confident that everyone is taking the cards correctly. In the case of my friend playing BW, he told me the first seven cards he picked were black removal spells. There's something wrong with that picture.
Creatures like the 'derms and other shroud guys are resistant to removal, but that's not really enough. One of my finishers in my RG deck was Cudgel Troll (a card that I love, btw) and even with his regeneration, I couldn't make him stick.
I think one of my problems comes from the fact that I look to my rare cube a lot of times for ideas and numbers. It looks like I'm running near the same amount of targeted black removal in my rare cube as I am in my C/U cube. That wouldn't be a bad thing except my rare cube is 175 cards larger. I think I'm going to do some contrasting with 360 rare lists to see how much black spot removal they're running. Peasant is definitely a different format than other cubes, but comparing numbers can be helpful.
EDIT: What do you guys think of this as a 50 card black section? Still too much removal? Not enough now? Too much reanimation for C/U? Anything missing that's blatantly obvious? Anything present that should not make the cut in a section this small?
1 Carnophage
1 Fume Spitter
1 Vampire Lacerator
//2cc
1 Black Knight
1 Blind Creeper
1 Child of Night
1 Dauthi Horror
1 Dauthi Slayer
1 Nezumi Graverobber
1 Nezumi Cutthroat
1 Wretched Anurid
1 Bone Shredder
1 Crypt Rats
1 Dauthi Marauder
1 Hypnotic Specter
1 Lilana's Specter
1 Ogre Marauder
1 Phyrexian Rager
1 Vampire Nighthawk
//4cc
1 Entomber Exarch
1 Keening Banshee
1 Nekrataal
1 Okiba-Gang Shinobi
1 Skinrender
1 Sengir Vampire
1 Shriekmaw
//6cc
1 Twisted Abomination
1 Dark Ritual
1 Duress
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Reanimate
//2cc
1 Animate Dead
1 Chainer's Edict
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Diabolic Edict
1 Doom Blade
1 Go for the Throat
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Night's Whisper
1 Necromancy
1 Dismember
1 Infest
1 Stupor
//4cc
1 Barter in Blood
1 Diabolic Servitude
1 Pestilence
1 Snuff Out
1 Contagion
//6cc
1 Enslave
//Xcc
1 Skeletal Scrying
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I like it, I may make some some similar changes. I want to experiment with some of the 2-3 cmc guys like Ogre Marauder and Blind Creeper.
The problem is that a lot of the "best" black cards push the game to a stalemate. You need to break that. Phyrexian gargantua, could help with that.
I don't like keening banshee enough to let it go without at least mentioning it. Thats a good spot for you to try vampire outcasts. And I prefer incremental blight over contagioun. I dropped Diabolic edict from my cube as well. Finally, there is no excuse for missing marsh flitter. She is bona fide amazing, and a remedy for the removal problem.
Also, don't apologize for cudgel troll. He's good.
Extremely Important
My cube has been optimized to work with a 2 man draft format of my own invention. Whether or not that changes some card evaluations or even my cube-theory is unknown.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
540+, Peasant
Take your hybrids out of your gold section
Mana-math Article
I've never played Corpse Connoisseur, so I can't speak from experience, but it seems like he'll only be useful if I have some reanimation in hand. There aren't that many cards that I want to have in my graveyard without a way to bring them back. He seems like he could be good in the right situation, but he also seems quite narrow and probably not worthy of a spot in a 50 card section.
Maybe Phyrexian Gargantua could go in over Twisted Abomination?
I may make that change. Why don't you like Keening Banshee? I think it's fine, but not amazing. It's like a mini Skinrender that trades a point of p/t and "damage" for evasion.
That could be a possible change as well. I like that Contagion is free, though. But it falls into the same boat as FoW in this format. The free is much more detrimental than it is in a constructed deck.
And I can't imagine ever cutting Diabolic Edict. That's one of the best removal spells available, IMO.
I really don't understand the love of this card and why I see it in so many lists. I love Cloudgoat Ranger, but Marsh Flitter just feels like a much much worse version of that card. It's only three power for four mana. It can only gain evasion twice (assuming I'm only sacrificing the goblins it makes). After that, I'm left with a 1/1 dork. I've never looked at that card and thought it was good. Tell me why this card is good and I'll certainly consider it.
It could very well affect some of your card evaluations and the way certain cards play. With that said, however, it doesn't seem to be affecting the advice you're giving. (Except for that whole bit about Diabolic Edict... but I'll look over that one. Once. :p)
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
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Regarding your card choices: I actually don't like Chainer's Edict. It's sorcery speed edict with grinding card advantage which contributes to the game slowing down. Other than that, I like your list. I run 72 black cards, so mine has a lot more fluff than yours.
How do you like Child of Night and Skeletal Scrying? I've wanted to try out the Scrying.
I don't like Keening Banshee either, actually. Trading permanent Last Gasp for Disfigure is pretty terrible, although going from a 3/3 to a 2/2 flying is quite fine. However, against Skinrender most chumps look rather terrible so I guess it's forgivable. I do like Marsh Flitter, on the other hand, and I run it over Keening Banshee. I don't know why, but I had a soft spot for this card. It's splashable chump bodies which can be brought back a few times for a big force. It's no Cloudgoat Ranger, but it's good in black. I would not be opposed to cutting it for Vampire Outcasts, however.
Corpse Connoseur seems interesting, but his function is rather limited. He can't abuse chain Unearth, as there are very few unearth dudes (just him and hellspark) in the cube. It's good if you have a bunch of reanimation, for sure.
Cubetutor link - 380 Peasant Cube
Child of Night is hit or miss. She's another aggro body that could come or go depending on what C/U weenies we see in Innistrad. She's good, not great, but she fills a niche that needs filling. I wish we would get a black Stormfront Pegasus.
I'm still not convinced on Marsh Flitter. I don't want to splash something just for chumps, so the splashable aspect of it doesn't really mean much to me. I also don't want to play something just for chumps. If it was "Tap two goblins, gain +2/+2 and flying" like Cloudgoat, then it'd be sweet as the black version. I guess if you can abuse find a way to chain it in and out of play and make a bunch of goblins, it's good, but on it's own, I'm just not seeing it.
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
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Speaking of black, what do you guys think about Mesmeric Fiend and Faceless Butcher?
I don't like Mesmeric Fiend at all. It does let me look at their hand, but the most it ever did was take their best removal spell and die to their second best removal spell. Or a pinger. Or a wrath effect. Or combat because I had to block or die. Mesmeric Fiend was just too... I don't know... useless, I guess. He just didn't do much and what little he did do was more of a tempo hit than anything.
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
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Got Diabolic edict confused with cruel edict.
I run grixis slavedriver as my third 6 drop. That, and all the reanimation I run, makes the connoisseur good for me.
Marsh flitter is always evasive, it just isn't always a 3/3. It's better to say it's black's best imitation of spectral procession, rather than the impossible to match up with Cloudgoat ranger.
It's good because it pushes stalemates in your favor and makes combat flexible for you. Three toughness black creatures aren't too easy to dispatch, and It makes blink effects, reanimation, and equipment all look like allstars (more than usual).
edit
It seems as though my cube is the only one that isn't filled to the brim with kill spells. That makes mesmeric fiend happy in my cube.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
540+, Peasant
Take your hybrids out of your gold section
Mana-math Article
I think you gave a better argument for the inclusion of Marsh Flitter than I did. He's just in here to be abused for blink and reanimation shenanigans.
As for Mesmeric Fiend, I think I like him. He's an easy to cast Tidehollow Sculler that is bolt-bait. You can really turn a good hand into a terrible hand by casting him early on enough if it makes them shoot it with a spell they didn't want to just to get back the card they really wanted to play.
Cubetutor link - 380 Peasant Cube
Does anybody have other reports from m12 cards.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
540+, Peasant
Take your hybrids out of your gold section
Mana-math Article
That means the M12 cards I'm trying out are those three bloodthirst guys, Crimson Mage, Jade Mage, Azure Mage, and Stormblood Berserker.
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
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I managed to get a chance to cube today with 8 people, and here's what I can say about the M12 cards that got ran:
Azure Mage: My friend really liked this, and it net a lot of card advantage for otherwise unused mana. It saw play in a counterburn deck, where he could lay it down when he hit 6 mana.
Jade Mage: Produced many many tokens. Did really well for a 2-drop that functioned as a more specialized Selesnya Guildmage.
Hunter's Insight: Drew as many cards as harmonize if not more on most uses while being more aggressive.
Blood Ogre, Crimson Mage, Tectonic Rift, and Master thief all sat on sideboards. I'm not sure if Carnage Wurm saw play.
Cubetutor link - 380 Peasant Cube
Cubetutor link - 380 Peasant Cube