See I’m adding that card so the black sac deck I’m adding has a way of locking an opponent out of the game besides just Grinfing our value. Are there any other strong utility creatures for that archetype anyone can think of?
Currently I'm running Viscera Seer, Carrion Feeder, Thoughtpicker Witch, and Blood Artist/Zulaport Cutthroat. And then creatures to abuse like the Myr Naruventien mentioned.
Leelue: Could you remind me about your "no stricly betters" design philosophy? I seem to remember there being a bit more than just no strictly betters.
OK, I’ll have to add the bombardment, and maybe re-add the spirit. Victimize however I think will just replace exhume. Mae I’ve wanted to play for a while now, and the Noble I may re-add
Where possible, I was not including a pair of cards where there was no realistic way one could draft A over B. Not P1p1, but at all in draft.
I made a bunch of exceptions over the years (from simple like porcelain legionnaire vs any red 2 drop, to complicated) but they've slowly been making their way out of my cube. It's not easy
Instead of creating a new thread I'll just post here.
I have a few questions if anyone would be kind enough to help or give opinions.
Basically I created my first C/Ube a few years back, when returning to MTG (end of Theros block). It used to be 360 Modern Peasant + Rare Lands.
I decided later on to expand it beyond modern for a power boost.
My playgroup was also growing fast back then, so next I expanded it to 540.
Then life got in the way and I haven't had time to play, let alone maintain my cube.
So for a year and half it gathered dust and our playgroup partially lost interest.
CUBETUTOR: http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/33647
Now I want to bring it back, so my ideas are the following:
0. GOALS, RULES OF THE CUBE AND 'KNOW THY PLAYGROUP'
The main reasons I built my Cube:
- to enable new players to pick up MTG, to learn to Draft and to play.
- to play with my more experienced friends, have it be interesting for them.
- my playgroup is a constant few and many fluctuating or newer players.
- online legality, no un-cards; I might have a small conspiracy package to bring in, but that's neither here nor there.
As you can tell it's really a balancing act for this Cube, granted Peasant is best suited for it.
1. MODULARITY
I want to make a 360 C/Ube (for smaller playgroups) with a 180 expansion package (for larger drafts). So a 540 Cube total.
I know it'll be a complicated thing to build, so any suggestions how to approach it, to keep it balanced are much appreciated.
2. COLOUR BALANCE
How do you go about when you feel like one colour is stronger than the rest, do you prefer cutting from it or giving answers to other colours?
What unexpected results has that yielded?
3. ARCHETYPES
I want to refresh Draft Archetypes within my Cube.
What are Archetypes you like in your Cubes that you feel work well?
Do you create Primary and Secondary Archetypes for all colour pairs?
If not I would be very interested in hearing how you choose them.
4. DRAFT ENVIRONMENT
It used to be Power first, but now I want to create a complex and deep draft environment.
Additionally I want to create a banlist (e.g. Isochron Scepter, Demonic Tutor, Loxodon Warhammer,...)
So how do you go about creating a base idea for the environment or the Cube Outline?
How do you think about Ally vs. Enemy colour pairs? Do you consider Shards and Clans?
5. LANDS
I used to have cycle of Painlands as support for aggro. Now with the full cycle of Fastlands are they the better choice?
For the Purists do you feel like aggro is good enough without rare land support?
How about Scry lands for control? Or how about giving different Guilds different lands?
I also felt like my Cube used to have too much fixing. Where do you consider the sweet spot?
Sorry for a lot of questions. If you take time to even answer one of them it would really be much appreciated.
I just really want to make the Peasant Cube justice and show it in it's best light.
Thanks to everyone for creating and cultivating this community, it really helps out a lot.
That's a bit of a harsh biteoff, but it is really hard to answer something like that. You are basically asking people to spend several hours writing a massive essay.
A better approach is probably to structure this for yourself and start with one or two questions at the time and then keep coming back for more. That way people see it as more manageable to respond.
Sorry if you dislike my post, maybe I should've made a seperate thread.
I just want to discuss Cube Building outlooks, just gave my Cube as an example. Maybe I should've started more from my experiences.
I've been lurking for years before, and now again very actively for the last few weeks.
Also done my fair share of reading, I am not looking for you to build my cube by any means. What's the fun in that?
And while I understand that it is annoying to repeat yourselves, I am just trying to spark some conversation.
Many of us have read the same articles but we each have different experiences and opinions.
My experiences:
1. Having a 540 Cube leads to quite a dilution in both power level of the Cube and actual mindful drafting.
Decks tend to be more goodstuff.dec compared to when it was 360. It also becomes very awkward when there is a 4-6 person draft, because the payoff card just don't get to be seen.
2. I decided not to use many of the "Isolated Island" types of abilites like Shroud and Hexproof in my Cube. That made Removal very strong in the Cube and subsequently Black became the strongest colour of the Cube. I've previously always cut cards to accommodate for the discrepancies but I feel that is not the best way to do it. The problems with it is, that it often makes strong cards even stronger when doing so unintentionally. I will remove such self-limitations, even though I agree that protection from colour is pretty bad for draft-play experience.
3. My Cube gravitates towards Midrange being very strong. I am trying very hard to push U/x Tempo but I rarely get to see a deck be good enough. I also love R/B Sweeper Control for the Advanced players and since having Havoc Demon it's just the dream. G/B(u) Bounce is also tons of fun. I tried making U/W Blink a thing but it just doesn't have the payoff cards and the blink effects usually just end up being in the other three colours. The issues I find like said is that too many strictly good standalone cards and ETB triggers and removal especially makes almost all decks be Midrange-y. I also never succeeded in creating a U/x Draw Go, despite wanting to have it s part of the Archetypes. Draw spells and Counterspells keep being taken by other decks too much.
4. This is where I am most lacking, since my Cube was Power>Environment before. I loved KTK for where I feel a great environment is. I really thing that one can only cram so much Archetypes in the Cube otherwise it just becomes a big mess of three colour value decks. Which is fun at first, but gets stale after a while.
5. My experience with running the fixing I am running (10x Pain, 10x Tri, 10x Bounce, 5x Vivid, 10x Utility/Fetch) is that I can easily draft 4 colour with two primary, especially with Green being one of them. I would recommend lowering for 540 Cubes, unless this is what you are going for. Bounce lands I never really liked, they are complicated for newer players. The only reason I play them is because my best friends still misses his Pauper Esper Combo, and his dream lives to draft the Deck. (Bounce Lands, CoF, Mnemonic Wall, Ghostly Flicker)
Don't worry, you're welcome. Maybe it's better to just see what's going on right now and take part in those discussions. Your questions are the kind of questions that are discussed every now and then, but usually because a person has a concrete problem. It's a bit hard to say anything interesting about a lot of these topics in the abstract.
0: cubes are inherently troublesome for teaching, I think. But you could limit or ban the complex staples like cloudgoat ranger, or evoke creatures. Old wording is also confusing (sylvan library)
1) We have an average cube list thread somewhere on the forum. Also, cubetutor.com has an average cube function, so you can see what people outside the bubble play.
I think most of those people are playing worse cards, but it will broaden your scope.
In any case, I prefer to keep my cube at the size where I'm not playing cards that are bad. For me that's like 370 or 380. But I have a large banlist, so the sweetspot is probably closer to 450. I couldn't imagine running 540 while still supporting blue aggro, for example, because the cardpool for blue aggro is too shallow.
2) you should always be looking to cut the worst cards from your cube. When you do, see if you can identify what strategies are best (for me, it's white tokens) and put in new cards good against that strategy (pyroclasm).
3) aside from supporting aggro and control in every color, archetypes for me get support when they are deemed worthy (tokens) or interesting by players.
I don't have, say, a simic strategy. But I know simic probably needs interaction so I make sure I have plenty of fight and or bounce. And then I make sure there are ramp targets. You can be creative, but don't force something that doesn't work after multiple iterations.
4) I think ally vs enemy pairs is a horrible distinction that is a stain on magic history. Treat every combination equally.
To find a base outline, look at anybody's list (many of us have links in our signatures). We all have different ideas (I have a very heavy and complicated banlist) but you can get a gist.
5) I strongly suggest you support the best mana fixing you can. I have no relevant experience with fast or painlands, but if one is played in modern or edh more I assume it's better.
Get as many great 5 color lands as possible though. 2 color lands dilute drafts if you have too many.
There. That took 12 minutes on my phone. Wasnt so hard.
I spend more time writing arguments vs phitt and calibretto than that.
Instead of creating a new thread I'll just post here.
I have a few questions if anyone would be kind enough to help or give opinions.
Basically I created my first C/Ube a few years back, when returning to MTG (end of Theros block). It used to be 360 Modern Peasant + Rare Lands.
I decided later on to expand it beyond modern for a power boost.
My playgroup was also growing fast back then, so next I expanded it to 540.
Then life got in the way and I haven't had time to play, let alone maintain my cube.
So for a year and half it gathered dust and our playgroup partially lost interest.
CUBETUTOR: http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/33647
Now I want to bring it back, so my ideas are the following:
0. GOALS, RULES OF THE CUBE AND 'KNOW THY PLAYGROUP'
The main reasons I built my Cube:
- to enable new players to pick up MTG, to learn to Draft and to play.
- to play with my more experienced friends, have it be interesting for them.
- my playgroup is a constant few and many fluctuating or newer players.
- online legality, no un-cards; I might have a small conspiracy package to bring in, but that's neither here nor there.
As you can tell it's really a balancing act for this Cube, granted Peasant is best suited for it.
1. MODULARITY
I want to make a 360 C/Ube (for smaller playgroups) with a 180 expansion package (for larger drafts). So a 540 Cube total.
I know it'll be a complicated thing to build, so any suggestions how to approach it, to keep it balanced are much appreciated.
2. COLOUR BALANCE
How do you go about when you feel like one colour is stronger than the rest, do you prefer cutting from it or giving answers to other colours?
What unexpected results has that yielded?
3. ARCHETYPES
I want to refresh Draft Archetypes within my Cube.
What are Archetypes you like in your Cubes that you feel work well?
Do you create Primary and Secondary Archetypes for all colour pairs?
If not I would be very interested in hearing how you choose them.
4. DRAFT ENVIRONMENT
It used to be Power first, but now I want to create a complex and deep draft environment.
Additionally I want to create a banlist (e.g. Isochron Scepter, Demonic Tutor, Loxodon Warhammer,...)
So how do you go about creating a base idea for the environment or the Cube Outline?
How do you think about Ally vs. Enemy colour pairs? Do you consider Shards and Clans?
5. LANDS
I used to have cycle of Painlands as support for aggro. Now with the full cycle of Fastlands are they the better choice?
For the Purists do you feel like aggro is good enough without rare land support?
How about Scry lands for control? Or how about giving different Guilds different lands?
I also felt like my Cube used to have too much fixing. Where do you consider the sweet spot?
Sorry for a lot of questions. If you take time to even answer one of them it would really be much appreciated.
I just really want to make the Peasant Cube justice and show it in it's best light.
Thanks to everyone for creating and cultivating this community, it really helps out a lot.
1. I actually did this for a while. The extension was marked with a black sharpie circle at the bottom left hand corner of the sleeve on the front side so not to impair drafting but made sorting faster. Overall I eventually phased it out but have considered bringing it back in.
2. Color is one thing I tend not to balance to much as I have found my drafters draft based on their personal play style not power when it comes to my cube. I have however made each color follow more of how most sets set up their logistics so to follow creature count ect which has helped prevent certain colors (cough red cough) from running away. So i guess i do modify but mostly to mimic how sets are set up as they tend to lead to more stable drafts.
3. Archetypes:
Azorius: Control (still figuring this out in my rework)
Dimir: Artifacts (gravematters control sub)
Rakdos: Suicide Aggro (sweeper control sub archetype)
Gruul: Yavimay Fires (with X spell Sub arch)
Selesnya: Value.dec (i guess) with a Warrior Tribal sub theme (testing currently)
Boros: Tokens (aggro also)
Orzhov: Aristrocats
Simic: Ramp
Golgari: dredge
Izzet: Spells Matter
I chose these as I know how my playgroup likes to play in various formats and peasant offers a unique way of highlighting these without have broken decks.
4. my cube is set up to support the draft for my group so idk i haven't banned anything outside wall of denial but that was only because it made control unbeatable majority of games it was successfully fast.
5. Land i keep true peasant so ranivca karoos, trilands, and life khan lands and then value lands outside of that but i try to keep rare lands out of my cube.
0.I've always used it following pauper or newcomer decks or for Hearstone players, since they understand quicker.
So I don't think simplifying is the right for me and my Cube. It serves more the Advanced training course purpose.
Sylvan library might be a bit too strong for me though. It's best in Midrange decks and they are already too strong as is.
1. I've checked the average list before and it has already been very helpful.
CubeTutor average helped me a lot when building the first time, but I fail to see how it could help me define my strategies more.
That also poses the question: How much control do you want to give the players vs. how much the cube is leading you?
For my needs I wish to lean on the Cube being designed to lead the player.
2. I agree with cutting bad cards. I guess you do control the good cards with your large banlist?
3. I will try to take that from you. I sometimes fall into the trap of wanting the Cube to be meta organized (e.g. each Guild needs a clear archetype; each colour has a land). Anyone else has these issues?
4. I dare to disagree. I am not saying they are good, however while being awkward in a way maybe a Cube focused only on one of those could yield good draft experience. Usually Sets are designed like that by Wizards. That begs the question: should a Cube strive to be complex or focused? Which do you find more rewarding?
5. While I agree with the quality, quantity from my experience can make a net negative experience. It really has a strong impact on how much goodstuff.dec there is.
Since I have rare lands available I run Tendo and City. Would something like an Ancient Ziggurat be too narrow? I've actually seen City go quite deep into the pack, so it doesn't seem too strong (Maze was absurd though.)
1. What makes you think about it again? Did you find it hard to keep balanced? Was the Cube a completely different experience small/large?
2. You are talking a lot of sense. I have to say my experiences are quite similar. Like said it could just be my issue comes from too many removal in black and not enough resilient creatures. Or the fact that I prefer black myself...
3. I'm very interested in how your U/W Control will work out. From my experience the lack draw in White makes it much weaker for control compared to Black. Maybe defensive creatures are it's forte. UW Tempo Fliers usually worked great for me though.
I looked at your list and don't really see a big support for UB Artifact, even though it seems interesting. I would guess it can be quite parasitic.
The rest seem pretty much what I've already been using.
4. I saw your power level is pretty high... You've never thought UR Tinker/Isochron is too strong? Loxodon player as a winnning the lotery? I guess it comes down to the playgroup. Maybe regular playgroups allows time for players to adapt and prioritize hate cards more...
5. How do you think it influences aggro? Both Karoo and Khan are Control Lands, I would guess it would slow the format down a little.
@xyape, @ulka
I don’t wanna intrude, but in my own experience. UW control decks are generally the most consistently strong, with Us draw, and counter spells, Ws removal, and excellent creatures make a potent combination.
I didn’t see anyone one else answer this, but I don’t have any rare lands in my C/ube, and I find the Aggro decks don’t really need the help, they just need more dedication earlier in the draft.
And @ulka, how have the liked the following cards? Emrakuls Hatcher, Meteor Blast, and Rolling Thunder.
@xyape, I’ve always found isochron scepter to be really inconsistent, and easy to deal with.
I would be really interested to hear if anyone has made artifacts work and how.
I’ve played with the idea of an expansion, but I would be worried it would be a little annoying having to remove 150 cards depending on the group size for that day, though I might just be lazy. Lol
You mentioned something about the way wizards does things.
The way wizards does things had no bearing on how I do things, aside from the fact that I use their products. I think they do a lot of things that are distasteful.
I strongly dislike sets like ravnica specifically because you're pigeonholed into only a handful of viable color pairs. If I want to play simic or boros, I should be allowed to I say.
I hate these kinds of questions. Go lurk around the forums and do your own reading. Certainly you'll find some answers to your questions.
Or, you know, we could try and make someone feel welcome. Even if it's the internet, you don't tell off people on their literal first post when it's an honest question. Imagine people reacting like this to new people in a game store or similar RL situation..
For what its worth, xyape seems like the type to understand 1) the poster doesn't speak for everyone, as clearly seen, and 2) sometimes bad days manifest in rude internet statements that rational individuals can later take a step back from and realize they sucked for saying.
Does it make it acceptable? No, but apologies and owning-up goes a long way, and regardless the rest of us welcome xyape and would be happy to answer his questions. (Or if you've been kinda lazy lately like me, are able to ignore the posts without being massively *****ty.) Other users have done the same, I try to apologize whenever I've done the same (even if not to that degree), and I get it can be easy to not understand tone as linguistics and language are tough when they go from mouth to messenger.
If you've never got your opponent in the soft lock with it, you've never lived. Great great fun in the token decks or even with Reassembling Skeleton.
Good times....
My Peasant Cube thread !!! (380 cards)
Draft my Peasant Cube on Cube Cobra !!!
No point in getting redunadant advice
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Hmmm I just noticed most of my sac for value creatures at not in black at all they are artifact or white.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
http://www.cubetutor.com/cubeblog/26407
Victimize in general is overpowered, regardless of support
Doomed traveler would be the card I'm least interested in but it makes sense
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Cubetutor Peasant'ish-Funbox
Project: Khans of Tarkir Cube (cubetutor)
I made a bunch of exceptions over the years (from simple like porcelain legionnaire vs any red 2 drop, to complicated) but they've slowly been making their way out of my cube. It's not easy
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Instead of creating a new thread I'll just post here.
I have a few questions if anyone would be kind enough to help or give opinions.
Basically I created my first C/Ube a few years back, when returning to MTG (end of Theros block). It used to be 360 Modern Peasant + Rare Lands.
I decided later on to expand it beyond modern for a power boost.
My playgroup was also growing fast back then, so next I expanded it to 540.
Then life got in the way and I haven't had time to play, let alone maintain my cube.
So for a year and half it gathered dust and our playgroup partially lost interest.
CUBETUTOR: http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/33647
Now I want to bring it back, so my ideas are the following:
0. GOALS, RULES OF THE CUBE AND 'KNOW THY PLAYGROUP'
The main reasons I built my Cube:
- to enable new players to pick up MTG, to learn to Draft and to play.
- to play with my more experienced friends, have it be interesting for them.
- my playgroup is a constant few and many fluctuating or newer players.
- online legality, no un-cards; I might have a small conspiracy package to bring in, but that's neither here nor there.
As you can tell it's really a balancing act for this Cube, granted Peasant is best suited for it.
1. MODULARITY
I want to make a 360 C/Ube (for smaller playgroups) with a 180 expansion package (for larger drafts). So a 540 Cube total.
I know it'll be a complicated thing to build, so any suggestions how to approach it, to keep it balanced are much appreciated.
2. COLOUR BALANCE
How do you go about when you feel like one colour is stronger than the rest, do you prefer cutting from it or giving answers to other colours?
What unexpected results has that yielded?
3. ARCHETYPES
I want to refresh Draft Archetypes within my Cube.
What are Archetypes you like in your Cubes that you feel work well?
Do you create Primary and Secondary Archetypes for all colour pairs?
If not I would be very interested in hearing how you choose them.
4. DRAFT ENVIRONMENT
It used to be Power first, but now I want to create a complex and deep draft environment.
Additionally I want to create a banlist (e.g. Isochron Scepter, Demonic Tutor, Loxodon Warhammer,...)
So how do you go about creating a base idea for the environment or the Cube Outline?
How do you think about Ally vs. Enemy colour pairs? Do you consider Shards and Clans?
5. LANDS
I used to have cycle of Painlands as support for aggro. Now with the full cycle of Fastlands are they the better choice?
For the Purists do you feel like aggro is good enough without rare land support?
How about Scry lands for control? Or how about giving different Guilds different lands?
I also felt like my Cube used to have too much fixing. Where do you consider the sweet spot?
Sorry for a lot of questions. If you take time to even answer one of them it would really be much appreciated.
I just really want to make the Peasant Cube justice and show it in it's best light.
Thanks to everyone for creating and cultivating this community, it really helps out a lot.
A better approach is probably to structure this for yourself and start with one or two questions at the time and then keep coming back for more. That way people see it as more manageable to respond.
Cubetutor Peasant'ish-Funbox
Project: Khans of Tarkir Cube (cubetutor)
I just want to discuss Cube Building outlooks, just gave my Cube as an example. Maybe I should've started more from my experiences.
I've been lurking for years before, and now again very actively for the last few weeks.
Also done my fair share of reading, I am not looking for you to build my cube by any means. What's the fun in that?
And while I understand that it is annoying to repeat yourselves, I am just trying to spark some conversation.
Many of us have read the same articles but we each have different experiences and opinions.
My experiences:
1. Having a 540 Cube leads to quite a dilution in both power level of the Cube and actual mindful drafting.
Decks tend to be more goodstuff.dec compared to when it was 360. It also becomes very awkward when there is a 4-6 person draft, because the payoff card just don't get to be seen.
2. I decided not to use many of the "Isolated Island" types of abilites like Shroud and Hexproof in my Cube. That made Removal very strong in the Cube and subsequently Black became the strongest colour of the Cube. I've previously always cut cards to accommodate for the discrepancies but I feel that is not the best way to do it. The problems with it is, that it often makes strong cards even stronger when doing so unintentionally. I will remove such self-limitations, even though I agree that protection from colour is pretty bad for draft-play experience.
3. My Cube gravitates towards Midrange being very strong. I am trying very hard to push U/x Tempo but I rarely get to see a deck be good enough. I also love R/B Sweeper Control for the Advanced players and since having Havoc Demon it's just the dream. G/B(u) Bounce is also tons of fun. I tried making U/W Blink a thing but it just doesn't have the payoff cards and the blink effects usually just end up being in the other three colours. The issues I find like said is that too many strictly good standalone cards and ETB triggers and removal especially makes almost all decks be Midrange-y. I also never succeeded in creating a U/x Draw Go, despite wanting to have it s part of the Archetypes. Draw spells and Counterspells keep being taken by other decks too much.
4. This is where I am most lacking, since my Cube was Power>Environment before. I loved KTK for where I feel a great environment is. I really thing that one can only cram so much Archetypes in the Cube otherwise it just becomes a big mess of three colour value decks. Which is fun at first, but gets stale after a while.
5. My experience with running the fixing I am running (10x Pain, 10x Tri, 10x Bounce, 5x Vivid, 10x Utility/Fetch) is that I can easily draft 4 colour with two primary, especially with Green being one of them. I would recommend lowering for 540 Cubes, unless this is what you are going for. Bounce lands I never really liked, they are complicated for newer players. The only reason I play them is because my best friends still misses his Pauper Esper Combo, and his dream lives to draft the Deck. (Bounce Lands, CoF, Mnemonic Wall, Ghostly Flicker)
I know it is hard to reply to big walls of text, I am sorry.
It is hard to break into a community I guess...
How about we talk about Cube Size first?
What is your experiences, what do you like/dislike about your Cube size?
Don't worry, you're welcome. Maybe it's better to just see what's going on right now and take part in those discussions. Your questions are the kind of questions that are discussed every now and then, but usually because a person has a concrete problem. It's a bit hard to say anything interesting about a lot of these topics in the abstract.
I hate these kinds of answers. Go lurk around in other threads and answer another post. Certainly you'll find something better to say
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
0: cubes are inherently troublesome for teaching, I think. But you could limit or ban the complex staples like cloudgoat ranger, or evoke creatures. Old wording is also confusing (sylvan library)
1) We have an average cube list thread somewhere on the forum. Also, cubetutor.com has an average cube function, so you can see what people outside the bubble play.
I think most of those people are playing worse cards, but it will broaden your scope.
In any case, I prefer to keep my cube at the size where I'm not playing cards that are bad. For me that's like 370 or 380. But I have a large banlist, so the sweetspot is probably closer to 450. I couldn't imagine running 540 while still supporting blue aggro, for example, because the cardpool for blue aggro is too shallow.
2) you should always be looking to cut the worst cards from your cube. When you do, see if you can identify what strategies are best (for me, it's white tokens) and put in new cards good against that strategy (pyroclasm).
3) aside from supporting aggro and control in every color, archetypes for me get support when they are deemed worthy (tokens) or interesting by players.
I don't have, say, a simic strategy. But I know simic probably needs interaction so I make sure I have plenty of fight and or bounce. And then I make sure there are ramp targets. You can be creative, but don't force something that doesn't work after multiple iterations.
4) I think ally vs enemy pairs is a horrible distinction that is a stain on magic history. Treat every combination equally.
To find a base outline, look at anybody's list (many of us have links in our signatures). We all have different ideas (I have a very heavy and complicated banlist) but you can get a gist.
5) I strongly suggest you support the best mana fixing you can. I have no relevant experience with fast or painlands, but if one is played in modern or edh more I assume it's better.
Get as many great 5 color lands as possible though. 2 color lands dilute drafts if you have too many.
There. That took 12 minutes on my phone. Wasnt so hard.
I spend more time writing arguments vs phitt and calibretto than that.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
1. I actually did this for a while. The extension was marked with a black sharpie circle at the bottom left hand corner of the sleeve on the front side so not to impair drafting but made sorting faster. Overall I eventually phased it out but have considered bringing it back in.
2. Color is one thing I tend not to balance to much as I have found my drafters draft based on their personal play style not power when it comes to my cube. I have however made each color follow more of how most sets set up their logistics so to follow creature count ect which has helped prevent certain colors (cough red cough) from running away. So i guess i do modify but mostly to mimic how sets are set up as they tend to lead to more stable drafts.
3. Archetypes:
Azorius: Control (still figuring this out in my rework)
Dimir: Artifacts (gravematters control sub)
Rakdos: Suicide Aggro (sweeper control sub archetype)
Gruul: Yavimay Fires (with X spell Sub arch)
Selesnya: Value.dec (i guess) with a Warrior Tribal sub theme (testing currently)
Boros: Tokens (aggro also)
Orzhov: Aristrocats
Simic: Ramp
Golgari: dredge
Izzet: Spells Matter
I chose these as I know how my playgroup likes to play in various formats and peasant offers a unique way of highlighting these without have broken decks.
4. my cube is set up to support the draft for my group so idk i haven't banned anything outside wall of denial but that was only because it made control unbeatable majority of games it was successfully fast.
5. Land i keep true peasant so ranivca karoos, trilands, and life khan lands and then value lands outside of that but i try to keep rare lands out of my cube.
Hope that helps
0.I've always used it following pauper or newcomer decks or for Hearstone players, since they understand quicker.
So I don't think simplifying is the right for me and my Cube. It serves more the Advanced training course purpose.
Sylvan library might be a bit too strong for me though. It's best in Midrange decks and they are already too strong as is.
1. I've checked the average list before and it has already been very helpful.
CubeTutor average helped me a lot when building the first time, but I fail to see how it could help me define my strategies more.
That also poses the question: How much control do you want to give the players vs. how much the cube is leading you?
For my needs I wish to lean on the Cube being designed to lead the player.
2. I agree with cutting bad cards. I guess you do control the good cards with your large banlist?
3. I will try to take that from you. I sometimes fall into the trap of wanting the Cube to be meta organized (e.g. each Guild needs a clear archetype; each colour has a land). Anyone else has these issues?
4. I dare to disagree. I am not saying they are good, however while being awkward in a way maybe a Cube focused only on one of those could yield good draft experience. Usually Sets are designed like that by Wizards. That begs the question: should a Cube strive to be complex or focused? Which do you find more rewarding?
5. While I agree with the quality, quantity from my experience can make a net negative experience. It really has a strong impact on how much goodstuff.dec there is.
Since I have rare lands available I run Tendo and City. Would something like an Ancient Ziggurat be too narrow? I've actually seen City go quite deep into the pack, so it doesn't seem too strong (Maze was absurd though.)
Thank you for taking the time.
1. What makes you think about it again? Did you find it hard to keep balanced? Was the Cube a completely different experience small/large?
2. You are talking a lot of sense. I have to say my experiences are quite similar. Like said it could just be my issue comes from too many removal in black and not enough resilient creatures. Or the fact that I prefer black myself...
3. I'm very interested in how your U/W Control will work out. From my experience the lack draw in White makes it much weaker for control compared to Black. Maybe defensive creatures are it's forte. UW Tempo Fliers usually worked great for me though.
I looked at your list and don't really see a big support for UB Artifact, even though it seems interesting. I would guess it can be quite parasitic.
The rest seem pretty much what I've already been using.
4. I saw your power level is pretty high... You've never thought UR Tinker/Isochron is too strong? Loxodon player as a winnning the lotery? I guess it comes down to the playgroup. Maybe regular playgroups allows time for players to adapt and prioritize hate cards more...
5. How do you think it influences aggro? Both Karoo and Khan are Control Lands, I would guess it would slow the format down a little.
Thank you as well for giving some great insights.
I don’t wanna intrude, but in my own experience. UW control decks are generally the most consistently strong, with Us draw, and counter spells, Ws removal, and excellent creatures make a potent combination.
I didn’t see anyone one else answer this, but I don’t have any rare lands in my C/ube, and I find the Aggro decks don’t really need the help, they just need more dedication earlier in the draft.
And @ulka, how have the liked the following cards? Emrakuls Hatcher, Meteor Blast, and Rolling Thunder.
@xyape, I’ve always found isochron scepter to be really inconsistent, and easy to deal with.
I would be really interested to hear if anyone has made artifacts work and how.
I’ve played with the idea of an expansion, but I would be worried it would be a little annoying having to remove 150 cards depending on the group size for that day, though I might just be lazy. Lol
The way wizards does things had no bearing on how I do things, aside from the fact that I use their products. I think they do a lot of things that are distasteful.
I strongly dislike sets like ravnica specifically because you're pigeonholed into only a handful of viable color pairs. If I want to play simic or boros, I should be allowed to I say.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
For what its worth, xyape seems like the type to understand 1) the poster doesn't speak for everyone, as clearly seen, and 2) sometimes bad days manifest in rude internet statements that rational individuals can later take a step back from and realize they sucked for saying.
Does it make it acceptable? No, but apologies and owning-up goes a long way, and regardless the rest of us welcome xyape and would be happy to answer his questions. (Or if you've been kinda lazy lately like me, are able to ignore the posts without being massively *****ty.) Other users have done the same, I try to apologize whenever I've done the same (even if not to that degree), and I get it can be easy to not understand tone as linguistics and language are tough when they go from mouth to messenger.
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