I have been looking through the cube forum and the different cube lists. I have decided that I want to build a cube, but don't really know where to begin. I have a budget of around $100 so I was think that a pauper cube would probably be a good starting point.
My question is, is there a pauper cube that someone has already built that this forum feels is the best jumping off point for someone like me? I want to add my own personal touch to a cube, but I don't really feel like building from the ground up would work well for me. Also do you think that I can pull off a playable cube for around $100?
If you want to start small and cheap, a 360 card cube is what you'd want. I'd suggest either Adam Styborski's cube (probably the most famous one out there), or Rubin's cube. If you want to go higher than that, my own cube is 400 cards.
The cost is not the main factor, pauper cubes are dirt cheap but the cards are just hard to find. I'm still missing three cards.
As for what list you should start with, I think you should steal the structure of someone's cube, probably a 360 to start with (Lanxal linked to my 360), but make some of the choices your own.
but the cards are just hard to find. I'm still missing three cards..
So are there any small Pauper Cubes which are highly regarded that meet all of the following criteria:
- Cards that can be acquired without major difficulty ("common" means diddly if I can't find the card easily and for cheap)
- Can be constructed for $40 (at 360 that's an average of .11 cents per card)
- Well suited for players new M:tG (most people I will using the cube with)
Going to the trouble of crafting a cube myself is out of the question as my whole attraction to cube drafting is to enjoy M:tG in a form that doesn't involve such fiddling or become a money sink.
I'm willing to go to the trouble of ordering all the cards from a few different online vendors if need be, but that's as much time as I'm willing to devote to it apart from the actual playing.
Probably the overall cheapest and easiest way to build a cube would be to buy two deckbuilder's kits and combine them for a 370 card cube (or cut the 10 worst cards to make it an even 360) as described here:
You could probably make a dedicated pauper cube for less money, but it'd take a lot more time to round up all the necessary singles if you're starting from scratch.
Probably the overall cheapest and easiest way to build a cube would be to buy two deckbuilder's kits and combine them for a 370 card cube (or cut the 10 worst cards to make it an even 360) as described here:
You could probably make a dedicated pauper cube for less money, but it'd take a lot more time to round up all the necessary singles if you're starting from scratch.
I actually came across that thread in the same search that landed me here, and I may resort to that if there's no other alternative.
I actually don't mind rounding up all the cards if it will provide a far superior gaming experience.
My main concern is whether there is a well designed pauper/peasant cube that is made up of cards that are readily available within my budget.
Sleeves are going to cost at least $25. Excluding that, it's pretty easy to hit your near your price criteria with many pauper cubes. Playing with more newer cards helps that criteria and the third one as well, which is something to consider.
Sleeves are going to cost at least $25. Excluding that, it's pretty easy to hit your near your price criteria with many pauper cubes. Playing with more newer cards helps that criteria and the third one as well, which is something to consider.
It's a pauper cube for someone that isn't at all involved in the CC part of CCG. I won't be sleeving, so that $25 is not at all a consideration.
Of course if it's simply impossible to find a cheap cube where every single card can be acquired easily and I absolutely must resort to proxies for a few cards, then I'd just use penny sleeves which I have access to super cheap.
I kept up my own list but since I haven't had time to test my own changes extensively, I just copy Usman's pauper cube from https://idratherbecubing.wordpress.com/commons-all/. I can see good reasoning behind all the picks and the colors do what people expect them to do. Blue feels like control, etc. I do swap in a few personal favorites from time to time though.
What Adam Styborski is doing with his cube is interesting, but I feel he's moving towards crafting an all new environment where sweepers make black and red control colors, and that's not the flavor I'm really looking for.
As for the other forum members, I used to track all of your lists and changes but haven't been able to lately, hence getting lazy and just going to 1 source.
When it comes to picking up cards, one strategy would be to make a large order from tcgplayer.com and use their optimizer tool to pick the cheapest version card and minimize all costs including shipping. There are some cards that you won't find cheap no matter what but the majority will be available from someone for 1 or 2 cents apiece.
Thanks so much for the tip on TCGPlayer, definitely seeing a good number of cards cheaper there than other sites I've browsed so far.
So of the these four already mentioned:
Usman
Styborski
Rubin
Lanxal
Which of these do folks think would best fit the original criteria I posted earlier?
- Cards that can be acquired without major difficulty ("common" means diddly if I can't find the card easily and for cheap)
- Can be constructed for $40 (at 360 that's an average of .11 cents per card)
- Well suited for players new M:tG (most people I will using the cube with)
None of those four cubes are made to be "budget" Pauper, so none of them fit your second criteria. However, it's not hard to cut some of the more expensive cards from the cube like Chain Lightning (powerful but replaceable) and Sinkhole (which is not actually that good, just expensive).
The easiest way to make a cheap cube is to make it small to start with. Something like 200 or 300 cards, which would not be good enough for 8man drafts. From there, enlarge as time & funds allow.
A second alternative would be to make a "Modern" Pauper cube (mostly of recent cards). Something like "only commons that are legal in Modern". Restricting it to recent cards lowers the cost, and you can even argue that it's easier to learn as you play with it because its less complex mechanically. Again, after you start with the list
Neither of these comes with it a definitive "list" that you can start with, unfortunately.
Also, it's not hard to get a lot of good commons from friends who play magic or even your own collection. A lot of people have collections of cards from prereleases or whatnot that they have no use for anymore.
Thanks Lanxal. So am I basically hearing that there are no pre-constructed cube lists available that meets with the three criteria I'm asking for?
I completely appreciate that for all of you it's a natural recommendation to just begin putting a cube together from an assortment of cards, but that's just not going to happen.
Truth is, I just don't have the time to familiarize myself with hundreds and hundreds of cards well enough to make an even remotely balanced cube.
Is there really not a single cheap beginner friendly cube design out there that someone can point me to?
If not, then it sure sounds like a challenge to put out there in the community to create one because I found my way here from a board game forum where there are countless people who would LOVE to try exactly that.
What better way to introduce new players that are daunted by how vast and overwhelming MtG has become, and who have steered clear because of the perception that the only way to enjoy it is by investing a ton of cash.
I'm sure that many many folks would find their way deeper into the fold if something like this was out there as a perfect introduction.
I'm sure I'd eventually start tinkering myself, but only AFTER I've played with a cube like this for quite some time.
------
(from second post added later… sorry for double posting)
Look, how about if I made the first two points a bit more flexible…
As far as availability, as long as the vast majority can be acquired at very reasonable prices, I'm more than willing to do paste-up proxies for the few that are either harder to find and/or more expensive.
So the criteria would be… a balanced cube well suited to play by relative newcomers where most of the cards can be had for a reasonable price. (allowing for a few exceptions that will be proxied)
Does that help?
Or is this more a problem because those who are savvy enough to have spent time developing a solid cube are also so deep into the game that it's always going include very complex mechanics and strategies that aren't suited to new players?
Also, let me clarify what I mean by "new players". This will usually be gamers that have no experience with MtG, but do have a good deal of experience with modern deck builders like Dominion and Ascension. So there won't be any knowledge of MtG strategies but they will have a basic grasp of the concepts of card synergies and combos.
The issue is that I'm not familiar 100% with the average price of the cards in my cube, so I wouldn't be able to tell you just how feasible $40 is. I really doubt it can happen, nor am I familiar with any lists that I think comes close to that.
On the topic of suitability, I think there are more basic and easier ways to teach new players how to play, but a Pauper cube certainly is good for it. I've taught a friend or two how to play with my cube.
The more I look around at pauper cubes the more I'm realizing how true what you're saying really is. I've clearly misinterpreted what "pauper" implies in the world of cubing, now that I'm seeing "budget" lists for certain cubes that total $300+
That said when I've checked prices for the first 20-30 cards of a few cubes, many prices have been very reasonable. Usman's was averaging close to my target of .11 cents, and Styborski's maybe 50% more at about .16.
So I'm still hopeful that with a willingness to proxy the 20-30 most expensive cards I might be able to keep this below $100? (feel free to let me know if this is still utterly delusional)
So that said, is there any Pauper Cube in particular that folks would say is more newbie friendly than most others?
This cube looks like it had a similar goal in mind albeit with a much larger "budget" build of $360. Unfortunately it looks like the OP got almost no feedback on the actual card list he posted so it appears to be entirely un-vetted:
And to clarify further, my interest in the format is not because I think it's ideal for teaching new players, but rather because I honestly wouldn't be coming anywhere near MtG again if it wasn't for the rise of a limited format like this where I've heard a one time outlay can yield a great deal of gaming fun without an ongoing investment. (I quit playing 4th Ed. right around the time Ice Age was released when I saw what a money sink it was going to be for me)
My desire for it being newcomer friendly is simply because most of the people I will be using my cube with will likely be learning the game in the process.
My question is, is there a pauper cube that someone has already built that this forum feels is the best jumping off point for someone like me? I want to add my own personal touch to a cube, but I don't really feel like building from the ground up would work well for me. Also do you think that I can pull off a playable cube for around $100?
A list of good Pauper cubes is available here.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
Its not yet on the list given above, so I thought I'd throw it here.
My 360 Commons Cube
Your favorite MTG website
As for what list you should start with, I think you should steal the structure of someone's cube, probably a 360 to start with (Lanxal linked to my 360), but make some of the choices your own.
Draft it on Cubetutor!
So are there any small Pauper Cubes which are highly regarded that meet all of the following criteria:
- Cards that can be acquired without major difficulty ("common" means diddly if I can't find the card easily and for cheap)
- Can be constructed for $40 (at 360 that's an average of .11 cents per card)
- Well suited for players new M:tG (most people I will using the cube with)
Going to the trouble of crafting a cube myself is out of the question as my whole attraction to cube drafting is to enjoy M:tG in a form that doesn't involve such fiddling or become a money sink.
I'm willing to go to the trouble of ordering all the cards from a few different online vendors if need be, but that's as much time as I'm willing to devote to it apart from the actual playing.
Any insights would be greatly appreciated!
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=474651
You could probably make a dedicated pauper cube for less money, but it'd take a lot more time to round up all the necessary singles if you're starting from scratch.
I actually came across that thread in the same search that landed me here, and I may resort to that if there's no other alternative.
I actually don't mind rounding up all the cards if it will provide a far superior gaming experience.
My main concern is whether there is a well designed pauper/peasant cube that is made up of cards that are readily available within my budget.
It's a pauper cube for someone that isn't at all involved in the CC part of CCG. I won't be sleeving, so that $25 is not at all a consideration.
Of course if it's simply impossible to find a cheap cube where every single card can be acquired easily and I absolutely must resort to proxies for a few cards, then I'd just use penny sleeves which I have access to super cheap.
What Adam Styborski is doing with his cube is interesting, but I feel he's moving towards crafting an all new environment where sweepers make black and red control colors, and that's not the flavor I'm really looking for.
As for the other forum members, I used to track all of your lists and changes but haven't been able to lately, hence getting lazy and just going to 1 source.
When it comes to picking up cards, one strategy would be to make a large order from tcgplayer.com and use their optimizer tool to pick the cheapest version card and minimize all costs including shipping. There are some cards that you won't find cheap no matter what but the majority will be available from someone for 1 or 2 cents apiece.
Pauper Cube
(Last update: Fate Reforged--March 2015)
So of the these four already mentioned:
Usman
Styborski
Rubin
Lanxal
Which of these do folks think would best fit the original criteria I posted earlier?
The easiest way to make a cheap cube is to make it small to start with. Something like 200 or 300 cards, which would not be good enough for 8man drafts. From there, enlarge as time & funds allow.
A second alternative would be to make a "Modern" Pauper cube (mostly of recent cards). Something like "only commons that are legal in Modern". Restricting it to recent cards lowers the cost, and you can even argue that it's easier to learn as you play with it because its less complex mechanically. Again, after you start with the list
Neither of these comes with it a definitive "list" that you can start with, unfortunately.
Also, it's not hard to get a lot of good commons from friends who play magic or even your own collection. A lot of people have collections of cards from prereleases or whatnot that they have no use for anymore.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
I completely appreciate that for all of you it's a natural recommendation to just begin putting a cube together from an assortment of cards, but that's just not going to happen.
Truth is, I just don't have the time to familiarize myself with hundreds and hundreds of cards well enough to make an even remotely balanced cube.
Is there really not a single cheap beginner friendly cube design out there that someone can point me to?
If not, then it sure sounds like a challenge to put out there in the community to create one because I found my way here from a board game forum where there are countless people who would LOVE to try exactly that.
What better way to introduce new players that are daunted by how vast and overwhelming MtG has become, and who have steered clear because of the perception that the only way to enjoy it is by investing a ton of cash.
I'm sure that many many folks would find their way deeper into the fold if something like this was out there as a perfect introduction.
I'm sure I'd eventually start tinkering myself, but only AFTER I've played with a cube like this for quite some time.
------
(from second post added later… sorry for double posting)
Look, how about if I made the first two points a bit more flexible…
As far as availability, as long as the vast majority can be acquired at very reasonable prices, I'm more than willing to do paste-up proxies for the few that are either harder to find and/or more expensive.
So the criteria would be… a balanced cube well suited to play by relative newcomers where most of the cards can be had for a reasonable price. (allowing for a few exceptions that will be proxied)
Does that help?
Or is this more a problem because those who are savvy enough to have spent time developing a solid cube are also so deep into the game that it's always going include very complex mechanics and strategies that aren't suited to new players?
Also, let me clarify what I mean by "new players". This will usually be gamers that have no experience with MtG, but do have a good deal of experience with modern deck builders like Dominion and Ascension. So there won't be any knowledge of MtG strategies but they will have a basic grasp of the concepts of card synergies and combos.
Doubleposting merged.
—Lanxal
On the topic of suitability, I think there are more basic and easier ways to teach new players how to play, but a Pauper cube certainly is good for it. I've taught a friend or two how to play with my cube.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
That said when I've checked prices for the first 20-30 cards of a few cubes, many prices have been very reasonable. Usman's was averaging close to my target of .11 cents, and Styborski's maybe 50% more at about .16.
So I'm still hopeful that with a willingness to proxy the 20-30 most expensive cards I might be able to keep this below $100? (feel free to let me know if this is still utterly delusional)
So that said, is there any Pauper Cube in particular that folks would say is more newbie friendly than most others?
This cube looks like it had a similar goal in mind albeit with a much larger "budget" build of $360. Unfortunately it looks like the OP got almost no feedback on the actual card list he posted so it appears to be entirely un-vetted:
Savation Cube: a Community Project To Help New Players Get Into The Format
And to clarify further, my interest in the format is not because I think it's ideal for teaching new players, but rather because I honestly wouldn't be coming anywhere near MtG again if it wasn't for the rise of a limited format like this where I've heard a one time outlay can yield a great deal of gaming fun without an ongoing investment. (I quit playing 4th Ed. right around the time Ice Age was released when I saw what a money sink it was going to be for me)
My desire for it being newcomer friendly is simply because most of the people I will be using my cube with will likely be learning the game in the process.
now, we cant get rid of this topic for the next few month.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t