Looks pretty good. I'm interested to see how the Oracle works out compared to Masked Admirers.
Yeah, that's the one I'm most curious about. I'm also not totally impressed with Gelectrode, but it's got to be better than Nucklavee. I had high hopes for the hybrid beast but I've never seen it get back two spells in cube. Too bad. I'd like to push a counterburn deck and Gelectrode should help with that.
Speaking of counterburn, what do my fellow Cubists think of my counterspells? Do I have enough and could I run better ones. I know I need Remand and I can't afford Mana Drain right now. Any other suggestions?
I just browsed your list and I really don't see that you're missing anything significant other than the two you mentioned. You got the big hitters (FoW, Counterspell, Mana Leak, Dismiss, Cryptic Command) and some small timers (Force Spike, Miscalculation, Faerie Trickery (this should be Dissipate), Desertion). I think your counter suite is fine.
EDIT: I just realized you're missing Arcane Denial. A hard counter that replaces itself and is easy to cast should be a cube staple, IMO. Get that card in ASAP.
If you're really trying to force UR counterburn, I suggest using as many of the single-U counter as you can add in. I find that I prefer cards like Arcane Denial, Miscalculation and Complicate over UU countermagic in that particular archetype.
Arcane denial is pretty horrible since it gives your opponent extra cards, same reason you shouldn't play howling mine in the cube :/
(not looking to start this argument again, but I figure both sides should be represented)
Agreed with eidolon232's suggestions. also Oracle seems much better than the admirers, so good change!
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Arcane denial is pretty horrible since it gives your opponent extra cards, same reason you shouldn't play howling mine in the cube :/
(not looking to start this argument again, but I figure both sides should be represented)
Once again, you can't just do this.
"I don't want to argue! But I'm right and they're wrong."
It doesn't work that way.
It's not a horrible card at all, in fact, it's really good. It's the only hard-counter at that mana cost, and you draw cards with it in a position to use them before your opponent. Any true hard counter with only a single blue in its cost is bound to have drawbacks, but it doesn't stop the card from being anything less than great.
Good counters that haven't been mentioned yet are Serum Visions -> Memory Lapse: almost on the level of Remand, sometimes even better Remove Soul->Exclude: You don't get a cantrip effect for only 1 extra mana often. Repulse -> Venser, Shaper Savant: being a creature makes him reusable and he can provide you with the needed body for equipments
These seem like solid suggestions. I don't have a Venser, but the others are changes I can make.
I really thought Dissipate was in my cube already...dur! I guess I just have to swap Faerie Trickery for it.
I'm mostly pro-Arcane Denial. I just don't know if it is up to cube standards.
"I don't want to argue! But I'm right and they're wrong."
It doesn't work that way.
It's not a horrible card at all, in fact, it's really good. It's the only hard-counter at that mana cost, and you draw cards with it in a position to use them before your opponent. Any true hard counter with only a single blue in its cost is bound to have drawbacks, but it doesn't stop the card from being anything less than great.
Eh thats not what I said.
You said arcane denial is great because ooxx
i said arcane denial is horrible because ooxx
we have both presented out argument, I suggested we then stop discussing this and move on, because I don't want to do this in every cube thread, sounds fair? if you feel like you need to get the last word in, thats fine, you just did, we should move on now. I simply pointed out there are people who love it and people who hate it, and nothing more.
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When someone asks what kind of cards they should include, I can say Arcane Denial if I want to. You can come in and argue against it if you want, but someone posed a specific question about what counters people like for UR counterburn, and my answer was Arcane Denial because I feel it's the best counterspell for that archetype. You don't have to agree, and if you want to debate why again, I'll leave that up to you. Someone asked me a question and I answered it.
I posted my thought, and you counter-posted your opinion about the card while also saying "not looking to start this argument again", meaning you were trying to get the last word in, not me. It doesn't work that way. You can't say "Arcane denial is pretty horrible" AND "I don't want to argue" in the same post... because it's obvious that you're looking to debate the card again, otherwise you'd have left it alone.
sure I disagree with you, but its clear from previous encounters either will change their position, hence I felt it was best to simply say what we think once, then move on rather than continue to talk about the same points which has been discussed countless times before. I am clearly not looking to debate the card again because its fruitless because no one will change their position. I don't understand why you feel when some people disagree there has to be an argument/debate, where plenty of other times you have seen people agree to disagree. Look, if its so hard to understand for you, I agree we must disagree on the card, and neither side will change their position, since you have stated your position on the card (and rightfully so), I will also state my position. why is this so hard to understand for you.
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Copy this sig to join the cause. Cuz, ya know, Wizards makes decisions based on sigs.
... I'd like to push a counterburn deck ...
Speaking of counterburn, what do my fellow Cubists think of my counterspells? Do I have enough and could I run better ones.....Any other suggestions?
Including the ones you mentioned, these are the counters I run that aren't in your list (my cube is big though):
sure I disagree with you, but its clear from previous encounters either will change their position, hence I felt it was best to simply say what we think once, then move on rather than continue to talk about the same points which has been discussed countless times before. I am clearly not looking to debate the card again because its fruitless because no one will change their position. I don't understand why you feel when some people disagree there has to be an argument/debate, where plenty of other times you have seen people agree to disagree. Look, if its so hard to understand for you, I agree we must disagree on the card, and neither side will change their position, since you have stated your position on the card (and rightfully so), I will also state my position. why is this so hard to understand for you.
Um... the Arcane Denial debate had nothing to do with this thread. Someone asked me what counterspells I like for UR counterburn and I said Arcane Denial. You came in and said "Arcane Denial is garbage, but I don't want to debate". You're the one that had to try and squeeze in the last word, and wouldn't let the debate go. I'm not trying to change your opinion on the card. I don't care weather or not you like the card. This was never a debate with you. I'm simply saying that Arcane Denial is a great card for the cube, and a perfect card for UR counterburn. You're more than welcome to debate if you want to, I don't care.
no I agree we are not going to debate this here...so...lets stop?...ok...my head hurts
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Copy this sig to join the cause. Cuz, ya know, Wizards makes decisions based on sigs.
Removing:
Expedition Map
Chrome Mox
Momentary Blink
Faerie Trickery
Rewind
Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
Seal of Fire
Ghitu Fire
Deadwood Treefolk
Adding: Chrome Mox (foil!)
[CARD]Black Vise
Akroma, Angel of Wrath
Thieving Magpie
Dissipate
Complicate
Fireball
Urza's Rage
Kodama of the North Tree[/CARD]
I think this update is pretty solid, but it should've been even more solid: Someone was supposed to sell me a From the Vault: Exiles, but their buddy put it up on ebay instead. Poop.
Let me know what you think. Also in the size cube I have, do you think I need to run Fyndhorn Elves along with Llanowar Elves?
Also, fantastic update. The only one of those cards I'd miss is Chrome Mox (which plays really well for us here, despite a lot of peoples' distaste for it in the cube)... but luckily there's a foil one going in, so no harm done!
Channel is hit or miss but can be very explosive, to play stuff like Terastodon on T3 or 4 and virtually any good artifact (or Eldrazi :D) on Turn 2. I'd cut Rude Awakening, personally.
I just acquired a nice shiny Faerie Conclave. Would a few of you fine folks review my blue section and suggest what to cut for it? My first thought was Pestermite, but my blue creature count already seems low. Thoughts?
Looks pretty good. I'm interested to see how the Oracle works out compared to Masked Admirers.
Yeah, that's the one I'm most curious about. I'm also not totally impressed with Gelectrode, but it's got to be better than Nucklavee. I had high hopes for the hybrid beast but I've never seen it get back two spells in cube. Too bad. I'd like to push a counterburn deck and Gelectrode should help with that.
Speaking of counterburn, what do my fellow Cubists think of my counterspells? Do I have enough and could I run better ones. I know I need Remand and I can't afford Mana Drain right now. Any other suggestions?
Cheers,
rant
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EDIT: I just realized you're missing Arcane Denial. A hard counter that replaces itself and is easy to cast should be a cube staple, IMO. Get that card in ASAP.
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(not looking to start this argument again, but I figure both sides should be represented)
Agreed with eidolon232's suggestions. also Oracle seems much better than the admirers, so good change!
Copy this sig to join the cause. Cuz, ya know, Wizards makes decisions based on sigs.
Once again, you can't just do this.
"I don't want to argue! But I'm right and they're wrong."
It doesn't work that way.
It's not a horrible card at all, in fact, it's really good. It's the only hard-counter at that mana cost, and you draw cards with it in a position to use them before your opponent. Any true hard counter with only a single blue in its cost is bound to have drawbacks, but it doesn't stop the card from being anything less than great.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
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My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
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These seem like solid suggestions. I don't have a Venser, but the others are changes I can make.
I really thought Dissipate was in my cube already...dur! I guess I just have to swap Faerie Trickery for it.
I'm mostly pro-Arcane Denial. I just don't know if it is up to cube standards.
Cheers,
rant
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It totally is. As a matter of fact, I'm of the opinion that it should be a cube staple.
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Eh thats not what I said.
You said arcane denial is great because ooxx
i said arcane denial is horrible because ooxx
we have both presented out argument, I suggested we then stop discussing this and move on, because I don't want to do this in every cube thread, sounds fair? if you feel like you need to get the last word in, thats fine, you just did, we should move on now. I simply pointed out there are people who love it and people who hate it, and nothing more.
Copy this sig to join the cause. Cuz, ya know, Wizards makes decisions based on sigs.
I posted my thought, and you counter-posted your opinion about the card while also saying "not looking to start this argument again", meaning you were trying to get the last word in, not me. It doesn't work that way. You can't say "Arcane denial is pretty horrible" AND "I don't want to argue" in the same post... because it's obvious that you're looking to debate the card again, otherwise you'd have left it alone.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Cube and EDH are pretty much the best Magic formats in the world. If you aren't playing them, you should be.
Copy this sig to join the cause. Cuz, ya know, Wizards makes decisions based on sigs.
Including the ones you mentioned, these are the counters I run that aren't in your list (my cube is big though):
- Venser, Shaper Savent
- Pact of Negation
- Arcane Denial
- Remand
- Memory Lapse
- Mana Drain
- Complicate
- Dissapate
- Exclude
- Desertion
- Time Stop
- Power Sink
.If you really want to push Counter-Burn, try fitting in Swans of Bryn Argoll ...
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=385729
Um... the Arcane Denial debate had nothing to do with this thread. Someone asked me what counterspells I like for UR counterburn and I said Arcane Denial. You came in and said "Arcane Denial is garbage, but I don't want to debate". You're the one that had to try and squeeze in the last word, and wouldn't let the debate go. I'm not trying to change your opinion on the card. I don't care weather or not you like the card. This was never a debate with you. I'm simply saying that Arcane Denial is a great card for the cube, and a perfect card for UR counterburn. You're more than welcome to debate if you want to, I don't care.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Copy this sig to join the cause. Cuz, ya know, Wizards makes decisions based on sigs.
Removing:
Expedition Map
Chrome Mox
Momentary Blink
Faerie Trickery
Rewind
Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
Seal of Fire
Ghitu Fire
Deadwood Treefolk
Adding:
Chrome Mox (foil!)
[CARD]Black Vise
Akroma, Angel of Wrath
Thieving Magpie
Dissipate
Complicate
Fireball
Urza's Rage
Kodama of the North Tree[/CARD]
I think this update is pretty solid, but it should've been even more solid: Someone was supposed to sell me a From the Vault: Exiles, but their buddy put it up on ebay instead. Poop.
Let me know what you think. Also in the size cube I have, do you think I need to run Fyndhorn Elves along with Llanowar Elves?
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963
Also, fantastic update. The only one of those cards I'd miss is Chrome Mox (which plays really well for us here, despite a lot of peoples' distaste for it in the cube)... but luckily there's a foil one going in, so no harm done!
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My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Calvin and Hobbes
Cube Tutor
Cheers,
rant
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Civic Wayfinder, Oracle of Mul Daya or Channel.
...or Rude Awakening.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
I think Channel is the worst card on that list.
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On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
-Channel
+Fyndhorn Elves
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963