Those are some very good suggestions; in fact, I have implemented many of them in the last few changes. Some of the changes were card for card what you suggested However, there are still some good cards you recommended in that post and helped me also see a few cards I would like to reconsider as maybe not as good as I thought. Usually these cards are just relics of a bygone age of my cube.
But I'm very curious about how you would rank the top 5 of the cards in post #192, especially the white and the blue.
Elite Vanguard - Huge help to WW.
Harm's Way - I've been impressed with Shining Shoal, and in my experience, this compares extremely favorably.
Miraculous Recovery - one of my all-time favorite white spells, I think it's a better Makeshift Mannequin.
Prison Term - Not bad, although I've honestly never seen it move.
Battlegrace Angel - Much like Rafiq, makes you really want to attack. But if I had to choose between that and Baneslayer, I'd take Baneslayer.
U:
Upheaval - such a game breaker, especially if you build around it (float a ton of mana, upheaval, drop something, win)
Opposition - Probably the best U/X aggro enabler ever.
Time Spiral - Talked about in another thread.
Deep Analysis - Draw 2 + draw a slightly worse night's whisper.
Serendib Efreet - Another aggro great in blue.
B:
Yawgmoth's Will - wins games via huge card advantage
Bone Shredder - terror on a guy, granted, a slightly more expensive guy, but solid.
Terror - see above, good ol' removal.
Reanimate - cheating guys into play FTW
Necromancy - see above, but for 3 mana.
R:
Fireblast - Oops, I burned you to 4 life and I'm tapped out, you still die.
Banefire - X spells, so good.
Greater Gargadon - makes the opponents' removal blow. It's also nice to sneak out when your opponent is tapped out, sacrificing a few cards for a random 9/7. Also awesome with/against Armageddon, Wrath of God and the like.
Jaya Ballard, Task Mage - Awesome against aggro (Discard a card + 1R = kill one of their guys) and control (Discard + R = kill target blue wincon if you can.) The Inferno effect is a nice effect as well, although I've only seen it happen once FTW.
Ancient Hydra - TBH, I've no idea.
G:
Thornling - most green 5 drops are really good. This is no exception, it's nearly impossible to kill in combat.
Call of the Herd - 3/3 for 3 is decent but getting a free Hill Giant spell out of it also is solid when you need to cast it.
Caller of the Claw - good for Wrath Insurance.
Woodfall Primus - If you can get it out, it should be quite insane. The problem being that it's hard to get out, but if it does, it should have quite the board impact.
All Suns' Dawn - Best in 5CC or decks with a lot of hybrid. Typically beats Restock.
I would definitely try to make room for the Planeswalkers ASAP, they're all (exception being Tezzeret and even that's debatable) extremely good and are a huge help to the colors who run them, especially white. I'd honestly also take out Crime/Punishment for Nicol Bolas if you have to for having a 3-color card.
Usman's last few posts are very on-point, and I almost agree completely with everything he said. A few slight differences in ranking, but for the most part I think he's got it spot-on.
A few other cards not mentioned that I also think you should consider:
-Catastrophe: One of the best Wraths ever, as the flexibility of 'Geddon or Wrath is easily worth the extra two mana.
-Treachery: You definitely need this one in ASAP. Card is easily one of the best blue cards available, and arguably THE best since you don't run any power.
-Future Sight: This card is sometimes unbelievable busted, while other times a bit clunky. I would recommend giving it a shot as the more powerful and condensed the cube the better this card often gets.
-Decree of Pain: This card is very good both hardcast and cycled. Highly recommended.
-Recurring Nightmare: I'm going to assume it's not in here simply cause you don't have a copy.
-Profane Command: One of the best black cards, period. All modes are backbreaking for the most part. The best Command for limited, IMO (Cryptic ain't no joke, but this card just wins the game an unreal amount of the time).
...I'll leave it at this for now, and if you have stated elsewhere in the thread that you are adding some of these I apologize, since I scanned you list on the first page and the last page of comments about additions, but I know you've been adding a lot lately so it's possible that I missed something. If I get around to it later I will continue going through colors and looking for amazing cards that are very worthy of inclusion.
Thanks for the feedback, guys. I am still very interested in anyone's opinionon post #192 as the more I read about various takes on cards, the better I can understand them. In any case, this decision is getting easier with more opinions to cull and sift.
And no, the OP is not up to date. It got out of sync and it was just easier to do a total overhaul after this next update. I didn't say anything because I was enjoying the comments that confirmed some of the changes I have already made, plus no comments are a waste as awesome cards like Recurring Nightmare and Future Sight and Profane Command deserve to be brought up over and over again.
And yes, I think Profane Command is the best command in the cube. That card is just sick, sick, sick.
Archon of Justice and Battlegrace Angel both get picked highly in my cube. Elite vanguard is really good for aggro, and I can attest to Harm's way's power from drafting M10. Feudkillers Edict is a card that I wish I had room for, its a really cool effect.
Deep Analysis and Foresee are both solid card draw. Ninja is quality, and Riftwing is a great 2 drop that solves problems. Frantic Search is free instant-speed card draw. Even at -1 card advantage, its still quality.
Kind of hard to give make this choices without knowing what else is in the cube exactly, but as I asked for the same and got an answer from you this is not a reason to not answer here I guess.
White
Miraculous Recovery - the perfect card for the 'minor theme of reanimator'
Prison Term - removal that aggro and control can use
Harm's Way - what Usman said
Elite Vanguard - two power for one mana, no drawback? yes, please.
Serra Avenger - because it was the cheapest creature left on the list; if for some reason one of Baneslayer Angel, Exalted Angel, Reveillark, Cloudgoat Ranger and Akroma, Angel of Wrath are not on your list already and you don't want to add them, take Battlegrace Angel here.
Blue
Time Spiral - a draw-seven for basically free or less
Deep Analysis - good draw
Aeon Chronicler - uncounterable draw that ends up beeing creature
Upheaval - one of the Top 10 blue cards
Riftwing Cloudskate - Boomerang on a stick
Note that I did not include blue aggro oriented cards as this is not what blue does in your cube, according to the first post.
Black
Necromancy - good Animate Dead variant
Reanimate - Akroma, Angel of Wrath for 1 mana? Sounds good!
Yawgmoth's Will - sounds good
Bone Shredder - Terror on a stick makes it reusable
Death Denied - it is an instant, that makes it quite good; if you are short on removal, I would choose Terror instead
Red
Greater Gargadon - great
Sneak Attack - nice build-around-me card
Jaya Ballard, Task Mage - I like her, though she often dies before using one of her abilities. That just shows that other people fear her
Banefire - uncounterable, unpreventable X burn sounds good
Fireblast - what Usman said
Green
Thornling - this can win games
Woodfall Primus - great target for reanimation, even for instant speed Necromancy
All Suns' Dawn - 5 color should love this, I think I'm just going to re-add this to my cube
Call of the Herd - two creatures for one card is a good deal
Fastbond or Caller of the Claw, I don't know. Fastbond is broken if you get a really fast start out of it, but seems rather useless later on. Caller of the Claw on the other hand, I had him in my cube but he never performed well. I'd give Fastbond a try here, I think.
Harm's Way
Elite Vanguard
Battlegrace Angel
Archon of Justice
Serra Avenger
Time Spiral
Deep Analysis
Ninja of the Deep Hours
Upheaval
Frantic Search
Reanimate
Bone Shredder
Terror
Death Denied
Yawgmoth's Will
I wouldn't include Jaya. Her abilities are rarely ever abused for us. In fact she'll be on the chopping block once Zendikar is released.
All of the green cards seem really good. My cuts there would be between Caller of the Claw or Fastbond. I have no experience with either, but I here good things about both. This is a tough cut.
You want to cut Jaya ?
She's one of red best 3-drops. Red has a problem with finding good efficient cards and Jaya is pretty solid: she's a 2/2 for 3 mana and she turns every card in your hand into an incinerate or Inferno. You'll need a really good 3-drop to do better than that.
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You want to cut Jaya ?
She's one of red best 3-drops. Red has a problem with finding good efficient cards and Jaya is pretty solid: she's a 2/2 for 3 mana and she turns every card in your hand into an incinerate or Inferno. You'll need a really good 3-drop to do better than that.
This is why I'm still running her. She seems so good in theory. I sadly have found her dissapointing in actual use. I hope this is just a small sample size effect, but I keep reading similar reviews on here.
This is why I'm still running her. She seems so good in theory. I sadly have found her dissapointing in actual use. I hope this is just a small sample size effect, but I keep reading similar reviews on here.
I'm in the same situation. She been in our cube almost since the beginning. She seems amazing on paper, but she rarely works out that way. It's been two years now and I'm still not impressed with her, so if Zendikar gives me the goods, she gets the axe.
And no, the OP is not up to date. It got out of sync and it was just easier to do a total overhaul after this next update. I didn't say anything because I was enjoying the comments that confirmed some of the changes I have already made, plus no comments are a waste as awesome cards like Recurring Nightmare and Future Sight and Profane Command deserve to be brought up over and over again.
Any chance you'll be updating the OP sometime soon? I'd like to know what cards are in your cube at this point.
I'm still looking to buy some cards... the eternal excuse. But this time it would literally be impossible to update it as my cube is in pieces awaiting updates large and small.
I am thinking of doing an MSE file when I get a chance to look at the cube statistically. There are some powerful analytical tools to use that will really shed light on how the cube looks.
...... I can add five cards for each color/gold/artifact/land. Here are the problem sections, so please give me your top five cards you would add and comments on any others you feel like.
And either Frantic Search, Riftwing Cloudskate or Opposition. Whichever your cube wants more. I think the bolded ones are absolute staples though. If it were my cube, I'd use Frantic Search. I like cards that dig for free.
Never been a fan of Sneak Attack. It's a good card in the right deck (when you draw it), but ultimately I cut it because it's too narrow in the cube. A Sneak Attack deck that doesn't draw its Sneak Attack is just called "bad deck".
I'd use all except for either the Primus or the Sun's Dawn. If you play lots of 3-5 color stuff, the ASD is a powerhouse. If you're like my playgroup that plays a lot of 1-2 color stuff, the Dawn is almost strictly worse than Restock... which I don't run either. The rest are pretty strong, especially Caller of the Claw, which I think is vastly underrated on this forum.
I agree with most of wtwlf's suggestions.
For white my 5th card would be Battlegrace Angel.
For blue it would be Opposition.
For red my choice would be Sneak Attack or Ancient Hydra.
For green I would prefer Woodfall Primus and All Suns' Dawn over Caller of the Claw.
But I'm very curious about how you would rank the top 5 of the cards in post #192, especially the white and the blue.
Top 5 out of the proposed cards:
W:
Elite Vanguard - Huge help to WW.
Harm's Way - I've been impressed with Shining Shoal, and in my experience, this compares extremely favorably.
Miraculous Recovery - one of my all-time favorite white spells, I think it's a better Makeshift Mannequin.
Prison Term - Not bad, although I've honestly never seen it move.
Battlegrace Angel - Much like Rafiq, makes you really want to attack. But if I had to choose between that and Baneslayer, I'd take Baneslayer.
U:
Upheaval - such a game breaker, especially if you build around it (float a ton of mana, upheaval, drop something, win)
Opposition - Probably the best U/X aggro enabler ever.
Time Spiral - Talked about in another thread.
Deep Analysis - Draw 2 + draw a slightly worse night's whisper.
Serendib Efreet - Another aggro great in blue.
B:
Yawgmoth's Will - wins games via huge card advantage
Bone Shredder - terror on a guy, granted, a slightly more expensive guy, but solid.
Terror - see above, good ol' removal.
Reanimate - cheating guys into play FTW
Necromancy - see above, but for 3 mana.
R:
Fireblast - Oops, I burned you to 4 life and I'm tapped out, you still die.
Banefire - X spells, so good.
Greater Gargadon - makes the opponents' removal blow. It's also nice to sneak out when your opponent is tapped out, sacrificing a few cards for a random 9/7. Also awesome with/against Armageddon, Wrath of God and the like.
Jaya Ballard, Task Mage - Awesome against aggro (Discard a card + 1R = kill one of their guys) and control (Discard + R = kill target blue wincon if you can.) The Inferno effect is a nice effect as well, although I've only seen it happen once FTW.
Ancient Hydra - TBH, I've no idea.
G:
Thornling - most green 5 drops are really good. This is no exception, it's nearly impossible to kill in combat.
Call of the Herd - 3/3 for 3 is decent but getting a free Hill Giant spell out of it also is solid when you need to cast it.
Caller of the Claw - good for Wrath Insurance.
Woodfall Primus - If you can get it out, it should be quite insane. The problem being that it's hard to get out, but if it does, it should have quite the board impact.
All Suns' Dawn - Best in 5CC or decks with a lot of hybrid. Typically beats Restock.
I would definitely try to make room for the Planeswalkers ASAP, they're all (exception being Tezzeret and even that's debatable) extremely good and are a huge help to the colors who run them, especially white. I'd honestly also take out Crime/Punishment for Nicol Bolas if you have to for having a 3-color card.
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A few other cards not mentioned that I also think you should consider:
-Catastrophe: One of the best Wraths ever, as the flexibility of 'Geddon or Wrath is easily worth the extra two mana.
-Martial Coup: Yet another completely awesome Wrath variant. I understand you probably don't want too many of these, so I would probably rank them Wrath of God, Catastrophe, Martial Coup, Austere Command, Rout, Akroma's Vengeance, followed after that by others but I'm sure you don't have the space for them.
-Treachery: You definitely need this one in ASAP. Card is easily one of the best blue cards available, and arguably THE best since you don't run any power.
-Future Sight: This card is sometimes unbelievable busted, while other times a bit clunky. I would recommend giving it a shot as the more powerful and condensed the cube the better this card often gets.
-Decree of Pain: This card is very good both hardcast and cycled. Highly recommended.
-Recurring Nightmare: I'm going to assume it's not in here simply cause you don't have a copy.
-Doomblade/Diabolic Edict: Excellent, efficient removal.
-Profane Command: One of the best black cards, period. All modes are backbreaking for the most part. The best Command for limited, IMO (Cryptic ain't no joke, but this card just wins the game an unreal amount of the time).
...I'll leave it at this for now, and if you have stated elsewhere in the thread that you are adding some of these I apologize, since I scanned you list on the first page and the last page of comments about additions, but I know you've been adding a lot lately so it's possible that I missed something. If I get around to it later I will continue going through colors and looking for amazing cards that are very worthy of inclusion.
(list not current)
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(list is always current)
W
.
U
.
B (Here I would appreciate the suggestion of solid black creatures that you might instead place in the top five to add list.)
Is your opening post up to date? You don't run Shriekmaw or Graveborn Muse?
.
R (since there are only six cards here, you may also state if you find any of these cards underwhelming and if so, why.)
Those five all seem like great adds.
.
G (same as red, please)
As do those five.
And no, the OP is not up to date. It got out of sync and it was just easier to do a total overhaul after this next update. I didn't say anything because I was enjoying the comments that confirmed some of the changes I have already made, plus no comments are a waste as awesome cards like Recurring Nightmare and Future Sight and Profane Command deserve to be brought up over and over again.
And yes, I think Profane Command is the best command in the cube. That card is just sick, sick, sick.
Does this change/modify the lists for these cards?
I am still looking for more input on the white and blue cards, as they are the biggest areas of conflicting choices.
W
Archon of Justice and Battlegrace Angel both get picked highly in my cube. Elite vanguard is really good for aggro, and I can attest to Harm's way's power from drafting M10. Feudkillers Edict is a card that I wish I had room for, its a really cool effect.
U
Deep Analysis and Foresee are both solid card draw. Ninja is quality, and Riftwing is a great 2 drop that solves problems. Frantic Search is free instant-speed card draw. Even at -1 card advantage, its still quality.
B
Plaguelord is incredible.
R
G
Thornling and All Suns' Dawn are both really solid cards. I haven't tried Caller, but it seems better than Fastbond.
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White
Miraculous Recovery - the perfect card for the 'minor theme of reanimator'
Prison Term - removal that aggro and control can use
Harm's Way - what Usman said
Elite Vanguard - two power for one mana, no drawback? yes, please.
Serra Avenger - because it was the cheapest creature left on the list; if for some reason one of Baneslayer Angel, Exalted Angel, Reveillark, Cloudgoat Ranger and Akroma, Angel of Wrath are not on your list already and you don't want to add them, take Battlegrace Angel here.
Blue
Time Spiral - a draw-seven for basically free or less
Deep Analysis - good draw
Aeon Chronicler - uncounterable draw that ends up beeing creature
Upheaval - one of the Top 10 blue cards
Riftwing Cloudskate - Boomerang on a stick
Note that I did not include blue aggro oriented cards as this is not what blue does in your cube, according to the first post.
Black
Necromancy - good Animate Dead variant
Reanimate - Akroma, Angel of Wrath for 1 mana? Sounds good!
Yawgmoth's Will - sounds good
Bone Shredder - Terror on a stick makes it reusable
Death Denied - it is an instant, that makes it quite good; if you are short on removal, I would choose Terror instead
Red
Greater Gargadon - great
Sneak Attack - nice build-around-me card
Jaya Ballard, Task Mage - I like her, though she often dies before using one of her abilities. That just shows that other people fear her
Banefire - uncounterable, unpreventable X burn sounds good
Fireblast - what Usman said
Green
Thornling - this can win games
Woodfall Primus - great target for reanimation, even for instant speed Necromancy
All Suns' Dawn - 5 color should love this, I think I'm just going to re-add this to my cube
Call of the Herd - two creatures for one card is a good deal
Fastbond or Caller of the Claw, I don't know. Fastbond is broken if you get a really fast start out of it, but seems rather useless later on. Caller of the Claw on the other hand, I had him in my cube but he never performed well. I'd give Fastbond a try here, I think.
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Harm's Way
Elite Vanguard
Battlegrace Angel
Archon of Justice
Serra Avenger
Time Spiral
Deep Analysis
Ninja of the Deep Hours
Upheaval
Frantic Search
Reanimate
Bone Shredder
Terror
Death Denied
Yawgmoth's Will
I wouldn't include Jaya. Her abilities are rarely ever abused for us. In fact she'll be on the chopping block once Zendikar is released.
All of the green cards seem really good. My cuts there would be between Caller of the Claw or Fastbond. I have no experience with either, but I here good things about both. This is a tough cut.
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She's one of red best 3-drops. Red has a problem with finding good efficient cards and Jaya is pretty solid: she's a 2/2 for 3 mana and she turns every card in your hand into an incinerate or Inferno. You'll need a really good 3-drop to do better than that.
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540> 360 Powered CubeThis is why I'm still running her. She seems so good in theory. I sadly have found her dissapointing in actual use. I hope this is just a small sample size effect, but I keep reading similar reviews on here.
I'm in the same situation. She been in our cube almost since the beginning. She seems amazing on paper, but she rarely works out that way. It's been two years now and I'm still not impressed with her, so if Zendikar gives me the goods, she gets the axe.
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Any chance you'll be updating the OP sometime soon? I'd like to know what cards are in your cube at this point.
I am thinking of doing an MSE file when I get a chance to look at the cube statistically. There are some powerful analytical tools to use that will really shed light on how the cube looks.
These are the 5 I'd keep from your list.
W
U(too many good ones to cut)
- Foresee
- Opposition
- Serendib Efreet
- Upheaval
- Frantic Search
.B
- Necromancy
- Reanimate
- Yawgmoth's Will
- Terror
- Bone Shredder
.R
- Greater Gargadon
- Sneak Attack
- Jaya Ballard, Task Mage (o.k. if blue is strong in cube ... which it should be)
- Banefire
- Fireblast
.G
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=385729
W
And one more of your choice. Not really a fan of any of 'em... but gun to head, I'd probably use the Avenger.
U
And either Frantic Search, Riftwing Cloudskate or Opposition. Whichever your cube wants more. I think the bolded ones are absolute staples though. If it were my cube, I'd use Frantic Search. I like cards that dig for free.
B
Don't like the other two at all.
R
Never been a fan of Sneak Attack. It's a good card in the right deck (when you draw it), but ultimately I cut it because it's too narrow in the cube. A Sneak Attack deck that doesn't draw its Sneak Attack is just called "bad deck".
G
I'd use all except for either the Primus or the Sun's Dawn. If you play lots of 3-5 color stuff, the ASD is a powerhouse. If you're like my playgroup that plays a lot of 1-2 color stuff, the Dawn is almost strictly worse than Restock... which I don't run either. The rest are pretty strong, especially Caller of the Claw, which I think is vastly underrated on this forum.
Hope that helps.
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For white my 5th card would be Battlegrace Angel.
For blue it would be Opposition.
For red my choice would be Sneak Attack or Ancient Hydra.
For green I would prefer Woodfall Primus and All Suns' Dawn over Caller of the Claw.
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