This is intended an article, a collection of my cube experiences with less popular cards, but I encourage people to share their own afterwards.
Is there any cards in your list that you think may have been missed by forum members that worked out great for you? Is there a card that you tested a year ago, loved, championed, but have now cut?
Below is a comprehensive list of cards that I don't think are unanimously played, I've played a lot with and why I like them.
FWIW a lot of these opinions aren't just mine, I actively probe my playgroup for feedback, and regularly have discussions with them on cards in my cube. The following opinions were formed through a lot of testing unless otherwise stated.
Also, every cube environment is different and some cards may not be suited to yours. I try to mention that when possible.
Cards that were slept on , but I feel people are coming around to
Craterhoof behemoth
Gaea's cradle
Massacre wurm
Karakas
Collective brutality
Palace Jailer
These are all clear 360-450 staples in my eyes, unpowered, powered, whatever... The first three i've had literal hundreds of cubes experience with now, and my whole playgroup would agree. I would literally wager everything I own, laying 5 to 1 odds that on a power level basis, they deserve a slot in 98%+ of cubes who's design philosophy is primarily based on "pick the best cards from magics history and put them in a limited draft format".
The first 2 are among the top ~150 powerful cards in cube.
Powerful Narrow/Fringe cards, not for every cube
-Mishra's workshop, If you are playing a powered cube and supporting the "artifact.dec" this is one of the better cards in the archtype. It's no tolarian academy, but it's still very powerful and worth supporting. It requires a certain artifact density, mana rocks, payoff etc. A little more than 1/10th of my cube is artifacts and that feels about right. If you run a support the artifact.dec with artifact specific cards, you should be playing this card.
-Fastbond/Zuran orb/Crucible of worlds Combo, I tried FOREVER to make fastbond work and failed time and time again. FINALLY, I got it to work as a competitive archetype but it needs a LOT of support. Outside of zuran orb, all the support cards are fine cube cards on their own though. I'm very confident I did get it to work. The perfect fastbond combo deck is as good as any deck in cube, but it only gets drafted 1/5 cubes or so. It's a cool archetype and has a very "power" esque feel to it since your nut draws are completely broken. it's super fun and complex to play. My only fear is that the duplicate fetch lands in my cube, contribute to it's potency and it wouldn't work well as a two color deck.
If you want to make it work, I'd say you need a cube 360-485 in size (high density of draw 7's is critical), and need every cubeable draw 7 printed , courser of kruphix, tireless tracker, enlightened tutor, ramunap excavator, strip mine. I think I posted a more comprehensive list on the fastbond thread.
You do not need the obscure lands matters cards like Gitrog monster, Titania etc. but they do make the archetype better.
Bazaar of baghdad
Very powerful, very narrow. In an ideal all-in reanimator deck, it is THE BEST enabler along with entomb. Helps if you have urborg. I currently do not run it, as I found it too narrow for my tastes... Not every style of reanimator decks wants it, and it's only good in reanimator. You might enjoy it, especially if you value historic cards in your cube. We tested it at a long time and it was excellent in decks that wanted discard outlets.
FWIW, Every 9 months or so we do a cube rotisserie draft with best players in my group. Reanimator has won it 3/4 times and everyone agreed bazaar was the MVP of those decks... We are actually BANNING bazaar from the next rotisserie. It's upside is that high.
Lake of the dead
This one caught me by surprise, but far exceeded my expectations in testing. This may sound crazy, but I actually think it is the best mono black payoff in cube, but it entirely depends on how your black section is built.
I think most black sections around here are built supporting hyper agro, reanimator and a sprinkle of control. I am unconfident about how this land will function within that paradigm.
I assure you that a midrange mono black "devotion" build is very possible to support in a singleton cube and is competitive. If you are unhappy with your black section for whatever reason, I strongly recommend running the following experiment. Prune some of the worst of your agressive creatures, removal spells, or very narrow black cards and ensure you have the following.
-Enough discard outlets in black to make close to mono-black reanimator a thing. Collective brutality , divest etc.
-Massacre wurm and grave titan (a 3rd 6 drop would be welcome, but not needed). The 6 drops are critical to the strategy.
-A 2 drop or two that can block well. Gifted Aetherborn and relentless dead I think are the best. the 1/3 warrior from the new set is interesting too.
-Geralf's messenger/Gray merchant of asphodel.
-A decent black payoff card advantage spell, either Profane command or Wretched confluence is good.
-Lake of the dead
What this build does is it leverages most of the best black cards in cube, without forcing you to go all-in reanimator. While not every black card is great in the build, almost every black card is playable allowing you to semi-force mono black without train wrecking. Recurring nightmare and skull clamp are extremly powerful cards in the build, reanimate becomes a fine value card. Massacre wurm is even better when backed up with ground beat downs, and grave titan is one of the best creatures in cube. When you are putting a lot of black permanants in play, Gray merchant becomes excellent (also is absurd with recurring nightmare).
Dark ritual and Lake of the dead give the deck a very high level of explosiveness. When backed up with some disruption from discard spells, an early grave titan, or dumping your hand of powerful 3drops is often game over against non-control decks.
With lake of the dead, the sequence of
Turn 1 - swamp , Discard spell
Turn 2,- swamp , 2 drop
Turn 3,- lake of the dead, Grave titan is extremly busted.
Lake of the dead is also not "devotion only", it is ok in heavy black agro and excellent in mostly black reanimator, if most of the creatures you reanimate are colorless or black. (5 drop Liliana , grave titan, massacre wurm, wurmcoil engine). Even a turn 5 hardcast griselbrand, turn 4 hardcast myr battlesphere happens and is solid.
Leovold, Emissary of Trest
This card is only great in cubes with very good fixing. I'm continually amazed by how many cards leovold shuts down or draws cards off that I never noticed before. in 3+ color decks, this is one of the best payoffs out there. I don't recommend him for the majority of cubes, but if you feel like your mana is great and you get a lot of 3+ color decks, give it a whirl. He's more than earned a slot in my cube.
Breya, Etherium Shaper
An even more extreme example of a card that's only great in cubes with very very good fixing. At the moment my cube has double duals, double fetches, single shocks and 1 manland/other @500 AND the only conspiracy I run is unexpected potential. Breya is a beast of a card that has all sorts of synergy in cube IF you can cast it a decent consistency. We've cast her a lot, and she's extremly good.
Temporal Mastery
The cubes I do recommend it for, are for cubes that run arcane savant, but don't want to run cards that are only good under arcane savant, or are potentially too broken (cruel ultimatum and summon the pack).
With a brain storm and a mystical tutor, or a scroll rack and a vampiric tutor, temporal mastery is very solid card by itself and doesn't need arcane savant. It's probably the best arcane savant payoff in my cube at the moment.
In my cube I run double brainstorm, and the extra brainstorm is enough to make temporal mastery deserve a slot without arcane savant.
Generic good cards, underappreciated that are 450-540 range
negate/spell pierce
Counter spells are awsome in cube because a lot of strategies aim to leverage broken non-creature spells, or very expesnive spells (planeswalkers etc.). If your opponents are casting tutors like vampiric tutor to set them up, a well timed counter spells often generates multiple cards of value.
Cards like time spiral or upheavel can outdo all the card advantage you've accumulated in a single card. Denying their resolution is essential.
Even agro decks run broken non-creautre spells like armageddon, equipment, burn spells etc.
They are main deckable effects in cube for the same reason duress is. In fact I don't think know if I've ever seen either negate or spell pierce ride a sidebord in a deck with 7+ islands heh.
I personally don't like to run TOO many counter spells as it reduces the power level of combo decks, which are among the more fun decks to draft... But negate/spell pierce definitely deserve a slot in power level for mid sized cubes.
I currently am only running negate.
Serum visions/Gitaxian probe
Cantrips in blue are good, and these ones are very solid. I do not think they are a must play in small cubes, as you want to strike a balance between generic good cards, a variety of CMC's , a variety of archetypes etc... But I believe some people overestimate the value of expensive cards in cube for larger cubes and vastly underestimate cantrips. In no world would I play neither of these two @540. The best blue decks in cube have a high density of cantrips, they dig for your broken cards (power), your combo pieces, answers, provide GY food for dig through time/treasure cruise/tasigur/grim lavamancer, trigger prowess for mentor/pyromancer/thing in the ice.
Serum visions is better if the deck contains 8+ blue sources, but I like gitaxian probe as any non-blue combo deck is happy to play it, and it still has all the benefits of prowess/GY food above. Seeing your opponents hand is a powerful effect that is easy to underestimate. I'm not sure which i'd rather support if I could pick one.
There's a reason why some cantrips have been banned and every modern/legacy blue deck runs tons
They are both in my cube at the moment.
Shelldock isle
Very good for supporting blue Eldrazi/Griselbrand combo decks that is also a fine value playable in any slow blue deck. It took me a while to come around to this card. It wasn't until a group member ranted and raved about me including it, I begrudgingly included it. Right away he played it all the time and crushed me with it. Eventually, I drafted it myself a bunch, THEN I fully respected it's power. It's in my cube at the moment and not on the chopping block.
Glorybringer
I dismissed glory bringer when I read it.. Seemed powerful , but not good enough to compete with a super stacked section. I eventually tested it around half way into it's standard season, and it's done nothing but impress me. There's a good chance it is the #1 cube red 5 drop by a very small margin. Thundermaw, zealous conscripts and siege-gang commander are all optimized in slightly different builds.. so it kind of depends on how your red decks play out and your cube format. It's competition is so close to it, that I don't hate not including it... But if you aren't running purphorous, or see a ton of revilark/alesha type decks, I would strongly advise testing it over seige-gang commander. And if you don't run kiki-jiki combo, I'd test it as a #3 red 5 drop at least.
It's like sarkhan dragonspeaker, but you get to +1 it AND -3 it on the same turn and replaces vulnerability to combat damage to vulnerability to wraths/doomblade. I think it's much better than sarkhan and I see a lot of people still running him. Wildfire is the only archetype where that's an exception and glorybringer's not even that much worse in wildfire!
Whisperwood elemental
I know a lot of people here have tested it and it fallen short, but that surprises me. It's around #4 or #5 green 5 drop for me. It's resiliency combined with the potential of running away with the game is why I like it so much. I am happy to have it in my list, and when I am searching for green cuts, I don't really consider it. I've played a LOT with it since Khans block was printed. The better green 5 drops have clearly better upside when built with synergies in mind, but by itself, it may be my best main deck green 5 drop creature for ramp decks. Protection from wraths/Ugin is big.
Territorial Hellkite
This one slipped through the cracks of spoiler season for a lot of people, ANOTHER red 4 drop? we dont need one of those! But it's performed very well for me. Very close to hellrider in power level. Maybe 5% worse in decks with a bunch of creatures, but in creature light deck (UR spells for example) with an aggressive slant it is much better. I would 100% play it over hazoret, which I think is worse in cube than constructed for a bunch of reasons.
Rampaging Ferocidon
Ended up just cutting it to test Najeela, but Rampaging ferocidon performed very well for me since I started testing it from ixalan spoiler season. Shutting down life gain is so so important for red, and a 3/3 menace body is far from bad. Winning games through griselbrand and sphinx of the steel wind is a good feeling
Basically, think of what the two worst things for red decks are, life gain and lots of blockers. This card restricts the BEST way that red decks are combatted and thus, is at it's best in red's worst matchups. It's a red agro only card though, and the 3rd best at the time of writing, so not for the smallest cubes. It also is better with burn than it is with lots of other creatures. So it depends a bit on the composition of your red section.
It's underwhelming if they have a bunch of wraths or something, but red decks with burn don't care too much about that. and a mediocore card in a matchup that's already very good is totally fine.
Ashen Rider
Orzhov classification is part of the reason I think so few people consider this card, but the casting cost is misleading. You basically never hardcast it so it may as well cost 4BBBRRBWU. However, it's a strong playble in the majority of cheaty archetypes in cube.
Ashen rider goes in and out of my list , I primarily bring it in if I think both reanimator and sneak/show/eureka are underperforming. It gives a shot in the arm to both archetypes.
It has one of the best floors out of any reanimation target period. Stabalizing the board, or crippling the opponents mana base. Your opponent losing a removal spell and two of their best permanants is pretty hard to come back from, and often buys you time to reanimate something else.
It's good against literally every archetype and almost every board state in cube. Nice karakas bro!
In my re-animator decks, I think it's about the 3rd-4th? best target in cube (if hardcasting doesnt matter) and sneak and show decks it's not the very best, but it's still quite powerful. I also love it with eureka, because it can answer the things that can potentially answer the eldrazi/ugin you also put into play (say they put in a karn , an oblivion ring, a sower of temptation, or Emrakul of their own).
At the moment I am not running Ashen rider, but If my cube ever went to 540 in size , it would have a permanent home.
Vraska's Contempt
I and most people dismissed the card during spoiler season for being 4 mana instead of 3, and all the competition that comes at the four mana slot in cube.
However, after losing back to back against blightsteel colosus in my black deck and seeing vraska's contempt in standard, I decided to give it a whirl.
It pleasently surprised me and confirmed my theory.
I now think its slightly better than Never//Return and Ruinous path overall.
The main reasons are, exile >> destroy. With reanimator being a commonly deck, indestructible creatures, recursive creatures etc. Black doesn't have many good answers to resilient creatures and cube has a lot of them. They typically have to x for 1 themselves, or hope that they land an edict on an empty board. There's a fair number of generic kill spells, but that doesn't deal well with a woodfall primus for example. I want my versatile expensive kill spells to be as versatile as possible
Instant > Sorcery, it may not always be obvious, but there are many times where instant speed is relevant for agressive decks. And for UB control decks it's 1000000x better.
Gain 2 life is nice and non-neglible, especially in black which has so much incidental life loss.
I currently am running Vraska's contempt, and am not running never//return.
Wretched Confluence
A card I just cut in my most recent batch of updates, but one that is very solid. I've been playing it since the confluence cycle got spoiled and have seen it done great work. It didn't see much play outside of UB control, but was still an ok 22nd playable outside of that deck. IN that deck it's insane. Especially with torrential gearhulk
UB control doesn't come up quite often enough for me to feel the need to keep it as I'm performing some weird tests at the moment. It could easily come back. At 540 it would have a permanant home
Ashiok, Nightmare weaver
This card potentially should go in my first section on a power level basis, but I personally loathe the gameplay it presents, and don't like it's synergies. I don't like the card, but I cannot deny it's power level. It's clear top 4 in dimir (most of my playgroup believes #2), but meh, I hate it
I recommend testing it if you haven't given it it's proper due and don't care about milling.
Jace , Memory adept
I dislike this card even more than ashiok for gameplay reasons, but again, I can't deny it's power. Unlike ashiok I havent tested jace much, but I have played it in other cubes, and the mill effect is super super good. It may be less good in cubes that support agro thoroughly though. MTG salvation forums cubes tend to support agro better than most cubes I've seen IRL. I'm not recommending this card, only mentioning it for completion.
I've enjoyed reading this! As our cube is large, we have played most of the cards you've written about, yet is is always good to hear more perspectives on those too.
Mishra's Workshop didn't/doesn't work here, although I'm trying to support the artifact deck pretty hard and we play powered. Unlike Metalworker he cannot cast Eldrazis. People here don't maindeck Workshop just to cast mana stones (those that cost 2), and so far it was very hard to have a high enough artifact density to make it maindeckable. It might be a greater issue about archetype support though, I fully believe it can be made busted, I just haven't figured out how.
Temporal Mastery - It's terrible when drawn. Ways to put it back from your hand into the library are essential. Brainstorm, Jace TMS and Scroll Rack are the only good cards that do that. In any case, Arcane Savant doesn't need dedicated support to be good in my experience. Last draft I played him with Mystic Confluence. Upheaval is also complete nonsense with that guy.
Spell Pierce - It, along with Force Spike and Mana Tithe, didn't fly with our playgroup. They lose value very fast, and often you counter spells you don't really want to spend a card to deal with, because of the fear you'll never get an opportunity to use them again.
Negate - We play it but honestly it didn't impress me. Definitely playable though.
Serum Visions - A great card. One of the weaker card selection tools in the late game, but one of the best on turn one (better than Ponder and Brainstorm). Seldom should you regret playing cheap card quality.
Shelldock Isle - In the right kind of deck (one that has Eldrazi) it is a bomb, otherwise it is just very strong. I didn't keep track, but my gut feeling is that it gets activated around 70% of the time. Free spells, at instant speed, what's not to like? The best blue land IMO
Glorybringer - A strong one. A reanimator deck that didn't play red used it recently. Sounds underpowered, but was usually enough to stabilize the game and even sometimes to close it. Brings enough immediate impact to pass the Vindicate test with flying colors. Sometimes it immediately kills a planeswalker and a creature. Controllish red decks prefer it to Thundermaw (counterburn, RG ramp, reanimator depending on build). In aggro or midrange Thundermaw is better and red still features those prominently so I'd say Thundermaw is better.
Fully agree that Glorybringer is better than Sarkhan, Dragonspeaker (unless you support Wildfire).
Whsiperwood Elemental - Disagree with you on that one, I'd rank it at #11 at best at 5cc green (including planeswalkers and Plow Under, as they all want to be played on curve).
Terittorial Hellkite - Smashes face very well. My experience mirrors yours, he was better than Hazoret (and far more consistent)
Ashen Rider - You convinced me to try it, reanimator can use another fatty.
Vraska's Contempt - Was recently added for exile clause, don't have the experience to tell if it is better than Never//Return. Never//Return has been pretty good though.
Wretched Confluence - Also pretty good against aggro if you survive long enough to cast it. Sucks when you need to kill a titan with it, but that option still exists. Another top target for Arcane Savant.
Ashiok, JMA - both are very powerful cards, with high win rates. JMA is purely a wincon, but is very good at what it does. Ashiok is also ranked at #2 in Dimir here.
What you feel about Ashiok I feel towards Dragonlord Silumgar. It has no meaningful synergies (sac outlets I guess? Not really a thing in UB control decks), is good in matchups where your deck is at its best, bad when your deck is at its worst and the play pattern is always just to snag the most powerful permanent you can and cross your fingers they have no removal. Yet I cannot deny its power.
LucidVision, great article, you have given me a lot of food for thought. Of the cards you mentioned, I'm most interested in Collective Brutality and Territorial Hellkite. Lake of the Dead is a card I've never considered before and seems super interesting. I'm currently doing a lot of work editing my cube and I could see a lot of these cards going in.
One pet card of mine that has pretty much never left my cube is Realm Razer. I'm not going try and argue that this card is more powerful than other commonly run tri color cards, because it probably isn't. In my experience, however, it is good enough for my 540 unpowered and extremely fun to play. It's a decent target for Natural Order, Green Sun's Zenith, and Recruiter of the Guard and it plays very well in superfriends and Wildfire decks for us. Not to mention being a solid play in many midrange decks that can support Naya colors and have a little bit of ramp. You can't just run it out willy nilly, but if you can stick it after a couple advantageous blocks or while you are even marginally ahead on the board it often results in a win. Plus, the effect is just super fun and unique.
I've enjoyed reading this! As our cube is large, we have played most of the cards you've written about, yet is is always good to hear more perspectives on those too.
Mishra's Workshop didn't/doesn't work here, although I'm trying to support the artifact deck pretty hard and we play powered. Unlike Metalworker he cannot cast Eldrazis. People here don't maindeck Workshop just to cast mana stones (those that cost 2), and so far it was very hard to have a high enough artifact density to make it maindeckable. It might be a greater issue about archetype support though, I fully believe it can be made busted, I just haven't figured out how.
Temporal Mastery - It's terrible when drawn. Ways to put it back from your hand into the library are essential. Brainstorm, Jace TMS and Scroll Rack are the only good cards that do that. In any case, Arcane Savant doesn't need dedicated support to be good in my experience. Last draft I played him with Mystic Confluence. Upheaval is also complete nonsense with that guy.
Spell Pierce - It, along with Force Spike and Mana Tithe, didn't fly with our playgroup. They lose value very fast, and often you counter spells you don't really want to spend a card to deal with, because of the fear you'll never get an opportunity to use them again.
Negate - We play it but honestly it didn't impress me. Definitely playable though.
Serum Visions - A great card. One of the weaker card selection tools in the late game, but one of the best on turn one (better than Ponder and Brainstorm). Seldom should you regret playing cheap card quality.
Shelldock Isle - In the right kind of deck (one that has Eldrazi) it is a bomb, otherwise it is just very strong. I didn't keep track, but my gut feeling is that it gets activated around 70% of the time. Free spells, at instant speed, what's not to like? The best blue land IMO
Glorybringer - A strong one. A reanimator deck that didn't play red used it recently. Sounds underpowered, but was usually enough to stabilize the game and even sometimes to close it. Brings enough immediate impact to pass the Vindicate test with flying colors. Sometimes it immediately kills a planeswalker and a creature. Controllish red decks prefer it to Thundermaw (counterburn, RG ramp, reanimator depending on build). In aggro or midrange Thundermaw is better and red still features those prominently so I'd say Thundermaw is better.
Fully agree that Glorybringer is better than Sarkhan, Dragonspeaker (unless you support Wildfire).
Whsiperwood Elemental - Disagree with you on that one, I'd rank it at #11 at best at 5cc green (including planeswalkers and Plow Under, as they all want to be played on curve).
Terittorial Hellkite - Smashes face very well. My experience mirrors yours, he was better than Hazoret (and far more consistent)
Ashen Rider - You convinced me to try it, reanimator can use another fatty.
Vraska's Contempt - Was recently added for exile clause, don't have the experience to tell if it is better than Never//Return. Never//Return has been pretty good though.
Wretched Confluence - Also pretty good against aggro if you survive long enough to cast it. Sucks when you need to kill a titan with it, but that option still exists. Another top target for Arcane Savant.
Ashiok, JMA - both are very powerful cards, with high win rates. JMA is purely a wincon, but is very good at what it does. Ashiok is also ranked at #2 in Dimir here.
What you feel about Ashiok I feel towards Dragonlord Silumgar. It has no meaningful synergies (sac outlets I guess? Not really a thing in UB control decks), is good in matchups where your deck is at its best, bad when your deck is at its worst and the play pattern is always just to snag the most powerful permanent you can and cross your fingers they have no removal. Yet I cannot deny its power.
Awsome feedback man, honestly I think a lot of it has to do with cube size.
I don't think mishra's workshop works at 720 given the lower density of powerful mana rocks, you'd have to put some pretty jank artifact stuff in there just to get the proper density a 450 cube could get to. You also lose the density of payoff... like after sundering titan/leviathan, the good cards drop off pretty sharp. I mean I guess there's like scuttling doom engine? Bosh iron golem? Soul of new phyrexia? Havent really played with these cards, but I guess they are no wurmcoil engine.
I would also expect negate to be worse at that density, and spell pierce even more so... but i'd for sure play negate.
Temporarly mastery needs ways to put it on the top of the library, and I think the density at 450 is barely enough to support it WITH arcane savant. My cube the 2x brainstorms make a world of difference in the power of the card.
I could see it not working @ 720, though I wasn't sure.
Fastbond combo I'm almost certain wouldn't work at 720
Almost everything you said confirms what I would have predicted except whisperwood! hahaha
Thanks so much for the feedback. I'll definitely try Glorybringer over Sarkhan and give territorial hellkite a go. I like wretched confluence a lot, and draft it in other cubes quite highly, I just prefer Ob Nixilis, Reignited over it. Although worse against aggro, I think he's a stronger card against midrange and control decks.
Edit* My overachiever is nothing new. Abyssal Prosecutor is just great. I've cubed with him from the beginning and I've never seen the downside matter. This card has existed for me strictly as a 6/6 flying trampler for 2BB. What a beast.
Awesome write-up! I'll definitely read the whole thing when I have more time and I get home, but hopefully there are some worthwhile gems in here.
All I can add is that Thalia's Lieutenant and Champion of the Parish have been really good in my cube, and at this point with the density of powerful humans I'd recommend them to everybody. Nothing crazy by an means, and in no way a staple, but the human package is certainly incredibly powerful and I feel like more people should give it a shot, just to see if they like it. Its just such an easy inclusion and the payoff creatures are super good, Parish oftentimes getting up to a 4/4 or 5/5 for :symw:, and Lieutenant being similarly good early game but a much better topdeck.
Neheb, the Eternal has been good in RG ramp/wildfire shells. It's not a high pick very often, but the deck that wants it REALLY wants it.
Prime Speaker Zegana far outperformed Shardless Agent and has earned its place in my cube. It's a great source of card advantage, but the 6 slot is a bit crowded in both of its colors so I could see it leaving if a similar card were printed at a different cost.
Gifted Aetherborn has always been effective whenever I've played with or against it. It's a great speed bump and an effective attacker since no one wants to block it.
Thanks so much for the feedback. I'll definitely try Glorybringer over Sarkhan and give territorial hellkite a go. I like wretched confluence a lot, and draft it in other cubes quite highly, I just prefer Ob Nixilis, Reignited over it. Although worse against aggro, I think he's a stronger card against midrange and control decks.
Edit* My overachiever is nothing new. Abyssal Prosecutor is just great. I've cubed with him from the beginning and I've never seen the downside matter. This card has existed for me strictly as a 6/6 flying trampler for 2BB. What a beast.
Haha, I love abysal persecutor! Too many players in my playgroup berated me for it and was riding too many sideboards so I caved to the social pressure.. but I definitly won my fair share of games with it. Rarely did the drawback come into play... although it did cause it to sit in more sideboards than I wanted.
Ob nixilis was solid when we tested it as well. One of my favourite black lotus/ritual targets in black.
One for me that stands out is Master Biomancer. Ive been running this in my simic section since the "Janky reare cube" days of its beginning and this thing has always been a beast.
Fits in a arguably weaker guild with a bit of an identity crisis
has a fat butt to help stabilize the board and dodge most damage based removal.
helps support +1/+1 counters, and token archetypes.
Do or Die is my pet card; on a board with 1 creature it does nothing, with 2 creatures its an edict, but once you pass that it can generate some pretty crazy value. Probably not for the tightest of lists but it does fine for me. Someone from the forum put me onto it, good job to whoever that was.
Clever Impersonator is good because it's the best of the clones IMO. If you are ever without a target it is probably a good sign. It feel bad to have to copy something that costs less than 4 but when you are copying planeswalkers or reanimated threats it feel pretty awesome.
Flame Slash doesn't seem to get a lot of love but, not hitting faces or walkers definitely hurts it, but 4 damage will kill a lot of creatures that red usually has more trouble with.
Breath of Darigaaz is a flexible sweeper that can go to the face whilst killing off larger creatures. Not hitting flyers can be an real pain when your against spirits, but if you happen to be the one fliers? then you have a sweet one sided sweeper.
Ankh of Mishra is a card I love with all my heart that not enough cubes run, I see it as underplayed purely because not all cubes run it.
I like Ankh of Mishra a lot and would likely cube it if I went up to a 540 cube. I'm going to be readding Black Vise soon because I miss it. Yes, it can be a dud but it's also one of the few cards that can deal 6+ damage for 1 mana.
To this day I have yet to see another cube play Hymn of the Wilds. The card is insane and probably one of the best cards in our entire cube, if not the best. If cards are included in your cube on power level alone, this card is a must-have. If you don’t play it because it isn’t vintage legal, man are you missing out! It lets your aggro and midrange decks start the game with a mox that doesn’t cost a card every single game, at the small cost of not running any instants or sorceries. That sounds like a big sacrifice, but it really isn’t, it just means that hymn is not great when paired with blue, but the rest of the colors are all still really strong with it. I’ve played this card in my cube since about a month or two after the card came out, and I am speaking from personal experience when I say that it is absolutely amazing.
To this day I have yet to see another cube play Hymn of the Wilds. The card is insane and probably one of the best cards in our entire cube, if not the best. If cards are included in your cube on power level alone, this card is a must-have. If you don’t play it because it isn’t vintage legal, man are you missing out! It lets your aggro and midrange decks start the game with a mox that doesn’t cost a card every single game, at the small cost of not running any instants or sorceries. That sounds like a big sacrifice, but it really isn’t, it just means that hymn is not great when paired with blue, but the rest of the colors are all still really strong with it. I’ve played this card in my cube since about a month or two after the card came out, and I am speaking from personal experience when I say that it is absolutely amazing.
We've done a few drafts where we rotisseried for 2 rounds with conspiracies and the best cube cards, then shuffled in what wasn't rotisseried and drafted..
I picked hymn of the wilds and built around it... I didn't come close to losing a game.
Card is super broken. Better than black lotus p1p1 imo.
Don't really enjoy drafting with most conspiracies personally, but they are powerful.
To this day I have yet to see another cube play Hymn of the Wilds. The card is insane and probably one of the best cards in our entire cube, if not the best. If cards are included in your cube on power level alone, this card is a must-have. If you don’t play it because it isn’t vintage legal, man are you missing out! It lets your aggro and midrange decks start the game with a mox that doesn’t cost a card every single game, at the small cost of not running any instants or sorceries. That sounds like a big sacrifice, but it really isn’t, it just means that hymn is not great when paired with blue, but the rest of the colors are all still really strong with it. I’ve played this card in my cube since about a month or two after the card came out, and I am speaking from personal experience when I say that it is absolutely amazing.
We've played with it. It was cut from my cube due to a few problems:
1) Makes the draft mindless for the guy who picked it. It cuts your choices by almost 50% during the draft process, which players didn't enjoy.
2) Usually unplayable unless opened in pack 1.
3) Interference with other drafters. As your choices are so limited, cheap creatures will seldom wheel past you. All other decks will have noticeably less cheap creatures as a result (expensive ones are usually safe as you have no ramp or cheat/reanimation cards). Sucks for other aggro drafters, and makes games against the Hymn deck even more polar. Also makes signaling weird, as the color will seem open if the spells flow.
4) Power level is oppressive. This is the least important reason to me, but it was still strong enough, in a fully powered cube, to cause imbalance. We agreed it is a better pick than Backup Plan (again, only P1P1).
To this day I have yet to see another cube play Hymn of the Wilds. The card is insane and probably one of the best cards in our entire cube, if not the best. If cards are included in your cube on power level alone, this card is a must-have. If you don’t play it because it isn’t vintage legal, man are you missing out! It lets your aggro and midrange decks start the game with a mox that doesn’t cost a card every single game, at the small cost of not running any instants or sorceries. That sounds like a big sacrifice, but it really isn’t, it just means that hymn is not great when paired with blue, but the rest of the colors are all still really strong with it. I’ve played this card in my cube since about a month or two after the card came out, and I am speaking from personal experience when I say that it is absolutely amazing.
It's in mine, but it's in a dedicated section with other Conspiracies, and players vote before drafting whether or not to play with them. If we do, each player gets one random card from the Conspiracy bundle as a bonus card in their opening pack.
Playing with cards like Sovereign's Realm and Worldknit can be a ton of fun... but making them optional lets people who want to play "real Magic" have a say too.
Also makes signaling weird, as the color will seem open if the spells flow.
The entire point of conspiracies is to wreck "signalling." Between Hymn, Sovereign's Realm, and Worldknit, my drafters know better than to try to read the tea leaves. Draft is about building a deck given fundamental uncertainty about what you might see and what will wheel. If you want archetypes, go play Standard. If you want to build a different deck and explore new synergies every time you sit down, play Cube.
Again big butt that survives most damage based removal.
Triggers the turn it enters the battlefield. (people always forget that you dont even need a single counter to get a creature back to hand.)
Has synergy with lots of black and green creatures that allow you to get counters easily (sakura tribe elder, yavimaya elder, braids, cabal minion, flesh carver, etc.)
works wonders with the evoke on shriekmaw gravedigger effects are hard to include in cube on their own but meren is a good way to get a repetitive gravedigger effect with increased upside as the game goes on. volrath's stronghold is a staple with all the 187 creatures and other great creatures to bring back and meren is no different.
really enjoyed cubing with this card. but obviously depending on your cube it can be hard to find a slot in golgari. Personally i find that deathrite shaman is overrated and unnecessary and while abrupt decay, pernicious deed, and maelstrom pulse are the three includes for most people, its nice to diversify the guild a bit and have something that isnt removal based but still plays well with the guilds typical archetypes and themes.
The entire point of conspiracies is to wreck "signalling." Between Hymn, Sovereign's Realm, and Worldknit, my drafters know better than to try to read the tea leaves. Draft is about building a deck given fundamental uncertainty about what you might see and what will wheel. If you want archetypes, go play Standard. If you want to build a different deck and explore new synergies every time you sit down, play Cube.
Just to offer a different viewpoint, I'm playing 15 conspiracies but not those three, in a very large part because they mess up the experience for the rest of the table.
Hymn of the Wilds is in my conspiracy add-on that we occasionally shuffle in. To be honest, the HotW deck usually ends up being super aggressive so my group doesn't value it super highly. Personally, though, I'm a huge fan and will take it P1P1 as often as I can and sometimes even try to pivot my deck in that direction even if it shows up in pack two. The last time I played it, I was black/white. Turn one Bob or Thalia is insane. If your group is ok with these types of conspiracies, I'd highly recommend it. I like the ones like this (and Worldknit/Sovereign's Realm) because they shape your deck rather than boost one card. I think they make for an interesting draft and play experience.
At the recommendation from Kranny on Twitter, I recently added in Jeweled Amulet. It's been performing quite well and I think it's probably going to stick around. Should probably add it to this list and discuss it here, since it's largely unplayed.
At the recommendation from Kranny on Twitter, I recently added in Jeweled Amulet. It's been performing quite well and I think it's probably going to stick around. Should probably add it to this list and discuss it here, since it's largely unplayed.
interesting card! never even heard of it before! i'll keep my eye on it.
At the recommendation from Kranny on Twitter, I recently added in Jeweled Amulet. It's been performing quite well and I think it's probably going to stick around. Should probably add it to this list and discuss it here, since it's largely unplayed.
Didn't even know this card existed! Am a big fan of 0 mana cost artifacts in powered cube because of all the interactions with the artifact deck.
The artifact deck loves balance and draw 7's, and both balance and draw 7's love 0 mana artifacts
It's probably too low impact to play in a good stuff deck without proper interactions, but I could see plenty of decks that would want it. I am strongly considering testing this.
Is there any cards in your list that you think may have been missed by forum members that worked out great for you? Is there a card that you tested a year ago, loved, championed, but have now cut?
Below is a comprehensive list of cards that I don't think are unanimously played, I've played a lot with and why I like them.
FWIW a lot of these opinions aren't just mine, I actively probe my playgroup for feedback, and regularly have discussions with them on cards in my cube. The following opinions were formed through a lot of testing unless otherwise stated.
Also, every cube environment is different and some cards may not be suited to yours. I try to mention that when possible.
Cards that were slept on , but I feel people are coming around to
Craterhoof behemoth
Gaea's cradle
Massacre wurm
Karakas
Collective brutality
Palace Jailer
These are all clear 360-450 staples in my eyes, unpowered, powered, whatever... The first three i've had literal hundreds of cubes experience with now, and my whole playgroup would agree. I would literally wager everything I own, laying 5 to 1 odds that on a power level basis, they deserve a slot in 98%+ of cubes who's design philosophy is primarily based on "pick the best cards from magics history and put them in a limited draft format".
The first 2 are among the top ~150 powerful cards in cube.
Powerful Narrow/Fringe cards, not for every cube
-Mishra's workshop, If you are playing a powered cube and supporting the "artifact.dec" this is one of the better cards in the archtype. It's no tolarian academy, but it's still very powerful and worth supporting. It requires a certain artifact density, mana rocks, payoff etc. A little more than 1/10th of my cube is artifacts and that feels about right. If you run a support the artifact.dec with artifact specific cards, you should be playing this card.
-Fastbond/Zuran orb/Crucible of worlds Combo, I tried FOREVER to make fastbond work and failed time and time again. FINALLY, I got it to work as a competitive archetype but it needs a LOT of support. Outside of zuran orb, all the support cards are fine cube cards on their own though. I'm very confident I did get it to work. The perfect fastbond combo deck is as good as any deck in cube, but it only gets drafted 1/5 cubes or so. It's a cool archetype and has a very "power" esque feel to it since your nut draws are completely broken. it's super fun and complex to play. My only fear is that the duplicate fetch lands in my cube, contribute to it's potency and it wouldn't work well as a two color deck.
If you want to make it work, I'd say you need a cube 360-485 in size (high density of draw 7's is critical), and need every cubeable draw 7 printed , courser of kruphix, tireless tracker, enlightened tutor, ramunap excavator, strip mine. I think I posted a more comprehensive list on the fastbond thread.
You do not need the obscure lands matters cards like Gitrog monster, Titania etc. but they do make the archetype better.
Bazaar of baghdad
Very powerful, very narrow. In an ideal all-in reanimator deck, it is THE BEST enabler along with entomb. Helps if you have urborg. I currently do not run it, as I found it too narrow for my tastes... Not every style of reanimator decks wants it, and it's only good in reanimator. You might enjoy it, especially if you value historic cards in your cube. We tested it at a long time and it was excellent in decks that wanted discard outlets.
FWIW, Every 9 months or so we do a cube rotisserie draft with best players in my group. Reanimator has won it 3/4 times and everyone agreed bazaar was the MVP of those decks... We are actually BANNING bazaar from the next rotisserie. It's upside is that high.
Lake of the dead
This one caught me by surprise, but far exceeded my expectations in testing. This may sound crazy, but I actually think it is the best mono black payoff in cube, but it entirely depends on how your black section is built.
I think most black sections around here are built supporting hyper agro, reanimator and a sprinkle of control. I am unconfident about how this land will function within that paradigm.
I assure you that a midrange mono black "devotion" build is very possible to support in a singleton cube and is competitive. If you are unhappy with your black section for whatever reason, I strongly recommend running the following experiment. Prune some of the worst of your agressive creatures, removal spells, or very narrow black cards and ensure you have the following.
-Enough discard outlets in black to make close to mono-black reanimator a thing. Collective brutality , divest etc.
-Massacre wurm and grave titan (a 3rd 6 drop would be welcome, but not needed). The 6 drops are critical to the strategy.
-A 2 drop or two that can block well. Gifted Aetherborn and relentless dead I think are the best. the 1/3 warrior from the new set is interesting too.
-Geralf's messenger/Gray merchant of asphodel.
-A decent black payoff card advantage spell, either Profane command or Wretched confluence is good.
-Lake of the dead
What this build does is it leverages most of the best black cards in cube, without forcing you to go all-in reanimator. While not every black card is great in the build, almost every black card is playable allowing you to semi-force mono black without train wrecking. Recurring nightmare and skull clamp are extremly powerful cards in the build, reanimate becomes a fine value card. Massacre wurm is even better when backed up with ground beat downs, and grave titan is one of the best creatures in cube. When you are putting a lot of black permanants in play, Gray merchant becomes excellent (also is absurd with recurring nightmare).
Dark ritual and Lake of the dead give the deck a very high level of explosiveness. When backed up with some disruption from discard spells, an early grave titan, or dumping your hand of powerful 3drops is often game over against non-control decks.
With lake of the dead, the sequence of
Turn 1 - swamp , Discard spell
Turn 2,- swamp , 2 drop
Turn 3,- lake of the dead, Grave titan is extremly busted.
Lake of the dead is also not "devotion only", it is ok in heavy black agro and excellent in mostly black reanimator, if most of the creatures you reanimate are colorless or black. (5 drop Liliana , grave titan, massacre wurm, wurmcoil engine). Even a turn 5 hardcast griselbrand, turn 4 hardcast myr battlesphere happens and is solid.
Leovold, Emissary of Trest
This card is only great in cubes with very good fixing. I'm continually amazed by how many cards leovold shuts down or draws cards off that I never noticed before. in 3+ color decks, this is one of the best payoffs out there. I don't recommend him for the majority of cubes, but if you feel like your mana is great and you get a lot of 3+ color decks, give it a whirl. He's more than earned a slot in my cube.
Breya, Etherium Shaper
An even more extreme example of a card that's only great in cubes with very very good fixing. At the moment my cube has double duals, double fetches, single shocks and 1 manland/other @500 AND the only conspiracy I run is unexpected potential. Breya is a beast of a card that has all sorts of synergy in cube IF you can cast it a decent consistency. We've cast her a lot, and she's extremly good.
Temporal Mastery
The cubes I do recommend it for, are for cubes that run arcane savant, but don't want to run cards that are only good under arcane savant, or are potentially too broken (cruel ultimatum and summon the pack).
With a brain storm and a mystical tutor, or a scroll rack and a vampiric tutor, temporal mastery is very solid card by itself and doesn't need arcane savant. It's probably the best arcane savant payoff in my cube at the moment.
In my cube I run double brainstorm, and the extra brainstorm is enough to make temporal mastery deserve a slot without arcane savant.
Generic good cards, underappreciated that are 450-540 range
negate/spell pierce
Counter spells are awsome in cube because a lot of strategies aim to leverage broken non-creature spells, or very expesnive spells (planeswalkers etc.). If your opponents are casting tutors like vampiric tutor to set them up, a well timed counter spells often generates multiple cards of value.
Cards like time spiral or upheavel can outdo all the card advantage you've accumulated in a single card. Denying their resolution is essential.
Even agro decks run broken non-creautre spells like armageddon, equipment, burn spells etc.
They are main deckable effects in cube for the same reason duress is. In fact I don't think know if I've ever seen either negate or spell pierce ride a sidebord in a deck with 7+ islands heh.
I personally don't like to run TOO many counter spells as it reduces the power level of combo decks, which are among the more fun decks to draft... But negate/spell pierce definitely deserve a slot in power level for mid sized cubes.
I currently am only running negate.
Serum visions/Gitaxian probe
Cantrips in blue are good, and these ones are very solid. I do not think they are a must play in small cubes, as you want to strike a balance between generic good cards, a variety of CMC's , a variety of archetypes etc... But I believe some people overestimate the value of expensive cards in cube for larger cubes and vastly underestimate cantrips. In no world would I play neither of these two @540. The best blue decks in cube have a high density of cantrips, they dig for your broken cards (power), your combo pieces, answers, provide GY food for dig through time/treasure cruise/tasigur/grim lavamancer, trigger prowess for mentor/pyromancer/thing in the ice.
Serum visions is better if the deck contains 8+ blue sources, but I like gitaxian probe as any non-blue combo deck is happy to play it, and it still has all the benefits of prowess/GY food above. Seeing your opponents hand is a powerful effect that is easy to underestimate. I'm not sure which i'd rather support if I could pick one.
There's a reason why some cantrips have been banned and every modern/legacy blue deck runs tons
They are both in my cube at the moment.
Shelldock isle
Very good for supporting blue Eldrazi/Griselbrand combo decks that is also a fine value playable in any slow blue deck. It took me a while to come around to this card. It wasn't until a group member ranted and raved about me including it, I begrudgingly included it. Right away he played it all the time and crushed me with it. Eventually, I drafted it myself a bunch, THEN I fully respected it's power. It's in my cube at the moment and not on the chopping block.
Glorybringer
I dismissed glory bringer when I read it.. Seemed powerful , but not good enough to compete with a super stacked section. I eventually tested it around half way into it's standard season, and it's done nothing but impress me. There's a good chance it is the #1 cube red 5 drop by a very small margin. Thundermaw, zealous conscripts and siege-gang commander are all optimized in slightly different builds.. so it kind of depends on how your red decks play out and your cube format. It's competition is so close to it, that I don't hate not including it... But if you aren't running purphorous, or see a ton of revilark/alesha type decks, I would strongly advise testing it over seige-gang commander. And if you don't run kiki-jiki combo, I'd test it as a #3 red 5 drop at least.
It's like sarkhan dragonspeaker, but you get to +1 it AND -3 it on the same turn and replaces vulnerability to combat damage to vulnerability to wraths/doomblade. I think it's much better than sarkhan and I see a lot of people still running him. Wildfire is the only archetype where that's an exception and glorybringer's not even that much worse in wildfire!
Whisperwood elemental
I know a lot of people here have tested it and it fallen short, but that surprises me. It's around #4 or #5 green 5 drop for me. It's resiliency combined with the potential of running away with the game is why I like it so much. I am happy to have it in my list, and when I am searching for green cuts, I don't really consider it. I've played a LOT with it since Khans block was printed. The better green 5 drops have clearly better upside when built with synergies in mind, but by itself, it may be my best main deck green 5 drop creature for ramp decks. Protection from wraths/Ugin is big.
Territorial Hellkite
This one slipped through the cracks of spoiler season for a lot of people, ANOTHER red 4 drop? we dont need one of those! But it's performed very well for me. Very close to hellrider in power level. Maybe 5% worse in decks with a bunch of creatures, but in creature light deck (UR spells for example) with an aggressive slant it is much better. I would 100% play it over hazoret, which I think is worse in cube than constructed for a bunch of reasons.
Rampaging Ferocidon
Ended up just cutting it to test Najeela, but Rampaging ferocidon performed very well for me since I started testing it from ixalan spoiler season. Shutting down life gain is so so important for red, and a 3/3 menace body is far from bad. Winning games through griselbrand and sphinx of the steel wind is a good feeling
Basically, think of what the two worst things for red decks are, life gain and lots of blockers. This card restricts the BEST way that red decks are combatted and thus, is at it's best in red's worst matchups. It's a red agro only card though, and the 3rd best at the time of writing, so not for the smallest cubes. It also is better with burn than it is with lots of other creatures. So it depends a bit on the composition of your red section.
It's underwhelming if they have a bunch of wraths or something, but red decks with burn don't care too much about that. and a mediocore card in a matchup that's already very good is totally fine.
Ashen Rider
Orzhov classification is part of the reason I think so few people consider this card, but the casting cost is misleading. You basically never hardcast it so it may as well cost 4BBBRRBWU. However, it's a strong playble in the majority of cheaty archetypes in cube.
Ashen rider goes in and out of my list , I primarily bring it in if I think both reanimator and sneak/show/eureka are underperforming. It gives a shot in the arm to both archetypes.
It has one of the best floors out of any reanimation target period. Stabalizing the board, or crippling the opponents mana base. Your opponent losing a removal spell and two of their best permanants is pretty hard to come back from, and often buys you time to reanimate something else.
It's good against literally every archetype and almost every board state in cube. Nice karakas bro!
In my re-animator decks, I think it's about the 3rd-4th? best target in cube (if hardcasting doesnt matter) and sneak and show decks it's not the very best, but it's still quite powerful. I also love it with eureka, because it can answer the things that can potentially answer the eldrazi/ugin you also put into play (say they put in a karn , an oblivion ring, a sower of temptation, or Emrakul of their own).
At the moment I am not running Ashen rider, but If my cube ever went to 540 in size , it would have a permanent home.
Vraska's Contempt
I and most people dismissed the card during spoiler season for being 4 mana instead of 3, and all the competition that comes at the four mana slot in cube.
However, after losing back to back against blightsteel colosus in my black deck and seeing vraska's contempt in standard, I decided to give it a whirl.
It pleasently surprised me and confirmed my theory.
I now think its slightly better than Never//Return and Ruinous path overall.
The main reasons are, exile >> destroy. With reanimator being a commonly deck, indestructible creatures, recursive creatures etc. Black doesn't have many good answers to resilient creatures and cube has a lot of them. They typically have to x for 1 themselves, or hope that they land an edict on an empty board. There's a fair number of generic kill spells, but that doesn't deal well with a woodfall primus for example. I want my versatile expensive kill spells to be as versatile as possible
Instant > Sorcery, it may not always be obvious, but there are many times where instant speed is relevant for agressive decks. And for UB control decks it's 1000000x better.
Gain 2 life is nice and non-neglible, especially in black which has so much incidental life loss.
I currently am running Vraska's contempt, and am not running never//return.
Wretched Confluence
A card I just cut in my most recent batch of updates, but one that is very solid. I've been playing it since the confluence cycle got spoiled and have seen it done great work. It didn't see much play outside of UB control, but was still an ok 22nd playable outside of that deck. IN that deck it's insane. Especially with torrential gearhulk
UB control doesn't come up quite often enough for me to feel the need to keep it as I'm performing some weird tests at the moment. It could easily come back. At 540 it would have a permanant home
Ashiok, Nightmare weaver
This card potentially should go in my first section on a power level basis, but I personally loathe the gameplay it presents, and don't like it's synergies. I don't like the card, but I cannot deny it's power level. It's clear top 4 in dimir (most of my playgroup believes #2), but meh, I hate it
I recommend testing it if you haven't given it it's proper due and don't care about milling.
Jace , Memory adept
I dislike this card even more than ashiok for gameplay reasons, but again, I can't deny it's power. Unlike ashiok I havent tested jace much, but I have played it in other cubes, and the mill effect is super super good. It may be less good in cubes that support agro thoroughly though. MTG salvation forums cubes tend to support agro better than most cubes I've seen IRL. I'm not recommending this card, only mentioning it for completion.
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Lake of the Dead was in my very first cube build, and it's been a while since I looked at it. Nice old school pick.
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
Mishra's Workshop didn't/doesn't work here, although I'm trying to support the artifact deck pretty hard and we play powered. Unlike Metalworker he cannot cast Eldrazis. People here don't maindeck Workshop just to cast mana stones (those that cost 2), and so far it was very hard to have a high enough artifact density to make it maindeckable. It might be a greater issue about archetype support though, I fully believe it can be made busted, I just haven't figured out how.
Temporal Mastery - It's terrible when drawn. Ways to put it back from your hand into the library are essential. Brainstorm, Jace TMS and Scroll Rack are the only good cards that do that. In any case, Arcane Savant doesn't need dedicated support to be good in my experience. Last draft I played him with Mystic Confluence. Upheaval is also complete nonsense with that guy.
Spell Pierce - It, along with Force Spike and Mana Tithe, didn't fly with our playgroup. They lose value very fast, and often you counter spells you don't really want to spend a card to deal with, because of the fear you'll never get an opportunity to use them again.
Negate - We play it but honestly it didn't impress me. Definitely playable though.
Serum Visions - A great card. One of the weaker card selection tools in the late game, but one of the best on turn one (better than Ponder and Brainstorm). Seldom should you regret playing cheap card quality.
Gitaxian Probe - We love it. One of my frequent target for conspiracies such as Double Stroke and Iterative Analysis. Also a good card for aggro decks, free information and deck thinning is good (not to mention synergies with Prowess/Tarmogoyf/Grim Lavamancer).
Shelldock Isle - In the right kind of deck (one that has Eldrazi) it is a bomb, otherwise it is just very strong. I didn't keep track, but my gut feeling is that it gets activated around 70% of the time. Free spells, at instant speed, what's not to like? The best blue land IMO
Glorybringer - A strong one. A reanimator deck that didn't play red used it recently. Sounds underpowered, but was usually enough to stabilize the game and even sometimes to close it. Brings enough immediate impact to pass the Vindicate test with flying colors. Sometimes it immediately kills a planeswalker and a creature. Controllish red decks prefer it to Thundermaw (counterburn, RG ramp, reanimator depending on build). In aggro or midrange Thundermaw is better and red still features those prominently so I'd say Thundermaw is better.
Fully agree that Glorybringer is better than Sarkhan, Dragonspeaker (unless you support Wildfire).
Whsiperwood Elemental - Disagree with you on that one, I'd rank it at #11 at best at 5cc green (including planeswalkers and Plow Under, as they all want to be played on curve).
Terittorial Hellkite - Smashes face very well. My experience mirrors yours, he was better than Hazoret (and far more consistent)
Ashen Rider - You convinced me to try it, reanimator can use another fatty.
Vraska's Contempt - Was recently added for exile clause, don't have the experience to tell if it is better than Never//Return. Never//Return has been pretty good though.
Wretched Confluence - Also pretty good against aggro if you survive long enough to cast it. Sucks when you need to kill a titan with it, but that option still exists. Another top target for Arcane Savant.
Ashiok, JMA - both are very powerful cards, with high win rates. JMA is purely a wincon, but is very good at what it does. Ashiok is also ranked at #2 in Dimir here.
What you feel about Ashiok I feel towards Dragonlord Silumgar. It has no meaningful synergies (sac outlets I guess? Not really a thing in UB control decks), is good in matchups where your deck is at its best, bad when your deck is at its worst and the play pattern is always just to snag the most powerful permanent you can and cross your fingers they have no removal. Yet I cannot deny its power.
The list on cube cobra
Read my blog on cube - Latest post June 2nd 2022
One pet card of mine that has pretty much never left my cube is Realm Razer. I'm not going try and argue that this card is more powerful than other commonly run tri color cards, because it probably isn't. In my experience, however, it is good enough for my 540 unpowered and extremely fun to play. It's a decent target for Natural Order, Green Sun's Zenith, and Recruiter of the Guard and it plays very well in superfriends and Wildfire decks for us. Not to mention being a solid play in many midrange decks that can support Naya colors and have a little bit of ramp. You can't just run it out willy nilly, but if you can stick it after a couple advantageous blocks or while you are even marginally ahead on the board it often results in a win. Plus, the effect is just super fun and unique.
Awsome feedback man, honestly I think a lot of it has to do with cube size.
I don't think mishra's workshop works at 720 given the lower density of powerful mana rocks, you'd have to put some pretty jank artifact stuff in there just to get the proper density a 450 cube could get to. You also lose the density of payoff... like after sundering titan/leviathan, the good cards drop off pretty sharp. I mean I guess there's like scuttling doom engine? Bosh iron golem? Soul of new phyrexia? Havent really played with these cards, but I guess they are no wurmcoil engine.
I would also expect negate to be worse at that density, and spell pierce even more so... but i'd for sure play negate.
Temporarly mastery needs ways to put it on the top of the library, and I think the density at 450 is barely enough to support it WITH arcane savant. My cube the 2x brainstorms make a world of difference in the power of the card.
I could see it not working @ 720, though I wasn't sure.
Fastbond combo I'm almost certain wouldn't work at 720
Almost everything you said confirms what I would have predicted except whisperwood! hahaha
Last Updated 02/07/24
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Edit* My overachiever is nothing new. Abyssal Prosecutor is just great. I've cubed with him from the beginning and I've never seen the downside matter. This card has existed for me strictly as a 6/6 flying trampler for 2BB. What a beast.
All I can add is that Thalia's Lieutenant and Champion of the Parish have been really good in my cube, and at this point with the density of powerful humans I'd recommend them to everybody. Nothing crazy by an means, and in no way a staple, but the human package is certainly incredibly powerful and I feel like more people should give it a shot, just to see if they like it. Its just such an easy inclusion and the payoff creatures are super good, Parish oftentimes getting up to a 4/4 or 5/5 for :symw:, and Lieutenant being similarly good early game but a much better topdeck.
Prime Speaker Zegana far outperformed Shardless Agent and has earned its place in my cube. It's a great source of card advantage, but the 6 slot is a bit crowded in both of its colors so I could see it leaving if a similar card were printed at a different cost.
Gifted Aetherborn has always been effective whenever I've played with or against it. It's a great speed bump and an effective attacker since no one wants to block it.
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Haha, I love abysal persecutor! Too many players in my playgroup berated me for it and was riding too many sideboards so I caved to the social pressure.. but I definitly won my fair share of games with it. Rarely did the drawback come into play... although it did cause it to sit in more sideboards than I wanted.
Ob nixilis was solid when we tested it as well. One of my favourite black lotus/ritual targets in black.
Last Updated 02/07/24
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Fits in a arguably weaker guild with a bit of an identity crisis
has a fat butt to help stabilize the board and dodge most damage based removal.
helps support +1/+1 counters, and token archetypes.
Dropping master biomancer into deranged hermit is devastating.
The snowball effect of cloning it with phantasmal image or phyrexian metamorph in insane
It reduces the cost of hangarback walker and walking ballista by 4.
Late game mana dorks become 3/3 beaters.
And if you support the +1/+1 counters archetype there are often numerous ways of pumping biomancer and getting some massive creatures ei: curse of predation, verdurous gearhulk, etc.
Its definitely a pet card for me. but it also has performed better than any other simic card in my cube. (sorry edric, spymaster of trest)
Clever Impersonator is good because it's the best of the clones IMO. If you are ever without a target it is probably a good sign. It feel bad to have to copy something that costs less than 4 but when you are copying planeswalkers or reanimated threats it feel pretty awesome.
Flame Slash doesn't seem to get a lot of love but, not hitting faces or walkers definitely hurts it, but 4 damage will kill a lot of creatures that red usually has more trouble with.
Breath of Darigaaz is a flexible sweeper that can go to the face whilst killing off larger creatures. Not hitting flyers can be an real pain when your against spirits, but if you happen to be the one fliers? then you have a sweet one sided sweeper.
Ankh of Mishra is a card I love with all my heart that not enough cubes run, I see it as underplayed purely because not all cubes run it.
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We've done a few drafts where we rotisseried for 2 rounds with conspiracies and the best cube cards, then shuffled in what wasn't rotisseried and drafted..
I picked hymn of the wilds and built around it... I didn't come close to losing a game.
Card is super broken. Better than black lotus p1p1 imo.
Don't really enjoy drafting with most conspiracies personally, but they are powerful.
Last Updated 02/07/24
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Blame xmage/other online platforms. I love conspiracies, but they don't.
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We've played with it. It was cut from my cube due to a few problems:
1) Makes the draft mindless for the guy who picked it. It cuts your choices by almost 50% during the draft process, which players didn't enjoy.
2) Usually unplayable unless opened in pack 1.
3) Interference with other drafters. As your choices are so limited, cheap creatures will seldom wheel past you. All other decks will have noticeably less cheap creatures as a result (expensive ones are usually safe as you have no ramp or cheat/reanimation cards). Sucks for other aggro drafters, and makes games against the Hymn deck even more polar. Also makes signaling weird, as the color will seem open if the spells flow.
4) Power level is oppressive. This is the least important reason to me, but it was still strong enough, in a fully powered cube, to cause imbalance. We agreed it is a better pick than Backup Plan (again, only P1P1).
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It's in mine, but it's in a dedicated section with other Conspiracies, and players vote before drafting whether or not to play with them. If we do, each player gets one random card from the Conspiracy bundle as a bonus card in their opening pack.
Playing with cards like Sovereign's Realm and Worldknit can be a ton of fun... but making them optional lets people who want to play "real Magic" have a say too.
The entire point of conspiracies is to wreck "signalling." Between Hymn, Sovereign's Realm, and Worldknit, my drafters know better than to try to read the tea leaves. Draft is about building a deck given fundamental uncertainty about what you might see and what will wheel. If you want archetypes, go play Standard. If you want to build a different deck and explore new synergies every time you sit down, play Cube.
https://www.cubecobra.com/cube/list/p420
Again big butt that survives most damage based removal.
Triggers the turn it enters the battlefield. (people always forget that you dont even need a single counter to get a creature back to hand.)
Has synergy with lots of black and green creatures that allow you to get counters easily (sakura tribe elder, yavimaya elder, braids, cabal minion, flesh carver, etc.)
works wonders with the evoke on shriekmaw
gravedigger effects are hard to include in cube on their own but meren is a good way to get a repetitive gravedigger effect with increased upside as the game goes on.
volrath's stronghold is a staple with all the 187 creatures and other great creatures to bring back and meren is no different.
really enjoyed cubing with this card. but obviously depending on your cube it can be hard to find a slot in golgari. Personally i find that deathrite shaman is overrated and unnecessary and while abrupt decay, pernicious deed, and maelstrom pulse are the three includes for most people, its nice to diversify the guild a bit and have something that isnt removal based but still plays well with the guilds typical archetypes and themes.
Just to offer a different viewpoint, I'm playing 15 conspiracies but not those three, in a very large part because they mess up the experience for the rest of the table.
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interesting card! never even heard of it before! i'll keep my eye on it.
Didn't even know this card existed! Am a big fan of 0 mana cost artifacts in powered cube because of all the interactions with the artifact deck.
The artifact deck loves balance and draw 7's, and both balance and draw 7's love 0 mana artifacts
It's probably too low impact to play in a good stuff deck without proper interactions, but I could see plenty of decks that would want it. I am strongly considering testing this.
Last Updated 02/07/24
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