Amen. I think Simic is strong, and this card just won't be cracking the top 6-7 cards in the guild, unless you exclusively play Simic super-ramp decks and not much else. And even there, it's contingent upon drawing very specific cards to interact with, because using this to untap a land is god-awful.
-Aside
I think the Simic issue comes down to taste. It is my personal favorite in magic, but I never sweat removing any of the cards to try new things, there are no cards left out that people miss(maybe the Prime Speaker), none of the cards are high pick, blink is not popular, and it is rarely drafted even though my group loves ramp. Maybe I just need to take another look at how my green and blue mesh.
My current top 3 and why I am uninspired:
SSS, he can be cut because I now have access to any number of amazing finishers in mono and multi color. He is not well loved.
Mystic snake is super cool but the days of a 4 mana counter spell not named Crytic Command are limited, even in my unpowered cube. No one has ever drafted a blink focused deck in my group.
Tyrgo Predator is uncuttable, even if it is not flashy. It is just so solid against mana nasty things that it needs to stay even if it is pretty soft to the fair decks and has been sideboarded out plenty.
-End Aside
I am not sure I will even test this guy but he is a long way from god awful. He goes in combo decks, big artifact ramp decks, and I like him ok in tempo too. No he is not the exciting Simic savior I am looking for but I would put him in the Gyre Sage level. It can beat down a little and ramp a little and occasionally help do something really cool.
This effect will never be printed on a one mana creature and it is the first time it has been on a 2 mana creature, and it is a 2/2 to boot. So I don't think this is something to sneeze at.
Two mana creature that can ramp, untap big creatures for defense, birthing pod shenagins, mess with opponents vedalken shackles, untap monoliths and has grisly bear stats?
Two mana creature that can ramp, untap big creatures for defense, birthing pod shenagins, mess with opponents vedalken shackles, untap monoliths and has grisly bear stats?
I'm definitely testing this.
Couldn't agree more.
I find it funny that every 2/1 with situational upside in white/ red/ black gets considered but are persona non gratta elsewhere.
And before people get too excited I understand those are agressive colors. but even where I am not Aggro we draft decks (particularly U/X) I love tempo. That usually means playing some cheap creatures with utility, and beating down with them, while laying on some cheap disruption.
I could see many scenarios where I use this guy to exploit of broken card, or bring up a blocker, ramp into a turn three control Dungeon Geists while still beating down with my one drop, or just apply a little more early pressure.
I find it funny that every 2/1 with situational upside in white/ red/ black gets considered but are persona non gratta elsewhere.
They're usually abilities that allow you to take advantage of the body and the ability. If you're using this thing for the untap effect, the fact that it's a 2-power 2-drop is pretty irrelevant. It would be much better as a 1/3 or an 0/4 even.
And this is a gold card. You're paying a premium cost for a card that can only go in a fraction of your decks. I want something more than an untap ability on a card with those kinds of restrictions.
I think this card is really interesting and I would love to see it in the MODO cube. In a real cube though, the competition is probably far too fierce in it's guild.
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I do not think comparison to mono color 2 drop is fair at all. I would think of this as 360 level card if it were mono-color. Most likely even staple. In a guild section, though, this isn't close to cubeable.
I do not think comparison to mono color 2 drop is fair at all. I would think of this as 360 level card if it were mono-color. Most likely even staple. In a guild section, though, this isn't close to cubeable.
I think comparing is fine, but you are completely right, I am likely to try this for a few games and find it outclassed and boring for gold. But the last couple of blocks have saturated us with gold cards to the point where choices aren't going to be about good vs bad for the 3-5 slots people have, they will be personal.
Do you choose-
Power?
Build around me cards?
Archetype support?
Unusual abilities?
Role players?
Mono hole fillers?
Undercost guys?
Group favorites?
Flexible?
Splashable?
I am sure it will be a combination of all of those when you do but I find my group misses the days when I foolishly had very large gold sections but agree with me that it hurts the draft, so I will keep mixing it up until I get cards that generate stories, or give people the feeling that a card is glue for that guild.
I play and like the card. I think it is less powerful than Kiora, Behemoth Beckoner or Vizier of Tumbling Sands, but I also play both of those. I also don't play time vault, and have never wanted it. The floor of a mana dork is just not bad, and the ceiling is quite a bit higher even without Time Vault.
But I have a lot more free guild slots than most cubers.
I wouldn't cube this card without time vault. Don't get me wrong, it sees play in basically all the UG decks for its ability to tap for more than one mana, but its just another random ramp dork unless you play the vault that will always go to the last few picks of the pack. I play it at 360 but I play Vault, and UG is a weak enough color combination that I don't feel bad playing it over trygon predator or Edric. But no, Follower is not good enough to justify a slot without vault to push it over the top into playability.
I wouldn't cube this card without time vault. Don't get me wrong, it sees play in basically all the UG decks for its ability to tap for more than one mana, but its just another random ramp dork unless you play the vault that will always go to the last few picks of the pack. I play it at 360 but I play Vault, and UG is a weak enough color combination that I don't feel bad playing it over trygon predator or Edric. But no, Follower is not good enough to justify a slot without vault to push it over the top into playability.
This is exactly how I feel. It has enough uses where it's not embarrassing in a random shell, but Vault Combo is what pushes it into being cube playable.
-Aside
I think the Simic issue comes down to taste. It is my personal favorite in magic, but I never sweat removing any of the cards to try new things, there are no cards left out that people miss(maybe the Prime Speaker), none of the cards are high pick, blink is not popular, and it is rarely drafted even though my group loves ramp. Maybe I just need to take another look at how my green and blue mesh.
My current top 3 and why I am uninspired:
SSS, he can be cut because I now have access to any number of amazing finishers in mono and multi color. He is not well loved.
Mystic snake is super cool but the days of a 4 mana counter spell not named Crytic Command are limited, even in my unpowered cube. No one has ever drafted a blink focused deck in my group.
Tyrgo Predator is uncuttable, even if it is not flashy. It is just so solid against mana nasty things that it needs to stay even if it is pretty soft to the fair decks and has been sideboarded out plenty.
-End Aside
I am not sure I will even test this guy but he is a long way from god awful. He goes in combo decks, big artifact ramp decks, and I like him ok in tempo too. No he is not the exciting Simic savior I am looking for but I would put him in the Gyre Sage level. It can beat down a little and ramp a little and occasionally help do something really cool.
This effect will never be printed on a one mana creature and it is the first time it has been on a 2 mana creature, and it is a 2/2 to boot. So I don't think this is something to sneeze at.
Two mana creature that can ramp, untap big creatures for defense, birthing pod shenagins, mess with opponents vedalken shackles, untap monoliths and has grisly bear stats?
I'm definitely testing this.
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Couldn't agree more.
I find it funny that every 2/1 with situational upside in white/ red/ black gets considered but are persona non gratta elsewhere.
And before people get too excited I understand those are agressive colors. but even where I am not Aggro we draft decks (particularly U/X) I love tempo. That usually means playing some cheap creatures with utility, and beating down with them, while laying on some cheap disruption.
I could see many scenarios where I use this guy to exploit of broken card, or bring up a blocker, ramp into a turn three control Dungeon Geists while still beating down with my one drop, or just apply a little more early pressure.
They're usually abilities that allow you to take advantage of the body and the ability. If you're using this thing for the untap effect, the fact that it's a 2-power 2-drop is pretty irrelevant. It would be much better as a 1/3 or an 0/4 even.
And this is a gold card. You're paying a premium cost for a card that can only go in a fraction of your decks. I want something more than an untap ability on a card with those kinds of restrictions.
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I think comparing is fine, but you are completely right, I am likely to try this for a few games and find it outclassed and boring for gold. But the last couple of blocks have saturated us with gold cards to the point where choices aren't going to be about good vs bad for the 3-5 slots people have, they will be personal.
Do you choose-
Power?
Build around me cards?
Archetype support?
Unusual abilities?
Role players?
Mono hole fillers?
Undercost guys?
Group favorites?
Flexible?
Splashable?
I am sure it will be a combination of all of those when you do but I find my group misses the days when I foolishly had very large gold sections but agree with me that it hurts the draft, so I will keep mixing it up until I get cards that generate stories, or give people the feeling that a card is glue for that guild.
1) It can go infinite and combo with Time Vault. (very high ceiling)
2) Untap Pod/ Vannifar
3) Untap land/ mana rock that produces 2-3 mana
At worst its a 2 mana, tap add one mana. (which is a very low floor)
But I have a lot more free guild slots than most cubers.
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This is exactly how I feel. It has enough uses where it's not embarrassing in a random shell, but Vault Combo is what pushes it into being cube playable.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!