Unburial Rites looks like an interesting reanimation spell. If you're really trying to push the reanimation theme, how good is this card really? Is it playable at 450 as your 4th Orzhov card if reanimation is a big part of your strategy, or is it simply too slow at 5 mana? I was thinking it would be too slow (if I'm paying 5 mana for a reanimation spell, I'd rather it be something broken like Living Death). Is the flashback that much more relevant than the reshuffle on Beacon of Unrest to justify it being a 2-color spell? What are your opinions?
Flashback and shuffling back are different stories. Shuffling back means that you slightly increase your chance of drawing gas later on, Flashback means that you draw another card that happens to be Breath of Life.
I think orzhov card #4 is adequate, after Sorin, Lingering Souls, Vindicate. Reanimator likes looting anyway, so discarding Unburial Rites and a fatty can become quite the value play.
Specialities about the cube: U tempo, B aggro, R slow-ish are supported. G aggro is not.
Currently trying to support tokens in all colors but blue, in different ways: W pumps them, B sacrifices them, R suicides them, G has decent-sized ones.
cube list outdated
*literal C/U definition according to gatherer
**some cards are banned. Library of Alexandria, Land Tax, Sol Ring.
I think it's a very strong card in cube and I ran it for a while in my 360 (wasn't good enough, but it was close) that said I think WB is just too deep a combo for it to crack the list. Vindicate, Lingering Souls, Sorin LoI, Stillmoon, Gerrards Verdict, Desolation Angel, and Mortify are all very solid options.
That said the flashback is so good as it just combos better with Loam, FoF, Gifts, and other spells like that, and that really bumps the power level up high enough that it would be a good enough cube card in a less stacked color combo.
I think it's a very strong card in cube and I ran it for a while in my 360 (wasn't good enough, but it was close) that said I think WB is just too deep a combo for it to crack the list. Vindicate, Lingering Souls, Sorin LoI, Stillmoon, Gerrards Verdict, Desolation Angel, and Mortify are all very solid options.
There are strong options in BW. I think which one to choose here is a matter of which archetype you want to support. Vindicate and Lingering Souls are a given imho, the cards are just universally good. After that, it is a preference call.
That said the flashback is so good as it just combos better with Loam, FoF, Gifts, and other spells like that, and that really bumps the power level up high enough that it would be a good enough cube card in a less stacked color combo.
All these interactions are why I want to give it a try at 450. I think that the overcosted Zombify is not good enough even with a free replacement Breath of Life thrown in, because in a typical cube game you don't have the time to repeatedly reanimate stuff at that high a price. In combination with the mentioned spells (Loam, FoF, Gifts) or just some looting action, though, it seems that the card provides some insane value.
I have not tested it, but it does not do what I want for a dedicated reanimator deck. The flashback cost is at the upper limit of what I want to pay for reanimation, and the initial cost is too much. White is the worst colour for supporting reanimator as it lacks ways of getting fatties into the yard, so it would likely necessitate going 3-colour.
If the flashback cost were any colour other than white, with the card otherwise identical, I'd probably try it out. As it stands I'm not impressed.
I can see it being solid in B/W midrange decks to provide resilience, but there's a lot of competition in that colour combination.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
I have not tested it, but it does not do what I want for a dedicated reanimator deck. The flashback cost is at the upper limit of what I want to pay for reanimation, and the initial cost is too much. White is the worst colour for supporting reanimator as it lacks ways of getting fatties into the yard, so it would likely necessitate going 3-colour.
I can see it being solid in B/W midrange decks to provide resilience, but there's a lot of competition in that colour combination.
You're right, it's no Animate Dead or Necromancy for a true reanimator deck. On the other hand, Unburial Rites is exactly what an attrition-focused BGW deck wants to be doing. That's where I see the card's justification.
Specialities about the cube: U tempo, B aggro, R slow-ish are supported. G aggro is not.
Currently trying to support tokens in all colors but blue, in different ways: W pumps them, B sacrifices them, R suicides them, G has decent-sized ones.
cube list outdated
*literal C/U definition according to gatherer
**some cards are banned. Library of Alexandria, Land Tax, Sol Ring.
If there weren't 6 or 7 solid orzhov cards, I could see it getting into 450 cubes. It's not a bad card but 5 mana for a spell that doesn't even necessarily do anything (if you don't have a creature in your graveyard) is hardly broken compared to solid spells like Mortify.
Would your opinions on this card change any if we are talking about a Modern cube. Lingering Souls and Sorin, Lord of Innistrad are pretty much a given but then what 2 other BW cards would you include in a Modern Cube? Would this be an option or is Mortify and Stillmoon Cavalier still better? Modern doesnt have any great reanimation spells so is reanimation even something a Modern cube should bother with?
I think it's a great 4th card for Orzhov. I run it in my cube and it's been great--usually in decks with Gifts Unigven or Liliana of the Veil. It's also fine as just a reanimation spell.
Would your opinions on this card change any if we are talking about a Modern cube. Lingering Souls and Sorin, Lord of Innistrad are pretty much a given but then what 2 other BW cards would you include in a Modern Cube? Would this be an option or is Mortify and Stillmoon Cavalier still better? Modern doesnt have any great reanimation spells so is reanimation even something a Modern cube should bother with?
Depends if you support reanimator. If you do, you pretty much have to run it, but if you don't it's actually worse than it is in non-modern cubes IMO. If you don't have the support I'd run Stillmoon and Mortify much before it, but if you want to run the support it's probably the best modern reanimation spell (though Makeshift Mannequin is pretty decent too)
We also ran Desolation Angel for ages, but it just wasn't being played much, despite its awesome ability to just seal games out of the blue. B/W was being played mostly as an aggro combination, and a 7-mana finisher just wasn't needed. We cut it for Lingering Souls, which of course has been fantastico.
I run unburial rites in my cube, and its one of my groups favorites. It made the esper good stuff deck even better. Its a good card in my cube, but it makes cards like fact or fiction, and gifts ungiven even better.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
I've wondered why it wasn't ever since it was released. :symu::symb: makes perfect sense since these are the zombie colours in Innistrad. Very confusing.
Also, I'm looking to support Reanimator more in my Cube, so watching the responses here closely. For me, it's not just the competition in BW, but the fact that White isn't one of the Reanimator colours leaves me on the fence.
I've wondered why it wasn't ever since it was released. :symu::symb: makes perfect sense since these are the zombie colours in Innistrad. Very confusing.
Also, I'm looking to support Reanimator more in my Cube, so watching the responses here closely. For me, it's not just the competition in BW, but the fact that White isn't one of the Reanimator colours leaves me on the fence.
The combination of high casting cost, competition in BW and lack of white support means I am over the fence, across the fields and down the lane.
If I really wanted a flashback reanimation spell I'd runs Dread Return, and draft plenty of token producing creatures to fuel it.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
My top 4 for Orzhov goes something like Vindicate/Sorin/Souls, and then G's Verdict, and then Stillmoon Cavalier and this card. Top 4 is pretty tight right now in B/W thanks to DKA. That's saying a lot, because Unburial Rites is a monster of a card.
i'm unburying this thread with the recent printing of Seasoned Hallowblade we have a decent discard outlet now in white that might allow this to crack into some lists. If anyone has any input that would be great.
I don't see this still making it at 350 sized cubes, since as Juju mentioned above Vindicate Sorin, Lord of Innistrad Lingering Souls
are still probably the top 3 +/- Lurrus of the Dream if you are doing that kind of a thing.
as is, i think i would need 2 more discard outlets in white to allow it to have a real role in reanimator decks, but it won't suprise me if WOTC ends up pushing a few things this way based on what we have seen lately.
Karmic Guide is also an interesting support card for that same kinds of deck. Not a discard outlet, but another white reanimation spell that's worth exploring.
I will never cut this card ust because of how much I love Gifts Ungiven. I'm actually about to add Intuition to my list as well.
It has gotten additional stock with the introduction of Thassa's Oracle as well. I've already seen a deck mill themselves with Doom Whisperer to hit Unburial Rites + Thassa's Oracle and kill
Unburial Rites looks like an interesting reanimation spell. If you're really trying to push the reanimation theme, how good is this card really? Is it playable at 450 as your 4th Orzhov card if reanimation is a big part of your strategy, or is it simply too slow at 5 mana? I was thinking it would be too slow (if I'm paying 5 mana for a reanimation spell, I'd rather it be something broken like Living Death). Is the flashback that much more relevant than the reshuffle on Beacon of Unrest to justify it being a 2-color spell? What are your opinions?
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I think orzhov card #4 is adequate, after Sorin, Lingering Souls, Vindicate. Reanimator likes looting anyway, so discarding Unburial Rites and a fatty can become quite the value play.
450, Peasant*, unpowered**
Specialities about the cube:
U tempo, B aggro, R slow-ish are supported. G aggro is not.
Currently trying to support tokens in all colors but blue, in different ways: W pumps them, B sacrifices them, R suicides them, G has decent-sized ones.
cube list outdated
*literal C/U definition according to gatherer
**some cards are banned. Library of Alexandria, Land Tax, Sol Ring.
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That said the flashback is so good as it just combos better with Loam, FoF, Gifts, and other spells like that, and that really bumps the power level up high enough that it would be a good enough cube card in a less stacked color combo.
All these interactions are why I want to give it a try at 450. I think that the overcosted Zombify is not good enough even with a free replacement Breath of Life thrown in, because in a typical cube game you don't have the time to repeatedly reanimate stuff at that high a price. In combination with the mentioned spells (Loam, FoF, Gifts) or just some looting action, though, it seems that the card provides some insane value.
"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
If the flashback cost were any colour other than white, with the card otherwise identical, I'd probably try it out. As it stands I'm not impressed.
I can see it being solid in B/W midrange decks to provide resilience, but there's a lot of competition in that colour combination.
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"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
You're right, it's no Animate Dead or Necromancy for a true reanimator deck. On the other hand, Unburial Rites is exactly what an attrition-focused BGW deck wants to be doing. That's where I see the card's justification.
450, Peasant*, unpowered**
Specialities about the cube:
U tempo, B aggro, R slow-ish are supported. G aggro is not.
Currently trying to support tokens in all colors but blue, in different ways: W pumps them, B sacrifices them, R suicides them, G has decent-sized ones.
cube list outdated
*literal C/U definition according to gatherer
**some cards are banned. Library of Alexandria, Land Tax, Sol Ring.
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Depends if you support reanimator. If you do, you pretty much have to run it, but if you don't it's actually worse than it is in non-modern cubes IMO. If you don't have the support I'd run Stillmoon and Mortify much before it, but if you want to run the support it's probably the best modern reanimation spell (though Makeshift Mannequin is pretty decent too)
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For the record I run:
Vindicate
Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
Lingering Souls
Stillmoon Cavalier (we debated about this choice when it came down to this, Mortify or Gerrard's Verdict, and people just liked Stillmoon the best. The other two are equally as good imo. though.
We also ran Desolation Angel for ages, but it just wasn't being played much, despite its awesome ability to just seal games out of the blue. B/W was being played mostly as an aggro combination, and a 7-mana finisher just wasn't needed. We cut it for Lingering Souls, which of course has been fantastico.
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It does feel like an Esper card rather than an Orzhov card. I wish it was flashback U3.
My 380 Beginners’ Cube on Cube Tutor
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
I've wondered why it wasn't ever since it was released. :symu::symb: makes perfect sense since these are the zombie colours in Innistrad. Very confusing.
Also, I'm looking to support Reanimator more in my Cube, so watching the responses here closely. For me, it's not just the competition in BW, but the fact that White isn't one of the Reanimator colours leaves me on the fence.
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The combination of high casting cost, competition in BW and lack of white support means I am over the fence, across the fields and down the lane.
If I really wanted a flashback reanimation spell I'd runs Dread Return, and draft plenty of token producing creatures to fuel it.
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"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
I don't see this still making it at 350 sized cubes, since as Juju mentioned above
Vindicate
Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
Lingering Souls
are still probably the top 3 +/- Lurrus of the Dream if you are doing that kind of a thing.
as is, i think i would need 2 more discard outlets in white to allow it to have a real role in reanimator decks, but it won't suprise me if WOTC ends up pushing a few things this way based on what we have seen lately.
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My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
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It has gotten additional stock with the introduction of Thassa's Oracle as well. I've already seen a deck mill themselves with Doom Whisperer to hit Unburial Rites + Thassa's Oracle and kill
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