I just have a theoretical question here, am I the only person that thinks that 1 drops are really bad in this deck? If not, please explain why they are good. I mean, Llanowar Elves? Seriously? Even Birds is kinda iffy to me. Doesn't seem to do that much for you. I'm testing a list without 1 drops atm, and it works fairly well...
Because conservative bias is a far, far worse thing. Liberal bias doesn't, statistically speaking, make people stupid. Conservative bias (or at least Fox's version of it) does.
Haha those were supposed to be Viridian Corruptors
I went with them over Sylvok Replicas because they had infect. Soul Sisters is surprisingly popular in my meta, as is infect - the reason for 2x Melira in the sb.
I'm playtesting again over the weekend, if I can get my mitts on some Solemn Simulacrums
I just have a theoretical question here, am I the only person that thinks that 1 drops are really bad in this deck? If not, please explain why they are good. I mean, Llanowar Elves? Seriously? Even Birds is kinda iffy to me. Doesn't seem to do that much for you. I'm testing a list without 1 drops atm, and it works fairly well...
Aside from letting you drop a turn two Birthing Pod, the fact that they generate additional mana for a low investment is the main reason that they're run. Without sufficient mana, this deck will be too slow. Birds of Paradise is needed to support the color requirements if you're running opposing colors or 3-color versions.
It should be fine making use of two drop mana accelerators, if that fits into your plan better. A number of RUG and RG builds mainly use Lotus Cobra, for example. Lotus Cobra can't fit in all builds, though, due to land/mana base considerations.
Well, I'm kicking around a build similar to Patrick Chapin's Jund build that basically drops the Gatekeepers and uses Pod as a method to beat control decks. It's not so much a "Pod Deck" as a deck that uses Pod to gain incremental advantage. I like it more than all-in Pod...
That's a perfectly fine direction to take it in, in my opinion. I've moved away from the all-in, toolbox approach, myself. I'm trying a much more aggressive approach, which has been interesting.
I'd agree that the best approaches are those that utilize Pod but focus on other strategies as well. Twin-Pod seems successful, and the mainstream Rock-Pod seems good as well.
Here's what I'm trying out for a while instead of BUG. Definitely plays a little more aggro than lists with blue, but I'm really diggin' it so far. Think a 2/1 split on Feast n Famine/War and Peace is needed?
The sideboard is all over the place so I left it out for now. The only things that I'm sure of are memoricides, the 4th duress and 2 Act of Agg. for Twin. Can't wait to get in some games against Valakut and RDW.
What do other people think of Abyssal Persecutor in this deck? I've been testing him for a bit and think he fits perfectly. He gives you a heavy threat when the 6-7 slots are still out of reach and with the pod\ beast within\ doom blade you can easily get rid of him. The fact that he flies is also a very nice bonus, since i notice that decks that are heavy on fliers can really cause issues.
Here's how I see it; Abyssal Persecutor pushes you away from the "aggro" version of these Pod decks. Yeah, I DID just say that about a 6/6 Flying, Trampler that costs 4 mana.
Seriously, the ONLY thing he's good for is as a top deck. Good blocker, and good to pod out of, but TERRIBLE to pod into. If anybody is understanding me here?
By the way, I think we pretty much all agree that these Pod Lists are a nightmare for control, and that our main issue is Aggro. How about we put a 1-of Obstinate Baloth mainboard to increase our chances game 1?
Here's how I see it; Abyssal Persecutor pushes you away from the "aggro" version of these Pod decks. Yeah, I DID just say that about a 6/6 Flying, Trampler that costs 4 mana.
Seriously, the ONLY thing he's good for is as a top deck. Good blocker, and good to pod out of, but TERRIBLE to pod into. If anybody is understanding me here?
By the way, I think we pretty much all agree that these Pod Lists are a nightmare for control, and that our main issue is Aggro. How about we put a 1-of Obstinate Baloth mainboard to increase our chances game 1?
In my consistent list I MD 3 as vs control Im just going to massacre them with or without a good 4 drop against them and RDW has no chance after I baloth
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In my consistent list I MD 3 as vs control Im just going to massacre them with or without a good 4 drop against them and RDW has no chance after I baloth
3 is too many slots in the mainboard. You're losing speed against control. I'd go with 2 more Vengevines or Metamorphs instead
3 is too many slots in the mainboard. You're losing speed against control. I'd go with 2 more Vengevines or Metamorphs instead
VV is lackluster in my test of him, I dont want to put in 1 or 2 metamorphs as that takes me more to a toolbox which i dont want
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rock (G/) pod
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At the end of that turn, you lose the game.
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I'd agree that the best approaches are those that utilize Pod but focus on other strategies as well. Twin-Pod seems successful, and the mainstream Rock-Pod seems good as well.
Basically Hand Disruption and Creature Removal with a bit of Enchantment removal as well. Obviously you wouldn't run all of these but any of them could work.
Do we even have a plan against twin? Seriously....
Pod is the nuts against control and you can use Wurmcoils as your 6 drops, and run O-Baloth, and run Pyroclasm and Slagstorm for aggro.
Twin, however....that's dangerous....
Depends on your list, since there are so many different Pod decks people have brewed.
1) You can Acidic Slime away their red source.
2) You can Dismember their combo if they don't have a Spellskite
3) If you're RUG, you can Twin combo them back.
There's really not room in most lists the way I see it. Utility spells are not numerous. My build runs 4 Dismember 4 Despise 4 Entomber Exarch Maindeck. I don't feel like that's enough.
I took Jund pod to a 24 man tournament tonight and took 11th after making some tweaks. Previously I had problems with games going too long and not being aggressive enough. So I dropped a Llanowar Elf and Sylvok Replica to the sideboard and tossed in Inferno Titan and Abyssal Persecutor.
Match 2: vs I don't even remember and it literally happened 3 hours ago. But it was 2-1.
Match 3: vs Mindcrank/Bloodchief
Game 1: He gets Bloodchief after Mental Misstep hits my opening Birds of Paradise in a one land, one Birds of Paradise, double Sylvan Ranger hand. I lose pretty quickly afterwards.
Game 2: I get to Memoricide before he gets to Mindcrank but since he has a Bloodchief Ascension in play I take out the Mindcranks. He has no red land and cannot get counters on his enchantment. I drop a Pod and pay two life for it giving him a counter. He plays two Tezzeret's Gambit on the following turns. So it's active. I had looked at his hand VERY briefly when I hit Memoricide but failed to notice an Archive Trap. So when I Pod he traps me and I lose. Huge play mistake considering I had an Entomber Exarch in hand.
Match 4: vs UW Control
Despite all efforts to win and hitting Memoricide on most of his threats in game 2 he manages to keep me off any land destruction and Celestial Colonnade me to death.
Match 5: vs really unique GWU Venser Control
Game 1: We had stupidly long games last week (35 minute game 1) so I expect more of the same. Then he pulls out a surprise Emeria Angel that wasn't in the deck last week and Phyrexian Metamorphs it. I lose to a bunch of flying birds.
Game 2: I draw a near perfect hand for this match and tear him apart by turn 6 before he could really stabilize.
Game 3: Pretty typical game start with a Pod on turn 3 that lead in to an Abyssal Persecutor. He Phyrexian Metamorphs my Persecutor and blows up my Pod. I'm pretty confident still as I have a Beast Within in hand and have him at 4. He drops Avenger of Zendikar and I'm forced to blow my Beast Within on it. He still gets like seven tokens and they're 1/2. We play an uneventful set of turns out. I drop Inferno Titan and hit him for 3. On his turn he responds with Venser and makes his creatures unblockable. He shows me Naturlize in hand and it's game.
I was VERY happy with the deck tonight. I am a bit sad that after starting 2-0 it took such a spin but I think this was a huge step in the right direction.
I'm really interested to see your decklist. This sounds a lot like what I am running.
Abyssal Persecutor was never a problem for me to get rid of when I needed to and he was almost always the first four drop I went for. He just wins games fast.
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs is my anti-Twin and anti-horde army guy. It's pretty funny to watch someone land Grave Titan and have their tokens be worthless unless they pay 3 per.
The sideboard so heavy on red sweepers was because our local meta is usually all inexpensive, aggro decks but the last few weeks it has been different so those slots are going to change quite a bit.
I think I'm going to try out the Pod-Twin idea next time I can go up to a tournament and see how it does. But, I have a feeling that I'll just wind up going back to G/B overall and going a bit less tool-boxxy. I will still keep Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs as my anti-Twin, anti-Aggro. He's just that good.
Abyssal Persecutor was never a problem for me to get rid of when I needed to and he was almost always the first four drop I went for. He just wins games fast.
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs is my anti-Twin and anti-horde army guy. It's pretty funny to watch someone land Grave Titan and have their tokens be worthless unless they pay 3 per.
The sideboard so heavy on red sweepers was because our local meta is usually all inexpensive, aggro decks but the last few weeks it has been different so those slots are going to change quite a bit.
I think I'm going to try out the Pod-Twin idea next time I can go up to a tournament and see how it does. But, I have a feeling that I'll just wind up going back to G/B overall and going a bit less tool-boxxy. I will still keep Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs as my anti-Twin, anti-Aggro. He's just that good.
Any reason you aren't running manlands? Also, your list is a bit removal light. How is your splintergay matchup? Isn't Kazuul a huge dismember target? I friggin love your creature selection, I'm just worried that without 1cmc discard and 2cmc removal I'd be outpaced by beatdown.
Jund: Dismember side and mainboard hand denial (duress/despise/iok), Entomber Exarch as a creature and Combust
GB: same as Jund, only may be running more hand denial, more creature hate (GftT, Doom Blade, Beast Within) and Molten Tail Masticore maybe...
RUG: RUG has the best matchup against Twin. RUG could be faster than Twin (lotus cobra + BoP easy handle a turn 3-4 combo), could add pressure with vengevine, run Combust SB and Spellskite (which is an obvious add in SB for every archetype listed above) and coul race the Pod with the Cobra+BoP engine to push out a Frost Titan... Not to mention they could run Dismember in SB anyway...
Kazuul and Urabrask as answers are possible for red on top of Spellskite and your typical removal answers. (White has Linvala as well). Creature based disruption is something we can do a lot easier and fits our game plan so it should be highlighted.
As I see it pod decks seem to fit into 2 categories mostly. GBx and GUx. These 2 approaches are the fundamental difference. GBx (including Jund) are mostly Rock decks based off removal and efficient trades. GUx (including RUG, and BUG and Bant) are mostly Tempo decks where you will see Cobra Titan/Slime. RUG has the option of running the combo themselves and BUG has the option of running Memoricide and combo foils, but otherwise very similar deck.
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rock (G/) pod
9-2-1
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They let you drop a turn 2 pod.
Haha looks better now! I like how this deck looks. But what about adding Obstinate Baloth?
Aside from letting you drop a turn two Birthing Pod, the fact that they generate additional mana for a low investment is the main reason that they're run. Without sufficient mana, this deck will be too slow. Birds of Paradise is needed to support the color requirements if you're running opposing colors or 3-color versions.
It should be fine making use of two drop mana accelerators, if that fits into your plan better. A number of RUG and RG builds mainly use Lotus Cobra, for example. Lotus Cobra can't fit in all builds, though, due to land/mana base considerations.
To those using white... Wall of Omens? Seems kinda awesomer than Phyrexian Rager...
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Current Deck(s):
GUElvesUG
GWBThe Birthing RockBWG
The sideboard is all over the place so I left it out for now. The only things that I'm sure of are memoricides, the 4th duress and 2 Act of Agg. for Twin. Can't wait to get in some games against Valakut and RDW.
4x Birds of Paradise
4x Lotus Cobra
4x Squadron Hawk
4x Blade Splicer
1x Hero of Bladehold
2x Vengevine
1x Phyrexian Metamorph
2x Acidic Slime
1x Grave Titan
1x Sun Titan
3x Birthing Pod
3x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Duress
2x Go for the Throat
Lands(25):
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Marsh Flats
4x Sunpetal Grove
3x Stirring Wildwood
4x Forest
3x Plains
3x Swamp
Here's how I see it; Abyssal Persecutor pushes you away from the "aggro" version of these Pod decks. Yeah, I DID just say that about a 6/6 Flying, Trampler that costs 4 mana.
Seriously, the ONLY thing he's good for is as a top deck. Good blocker, and good to pod out of, but TERRIBLE to pod into. If anybody is understanding me here?
By the way, I think we pretty much all agree that these Pod Lists are a nightmare for control, and that our main issue is Aggro. How about we put a 1-of Obstinate Baloth mainboard to increase our chances game 1?
In my consistent list I MD 3 as vs control Im just going to massacre them with or without a good 4 drop against them and RDW has no chance after I baloth
rock (G/) pod
9-2-1
Best Reminder text ever:
Warrior's Oath
RRTake another turn after this one.
At the end of that turn, you lose the game.
(YOU DON'T LOSE IF YOU'VE ALREADY WON.)
Check out my Lotuses
Formerly Jersam515.
3 is too many slots in the mainboard. You're losing speed against control. I'd go with 2 more Vengevines or Metamorphs instead
Turn 2 Pod is sometimes underwhelming. I find myself holding onto until I have a creature on board, then play it and activate it on the same turn.
VV is lackluster in my test of him, I dont want to put in 1 or 2 metamorphs as that takes me more to a toolbox which i dont want
rock (G/) pod
9-2-1
Best Reminder text ever:
Warrior's Oath
RRTake another turn after this one.
At the end of that turn, you lose the game.
(YOU DON'T LOSE IF YOU'VE ALREADY WON.)
Check out my Lotuses
Formerly Jersam515.
Wha exactly does a list for this "mainstream Rock-Pod" look like?
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
Pod is the nuts against control and you can use Wurmcoils as your 6 drops, and run O-Baloth, and run Pyroclasm and Slagstorm for aggro.
Twin, however....that's dangerous....
Duress, Dismember, Go for the Throat, Entomber Exarch, Inquisition of Kozilek, Despise, Combust, Sylvok Replica.
Basically Hand Disruption and Creature Removal with a bit of Enchantment removal as well. Obviously you wouldn't run all of these but any of them could work.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
Depends on your list, since there are so many different Pod decks people have brewed.
1) You can Acidic Slime away their red source.
2) You can Dismember their combo if they don't have a Spellskite
3) If you're RUG, you can Twin combo them back.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
I'm really interested to see your decklist. This sounds a lot like what I am running.
1 Dragonskull Summit
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Copperline Gorge
4 Swamp
4 Forest
3 Mountain
1 CC:
2 Birds of Paradise
2 Llanowar Elves
2 CC:
3 Sylvan Ranger
1 Perilous Myr
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 CC:
1 Tuktuk the Explorer
1 Glissa the Traitor
1 Pilgrim's Eye
1 Priest of Urabrask
1 Liliana's Specter
1 Entomber Exarch
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Obstinate Baloth
1 Abyssal Persecutor
1 Skinrender
5 CC:
2 Acidic Slime
1 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
1 Clone Shell
1 Mitotic Slime
6 CC:
1 Brutalizer Exarch
1 Massacre Wurm
1 Inferno Titan
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
Other:
4 Beast Within
4 Birthing Pod
1 Elixir of Immortality
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Sylvok Replica
3 Pyroclasm
2 Slagstorm
1 Manic Vandal
1 Hoarding Dragon
2 Viridian Corrupter
3 Memoricide
I think I like Grave Titan over Inferno Titan. So that change will probably happen. Once my other Birds arrive in the mail the Llanowar Elves go away.
Priest of Urabrask has been really good for me lately.
Abyssal Persecutor was never a problem for me to get rid of when I needed to and he was almost always the first four drop I went for. He just wins games fast.
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs is my anti-Twin and anti-horde army guy. It's pretty funny to watch someone land Grave Titan and have their tokens be worthless unless they pay 3 per.
The sideboard so heavy on red sweepers was because our local meta is usually all inexpensive, aggro decks but the last few weeks it has been different so those slots are going to change quite a bit.
I think I'm going to try out the Pod-Twin idea next time I can go up to a tournament and see how it does. But, I have a feeling that I'll just wind up going back to G/B overall and going a bit less tool-boxxy. I will still keep Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs as my anti-Twin, anti-Aggro. He's just that good.
Manaless Dredge
Standard:
Jund Birthing Pod Toolbox
Any reason you aren't running manlands? Also, your list is a bit removal light. How is your splintergay matchup? Isn't Kazuul a huge dismember target? I friggin love your creature selection, I'm just worried that without 1cmc discard and 2cmc removal I'd be outpaced by beatdown.
Kazuul and Urabrask as answers are possible for red on top of Spellskite and your typical removal answers. (White has Linvala as well). Creature based disruption is something we can do a lot easier and fits our game plan so it should be highlighted.
As I see it pod decks seem to fit into 2 categories mostly. GBx and GUx. These 2 approaches are the fundamental difference. GBx (including Jund) are mostly Rock decks based off removal and efficient trades. GUx (including RUG, and BUG and Bant) are mostly Tempo decks where you will see Cobra Titan/Slime. RUG has the option of running the combo themselves and BUG has the option of running Memoricide and combo foils, but otherwise very similar deck.
GWU Knightfall Modern
UW Tempo Legacy
UGR Burning Wish Cobra Vintage
8 Swamp
10 Forest
2 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Acidic Slime
3 Thrun, the Last Troll
3 Obstinate Baloth
1 Reassembling Skeleton
4 Birds of Paradise
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Birthing Pod
4 Beast Within
4 Phyrexian Rager
4 Despise
1 Viridian Emissary
rock (G/) pod
9-2-1
Best Reminder text ever:
Warrior's Oath
RRTake another turn after this one.
At the end of that turn, you lose the game.
(YOU DON'T LOSE IF YOU'VE ALREADY WON.)
Check out my Lotuses
Formerly Jersam515.