Nedo92's list above went largely uncommented but it got me thinking about some major themes of this archetype and Delver. Hope it's OK to discuss them here!
Delver of Secrets. Take a good, hard look at the card. Compare it to Spire Golem. Both are undercosted flyers that work well to win games. One can come on-line early, while the other pretty much requires 4 lands to be played. Is it bad to come on-line early and be a wicked threat just because you are a control deck? Of course not.
OK, so now let's take a look at what I call "the fairy/ninja package". This means Cloud of Faeries, Spellstutter Sprite and Ninja of the Deep Hours. All staples of traditional Delver builds. Why though? They have no synergy with delver. Delver isn't a fairy. Returning a flipped Delver to your hand at sorcery speed in the attack step is a horrible idea. Really, it's a stand-alone package - Ninja is ONLY there to return sprites (or cloud if the sprites are unavailable, since it's free). But even worse, it is anti-synergistic because Delver flips with non-permanents, not with more creatures. To make matters worse, you probably still want to include those Spire Golems, and perhaps a couple of Bonesplitters to make your 1/1 flyers into actual threats.
No, really. Who ever thought a deck with Delver of Secrets would be a good place to stick a creature based counter + draw engine? Granted, it has had huge success on-line, but later lists moved away from it, running stuff like Frostburn Weird instead, and you know, counterspells and draw spells of the instant kind - the kind that is good with Delver of Secrects.
The truth is that, if devoting 11-12 slots to the fairy/ninja package would be an effective way to counter spells and draw cards, MUC would run it too. The damage contribution in a race from these dudes is minimal. Anyone who's played "traditional" Delver knows that this is a fantastic package when the stars align and you curve a cloud into a sprite into a ninja. But it's also pretty horrible when it doesn't. Would you trade consistent draw and consistent countering for a slightly quicker clock and inconsistent draw/countering?
But actually, my point isn't to trash talk the fairy/ninja package, which has its merits, it is to point out that Delver of Secrets is actually a better inclusion in MUC than with ninjas/faeries. There is no hard line between aggro-control and control. You can't say that winning is just a formality with a deck like MUC because the opponent can top deck more threats than you have counters at any time, and it would always be more advantageous to close the game sooner rather than later if you can. "Tempo" is just a made-up term that makes you think there is something special with trying to create insurmountable problems for your opponent that cannot be overcome before you win the game - that is in fact what every deck wants to do. A so-so counter is still a so-so counter, you just notice it less when you're beating down with a 3/2 flyer meanwhile. You don't have to play inferior draw and counters just because you will sometimes be doing that starting turn 2.
Returning to nedo's list, there's not much I like about it except the creature base. I think it is pretty brilliant though.
Another thing: Something that strikes me as a bit odd with MUC is the lack of answers to resolved threats. Why did Curse of Chains get kicked from the main? Why aren't cards like Flood or Telekinesis discussed?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
A series of seven articles using Magic to explore the very stuff of the Universe! "At least for those who can play cards, their present incarnation is not quite wasted." [Click here for the articles!]
So, in a nutshell, you think Delver of Secrets should be played in MUC!
I have one very important rule when choosing my creatures: I want them to be good both offensively and defensively. This translates to them having at least two power and a large butt. This goes hand in hand as to why Curse of Chains does not make it into the maindeck: the strength of our blockers combined with the brokenness of Desert makes it unnecessary. My creatures block profitably or at least trade 90% of the time against other creatures that may have gotten past countermagic in the early turns. Bounce spells also go a long way here.
So while Delver of Secrets can end a game out of nowhere when you lay it down turn 1, it lacks the overall versatility of other creatures in terms of combat situations and stalling the board while you fly over for the win. Fatter creatures makes countering smaller creatures unnecessary, as they'll just die to Desert or be blocked by a Golem or something eventually. Delver forces you to race whatever they have that you couldn't counter (and there will be some), because it will typically just trade with other creatures when blocking.
By having great blockers, I can save my counters for things that really matter in a game.
For the two cards you mentioned, I must say I've never thought of them before. I was certain Telekinesis was only ever printed as a rare. If your playgroup accepts online rarity shifts, I suppose it could be played. I personally don't find it that great a card, since it is really a temporary fix, only useful in situations where you are in a tight race for damage. For Flood, I've used that card plenty in other, non-Pauper decks years ago, and I eventually found that it taxed my mana way too much just to tap down creatures every turn. Tapping your mana to do something proactive leads to your opponent being able to get past your countermagic. It seems to me Curse of Chains is just way better than both those cards.
Agreed on Flood and TK, jus wanted to mention them.
You know, even if Delver "just trades", it's still removal for one mana in a blue deck, and it might even do some damage before or draw removal away from the golems. Delver + desert kills 4/4 enforcers as early as turn 2. It's just a great card that can also enable a quick win as an extra bonus.
Have you not found removal to be a problem with your blocking strategy? A lot of decks are just lands, threats and removal so if you need to also counter their removal just to hold the fort against their early weenies (or early not-so-weenies) it might be better to just include hard removal instead. Are counters 13-16 really better than removal 1-4 against anything except combo?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
A series of seven articles using Magic to explore the very stuff of the Universe! "At least for those who can play cards, their present incarnation is not quite wasted." [Click here for the articles!]
You know, even if Delver "just trades", it's still removal for one mana in a blue deck, and it might even do some damage before or draw removal away from the golems. Delver + desert kills 4/4 enforcers as early as turn 2. It's just a great card that can also enable a quick win as an extra bonus.
The difference between trading and blocking profitably is card advantage. That's a really big deal. Nullifying the first cards your opponents with high toughness creatures allows you to save your counters for the actual threats. Being ahead on cards is more important than being ahead on damage, in my opinion.
Have you not found removal to be a problem with your blocking strategy? A lot of decks are just lands, threats and removal so if you need to also counter their removal just to hold the fort against their early weenies (or early not-so-weenies) it might be better to just include hard removal instead.
I never use my counters to save my creatures (usually). If they kill my creature(s), I'll take a few points of damage, but will always eventually play another, and possibly one that I can protect more efficiently. My priority is preventing them from playing more threats, then protecting my creatures. This play style has been quite rewarding for me.
Are counters 13-16 really better than removal 1-4 against anything except combo?
Essentially, yes. My larger creatures eliminate my need to counter early threats that won't get past them. This allows me to save my counters for more important threats. Having more counters increases my chances of being able to counter what's actually a threat, as well as being more versatile (I couldn't use removal on Rolling Thunder or Freed from the Real, for example) and more reactive.
Running removal is still an excellent thing to do. Don't get me wrong! I ran 2 Curse of Chains for the longest time myself. I eventually moved away from them when I discovered Deserts and changed the way I played my counters. They sometimes became dead cards in my hand because there were no good targets on a board I had complete control over already. I eventually saw that they would serve me much better as counters. They're still good in many situations. I just think they aren't necessary and would prefer using more countermagic.
Hello all! my LGS just started running Pauper on Wednesdays, so I decided to get back to my roots. The first deck I EVER built, when I first learned how to play MTG(back in Stronghold) as a MUC deck. I didn't have any idea what that was at the time, nor what Control or Aggro or whatever was. I asked about how Counterspell worked and my response was "You mean I tap two Islands, and whatever you just played goes in the graveyard instead of in play?" "Yeah." "THAT'S AMAZING!!!" I've been play control ever since. Anyway, I thought if I wanted to play Pauper, I ought to brush up on the format a bit. I have crap tons of commons, so I can put together basically everything that could go in the build by cracking open a single card box. One thing I wanted to ask, has anyone tried Treasure Cruise as a draw spell? By virtue of Control, we can easily turn this into Ancestral Recall in most cases, and have our Pauper cake and eat it too! lol. If not I have a ton of Think Twice, Brainstorm, GushAccumulated Knowledge, Treasure Hunt, Ponder, Preodrain, and Impulse to work with.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Sig By Rivenor
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
While the Primer hasn't been updated to show it, Treasure Cruise has become a boss in almost all formats, especially Pauper. Most draw spells MUC wants are Instant, but, to me, Treasure Hunt being a Sorcery doesn't matter since it can cost one mana and give HUGE card advantage. I'm sure it deserves a slot in the deck.
Also, Muddle the Mixture seems invaluable instead of Dispel. I know it costs 2, but it can hit sorceries, and you can transmute for just about any counter we may need in hand.
Sig By Rivenor
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
I think Treasure Cruise shouldn't be more than a 3-of, but I'd probably start testing it as a 2-of and see if you feel it should be 3.
Archaeomancer is definitely a good option especially since MUC can get grindy in a lot of matches so it can really pay off.
I see the reasoning for Muddle, but the Transmute seems under powered here since it can only be at Sorcery speed. I'd rather have instant draws or digs (Impulse) to find a counter that's needed. We pack a lot of counter spells so were bound to find a Counterspell or Mana Leak when needed. Have you tested it out at all? I could be wrong, but that's just my assessment.
Thanks for the assessment! I haven't had a chance to revisit MUC since before Khans so I haven't used Treasure Cruise outside of a Dredge/Discard deck I'm working on. With the right list 4 Treasure Cruise can definitely pay off!
I'm currently testing Cruise as a 2-of, although I made the mistake of running Rune Snag and Accumulated Knowledge. It doesn't exactly work well with cards that want other copies in the yard. If I decide to test a couple Archaeomancer, I might end up taking them out, since I would be swaying more towards a 'graveyard is you're second hand' method. Also, I REALLY want to have at least 4 Evolving Wilds/Terramorphic Expanse for yard fillers for Delve and to stop drawing lands at some point in the game. I will admit, that in testing, I ended up in a situation or two in which I over committed to delve(pitching a Snag or a knowledge) to keep mana open for a pair of spells, which was my own play mistake. I haven't had a matchup against control or Burn, where I would board in Muddle, but I'll let you know. Here's what my list looks like atm, without considering any of the changes except replacing Rune Snag and Accumulated Knowledge:
Edit: Does anyone run Waterfront Bouncer with Reality Acid for hard removal? You can use either one alone for decent removal, and eventually combo the two to spot remove like crazy.
Sig By Rivenor
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
Edit: Does anyone run Waterfront Bouncer with Reality Acid for hard removal? You can use either one alone for decent removal, and eventually combo the two to spot remove like crazy.
What am I missing here? Aren't you giving your opponent a two-for-one or three-for-one every time you do that? Seems awful.
Sig By Rivenor
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
Oh my goodness! So much activity while I was away for just a few days!
I completely forgot to update the Primer with Treasure Cruise (I did it for Turbo Fog and thought I had done it for both)! Indeed, this card has warped Pauper in ways only few new cards have done.
I would advocate running Treasure Cruise as a 3-of, max, in this deck (as Darkninja mentioned). Not being able to cast it for delve makes it a dead card, which is horrid for the deck. The fact that it is a sorcery also makes it a bit more difficult to use than something like the malleable Think Twice. I personally will be trying it out as a 2-of in my deck, fitting it I-don't-know-where-yet. Some number will eventually be used, but it's still so new that I have yet to test this powerful card. In a version like Cuss's deck, running many, many cantrips, the power of Treasure Cruise is valued by cards hitting the graveyard. In a version a bit more like mine, with less draw spells and more counters, it would be clunky to use in high quantities. Build around it if you will, but you need to draw into something other than cantrips, draw spells and lands.
Cuss,
You are very low on lands. Consider adding at least 3 more Islands. An MUC deck wants to hit all of its land drops from the start, and in having only twenty you run the risk of missing your fourth or fifth land drop.
Next, Miscalculation is not a very good card for MUC. It will become rather useless later in the game (forcing you to cycle into a potentially dead card) where a hard counter would have been a much surer bet. I would run 2 more Excludes instead.
While I understand the logic of Turn Aside, I think it would serve you much better as another counter. A simple hard counter will do just as well in fighting removal as a counter that is only useful against removal. Try to stay as general as possible. If you really want something to fight removal, try Negate. If you really want something at 1 mana, Dispel is quite powerful, though arguably just as narrow.
NTA,
Welcome to the wonderful world of Pauper!
Daze will become useless quickly as the turns go by, making it a dead draw in the late game. Try to avoid them as much as possible by running hard counters. There are very few things the opponent can play on turn 1 that will actually warrant these types of counters. They can later be bounced or made useless by Golems.
Instead of Boomerang, I would recommend Capsize. It can be played for three mana as an expensive Boomerang, and it can become a late-game hard lock on the opponent. Very powerful.
@Cuss: I agree with Obermeir about Turn Aside. Having counters that are good against anything are better than ones that only hit some of the things. Exclude is different though since mostly every Pauper deck uses creatures and it cantrips, which makes it very powerful for a seemingly narrow counter.
I also agree that you need more lands, which will help fuel Oona's Grace and, in turn, help Treasure Cruise. I will go further and recommend Lonely Sandbar for 2 of the 3 extra lands or all 3. The cycling will prove useful towards filling up your GY for Treasure Cruise.
You're very welcome! We strive here (and pretty much everywhere on these forums) to be as constructive as possible with comments. This is especially true with users who wrote primers; we are responsible for leading discussions on the archetype, and have a degree of mastery in their playability and deck-building.
I was watching a player playing a 17-land Delver deck, and noticed that he often kept his 1-land hands hoping that his 1-mana digging spells would help him get to his next land drops. As he failed miserably in a couple games, I couldn't help but think that if he had just been using more lands to begin with, his digging/filtering spells could have been used to improve his draws rather than search for lands. I know I'd rather have the lands I need to get a game started and improve my draws with these great cards rather than use them just to get my land drop. I'm afraid this is the kind of trap you'll be falling into with this deck. Make sure your spells are used to get better spells, rather than look for lands. Don't rely on them to get what you should have plenty of in the first place.
I'm a little surprised you can't find some of those cards for 50 cents. Counterspell I kind of understand, but the others... I see multiple websites listing Mana Leak at 40 cents or less. Capsize is at 54 cents in a few places.
For your deck, Exclude is a must-have. It's like 25 cents, so grab 4.
There has to be something better than Treasure Hunt to choose from. Impulse is not a very well known spell, which benefits you because it's dirt-cheap and really good. I would go for those. Accumulated Knowledge and Gush would be my runner-ups. I'd also cut a card for a singleton Oona's Grace and replace your Sandbars with islands or Quicksands.
If you're more of an aggro player, I'd suggest to practice, practice, practice! Control is a whole other mindset and you need to get a hang of it before you go to a tournament. You need to know your deck through and through, and also what to counter. The more you know about your opponents' deck, the better.
Yes, I would have suggested Nullfy and Logic Knot to make room for Exclude. You won't be disappointed.
The counterspell suite looks pretty good, now. If ever you get your hand on 2 Mana Leaks, They could take the place of Condescend, but it's not a terribly urgent thing. Condescend can sometimes even be better than Mana Leak. I'm just worried you won't have enough 2 mana counters.
My last suggestion would be to remove Boomerang and replace them with Echoing Truths. They are less colour-hungry, can bounce multiple creatures or just wreck someone's tokens. It also costs something like 35 cents. If ever you got your hands on a Capsize, I would split them with 3 Truths and 1 Capsize.
I played with the sage a good bit casually and always liked him. I haven't used him in several years, though. As he doesn't replace himself or give you the option of putting the cards you see on the bottom, or shuffling. Generally, the additional effects of Brainstorm, Ponder or Preordain will trump the advantages of having a 1/1 body attached to the mediocre ability. I would look to something more along the lines of the ever popular Sea Gate Oracle or the slightly cheaper Omenspeaker, if you wanted a utility creature.
You may not know me but I was a big proponent of MUC in legacy for a long time...and did quite well with the deck for many years at SCGs and grandprixs - especially during MUCs heyday when mental misstep was a thing.
Anyway, the legacy deck no longer is viable for numerous reasons, including delver, deathrite, and abrupt decay. I've tooled around with a modern version, which was decent. I've also tooled around with Pauper, etc etc etc blah blah blah. I digress.
So, here is are the two variations I would build if I were to build a MUC deck in Pauper. The first would be a more classical version:
Urdjur makes a strong argument for the inclusion of delver over some sort of pestermite, spellstutter sprite package. Since we are playing delver then, ponder is correct to set him up over brainstorm (weak without fetches) and preordain.
Otherwise, a few cards that have not been discussed which should be are psychic barrier and psychic purge. The barrier is an obvious choice in this deck somewhere in the 75. Pauper is creature heavy so the card seems an great choice in addition to exclude and gets a little damage in on top to help delver. Psychic purge is a sweet little card in Pauper: it kills x/1s handily, can burn face for that last point of damage hilariously and has great utility against any discard around.
The deck has some insane amount of draw and filtering so, 1-of's aren't too bad. Hence the one of narcolepsy (equivalent to chains).
As far as draw package, I strongly prefer and suggest accumulated knowledge and gush over treasure cruise and think twice. Think twice is weak in comparison to AK...you should be able to cast 3 to 4 easy a game which is way stronger and lighter on mana. Cruise does not play nice with AK, or Oona's grace. It is okay in small numbers, but I feel gush is better all around as a hard cast or for it's alternative. The deck doesn't really need more draw really.
The problem with this deck is the win-cons. It is a very good control deck, the counters are strong...the bounce package is adequate to deal with resolved problems. Winning with delver and spire golem alone is troublesome however. It requires a large amount of counters to protect them, which is the last thing the deck should be doing. Flame slash, bolt, and electolize are everywhere. The deck really needs man-lands in addition such as 4x factory, but that isn't a possibility.
There are two options...we can play 4x of the convertible turtle (calcite snapper), which is reasonable. The shroud is a huge boon and the flippable ability can end games pretty quickly. He is a turn 5 and later play. This will be what I do if this second option fails.
Instead, I am experimenting with a different win-con package in Jace's Erasure + Curse of the bloody tome. This offers a non-creature win-con, which blanks all their removal. This is huge. We already draw so much that 2+ Jace's erasure on the board is an inevitable win. The deck would look something like this:
Those are what I am working with right now. Some food for thought. Both thee versions are slightly lighter counters, since there is some much draw and bounce. If that is a concern, I suggest 4x Rune Snag.
I'll go over my thoughts on Delver of Secrets again, and why I don't play it in my own version of MUC.
Essentially, we want our creatures to be as robust as possible. This has two advantages. First, we can block efficiently creatures that have slipped through our permission without trading with them. Second, they are harder to kill with removal, which in Pauper is mostly concentrated around damage spells.
With only 2 toughness, Insectile Aberration will most likely trade with the creature it blocks or that is blocking it, as well as being vulnerable to just about every removal spell being run (especially if it hasn't flipped). It is this fragility that will often force us to "babysit" our creatures with permission when, as you stated, this is not what we want to be doing.
The advantage of Delver of Secrets is that it can potentially end the game extremely quickly if unanswered. This is both a good and a bad thing. The role of the MUC player is not that of the aggressor. We thrive by stabilizing in the late game and taking over with hard-to-answer threats that will finish the game in a few turns. Delver of Secrets forces you into a proactive role, which then leads to a damage race, which I'm sure you'll agree MUC is poorly equipped to follow through on. Delver leads us to racing a race we cannot win. I'd rather have a creature that interacts positively with other creatures rather than the high-risk, high-reward of a frail Delver. We're not tempo, we're control.
This thought of interaction with creatures brings me to your idea of cutting out creatures entirely and replacing them with Mill. This is hard question to answer because using mill could be the right thing to do. This is entirely dependent on what your metagame looks like. Any good MUC player must know what to expect when preparing for a tournament. If the field is mostly control, then the mill plan is incredibly effective. There is very little in the form of enchantment removal that is being used in the format, and coupled with the massive drawing that other control decks are doing, Jace's Erasure and Curse of the Bloody Tome will make short work of them with very little hassle. However, when going up against aggro decks, the non-interactivity of Mill is dreadful. It is simply too slow to kill an aggro player that will be playing multiple threats a turn until something resolves. Most creatures will be much faster at killing through damage than a Jace's Erasure is at milling without the opponent drawing cards. If we were to have creatures, we now have a way to interactive with aggro (and with the right creatures, we can do so in a positive way). I conclude that using creatures rather than Mill cards is more broadly applicable against a wider variety of strategies. Jace's Erasure and Curse of the Bloody Tome are both excellent sideboard cards, though!
Now the choice of creatures is somewhat of a personal thing. Spire Golem is a very important card. To me, it embodies everything MUC wants in a creature: high toughness, cheap to play and has evasion. Generally though, we want at least another creature to help us out. I've chosen Sentinels of Glen Elendra, as they come close to what Golem can do. With flash, they can be played at the end of an opponents' turn, making them easy to cast. They also ambush creatures that we let slide. With 3 toughness, they can survive blocking many creatures, making them as effective as a counterspell on legs. Calcite Snapper is another good, though less popular choice. I've tested with Frostburn Weird and Halimar Wavewatch, but have always returned to the Sentinels. I can definitely see the turtle being an excellent choice.
I'm considering using Haunted Fengraf as a 1-of in the deck, to try to pally against removal, what do you think of that?
As for Accumulated Knowledge, I want to ask you a question: You feelin' lucky? Although Knowledge is a very solid choice for a draw spell, I prefer Think Twice because its card advantage is not contingent on drawing multiples of itself. Consider that Think Twice and Accumulated Knowledge net the exact same number of cards when three are drawn (6). Each Think Twice did so independently of the others. AK requires you to draw multiples in order to be good. I don't think mana is a valid argument for it, as MUC will tend to get its land drops, and the instant speed means you can get your cards without having to worry about tapping out, whatever it is you're using. Not to mention that AK can fall victim more easily to splash hate like Bojuka Bog, currently a staple in every Black deck in Pauper, ever. I would consider both AK and TT to be equally good and bad with Treasure Cruise, as you don't want to exile AK and TT exiles itself anyways.
Gush is good, but Treasure Cruise is better. I can guarantee that. You can always play both, too. Gush was most often played as a 1 or 2-of in the deck, and Treasure Cruise actually fits in those numbers very well, making the swap very easy. It also doesn't always empty your whole graveyard. I often leave my Oona's Grace and Think Twices in the grave after Treasure Cruise. This has never been an issue, barring graveyard hate.
Allow me to disagree. More cards equals better chance of being able to answer what your opponent is doing effectively. We want to draw as many cards as we can.
Psychic Barrier is interesting, thanks for bringing it up! To analyze quickly, I don't think the 1 life is going to matter very often, which makes it exactly like a Remove Soul, in my eyes. Actually, I think I might prefer Remove Soul because it can be cast using Desert and Quicksand.
As for Psychic Purge, the only word that comes to mind is "cute". The number of games you'll end with that card is unfathomably low, and it would seem bounce spells like Repeal would be so much better. The only thing I like about it is that it punishes discard, making it a potential sideboard spell that can deal with both Delver decks and MBC.
The deck needs to have a certain amount of 2-mana counters in order to function well, that much is clear. I noticed that you use Prohibit in none of your lists. After Counterspell and Exclude, I'd argue that Prohibit is the next best counter for the deck. The fact that it hits any type of spell is great, and mana curves in Pauper (and other eternal formats) are extremely low, making it a reliable counter throughout the game. And if hitting 2 cc or lower isn't enough, it always has the kicker, which I've used on occasion. There is no matchup where this card is dead, even MBC and Tron, who still use low cc cards to support their large spells.
I can't say there's one "perfect" counterspell suite for Pauper, but I know that mine wouldn't include Psychic Barrier. I'm a proponent of more counters over bounce, but that is a personal preference, again.
I definitely have to agree with Obermeir for his thoughts on Prohibit. The card is very powerful in the format and when I've used it in tournaments it takes players by surprise since it's surprisingly unknown. Think of how popular Spell Snare is in Modern; obviously Snare has an edge due to it's mana cost, but even without the Kicker, Prohibit hits more targets and can be kicked in a pinch to stay relevant throughout the game. Cards like Mana Leak, and in certain situations, Rune Snag, can't stay relevant like Prohibit can.
I also agree that Delver isn't as good of a creature in this archetype. It is true that it is a good card no matter what, but it gets weakened when used in MUC and I feel it doesn't bring enough to the deck to help its weaknesses. Consider using an MUC deck with Delver against a legitimate Delver deck. You will be outclassed by the early Tempo and even a T2 Aberration won't help. This will even hold true against Aggro as Obermeir already mentioned. If you want to use Delver then you should use a Delver Tempo deck and use it to its full potential.
I agree that delver is underwhelming and understand your concerns on his toughness and vulnerability. I was arguing that the creature package is MUC is very underwhelming in general, and delver at least could offer a remedy to that. I agree that Spire Golem is the best we have, but to close out a game, 4x 2/4 fliers is not even close to enough. I don't really like the Sentinels of Glen Elendra due to their 3 toughness and 4cc, even if flash is important in this deck. Again, the reasoning being an opponents removal mostly in the form of bolts and direct damage clogs their hand until we try to play our wincons. Flame slash seems to be one of the most popular cards in pauper, which kills all our win-cons. We can't be using all our counters on protection, like a tempo deck with delver would do. My suggestions would be to try a mill strategy, which could possibly be too slow in an aggro meta as mentioned, or to instead make use of aggressive shroud creature, which I think calcite snapper is perfect here.
As far as haunted Fengraf, seems like an interesting choice that could work if the small creature package is still the choice for win-cons. Maybe try testing.
As far as accumulated knowledge, you are correct in that think twice draws a similar number of cards, but it has a much higher liability that AK. Let's take a look here:
So 4 think twice for 8 cards total costs us 20 mana...! yes it is at instant speed, but it is not like they cannot respond to our tapping out to cast the flashback on think twice. I am not saying it is a bad card and if you prefer the consistency getting 2 cards, then that is a choice to make. I find this very underwhelming
To draw 10 cards, we sink 8 mana. Much better! Yes, this is if we see all 4, but I would even argue that seeing 2 for 3 cards total for 2uu mana is still much nicer than think twice.
Gush plays nicely with oona's grace. Treasure cruise eats up our grace, think twice's or AKs. Still, if your testing has proven this to not be a problem, then I think Cruise is a fine choice.
Sure, we want to draw as many cards as we can...but the cards we draw need to have impact on the game. Why don't we play 4x ponder, 4x preordain and 4x brainstorm? They are very powerful cards that filter and should get us to our answers? Well, we just durdle in that scenario. The same can happen with too much draw...you draw into more draw spells, or even get close to milling out. I think this deck has a huge amount of the best draw spells around, that isn't its problem. Card advantage is a real thing, but the deck I think lacks card quality if we jam too many draw spells in.
Whether the life from psychic barrier is worth the possibility of not being able to cast it due to our colorless lands if up to you to decide. I am not sure yet either way.
Psychic purge is definitely a specific card and perhaps a sb card. It however does offer us removal vs anything with 1 toughness, which seem to be rampant in pauper? The discard part is just gravy.
Delver of Secrets. Take a good, hard look at the card. Compare it to Spire Golem. Both are undercosted flyers that work well to win games. One can come on-line early, while the other pretty much requires 4 lands to be played. Is it bad to come on-line early and be a wicked threat just because you are a control deck? Of course not.
OK, so now let's take a look at what I call "the fairy/ninja package". This means Cloud of Faeries, Spellstutter Sprite and Ninja of the Deep Hours. All staples of traditional Delver builds. Why though? They have no synergy with delver. Delver isn't a fairy. Returning a flipped Delver to your hand at sorcery speed in the attack step is a horrible idea. Really, it's a stand-alone package - Ninja is ONLY there to return sprites (or cloud if the sprites are unavailable, since it's free). But even worse, it is anti-synergistic because Delver flips with non-permanents, not with more creatures. To make matters worse, you probably still want to include those Spire Golems, and perhaps a couple of Bonesplitters to make your 1/1 flyers into actual threats.
No, really. Who ever thought a deck with Delver of Secrets would be a good place to stick a creature based counter + draw engine? Granted, it has had huge success on-line, but later lists moved away from it, running stuff like Frostburn Weird instead, and you know, counterspells and draw spells of the instant kind - the kind that is good with Delver of Secrects.
The truth is that, if devoting 11-12 slots to the fairy/ninja package would be an effective way to counter spells and draw cards, MUC would run it too. The damage contribution in a race from these dudes is minimal. Anyone who's played "traditional" Delver knows that this is a fantastic package when the stars align and you curve a cloud into a sprite into a ninja. But it's also pretty horrible when it doesn't. Would you trade consistent draw and consistent countering for a slightly quicker clock and inconsistent draw/countering?
But actually, my point isn't to trash talk the fairy/ninja package, which has its merits, it is to point out that Delver of Secrets is actually a better inclusion in MUC than with ninjas/faeries. There is no hard line between aggro-control and control. You can't say that winning is just a formality with a deck like MUC because the opponent can top deck more threats than you have counters at any time, and it would always be more advantageous to close the game sooner rather than later if you can. "Tempo" is just a made-up term that makes you think there is something special with trying to create insurmountable problems for your opponent that cannot be overcome before you win the game - that is in fact what every deck wants to do. A so-so counter is still a so-so counter, you just notice it less when you're beating down with a 3/2 flyer meanwhile. You don't have to play inferior draw and counters just because you will sometimes be doing that starting turn 2.
Returning to nedo's list, there's not much I like about it except the creature base. I think it is pretty brilliant though.
Another thing: Something that strikes me as a bit odd with MUC is the lack of answers to resolved threats. Why did Curse of Chains get kicked from the main? Why aren't cards like Flood or Telekinesis discussed?
A series of seven articles using Magic to explore the very stuff of the Universe!
"At least for those who can play cards, their present incarnation is not quite wasted."
[Click here for the articles!]
I have one very important rule when choosing my creatures: I want them to be good both offensively and defensively. This translates to them having at least two power and a large butt. This goes hand in hand as to why Curse of Chains does not make it into the maindeck: the strength of our blockers combined with the brokenness of Desert makes it unnecessary. My creatures block profitably or at least trade 90% of the time against other creatures that may have gotten past countermagic in the early turns. Bounce spells also go a long way here.
So while Delver of Secrets can end a game out of nowhere when you lay it down turn 1, it lacks the overall versatility of other creatures in terms of combat situations and stalling the board while you fly over for the win. Fatter creatures makes countering smaller creatures unnecessary, as they'll just die to Desert or be blocked by a Golem or something eventually. Delver forces you to race whatever they have that you couldn't counter (and there will be some), because it will typically just trade with other creatures when blocking.
By having great blockers, I can save my counters for things that really matter in a game.
For the two cards you mentioned, I must say I've never thought of them before. I was certain Telekinesis was only ever printed as a rare. If your playgroup accepts online rarity shifts, I suppose it could be played. I personally don't find it that great a card, since it is really a temporary fix, only useful in situations where you are in a tight race for damage. For Flood, I've used that card plenty in other, non-Pauper decks years ago, and I eventually found that it taxed my mana way too much just to tap down creatures every turn. Tapping your mana to do something proactive leads to your opponent being able to get past your countermagic. It seems to me Curse of Chains is just way better than both those cards.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
You know, even if Delver "just trades", it's still removal for one mana in a blue deck, and it might even do some damage before or draw removal away from the golems. Delver + desert kills 4/4 enforcers as early as turn 2. It's just a great card that can also enable a quick win as an extra bonus.
Have you not found removal to be a problem with your blocking strategy? A lot of decks are just lands, threats and removal so if you need to also counter their removal just to hold the fort against their early weenies (or early not-so-weenies) it might be better to just include hard removal instead. Are counters 13-16 really better than removal 1-4 against anything except combo?
A series of seven articles using Magic to explore the very stuff of the Universe!
"At least for those who can play cards, their present incarnation is not quite wasted."
[Click here for the articles!]
The difference between trading and blocking profitably is card advantage. That's a really big deal. Nullifying the first cards your opponents with high toughness creatures allows you to save your counters for the actual threats. Being ahead on cards is more important than being ahead on damage, in my opinion.
I never use my counters to save my creatures (usually). If they kill my creature(s), I'll take a few points of damage, but will always eventually play another, and possibly one that I can protect more efficiently. My priority is preventing them from playing more threats, then protecting my creatures. This play style has been quite rewarding for me.
Essentially, yes. My larger creatures eliminate my need to counter early threats that won't get past them. This allows me to save my counters for more important threats. Having more counters increases my chances of being able to counter what's actually a threat, as well as being more versatile (I couldn't use removal on Rolling Thunder or Freed from the Real, for example) and more reactive.
Running removal is still an excellent thing to do. Don't get me wrong! I ran 2 Curse of Chains for the longest time myself. I eventually moved away from them when I discovered Deserts and changed the way I played my counters. They sometimes became dead cards in my hand because there were no good targets on a board I had complete control over already. I eventually saw that they would serve me much better as counters. They're still good in many situations. I just think they aren't necessary and would prefer using more countermagic.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
And what about Archaeomancer? It costs 4, but its the closest we'll get to Snapcaster Mage in Pauper.
Also, Muddle the Mixture seems invaluable instead of Dispel. I know it costs 2, but it can hit sorceries, and you can transmute for just about any counter we may need in hand.
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
Archaeomancer is definitely a good option especially since MUC can get grindy in a lot of matches so it can really pay off.
I see the reasoning for Muddle, but the Transmute seems under powered here since it can only be at Sorcery speed. I'd rather have instant draws or digs (Impulse) to find a counter that's needed. We pack a lot of counter spells so were bound to find a Counterspell or Mana Leak when needed. Have you tested it out at all? I could be wrong, but that's just my assessment.
16 Islands
4 Quicksand
2 Halimar Depths
Creatures 8
4 Spire Golem
4 Delver of Secrets
Spells 30
4 Counterspell
4 Boomerang
4 Think Twice
3 Exclude
3 Deprive
3 Daze
3 Brainstorm
2 Treasure Cruise
2 Repeal
2 Impulse
4 Annul
4 Blue Elemental Blast
3 Serrated Arrows
3 Muddle
1 Relic of Progenitus
With that, I'm gonna do some more testing.
Edit: Does anyone run Waterfront Bouncer with Reality Acid for hard removal? You can use either one alone for decent removal, and eventually combo the two to spot remove like crazy.
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
What am I missing here? Aren't you giving your opponent a two-for-one or three-for-one every time you do that? Seems awful.
Avatar by DarkNightCavalier
You will not remember my face, your name, or your journey, but in the end...
You will accede my every command.
I completely forgot to update the Primer with Treasure Cruise (I did it for Turbo Fog and thought I had done it for both)! Indeed, this card has warped Pauper in ways only few new cards have done.
I would advocate running Treasure Cruise as a 3-of, max, in this deck (as Darkninja mentioned). Not being able to cast it for delve makes it a dead card, which is horrid for the deck. The fact that it is a sorcery also makes it a bit more difficult to use than something like the malleable Think Twice. I personally will be trying it out as a 2-of in my deck, fitting it I-don't-know-where-yet. Some number will eventually be used, but it's still so new that I have yet to test this powerful card. In a version like Cuss's deck, running many, many cantrips, the power of Treasure Cruise is valued by cards hitting the graveyard. In a version a bit more like mine, with less draw spells and more counters, it would be clunky to use in high quantities. Build around it if you will, but you need to draw into something other than cantrips, draw spells and lands.
Cuss,
You are very low on lands. Consider adding at least 3 more Islands. An MUC deck wants to hit all of its land drops from the start, and in having only twenty you run the risk of missing your fourth or fifth land drop.
Next, Miscalculation is not a very good card for MUC. It will become rather useless later in the game (forcing you to cycle into a potentially dead card) where a hard counter would have been a much surer bet. I would run 2 more Excludes instead.
While I understand the logic of Turn Aside, I think it would serve you much better as another counter. A simple hard counter will do just as well in fighting removal as a counter that is only useful against removal. Try to stay as general as possible. If you really want something to fight removal, try Negate. If you really want something at 1 mana, Dispel is quite powerful, though arguably just as narrow.
NTA,
Welcome to the wonderful world of Pauper!
Daze will become useless quickly as the turns go by, making it a dead draw in the late game. Try to avoid them as much as possible by running hard counters. There are very few things the opponent can play on turn 1 that will actually warrant these types of counters. They can later be bounced or made useless by Golems.
Instead of Boomerang, I would recommend Capsize. It can be played for three mana as an expensive Boomerang, and it can become a late-game hard lock on the opponent. Very powerful.
EDIT: Derp, I'll most likely be replacing some number of Fathom Seer with Treasure Cruise.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
I also agree that you need more lands, which will help fuel Oona's Grace and, in turn, help Treasure Cruise. I will go further and recommend Lonely Sandbar for 2 of the 3 extra lands or all 3. The cycling will prove useful towards filling up your GY for Treasure Cruise.
I was watching a player playing a 17-land Delver deck, and noticed that he often kept his 1-land hands hoping that his 1-mana digging spells would help him get to his next land drops. As he failed miserably in a couple games, I couldn't help but think that if he had just been using more lands to begin with, his digging/filtering spells could have been used to improve his draws rather than search for lands. I know I'd rather have the lands I need to get a game started and improve my draws with these great cards rather than use them just to get my land drop. I'm afraid this is the kind of trap you'll be falling into with this deck. Make sure your spells are used to get better spells, rather than look for lands. Don't rely on them to get what you should have plenty of in the first place.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
I'm a little surprised you can't find some of those cards for 50 cents. Counterspell I kind of understand, but the others... I see multiple websites listing Mana Leak at 40 cents or less. Capsize is at 54 cents in a few places.
For your deck, Exclude is a must-have. It's like 25 cents, so grab 4.
There has to be something better than Treasure Hunt to choose from. Impulse is not a very well known spell, which benefits you because it's dirt-cheap and really good. I would go for those. Accumulated Knowledge and Gush would be my runner-ups. I'd also cut a card for a singleton Oona's Grace and replace your Sandbars with islands or Quicksands.
If you're more of an aggro player, I'd suggest to practice, practice, practice! Control is a whole other mindset and you need to get a hang of it before you go to a tournament. You need to know your deck through and through, and also what to counter. The more you know about your opponents' deck, the better.
Hope this helps!
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
Yes, I would have suggested Nullfy and Logic Knot to make room for Exclude. You won't be disappointed.
The counterspell suite looks pretty good, now. If ever you get your hand on 2 Mana Leaks, They could take the place of Condescend, but it's not a terribly urgent thing. Condescend can sometimes even be better than Mana Leak. I'm just worried you won't have enough 2 mana counters.
My last suggestion would be to remove Boomerang and replace them with Echoing Truths. They are less colour-hungry, can bounce multiple creatures or just wreck someone's tokens. It also costs something like 35 cents. If ever you got your hands on a Capsize, I would split them with 3 Truths and 1 Capsize.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
I played with the sage a good bit casually and always liked him. I haven't used him in several years, though. As he doesn't replace himself or give you the option of putting the cards you see on the bottom, or shuffling. Generally, the additional effects of Brainstorm, Ponder or Preordain will trump the advantages of having a 1/1 body attached to the mediocre ability. I would look to something more along the lines of the ever popular Sea Gate Oracle or the slightly cheaper Omenspeaker, if you wanted a utility creature.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
You may not know me but I was a big proponent of MUC in legacy for a long time...and did quite well with the deck for many years at SCGs and grandprixs - especially during MUCs heyday when mental misstep was a thing.
Anyway, the legacy deck no longer is viable for numerous reasons, including delver, deathrite, and abrupt decay. I've tooled around with a modern version, which was decent. I've also tooled around with Pauper, etc etc etc blah blah blah. I digress.
So, here is are the two variations I would build if I were to build a MUC deck in Pauper. The first would be a more classical version:
2 Lonely Sandbar
16 Island
3 Desert
2 Quicksand
Spells by CC
1 Psychic Purge
4 Ponder
2 Repeal
1 Narcolepsy
4 Accumulated Knowledge
3 Psychic Barrier
2 Echoing Truth
4 Counterspell
2 Capsize
1 Oona's Grace
3 Exclude
2 Gush
4 Spire Golem
3 [LG] Psychic Purge
3 [A] Blue Elemental Blast
3 [WWK] Dispel
3 [AT] Serrated Arrows
Urdjur makes a strong argument for the inclusion of delver over some sort of pestermite, spellstutter sprite package. Since we are playing delver then, ponder is correct to set him up over brainstorm (weak without fetches) and preordain.
Otherwise, a few cards that have not been discussed which should be are psychic barrier and psychic purge. The barrier is an obvious choice in this deck somewhere in the 75. Pauper is creature heavy so the card seems an great choice in addition to exclude and gets a little damage in on top to help delver. Psychic purge is a sweet little card in Pauper: it kills x/1s handily, can burn face for that last point of damage hilariously and has great utility against any discard around.
The deck has some insane amount of draw and filtering so, 1-of's aren't too bad. Hence the one of narcolepsy (equivalent to chains).
As far as draw package, I strongly prefer and suggest accumulated knowledge and gush over treasure cruise and think twice. Think twice is weak in comparison to AK...you should be able to cast 3 to 4 easy a game which is way stronger and lighter on mana. Cruise does not play nice with AK, or Oona's grace. It is okay in small numbers, but I feel gush is better all around as a hard cast or for it's alternative. The deck doesn't really need more draw really.
The problem with this deck is the win-cons. It is a very good control deck, the counters are strong...the bounce package is adequate to deal with resolved problems. Winning with delver and spire golem alone is troublesome however. It requires a large amount of counters to protect them, which is the last thing the deck should be doing. Flame slash, bolt, and electolize are everywhere. The deck really needs man-lands in addition such as 4x factory, but that isn't a possibility.
There are two options...we can play 4x of the convertible turtle (calcite snapper), which is reasonable. The shroud is a huge boon and the flippable ability can end games pretty quickly. He is a turn 5 and later play. This will be what I do if this second option fails.
Instead, I am experimenting with a different win-con package in Jace's Erasure + Curse of the bloody tome. This offers a non-creature win-con, which blanks all their removal. This is huge. We already draw so much that 2+ Jace's erasure on the board is an inevitable win. The deck would look something like this:
3 Desert
16 Island
2 Lonely Sandbar
2 Quicksand
Spells
4 Brainstorm
2 Preordain
2 Repeal
1 Negate
1 Remove Soul
4 Accumulated Knowledge
1 Narcolepsy
4 Jace's Erasure
2 Echoing Truth
4 Counterspell
2 Capsize
4 Exclude
3 Curse of the Bloody Tome
1 Oona's Grace
2 Gush
3 Annul
3 Blue Elemental Blast
3 Psychic Purge
3 Dispel
3 Serrated Arrows
Those are what I am working with right now. Some food for thought. Both thee versions are slightly lighter counters, since there is some much draw and bounce. If that is a concern, I suggest 4x Rune Snag.
A counter package like:
4x Counterspell
4x Rune Snag
3x Exclude
2x Psychic Barrier
1x Negate
is strong and reasonable
Standard
Blows
Modern
BWUTeachingsBWU
GUGU TempoGU
WLifeW
RWValakut ControlRW
UBModern MillUB
Legacy
UMUCU
BPoxB
BWRTokensBWR
Pauper
UBGRW Domain UBGRW
Vintage
RVise-Burn!R
"Out of the crooked timber of humanity, nothing straight was ever made" - Immanuel Kant
I'll go over my thoughts on Delver of Secrets again, and why I don't play it in my own version of MUC.
Essentially, we want our creatures to be as robust as possible. This has two advantages. First, we can block efficiently creatures that have slipped through our permission without trading with them. Second, they are harder to kill with removal, which in Pauper is mostly concentrated around damage spells.
With only 2 toughness, Insectile Aberration will most likely trade with the creature it blocks or that is blocking it, as well as being vulnerable to just about every removal spell being run (especially if it hasn't flipped). It is this fragility that will often force us to "babysit" our creatures with permission when, as you stated, this is not what we want to be doing.
The advantage of Delver of Secrets is that it can potentially end the game extremely quickly if unanswered. This is both a good and a bad thing. The role of the MUC player is not that of the aggressor. We thrive by stabilizing in the late game and taking over with hard-to-answer threats that will finish the game in a few turns. Delver of Secrets forces you into a proactive role, which then leads to a damage race, which I'm sure you'll agree MUC is poorly equipped to follow through on. Delver leads us to racing a race we cannot win. I'd rather have a creature that interacts positively with other creatures rather than the high-risk, high-reward of a frail Delver. We're not tempo, we're control.
This thought of interaction with creatures brings me to your idea of cutting out creatures entirely and replacing them with Mill. This is hard question to answer because using mill could be the right thing to do. This is entirely dependent on what your metagame looks like. Any good MUC player must know what to expect when preparing for a tournament. If the field is mostly control, then the mill plan is incredibly effective. There is very little in the form of enchantment removal that is being used in the format, and coupled with the massive drawing that other control decks are doing, Jace's Erasure and Curse of the Bloody Tome will make short work of them with very little hassle. However, when going up against aggro decks, the non-interactivity of Mill is dreadful. It is simply too slow to kill an aggro player that will be playing multiple threats a turn until something resolves. Most creatures will be much faster at killing through damage than a Jace's Erasure is at milling without the opponent drawing cards. If we were to have creatures, we now have a way to interactive with aggro (and with the right creatures, we can do so in a positive way). I conclude that using creatures rather than Mill cards is more broadly applicable against a wider variety of strategies. Jace's Erasure and Curse of the Bloody Tome are both excellent sideboard cards, though!
Now the choice of creatures is somewhat of a personal thing. Spire Golem is a very important card. To me, it embodies everything MUC wants in a creature: high toughness, cheap to play and has evasion. Generally though, we want at least another creature to help us out. I've chosen Sentinels of Glen Elendra, as they come close to what Golem can do. With flash, they can be played at the end of an opponents' turn, making them easy to cast. They also ambush creatures that we let slide. With 3 toughness, they can survive blocking many creatures, making them as effective as a counterspell on legs. Calcite Snapper is another good, though less popular choice. I've tested with Frostburn Weird and Halimar Wavewatch, but have always returned to the Sentinels. I can definitely see the turtle being an excellent choice.
I'm considering using Haunted Fengraf as a 1-of in the deck, to try to pally against removal, what do you think of that?
As for Accumulated Knowledge, I want to ask you a question: You feelin' lucky? Although Knowledge is a very solid choice for a draw spell, I prefer Think Twice because its card advantage is not contingent on drawing multiples of itself. Consider that Think Twice and Accumulated Knowledge net the exact same number of cards when three are drawn (6). Each Think Twice did so independently of the others. AK requires you to draw multiples in order to be good. I don't think mana is a valid argument for it, as MUC will tend to get its land drops, and the instant speed means you can get your cards without having to worry about tapping out, whatever it is you're using. Not to mention that AK can fall victim more easily to splash hate like Bojuka Bog, currently a staple in every Black deck in Pauper, ever. I would consider both AK and TT to be equally good and bad with Treasure Cruise, as you don't want to exile AK and TT exiles itself anyways.
Gush is good, but Treasure Cruise is better. I can guarantee that. You can always play both, too. Gush was most often played as a 1 or 2-of in the deck, and Treasure Cruise actually fits in those numbers very well, making the swap very easy. It also doesn't always empty your whole graveyard. I often leave my Oona's Grace and Think Twices in the grave after Treasure Cruise. This has never been an issue, barring graveyard hate.
Allow me to disagree. More cards equals better chance of being able to answer what your opponent is doing effectively. We want to draw as many cards as we can.
Psychic Barrier is interesting, thanks for bringing it up! To analyze quickly, I don't think the 1 life is going to matter very often, which makes it exactly like a Remove Soul, in my eyes. Actually, I think I might prefer Remove Soul because it can be cast using Desert and Quicksand.
As for Psychic Purge, the only word that comes to mind is "cute". The number of games you'll end with that card is unfathomably low, and it would seem bounce spells like Repeal would be so much better. The only thing I like about it is that it punishes discard, making it a potential sideboard spell that can deal with both Delver decks and MBC.
Narcolepsy is decent, but imo Curse of Chains is better only because it's multicoloured, making it capable of removing Guardian of the Guildpact.
The deck needs to have a certain amount of 2-mana counters in order to function well, that much is clear. I noticed that you use Prohibit in none of your lists. After Counterspell and Exclude, I'd argue that Prohibit is the next best counter for the deck. The fact that it hits any type of spell is great, and mana curves in Pauper (and other eternal formats) are extremely low, making it a reliable counter throughout the game. And if hitting 2 cc or lower isn't enough, it always has the kicker, which I've used on occasion. There is no matchup where this card is dead, even MBC and Tron, who still use low cc cards to support their large spells.
I can't say there's one "perfect" counterspell suite for Pauper, but I know that mine wouldn't include Psychic Barrier. I'm a proponent of more counters over bounce, but that is a personal preference, again.
This is something I could see working out:
4 Prohibit
1 Deprive
4 Exclude
3 Faerie Trickery
I hope this clears some things up for you, especially when it comes to familiarizing yourself with the Pauper Format.
UGTurboFogGU
BRSacrificial AggroBR
16The Paper Pauper Battle Bag16
EDH
BRRakdos, Lord of PingersBR
GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
UB Ramses OverdarkUB
Sig by Ace5301 of Ace of Spades Studio
I definitely have to agree with Obermeir for his thoughts on Prohibit. The card is very powerful in the format and when I've used it in tournaments it takes players by surprise since it's surprisingly unknown. Think of how popular Spell Snare is in Modern; obviously Snare has an edge due to it's mana cost, but even without the Kicker, Prohibit hits more targets and can be kicked in a pinch to stay relevant throughout the game. Cards like Mana Leak, and in certain situations, Rune Snag, can't stay relevant like Prohibit can.
I also agree that Delver isn't as good of a creature in this archetype. It is true that it is a good card no matter what, but it gets weakened when used in MUC and I feel it doesn't bring enough to the deck to help its weaknesses. Consider using an MUC deck with Delver against a legitimate Delver deck. You will be outclassed by the early Tempo and even a T2 Aberration won't help. This will even hold true against Aggro as Obermeir already mentioned. If you want to use Delver then you should use a Delver Tempo deck and use it to its full potential.
I agree that delver is underwhelming and understand your concerns on his toughness and vulnerability. I was arguing that the creature package is MUC is very underwhelming in general, and delver at least could offer a remedy to that. I agree that Spire Golem is the best we have, but to close out a game, 4x 2/4 fliers is not even close to enough. I don't really like the Sentinels of Glen Elendra due to their 3 toughness and 4cc, even if flash is important in this deck. Again, the reasoning being an opponents removal mostly in the form of bolts and direct damage clogs their hand until we try to play our wincons. Flame slash seems to be one of the most popular cards in pauper, which kills all our win-cons. We can't be using all our counters on protection, like a tempo deck with delver would do. My suggestions would be to try a mill strategy, which could possibly be too slow in an aggro meta as mentioned, or to instead make use of aggressive shroud creature, which I think calcite snapper is perfect here.
As far as haunted Fengraf, seems like an interesting choice that could work if the small creature package is still the choice for win-cons. Maybe try testing.
As far as accumulated knowledge, you are correct in that think twice draws a similar number of cards, but it has a much higher liability that AK. Let's take a look here:
Think twice:
1u - 1 card
3uu - 2 cards
4uuu - 3 cards
6uuuu - 4 cards
7uuuuu - 5 cards
9uuuuuu - 6 cards
10uuuuuu - 7 cards
12uuuuuuu - 8 cards
So 4 think twice for 8 cards total costs us 20 mana...! yes it is at instant speed, but it is not like they cannot respond to our tapping out to cast the flashback on think twice. I am not saying it is a bad card and if you prefer the consistency getting 2 cards, then that is a choice to make. I find this very underwhelming
Accumulated knowledge:
1u - 1 card
2uu - 3 cards
3uuu - 6 cards
4uuuu - 10 cards
To draw 10 cards, we sink 8 mana. Much better! Yes, this is if we see all 4, but I would even argue that seeing 2 for 3 cards total for 2uu mana is still much nicer than think twice.
Gush plays nicely with oona's grace. Treasure cruise eats up our grace, think twice's or AKs. Still, if your testing has proven this to not be a problem, then I think Cruise is a fine choice.
Sure, we want to draw as many cards as we can...but the cards we draw need to have impact on the game. Why don't we play 4x ponder, 4x preordain and 4x brainstorm? They are very powerful cards that filter and should get us to our answers? Well, we just durdle in that scenario. The same can happen with too much draw...you draw into more draw spells, or even get close to milling out. I think this deck has a huge amount of the best draw spells around, that isn't its problem. Card advantage is a real thing, but the deck I think lacks card quality if we jam too many draw spells in.
Whether the life from psychic barrier is worth the possibility of not being able to cast it due to our colorless lands if up to you to decide. I am not sure yet either way.
Psychic purge is definitely a specific card and perhaps a sb card. It however does offer us removal vs anything with 1 toughness, which seem to be rampant in pauper? The discard part is just gravy.
Excellent reason to use curse of chains. I forgot about Guardian of the Guildpact
I am not familiar with how effective prohibit is. I will need to test it out it sounds like. Fair enough.
Standard
Blows
Modern
BWUTeachingsBWU
GUGU TempoGU
WLifeW
RWValakut ControlRW
UBModern MillUB
Legacy
UMUCU
BPoxB
BWRTokensBWR
Pauper
UBGRW Domain UBGRW
Vintage
RVise-Burn!R
"Out of the crooked timber of humanity, nothing straight was ever made" - Immanuel Kant
3 [AN] Desert
2 [VI] Quicksand
15 [ST] Island (1)
2 [ON] Lonely Sandbar
Spells
4 [DKA] Thought Scour
1 [5E] Flood
4 [M11] Preordain
2 [GP] Repeal
1 [SHM] Curse of Chains
1 [M10] Essence Scatter
1 [M14] Negate
1 [DS] Echoing Truth
4 [M12] Jace's Erasure
1 [10E] Remove Soul
4 [NE] Accumulated Knowledge
1 [RAV] Muddle the Mixture
4 [5E] Counterspell
1 [TE] Capsize
2 [PLC] Wistful Thinking
2 [IN] Exclude
1 [EVE] Oona's Grace
2 [M13] Rewind
2 [MM] Gush
3 [THS] Annul
3 [A] Blue Elemental Blast
3 [LG] Psychic Purge
3 [WWK] Dispel
3 [AT] Serrated Arrows
Standard
Blows
Modern
BWUTeachingsBWU
GUGU TempoGU
WLifeW
RWValakut ControlRW
UBModern MillUB
Legacy
UMUCU
BPoxB
BWRTokensBWR
Pauper
UBGRW Domain UBGRW
Vintage
RVise-Burn!R
"Out of the crooked timber of humanity, nothing straight was ever made" - Immanuel Kant
Standard
Blows
Modern
BWUTeachingsBWU
GUGU TempoGU
WLifeW
RWValakut ControlRW
UBModern MillUB
Legacy
UMUCU
BPoxB
BWRTokensBWR
Pauper
UBGRW Domain UBGRW
Vintage
RVise-Burn!R
"Out of the crooked timber of humanity, nothing straight was ever made" - Immanuel Kant