Well, I finally made it down to the card shop and cajoled the owners into hunting down the few cards I still lacked for the Pauper list I'd envisioned in the first place. Here it is.
I'm sure I might be wrong about Brimstone Volley + Keldon Marauders, but on the other hand... that's 10 damage from 2 cards and 5 mana, with only 1 successful swing required. The Volley can also turn an unfortunate chump block into a 5 point life swing in my favor, giving me a shot at closing out the game with a topdecked burn spell.
Kiln Fiend is new to me, I hadn't heard of this card before Pauper. There are stabler, less explosive 2 drops in red, like the Chain Walker... but pretty much the whole deck synergizes with the Fiend. It's most particularly exciting to suspend a Rift Bolt on turn 3, laying the Kiln Fiend down on the same turn.
Assault Strobe I feel is too cute, and I only have 12 creatures: one of which dies to himself.
The biggest problem I've had so far is grips full of counters + burn, with no creatures.... those can run out of gas badly, and I have no dedicated card draw. If I can't hit 20 damage with my first 11 cards (the deck has a turn 4 clock on average), things get bad in a hurry.
Just curious when you say Aether Snap do you mean Aether burst? if so you could probably cut them for 2 vapor snag and something else since you run plenty of burn to use as early removal. I wouldn't play assult strobe here while yeah it combos well with fiend I think you could use those spots better. how often can you hit 2 mountains? I feel like 2 Fireblast could help finish things off a turn faster.
I mean Vapor Snag actually, I was writing that from memory and mixed the cards up. All my Vapor Snags are in Chinese and I tend to forget the English names of such cards.
The problem that's emerging is too many counters, actually. I'd rather have more burn. A hand of Leaks and Dazes doesn't work well with Fiend and Marauders.
if you have Chain lightning or are willing to shell out some cash for pauper they would be awesome in here, but I know a lot of people try to keep this as a cheap format (myself included). If you want some cheaper options you could go for the shock varients, things like firebolt or burst lightning could be nice, or the simple things like incinerate.
I might go in for Chain Lightning, not for this deck specifically but for Legacy burn. It's the most expensive card there, too, where $10 looks like a bargain!
Adding more burn helped a bunch. My problem now is that Affinity races me.
yeah with delver Brainstorm is better since you can drop a spell from hand if you hit 3 lands or the like, and you can run fetches if it becomes a problem, but unless it's a big issue then I'd leave them out since they will slow it down.
Have you thought of Manamorphose? It gives you a free draw and mana fixing and gives free pump to Kiln Fiend.
I like Delver paired with Kiln Fiend. It's more consistent than mono red Kiln Fiend I think, but at the same time I feel it weakens Kiln Fiend's power. I'm working on a mono red Fiend deck, but it's high risk, high reward. Possible 24-28 damage in one turn.
I recently threw together a delver/kiln fiend deck (not pauper) as an afterthought and was blown away by how destructive it was. There's just no competition, izzet aggro is just a very deadly combination of cards. The challenge is getting on of the 8 creatures into your hand quickly.
Also Brute Force, with kiln Fiend, or even Delver, 'nuff said.
Mutagenic Growth is also great especially with Kiln Fiend. It's a free +5/+2 on him. And I feel Assault Strobe and Double Cleave are great too since it really puts your damage over the top!
@CatParty: I keep forgetting about Brute Force. I need to get me a playset of those!
Mutagenic Growth is also great especially with Kiln Fiend. It's a free +5/+2 on him. And I feel Assault Strobe and Double Cleave are great too since it really puts your damage over the top!
I've done something like this before in a variant of infect. If you are running double strike then you might consider Invigorate as another free pump option if you wanted to tweak it a bit to include forests. Yes it does give the opponent 3 life, but it gives your creature +4+4 and with double strike you negate the 3 life gain by an additional 5 damage and you paid nothing for it.
I've done something like this before in a variant of infect. If you are running double strike then you might consider Invigorate as another free pump option if you wanted to tweak it a bit to include forests. Yes it does give the opponent 3 life, but it gives your creature +4+4 and with double strike you negate the 3 life gain by an additional 5 damage and you paid nothing for it.
I have thought about Invigorate before, but I don't know if I'd want to work in forests to run it. But a r/g Kiln Fiend would be interesting...
As far as the OP, have you considered Wee Dragonauts? It's a flyer that works like Kiln Fiend so it might give you more consistency and the flying on it is great evasion too.
yeah with delver Brainstorm is better since you can drop a spell from hand if you hit 3 lands or the like, and you can run fetches if it becomes a problem, but unless it's a big issue then I'd leave them out since they will slow it down.
Wanted to necro this thread as I'm going to be going to a Pauper event in June and wanted to get a jump on building and testing. Just curious, what fetches are you referring to that are pauper legal? Just Terramorphic and Evolving Wilds? Thanks?
Wanted to necro this thread as I'm going to be going to a Pauper event in June and wanted to get a jump on building and testing. Just curious, what fetches are you referring to that are pauper legal? Just Terramorphic and Evolving Wilds? Thanks?
Yes, those two, and the alara shard fetches like bant panorama.
We're doing 5 uncommon peasant, "Vintage" (but the oldest sets my playgroup plays is probably Mercadian Masques and definitely nothing awesome from those sets)
Anyway some card choices
Artful Dodge: I like that it can push Cyclops and Fiend though a clogged board state and trigger their buffs twice, but its not going be very useful without a creature.
Brainstorm: Combos with Delver, does work, nuff said.
Gitaxian Probe: Gives information, cantrips, and buffs dudes, solid.
Lava Dart: With such a low mana curve, this can double buff my dudes, and kill two x/1's or an x/2 dude. Can also sit in the grave and help push lightning bolts into the x/4 range, all for the cost of an extra mountain. Worth a try.
Lightning Bolt: Staple
Ponder: See Brainstorm
Isochron Scepter: Puts any spell on a stick for gross value. And the copy is 'cast' so it still buffs my guys.
Izzet Charm: Good general purpose spell, and I can take advantage of all modes. Protect my dudes, burn my opponents, and help me dig, pitching dead dodges, deep analysis, and darts.
We're doing 5 uncommon peasant, "Vintage" (but the oldest sets my playgroup plays is probably Mercadian Masques and definitely nothing awesome from those sets)
Anyway some card choices
Artful Dodge: I like that it can push Cyclops and Fiend though a clogged board state and trigger their buffs twice, but its not going be very useful without a creature.
Brainstorm: Combos with Delver, does work, nuff said.
Gitaxian Probe: Gives information, cantrips, and buffs dudes, solid.
Lava Dart: With such a low mana curve, this can double buff my dudes, and kill two x/1's or an x/2 dude. Can also sit in the grave and help push lightning bolts into the x/4 range, all for the cost of an extra mountain. Worth a try.
Lightning Bolt: Staple
Ponder: See Brainstorm
Isochron Scepter: Puts any spell on a stick for gross value. And the copy is 'cast' so it still buffs my guys.
Izzet Charm: Good general purpose spell, and I can take advantage of all modes. Protect my dudes, burn my opponents, and help me dig, pitching dead dodges, deep analysis, and darts.
Your lack of counters is a concern to me. A card that I feel is great would be Spell Rupture since it pumps your guys as you cast it, so, by playing other spells while it's on the stack can counter almost anything. But any other counter will work good also.
Also, I love running Assault Strobe with Kiln Fiend and friends. This can give you some wins right out the gate. If it being a Sorcery is a problem you can go with Double Cleave, but it costs one colorless more to cast.
spell rupture I feel can be inconsistent with my low creature count. and none of them have power on their own (although with anything but dragonauts it's on par with mana leak with the option to increase the toll by two for one-ing myself). I was going to run counters in the side. mizzium skin and good old mana leak probably. also what would you cut for main deck counter magic?
spell rupture I feel can be inconsistent with my low creature count. and none of them have power on their own (although with anything but dragonauts it's on par with mana leak with the option to increase the toll by two for one-ing myself). I was going to run counters in the side. mizzium skin and good old mana leak probably. also what would you cut for main deck counter magic?
I realize that Mana Leak is a good choice when you are running two colors, but in my own experience I always cater to the primary color as you generally always have more of that mana, so in this case your primary is U so you 'should' have extra laying around that you don't need at all times. Plus it is a hard counter.
Ugh lol I know you're probably right but I've had those damn deep analysis sitting around so long waiting to be used.
In general what sort of decks do tempo decks have trouble with? I'd imagine control decks would be a tough matchup. What sort of sideboard cards would strengthen my chances?
Honestly, I'd go with Dispel as my counter of choice for this type of deck; you're most likely wanting to keep people from murdering your dudes on their way in for the kill, so why spend more than 1 mana to do it?
Red Spells (20)
10 Mountain
10 Island
I'm sure I might be wrong about Brimstone Volley + Keldon Marauders, but on the other hand... that's 10 damage from 2 cards and 5 mana, with only 1 successful swing required. The Volley can also turn an unfortunate chump block into a 5 point life swing in my favor, giving me a shot at closing out the game with a topdecked burn spell.
Kiln Fiend is new to me, I hadn't heard of this card before Pauper. There are stabler, less explosive 2 drops in red, like the Chain Walker... but pretty much the whole deck synergizes with the Fiend. It's most particularly exciting to suspend a Rift Bolt on turn 3, laying the Kiln Fiend down on the same turn.
Assault Strobe I feel is too cute, and I only have 12 creatures: one of which dies to himself.
The biggest problem I've had so far is grips full of counters + burn, with no creatures.... those can run out of gas badly, and I have no dedicated card draw. If I can't hit 20 damage with my first 11 cards (the deck has a turn 4 clock on average), things get bad in a hurry.
Anyone else trying this sort of deck?
Overall record: 139-98-15
Total number of matches: 252
Win percentage ignoring draws: 58.649789
Win percentage including draws: 55.158730
Legacy:
RGWBUDredgeUBWGR
:symrg:Belcher:symrg:
WD&TW
Affinity
WGriffinsW (pauper)
U/thopter comboU/ (peasant)
:symbg:Moosebite:symbg: (peasant)
RGobo tokensR (peasant)
R slide R (peasant)
:symur:pingers:symur:
The problem that's emerging is too many counters, actually. I'd rather have more burn. A hand of Leaks and Dazes doesn't work well with Fiend and Marauders.
Overall record: 139-98-15
Total number of matches: 252
Win percentage ignoring draws: 58.649789
Win percentage including draws: 55.158730
Legacy:
RGWBUDredgeUBWGR
:symrg:Belcher:symrg:
WD&TW
Affinity
WGriffinsW (pauper)
U/thopter comboU/ (peasant)
:symbg:Moosebite:symbg: (peasant)
RGobo tokensR (peasant)
R slide R (peasant)
:symur:pingers:symur:
Adding more burn helped a bunch. My problem now is that Affinity races me.
Overall record: 139-98-15
Total number of matches: 252
Win percentage ignoring draws: 58.649789
Win percentage including draws: 55.158730
It depends on the deck, if you are running Delver, you always run Brainstorm.
All in all I prefer both Brainstorm and Ponder because they both let you dig deeper then Preordain
W White Weenie
Legacy:
RGWBUDredgeUBWGR
:symrg:Belcher:symrg:
WD&TW
Affinity
WGriffinsW (pauper)
U/thopter comboU/ (peasant)
:symbg:Moosebite:symbg: (peasant)
RGobo tokensR (peasant)
R slide R (peasant)
:symur:pingers:symur:
I like Delver paired with Kiln Fiend. It's more consistent than mono red Kiln Fiend I think, but at the same time I feel it weakens Kiln Fiend's power. I'm working on a mono red Fiend deck, but it's high risk, high reward. Possible 24-28 damage in one turn.
Also Brute Force, with kiln Fiend, or even Delver, 'nuff said.
GWUBRDraft my Old Border Nostalgia Cube! and/or The Little Pauper Cube That Could!RBUWG
Modern:WDeath & TaxesW | RUGRUG DelverRUG
@CatParty: I keep forgetting about Brute Force. I need to get me a playset of those!
I've done something like this before in a variant of infect. If you are running double strike then you might consider Invigorate as another free pump option if you wanted to tweak it a bit to include forests. Yes it does give the opponent 3 life, but it gives your creature +4+4 and with double strike you negate the 3 life gain by an additional 5 damage and you paid nothing for it.
W White Weenie
I have thought about Invigorate before, but I don't know if I'd want to work in forests to run it. But a r/g Kiln Fiend would be interesting...
Wanted to necro this thread as I'm going to be going to a Pauper event in June and wanted to get a jump on building and testing. Just curious, what fetches are you referring to that are pauper legal? Just Terramorphic and Evolving Wilds? Thanks?
Yes, those two, and the alara shard fetches like bant panorama.
GWUBRDraft my Old Border Nostalgia Cube! and/or The Little Pauper Cube That Could!RBUWG
Modern:WDeath & TaxesW | RUGRUG DelverRUG
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Kiln Fiend
4 Nivix Cyclops
2 Wee Dragonauts
Spells
2 Artful Dodge
4 Brainstorm
3 Gitaxian Probe
2 Lava Dart
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Ponder
2 Isochron Scepter
3 Izzet Charm
3 Deep Analysis
4 Izzet Guildgate
9 Island
8 Mountain
We're doing 5 uncommon peasant, "Vintage" (but the oldest sets my playgroup plays is probably Mercadian Masques and definitely nothing awesome from those sets)
Anyway some card choices
Artful Dodge: I like that it can push Cyclops and Fiend though a clogged board state and trigger their buffs twice, but its not going be very useful without a creature.
Brainstorm: Combos with Delver, does work, nuff said.
Gitaxian Probe: Gives information, cantrips, and buffs dudes, solid.
Lava Dart: With such a low mana curve, this can double buff my dudes, and kill two x/1's or an x/2 dude. Can also sit in the grave and help push lightning bolts into the x/4 range, all for the cost of an extra mountain. Worth a try.
Lightning Bolt: Staple
Ponder: See Brainstorm
Isochron Scepter: Puts any spell on a stick for gross value. And the copy is 'cast' so it still buffs my guys.
Izzet Charm: Good general purpose spell, and I can take advantage of all modes. Protect my dudes, burn my opponents, and help me dig, pitching dead dodges, deep analysis, and darts.
Your lack of counters is a concern to me. A card that I feel is great would be Spell Rupture since it pumps your guys as you cast it, so, by playing other spells while it's on the stack can counter almost anything. But any other counter will work good also.
Also, I love running Assault Strobe with Kiln Fiend and friends. This can give you some wins right out the gate. If it being a Sorcery is a problem you can go with Double Cleave, but it costs one colorless more to cast.
Posted from MTGsalvation.com App for Android
Personally, I would most likely drop Deep Analysis for Counterspell rather then Mana Leak.
I realize that Mana Leak is a good choice when you are running two colors, but in my own experience I always cater to the primary color as you generally always have more of that mana, so in this case your primary is U so you 'should' have extra laying around that you don't need at all times. Plus it is a hard counter.
W White Weenie
In general what sort of decks do tempo decks have trouble with? I'd imagine control decks would be a tough matchup. What sort of sideboard cards would strengthen my chances?
W White Weenie
Posted from MTGsalvation.com App for Android
I think smelt would be preferable to crush.
Legacy
WUBRGDredge
WUBRGManaless Dredge
BRWGZombardment
BGPact Spanish Inquisition
WUBRGTES
Vintage
WUBRGDredge
Standard
BAggro
EDH
WUBRGChild of Alara control
WBAthreos 1v1