would you keep in molten disaster against g/w goyf and zoo goyf or take them out?
hmmm. it really depends. agaisnt zoo version i keep them in. mainly because they dont run thrill of the hunt. against straight up greenwhite i take them out since thrill basically nullifies ur molten most of the time and also g/w runs 4x griffin guide, 4x serra avenger and of course mystic enforcers which cant be hurt by molten
???Mystic Enforcer got Protection from Black not red ?and if u fear the hunt pay one red mana more ...for splitt second .Sure 3 Red Mana are though but it also means that u get your damage
It's not Mystic Enforcer's protection, but its flying (as long as they have threshold) that protects it from Molten Disaster.
So I'm playing a variant of Adrian Sullivan's Shell Game Red deck, which has good matchups accross the board except UG Shifter (which isn't unwinnable, it's just not an easy matchup at all).
For those that care, it's Sullivan's deck with -3 Disintegrate, -3 Thunderblade Charge, -1 Jaya Ballard, -2 Fungal Reaches, +3 Greater Gargadon, +3 Molten Disaster, +2 Word of Seizing, +1 Urza's Factory. The SB is -4 Browbeat, -1 Molten Disaster, -1 Word of Seizing, +2 Fortune Theif, +1 Greater Gargadon, +1 Bogardan Hellkite, +2 Sudden Shock
I'm thinking of dumping the Fortune Theives for more Sudden Shocks and another Jaya so that my post board arrangement is +4 Dead//Gone, +4 Sudden Shock, +1 Molten Disaster, +2 Jaya Ballard, -3 Greater Gargadon, -2 Word of Seizing, -3 Akroma, -1 Mogg War Marshall, -2 Vesuva versus UG Shifter, since all I really want to do is kill as many creatures as possible on their side and pack away with damage while not getting ruined by Vesuvan Shapeshifter.
Any suggestions? I'm really only concerned about the UG Shifter matchup, but any comments or suggestions are welcome.
First, your mana base scares me: 28 lands with 8 of them CIP tapped? Sure, you can consider the Caverns as creatures, but that’s still 24 lands, far more than is required for an aggro deck, plus the Caverns isn’t that great as an aggro creature. Cutting land will help make more room.
I don’t believe RAkroma will help against UG, since it takes a lot to get RAkroma and tapping out is the worst thing to do against Pickles lock. Plus, they have decent agro defenses with Wall of Roots and Thelonite Hermit. Dead/Gone is a superb answer against morphs and should be maindecked anyways since Gone is also solid removal.
How has Molten Disaster worked for you? It seems hard to be able to build up enough mana to make it worthwhile. Sudden Shock seems like a better candidate for you since you want to get rid of morphs.
First, your mana base scares me: 28 lands with 8 of them CIP tapped? Sure, you can consider the Caverns as creatures, but that’s still 24 lands, far more than is required for an aggro deck, plus the Caverns isn’t that great as an aggro creature. Cutting land will help make more room.
I actually cut a land from Sullivan's build if you can beleive that. The CIP tapped lands are only a slight nuisance, but Vesuva is key to fighting Urborg (and hence Tendrils and Korlash). Also, this deck is very mana hungry, and I'm rarely 'flooded' since there is always stuff to do with the mana, and the deck plays out more like control than anything. Zoetic Caverns is there as more of a guessing game for the morphs (letting them guess as to whether it is a Zoetic Cavern, Gathan Riders, or Akroma), but they also double as mana fueling large Molten Disasters, Word of Seizing, and flipping Akroma.
If I did anything with the manabase, it would be to go to something like 24-25 land and run 4 Coalition Relic and some number of Prismatic Lens, especially since Bust scares me a little bit (unless I have Gargadon suspended).
Quote from Natsume »
I don’t believe RAkroma will help against UG, since it takes a lot to get RAkroma and tapping out is the worst thing to do against Pickles lock. Plus, they have decent agro defenses with Wall of Roots and Thelonite Hermit. Dead/Gone is a superb answer against morphs and should be maindecked anyways since Gone is also solid removal.
I agree that the right thing to do versus UG would be to side out Akromas. As for Dead//Gone main, I've considered moving them there to replace Fiery Temper but everytime I think about it, I always end up with Temper in the main and Dead//Gone in the side. I might make this change soon.
Quote from Natsume »
How has Molten Disaster worked for you? It seems hard to be able to build up enough mana to make it worthwhile. Sudden Shock seems like a better candidate for you since you want to get rid of morphs.
Moving Molten Disaster to the maindeck was the best move I've made. I always found myself boarding them in verus both control and aggro, and running as many mana sources as this deck does, it is not uncommon to ramp up to a 7-9 point Disaster FTW. It is also been key for me in gaining some ground in the UG matchup.
I'm considering running Pyrohemia as a possible sideboard option versus other aggro decks. I'm thinking that it will be a relative surprise to most players, and it might make the UG matchup go my way. I'll test it and let everyone know.
With the most recent results for PTQ T8, RDW has mysteriously vanished after a strong showing from the first week. Why is this? Is GW Tarmygoyf that tough? My testing didn't really show it like that. One deck I haven't tested yet was UB control variants, but it's been tough to focus on a deck version to test. Right now, I'm building up a Korlash-oriented version. Is Damnation and Tendrils really that serious for the deck?
I dunno... if you hit a field full of control then mono-red has a chance. I briefly converted to white-weenie but have not done well with it vs. mono-blue pickles so now I guess I'm just SOL as those are the only two decks I have in block.
I lost to Mono-U Pickles, which was an almost impossible matchup when I tested, but I've learned more on how to beat (which didn't help at the time), I beat UG Aggro, I smashed Virulent Slivers, and I almost beat GW Tarmogoyf (I think I SB wrong for this matchup). As for some of the changes: Epochrasite - This was surprisingly good in testing, and ended up sucking the whole tournament. Versus pickles, I got one stuck RFG while Teferi was in play (along with a Gargadon and a Delayed Tarox), and I boarded it out a lot. I may try it again, but for now I don't think it should stay. Tarox - This card is good. As long as you use his Grandeur ability as a combat trick and not try an get greedy with it, he is a keeper. No Magus of the Scroll - It pained me to get rid of these guys, but I was just never activating them and they ended up dead before I was ever able to get them active. Epochrasite just seems better. No Akroma MD - This was moved to make room for Tarox. Akroma is only really good in certain matchups, so I put it in the SB for now.
Some things I learned - I think the deck needs to go to 26 land. I got manascrewed too often for my liking, and I really need to hit 5+ mana. I also see that not having storage lands in the deck is stupid, and I will be adding them back in. I also think that the best way to beat the Tarmogoyf decks is through out-tempo-ing them in the early game, then letting your burn reach take over. I have been trying to take the control role versus them, and I think this is a mistake. Also, I'm not impressed by Rift Bolt one bit. Way too often, it ends up being a 3 mana Volcanic Hammer, and even though it helps with getting Hellbent I'm liking them less and less.
Anyway, I'm testing for a GPT this weekend and I'm leaning on trying this:
I think this deck has much better plans against GW and Mono-U, while it strenghtens the matchup versus UB. Slivers is a bye, but the 2 Rough//Tumble are primarily for Sliver decks. Versus GW, I'm going with a much more agressive plan of going up to 4 Words of Seizing and 4 Dead//Gone to come in for 1 Tarox, 1 Vesuva, and the 3 Molten Disasters instead of trying to load up on removal. Versus Mono-U, I can up the Word of Seizing count again, plus bring in a bunch of must counter threats while building up mana for a huge Molten Disaster or two. UB is a much better matchup with me winning on either a resolved Bust or a Kickered Molten Disaster. Also, since I'm running 26 land I am bound to get mana-screwed less... I hope. It's still not there yet, but things are looking better.
i do not see how you are dominating virulent.dec, i have a 50/50 matchup against it, ussually if they drop a gemhide without burn i lose.
what do you do to make it much better?
i do not see how you are dominating virulent.dec, i have a 50/50 matchup against it, ussually if they drop a gemhide without burn i lose.
what do you do to make it much better?
1) I don't get greedy with my removal.
2) I always stay the agressor
3) My opponents don't get lucky with Frenetic Sliver
The rise of the Sliver deck, and it's ability to smash slow decks and GW Goyf because of their inability to get rid of Telekinetic Sliver, and the renewed interest in UB Teachings are the primary reasons I started working with Mono-Red to begin with.
Here's what I'll be taking to PTQ this weekend in Lubbock, TX. This has had some amazing results. It's got good matchups with just about everything. The only thing that it really has a lot of trouble with is black aggro/Korlash.
Here's what I'll be taking to PTQ this weekend in Lubbock, TX. This has had some amazing results. It's got good matchups with just about everything. The only thing that it really has a lot of trouble with is black aggro/Korlash.
Wow... I almost built this exact same deck last night but I haven't had a chance to playtest it. With Damnations/Tendrils being so dominant I thought maybe a low creature-count/burn heavy deck with Browbeat might be playable. I used Mogg War Marshal instead of Sulfur Elemental and Emberwilde Augur instead of Blood Knight but otherwise our decks are eerily similar. Good luck with it!
Wow... I almost built this exact same deck last night but I haven't had a chance to playtest it. With Damnations/Tendrils being so dominant I thought maybe a low creature-count/burn heavy deck with Browbeat might be playable. I used Mogg War Marshal instead of Sulfur Elemental and Emberwilde Augur instead of Blood Knight but otherwise our decks are eerily similar. Good luck with it!
Thanks! I was thinking the exact same thing when I was running the old gargodon/raiders version. It just wasn't cutting it for me. Too slow and clunky for my taste. So I opted for more burn. So far out of about 10-12 mws matches, I've gone undefeated. But that's not saying much considering it IS after all mws. hmm...I'll playtest the emberwild auger in place of blood knights. Just thinking about it now sounds really good.
Tendrils kills us anyway. Gargodon was the first thing I replaced when I built my new version. EVERYBODY has an answer for him now. Blue will cancel him when he comes out, black will slaughter pact him, white will temporal isolation him, and I hear all of those cards are staples. Not once in playtesting has he stuck to the board. He belongs in the side now. Especially for my low creature count, Just for that reason only he's not effective.
Thanks! I was thinking the exact same thing when I was running the old gargodon/raiders version. It just wasn't cutting it for me. Too slow and clunky for my taste. So I opted for more burn. So far out of about 10-12 mws matches, I've gone undefeated. But that's not saying much considering it IS after all mws. hmm...I'll playtest the emberwild auger in place of blood knights. Just thinking about it now sounds really good.
Tendrils kills us anyway. Gargodon was the first thing I replaced when I built my new version. EVERYBODY has an answer for him now. Blue will cancel him when he comes out, black will slaughter pact him, white will temporal isolation him, and I hear all of those cards are staples. Not once in playtesting has he stuck to the board. He belongs in the side now. Especially for my low creature count, Just for that reason only he's not effective.
My take on RDW in block after many 8man tournies online.
Block RDW has potential. All my games were very close, my mistakes cost me quite a few I could have easily won and when i played perfect I either dominated or barely lost.
The 2 damage takes care of morphs when they are tapped out early game and can return griffin guided creatures for a momentum swing.
Riddle of Lightning This has flat out stole me games and does it rather consistantly. Find a GG for 10 or Akroma for 8 at instant speed.
Molten disaster. This can act as a board clearer or uncounterable finisher, its very very nice.
Slivers? hah. Molten D and sulfous blast in SB owns them. hard.
Playing with Akrom isnt a bad idea. Even at 6 mana she is slow though. Dont play more then 3. You dont want her in an early game draw cause you wont hit 6mana unless you're flooded for quite some time.
One problem with her is by the time you get her out you're usually in deep trouble vs the current meta game. They have enough mana for some type or answer or stall. But she is worth running for the sheer fact when you finally get her flipped she can win you games and is hard to remove.
Slaughter Pact. This is our greatest enemy. Bringing GG in or even akroma is not safe but we must chance it. So many games I would have won had they not had that card in hand.
Urborg. You must side board Boom // Bust or you will lose everytime to tendrils, U/B control is the most played block deck. GG can only help for so long and you must draw him. Boom Gives you more of a chance to deal with that much lifegane.
Over all we have good match ups against most decks in the metagame.
Heres my take on specific matchups in the current metagame
Poison Sliver.deck are almost guaranteed win unless we dont draw board removal. There are some other sliver variants but this is the strongest and we still beat it most of the time.
U/X is 50/50 depends on how fast our damage is. Consistant damage we can usually finish them before they stabilize. But if our damage is slow and we approach mid-game they get too powerful and we cannot overcome them
Mono Blue pickles is another 50/50 match up like above. I could go 60/40 in our favor. If you manage to Flip akroma their only answer is to shape shift copy it to apply the legends rule. But thats not horribly bad as you want their shape shifter off the board.
We do really well against the new R/G big mana deck thats starting to get popular. We are just too fast.
G/W Goyf. This is our hardest matchup for obvious reasons. Its a fast deck with bigger creatures. But with removal and Akroma we stand a chance. Blood Knight and Sulfur Elemental help loads. We just need to get lucky that they dont get a big goyf too fast.
Sorry dont know how to do links inside deck format.
Lot of normal includes as you can see.
Lands at 23 is needed since we need to hit 5/6 mana. Plus i notice much less mana screw which is nice. Not stuck on 2 mana the entire game.
Sb. may require some explanation.
Lightning axe is great when you need 5 damage fast. Ie G/W goyf. He can get 4/5 pretty quick but axe takes care of him. Just make sure an instant is already in the GY or he'll turn into a 5/6 when axe resolves and not die.
Molten disaster is amazing. Uncounterable board clearer. Great vs slivers. Ive also used to finish off players. Last 3-5 health np.
Boom // BustWith urborg decks so popular its a must. they dont run many so if you boom 1. you should be good for the entire game. When they make all their lands swamps...tendrils hurts so much or they may be playing korlash.
there are 2 matches you did not explain, U/G shifter, and u/g goyf
in which U/G goyf, has goyf, psi blast, forms into an aggro/control deck after board if need be
when u/g shifter has spiders, they have snapback to delay ur crap, get to the lock preety dam quick, and also has treefolk for ur spiders, i think that rdw against these 2 decks are 30/70 in their favor
thoughts?
I did well against both because they seem to not play as many counters.
U/G shifter is much easier match then U/G gyof.
Shifter just use all removal on their morphs. SB in sulf blast and molten D.
U/G gyof is beatable just like W/G gyof. Depends on how quick they get a huge gyof out, otherwise sulf blast / molten D will clear all their gyofs and calls.
Wow, it has been a while since I have even seen or touched a Magic card. I think it was at a GPT I went to during July and it is now August.
Anyways, I am not sure what to play. The problem is I have to buy all the cards this weekend to have my deck ready by Grand Prix San Fran. (Even though it is in San Jose..how stupid is that.) So I thought "I like Red..I like Aggro for long tournaments because there is less thinking, and I need to fix this RDW craving I have been having" on top of all that..the deck is cheap to build which is perfect for me since I still have to pay for my schooling.
So recently I have been talking to a few friends on line and I was directed to the following lists:
I do not like 4 Keldon Megaliths. I never have and I don't think I ever will. The main thing I like about this deck is the Riddle of Lightning. It is the type of card I have been waiting for in a RDW/MRA type deck for an "oops I win" card. The problem with this deck to me is, it's slow. At least it looks really slow on paper.
This deck looks a lot faster than the first deck. My only problem with it is that Dead/Gone is not at 4. Last time I played with Dead/Gone it was always at 4. I highly doubt this has changed in a month and a few odd weeks. Second, I have never liked Browbeat, EVER! It generally never does what you want it to do.
Although this deck came in 1st as well. However, from the looks of it this deck actually stood a chance unlike the first deck in the T8.
So if you were me, which deck would you suggest playing? Or do you have a 'better build' I should play or maybe bette card choices for the meta game I haven't seen yet. I really feel that RDW/MRA needs to be really fined tuned in order to win this Grand Prix (Let alone stand a fighting chance.) Any help to my mindless rants would be very helpful considering I have no time at all for anything Magic related except for this small post on "What I should play for GP:SF."
Is there any reason why this deck shouldn't slash green for Tarmogoyf? It's easy to make the mana work, and it gives the deck some interesting sideboard options (Scryb Ranger or Riftsweeper in the side for the Pickles Matchup seems reasonable). I'm thinking of something along these lines:
Jaya Ballard hasn't seen a lot of play recently, but it seems like it should be really good in this metagame. It's a *** effect against G/W (and Temp Iso doesn't stop it), it can kill lots of guys if it isn't stopped, and the Pyroblast ability is very nice in a metagame dominated by Mono-Blue Pickles and various other U/x decks.
I don't like the green splash, I tried it for a 1-3 scrub 2 weeks ago.
The deck itself is pretty bad for the current metagame anyway, my friend 1-2'd with a build of mine Saturday.
But if you are going to play it, I would suggest against 4 gargadons and war marshals because of all the bounce going around. Sure, it blanks Tendrils...which is not played anymore in block.
Has anyone played the deck billy moreno piloted a few months back in which he played RDW and urborg for korlash
I played this deck in a few(yes in kno that only 7 games doesn't constitute good) but its really good to strip mine a U/B teachings urborg then i also sided 4 tendrils for sb against aggro
Thoughts???
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hmmm. it really depends. agaisnt zoo version i keep them in. mainly because they dont run thrill of the hunt. against straight up greenwhite i take them out since thrill basically nullifies ur molten most of the time and also g/w runs 4x griffin guide, 4x serra avenger and of course mystic enforcers which cant be hurt by molten
It's not Mystic Enforcer's protection, but its flying (as long as they have threshold) that protects it from Molten Disaster.
4x Magus of the Scroll
4x Mogg War Marshall
1x Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
4x Gathan Riders
3x Akroma, Angel of Fury
3x Greater Gargadon
4x Rift Bolt
4x Fiery Temper
3x Molten Disaster
2x Word of Seizing
12x Mountain
4x Vesuva
4x Keldon Megaliths
4x Zoetic Caverns
1x Pendelhaven
1x Kher Keep
2x Urza's Factory
4x Dead//Gone
3x Fortune Theif
2x Word of Seizing
1x Molten Disaster
1x Greater Gargardon
1x Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
1x Bogardan Hellkite
2x Sudden Shock
For those that care, it's Sullivan's deck with -3 Disintegrate, -3 Thunderblade Charge, -1 Jaya Ballard, -2 Fungal Reaches, +3 Greater Gargadon, +3 Molten Disaster, +2 Word of Seizing, +1 Urza's Factory. The SB is -4 Browbeat, -1 Molten Disaster, -1 Word of Seizing, +2 Fortune Theif, +1 Greater Gargadon, +1 Bogardan Hellkite, +2 Sudden Shock
I'm thinking of dumping the Fortune Theives for more Sudden Shocks and another Jaya so that my post board arrangement is +4 Dead//Gone, +4 Sudden Shock, +1 Molten Disaster, +2 Jaya Ballard, -3 Greater Gargadon, -2 Word of Seizing, -3 Akroma, -1 Mogg War Marshall, -2 Vesuva versus UG Shifter, since all I really want to do is kill as many creatures as possible on their side and pack away with damage while not getting ruined by Vesuvan Shapeshifter.
Any suggestions? I'm really only concerned about the UG Shifter matchup, but any comments or suggestions are welcome.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
I don’t believe RAkroma will help against UG, since it takes a lot to get RAkroma and tapping out is the worst thing to do against Pickles lock. Plus, they have decent agro defenses with Wall of Roots and Thelonite Hermit. Dead/Gone is a superb answer against morphs and should be maindecked anyways since Gone is also solid removal.
How has Molten Disaster worked for you? It seems hard to be able to build up enough mana to make it worthwhile. Sudden Shock seems like a better candidate for you since you want to get rid of morphs.
- Natsume
I actually cut a land from Sullivan's build if you can beleive that. The CIP tapped lands are only a slight nuisance, but Vesuva is key to fighting Urborg (and hence Tendrils and Korlash). Also, this deck is very mana hungry, and I'm rarely 'flooded' since there is always stuff to do with the mana, and the deck plays out more like control than anything. Zoetic Caverns is there as more of a guessing game for the morphs (letting them guess as to whether it is a Zoetic Cavern, Gathan Riders, or Akroma), but they also double as mana fueling large Molten Disasters, Word of Seizing, and flipping Akroma.
If I did anything with the manabase, it would be to go to something like 24-25 land and run 4 Coalition Relic and some number of Prismatic Lens, especially since Bust scares me a little bit (unless I have Gargadon suspended).
I agree that the right thing to do versus UG would be to side out Akromas. As for Dead//Gone main, I've considered moving them there to replace Fiery Temper but everytime I think about it, I always end up with Temper in the main and Dead//Gone in the side. I might make this change soon.
Moving Molten Disaster to the maindeck was the best move I've made. I always found myself boarding them in verus both control and aggro, and running as many mana sources as this deck does, it is not uncommon to ramp up to a 7-9 point Disaster FTW. It is also been key for me in gaining some ground in the UG matchup.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
- Natsume
4x Greater Gargadon
4x Mogg Warshall
4x Keldon Marauders
3x Epochrasite
3x Gathan Riders
4x Tarox Bladewing
4x Rift Bolt
4x Fiery Temper
2x Word of Seizing
3x Molten Disaster
4x Zoetic Caverns
4x Keldon Megaliths
2x Vesuva
1x Pendelhaven
1x Kher Keep
1x Urza's Factory
12x Mountain
2x Word of Seizing
1x Molten Disaster
4x Dead//Gone
3x Rough//Tumble
3x Sudden Shock
2x Akroma, Angel of Fury
I lost to Mono-U Pickles, which was an almost impossible matchup when I tested, but I've learned more on how to beat (which didn't help at the time), I beat UG Aggro, I smashed Virulent Slivers, and I almost beat GW Tarmogoyf (I think I SB wrong for this matchup). As for some of the changes:
Epochrasite - This was surprisingly good in testing, and ended up sucking the whole tournament. Versus pickles, I got one stuck RFG while Teferi was in play (along with a Gargadon and a Delayed Tarox), and I boarded it out a lot. I may try it again, but for now I don't think it should stay.
Tarox - This card is good. As long as you use his Grandeur ability as a combat trick and not try an get greedy with it, he is a keeper.
No Magus of the Scroll - It pained me to get rid of these guys, but I was just never activating them and they ended up dead before I was ever able to get them active. Epochrasite just seems better.
No Akroma MD - This was moved to make room for Tarox. Akroma is only really good in certain matchups, so I put it in the SB for now.
Some things I learned - I think the deck needs to go to 26 land. I got manascrewed too often for my liking, and I really need to hit 5+ mana. I also see that not having storage lands in the deck is stupid, and I will be adding them back in. I also think that the best way to beat the Tarmogoyf decks is through out-tempo-ing them in the early game, then letting your burn reach take over. I have been trying to take the control role versus them, and I think this is a mistake. Also, I'm not impressed by Rift Bolt one bit. Way too often, it ends up being a 3 mana Volcanic Hammer, and even though it helps with getting Hellbent I'm liking them less and less.
Anyway, I'm testing for a GPT this weekend and I'm leaning on trying this:
4x Greater Gargardon
4x Mogg War Marshall
4x Keldon Marauders
4x Gathan Riders
4x Tarox Bladewing
4x Rift Bolt
4x Fiery Temper
3x Molten Disaster
3x Word of Seizing
4x Zoetic Caverns
4x Keldon Megaliths
2x Vesuva
3x Fungal Reach
1x Kher Keep
1x Pendelhaven
11x Mountain
1x Word of Seizing
1x Molten Disaster
2x Rough//Tumble
4x Dead//Gone
4x Avalanche Riders
1x Vesuva
2x Boom//Bust
I think this deck has much better plans against GW and Mono-U, while it strenghtens the matchup versus UB. Slivers is a bye, but the 2 Rough//Tumble are primarily for Sliver decks. Versus GW, I'm going with a much more agressive plan of going up to 4 Words of Seizing and 4 Dead//Gone to come in for 1 Tarox, 1 Vesuva, and the 3 Molten Disasters instead of trying to load up on removal. Versus Mono-U, I can up the Word of Seizing count again, plus bring in a bunch of must counter threats while building up mana for a huge Molten Disaster or two. UB is a much better matchup with me winning on either a resolved Bust or a Kickered Molten Disaster. Also, since I'm running 26 land I am bound to get mana-screwed less... I hope. It's still not there yet, but things are looking better.
Comments?
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
what do you do to make it much better?
1) I don't get greedy with my removal.
2) I always stay the agressor
3) My opponents don't get lucky with Frenetic Sliver
The rise of the Sliver deck, and it's ability to smash slow decks and GW Goyf because of their inability to get rid of Telekinetic Sliver, and the renewed interest in UB Teachings are the primary reasons I started working with Mono-Red to begin with.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
2 Molten Slagheap
1 Fungal Reaches
1 Keldon Megoliths
4 Blood Knight
4 Sulfur Elemental
4 Dead//Gone
4 Rift Bolt
4 Disintegrate
4 Browbeat
3 Fiery Temper
3 Word of Seizing
3 Molten Disaster
Wish me luck! I'm gonna go tear it up!
Wow... I almost built this exact same deck last night but I haven't had a chance to playtest it. With Damnations/Tendrils being so dominant I thought maybe a low creature-count/burn heavy deck with Browbeat might be playable. I used Mogg War Marshal instead of Sulfur Elemental and Emberwilde Augur instead of Blood Knight but otherwise our decks are eerily similar. Good luck with it!
Thanks! I was thinking the exact same thing when I was running the old gargodon/raiders version. It just wasn't cutting it for me. Too slow and clunky for my taste. So I opted for more burn. So far out of about 10-12 mws matches, I've gone undefeated. But that's not saying much considering it IS after all mws. hmm...I'll playtest the emberwild auger in place of blood knights. Just thinking about it now sounds really good.
Tendrils kills us anyway. Gargodon was the first thing I replaced when I built my new version. EVERYBODY has an answer for him now. Blue will cancel him when he comes out, black will slaughter pact him, white will temporal isolation him, and I hear all of those cards are staples. Not once in playtesting has he stuck to the board. He belongs in the side now. Especially for my low creature count, Just for that reason only he's not effective.
Here's how the SB is going.
1 Molten Disaster
3 Avalanche Riders
3 Greater Gargodon
3 Cryoclasm
4 ?
I just don't know what else to throw in.
other than the fact that if u bring that sideboard to an block torny ur gonna get dqed
t2 RDW must have gotten mixed up with the block one.
Block RDW has potential. All my games were very close, my mistakes cost me quite a few I could have easily won and when i played perfect I either dominated or barely lost.
You must main deck x4 Dead // Gone
The 2 damage takes care of morphs when they are tapped out early game and can return griffin guided creatures for a momentum swing.
Riddle of Lightning This has flat out stole me games and does it rather consistantly. Find a GG for 10 or Akroma for 8 at instant speed.
Molten disaster. This can act as a board clearer or uncounterable finisher, its very very nice.
Slivers? hah. Molten D and sulfous blast in SB owns them. hard.
Playing with Akrom isnt a bad idea. Even at 6 mana she is slow though. Dont play more then 3. You dont want her in an early game draw cause you wont hit 6mana unless you're flooded for quite some time.
One problem with her is by the time you get her out you're usually in deep trouble vs the current meta game. They have enough mana for some type or answer or stall. But she is worth running for the sheer fact when you finally get her flipped she can win you games and is hard to remove.
Slaughter Pact. This is our greatest enemy. Bringing GG in or even akroma is not safe but we must chance it. So many games I would have won had they not had that card in hand.
Urborg. You must side board Boom // Bust or you will lose everytime to tendrils, U/B control is the most played block deck. GG can only help for so long and you must draw him. Boom Gives you more of a chance to deal with that much lifegane.
Over all we have good match ups against most decks in the metagame.
Heres my take on specific matchups in the current metagame
Poison Sliver.deck are almost guaranteed win unless we dont draw board removal. There are some other sliver variants but this is the strongest and we still beat it most of the time.
U/X is 50/50 depends on how fast our damage is. Consistant damage we can usually finish them before they stabilize. But if our damage is slow and we approach mid-game they get too powerful and we cannot overcome them
Mono Blue pickles is another 50/50 match up like above. I could go 60/40 in our favor. If you manage to Flip akroma their only answer is to shape shift copy it to apply the legends rule. But thats not horribly bad as you want their shape shifter off the board.
We do really well against the new R/G big mana deck thats starting to get popular. We are just too fast.
G/W Goyf. This is our hardest matchup for obvious reasons. Its a fast deck with bigger creatures. But with removal and Akroma we stand a chance.
Blood Knight and Sulfur Elemental help loads. We just need to get lucky that they dont get a big goyf too fast.
Now to my list:
Sorry dont know how to do links inside deck format.
Lot of normal includes as you can see.
Lands at 23 is needed since we need to hit 5/6 mana. Plus i notice much less mana screw which is nice. Not stuck on 2 mana the entire game.
Sb. may require some explanation.
Lightning axe is great when you need 5 damage fast. Ie G/W goyf. He can get 4/5 pretty quick but axe takes care of him. Just make sure an instant is already in the GY or he'll turn into a 5/6 when axe resolves and not die.
Molten disaster is amazing. Uncounterable board clearer. Great vs slivers. Ive also used to finish off players. Last 3-5 health np.
Boom // BustWith urborg decks so popular its a must. they dont run many so if you boom 1. you should be good for the entire game. When they make all their lands swamps...tendrils hurts so much or they may be playing korlash.
Sulfurous Blast Another answer to slivers.
Aether membrane: This is great vs G/W goyf. stops all their stuff + griff guide. Just pray they dont draw an temp iso or have already used it.
Ive considered Magus of the moon In the sb to deal with U/B but hes too easily removed to make an impact.
Well folks thats my take on RDW in the current metagame, ive done a lot of testing in tournaments online. It Can win, just play smart.
I did well against both because they seem to not play as many counters.
U/G shifter is much easier match then U/G gyof.
Shifter just use all removal on their morphs. SB in sulf blast and molten D.
U/G gyof is beatable just like W/G gyof. Depends on how quick they get a huge gyof out, otherwise sulf blast / molten D will clear all their gyofs and calls.
Wow, it has been a while since I have even seen or touched a Magic card. I think it was at a GPT I went to during July and it is now August.
Anyways, I am not sure what to play. The problem is I have to buy all the cards this weekend to have my deck ready by Grand Prix San Fran. (Even though it is in San Jose..how stupid is that.) So I thought "I like Red..I like Aggro for long tournaments because there is less thinking, and I need to fix this RDW craving I have been having" on top of all that..the deck is cheap to build which is perfect for me since I still have to pay for my schooling.
So recently I have been talking to a few friends on line and I was directed to the following lists:
16 Mountain
4 Keldon Megaliths
4 Zoetic Cavern
2 Pendelhaven
// Creatures
4 Greater Gargadon
4 Magus of the Scroll
4 Mogg War Marshal
4 Blood Knight
3 Akroma, Angel of Fury
3 Gathan Raiders
4 Dead / Gone
4 Fiery Temper
4 Riddle of Lightning
4 Keldon Marauders
4 Avalanche Riders
3 Fortune Thief
3 Rough / Tumble
1 Akroma, Angel of Fury
Although the deck did come in 1st place in a T8 that had the following decks:
* #2 UB Controll — Svante Riksberg
* #3 Red Deck Wins — Erik Gröndahl
* #4 Pickles — Per Nyström
* #5 Pickles — Jonathan Bergström
* #6 Pickles — Benny Torstensson
* #7 UG Goyf — Anders Moden
* #8 UG Goyf — Mattias Agerberg
This has to say something considering from what I read so far on line that this whole T8 should have given Niklas problems and most likely shouldn't have won.
The second deck that was brought to me was:
19 Mountain
3 Gemstone Caverns
2 Keldon Marauders
2 Pendelhaven
2 Keldon Megaliths
// Creatures
4 Blood Knight
4 Mogg War Marshal
4 Greater Gargadon
4 Sulfur Elemental
4 Magus of the Scroll
4 Disintegrate
4 Rift Bolt
3 Dead / Gone
2 Browbeat
4 Avalanche Riders
3 Wildfire Emissary
3 Word of Seizing
2 Keldon Marauders
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Dead / Gone
1 Molten Disaster
Although this deck came in 1st as well. However, from the looks of it this deck actually stood a chance unlike the first deck in the T8.
Here is this decks T8:
* #2 WW — Tilman Steffens
* #3 U/B/w — Tim Köhler
* #4 WW — Matthias Klein
* #5 Korlash Control — Rouven Hohlstein
* #6 Relic Control — Björn Schumann
* #7 G/W Aggro — Xhemil Baruti
* #8 G/W Aggro — Vincent Audejean
With all that said and done, I am still looking for a RDW/MRA deck to play. I am still looking for articles on SCG/MTG for some insight so I don't go completely blind into the Grand Prix. The only real testing I will be able to do is the night before the Grand Prix.
So if you were me, which deck would you suggest playing? Or do you have a 'better build' I should play or maybe bette card choices for the meta game I haven't seen yet. I really feel that RDW/MRA needs to be really fined tuned in order to win this Grand Prix (Let alone stand a fighting chance.) Any help to my mindless rants would be very helpful considering I have no time at all for anything Magic related except for this small post on "What I should play for GP:SF."
Thanks again, and make it happen!
4 Terramorphic Expanse
3 Forest
3 Zoetic Cavern
3 Fungal Reaches
2 Llanowar Reborn
1 Pendelhaven
1 Keldon Megaliths
4 Dead/Gone
4 Fiery Temper
4 Riddle of Lightning
3 Disintegrate
4 Greater Gargadon
3 Mogg War Marshal
3 Gathan Raiders
3 Akroma, Angel of Fury
2 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
4 Riftsweeper
4 Avalanche Riders
3 Ancient Grudge
2 Molten Disaster
2 Word of Seizing
Jaya Ballard hasn't seen a lot of play recently, but it seems like it should be really good in this metagame. It's a *** effect against G/W (and Temp Iso doesn't stop it), it can kill lots of guys if it isn't stopped, and the Pyroblast ability is very nice in a metagame dominated by Mono-Blue Pickles and various other U/x decks.
Thanks to Avatar for the rockin' Sig and Avvy!
The deck itself is pretty bad for the current metagame anyway, my friend 1-2'd with a build of mine Saturday.
But if you are going to play it, I would suggest against 4 gargadons and war marshals because of all the bounce going around. Sure, it blanks Tendrils...which is not played anymore in block.
I played this deck in a few(yes in kno that only 7 games doesn't constitute good) but its really good to strip mine a U/B teachings urborg then i also sided 4 tendrils for sb against aggro
Thoughts???
Cockatrice User ID: Jayce, The Mind Sculptor