I think sulfur elemental is a must, it is an uncounterable threat and it hoses WW, furtune thief rules vs aggro without removal too. there is an ocficial threat about mono red aggro, you may want to look over there.
Try this build out.. If you dont like it, then scrap it. Its very similar to decks being posted on this website. I like Akroma for the deck becuase if you resolve her, you pretty much win the game vs. anything.
[card=Dismal Failure]"Two magi could trade spells all day and never crown a victor.
The real battle is not one of power but of will.
If your confidence breaks, so too shall you." —Venser[/card]
Darkon: i think the best one should be the half way of both decks you told. I don't know why you have Detritivore on side without a land destruction card. Why is that?
Alamoth: I don't think must have storage lands since it will consume "tempo" that is needed for this kind of deck, aggro. The idea is hitting hard and always.
thanks guys i might try akroma it i stall out later game and go into top deck mode and topdecking her would like win me the game by far
i dont know how to do deck tags somebody show me how to due them
Please don't double-post. Also, there is a full explanation of the use of deck tags in the rules thread stickied in each section of Block Constructed. -Feuerdrache
4 dead/gone
4 brute force
4 rift bolt
4 disintegrate
4 terramorphic expanse
20 mountain
needless to say this thing hoses anything running white (particularly the weenie) Dead/Gone stops anything small and helps slip in the last few points of damage by throwing anything too big to handle back to the opponents hand. I couldn't find any room for sudden shock in this one (disintegrate and dead/gone are just so much more versatile).
Now let's i say why i have to disagree with you. I don't think Dead // Gone is a versatile version of Sudden Shock, and the main reason is: Target. Dead gone is only good when you're facing a strong aggro deck.
Now figure out, what is the deck housing tables around? Answer is: Control Teferi, there is no deck to match him. You ask me why? Because it acts in your turn, and leaves its mana open all time, so everything you cast will be bounced, countered or killed, 'til Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir and Bogardan Hellkite hits table, then the game is over for your disintegrate and friends.
Direct damage (on this occasion) is far better then a creature bouncer, since there is gonna be no creature to kill, and if foe is stuck with bouncing, you can hit him with direct damage, its gonna be your only chance.
In this case, Sudden Shock is far better than Dead // Gone. Sudden Shock is a 1R cost = to Dead, and more versatile in damage because it has Split Second wich don't let him be countered and do direct damage; and Gone is a too expensive bouncing (3R!!!!!), anyway i rather go with Sudden Shock than Dead // Gone, but its a matter of choice.
I can't see White Winnie, MRA or Scrybforce being any threat to Teferi, but at least, it needs to be the best. In your place i'd choose Sudden Shock, but Dead / Gone works too.
In a deck meanted to be fast, having no first drop will let you behind in the creatures advance; you're first turn is gonna be just a land drop and Magus of the Scroll can do direct damage with is always good. Imagine it as a Scorched Rusalka a little more expensive.
I see no problem in placing Akroma, Angel of Fury in place of Bogardan Hellkite, but usually Bogardan 5 damage when is put in play and flash ability is enough to finish (besides leave you mana open to disintegrate foes in your next turn).
As well as changing Keldon Marauders for Jaya Ballard, Task Mage. Keldon Marauders attacks just 1 turn than dies, and since it has no trample, if blocked by a 1/1 javalineers with no javalin, does no damage and dies ( besides its put in/put out ability), being behind again in the creature rush. I just think that direct damage is the way, like have a stuck Blood Knight late game, discard him for 3 or even more damage. Anyway, i think its a respectful replacement.
Wilfire Emissary is a subpar creature, It's a 3R 2/4 creature, and needs next turn 2RR just to get 4/4.
Well, that's what i think, but everyone plays in a certain way, so play do way you feel more confortable and secure; that was just tips of my view.
I'm not entirely certain if I should take a posting with this many errors seriously, but I'll point them out just to be informative.
1. It seems his deck is tuned to beating WW, which I'd think it does thorougly. Did you take this into account when you critized Dead/Gone?
2. Gone costs 2R. Putting no less than five exlamation marks behind something should warrant double checking it.
3. White Weenie has a decent matchup vs. the Teferi Control decks, but it depends on the version. The ones with 3-4 Tendrils of Despair tend to win, but has problems with the mirror. Results in the online PEs has shown this time, and time again.
4. ScrybForce doesn't really exist in TSP Block constructed anymore. I no longer see versions of GR that play Scryb Ranger all that much. Most have cut them all together. The GR decks that still are present have a decent matchup vs. control and the GRu versions roll over control. It's the best matchup for them.
5. Mono Red has had a good matchup vs. control all through it's existence hardly dependent on format. It's the same here. To some degree it depends on the version of control, but Mono Red has an edge over any version. It's just too fast for the Control Decks to beat consistently without tuning it quite a bit, which makes is much worse in the mirror.
7. Keldon Maurauders does 5 damage to control, and most of the time versus other creatures as well. Do anyone want to block it or kill it and still take 2 damage? It's main problem is Wall of Roots. Still, all mono red decks play it, and most RW aggro as well, and for a good reason.
8. I'm prone to agree that Wildfire Emissary has it's problems (but surely not more than 4 Akromas? I'd think they'd slow you down way too often to warrant 4 in a deck with now mana accelleration.), but in a deck that seems ready to battle WW I can understand the choice. Oh, and Wildfire Emissary is another creature that has proven it's worth in several formats since it was first introduced in Mirage.
That comments seems lack of pratice, but ok, let's go:
1- Can you take seriously a deck created just to face one kind of deck in a competitve enviroment?
2- Ok, i've written wrong the cost, anyway it's costy for what it does, besides i don't believe in a fast damage deck using Gone, i'm certain that Sudden Shock is more versatile in any occasion than Dead // Gone.
3- I think MWA can't think about to win a U/R Teferi Control, MAYBE U/B or U/B/r, but still i don't believe. Damnation, Sudden Death besides counter and bouncings are just enough to keep MRA quiet.
5- Completly don't agree. This talk about too fast is just talk. Sudden Shock, Snapback, Lightning Axe, Cancel are all fast cards with low cost that can keep all this Red card shutted up 'til big threats comes in. And better, all in your turn.
6- Maybe you had difficult understanding, but i was just comparing.
7- I didn't tell this card is not good, i just said i rather direct damage. But as i said its a respectful choice.
8- Again one deck match up card, that within a tournament (we are in competitive forum) is not enough to deserve a place.
So, i see no point in your talking. But certainly you have the right to think that way.
I don't see the point in arguing. One thing is our differences of opinion but when it comes to the matchups for MRA vs control and wether or not Scryb Ranger is actually in the decks running Spectral Force these days is pure statistics. It's not my opinion.
As for not agreeing on my opinions; I think we'll just have to agree to disagree.
Edit: Reread your previous post. Didn't read your comment on Scorched Rusalka properly. Sorry about that one.
2- Ok, i've written wrong the cost, anyway it's costy for what it does, besides i don't believe in a fast damage deck using Gone, i'm certain that Sudden Shock is more versatile in any occasion than Dead // Gone.
Sudden Shock doesn't even make a Dragon flinch - much less an Elephant. How you can consider it more versatile is beyond me. I think, perhaps, you're overestimating the countering ability of the Teferi decks.
3- I think MWA can't think about to win a U/R Teferi Control, MAYBE U/B or U/B/r, but still i don't believe. Damnation, Sudden Death besides counter and bouncings are just enough to keep MRA quiet.
I'll be honest. That comment seems to show a lack of practice to me.
Er...? Just because there's a thread for it doesn't mean it's showing up in tournaments with any regularity.
Tussius, of all users on here, is an expert on the MTGO events. His blog is dedicated to them. If he says they don't really show up any more he's more than likely correct.
5- Completly don't agree. This talk about too fast is just talk. Sudden Shock, Snapback, Lightning Axe, Cancel are all fast cards with low cost that can keep all this Red card shutted up 'til big threats comes in. And better, all in your turn.
Sudden Shock isn't run in any control builds because it's just a damn Shock; Snapback is actually a decent spell but it only bounces the creature (still effective, though); Lightning Axe is huge card disadvantage, which is something control really doesn't want; Cancel is only relevant on your third or fourth turn (if you're the RDW guy), and that's assuming that they've got double blue by then - not a guarantee.
So, i see no point in your talking. But certainly you have the right to think that way.
It's possible that this may just be a language deficiency, but as a native English speaker and moderator of these forums, I'm going to make sure you're aware that this comment was very rude.
Tussius: i don't play in MTGO so i can't say anything about there, i just play by Magic Workstation and around here. the Match up MRA x Control is indeed an statistic, can't see any game of MRA x Control (except the bad builds, but you can't count that) being won by MRA. About Scryb i ment MGA, but anyway you see them pretty much around yet, but even the timberware, groundbraker and friends build, i never see them won a game vs U/R Control. So i can't state they have a chance, besides bad luck.
First of all, he didn't create it *just* to beat White Weenie. If he wanted to make a deck like that, he'd have made Black-based control.
WW is a very common deck in today's meta, and it's quite fair to tune your deck towards beating it. In fact, it's probably a good idea to do so.
Really, in a constructed block deck tournament, would you create a deck to face an specific kind of deck and expect to win it? No more comments.
Sudden Shock doesn't even make a Dragon flinch - much less an Elephant. How you can consider it more versatile is beyond me. I think, perhaps, you're overestimating the countering ability of the Teferi decks.
I'll be honest. That comment seems to show a lack of practice to me.
Really? What you expect to bounce against control? or creature to do 2 points of damage? You cannot even hit foes. But you can do that with Sudden Shock, even do 2 damage to creature and even can't be countered. If foes has 2 life left, do you expect to have Sudden Shock or Dead // Gone? Lets see WW cards: Soltari Priest (can't be hit), Knight of the Holy Nimbus (regenerate or just cast in turn 3 to kill a turn 2 card), later cards, being the reason for this bounce, Calciderm (can´t be targeted). So if this deck is made for WW, why have a card that can't destroy half of their deck's creature cards?
Maybe its my lack of pratice...;)
Er...? Just because there's a thread for it doesn't mean it's showing up in tournaments with any regularity.
Tussius, of all users on here, is an expert on the MTGO events. His blog is dedicated to them. If he says they don't really show up any more he's more than likely correct.
Well in live tournaments here, there a plenty number of them, with or without Scryb. High tournament levels will show who's right.
Sudden Shock isn't run in any control builds because it's just a damn Shock; Snapback is actually a decent spell but it only bounces the creature (still effective, though); Lightning Axe is huge card disadvantage, which is something control really doesn't want; Cancel is only relevant on your third or fourth turn (if you're the RDW guy), and that's assuming that they've got double blue by then - not a guarantee.
you didn't face a Shock in a control build? Man, i faced these cards in control more than a 50 times. And just to tell you that a well balanced control deck can handle this card disadvantage very well, Blue is the cantrip color: Ancestral Vision, Think Twice and Careful Consideration all in your turn. You can even Bewilder a Keldon Marauder cause he's gonna die next turn, and buy a card . (Before you take me serious, i'm just kidding about this card.)
You got him there, I guess.
You missed his point. He's saying that Keldon Marauders acts like a burn spell.
You got me here, it really does. Anyway Jaya is very useful through my tests, i've tested Keldon Marauder and they really do well, but as well as do Jaya.
See my earlier point about you underestimating the value of tuning to beat White.
I just CAN'T agree with you in a competitive term.
It's possible that this may just be a language deficiency, but as a native English speaker and moderator of these forums, I'm going to make sure you're aware that this comment was very rude.
Maybe i'm not a native speaker, but lived in US for 2 years, so I can guarantee you that i don't see any harsh comment, i just said that i see no point in his statements, simply for the reasons i already stated.
it crushes reanimator it beats white weenie it beats the blue white control
it beats mono blue it fairs with green and my deck is going to be ridiculous after future sight because the new land and the two or three new burn spells and i may try dead and gone and who ever sent me that warning i did not post twice on this so yea please dont do that when i dont i hate that because i have got several warnings like that where i didnt even do it and its really unfair if my account gets banned for stuff i dont do
Really, in a constructed block deck tournament, would you create a deck to face an specific kind of deck and expect to win it? No more comments.
Yes more comments. OF FREAKIN COURSE MAN! That is traditionally called 'the metagame philosophy.' It is ironic they reprinted the Whirling Dervish card because around the time it was first printed most magic players said, 'Eeew... what an aweful card. Who would ever play it?' That is until the emergence of a deck that played it... tuned to beat the mono-Black archtype deck of its time. And of course won!
So your assumption is incorrect. There are those that play decks built solely to beat a specific type of deck that exists. Since this format is dominated mostly by net-deck fools that copy paste and build decks. Expect to run into white weenie, Dralnu / X , then meta-gamed decks built to beat those two decks! Hmmm... sounds like a job for RED DECK WINS?
Hmmm... Hard to argue with a 5-0 but doesn't 24 lands seem a bit much?
I mean I could see running more lands then I do (I've considered adding a couple more myself) but 24?
Are you "sure" about that or is the list still fairly unknown?
Actually, with two days of swiss ahead of you I'd be more than happy with 24 lands. I've yet to play a single TSP Block deck with less than 24 lands. I meet people who say "23 lands is supposed to be enough!" so often, and I know, from testing, experience, my own and others, that it almost never is enough. Even my RGu deck with 4 wall of roots, 4 mwonvuli and 4 search play 24 lands.
As for the discussions I've had over WW and mono Red (and other decks). I just have to say to all those who've disagreed:
Told you so.
My "no ww in the top 8 in yoko" is about to come true.
MRA is strong and has a good matchup vs. control is proven true even at the pro level. You can't argue that they have sub par builds or play poorly.
Oh, and Wildfire Emissary is a good card. Tada!
However, to all that have said to me: "Browbeat is good" or "Browbeat is a force!" You got me!
You can all just message me with "told you so". It's okay. I've deserved it. Apparently Browbeat is better than I'd have thought.
Yeah i was wondering about that too, i watched it on magicthegathering.com and all they did was layout Levy's deck on the table and he explained it too us. They didn't explain all of the cards so i could only gather the cards that he placed from the table and they were hard to see. They said that he was running 18 creatures and 18 spells, so that leaves 24 land, and from what i counted, it added up. The only reasoning I could come up with is to build up for a big disintegrate? I would probaly only use 22 land at max with Molten Slagheap for a big disintegrate.
And i've tested the Browbeat, and it's one of the best cards in this deck, only for block though. If u play it 3rd-5th turn they are automatically going to take the 5 damage rather than risk you drawing 3 more burn to kill them with. And if they're on 5 or less, 3 cards lets you draw more burn and finish them off. So..Browbeat is nuts, it's 3 mana for 5 damage.
I'll have test it further, so what do you suppose the unknown cards are? I was thinking maybe lightning axe? Seems suitable for the deck and it kills that pesky Wall of Roots.
Actually, with two days of swiss ahead of you I'd be more than happy with 24 lands. I've yet to play a single TSP Block deck with less than 24 lands. I meet people who say "23 lands is supposed to be enough!" so often, and I know, from testing, experience, my own and others, that it almost never is enough. Even my RGu deck with 4 wall of roots, 4 mwonvuli and 4 search play 24 lands.
I'm not sure what you mean by not enough. Do you have a use for all that mana? I only run twenty and by about turn four/five/six I've mostly cleared my hand (faster with jaya). I would consider more lands but only to lessen the number of mulls due to lack of lands in my openers. That is useful for a long tourney but at the same time 24 leaves you in danger of floods (I'd rather have too few lands and a good hand then too many and nothing to play)... Anyhow...
I would argue that a card being good or not depends on the meta...
I'm not sure a 2/4 for four is all that hot vs U/x control... Is it? (It very well might be I'm asking)
However, to all that have said to me: "Browbeat is good" or "Browbeat is a force!" You got me!
You can all just message me with "told you so". It's okay. I've deserved it. Apparently Browbeat is better than I'd have thought.
I would also ask why you say this? Browbeat was no better/worse yesterday then it is today (unless this tourney shifts things in a way that could cause it to be more/less relivent). If you felt some way about it and had a sound reasoning for why then you shouldn't neccissarily flip over like that. Just because some people playing in a tourney are doing well with it doesn't change how good/bad the card was. "Pros" are players like you and me.
Take everything with a grain of salt (especially things like these).
~Nim
Browbeat has proven it's worth, which is something I never thought it would do. It doesn't mean I'll trade for 4 Browbeats now, but that's mostly because I'm not a control player.
As for playing 20-22 lands. You'll mulligan often, and you'll stop at 2-3 lands quite often. This will keep you from utilizing disintegrate to it's fullest.
The probabilities for running low on lands with less than 24 are just too high.
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my have/wants list: :http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=95773
Repost first:
4 Blood Night
4 Sulfur Elemental
4 Mogg War Marshal
3 Magus of the Scroll
4 Suq'Ata Lancer
2 Greater Gargadon
4 Rift Bolt
4 Sudden Shock
4 Disentegrate
4 Brute Force
21 Mountains
4 Blood Knight
4 Sulfur Elemental
4 Suq'Ata Lancer
3 Magus of the Scroll
3 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
2 Akroma, Angel of Fury
Spells (20):
4 Sudden Shock
4 Rift Bolt
4 Fiery Temper
3 Disintegrate
3 Brute Force
2 Conflagrate
16 Mountain
4 Desert
4 Blazing Blade Askari
4 Word of Seizing
3 Detritivore
2 Fortune Thief
1 Reiterate
Try this build out.. If you dont like it, then scrap it. Its very similar to decks being posted on this website. I like Akroma for the deck becuase if you resolve her, you pretty much win the game vs. anything.
:symr::symu: Reality Bites
:symr::symu: Delver Cyclops
:symr::symu: Niv Control EDH
:symg::symw: Sigarda EDH
The real battle is not one of power but of will.
If your confidence breaks, so too shall you."
—Venser[/card]
** DigitalLogic on MTGO **
Alamoth: I don't think must have storage lands since it will consume "tempo" that is needed for this kind of deck, aggro. The idea is hitting hard and always.
Here is my deck:
18 Mountain
04 Desert
CREATURES (18)
4 Magus of the Scroll
4 Blood Knight
4 Sulfur Elemental
3 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
3 Bogardan Hellkite
4 Fiery Temper
4 Disintegrate
4 Rift Bolt
4 Brute Force
4 Sudden Shock
Fiery Temper + Jaya Ballard, Task Mage = 6 damage for 3 mana
i dont know how to do deck tags somebody show me how to due them
Please don't double-post. Also, there is a full explanation of the use of deck tags in the rules thread stickied in each section of Block Constructed. -Feuerdrache
4 blood knight
4 sulfur elemental
4 keldon marauders
4 wildfire emissary
4 akroma, angel of fury
4 dead/gone
4 brute force
4 rift bolt
4 disintegrate
4 terramorphic expanse
20 mountain
needless to say this thing hoses anything running white (particularly the weenie) Dead/Gone stops anything small and helps slip in the last few points of damage by throwing anything too big to handle back to the opponents hand. I couldn't find any room for sudden shock in this one (disintegrate and dead/gone are just so much more versatile).
let me know what u think
4 sulfur elemental
4 keldon marauders
4 wildfire emissary
4 akroma, angel of fury
4 brute force
4 rift bolt
4 disintegrate
20 mountain
Now let's i say why i have to disagree with you. I don't think Dead // Gone is a versatile version of Sudden Shock, and the main reason is: Target. Dead gone is only good when you're facing a strong aggro deck.
Now figure out, what is the deck housing tables around? Answer is: Control Teferi, there is no deck to match him. You ask me why? Because it acts in your turn, and leaves its mana open all time, so everything you cast will be bounced, countered or killed, 'til Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir and Bogardan Hellkite hits table, then the game is over for your disintegrate and friends.
Direct damage (on this occasion) is far better then a creature bouncer, since there is gonna be no creature to kill, and if foe is stuck with bouncing, you can hit him with direct damage, its gonna be your only chance.
In this case, Sudden Shock is far better than Dead // Gone. Sudden Shock is a 1R cost = to Dead, and more versatile in damage because it has Split Second wich don't let him be countered and do direct damage; and Gone is a too expensive bouncing (3R!!!!!), anyway i rather go with Sudden Shock than Dead // Gone, but its a matter of choice.
I can't see White Winnie, MRA or Scrybforce being any threat to Teferi, but at least, it needs to be the best. In your place i'd choose Sudden Shock, but Dead / Gone works too.
In a deck meanted to be fast, having no first drop will let you behind in the creatures advance; you're first turn is gonna be just a land drop and Magus of the Scroll can do direct damage with is always good. Imagine it as a Scorched Rusalka a little more expensive.
I see no problem in placing Akroma, Angel of Fury in place of Bogardan Hellkite, but usually Bogardan 5 damage when is put in play and flash ability is enough to finish (besides leave you mana open to disintegrate foes in your next turn).
As well as changing Keldon Marauders for Jaya Ballard, Task Mage. Keldon Marauders attacks just 1 turn than dies, and since it has no trample, if blocked by a 1/1 javalineers with no javalin, does no damage and dies ( besides its put in/put out ability), being behind again in the creature rush. I just think that direct damage is the way, like have a stuck Blood Knight late game, discard him for 3 or even more damage. Anyway, i think its a respectful replacement.
Wilfire Emissary is a subpar creature, It's a 3R 2/4 creature, and needs next turn 2RR just to get 4/4.
Well, that's what i think, but everyone plays in a certain way, so play do way you feel more confortable and secure; that was just tips of my view.
ps: remember to deck tag.
Hugs
1. It seems his deck is tuned to beating WW, which I'd think it does thorougly. Did you take this into account when you critized Dead/Gone?
2. Gone costs 2R. Putting no less than five exlamation marks behind something should warrant double checking it.
3. White Weenie has a decent matchup vs. the Teferi Control decks, but it depends on the version. The ones with 3-4 Tendrils of Despair tend to win, but has problems with the mirror. Results in the online PEs has shown this time, and time again.
4. ScrybForce doesn't really exist in TSP Block constructed anymore. I no longer see versions of GR that play Scryb Ranger all that much. Most have cut them all together. The GR decks that still are present have a decent matchup vs. control and the GRu versions roll over control. It's the best matchup for them.
5. Mono Red has had a good matchup vs. control all through it's existence hardly dependent on format. It's the same here. To some degree it depends on the version of control, but Mono Red has an edge over any version. It's just too fast for the Control Decks to beat consistently without tuning it quite a bit, which makes is much worse in the mirror.
6. Scorched Rusalka, while good, is not in this format.
7. Keldon Maurauders does 5 damage to control, and most of the time versus other creatures as well. Do anyone want to block it or kill it and still take 2 damage? It's main problem is Wall of Roots. Still, all mono red decks play it, and most RW aggro as well, and for a good reason.
8. I'm prone to agree that Wildfire Emissary has it's problems (but surely not more than 4 Akromas? I'd think they'd slow you down way too often to warrant 4 in a deck with now mana accelleration.), but in a deck that seems ready to battle WW I can understand the choice. Oh, and Wildfire Emissary is another creature that has proven it's worth in several formats since it was first introduced in Mirage.
1- Can you take seriously a deck created just to face one kind of deck in a competitve enviroment?
2- Ok, i've written wrong the cost, anyway it's costy for what it does, besides i don't believe in a fast damage deck using Gone, i'm certain that Sudden Shock is more versatile in any occasion than Dead // Gone.
3- I think MWA can't think about to win a U/R Teferi Control, MAYBE U/B or U/B/r, but still i don't believe. Damnation, Sudden Death besides counter and bouncings are just enough to keep MRA quiet.
4- Sure there is:http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=70851. I think that only match up is G/U made.
5- Completly don't agree. This talk about too fast is just talk. Sudden Shock, Snapback, Lightning Axe, Cancel are all fast cards with low cost that can keep all this Red card shutted up 'til big threats comes in. And better, all in your turn.
6- Maybe you had difficult understanding, but i was just comparing.
7- I didn't tell this card is not good, i just said i rather direct damage. But as i said its a respectful choice.
8- Again one deck match up card, that within a tournament (we are in competitive forum) is not enough to deserve a place.
So, i see no point in your talking. But certainly you have the right to think that way.
Hugs
As for not agreeing on my opinions; I think we'll just have to agree to disagree.
Edit: Reread your previous post. Didn't read your comment on Scorched Rusalka properly. Sorry about that one.
First of all, he didn't create it *just* to beat White Weenie. If he wanted to make a deck like that, he'd have made Black-based control.
WW is a very common deck in today's meta, and it's quite fair to tune your deck towards beating it. In fact, it's probably a good idea to do so.
Sudden Shock doesn't even make a Dragon flinch - much less an Elephant. How you can consider it more versatile is beyond me. I think, perhaps, you're overestimating the countering ability of the Teferi decks.
I'll be honest. That comment seems to show a lack of practice to me.
Er...? Just because there's a thread for it doesn't mean it's showing up in tournaments with any regularity.
Tussius, of all users on here, is an expert on the MTGO events. His blog is dedicated to them. If he says they don't really show up any more he's more than likely correct.
Sudden Shock isn't run in any control builds because it's just a damn Shock; Snapback is actually a decent spell but it only bounces the creature (still effective, though); Lightning Axe is huge card disadvantage, which is something control really doesn't want; Cancel is only relevant on your third or fourth turn (if you're the RDW guy), and that's assuming that they've got double blue by then - not a guarantee.
You got him there, I guess.
You missed his point. He's saying that Keldon Marauders acts like a burn spell.
See my earlier point about you underestimating the value of tuning to beat White.
It's possible that this may just be a language deficiency, but as a native English speaker and moderator of these forums, I'm going to make sure you're aware that this comment was very rude.
Really, in a constructed block deck tournament, would you create a deck to face an specific kind of deck and expect to win it? No more comments.
Really? What you expect to bounce against control? or creature to do 2 points of damage? You cannot even hit foes. But you can do that with Sudden Shock, even do 2 damage to creature and even can't be countered. If foes has 2 life left, do you expect to have Sudden Shock or Dead // Gone? Lets see WW cards: Soltari Priest (can't be hit), Knight of the Holy Nimbus (regenerate or just cast in turn 3 to kill a turn 2 card), later cards, being the reason for this bounce, Calciderm (can´t be targeted). So if this deck is made for WW, why have a card that can't destroy half of their deck's creature cards?
Maybe its my lack of pratice...;)
Well in live tournaments here, there a plenty number of them, with or without Scryb. High tournament levels will show who's right.
you didn't face a Shock in a control build? Man, i faced these cards in control more than a 50 times. And just to tell you that a well balanced control deck can handle this card disadvantage very well, Blue is the cantrip color: Ancestral Vision, Think Twice and Careful Consideration all in your turn. You can even Bewilder a Keldon Marauder cause he's gonna die next turn, and buy a card . (Before you take me serious, i'm just kidding about this card.)
You got me here, it really does. Anyway Jaya is very useful through my tests, i've tested Keldon Marauder and they really do well, but as well as do Jaya.
I just CAN'T agree with you in a competitive term.
Maybe i'm not a native speaker, but lived in US for 2 years, so I can guarantee you that i don't see any harsh comment, i just said that i see no point in his statements, simply for the reasons i already stated.
it beats mono blue it fairs with green and my deck is going to be ridiculous after future sight because the new land and the two or three new burn spells and i may try dead and gone and who ever sent me that warning i did not post twice on this so yea please dont do that when i dont i hate that because i have got several warnings like that where i didnt even do it and its really unfair if my account gets banned for stuff i dont do
Here is the list I am currently useing:
*Updated*
4x Blood Knight
4x Suq'Ata Lancer
4x Sulfur Elemental
3x Greater Gargadon
4x Keldon Marauders
4x Mogg War Marshall
3x Magus of the Scroll
2x Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
4x Brute Force
4x Dead//Gone
4x Disintegrate
Lands: (20)
17x Mountain
2x Molten Slagheap
1x Gemstone Cavern
3x Lightning Axe
2x Fortune Theif
4x Word of Seizing
1x Molten Slagheap
4x Avalanche Riders
1x Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
So, I was wondering what your opinions on this list would be.
Anyhow, Thanks for your time!
~Nim
Yes more comments. OF FREAKIN COURSE MAN! That is traditionally called 'the metagame philosophy.' It is ironic they reprinted the Whirling Dervish card because around the time it was first printed most magic players said, 'Eeew... what an aweful card. Who would ever play it?' That is until the emergence of a deck that played it... tuned to beat the mono-Black archtype deck of its time. And of course won!
So your assumption is incorrect. There are those that play decks built solely to beat a specific type of deck that exists. Since this format is dominated mostly by net-deck fools that copy paste and build decks. Expect to run into white weenie, Dralnu / X , then meta-gamed decks built to beat those two decks! Hmmm... sounds like a job for RED DECK WINS?
Raphael Levy 5-0:
Creatures:18
4 Blood Knight
4 Sulfur Elemental
4 Magus of the Scroll
4 Keldon Marauders
2 Wildfire Emissary
Spells:18
4 Rift Bolt
2 Sudden Shock
4 Browbeat
4 Unknown? I couldn't make out what it was.
4 Disintegrate
It didn't show the Lands, but there were 24 with a possible Molten Slagheap i think, and the rest mountains.
Sideboard not shown.
I mean I could see running more lands then I do (I've considered adding a couple more myself) but 24?
Are you "sure" about that or is the list still fairly unknown?
Anyway...
~Nim
Told you so.
My "no ww in the top 8 in yoko" is about to come true.
MRA is strong and has a good matchup vs. control is proven true even at the pro level. You can't argue that they have sub par builds or play poorly.
Oh, and Wildfire Emissary is a good card. Tada!
However, to all that have said to me: "Browbeat is good" or "Browbeat is a force!" You got me!
You can all just message me with "told you so". It's okay. I've deserved it. Apparently Browbeat is better than I'd have thought.
And i've tested the Browbeat, and it's one of the best cards in this deck, only for block though. If u play it 3rd-5th turn they are automatically going to take the 5 damage rather than risk you drawing 3 more burn to kill them with. And if they're on 5 or less, 3 cards lets you draw more burn and finish them off. So..Browbeat is nuts, it's 3 mana for 5 damage.
I'm not sure what you mean by not enough. Do you have a use for all that mana? I only run twenty and by about turn four/five/six I've mostly cleared my hand (faster with jaya). I would consider more lands but only to lessen the number of mulls due to lack of lands in my openers. That is useful for a long tourney but at the same time 24 leaves you in danger of floods (I'd rather have too few lands and a good hand then too many and nothing to play)... Anyhow...
I would argue that a card being good or not depends on the meta...
I'm not sure a 2/4 for four is all that hot vs U/x control... Is it? (It very well might be I'm asking)
I would also ask why you say this? Browbeat was no better/worse yesterday then it is today (unless this tourney shifts things in a way that could cause it to be more/less relivent). If you felt some way about it and had a sound reasoning for why then you shouldn't neccissarily flip over like that. Just because some people playing in a tourney are doing well with it doesn't change how good/bad the card was. "Pros" are players like you and me.
Take everything with a grain of salt (especially things like these).
~Nim
As for playing 20-22 lands. You'll mulligan often, and you'll stop at 2-3 lands quite often. This will keep you from utilizing disintegrate to it's fullest.
The probabilities for running low on lands with less than 24 are just too high.