I know that the sideboard seems thrown together and the deck not exactly finished, but I probably won't have a chance to grab additional Nihiliths, Tombstalkers, etc. before the PTQ.
Also, if you're gonna suggest to convert this to Mono-Black Rack, I'm not exactly in the green on The Rack and Funeral Charm. Curse Neutral Ground and expensive singles that I don't want to buy yet.
Anyway, Turn 2 Nihilith into Turn 3 Stupor into Turn 4 Stupor is just hilarious. Psychotic Episode is decent at 3CC and works pretty effectively, and I've had okay matchups against U/B/w Teachings. I can effectively deal with G/W Goyf, and Korlash is just a matter of who gets something to stick first.
So far it has tested well.
Slivers is a good match up as long as they don't get the wild pair combo going but with all the discard and kill i have not had a problem yet.
Mono Red is only tough if the suspend due pops and i cant kill it but most of the time they do not have a hand to hurt me with.
Any pickles deck is even money. If i get the turn one charm turn two augur turn three stupor i win period. Sudden death is my best friend in this match up.
Mono white is easy unless they drop a sacred mesa. I'm thinking of siding a stronghold overseer for that card.
The various U/B teachings and such with out the shape shifter are cake walks. They lose there hand and I win.
Blink decks I've got the same odds as a Pickles deck.
Any advice for deck or SB is welcomed.
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The wizard who reads a thousand books is powerful.
The wizard who memorizes a thousand books is insane.
I have read thousands of books. I have only memorized 800.
I don't know yet if I need both Wretch and Extirpate in the sideboard. The U/B/r Reanimator deck looks like a serious beating early in our testing (though we haven't tried the Black deck against it yet), but still, one of those might be enough. Or maybe just 2 Wretches to support the Extirpate suite, leaving 2 slots for something else.
I've been playing some MBC on MODO and while I think the MBC matchup vs. Pickles is better for MBC than it would be for U/B Teachings, it's still tough. I think you pretty much mulligan any hand that doesn't have discard in it. No Augur or no Stupor means you don't keep it against Pickles. A hand of fatties and a couple of removal spells just won't cut it.
I also think the deck needs Extirpate maindeck to beat Pickles and the prime rule is that you *have* to save that Extirpate for a Brine Elemental. It looks tempting to Extirpate that first Ancestral Visions but don't be suckered into it. You'll get a Brine Elemental in the graveyard through either discard or removal and *that's* what you need to Extirpate. Note it's not easy street even after that as they can still win on tempo. Having Venser and Cloudskates and Shapeshifter Cloudskates bounce your Korlash three or four turns in a row while they are beating on you for four or six a turn sucks.
I'm also not an advocate of Nihilith anymore because of Pickles. Yes, he can be quite a beating but if he doesn't resolve before turn five then you can bet Teferi will hit the board first. When your Nihilith has one counter on it and Teferi hits the board, all you can do is frown. He's potentially your quickest beater but I've just had too many of the things not resolve thanks to Teferi so something else will have to be found.
I like MBC... yes, the lack of card drawing hurts but you get some card advantage via discard. You have a very consistent mana base and access to some of the most powerful spells in the format. I wanted to play it in Nashville this weekend but it's a long drive there and I can't find anyone willing to go with me and split gas. I will likely be in Atlanta on 8/25 though.
I don't know yet if I need both Wretch and Extirpate in the sideboard. The U/B/r Reanimator deck looks like a serious beating early in our testing (though we haven't tried the Black deck against it yet), but still, one of those might be enough. Or maybe just 2 Wretches to support the Extirpate suite, leaving 2 slots for something else.
Thoughts?
I am no expert but here is what I am thinking.
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth: I am a pretty big fan of playing more of these in MBC because they are functionally wastelands against U/B teachings & Coalition control effectively undermine their Korlash and Tendrils because they are swamp light. Yes the possibility exist that you will be sitting on a dead card in your hand but you can compensate for this by playing Vesuva over the extra Urborgs.
Urza's Factory: I have struggled with playing this card. Take Possession has seen significant more play since the PTQ in Seattle and you will see it in some Pickles builds Teachings, etc. Personally, I would rather play Vesuva. Worst case they get a small tempo advantage yours coming into play tapped. But if they already have one in play using Take Possession on it doesn’t net them more dudes.
Nihilith: I am not a big fan. I’d rather play with Totem or Epochrasite. Think about it.
Twisted Abomination: I’d rather play Street Wraith. At least he swampwalk’s which has some nice synergy with Urborg. But then again I play Sudden Death in my version so if he gets pulled with Take Possession I don’t have to wait for a damnation to clear him off the board.
Slaughter Pact: I worry about playing so many with boom//bust and the pickles lock. Clearly that hasn’t been sufficient reason to kill this card considering it’s a staple in many Teachings decks.
Hope I'm not breaking a forum rule by posting a link to an MTGO screenshot, but anyway...
Had a fun game last night where I was playing MBC with heavy discard and my opponent was playing Mono-green Gauntlet. The game had just dragged on and on with my opponent hitting land after land but he finally drew a Verdeloth and made 37! saproling tokens to go along with what he already had.
He swung with the stuff that didn't have summoning sickness but I was able to kill his Verdeloth and a token, block four of them (regenerating my Augur) and put a couple of -1/-1 counters on another token. So I wound up taking 10 damage, leaving me at one life and topdecking a Damnation or a Rack would have been the win. I sack my Augur during my upkeep to empty his hand and then I topdeck... a Swamp...
Still, it was a great, fun game. My deck is different in that it is essentialy creatureless and runs Gibbering Descent which isn't as bad as you might think. I will test it some more and post results. I'm thinking of naming the deck "Fifty Minutes of H*ll" as that's pretty much what it would be round after round to play it at a PTQ for both me and my opponent.
I'm trying out a transformational sideboard into a Rack deck.
"transformational sideboard into a Rack deck": People are going to assume this is a rack deck after game one even if they don't see one. You just have to much discard for them to assume anything else. So you will see their hate (possibly dodecapod) without seeing any advantage. Anyway I am not seeing a lot of Artifact hate on sideboards (there is some) so I don't know what you gain. If they have it they may board in their anti-artifact tek for Totem... It might be "fun" but i don't think it helps you.
Desert: 3 is probably to many. You have plenty of removal if you don't get it with the discard. Remember Funeral Charm can kill their x/1(s).
Terramorphic Expanse: is pretty much an auto include to thin the deck. Especially, when Funeral Charm is your only one drop.
This has been doing very well for me in the MODO Tournament Practice room. Gibbering Descent is surprisingly good. The deck is very capable of creating a situation where there are no creatures on the board and both players have empty hands. The difference is, I have Racks in play and my opponent doesn't. I also have Totems which really shine in that situation.
I know 27 seems like a lot of mana sources but I a) intend to cast Smallpox early if needed and b) will likely be hardcasting Gibbering Descent. Mindless Automaton can help get Gibbering Descent into play for one less mana but that's not really why it's there. They are more there for when there's already a Descent in play and my hand is already empty. If I topdeck removal and my opponent has no creatures in play then I can just discard the card to the Automaton. Plus, they are obviously good vs. Damnation and are good chump blockers, too. If you really want to go beatdown then just replace them with Korlash.
The sideboard is a work in progress. A lot of creature kill but different kill cards come in for different decks. Sudden Death is reserved for Pickles while Dark Withering tends to come in against Goyf. (Dark Withering is amazing when combined with Small Pox.) Arrows can come in against either. Imp's Mischief may become a four-of as it is an answer to Haunting Hymn, can steal Ancestral Visions or even potentially counter a Cancel or a Delay. (The trick is to change the target of the counterspell to Imp's Mischief.) Extirpate is for Pickles and any ultra slow deck with few threats.
Tough to know what to take out sometimes when sideboarding. You may find yourself swapping removal for removal such as vs. Pickles. where Tendrils is inferior to Sudden Death. When in doubt I'll gladly take out a Gibbering Descent or even an Automaton. Against WW and such, I'll take out a Stupor or two. They are pretty much emptying their hand for you anyway.
I don't have match up percentages but have done enough playtesting against every archetype to feel like the deck has game vs. everything in the format. Void control has been the hardest to deal with so far. Void for four hurts badly and they have Totems as well. Goyf can be tricky as filling up their graveyard early can result in 5/6 Goyfs as early as turn three but the matchup is winnable given the overwhelming creature kill available, especially after sideboarding. I've also played against a good bit of discard hate and really haven't had that much trouble with it. Dodecapod is only fearsome before turn four or five. After that, he's easily dealt with. Keep in mind that in these situations, it pays to NOT sack your Augurs and instead use them as blockers until you can draw an answer.
It'll be Tuesday before I can playtest some more. I may be back here Wednesday telling you all that everything I just posted was rubbish!
I had a really bad night of playtesting Tuesday. Saturday I went something like 7-2 with this deck and felt pretty good about it. Tuesday night I go something like 1-4. Maybe I just had an off night or something. At any rate, I'm not sold on this particular mix of MBC and will be testing a different mix tonight.
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4 Augur of Skulls
4 Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
3 Withered Wretch
1 Nihilith
1 Tombstalker
3 Nether Traitor
3 Dauthi Slayer
Spells (19):
3 Damnation
3 Sudden Death
4 Tendrils of Corruption
3 Stupor
3 Psychotic Episode
3 Phyrexian Totem
19 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Zoetic Cavern
2 Slaughter Pact
1 Sudden Death
2 Darkness
1 Stronghold Overseer
2 Bad Moon
3 Sudden Spoiling
1 Extirpate
2 Serrated Arrows
1 Nihilith
I know that the sideboard seems thrown together and the deck not exactly finished, but I probably won't have a chance to grab additional Nihiliths, Tombstalkers, etc. before the PTQ.
Also, if you're gonna suggest to convert this to Mono-Black Rack, I'm not exactly in the green on The Rack and Funeral Charm. Curse Neutral Ground and expensive singles that I don't want to buy yet.
Anyway, Turn 2 Nihilith into Turn 3 Stupor into Turn 4 Stupor is just hilarious. Psychotic Episode is decent at 3CC and works pretty effectively, and I've had okay matchups against U/B/w Teachings. I can effectively deal with G/W Goyf, and Korlash is just a matter of who gets something to stick first.
Suggestions?
[GTC] Gatecrash Patch for MWS (249/249)
16 Swamp
2 Urza's Factory
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Creatures
3 Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
1 Roiling Horror
3 Augur of Skulls
4 Street Wraith
2 Tombstalker
4 Extirpate
4 Stupor
4 Sudden Death
4 Tendrils of Corruption
2 Damnation
4 Funeral Charm
2 Slaughter Pact
3 Smallpox
So far it has tested well.
Slivers is a good match up as long as they don't get the wild pair combo going but with all the discard and kill i have not had a problem yet.
Mono Red is only tough if the suspend due pops and i cant kill it but most of the time they do not have a hand to hurt me with.
Any pickles deck is even money. If i get the turn one charm turn two augur turn three stupor i win period. Sudden death is my best friend in this match up.
Mono white is easy unless they drop a sacred mesa. I'm thinking of siding a stronghold overseer for that card.
The various U/B teachings and such with out the shape shifter are cake walks. They lose there hand and I win.
Blink decks I've got the same odds as a Pickles deck.
Any advice for deck or SB is welcomed.
The wizard who memorizes a thousand books is insane.
I have read thousands of books. I have only memorized 800.
21 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
4 Augur of Skulls
4 Twisted Abomination
3 Nihilith
2 Tombstalker
4 Damnation
4 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Funeral Charm
4 Stupor
2 Withered Wretch
4 Dauthi Slayer
3 Plague Sliver
4 Dodecapod
2 Sudden Death
I like the maindeck, and made one tweak. The sideboard seemed pretty random, though, so I changed it around a lot:
21 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
4 Augur of Skulls
4 Twisted Abomination
3 Nihilith
2 Tombstalker
4 Damnation
4 Tendrils of Corruption
3 Funeral Charm
4 Stupor
4 Withered Wretch
4 Extirpate
4 Sudden Death
3 Plague Sliver
I don't know yet if I need both Wretch and Extirpate in the sideboard. The U/B/r Reanimator deck looks like a serious beating early in our testing (though we haven't tried the Black deck against it yet), but still, one of those might be enough. Or maybe just 2 Wretches to support the Extirpate suite, leaving 2 slots for something else.
Thoughts?
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I also think the deck needs Extirpate maindeck to beat Pickles and the prime rule is that you *have* to save that Extirpate for a Brine Elemental. It looks tempting to Extirpate that first Ancestral Visions but don't be suckered into it. You'll get a Brine Elemental in the graveyard through either discard or removal and *that's* what you need to Extirpate. Note it's not easy street even after that as they can still win on tempo. Having Venser and Cloudskates and Shapeshifter Cloudskates bounce your Korlash three or four turns in a row while they are beating on you for four or six a turn sucks.
I'm also not an advocate of Nihilith anymore because of Pickles. Yes, he can be quite a beating but if he doesn't resolve before turn five then you can bet Teferi will hit the board first. When your Nihilith has one counter on it and Teferi hits the board, all you can do is frown. He's potentially your quickest beater but I've just had too many of the things not resolve thanks to Teferi so something else will have to be found.
I like MBC... yes, the lack of card drawing hurts but you get some card advantage via discard. You have a very consistent mana base and access to some of the most powerful spells in the format. I wanted to play it in Nashville this weekend but it's a long drive there and I can't find anyone willing to go with me and split gas. I will likely be in Atlanta on 8/25 though.
I am no expert but here is what I am thinking.
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth: I am a pretty big fan of playing more of these in MBC because they are functionally wastelands against U/B teachings & Coalition control effectively undermine their Korlash and Tendrils because they are swamp light. Yes the possibility exist that you will be sitting on a dead card in your hand but you can compensate for this by playing Vesuva over the extra Urborgs.
Urza's Factory: I have struggled with playing this card. Take Possession has seen significant more play since the PTQ in Seattle and you will see it in some Pickles builds Teachings, etc. Personally, I would rather play Vesuva. Worst case they get a small tempo advantage yours coming into play tapped. But if they already have one in play using Take Possession on it doesn’t net them more dudes.
Nihilith: I am not a big fan. I’d rather play with Totem or Epochrasite. Think about it.
Twisted Abomination: I’d rather play Street Wraith. At least he swampwalk’s which has some nice synergy with Urborg. But then again I play Sudden Death in my version so if he gets pulled with Take Possession I don’t have to wait for a damnation to clear him off the board.
Slaughter Pact: I worry about playing so many with boom//bust and the pickles lock. Clearly that hasn’t been sufficient reason to kill this card considering it’s a staple in many Teachings decks.
RG Goyf Deck Wins
GB Goyfpox
Had a fun game last night where I was playing MBC with heavy discard and my opponent was playing Mono-green Gauntlet. The game had just dragged on and on with my opponent hitting land after land but he finally drew a Verdeloth and made 37! saproling tokens to go along with what he already had.
He swung with the stuff that didn't have summoning sickness but I was able to kill his Verdeloth and a token, block four of them (regenerating my Augur) and put a couple of -1/-1 counters on another token. So I wound up taking 10 damage, leaving me at one life and topdecking a Damnation or a Rack would have been the win. I sack my Augur during my upkeep to empty his hand and then I topdeck... a Swamp...
Still, it was a great, fun game. My deck is different in that it is essentialy creatureless and runs Gibbering Descent which isn't as bad as you might think. I will test it some more and post results. I'm thinking of naming the deck "Fifty Minutes of H*ll" as that's pretty much what it would be round after round to play it at a PTQ for both me and my opponent.
4 Augur of Skulls
4 Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
//Spells (28)
4 Damnation
4 Funeral Charm
4 Phyrexian Totem
4 Stupor
4 Sudden Death
4 Tendrils of Corruption
3 Desert
18 Swamp
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Urza's Factory
4 Extirpate
3 Slaughter Pact
4 Smallpox
4 The Rack
I'm trying out a transformational sideboard into a Rack deck.
"transformational sideboard into a Rack deck": People are going to assume this is a rack deck after game one even if they don't see one. You just have to much discard for them to assume anything else. So you will see their hate (possibly dodecapod) without seeing any advantage. Anyway I am not seeing a lot of Artifact hate on sideboards (there is some) so I don't know what you gain. If they have it they may board in their anti-artifact tek for Totem... It might be "fun" but i don't think it helps you.
Desert: 3 is probably to many. You have plenty of removal if you don't get it with the discard. Remember Funeral Charm can kill their x/1(s).
Terramorphic Expanse: is pretty much an auto include to thin the deck. Especially, when Funeral Charm is your only one drop.
RG Goyf Deck Wins
GB Goyfpox
4 Augur of Skulls
4 Damnation
1 Extirpate
4 Gibbering Descent
4 Mindless Automaton
3 Phyrexian Totem
4 Smallpox
4 Stupor
24 Swamp
4 Tendrils of Corruption
4 The Rack
4 Dark Withering
2 Extirpate
2 Imp's Mischief
3 Serrated Arrows
4 Sudden Death
I know 27 seems like a lot of mana sources but I a) intend to cast Smallpox early if needed and b) will likely be hardcasting Gibbering Descent. Mindless Automaton can help get Gibbering Descent into play for one less mana but that's not really why it's there. They are more there for when there's already a Descent in play and my hand is already empty. If I topdeck removal and my opponent has no creatures in play then I can just discard the card to the Automaton. Plus, they are obviously good vs. Damnation and are good chump blockers, too. If you really want to go beatdown then just replace them with Korlash.
The sideboard is a work in progress. A lot of creature kill but different kill cards come in for different decks. Sudden Death is reserved for Pickles while Dark Withering tends to come in against Goyf. (Dark Withering is amazing when combined with Small Pox.) Arrows can come in against either. Imp's Mischief may become a four-of as it is an answer to Haunting Hymn, can steal Ancestral Visions or even potentially counter a Cancel or a Delay. (The trick is to change the target of the counterspell to Imp's Mischief.) Extirpate is for Pickles and any ultra slow deck with few threats.
Tough to know what to take out sometimes when sideboarding. You may find yourself swapping removal for removal such as vs. Pickles. where Tendrils is inferior to Sudden Death. When in doubt I'll gladly take out a Gibbering Descent or even an Automaton. Against WW and such, I'll take out a Stupor or two. They are pretty much emptying their hand for you anyway.
I don't have match up percentages but have done enough playtesting against every archetype to feel like the deck has game vs. everything in the format. Void control has been the hardest to deal with so far. Void for four hurts badly and they have Totems as well. Goyf can be tricky as filling up their graveyard early can result in 5/6 Goyfs as early as turn three but the matchup is winnable given the overwhelming creature kill available, especially after sideboarding. I've also played against a good bit of discard hate and really haven't had that much trouble with it. Dodecapod is only fearsome before turn four or five. After that, he's easily dealt with. Keep in mind that in these situations, it pays to NOT sack your Augurs and instead use them as blockers until you can draw an answer.
It'll be Tuesday before I can playtest some more. I may be back here Wednesday telling you all that everything I just posted was rubbish!
Everything I posted on Monday was indeed rubbish... That is all...
I had a really bad night of playtesting Tuesday. Saturday I went something like 7-2 with this deck and felt pretty good about it. Tuesday night I go something like 1-4. Maybe I just had an off night or something. At any rate, I'm not sold on this particular mix of MBC and will be testing a different mix tonight.