Oh! I dont know how Bridge from Bellow work in others dredge decks...
I try to use it on my deck. Zombie Infestation is a great enabler to me. Please explain to my if not.
Why not Bloodghast?
Cause this cant be recats like Bloodsoaked Champion or Gravecrawler and dont trigger Vengevine.
Other people have commented on the list, but I just want to make sure everyone understands that Bloodsoaked Champion's Raid trigger will not in turn trigger Vengevine.
Vengevine's clause requires you to cast the spell, while BSC's return is a activated ability, not a cast. Even though you're paying mana for it, it's never a spell on the stack. This is unlike Gravecrawler which explicitly says you may cast it from the graveyard. In this regard, both Bloodsoaked and Bloodghast are identically useless in returning Vengeveine.
BSC does have the advantage of being only B, rather than BB, which is relevant in a deck with only 20-ish lands. On the downside, he always costs mana to reanimate, unlike Bloodghast, which reanimates more or less for free. However since the activated ability has no timing clause you can actually use it at instant speed if you choose, including during end step or even inside combat. That can be a nice surprise way to save a Varolz, the Scar-Striped from removal. If they try to end-step bolt him, you can reanimate and then sacrifice the BSC for regeneration, much like cracking a fetch to surprise reanimate a Bloodghast.
From reading this post it seems like you think Bloodsoaked Champion's ability returns it to your hand. It returns it to play. The only way Bloodsoaked is better at recurring Vengevine is that it's one mana as opposed to two.
I only use BSC because it's more aggressive than BoP and it's not a totally dead card in the graveyard. Bringing it back from the graveyard will not trigger Vengevine. It is simply another way to keep putting pressure on your opponent. It's the same thing with Bloodghast. It puts pressure on your opponent and it's a cheap spell to keep recurring. Note that both are great discard outlets to Lotleth Troll. The day WotC prints another card like Gravecrawler is the day BSC gets replaced.
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Modern decks: BGRDredgevineBGR UWRJeskai ControlUWR
I think axe has some interesting implications since it is an extra discard outlet which could be nice, other than that I think 2 thugs in your list is too many, one is fine, and even that rarely feels impactful tbh
Gotta argue that, it is a 2 mana dredge card with a semi-useful ability. I have used him many times just to cast vine versus a three mana stinkweed Imp.
Anyway here is my list and update I meant to get up two weeks ago.
I'm thinking of pulling the Tymaret for a Tombstalker. Tymaret is just too mana intensive. I also am thinking of dropping the three lightning axes for a third Abrupt Decay and two more vengeful Pharoah or a Shriekmaw or two. Shriekmaw would be great with a golgari thug for evoking their guys and then chump for it back, it also kills wurmcoil without giving them life. On the other hand Pharoah wrecks burn decks and decks reliant and small creatures constantly hitting and decks that play few but big creatures(Boggles) but the damage still goes through. thoughts there? Another question about the sideboard, do we have anything to keep stuff out of our graveyard. When I was playing boggles the other night I milled through all there of my smallpox. Same thing happened against pod game 2, Game 3 I opened with a orb so I kept and dropped it, he played pridemage, then killed orb and finks, then seer and melira.
Value is good. But Dredgevine isn't supposed to be about value. It's supposed to be about V-8; 2000 pounds of nitro boosted war vegetables. The more velocity, the better.
Modern:
DredgeVine EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima Standard:
Value is good. But Dredgevine isn't supposed to be about value. It's supposed to be about V-8; 2000 pounds of nitro boosted war vegetables. The more velocity, the better.
Modern:
DredgeVine EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima Standard:
Yeah if i have one criticism if your list its the lack of MD abrupt decay. The card is basically good in every matchup, and i feel 3-4 MD is totally fine over a few creatures. Bloodghast probably since i really don't think its ever impactful compared to everything else the deck does.
Hmm. interesting list. THe only reason vor R is the Faithless Looting? I think I would cut R and add Liliana of the Veil.
Honestly faithless looting is one of the best cards in the deck. Allowing to turn one discard a vengvine and a Bloodghast is very good. It makes usually unkeepable hands insane. You can also dredge off looting which helps a lot. I was just testing with a friend last night and after casting looting turn one on him a couple times he said "ugh that's like brainstorm in your deck" and he's not wrong haha
If yours running the BUG variants of Dredgevine then yes, graveyard hate will most mean game over for you, but that is one of the main reasons why I think most people are leaning on the Jund variant now, its just got more power, more speed, and less overall reliance on the graveyard.
If yours running the BUG variants of Dredgevine then yes, graveyard hate will most mean game over for you, but that is one of the main reasons why I think most people are leaning on the Jund variant now, its just got more power, more speed, and less overall reliance on the graveyard.
Honestly, I have a BUG Variant that plays like a Jund list, but is a bit more all over IMO. I'm in the middle of messing around with it, still not sure if I want to have a red splash for Bolt and Faithless. It might just not be worth the pain. I kinda want to toss in a couple more Dredgers for Cruise and friends, but most of them are just awkward to have. Maybe Shambling Shell?
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I know how Faithless plays. However, its not always what I want or need. I'm not running lots of cards with Dredge, and there aren't cards I always NEED out of my hand except maybe Vengevine. When it comes down to it, I am just not sure I want to splash red for just it and maybe bolt in this list. If your in red for other things, than definitely run it.
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-H. P. Lovecraft
Atm my list is like these:
2 Golgari Thug
4 Gravecrawler
3 Hooting Mandrills
4 Lotleth Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Vengevine
4 Faithless Looting
1 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Blood Crypt
2 Copperline Gorge
1 Forest
4 Overgrown Tomb
1 Stomping Ground
1 Swamp
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Darkblast
3 Lightning Axe
3 Slitherhead
2 Dakmor Salvage
Someone have some advice?
(sorry for my english)
I try to use it on my deck.
Zombie Infestation is a great enabler to me. Please explain to my if not.
Other people have commented on the list, but I just want to make sure everyone understands that Bloodsoaked Champion's Raid trigger will not in turn trigger Vengevine.
Vengevine's clause requires you to cast the spell, while BSC's return is a activated ability, not a cast. Even though you're paying mana for it, it's never a spell on the stack. This is unlike Gravecrawler which explicitly says you may cast it from the graveyard. In this regard, both Bloodsoaked and Bloodghast are identically useless in returning Vengeveine.
BSC does have the advantage of being only B, rather than BB, which is relevant in a deck with only 20-ish lands. On the downside, he always costs mana to reanimate, unlike Bloodghast, which reanimates more or less for free. However since the activated ability has no timing clause you can actually use it at instant speed if you choose, including during end step or even inside combat. That can be a nice surprise way to save a Varolz, the Scar-Striped from removal. If they try to end-step bolt him, you can reanimate and then sacrifice the BSC for regeneration, much like cracking a fetch to surprise reanimate a Bloodghast.
Once you cast Bloodghast never will trigger Vengevine again.
From reading this post it seems like you think Bloodsoaked Champion's ability returns it to your hand. It returns it to play. The only way Bloodsoaked is better at recurring Vengevine is that it's one mana as opposed to two.
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UWRJeskai ControlUWR
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I'm sorta interested with Lightning Axe.
How well does it work?
GWU Knightfall
[Legacy]
GBW Nic-Fit
Anyway here is my list and update I meant to get up two weeks ago.
4 Vengevine
4 Bloodghast
4 Gravecrawler
4 Lotleth troll
3 Birds of paradise
2 Grim lavamancer
2 Stinkweed imp
2 Golgari thug
1 Vengeful Pharoah
1 Tymaret, The murder King
1 Life from
1 Gnaw to the bone
2 Grisly salvage
3 Lightning Axe
2 Abrupt decay
I'm thinking of pulling the Tymaret for a Tombstalker. Tymaret is just too mana intensive. I also am thinking of dropping the three lightning axes for a third Abrupt Decay and two more vengeful Pharoah or a Shriekmaw or two. Shriekmaw would be great with a golgari thug for evoking their guys and then chump for it back, it also kills wurmcoil without giving them life. On the other hand Pharoah wrecks burn decks and decks reliant and small creatures constantly hitting and decks that play few but big creatures(Boggles) but the damage still goes through. thoughts there? Another question about the sideboard, do we have anything to keep stuff out of our graveyard. When I was playing boggles the other night I milled through all there of my smallpox. Same thing happened against pod game 2, Game 3 I opened with a orb so I kept and dropped it, he played pridemage, then killed orb and finks, then seer and melira.
Modern:
DredgeVine
EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima
Standard:
I may have misunderstood you, but doesn't Shriekmaw target nonartifact creatures, and thus can't target Wurmcoil Engine?
Modern:
DredgeVine
EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima
Standard:
4 Vengvine
4 Bloodghast
4 Grave Crawler
4 Satyr Wayfinder
3 Stinkweed Imp
3 Hooting Mandrils
2 Lotleth Troll
2 Extractor Demon
Spells:
2 Darkblast
4 Faithless Looting
4 Murderous Cut
4 Grisly Salvage
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Copperline Gorge
2 Overgrown Tomb
1 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground
1 Swamp
1 Forest
3 Ancient Grudge
3 Gnaw to the Bone
3 Abrupt Decay
4 THoughtseize
2 Golgari Charm
Honestly faithless looting is one of the best cards in the deck. Allowing to turn one discard a vengvine and a Bloodghast is very good. It makes usually unkeepable hands insane. You can also dredge off looting which helps a lot. I was just testing with a friend last night and after casting looting turn one on him a couple times he said "ugh that's like brainstorm in your deck" and he's not wrong haha
Honestly, I have a BUG Variant that plays like a Jund list, but is a bit more all over IMO. I'm in the middle of messing around with it, still not sure if I want to have a red splash for Bolt and Faithless. It might just not be worth the pain. I kinda want to toss in a couple more Dredgers for Cruise and friends, but most of them are just awkward to have. Maybe Shambling Shell?
"I am disillusioned enough to know that no man's opinion on any subject is worth a damn unless backed up with enough genuine information to make him really know what he's talking about."
-H. P. Lovecraft
"I am disillusioned enough to know that no man's opinion on any subject is worth a damn unless backed up with enough genuine information to make him really know what he's talking about."
-H. P. Lovecraft