Elves at 26, some Company decks in the 20's. I'm still convinced that CoCo decks while good are just to random going to just have those games where you hit bird, bird and your looking at Eldrazi monsters, plus quite a few Grafdiggers Cages in the SB's of decks.
Coco is horrible to play online. That matters a lot.
It's really not that bad anymore since they did a change to the yields a few months back.
You still can't just gain 1 million life in 1 second. It's not close to the same as paper and this is why it sees less play online.
So what about the non Abzan company green decks.
Such as? You can go down the list and look at the decks I'm not really sure what you're asking about. All random creature decks are like t3 (because of so many reason stated numerous times in this thread) so it's not hard to believe they aren't there.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Vorthos-y Johnny. All will be One
Modern - Cheeri0s (building), Belcher (building), Lantern (building), UW Control (building)
RIP Magic Duels. Wizards will regret what they did to you.
Coco is horrible to play online. That matters a lot.
It's really not that bad anymore since they did a change to the yields a few months back.
You still can't just gain 1 million life in 1 second. It's not close to the same as paper and this is why it sees less play online.
So what about the non Abzan company green decks.
Such as? You can go down the list and look at the decks I'm not really sure what you're asking about. All random creature decks are like t3 (because of so many reason stated numerous times in this thread) so it's not hard to believe they aren't there.
Knightfall, elves. It's pretty clear to me that you have some vendetta against for the past few days. You ignore what im saying and only seem to be interested in trying to disprove me and pushing your narrative. I'm done responding to you
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Most control decks wouldn't want it because it's sorcery speed, and does not generate card advantage. Storm sure as heck would love to run Faithless Looting alongside Faithless Blueting.
I wonder if an instant speed Ideas Unbound might see play? Being able to play it and hold it during your opponent's turn would be huge without being gamebreaking.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Level 1 Judge
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
It's really not that bad anymore since they did a change to the yields a few months back.
You still can't just gain 1 million life in 1 second. It's not close to the same as paper and this is why it sees less play online.
So what about the non Abzan company green decks.
Such as? You can go down the list and look at the decks I'm not really sure what you're asking about. All random creature decks are like t3 (because of so many reason stated numerous times in this thread) so it's not hard to believe they aren't there.
Knightfall, elves. It's pretty clear to me that you have some vendetta against for the past few days. You ignore what im saying and only seem to be interested in trying to disprove me and pushing your narrative. I'm done responding to you
You were already told elves is at 26. Knightfall is a t3 (edit: guess it's t2 on here now but it still has the issue of not being good in the meta) creature combo deck why should it be at the top? Idk what you're trying to say? Green creature decks are currently outclassed is all. Eldrazi and Ds do creatures bigger and better. I have no narrative other than discussion. I have 10 modern decks so I don't have a pet deck or really a pet type other than one that can't be mentioned here so beyond that I just like talking modern. As far as you personally go, I don't even tend to look at who posts what I just respond how I feel, as we all should imo.
You still can't just gain 1 million life in 1 second. It's not close to the same as paper and this is why it sees less play online.
So what about the non Abzan company green decks.
Such as? You can go down the list and look at the decks I'm not really sure what you're asking about. All random creature decks are like t3 (because of so many reason stated numerous times in this thread) so it's not hard to believe they aren't there.
Knightfall, elves. It's pretty clear to me that you have some vendetta against for the past few days. You ignore what im saying and only seem to be interested in trying to disprove me and pushing your narrative. I'm done responding to you
You were already told elves is at 26. Knightfall is a t3 (edit: guess it's t2 on here now but it still has the issue of not being good in the meta) creature combo deck why should it be at the top? Idk what you're trying to say? Green creature decks are currently outclassed is all. Eldrazi and Ds do creatures bigger and better. I have no narrative other than discussion. I have 10 modern decks so I don't have a pet deck or really a pet type other than one that can't be mentioned here so beyond that I just like talking modern. As far as you personally go, I don't even tend to look at who posts what I just respond how I feel, as we all should imo.
All I'm doing is asking questions, your the one that seems to take exception to that with a condescending attitude. You keep pestering me and then complain when I answer. Just leave me alone
Whats your source for it was created to Deal with counter-top? http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/top-decks/it-also-speaks-itself-2012-09-05 This is the only article I could find talking about it and the only mention of any specific card that it was great to Hate on was Delver of Secrets but again this card was clearly designed just to be a super flexible removal for anything 3 or less without protection from BG or Hexproof. WotC designs for Standard first and foremost always.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Even with that its obvious still a card that they heavily weighted for standard given the article I found about the card. It wasn't like it wasn't a very strong card in Standard it pretty much made 4cc stuff and up the better options when possible because it was just so punishing for the Rev decks to face down that uncounterable removal. Certainly a better attempt than Rending Volley which was designed specifically for Modern.
Whats your source for it was created to Deal with counter-top? http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/top-decks/it-also-speaks-itself-2012-09-05 This is the only article I could find talking about it and the only mention of any specific card that it was great to Hate on was Delver of Secrets but again this card was clearly designed just to be a super flexible removal for anything 3 or less without protection from BG or Hexproof. WotC designs for Standard first and foremost always.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Even with that its obvious still a card that they heavily weighted for standard given the article I found about the card. It wasn't like it wasn't a very strong card in Standard it pretty much made 4cc stuff and up the better options when possible because it was just so punishing for the Rev decks to face down that uncounterable removal. Certainly a better attempt than Rending Volley which was designed specifically for Modern.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
Whats your source for it was created to Deal with counter-top? http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/top-decks/it-also-speaks-itself-2012-09-05 This is the only article I could find talking about it and the only mention of any specific card that it was great to Hate on was Delver of Secrets but again this card was clearly designed just to be a super flexible removal for anything 3 or less without protection from BG or Hexproof. WotC designs for Standard first and foremost always.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Even with that its obvious still a card that they heavily weighted for standard given the article I found about the card. It wasn't like it wasn't a very strong card in Standard it pretty much made 4cc stuff and up the better options when possible because it was just so punishing for the Rev decks to face down that uncounterable removal. Certainly a better attempt than Rending Volley which was designed specifically for Modern.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore. [/quote]
Volley was not Great it was SB fodder and the deck it was designed to hate would often just SB out the reason you even wanted to bring it in for to begin with. Was it played yes, but only because you have to try to use what is available even if it is ineffective (look at hate for things like Tron lands etc... we have hate it see's play but isn't really effective at the desired goal)
Whats your source for it was created to Deal with counter-top? http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/top-decks/it-also-speaks-itself-2012-09-05 This is the only article I could find talking about it and the only mention of any specific card that it was great to Hate on was Delver of Secrets but again this card was clearly designed just to be a super flexible removal for anything 3 or less without protection from BG or Hexproof. WotC designs for Standard first and foremost always.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Even with that its obvious still a card that they heavily weighted for standard given the article I found about the card. It wasn't like it wasn't a very strong card in Standard it pretty much made 4cc stuff and up the better options when possible because it was just so punishing for the Rev decks to face down that uncounterable removal. Certainly a better attempt than Rending Volley which was designed specifically for Modern.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
It's a great example of wotc saying we have x problem in modern so let's try to find a card we can print to help it. Rather than just not worrying about the format. I don't recall too much from that standard that would have justified volley although I may be wrong.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Not too sure if Careful Study would even see play in standard, let alone modern. A draw 2, discard 1 would be fantastic or at this point I'm confident that Opt would be fine.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern URBSome variant of Death's Shadow URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version) JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / Infect
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Even with that its obvious still a card that they heavily weighted for standard given the article I found about the card. It wasn't like it wasn't a very strong card in Standard it pretty much made 4cc stuff and up the better options when possible because it was just so punishing for the Rev decks to face down that uncounterable removal. Certainly a better attempt than Rending Volley which was designed specifically for Modern.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
It's a great example of wotc saying we have x problem in modern so let's try to find a card we can print to help it. Rather than just not worrying about the format. I don't recall too much from that standard that would have justified volley although I may be wrong.
It saw play in standard, it was good against the some of the Dragon mid-range decks. Still a SB card.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Not too sure if Careful Study would even see play in standard, let alone modern. A draw 2, discard 1 would be fantastic or at this point I'm confident that Opt would be fine.
I bet we get Opt before the end of 2018. It's totally fine for the right Standard format, and I believe it's just a matter of time until we see a reprint. I think I'd play a full playset over SV in UW Control. Instant-speed is just so good overall, especially with Snapcaster, and I'd rather dig one less than have that first draw be totally random. Sorcery speed is also awkward with certain Colonnade hands.
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Not too sure if Careful Study would even see play in standard, let alone modern. A draw 2, discard 1 would be fantastic or at this point I'm confident that Opt would be fine.
I bet we get Opt before the end of 2018. It's totally fine for the right Standard format, and I believe it's just a matter of time until we see a reprint. I think I'd play a full playset over SV in UW Control. Instant-speed is just so good overall, especially with Snapcaster, and I'd rather dig one less than have that first draw be totally random. Sorcery speed is also awkward with certain Colonnade hands.
Sure Opt would be fine in Modern, I just don't see them reprinting it for standard. They have no problem with 1cc blind cantrips but they really have pushed Anticipate as the standard acceptable variant for blue dig cantriping.
Top 8:
1 burn - opponents stumbled, good matchups
2 Affinity - experienced players, dodged hate
1 grixis shadow - chose the right deck, dodged gds "hate" decks
2 counters company - dodged some poor matchups
1 esper control - best player skill-wise at this tournament
1 Titan shift - good hands and good matchups
This is from our 50ish player monthly open
No offense, but this is what comes to mind when I see this.
You were already told elves is at 26. Knightfall is a t3 (edit: guess it's t2 on here now but it still has the issue of not being good in the meta) creature combo deck why should it be at the top? Idk what you're trying to say? Green creature decks are currently outclassed is all. Eldrazi and Ds do creatures bigger and better. I have no narrative other than discussion. I have 10 modern decks so I don't have a pet deck or really a pet type other than one that can't be mentioned here so beyond that I just like talking modern. As far as you personally go, I don't even tend to look at who posts what I just respond how I feel, as we all should imo.
I am in the early stages of testing, but the Knightfall version I play has a good matchup vs. Shadow. It's slightly above 50% so far. Eldrazi is pretty terrible. There's no denying that, but it has game vs. many other decks (not Burn though )
I bet we get Opt before the end of 2018. It's totally fine for the right Standard format, and I believe it's just a matter of time until we see a reprint. I think I'd play a full playset over SV in UW Control. Instant-speed is just so good overall, especially with Snapcaster, and I'd rather dig one less than have that first draw be totally random. Sorcery speed is also awkward with certain Colonnade hands.
I personally hope that Wizards opts to just unban Preordain, but looking at the recent Commander bans doesn't have me optimistic.
I saw someone respond that Preordain and Ponder are banned in Commander, yet Demonic Tutor is fine? I certainly agree that something's wrong with that...
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Although it certainly feels 100% wrong, it's not yet. Wizards is used to judge various cards depending of the playability of them in the format. 1v1 Commander had essentially become a blue dominated format. More than 1/3 of the decks were playing Ponder, Preordain, Brainstorm. This change was made so that the format could have a little bit more of a colour diversity.
Now, if you want to play blue you have to settle with cards like Serum Visions, etc which makes all of the colours equally playable. Also, Baral, Chief Of Compliance is a problem. It's just too good in that format. If Demonic Tutor is played in 1 out of 3 decks in the format, it will get the axe also. All of this is a reminder about the fact that Wizards bans cards not because they are just too strong, but only when they are being played too much. Of course this concerns Modern as well.
For example, most of us think Simian Spirit Guide is a busted, unfair card looking to achieve fast kills. It's not a problem right now though; If it becomes one(say if a new deck that T3 kills consistent enough with the card is found), the card will get the axe instant speed.
It's much easier for me to say. I know hardly anything of the Commander format. I thought I had read that Tasigur, the Golden Fang was the best 1 on 1 Commander, but maybe I am mistaken.
I just feel like Wizards is trying to axe Preordain almost completely like they did to Gitaxian Probe. I don't like this. I loved playing those cards in Standard Uw Delver and I don't think that they are too powerful for certain formats.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Lauer: Modern is a format created by players, not developers. So we tend to be hands off, although we try to avoid adding turn-three kills. With Legacy, we sometimes design "answer cards" such as Abrupt Decay being an answer to Counterbalance. When appropriate, we might do that with Modern. But we haven't had to yet.
Note this was from late 2012, hence the "we haven't had to [design "answer cards" for Modern] yet" (which is likely no longer true).
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Not too sure if Careful Study would even see play in standard, let alone modern. A draw 2, discard 1 would be fantastic or at this point I'm confident that Opt would be fine.
Careful Study would be an auto-include in any Dredge deck. There's no way they reprint that for Modern.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
WoTC, thank you for finally announcing the Modern format, an eternal format where everyone can participate.
1 burn - opponents stumbled, good matchups
2 Affinity - experienced players, dodged hate
1 grixis shadow - chose the right deck, dodged gds "hate" decks
2 counters company - dodged some poor matchups
1 esper control - best player skill-wise at this tournament
1 Titan shift - good hands and good matchups
This is from our 50ish player monthly open
No offense, but this is what comes to mind when I see this.
You were already told elves is at 26. Knightfall is a t3 (edit: guess it's t2 on here now but it still has the issue of not being good in the meta) creature combo deck why should it be at the top? Idk what you're trying to say? Green creature decks are currently outclassed is all. Eldrazi and Ds do creatures bigger and better. I have no narrative other than discussion. I have 10 modern decks so I don't have a pet deck or really a pet type other than one that can't be mentioned here so beyond that I just like talking modern. As far as you personally go, I don't even tend to look at who posts what I just respond how I feel, as we all should imo.
I am in the early stages of testing, but the Knightfall version I play has a good matchup vs. Shadow. It's slightly above 50% so far. Eldrazi is pretty terrible. There's no denying that, but it has game vs. many other decks (not Burn though )
Why would I be offended? The event pays out $400 to first with getting an invite to the end of year event. So being in Madison WI it draws a good amount of skilled players as well as not so skilled players. I'm fairly certain at least 2 of the top 8 have gone to at least 1 pt this year (I wasn't there so I'm not 100%). What you said sounds exactly like a modern event to me. You have to dodge bad matchups and avoid hate. Knightfall In the challenge meta doesn't seem like a good choice was my point. The top decks seemed like bad matchups for it. Paper and mtgo are very different metas imo, that's what I was trying to get at. Heck did You see the finals of the tj collectibles stream they had? Not sure how many people but it was 6 rounds and finals was grixis delver vs Cheeri0's lol. Modern is wide open sometimes luck gets you there and sometimes skill does.
Literally every player in every event needs a little luck in dodging bad matchups to make top 8. That's inevitable, especially if there's more than a couple dozen participants. I think it's poisoning the well to take that top 8 and give every single deck an excuse that almost says "no, I know there were six unique decks but really it should have been eight grixis shadow, except this one thing happened..."
That's why it has been said many times that modern rewards understanding your deck as opposed to trying to metagame.
Literally every player in every event needs a little luck in dodging bad matchups to make top 8. That's inevitable, especially if there's more than a couple dozen participants. I think it's poisoning the well to take that top 8 and give every single deck an excuse that almost says "no, I know there were six unique decks but really it should have been eight grixis shadow, except this one thing happened..."
That's why it has been said many times that modern rewards understanding your deck as opposed to trying to metagame.
I agree to an extent but honestly good modern players can play most decks really well. I play a lot of different decks and sure I could pick up a few percentage points just grinding 1 but I think those same points if not more can be picked up just making sure you have a better deck for the meta.
Literally every player in every event needs a little luck in dodging bad matchups to make top 8. That's inevitable, especially if there's more than a couple dozen participants. I think it's poisoning the well to take that top 8 and give every single deck an excuse that almost says "no, I know there were six unique decks but really it should have been eight grixis shadow, except this one thing happened..."
That's why it has been said many times that modern rewards understanding your deck as opposed to trying to metagame.
I agree to an extent but honestly good modern players can play most decks really well. I play a lot of different decks and sure I could pick up a few percentage points just grinding 1 but I think those same points if not more can be picked up just making sure you have a better deck for the meta.
Yeah it does seem too broad to say that "understanding your deck" is more important than metagaming. At a certain point, I think you'll pick up more % to win an event if you give yourself a second or even third option to attack the top decks. Even that is part of the skill of modern: figuring out which deck you should put your practice into. Sometimes your best deck isn't well positioned, and more reps aren't going to change that. The more time you put into the second deck, the more precisely you will know the relative positioning.
UW control seems fairly well positioned now, so I'm jamming that. But I'm normally the Knightfall guy - it's just the meta which gives a number of incentives to attack from a different direction. (Gideon of the trials is such a beating vs Grixis Shadow).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern Decks
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
I feel like the online meta might reward deck choice because of how much more likely you are to see the handful of top decks. At big paper tournaments (read: GP's) you are not near as likely to see those decks. It's entirely possible, and fairly likely, that you won't see multiple copies of the same deck on Day 1 and it won't be until X-0 on day two that you start grinding against the top decks. In that type of a scenario, you get highly rewarded for playing a deck you know in and out against every matchup to make it to those X-0 tables on day two and then having a solid plan for beating the bogeymen if you do encounter them.
That being said, if you know the format really well, even the tier 1.5-2.5 decks you will run into and have a fair amount of experience across a range of decks, your reward for playing a well positioned deck goes up. It's just different points in your modern experience. Early on, knowledge of one deck and experience with it is super key. Eventually you learn the ins and outs of other decks by playing against them. Then, with that knowledge of the format you start learning new strategies and decks. Then once you are that experienced with meta knowledge and knowledge of different decks, you can be rewarded for metagame deck choices.
With both looting and a blue looting I believe hollow one would be a thing to say the least. Dredge probably wouldn't play it because it's blue but if cathartic reunion didn't exist I imagine they would. I personally would love this printing. Hell, I would even take careful study and jam four immediately at this point.
Literally every player in every event needs a little luck in dodging bad matchups to make top 8. That's inevitable, especially if there's more than a couple dozen participants. I think it's poisoning the well to take that top 8 and give every single deck an excuse that almost says "no, I know there were six unique decks but really it should have been eight grixis shadow, except this one thing happened..."
That's why it has been said many times that modern rewards understanding your deck as opposed to trying to metagame.
I agree to an extent but honestly good modern players can play most decks really well. I play a lot of different decks and sure I could pick up a few percentage points just grinding 1 but I think those same points if not more can be picked up just making sure you have a better deck for the meta.
To an extent. I've played in 3 Modern PPTQ seasons and around 5 Standard ones. Here's how it went.
For Modern, I got the RPTQ invite all 3 seasons very easily with Bogles twice and Grishoalbrand once.
For Standard and Limited, I didn't get in once. I got a lot of top 8s, especially in Sealed, despite never practicing those Sealed formats, but was very overmatched in the top 8 each time. For Standard, which I hate with a passion, I top 8ed 2 out of 6 times, even though I practiced a little at FNM and Game Day and crushed there. I will admit for Standard though that I only tried 3-4 PPTQs per season, so I could have tried harder.
So you can see why my bias is that it helps "to an extent." Just because you play one deck well doesn't mean you automatically pick up a deck and play it well. I know that Todd Stevens is a better player than myself. But I also know that I play Cheerios better than he does, just by watching his stream. Nobody plays White based Aggro like Craig Wescoe, but I'm sure there are players here that play Control better than Craig Wescoe.
Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Literally every player in every event needs a little luck in dodging bad matchups to make top 8. That's inevitable, especially if there's more than a couple dozen participants. I think it's poisoning the well to take that top 8 and give every single deck an excuse that almost says "no, I know there were six unique decks but really it should have been eight grixis shadow, except this one thing happened..."
That's why it has been said many times that modern rewards understanding your deck as opposed to trying to metagame.
I agree to an extent but honestly good modern players can play most decks really well. I play a lot of different decks and sure I could pick up a few percentage points just grinding 1 but I think those same points if not more can be picked up just making sure you have a better deck for the meta.
To an extent. I've played in 3 Modern PPTQ seasons and around 5 Standard ones. Here's how it went.
For Modern, I got the RPTQ invite all 3 seasons very easily with Bogles twice and Grishoalbrand once.
For Standard and Limited, I didn't get in once. I got a lot of top 8s, especially in Sealed, despite never practicing those Sealed formats, but was very overmatched in the top 8 each time. For Standard, which I hate with a passion, I top 8ed 2 out of 6 times, even though I practiced a little at FNM and Game Day and crushed there. I will admit for Standard though that I only tried 3-4 PPTQs per season, so I could have tried harder.
So you can see why my bias is that it helps "to an extent." Just because you play one deck well doesn't mean you automatically pick up a deck and play it well. I know that Todd Stevens is a better player than myself. But I also know that I play Cheerios better than he does, just by watching his stream. Nobody plays White based Aggro like Craig Wescoe, but I'm sure there are players here that play Control better than Craig Wescoe.
Except that's a testimony for modern as a I do me you do you and we see who wins. Both of those decks are very low interaction based. PPTQ's aren't that large of a tournament so they are actually sometimes easier to meta game than just playing your 1 deck you've had forever.
Could just be the way I look at it with my experience. I've been playing this game for long before I even knew about these forums or you could just go net deck something quick. I know most modern decks more than well enough to just grab it sit down with it and play.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Such as? You can go down the list and look at the decks I'm not really sure what you're asking about. All random creature decks are like t3 (because of so many reason stated numerous times in this thread) so it's not hard to believe they aren't there.
Big thanks, I was trying to remember and coming up with nothing.
In other news, MaRo has confirmed that Faithless Looting is at the time of writing impossible to reprint into Standard because of how Red now has to discard prior to drawing. (Source)
This, however, opens up for the possibility of a version colorshifted into Blue! Would any deck want it? Would it help the format?
Modern - Cheeri0s (building), Belcher (building), Lantern (building), UW Control (building)
RIP Magic Duels. Wizards will regret what they did to you.
Knightfall, elves. It's pretty clear to me that you have some vendetta against for the past few days. You ignore what im saying and only seem to be interested in trying to disprove me and pushing your narrative. I'm done responding to you
Most control decks wouldn't want it because it's sorcery speed, and does not generate card advantage. Storm sure as heck would love to run Faithless Looting alongside Faithless Blueting.
I wonder if an instant speed Ideas Unbound might see play? Being able to play it and hold it during your opponent's turn would be huge without being gamebreaking.
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
You were already told elves is at 26. Knightfall is a t3 (edit: guess it's t2 on here now but it still has the issue of not being good in the meta) creature combo deck why should it be at the top? Idk what you're trying to say? Green creature decks are currently outclassed is all. Eldrazi and Ds do creatures bigger and better. I have no narrative other than discussion. I have 10 modern decks so I don't have a pet deck or really a pet type other than one that can't be mentioned here so beyond that I just like talking modern. As far as you personally go, I don't even tend to look at who posts what I just respond how I feel, as we all should imo.
All I'm doing is asking questions, your the one that seems to take exception to that with a condescending attitude. You keep pestering me and then complain when I answer. Just leave me alone
Even with that its obvious still a card that they heavily weighted for standard given the article I found about the card. It wasn't like it wasn't a very strong card in Standard it pretty much made 4cc stuff and up the better options when possible because it was just so punishing for the Rev decks to face down that uncounterable removal. Certainly a better attempt than Rending Volley which was designed specifically for Modern.
Volley is a great example of a modern answer comeing through standard. It unfortunately doesn't ever shine because blue creatures just aren't really relevant anymore.
Volley was not Great it was SB fodder and the deck it was designed to hate would often just SB out the reason you even wanted to bring it in for to begin with. Was it played yes, but only because you have to try to use what is available even if it is ineffective (look at hate for things like Tron lands etc... we have hate it see's play but isn't really effective at the desired goal)
It's a great example of wotc saying we have x problem in modern so let's try to find a card we can print to help it. Rather than just not worrying about the format. I don't recall too much from that standard that would have justified volley although I may be wrong.
Not too sure if Careful Study would even see play in standard, let alone modern. A draw 2, discard 1 would be fantastic or at this point I'm confident that Opt would be fine.
URB Some variant of Death's Shadow
URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version)
JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / InfectCommander/EDH
This pile of cards when I feel like it
Death's Shadow discord link
It saw play in standard, it was good against the some of the Dragon mid-range decks. Still a SB card.
I bet we get Opt before the end of 2018. It's totally fine for the right Standard format, and I believe it's just a matter of time until we see a reprint. I think I'd play a full playset over SV in UW Control. Instant-speed is just so good overall, especially with Snapcaster, and I'd rather dig one less than have that first draw be totally random. Sorcery speed is also awkward with certain Colonnade hands.
Sure Opt would be fine in Modern, I just don't see them reprinting it for standard. They have no problem with 1cc blind cantrips but they really have pushed Anticipate as the standard acceptable variant for blue dig cantriping.
No offense, but this is what comes to mind when I see this.
I am in the early stages of testing, but the Knightfall version I play has a good matchup vs. Shadow. It's slightly above 50% so far. Eldrazi is pretty terrible. There's no denying that, but it has game vs. many other decks (not Burn though )
I personally hope that Wizards opts to just unban Preordain, but looking at the recent Commander bans doesn't have me optimistic.
I saw someone respond that Preordain and Ponder are banned in Commander, yet Demonic Tutor is fine? I certainly agree that something's wrong with that...
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)It's much easier for me to say. I know hardly anything of the Commander format. I thought I had read that Tasigur, the Golden Fang was the best 1 on 1 Commander, but maybe I am mistaken.
I just feel like Wizards is trying to axe Preordain almost completely like they did to Gitaxian Probe. I don't like this. I loved playing those cards in Standard Uw Delver and I don't think that they are too powerful for certain formats.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Careful Study would be an auto-include in any Dredge deck. There's no way they reprint that for Modern.
Why would I be offended? The event pays out $400 to first with getting an invite to the end of year event. So being in Madison WI it draws a good amount of skilled players as well as not so skilled players. I'm fairly certain at least 2 of the top 8 have gone to at least 1 pt this year (I wasn't there so I'm not 100%). What you said sounds exactly like a modern event to me. You have to dodge bad matchups and avoid hate. Knightfall In the challenge meta doesn't seem like a good choice was my point. The top decks seemed like bad matchups for it. Paper and mtgo are very different metas imo, that's what I was trying to get at. Heck did You see the finals of the tj collectibles stream they had? Not sure how many people but it was 6 rounds and finals was grixis delver vs Cheeri0's lol. Modern is wide open sometimes luck gets you there and sometimes skill does.
That's why it has been said many times that modern rewards understanding your deck as opposed to trying to metagame.
I agree to an extent but honestly good modern players can play most decks really well. I play a lot of different decks and sure I could pick up a few percentage points just grinding 1 but I think those same points if not more can be picked up just making sure you have a better deck for the meta.
UW control seems fairly well positioned now, so I'm jamming that. But I'm normally the Knightfall guy - it's just the meta which gives a number of incentives to attack from a different direction. (Gideon of the trials is such a beating vs Grixis Shadow).
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
That being said, if you know the format really well, even the tier 1.5-2.5 decks you will run into and have a fair amount of experience across a range of decks, your reward for playing a well positioned deck goes up. It's just different points in your modern experience. Early on, knowledge of one deck and experience with it is super key. Eventually you learn the ins and outs of other decks by playing against them. Then, with that knowledge of the format you start learning new strategies and decks. Then once you are that experienced with meta knowledge and knowledge of different decks, you can be rewarded for metagame deck choices.
Marath, Will of the Wild Tokens!! / Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund Dragons! / Muzzio, Visionary Architect / Brago, King Eternal / Daretti, Scrap Savant / Narset, Enlightened Master / Alesha, Who Smiles at Death / Bruna, Light of Alabaster / Marchesa, the Black Rose / Iroas, God of Victory / Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury / Omnath, Locus of rage / Titania, Protector of Argoth / Kozilek, the Great Distortion
Modern
Elves / Titanshift / Merfolk
To an extent. I've played in 3 Modern PPTQ seasons and around 5 Standard ones. Here's how it went.
For Modern, I got the RPTQ invite all 3 seasons very easily with Bogles twice and Grishoalbrand once.
For Standard and Limited, I didn't get in once. I got a lot of top 8s, especially in Sealed, despite never practicing those Sealed formats, but was very overmatched in the top 8 each time. For Standard, which I hate with a passion, I top 8ed 2 out of 6 times, even though I practiced a little at FNM and Game Day and crushed there. I will admit for Standard though that I only tried 3-4 PPTQs per season, so I could have tried harder.
So you can see why my bias is that it helps "to an extent." Just because you play one deck well doesn't mean you automatically pick up a deck and play it well. I know that Todd Stevens is a better player than myself. But I also know that I play Cheerios better than he does, just by watching his stream. Nobody plays White based Aggro like Craig Wescoe, but I'm sure there are players here that play Control better than Craig Wescoe.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Except that's a testimony for modern as a I do me you do you and we see who wins. Both of those decks are very low interaction based. PPTQ's aren't that large of a tournament so they are actually sometimes easier to meta game than just playing your 1 deck you've had forever.
Could just be the way I look at it with my experience. I've been playing this game for long before I even knew about these forums or you could just go net deck something quick. I know most modern decks more than well enough to just grab it sit down with it and play.