well at least this bannings came before i dropped a bunch of money on steam vents to modernize my pyromancer deck. It still makes me sad that one of my favorite decks in a long time just got the ban hammer pretty hard
The only card that makes little sense is Green Sun's Zenith. R&D has an explanation pending, come Friday, but I imagine that it is not going to divert critics. I will go out and say that this ban is probably an indirect target at Zoo, future ramp decks (using Urzatron), and Melira/Pod builds. It might very well be a mistake. Wizards will, in all likelihood, unban this bad boy within the next 12 months once it becomes clear that it is an unnecessary addition. Given the rest of the banlist, Wizards is allowed this error.
-ktkenshinx-
The reason GSZ got the nix is because it made goyf and to a lesser extend KotR way to powerful. If zoo could run 8 goyfs I'm sure they would, but this is essentially better than 8 goyfs because if goyf is small its a wild nactl, gaddok teeg, pridemage, or KotR.
Also pretty much every elf deck was going to use it, although they have other options that are just a tad bit slower.
AV gives 3 cards after 3 turns, so you see it coming. If you want, you can easily nix, or use another counter on it. It doesn't fuel storm, it doesn't offer card selection, it just restocks your hand. Control wants that, combo not so much. Seems a fine card for the format, in my opinion and it'll help control in the format. They need some love to be able to pull ahead in the lategame.
Actually AV takes 4 turns not counting the turn that you play it. It is probably too slow for this format, thus it doesn't make sense to be banned. Honestly they need to remove several cards that were banned in the initial list and the second list.
Looks like I'll be playing Legacy from now on. I went from playing mostly standard to mostly modern because it WAS a much more fun format. Now they're just going to nerf every deck that gets powerful. I would rather not spend $1,000 every 6 months putting a new tier 1 deck together because Wizards keeps banning every auto-include in the format. They ban cloudpost to stop breachpost because it was keeping control out of the format. Then they ban 2 cards that would be auto includes in any modern control deck and don't unban any good control cards. Way to go Wizards. We now have less fun aggro and combo decks and control will still suck.
So the ability to run through the breach was the problem and not the card that actually powered the engine? Cloudpost itself was keeping control out of the format, because it invalidates every viable counterspell that control has not to mention that hardcast eldrazi before turn 9-10 is completely busted.
Ponder would not have been played in a modern control deck(see combo decks card) and preordain would have only say slight play. This isn't standard where you can run cantrips and expect to win. You need real card draw and tons of it.
well at least this bannings came before i dropped a bunch of money on steam vents to modernize my pyromancer deck. It still makes me sad that one of my favorite decks in a long time just got the ban hammer pretty hard
I assure you that pyromancer's ascension is still very viable.
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GSZ is a mistake. Apparently WotC has decided that they will ban every tutor card that makes an appearance in a top-8 spot. Once. Sweet.
Banning BOTH cantrips was probably a mistake.
The rest is fine.
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You are in the minority of players who want Modern to be completely busted turn 1 wins, matches decided on who wins the die roll. Most who have played that type magic in the past know its no fun in the log run.
I am just happy they are doing something. Its just a step closer to a more balanced format with these bannings. Happy deck building!
Oh, and to those who think 20 ban cards has destroyed the format, theres always Legacy and Vintage for you.
Not at all. I just want there to be aggro, combo and control. NOT, Aggro plus the scattered remains of combo and control decks that have been banned.
Like I said, I played the format before the first extensive wave of unnessicary bannings. Many major archtypes were well represented. Was there fast combo? sure, but guess what? Faeries, stoneforge control and Teachings were there waiting to tear combo decks a new *******. And then Zoo, G/W, Affinity and merfolk would be there to beat up on the control decks.
The first round of bannings took away the control decks that kept combo in check. The second took away combo. A format can only be screwed around with so much before people get sick of the constant bannings, and the format falls apart.
Basically, I think it's terrible for WoTC to tell people they can't play with their cards, and I think that the banned list should be used to neuter oppressive decks, NOT to tailor a format to be inclined towards a certain archtype. If WoTC simply doesn't impliment the first round of terrible bannings, I can promise you that this round wouldn't have happened.
This is somewhat good for me. Some of my strongest match ups were 12post, infect shoal and grapeshot storm, which kinda sucks since they all just got hosed. I am hoping that a few other match ups improved with some of the cards getting cut as well. The only thing I am losing is GSZ, which can easily be replaced by a few different cards.
This round of bannings is good for me too. My Knights and Ninjas aggro deck were struggling against Mono-G 12 posts and Zoo decks which I was testing against recently, therefore banning cloudposts and GSZ can only improve my matchups against them (if anyone is playing posts anymore). Aggro is definitely one of the winners after this second round of banning.
Blazing Shoal is banned.
Cloudpost is banned.
Green Sun's Zenith is banned.(mistake)
Ponder is banned.
Preordain is banned.(mistake)
Rite of Flame is banned.(mistake)
WTf is that
Grenn sun come on just ban everything? so stupid these bans keys that they use suck and are terrible
Banning ponder/preordain u make some blue aggro or control builds to weak
Rite of flame? come on get at least the seeting song and not rite
This round of bannings is good for me too. My Knights and Ninjas aggro deck were struggling against Mono-G 12 posts and Zoo decks which I was testing against recently, therefore banning cloudposts and GSZ can only improve my matchups against them (if anyone is playing posts anymore). Aggro is definitely one of the winners after this second round of banning.
Man not to be bad with you, but come on Ninjas deck? Knights deck come on the bans are not to make the paper and bad decks to be up the bans are a key to make some strategies reliable and some healthy formats
U will Still lose to Tooth and nail decks/Breach decks/Zoo/Doran
The format that was modern was not a good place to have those dekcks and i think it will still the same way
Again not personal atack or something like that but those strategies always lack power and wil still the same
Preodain NO plz
Green Sun No plz (good card but not broken at all)
Those ban tools are getting stupid just ban and go down
Next time they will ban Kikki Jikki too
Blazing Shoal is banned.
Cloudpost is banned.
Green Sun's Zenith is banned.(mistake)
Ponder is banned.
Preordain is banned.(mistake)
Rite of Flame is banned.(mistake)
WTf is that
Grenn sun come on just ban everything? so stupid these bans keys that they use suck and are terrible
Banning ponder/preordain u make some blue aggro or control builds to weak
Rite of flame? come on get at least the seeting song and not rite
Those ban tools are getting stupid just ban and go down
money stuff is ridiculous Mental Mistep lnow is a 1 buck card
Next time they will ban Kikki Jikki too
GSZ is a mistake. Apparently WotC has decided that they will ban every tutor card that makes an appearance in a top-8 spot. Once. Sweet.
Banning BOTH cantrips was probably a mistake.
The rest is fine.
1. Green suns zenith made goyf better than it already was. If you could run 8 copies of tarmogoyf and could afford to you would. This is essentially that.
2. Banning both cantrips is fine I guess not that It really matters since two that are very similar will be used now.
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Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
Not at all. I just want there to be aggro, combo and control. NOT, Aggro plus the scattered remains of combo and control decks that have been banned.
Like I said, I played the format before the first extensive wave of unnessicary bannings. Many major archtypes were well represented. Was there fast combo? sure, but guess what? Faeries, stoneforge control and Teachings were there waiting to tear combo decks a new *******. And then Zoo, G/W, Affinity and merfolk would be there to beat up on the control decks.
The first round of bannings took away the control decks that kept combo in check. The second took away combo. A format can only be screwed around with so much before people get sick of the constant bannings, and the format falls apart.
Basically, I think it's terrible for WoTC to tell people they can't play with their cards, and I think that the banned list should be used to neuter oppressive decks, NOT to tailor a format to be inclined towards a certain archtype. If WoTC simply doesn't impliment the first round of terrible bannings, I can promise you that this round wouldn't have happened.
I find it hard to believe you played prior to the first set of bannings. I did and know Fae was crap and got walked all over. It was actually too slow before the first group of bannings. It sounds as if you just want to play caw-blade in Modern and Wotc made that not possible. I doubt Jace 2.0 or SFM will be unbanned for quite some time. Replacing a heavy combo format with a format dominated by control is not a good trade off for the format. Aggro is always going to be played in all formats to different success levels. The key is to balance the format.
Bt the way, I am a Dredge player and Dregde was almost unplayable prior to the first set of bannings due to the speed of the format. I hope some day Dredge will be playable in Modern, but until then I have other cards and other decks I can play. Its really not the end of the world.
Ok, this is seriously getting ridicolous...
Banning cards at the beginning was a good idea (well, don't understand why dredge but, whatever...). But this? Apart from GSZ everything in the new list was easily answerable:
- posts die horribly to decks playing quarters; fulminator mage and LftL and BeastWithin are in the format; zoo is. At worst, they could have banned crucible of worlds if they feared posts too much.
- blazing shoal? good lord... bolt, path, ghost quarter, repeal, remand, they all answer blazing shoal poison. You can even answer it with a free spell like marrow shards!
- storm? we have white leyline, the split second stifle, the blue trap, ethersworn canonist, luminesce and more and more, and thoughtseize and sculler and castigate
- relic and crypt and leyline and faerie macabre and even more for graveyard based combos
boys, LEARN TO SIDEBOARD!
These bans are simply stupid, period.
(cantrips? really? what are we supposed to do on 1st turn if we don't wanna play a d**n creature!?!?!)
The problem is, and Wizards knows it, sideboards are only 15 cards. Trying to fit all the hate you need for all the decks is almost impossible. Not only that, what you need to stop post, doesnt stop twin. What you need to stop twin, wont stop pyro. What stops Zoo is useless against combo...
Looks like I'll be playing Legacy from now on. I went from playing mostly standard to mostly modern because it WAS a much more fun format. Now they're just going to nerf every deck that gets powerful. I would rather not spend $1,000 every 6 months putting a new tier 1 deck together because Wizards keeps banning every auto-include in the format. They ban cloudpost to stop breachpost because it was keeping control out of the format. Then they ban 2 cards that would be auto includes in any modern control deck and don't unban any good control cards. Way to go Wizards. We now have less fun aggro and combo decks and control will still suck.
This whole notion of Wizards "nerfing" powerful decks as they appear is just misinformed. Wizards is going to try and depower decks that are format warping, sure. Some of the cards that they banned are definitely good in that regard. Cloudpost? That had to go, and there have been so many players arguing for its removal for weeks now. Blazing Shoal? I am sad that it is gone, and I think that the card is quite answerable, but it does lead to turn 2 wins in a format that lacks Force of Will. That makes opening hands too important, and it consigns a lot of games to coin flips.
Wizards is just being conservative with this initial ban update. It is better to shake things up, as Mr. Forsythe intended, rather than to let things stagnate. A Worlds Modern event with the same banlist as PT Philly, or with just Cloudpost added, would be an ugly affair and would result in tanking format popularity. It is going to take time for Wizards to get this format going in the right direction, and players need to realize that. Legacy did not happen over night. Modern's "perfection" will also not happen over night. Give it time and see the rewards.
I think the format is just experiencing growing pains for now honestabe. Give it a year or 2 and it should settle.
Totally agree. Banning the right cards takes time, just as unbanning the wrongly-banned ones takes time. True supporters of an affordable, diverse, and accessible non-rotating format will stick on board with Modern as it works through its rough infancy. Speculators and idealists will leave when things get hard.
Modern is worth sticking out. Wizards cares about the format and will work to make the banlist right. Give it time and stop complaining.
I'm kind of mad about the bans. They're are purposefully nerfing blue as a color and it burns me up. I was so stoked to play Mono Blue or U/x in modern and now without both cantrips, Visions or Jace 2, blue is really underwhelming. Sorry Clique... you're the only blue powerhouse left.
On a related note, sucks for Pryomancer's Ascension players...
I think that it was too early for new modern bans other than shoal (shoal was waaay to fast). One (!) big tournament was played in this new format, meta is still under construction and they ban so many cards already... :/
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Archenemy EDH: Reaper king
I find it hard to believe you played prior to the first set of bannings. I did and know Fae was crap and got walked all over. It was actually too slow before the first group of bannings. It sounds as if you just want to play caw-blade in Modern and Wotc made that not possible. I doubt Jace 2.0 or SFM will be unbanned for quite some time. Replacing a heavy combo format with a format dominated by control is not a good trade off for the format. Aggro is always going to be played in all formats to different success levels. The key is to balance the format.
Bt the way, I am a Dredge player and Dregde was almost unplayable prior to the first set of bannings due to the speed of the format. I hope some day Dredge will be playable in Modern, but until then I have other cards and other decks I can play. Its really not the end of the world.
First I want all turn 1 kill decks, and now I just want to play Caw-blade. You must be a detective or something.
I did indeed play the format before the first set of bannings. I had Faeries, Caw-Blade, Teachings, and Zoo built on modo. Of all the decks, Zoo was the strongest. Followed by Caw-Blade, then Faeries then teachings. BUT of all these decks, Faeries by FAR had the best combo MU. If you try and tell me otherwise, you're simply trolling.
Once again, I don't understand where you think I want a format dominated by control or combo. I want a proper format, where all 3 major archtypes are represented. I've said it before and I'll say it again. I had always proposed Faeries as a good way to keep the combo decks in check without having to ban a million more cards. That means I want faeries to keep combo in check, not control to dominate an entire format.
You also say Faeries was crap in your testing, so why does it need to be banned?
I'm kind of mad about the bans. They're are purposefully nerfing blue as a color and it burns me up. I was so stoked to play Mono Blue or U/x in modern and now without both cantrips, Visions or Jace 2, blue is really underwhelming. Sorry Clique... you're the only blue powerhouse left.
On a related note, sucks for Pryomancer's Ascension players...
ascension is still very viable. Honestly the loss of preordain or ponder doesn't really make a big difference. Actually neither does jace or visions. Control has a few problems none of which are the U cards that are banned.
I think that it was too early for new modern bans other than shoal (shoal was waaay to fast). One (!) big tournament was played in this new format, meta is still under construction and they ban so many cards already... :/
Honesty i like this approach a lot better than seeing the format ruled by the same 2 decks for years on end. Also the lack of control made a pretty noxious meta game.
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Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
I'm glad that they are more or less sticking with the intent they set out for Modern. I want the format they said they were trying to create, and if we have to go through a year of aggressive bannings to get there, I am fine with that.
This. It's a new format, and I expected it to be quite unstable for at least the first year or two. Legacy has had years to reach the point of relative stability and diversity that it has now; anyone who expected Modern to reach that state overnight was bound to be as disappointed as the brewers hoping their midrange-jank was going to stand up to an environment of 12post, Shoal and Storm.
I suspect that no matter what they did with the ban list - even if they left it alone or unbanned all the stuff people wanted unbanned - we'd have a swarm of people saying they don't know what they're doing. It might be a different group of people, but I doubt the numbers would have changed much.
This. It's a new format, and I expected it to be quite unstable for at least the first year or two. Legacy has had years to reach the point of relative stability and diversity that it has now; anyone who expected Modern to reach that state overnight was bound to be disappointed.
I suspect that no matter what they did with the ban list - even if they left it alone or unbanned all the stuff people wanted unbanned - we'd have a swarm of people saying they don't know what they're doing. It might be a different group of people, but I doubt the numbers would have changed much.
TBQH I was one of those people, but they have started to show mental process with a slight ability of cognitive though. Some times it is blatantly clear that they don't know what their doing when they say something like this.
"well up to this point we had not banned anything in blue so"
This kind of thinking shows the logic they have is way to simplistic to still think of this game as a color based game. This is the way that the pros thought of the game at first before several great minds like flores came together and formed magic and card advantage theory, which could also be used to dictate what is overpowered and what is just good. In truth the game is based off of synergy and efficiency and not what color mana symbol is at the top of your cards...at least at the highest levels.
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In life all we can do is try to make things better. Sitting lost in old ways and fearing change only makes us outdated and ignorant.
Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding.
Albert Einstein
Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
TBQH I was one of those people, but they have started to show mental process with a slight ability of cognitive though. Some times it is blatantly clear that they don't know what their doing when they say something like this.
This kind of thinking shows the logic they have is way to simplistic to still think of this game as a color based game. This is the way that the pros thought of the game at first before several great minds like flores came together and formed magic and card advantage theory, which could also be used to dictate what is overpowered and what is just good. In truth the game is based off of synergy and efficiency and not what color mana symbol is at the top of your cards...at least at the highest levels.
Right, sure. No argument there.
But at the same time, I've been watching the game since the days before even the Dojo; when 'net-decks' came from Usenet, you could pick up the P9 for Vintage for under $300 if you shopped around, and extended wasn't even a format yet. And in all that time, I've never seen that whether they demonstrably know what they're doing or not has ever had any affect on the quantity of nay-sayers. The quality, perhaps, but not the quantity.
ascension is still very viable. Honestly the loss of preordain or ponder doesn't really make a big difference. Actually neither does jace or visions. Control has a few problems none of which are the U cards that are banned.
No it isn't. Show me a decklist. All the top tier combo decks have been completely removed from the format. The tier 2 combo decks are the only ones left.
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The reason GSZ got the nix is because it made goyf and to a lesser extend KotR way to powerful. If zoo could run 8 goyfs I'm sure they would, but this is essentially better than 8 goyfs because if goyf is small its a wild nactl, gaddok teeg, pridemage, or KotR.
Also pretty much every elf deck was going to use it, although they have other options that are just a tad bit slower.
Actually AV takes 4 turns not counting the turn that you play it. It is probably too slow for this format, thus it doesn't make sense to be banned. Honestly they need to remove several cards that were banned in the initial list and the second list.
So the ability to run through the breach was the problem and not the card that actually powered the engine? Cloudpost itself was keeping control out of the format, because it invalidates every viable counterspell that control has not to mention that hardcast eldrazi before turn 9-10 is completely busted.
Ponder would not have been played in a modern control deck(see combo decks card) and preordain would have only say slight play. This isn't standard where you can run cantrips and expect to win. You need real card draw and tons of it.
I assure you that pyromancer's ascension is still very viable.
Albert Einstein
Thomas Jefferson
Banning BOTH cantrips was probably a mistake.
The rest is fine.
Not at all. I just want there to be aggro, combo and control. NOT, Aggro plus the scattered remains of combo and control decks that have been banned.
Like I said, I played the format before the first extensive wave of unnessicary bannings. Many major archtypes were well represented. Was there fast combo? sure, but guess what? Faeries, stoneforge control and Teachings were there waiting to tear combo decks a new *******. And then Zoo, G/W, Affinity and merfolk would be there to beat up on the control decks.
The first round of bannings took away the control decks that kept combo in check. The second took away combo. A format can only be screwed around with so much before people get sick of the constant bannings, and the format falls apart.
Basically, I think it's terrible for WoTC to tell people they can't play with their cards, and I think that the banned list should be used to neuter oppressive decks, NOT to tailor a format to be inclined towards a certain archtype. If WoTC simply doesn't impliment the first round of terrible bannings, I can promise you that this round wouldn't have happened.
Ux Whirza
Rb Goblins
Legacy
U Urza Stompy
Duel Commander
Sai, Master Thopterist
FREE BLOODBRAID ELF
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Cloudpost is banned.
Green Sun's Zenith is banned.(mistake)
Ponder is banned.
Preordain is banned.(mistake)
Rite of Flame is banned.(mistake)
WTf is that
Grenn sun come on just ban everything? so stupid these bans keys that they use suck and are terrible
Banning ponder/preordain u make some blue aggro or control builds to weak
Rite of flame? come on get at least the seeting song and not rite
This round of bannings is good for me too. My Knights and Ninjas aggro deck were struggling against Mono-G 12 posts and Zoo decks which I was testing against recently, therefore banning cloudposts and GSZ can only improve my matchups against them (if anyone is playing posts anymore). Aggro is definitely one of the winners after this second round of banning.
Man not to be bad with you, but come on Ninjas deck? Knights deck come on the bans are not to make the paper and bad decks to be up the bans are a key to make some strategies reliable and some healthy formats
U will Still lose to Tooth and nail decks/Breach decks/Zoo/Doran
The format that was modern was not a good place to have those dekcks and i think it will still the same way
Again not personal atack or something like that but those strategies always lack power and wil still the same
Preodain NO plz
Green Sun No plz (good card but not broken at all)
Those ban tools are getting stupid just ban and go down
Next time they will ban Kikki Jikki too
how is Ponder not a mistake, but Preordain is?
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1. Green suns zenith made goyf better than it already was. If you could run 8 copies of tarmogoyf and could afford to you would. This is essentially that.
2. Banning both cantrips is fine I guess not that It really matters since two that are very similar will be used now.
Albert Einstein
Thomas Jefferson
I find it hard to believe you played prior to the first set of bannings. I did and know Fae was crap and got walked all over. It was actually too slow before the first group of bannings. It sounds as if you just want to play caw-blade in Modern and Wotc made that not possible. I doubt Jace 2.0 or SFM will be unbanned for quite some time. Replacing a heavy combo format with a format dominated by control is not a good trade off for the format. Aggro is always going to be played in all formats to different success levels. The key is to balance the format.
Bt the way, I am a Dredge player and Dregde was almost unplayable prior to the first set of bannings due to the speed of the format. I hope some day Dredge will be playable in Modern, but until then I have other cards and other decks I can play. Its really not the end of the world.
I'm a little sad to see Ponder and Preordain go, but not too sad.
I look forward to seeing how the metagame reacts.
The problem is, and Wizards knows it, sideboards are only 15 cards. Trying to fit all the hate you need for all the decks is almost impossible. Not only that, what you need to stop post, doesnt stop twin. What you need to stop twin, wont stop pyro. What stops Zoo is useless against combo...
This whole notion of Wizards "nerfing" powerful decks as they appear is just misinformed. Wizards is going to try and depower decks that are format warping, sure. Some of the cards that they banned are definitely good in that regard. Cloudpost? That had to go, and there have been so many players arguing for its removal for weeks now. Blazing Shoal? I am sad that it is gone, and I think that the card is quite answerable, but it does lead to turn 2 wins in a format that lacks Force of Will. That makes opening hands too important, and it consigns a lot of games to coin flips.
Wizards is just being conservative with this initial ban update. It is better to shake things up, as Mr. Forsythe intended, rather than to let things stagnate. A Worlds Modern event with the same banlist as PT Philly, or with just Cloudpost added, would be an ugly affair and would result in tanking format popularity. It is going to take time for Wizards to get this format going in the right direction, and players need to realize that. Legacy did not happen over night. Modern's "perfection" will also not happen over night. Give it time and see the rewards.
Totally agree. Banning the right cards takes time, just as unbanning the wrongly-banned ones takes time. True supporters of an affordable, diverse, and accessible non-rotating format will stick on board with Modern as it works through its rough infancy. Speculators and idealists will leave when things get hard.
Modern is worth sticking out. Wizards cares about the format and will work to make the banlist right. Give it time and stop complaining.
-ktkenshinx-
On a related note, sucks for Pryomancer's Ascension players...
Commander GU Edric Control
I can see wizards reasons for banning things like the shoal and rite of flame.
Too much combo going on, not enough zoo!
This format will turn into control goyf decks and agro goyf decks.
Decks:
EDH: :symbw::symuw::symub:Merieke Ri Berit:symbw::symuw::symub:
Archenemy EDH: Reaper king
(")(")
GONZO
Genius, fast, and long eared.
First I want all turn 1 kill decks, and now I just want to play Caw-blade. You must be a detective or something.
I did indeed play the format before the first set of bannings. I had Faeries, Caw-Blade, Teachings, and Zoo built on modo. Of all the decks, Zoo was the strongest. Followed by Caw-Blade, then Faeries then teachings. BUT of all these decks, Faeries by FAR had the best combo MU. If you try and tell me otherwise, you're simply trolling.
Once again, I don't understand where you think I want a format dominated by control or combo. I want a proper format, where all 3 major archtypes are represented. I've said it before and I'll say it again. I had always proposed Faeries as a good way to keep the combo decks in check without having to ban a million more cards. That means I want faeries to keep combo in check, not control to dominate an entire format.
You also say Faeries was crap in your testing, so why does it need to be banned?
ascension is still very viable. Honestly the loss of preordain or ponder doesn't really make a big difference. Actually neither does jace or visions. Control has a few problems none of which are the U cards that are banned.
Honesty i like this approach a lot better than seeing the format ruled by the same 2 decks for years on end. Also the lack of control made a pretty noxious meta game.
Albert Einstein
Thomas Jefferson
This. It's a new format, and I expected it to be quite unstable for at least the first year or two. Legacy has had years to reach the point of relative stability and diversity that it has now; anyone who expected Modern to reach that state overnight was bound to be as disappointed as the brewers hoping their midrange-jank was going to stand up to an environment of 12post, Shoal and Storm.
I suspect that no matter what they did with the ban list - even if they left it alone or unbanned all the stuff people wanted unbanned - we'd have a swarm of people saying they don't know what they're doing. It might be a different group of people, but I doubt the numbers would have changed much.
TBQH I was one of those people, but they have started to show mental process with a slight ability of cognitive though. Some times it is blatantly clear that they don't know what their doing when they say something like this.
This kind of thinking shows the logic they have is way to simplistic to still think of this game as a color based game. This is the way that the pros thought of the game at first before several great minds like flores came together and formed magic and card advantage theory, which could also be used to dictate what is overpowered and what is just good. In truth the game is based off of synergy and efficiency and not what color mana symbol is at the top of your cards...at least at the highest levels.
Albert Einstein
Thomas Jefferson
Right, sure. No argument there.
But at the same time, I've been watching the game since the days before even the Dojo; when 'net-decks' came from Usenet, you could pick up the P9 for Vintage for under $300 if you shopped around, and extended wasn't even a format yet. And in all that time, I've never seen that whether they demonstrably know what they're doing or not has ever had any affect on the quantity of nay-sayers. The quality, perhaps, but not the quantity.
No it isn't. Show me a decklist. All the top tier combo decks have been completely removed from the format. The tier 2 combo decks are the only ones left.
EDHCommanderWUBSharuum the HegemonBUW
UGRRiku of the Two ReflectionsRGU
Clan Limited