Obviously in any eternal format with some type of check and balance system, there is a defined meta with certain archetypes that beat certain other types of decks.
From this, it's been widely understood that most eternal formats fall into a "rock paper scissors" category with aggro, control, and combo around.
That being said, I think it's time we rethink this broken cliche. Magic has changed a LOT since the time where we could legitimately say that rock paper scissors was true. If going by the previous assumption of a "rock paper scissors" meta, here is how it would look.
Aggro > Control
Combo > Aggro
Control > Combo
There are a few problems with this line of thought these days..
First, the idea that aggro is by default a bad matchup for control just isn't true anymore. This of course depends entirely on how the control deck is built, but if we're assuming a deck like Tron is a control deck, then there is no way that Aggro is by default better than control.
Second, we also should stop assuming control > combo. Once again, this all just comes down to tuning. Certain combo decks are really really good against control decks, but are royally awful vs. aggro decks. (Ad nauseam/Lightning Storm combo is a good example). In legacy, decks like high tide generally have a good control matchup as well.
Third, echoing the previous two comments, we should already realize that aggro isn't the dog to combo it once was. A zoo deck with maindeck pridemages and Thalias will have anywhere from 10-13 maindeck answers to a high tier combo deck such as Splinter Twin, and this isn't even accounting for the fact that Zoo can frequently just out-clock twin. The same goes for aggro vs. storm combo or just about any other combo. The days of aggro decks simply turning vanilla creatures sideways and playing burn spells are a thing of the past.
On top of other misconceptions..
We should consider the fact that the meta isn't a 3-prong game of rock paper scissors. In a VERY (as in very generalized and spotty) broad conceptualization, this is probably a more accurate depiction of archetypes in modern..
Control > Combo, Aggro
Tempo > Combo, Control,
Ramp (tron in modern) > Tempo, Control, Midrange
Combo > Aggro, Ramp, Midrange
Aggro > Tempo, Midrange
Midrange > Control, Aggro, Tempo
Once again, this is woefully unbalanced and isn't intended to describe how all matchups will actually turn out. More of a deck's success comes down to tuning (hence a good aggro deck can easily have a favorable matchup vs. combo and control if tuned properly). But further than that, we can see there are realistically 6 different archetypes here, and that doesn't even start to count hybrid strategies such as Melira (midrange/combo).
I think the most important part to keep in mind, and this is a bit more of a newcomer (mostly due to Emrakul being printed) is that we should start assuming that ramp decks will typically have favorable matchups against any deck without a particularly fast clock. In a format without wasteland to keep it in check, ramp is the best way to beat "fair" decks in the format.
In any case, feel free to discuss, I just wanted to add my $.02 on the really inaccurate thought of the meta being defined by rock paper scissors.
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Find me online - I'm on Cockatrice * Tag - Badd B - Or on MTGO - Tag - Cbus05
For the most part, I agree with your re-evaluation.
Having said that, there are some matchups that are just awful and short of getting a bad draw, there is no way around it.
If I'm playing a deck with heavy permission and removal and going up against a deck that's combo off of a few cards or even just two, stopping the combo is a piece of cake. I'd have to fall over stone cold dead not to beat this deck.
If the deck I'm playing against tries to stop control from stopping its game, then in order to do that, it has to water down its deck with these particular cards, thus slowing the combo down OR making it less likely to come up at all.
For every action you take when building a deck, there is a cost to that action. If your deck is built on on strategy but folds to another strategy (I'm talking pure forms here) then there is no way to get around that other than to remove cards from that deck and replace with other cards in order to improve that matchup. When you do that, you're weakening other parts of the deck. There is no way around this.
The good news to what I just said is that everybody is in the same boat. It's not like only one archetype is going to adjust. They all have to or die. So Magic has become a more hybrid kind of game.
Add to that the fact that in some areas certain cards are weaker now than they were back in the old days (I'm speaking about modern and standard in particular) and certain archetypes have no choice but to adapt. Old school permission in modern doesn't exist. The card pool isn't strong enough (No FoW, Counterspell, etc.) So control decks have to adapt.
With midrange, ramp, etc., aggro has to adapt. Once a weenie deck runs into a Titan or whatever, it's tough getting passed them. So they have to adapt.
Conversely, ramp can't just concentrate all its early resources on ramping to a big fatty because that big fatty is too easily dealt with. So a ramp deck has to have some early threats. Look what Wolf Run did in standard by including Huntmaster.
Ultimately, what's going to happen is we're going to see Magic become a pure hybrid system and the old stereotyped archetypes aren't going to exist anymore, if that hasn't already happened.
Take a look at UR Storm vs Affinty. The way storm has adapted to disruption has been nothing short of inspiring, now including cards like Delver and Wurmcoil in the sideboard. Expect this to continue as decks find that they can't win playing a pure rock, paper or scissors.
Having said all that, you're still going to have lopsided matchups. There is no way around that. But that's good for the game. Once one kind of deck dominates, that's when Magic falls apart because then everybody plays that deck and you're playing nothing but mirror matches all day long.
Taking a look at this passed modern season at all the different decks that have won, it's obvious that magic in general is quite healthy and modern in particular is very healthy.
Well, Spock has to be combo control since he's got that Vulcan mind meld thing going. That's about as combo control as you're going to get.
Makes sense, so Tempo is Lizard. Fitting, just like those slippery bastard Geckos we get here in the desert. Have you ever tried catching a Gecko? Those little buggers are fast, and just when you think you've got them, poof they disappear. Sort of like your life total against Delver or Geist. :D:p
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Legacy Decks
~~~~~~~~~
Too many to list efficiently. Find me online with the same SN if you want to play, or message me here to set up a time to play.
Modern
~~~~~~~~~
Whatever pile of 75 I throw together the night before without testing. Usually: :symb::symu::symg:
where is good ole slipknot when you need him to totally spam all over this thread and up my reported post count...
I think RPS is really defunct once you expand the card pool over more than 5 blocks. You can just look at archetypes like Bant that can be built multiple ways and try to sit there thinking.. is this aggro, is it control, is it aggro-control, is it midrange or what does any of that mean????
There are so very few decks that are even built the same way, I mean you may have 50 cards in common in your jund decks but those other 10 can strengthen the deck against some archetypes but not others.
Then you have hate bears like Thalia who mess with strategies like Assault Loam, but are largely ineffective against Rampa Tron dispite the focus on spells due to the massive piles of mana the deck can generate.
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Out of the blackness and stench of the engulfing swamp emerged a shimmering figure. Only the splattered armor and ichor-stained sword hinted at the unfathomable evil the knight had just laid waste.
where is good ole slipknot when you need him to totally spam all over this thread and up my reported post count...
I think RPS is really defunct once you expand the card pool over more than 5 blocks. You can just look at archetypes like Bant that can be built multiple ways and try to sit there thinking.. is this aggro, is it control, is it aggro-control, is it midrange or what does any of that mean????
There are so very few decks that are even built the same way, I mean you may have 50 cards in common in your jund decks but those other 10 can strengthen the deck against some archetypes but not others.
Then you have hate bears like Thalia who mess with strategies like Assault Loam, but are largely ineffective against Rampa Tron dispite the focus on spells due to the massive piles of mana the deck can generate.
I stopped thinking in RPS mode a long time ago. It's more about individual matchups and starting hands now. For some matchups certain hands you keep can lead to assured victory, where as the same pile of 60 can also have hands that will lead to just dying before you can do anything relevant.
The matchup always starts with the 75 that you chose to sleeve up before you leave the house though. From there you get your shuffling and keeps, and then into decision trees, and optimal play. RPS is obsolete.
Some players are all about learning the in's and out's of an established deck. Others, like myself, are all about Meta-gaming and building to hate out the dominant strategies of a given Meta. Either is a viable methodology, but the difference lies in the win percentage. Players that know the in's and out's of a given archetype tend to win more often and consistently. Some of us though like a challenge, and enjoy brewing though.
Just to add, Slipknot being banned is actually a good thing IMO. He was constantly abrasive and could not reasonably understand people with different play styles than his own. This sort of makes the community a less tolerable one for some of us, and even harder for the newer player's to get accurate information without feeling as if the community is hostile to them. None of us really have anything against new players, at least I do not see it in a regular environment at a LGS. That should not be the face being put forward in this community here.
I stopped thinking in RPS mode a long time ago. It's more about individual matchups and starting hands now. For some matchups certain hands you keep can lead to assured victory, where as the same pile of 60 can also have hands that will lead to just dying before you can do anything relevant.
The matchup always starts with the 75 that you chose to sleeve up before you leave the house though. From there you get your shuffling and keeps, and then into decision trees, and optimal play. RPS is obsolete.
Some players are all about learning the in's and out's of an established deck. Others, like myself, are all about Meta-gaming and building to hate out the dominant strategies of a given Meta. Either is a viable methodology, but the difference lies in the win percentage. Players that know the in's and out's of a given archetype tend to win more often and consistently. Some of us though like a challenge, and enjoy brewing though.
This is very accurate and well put. I love to brew, and I have a knack for creating rogue decks that assassinate the meta. To win with any kind of consistency in this format you must take advantage of how little creativity people have. Whatever deck I am playing, be it an aggro deck or a control deck, I build it with meta hate cards.
For example, I have a -monster- WR control deck that maindecks Leyline of Sanctity. Most people would consider the leyline a sideboard card, but this is how to assassinate a meta. You must find cards that hate on the meta BUT also provide you with a good amount of utility.
When combined with Ensnaring Bridge the leyline makes you impervious to all threats. The fact that it makes red and black based decks scoop in on turn 0 is icing on the cake.
Control doesn't seem to be a strong enough deck in this format to actually be considered as a tier 1 archetype though. I mean, I like control and all, but control doesnt really beat much at all as far as the major deck archetypes go. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
Control doesn't seem to be a strong enough deck in this format to actually be considered as a tier 1 archetype though. I mean, I like control and all, but control doesnt really beat much at all as far as the major deck archetypes go. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
Control isn't really weak in modern, BUT Blue based control decks are clearly weaker now. Just look at how many blue cards are on the ban list, and the loss of Bitterblossom basically removed Fae from the scene entirely. Without Fae or Cawblade, blue lacks the consistency it once had.
I'm not saying that is a bad thing, I really like how WOTC is forcing control players to let go of their security blanket of counterspells and instead start thinking of new ways to control the game.
Consider the interaction of the following cards: Ghostly Prison, Ensnaring Bridge, Leyline of Sanctity. Each card is useful individually and together they form a complete board lock. Now just toss in a Planeswalker of your choice as a finisher, Ajani Vengeant and Elspeth, Knight-Errant are my personal favorites, but you can also use Venser, or the new Sorin and accomplish the same thing. Now you have yourself a nice control deck framework that can be adjusted to your personal meta. Just pick whatever color your want to add to white and you are off and running.
Control isn't dead, but controls base color has shifted from blue to white in modern. The sooner people realize that the sooner you will see control decks become more common.
Control doesn't seem to be a strong enough deck in this format to actually be considered as a tier 1 archetype though. I mean, I like control and all, but control doesnt really beat much at all as far as the major deck archetypes go. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
Control is a meta decision to be honest. Its not like there is a control deck that can be built that can be brought to any tournament and do some damage. But if you can think ahead and meta right it can destroy the field. Just ask all those who lost to mono blue control a while back.
Also what Memory Lapse says is true. Control isnt just blue anymore. Its hard for some blue mages to shift into other colors to play their favorite archtype.
This is very accurate and well put. I love to brew, and I have a knack for creating rogue decks that assassinate the meta. To win with any kind of consistency in this format you must take advantage of how little creativity people have. Whatever deck I am playing, be it an aggro deck or a control deck, I build it with meta hate cards.
For example, I have a -monster- WR control deck that maindecks Leyline of Sanctity. Most people would consider the leyline a sideboard card, but this is how to assassinate a meta. You must find cards that hate on the meta BUT also provide you with a good amount of utility.
When combined with Ensnaring Bridge the leyline makes you impervious to all threats. The fact that it makes red and black based decks scoop in on turn 0 is icing on the cake.
I have that deck together as well. I only bring it out for major events, as I don't want to get hated out and let people actually figured out a SB plan for it. It doesn't do as well against the Delver decks, but it's matchup against the Grixis Fae is still really good. Against Delver I found that just mulling into Combust is usually the right answer.
Control doesn't seem to be a strong enough deck in this format to actually be considered as a tier 1 archetype though. I mean, I like control and all, but control doesnt really beat much at all as far as the major deck archetypes go. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
BUG is a really good control deck with good matchups across the board. They are not all over-whelming matchups, as the UWR and Grixis Fae matchups are very grindy, but winnable.
It's just so few people play it because of the cost of the deck itself. When I put it together I counted out the total for it, and it's easily a $1k deck on the low side. That is one instance where I will that cost is the limiting factoring for a playable deck.
Control isn't really weak in modern, BUT Blue based control decks are clearly weaker now. Just look at how many blue cards are on the ban list, and the loss of Bitterblossom basically removed Fae from the scene entirely. Without Fae or Cawblade, blue lacks the consistency it once had.
Fae is still really good without Bitterblossom. It just needs to be build in the right colors to make up for the loss of BB. The Grixis version is ridiculously good. It's another Bob deck, but the amount reach and how fast it can take over the game and kill is pretty impressive. I've played against it a lot, and it won a local PTQ. It's worse matchup is the more Mono-U Fae due to the Cryptic Commands. That Fae deck gets hated out by everyone else pretty easily though, so over all it's a good one to run.
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Legacy Decks
~~~~~~~~~
Too many to list efficiently. Find me online with the same SN if you want to play, or message me here to set up a time to play.
Modern
~~~~~~~~~
Whatever pile of 75 I throw together the night before without testing. Usually: :symb::symu::symg:
I have that deck together as well. I only bring it out for major events, as I don't want to get hated out and let people actually figured out a SB plan for it. It doesn't do as well against the Delver decks, but it's matchup against the Grixis Fae is still really good. Against Delver I found that just mulling into Combust is usually the right answer.
Delver is one of my best matchups. They have the same weaknesses as a slow aggro deck, with fewer counterspells than a traditional blue control deck. All of delver's removal cards are dead in their hands. Basically if any one of my permanents hits the board its gg for them. Just cast your hand, and save the ensnaring bridge for last.
I dont see grixis Fae online so I really have no idea what its about.
My version has an excellent game vs. all forms of aggro and all current popular combo decks BUT it does have a weakness: heavy blue counterspell brews. But then again, no one online is playing heavy blue counterspell brews because blue has had its balls cut off in modern via the ban list.
I find it weird that you (OP) talk about RPS in Eternal formats and then update the definitions using a non-eternal format...
Anyway, in Duel Commander it's hard to define such schemes. Control, Aggro and Combo are divided in many sub-categories. Aggro can have many forms and almost always a little bit of combo; combo can use your graveyard, or creatures or none. Control also has many forms, since it can be Daretti or Jace who use the graveyard a lot or things like Arbiter and Geist where the graveyard is not that important.
Here you're combating strategies. You don't play Phyrexian Furnace and Scrabbling Claws because of combo. You play it to fight "graveyard based strategies". Some of them are combo, some are not (Meren, for example). You don't play Cursed Totem to fight Aggro. You play it to fight a plethora of things that suffer against it, as elfball and a few commanders themselves.
So the fact is I don't even know how a pie would work in our format. Every deck has strengths against other decks and strategies or not; but it's very hard for a deck to have a good matchup against all Aggro/Combo/Control decks in the format.
A good example is Daretti. I've been playing it for a while now, and it has awesome matches against aggro in general. But aggro with black is hard. Combo is good too, but Reanimator and gy based strategies are hard. Control is harder, but Geist and Vendilion are way harder then the rest. You see, there's no way to talk about Rock-Papers-Scissors anymore. That thinking is gone, even if you add Spock and Lizard.
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From this, it's been widely understood that most eternal formats fall into a "rock paper scissors" category with aggro, control, and combo around.
That being said, I think it's time we rethink this broken cliche. Magic has changed a LOT since the time where we could legitimately say that rock paper scissors was true. If going by the previous assumption of a "rock paper scissors" meta, here is how it would look.
Aggro > Control
Combo > Aggro
Control > Combo
There are a few problems with this line of thought these days..
First, the idea that aggro is by default a bad matchup for control just isn't true anymore. This of course depends entirely on how the control deck is built, but if we're assuming a deck like Tron is a control deck, then there is no way that Aggro is by default better than control.
Second, we also should stop assuming control > combo. Once again, this all just comes down to tuning. Certain combo decks are really really good against control decks, but are royally awful vs. aggro decks. (Ad nauseam/Lightning Storm combo is a good example). In legacy, decks like high tide generally have a good control matchup as well.
Third, echoing the previous two comments, we should already realize that aggro isn't the dog to combo it once was. A zoo deck with maindeck pridemages and Thalias will have anywhere from 10-13 maindeck answers to a high tier combo deck such as Splinter Twin, and this isn't even accounting for the fact that Zoo can frequently just out-clock twin. The same goes for aggro vs. storm combo or just about any other combo. The days of aggro decks simply turning vanilla creatures sideways and playing burn spells are a thing of the past.
On top of other misconceptions..
We should consider the fact that the meta isn't a 3-prong game of rock paper scissors. In a VERY (as in very generalized and spotty) broad conceptualization, this is probably a more accurate depiction of archetypes in modern..
Control > Combo, Aggro
Tempo > Combo, Control,
Ramp (tron in modern) > Tempo, Control, Midrange
Combo > Aggro, Ramp, Midrange
Aggro > Tempo, Midrange
Midrange > Control, Aggro, Tempo
Once again, this is woefully unbalanced and isn't intended to describe how all matchups will actually turn out. More of a deck's success comes down to tuning (hence a good aggro deck can easily have a favorable matchup vs. combo and control if tuned properly). But further than that, we can see there are realistically 6 different archetypes here, and that doesn't even start to count hybrid strategies such as Melira (midrange/combo).
I think the most important part to keep in mind, and this is a bit more of a newcomer (mostly due to Emrakul being printed) is that we should start assuming that ramp decks will typically have favorable matchups against any deck without a particularly fast clock. In a format without wasteland to keep it in check, ramp is the best way to beat "fair" decks in the format.
In any case, feel free to discuss, I just wanted to add my $.02 on the really inaccurate thought of the meta being defined by rock paper scissors.
Having said that, there are some matchups that are just awful and short of getting a bad draw, there is no way around it.
If I'm playing a deck with heavy permission and removal and going up against a deck that's combo off of a few cards or even just two, stopping the combo is a piece of cake. I'd have to fall over stone cold dead not to beat this deck.
If the deck I'm playing against tries to stop control from stopping its game, then in order to do that, it has to water down its deck with these particular cards, thus slowing the combo down OR making it less likely to come up at all.
For every action you take when building a deck, there is a cost to that action. If your deck is built on on strategy but folds to another strategy (I'm talking pure forms here) then there is no way to get around that other than to remove cards from that deck and replace with other cards in order to improve that matchup. When you do that, you're weakening other parts of the deck. There is no way around this.
The good news to what I just said is that everybody is in the same boat. It's not like only one archetype is going to adjust. They all have to or die. So Magic has become a more hybrid kind of game.
Add to that the fact that in some areas certain cards are weaker now than they were back in the old days (I'm speaking about modern and standard in particular) and certain archetypes have no choice but to adapt. Old school permission in modern doesn't exist. The card pool isn't strong enough (No FoW, Counterspell, etc.) So control decks have to adapt.
With midrange, ramp, etc., aggro has to adapt. Once a weenie deck runs into a Titan or whatever, it's tough getting passed them. So they have to adapt.
Conversely, ramp can't just concentrate all its early resources on ramping to a big fatty because that big fatty is too easily dealt with. So a ramp deck has to have some early threats. Look what Wolf Run did in standard by including Huntmaster.
Ultimately, what's going to happen is we're going to see Magic become a pure hybrid system and the old stereotyped archetypes aren't going to exist anymore, if that hasn't already happened.
Take a look at UR Storm vs Affinty. The way storm has adapted to disruption has been nothing short of inspiring, now including cards like Delver and Wurmcoil in the sideboard. Expect this to continue as decks find that they can't win playing a pure rock, paper or scissors.
Having said all that, you're still going to have lopsided matchups. There is no way around that. But that's good for the game. Once one kind of deck dominates, that's when Magic falls apart because then everybody plays that deck and you're playing nothing but mirror matches all day long.
Taking a look at this passed modern season at all the different decks that have won, it's obvious that magic in general is quite healthy and modern in particular is very healthy.
You may be right. I'm just not sure who Lizard and Spock is.
One is Tempo, and the other would be Combo Control? Seems reasonable, but which is which, that is the real question.
~~~~~~~~~
Too many to list efficiently. Find me online with the same SN if you want to play, or message me here to set up a time to play.
Modern
~~~~~~~~~
Whatever pile of 75 I throw together the night before without testing. Usually: :symb::symu::symg:
Well, Spock has to be combo control since he's got that Vulcan mind meld thing going. That's about as combo control as you're going to get.
Makes sense, so Tempo is Lizard. Fitting, just like those slippery bastard Geckos we get here in the desert. Have you ever tried catching a Gecko? Those little buggers are fast, and just when you think you've got them, poof they disappear. Sort of like your life total against Delver or Geist. :D:p
~~~~~~~~~
Too many to list efficiently. Find me online with the same SN if you want to play, or message me here to set up a time to play.
Modern
~~~~~~~~~
Whatever pile of 75 I throw together the night before without testing. Usually: :symb::symu::symg:
I think RPS is really defunct once you expand the card pool over more than 5 blocks. You can just look at archetypes like Bant that can be built multiple ways and try to sit there thinking.. is this aggro, is it control, is it aggro-control, is it midrange or what does any of that mean????
There are so very few decks that are even built the same way, I mean you may have 50 cards in common in your jund decks but those other 10 can strengthen the deck against some archetypes but not others.
Then you have hate bears like Thalia who mess with strategies like Assault Loam, but are largely ineffective against Rampa Tron dispite the focus on spells due to the massive piles of mana the deck can generate.
I stopped thinking in RPS mode a long time ago. It's more about individual matchups and starting hands now. For some matchups certain hands you keep can lead to assured victory, where as the same pile of 60 can also have hands that will lead to just dying before you can do anything relevant.
The matchup always starts with the 75 that you chose to sleeve up before you leave the house though. From there you get your shuffling and keeps, and then into decision trees, and optimal play. RPS is obsolete.
Some players are all about learning the in's and out's of an established deck. Others, like myself, are all about Meta-gaming and building to hate out the dominant strategies of a given Meta. Either is a viable methodology, but the difference lies in the win percentage. Players that know the in's and out's of a given archetype tend to win more often and consistently. Some of us though like a challenge, and enjoy brewing though.
Just to add, Slipknot being banned is actually a good thing IMO. He was constantly abrasive and could not reasonably understand people with different play styles than his own. This sort of makes the community a less tolerable one for some of us, and even harder for the newer player's to get accurate information without feeling as if the community is hostile to them. None of us really have anything against new players, at least I do not see it in a regular environment at a LGS. That should not be the face being put forward in this community here.
~~~~~~~~~
Too many to list efficiently. Find me online with the same SN if you want to play, or message me here to set up a time to play.
Modern
~~~~~~~~~
Whatever pile of 75 I throw together the night before without testing. Usually: :symb::symu::symg:
I don't know if this makes any sense but the diagram is pretty epic.
This is very accurate and well put. I love to brew, and I have a knack for creating rogue decks that assassinate the meta. To win with any kind of consistency in this format you must take advantage of how little creativity people have. Whatever deck I am playing, be it an aggro deck or a control deck, I build it with meta hate cards.
For example, I have a -monster- WR control deck that maindecks Leyline of Sanctity. Most people would consider the leyline a sideboard card, but this is how to assassinate a meta. You must find cards that hate on the meta BUT also provide you with a good amount of utility.
When combined with Ensnaring Bridge the leyline makes you impervious to all threats. The fact that it makes red and black based decks scoop in on turn 0 is icing on the cake.
Modern Junk Primer
Legacy ANT Primer
L1 Judge
Control isn't really weak in modern, BUT Blue based control decks are clearly weaker now. Just look at how many blue cards are on the ban list, and the loss of Bitterblossom basically removed Fae from the scene entirely. Without Fae or Cawblade, blue lacks the consistency it once had.
I'm not saying that is a bad thing, I really like how WOTC is forcing control players to let go of their security blanket of counterspells and instead start thinking of new ways to control the game.
Consider the interaction of the following cards: Ghostly Prison, Ensnaring Bridge, Leyline of Sanctity. Each card is useful individually and together they form a complete board lock. Now just toss in a Planeswalker of your choice as a finisher, Ajani Vengeant and Elspeth, Knight-Errant are my personal favorites, but you can also use Venser, or the new Sorin and accomplish the same thing. Now you have yourself a nice control deck framework that can be adjusted to your personal meta. Just pick whatever color your want to add to white and you are off and running.
Control isn't dead, but controls base color has shifted from blue to white in modern. The sooner people realize that the sooner you will see control decks become more common.
Control is a meta decision to be honest. Its not like there is a control deck that can be built that can be brought to any tournament and do some damage. But if you can think ahead and meta right it can destroy the field. Just ask all those who lost to mono blue control a while back.
Also what Memory Lapse says is true. Control isnt just blue anymore. Its hard for some blue mages to shift into other colors to play their favorite archtype.
Anyone else still trying to figure this out?
I hope this wasn't troll... I'm thoroughly intrigued.
I have that deck together as well. I only bring it out for major events, as I don't want to get hated out and let people actually figured out a SB plan for it. It doesn't do as well against the Delver decks, but it's matchup against the Grixis Fae is still really good. Against Delver I found that just mulling into Combust is usually the right answer.
BUG is a really good control deck with good matchups across the board. They are not all over-whelming matchups, as the UWR and Grixis Fae matchups are very grindy, but winnable.
It's just so few people play it because of the cost of the deck itself. When I put it together I counted out the total for it, and it's easily a $1k deck on the low side. That is one instance where I will that cost is the limiting factoring for a playable deck.
Fae is still really good without Bitterblossom. It just needs to be build in the right colors to make up for the loss of BB. The Grixis version is ridiculously good. It's another Bob deck, but the amount reach and how fast it can take over the game and kill is pretty impressive. I've played against it a lot, and it won a local PTQ. It's worse matchup is the more Mono-U Fae due to the Cryptic Commands. That Fae deck gets hated out by everyone else pretty easily though, so over all it's a good one to run.
~~~~~~~~~
Too many to list efficiently. Find me online with the same SN if you want to play, or message me here to set up a time to play.
Modern
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Whatever pile of 75 I throw together the night before without testing. Usually: :symb::symu::symg:
Delver is one of my best matchups. They have the same weaknesses as a slow aggro deck, with fewer counterspells than a traditional blue control deck. All of delver's removal cards are dead in their hands. Basically if any one of my permanents hits the board its gg for them. Just cast your hand, and save the ensnaring bridge for last.
I dont see grixis Fae online so I really have no idea what its about.
My version has an excellent game vs. all forms of aggro and all current popular combo decks BUT it does have a weakness: heavy blue counterspell brews. But then again, no one online is playing heavy blue counterspell brews because blue has had its balls cut off in modern via the ban list.
Thus: I have a meta assassin deck.
Anyway, in Duel Commander it's hard to define such schemes. Control, Aggro and Combo are divided in many sub-categories. Aggro can have many forms and almost always a little bit of combo; combo can use your graveyard, or creatures or none. Control also has many forms, since it can be Daretti or Jace who use the graveyard a lot or things like Arbiter and Geist where the graveyard is not that important.
Here you're combating strategies. You don't play Phyrexian Furnace and Scrabbling Claws because of combo. You play it to fight "graveyard based strategies". Some of them are combo, some are not (Meren, for example). You don't play Cursed Totem to fight Aggro. You play it to fight a plethora of things that suffer against it, as elfball and a few commanders themselves.
So the fact is I don't even know how a pie would work in our format. Every deck has strengths against other decks and strategies or not; but it's very hard for a deck to have a good matchup against all Aggro/Combo/Control decks in the format.
A good example is Daretti. I've been playing it for a while now, and it has awesome matches against aggro in general. But aggro with black is hard. Combo is good too, but Reanimator and gy based strategies are hard. Control is harder, but Geist and Vendilion are way harder then the rest. You see, there's no way to talk about Rock-Papers-Scissors anymore. That thinking is gone, even if you add Spock and Lizard.