sideboard is got slaughter pact, tormod's crypt, surgical extraction, dismember, Mindbreak Trap in varying numbers. I was designing the deck to be able to tap out on a rune-scarred demon and have a tool box of answers for games 2 and 3. So far i'm happy with the way demon has performed in games 2 and 3 getting me 1 card answers (some times hail maries, cause i need them as stoppers.)
roughest match up seems to be spirits i'm 0-4 against this in games.
trons never been a huge threat.
arclight pheonix decks occationally get me by surprise. 2/3 3 surgicals in the side seems to keep that shut off.
@dos_rogue : it just seems to be a bad shuffle between rock, ponza and amulet titan.
Ligth disrupt, no discard, very slow values, very slow clock, average PW..
I think Big Rock looks fun, but probably not meant to be a true competitve deck. I would sleeve it up for FNM and I imagine I would really enjoy crushing with a deck no one sees coming. Keep on Rockin'!
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He raged at the world, at his family, at his life. But mostly he just raged.
Modern: BG Rock, Grixis Control, UW Control
Commander: Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
"Win or lose, naught to choose - all men are equal when their memory fades. No one knows, friends or foes, if Valhalla lies beyond the grave." - Motörhead “Deaf Forever”
Saw this list on MtgGoldfish and it was interesting in that it has 4 main deck kalitas, traitor of ghet and only 2 liliana of the veil. I will probably sleeve it up on MTGO, but also wanted to see if anyone else thought it was good... or perhaps just lucky.
He raged at the world, at his family, at his life. But mostly he just raged.
Modern: BG Rock, Grixis Control, UW Control
Commander: Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
"Win or lose, naught to choose - all men are equal when their memory fades. No one knows, friends or foes, if Valhalla lies beyond the grave." - Motörhead “Deaf Forever”
@shocker_nation :
It's strange, i think kalitas is a really good now but 4 is a little too much, you are rarely happy to have 2 kalitas in hand except if you face dredge, burn, humans and spirits all the day and even it's not always good.
By the way SCG's IQ are not a high level tournament if i am correct ? It's close than PPTQ i guess.
I can see a 3rd kalitas in SB but no more imo.
@Pikupstyks : Board out LotV and some tarmogoyfs, board any removals or value creatures, if you have leyline of the void, you should board in too but it's harder to know what board out, probably ooze and keep all the goyfs i don't know in that case.
Just to clarify Kalitas,Traitor of Ghet and Leyline of the Void do not allow the Modular trigger to resolve after death because they never hit the graveyard, is that correct? Is it the same for Hangerback Walker because its a replacement effect of death? I don't run LotV in my sideboard but I run two Kalitas main board so that will help. What is the difference in running Damnation over Languish? I currently run one Languish and one Engineered Explosives for board sweepers. Is there a better argument for Damnation over Languish? What is the argument for each card?
One of Hardened Scales main win-cons is Infect via Inkmoth Nexus so anything that destroys a land is good. Another major win-con is Walking Ballista and the third is Hangarback Walker. Engineered Explosives is perfect for these last two. Artifact hate is of course good for all three as long as it is Instant-speed.
The lynch pin of all three of these win cons is the synergy between Arcbound Ravager and Hardened Scales. Anyway of shutting down the modular effect is good. With these two cards and any one of their three win-cons just mentioned, they can assemble lethal damage or Infect stupidly quickly.
Steel Overseer is a much slower way of getting the counters where they need to be but with Scales they can add up faster. Anything that can kill an artifact is good.
I would say Damnation is a better card here than Languish as it's not too tough for them to bulk up a Ravager to 5+; it's comically easy if Hardened Scales is in play. Alternatively they can move the counters to a Walker or a Ballista. Yes Languish might make them very vulnerable to a single targeted removal spell, but if you tap out to cast Languish or are Hellbent, they might just kill you next turn. Either card can leave an number of Hangerback flyers in it's aftermath.
If this is too basic I apologize. But maybe it will help someone.
^ good advice above from pzbw7z. As far as Languish vs Damnation, I agree, but a point worth noting in favor of Languish is that it gets around Welding Jar. Regardless, both wrath effects are for sure worth bringing in vs Scales, but neither is foolproof, and IMO it’s a little hard to say which one is better positioned in the broad meta right now.
Your siding looks fine, pikupstyks, especially if you’re utilizing those Fulminators, but I’d also consider bringing in your CoBru. Even as a simple early kill spell it can be worthwhile; and, like Languish, it bypasses Welding Jar. Not everyone’s 75 warrants Brutalities against Scales, but you’re a tad light on tech for the matchup so it may work.
@ShockerNation: I expected 4x Kalitas to be a build-around (Slaughter Pact and/or 25 lands, for instance), but nope! Looks like they just more or less took a relatively stock list with 2 maindecked Kalitas, swapped two LoTV out for another pair of Kalitas, and called it good lol. I can’t imagine a world in which that’s optimal, but well done to the pilot for sure!
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GB Golgari Midrange GB YouTube Channel, with deck techs, gameplay, analysis, spoiler reviews, and more!
Damnation also gets around Welding Jar, it's written on the card
Anyway, I think the main arguments for Languish is that it gets around selfless spirit and also there's the upside that it might leave some of your own creatures left on the battlefield. Also Languish kan kill stuff like Hazoret (though it does not seem to be played that much anymore). Damnation is for sure the better sweeper against scales specifically I'd say - languish (when it gets to resolve) is real good against spirits however.
I have really been liking 2 Kalitas main. I can't imagine going higher than that for a legandary creature, though it must be said that if you have one on the battlefield already and you avoid casting the second one due to the legendary rule - you're probably in great shape already.
Damnation also gets around Welding Jar, it's written on the card
Well, this is what I get for trying to post during intermittent downtimes at work. May this forever stand as a monument to the parable: READ THE CARD, haha!
I agree with the rest of your takes here. There are some real hosers against us that aren’t seeing a great deal of play at the moment, and Haz is certainly one of them ( Mirran Crusader also comes to mind).
It’s really interesting how “unsolved” the BG wrath debate is. 0, 1, or 2 total copies in the 75 are all viable choices IMO. I do think that opting for the latter means you should probably split the difference with one of each, but it’s genuinely hard to say if there’s a decisively better call if you’re only dedicating one slot to these effects.
Looking forward to tonight’s announcement, btw. Pernicious Deed direct-to-Modern special delivery? Stranger things have happened!
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I was thinking of trying 4 Gonti, Lord of Luxury in that spot.
Which wouldn't make much sense if that spots critical for the life gain and graveyard disruption all in one.
All the same though stealing opponents resources can be useful.
I was thinking of trying 4 Gonti, Lord of Luxury in that spot.
Which wouldn't make much sense if that spots critical for the life gain and graveyard disruption all in one.
All the same though stealing opponents resources can be useful.
I'm skeptical any four-drop is relevant against Burn or Dredge.
@Grim_Flayer: I've been playing 1 Damnation and 1 Languish for quite a while - which has worked nicely for me. If I were to stick with one or the other however - right now I think that would be Damnation. I like the applications against spirits with Languish - but it is mostly due to them not expecting it, I think most players have adjusted by now and also the chance that you get to "get them" with this are extremely slim. If Languish is good (as in better than damnation) chances are you are already dead.
Makes sense to me, kaster! Personally, I choose to dedicate just one slot to the four-mana sweepers, and I’ve been on the fence between the two for a while. Moving forward I’m very strongly considering increasing my Dark Confidant count from 3 to 4—I’ll actually be sitting down with my list today to see whether I can make that change without upsetting the balance of my list—and if the 4th Bob comes aboard, I think that’ll be my cue to finally pivot from Languish to Damnation. Such a close call!
What are people’s impressions of the newly-spoiled Cabal Therapist? I suppose the “beginning of your precombat main phase” clause sorta kills the prospect of its applications for us as part of an effective, traditional curve. Regardless, it’s interesting design—just wish we weren’t waiting until May for more Horizons spoilers!
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Makes sense to me, kaster! Personally, I choose to dedicate just one slot to the four-mana sweepers, and I’ve been on the fence between the two for a while. Moving forward I’m very strongly considering increasing my Dark Confidant count from 3 to 4—I’ll actually be sitting down with my list today to see whether I can make that change without upsetting the balance of my list—and if the 4th Bob comes aboard, I think that’ll be my cue to finally pivot from Languish to Damnation. Such a close call!
What are people’s impressions of the newly-spoiled Cabal Therapist? I suppose the “beginning of your precombat main phase” clause sorta kills the prospect of its applications for us as part of an effective, traditional curve. Regardless, it’s interesting design—just wish we weren’t waiting until May for more Horizons spoilers!
I would love to try him if I'm able to finish building the Rock by then (damn you Bob and Lili for being so damn expensive!) but I feel like I'd need a good sacrifice outlet for him, not sure if the Rock runs any creatures that can keep coming back (besides sacrificing zombie tokens from Kalitas/Last Hope).
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Makes sense to me, kaster! Personally, I choose to dedicate just one slot to the four-mana sweepers, and I’ve been on the fence between the two for a while. Moving forward I’m very strongly considering increasing my Dark Confidant count from 3 to 4—I’ll actually be sitting down with my list today to see whether I can make that change without upsetting the balance of my list—and if the 4th Bob comes aboard, I think that’ll be my cue to finally pivot from Languish to Damnation. Such a close call!
What are people’s impressions of the newly-spoiled Cabal Therapist? I suppose the “beginning of your precombat main phase” clause sorta kills the prospect of its applications for us as part of an effective, traditional curve. Regardless, it’s interesting design—just wish we weren’t waiting until May for more Horizons spoilers!
I would love to try him if I'm able to finish building the Rock by then (damn you Bob and Lili for being so damn expensive!) but I feel like I'd need a good sacrifice outlet for him, not sure if the Rock runs any creatures that can keep coming back (besides sacrificing zombie tokens from Kalitas/Last Hope).
Kitchen finks. The other thing is you could play thoughtseize or inquisition turn 1, him turn 2 and have him sacrifice himself.
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Modern
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Finally managed to grab all the cards through trading and vendors at GP LA! Highlights included a Spanish Bob going for $35, and 2 Chinese Liliana, the Last Hope, for $10 off market price.
I managed to get full playsets of Verdant Catacombs, Liliana of the Veil, and Bob, only having to spend $50 actual cash and emptying my trade binder for the rest. I can finally play the deck I've fantasized about ever since it thrashed me during one of my first Modern events.
My list is below, any general tips/advice for a new Rock player?
Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
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[deck]
4 primeval titan
4 rune-scarred demon
4 arbor elf
1 birds of paradise
1 eternal witness
2 courser of kruphix
1 liliana, the last hope
1 vraska, golgari queen
3 garruk wildspeaker
4 liliana of the veil
3 assassin's trophy
1 slaughter pact
3 fatal push
4 utopia sprawl
2 kessig wolf run
1 bojuka bog
1 khalni garden
1 stomping ground
4 overgrown tomb
4 verdent catacomb
2 wooded foot hills
1 swamp
8 forest
[deck]
sideboard is got slaughter pact, tormod's crypt, surgical extraction, dismember, Mindbreak Trap in varying numbers. I was designing the deck to be able to tap out on a rune-scarred demon and have a tool box of answers for games 2 and 3. So far i'm happy with the way demon has performed in games 2 and 3 getting me 1 card answers (some times hail maries, cause i need them as stoppers.)
roughest match up seems to be spirits i'm 0-4 against this in games.
trons never been a huge threat.
arclight pheonix decks occationally get me by surprise. 2/3 3 surgicals in the side seems to keep that shut off.
What do you think if BIG Rock?
Ligth disrupt, no discard, very slow values, very slow clock, average PW..
"Penguin is Evil ?"
Modern: BG Rock, Grixis Control, UW Control
Commander: Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
"Win or lose, naught to choose - all men are equal when their memory fades. No one knows, friends or foes, if Valhalla lies beyond the grave." - Motörhead “Deaf Forever”
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/modern-the-rock-50881#paper
Modern: BG Rock, Grixis Control, UW Control
Commander: Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
"Win or lose, naught to choose - all men are equal when their memory fades. No one knows, friends or foes, if Valhalla lies beyond the grave." - Motörhead “Deaf Forever”
It's strange, i think kalitas is a really good now but 4 is a little too much, you are rarely happy to have 2 kalitas in hand except if you face dredge, burn, humans and spirits all the day and even it's not always good.
By the way SCG's IQ are not a high level tournament if i am correct ? It's close than PPTQ i guess.
I can see a 3rd kalitas in SB but no more imo.
"Penguin is Evil ?"
"Penguin is Evil ?"
My current sideboard:
I have thought about cutting one of the Fulminator Mage in place of a Grafdigger's Cage with the sudden pop up of Collected Company
Currently how I have sideboard against harden Scales has been:
Cut:
Add:
I've thought about cutting Tireless Tracker (x2 main board) and adding in Fulminator Mage x2, any thoughts on this?
The lynch pin of all three of these win cons is the synergy between Arcbound Ravager and Hardened Scales. Anyway of shutting down the modular effect is good. With these two cards and any one of their three win-cons just mentioned, they can assemble lethal damage or Infect stupidly quickly.
Steel Overseer is a much slower way of getting the counters where they need to be but with Scales they can add up faster. Anything that can kill an artifact is good.
I would say Damnation is a better card here than Languish as it's not too tough for them to bulk up a Ravager to 5+; it's comically easy if Hardened Scales is in play. Alternatively they can move the counters to a Walker or a Ballista. Yes Languish might make them very vulnerable to a single targeted removal spell, but if you tap out to cast Languish or are Hellbent, they might just kill you next turn. Either card can leave an number of Hangerback flyers in it's aftermath.
If this is too basic I apologize. But maybe it will help someone.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Your siding looks fine, pikupstyks, especially if you’re utilizing those Fulminators, but I’d also consider bringing in your CoBru. Even as a simple early kill spell it can be worthwhile; and, like Languish, it bypasses Welding Jar. Not everyone’s 75 warrants Brutalities against Scales, but you’re a tad light on tech for the matchup so it may work.
@ShockerNation: I expected 4x Kalitas to be a build-around (Slaughter Pact and/or 25 lands, for instance), but nope! Looks like they just more or less took a relatively stock list with 2 maindecked Kalitas, swapped two LoTV out for another pair of Kalitas, and called it good lol. I can’t imagine a world in which that’s optimal, but well done to the pilot for sure!
YouTube Channel, with deck techs, gameplay, analysis, spoiler reviews, and more!
Anyway, I think the main arguments for Languish is that it gets around selfless spirit and also there's the upside that it might leave some of your own creatures left on the battlefield. Also Languish kan kill stuff like Hazoret (though it does not seem to be played that much anymore). Damnation is for sure the better sweeper against scales specifically I'd say - languish (when it gets to resolve) is real good against spirits however.
I have really been liking 2 Kalitas main. I can't imagine going higher than that for a legandary creature, though it must be said that if you have one on the battlefield already and you avoid casting the second one due to the legendary rule - you're probably in great shape already.
Well, this is what I get for trying to post during intermittent downtimes at work. May this forever stand as a monument to the parable: READ THE CARD, haha!
I agree with the rest of your takes here. There are some real hosers against us that aren’t seeing a great deal of play at the moment, and Haz is certainly one of them ( Mirran Crusader also comes to mind).
It’s really interesting how “unsolved” the BG wrath debate is. 0, 1, or 2 total copies in the 75 are all viable choices IMO. I do think that opting for the latter means you should probably split the difference with one of each, but it’s genuinely hard to say if there’s a decisively better call if you’re only dedicating one slot to these effects.
Looking forward to tonight’s announcement, btw. Pernicious Deed direct-to-Modern special delivery? Stranger things have happened!
YouTube Channel, with deck techs, gameplay, analysis, spoiler reviews, and more!
I'm wondering if it is also necessary for over coming burn match ups?
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/modern-the-rock-50881#paper
I was thinking of trying 4 Gonti, Lord of Luxury in that spot.
Which wouldn't make much sense if that spots critical for the life gain and graveyard disruption all in one.
All the same though stealing opponents resources can be useful.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
What are people’s impressions of the newly-spoiled Cabal Therapist? I suppose the “beginning of your precombat main phase” clause sorta kills the prospect of its applications for us as part of an effective, traditional curve. Regardless, it’s interesting design—just wish we weren’t waiting until May for more Horizons spoilers!
YouTube Channel, with deck techs, gameplay, analysis, spoiler reviews, and more!
I would love to try him if I'm able to finish building the Rock by then (damn you Bob and Lili for being so damn expensive!) but I feel like I'd need a good sacrifice outlet for him, not sure if the Rock runs any creatures that can keep coming back (besides sacrificing zombie tokens from Kalitas/Last Hope).
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Kitchen finks. The other thing is you could play thoughtseize or inquisition turn 1, him turn 2 and have him sacrifice himself.
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Wish they would just print cabal therapy in modern.
Begining of the main phase isn't conducive to effective cabal therapy use.
I managed to get full playsets of Verdant Catacombs, Liliana of the Veil, and Bob, only having to spend $50 actual cash and emptying my trade binder for the rest. I can finally play the deck I've fantasized about ever since it thrashed me during one of my first Modern events.
My list is below, any general tips/advice for a new Rock player?
4 Dark Confidant
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Tireless Tracker
Lands
4 Blooming Marsh
2 Field of Ruin
2 Forest
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Hissing Quagmire
2 Overgrown Tomb
5 Swamp
2 Treetop Village
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Liliana of the Veil
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
Spells
3 Assassin's Trophy
2 Collective Brutality
3 Fatal Push
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Mishra's Bauble
3 Thoughtseize
1 Damnation
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Fulminator Mage
1 Ishkanah, Grafwidow
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Nissa, Vital Force
1 Raking Canopy
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Yahenni's Expertise
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."