You would either need to cut a Last Hope or a Pulse for it. I prefer the 2 - 1 - 1 configuration between K Command, Last Hope and Pulse. Sometimes K Command can be irrelevant
Kind of off topic but if we can convince someone to make an updated banner like we have now but with Steve Argyle's BBE incorporated in there (minus the words "JUND") I'd be very interested in getting a high res down load of it to have made into a custom playmat.
Aside from that. In the past I've played some number of Slaughter Games in the sideboard as a catch all/I dont know what else to put in this slot kind of card if I'm going into a blind meta. Now with BBE being able to cascade into lost legacy the card has crossed my mind. Anyone tried it yet?
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Standard // nRG Aggro
Modern // Burn (main) and Living End (secondary) now Jund.
For fun check out my janky combo primer: Turn 3 Grixis Combo
"Can't beat em' Jund em'!"
I ulted on 6 lands so my LOTV hit the bin. My line of reasoning is that - against control decks playing red and snaps, i try to ult LOTV as soon as I can given that they have many ways to damage LOTV (bolt, helix, kommand, cryptic bounce etc). I knew he was on the Burkart 8 command grixis list with 4 snaps so he had many live topdecks. Even an Opt or serum visions is scary as he can filter into an answer. If I was greedy and went to 7 before ulting, I run the risk of him drawing an answer to LOTV. Therefore I ult immediately.
If I play against pure UW control, they have less answers to LOTV ult. I can only think of 3-4 cryptics (depending on JTMS density), 1-2 D sphere, 1-2 celestial purge, 1-2 snaps. the chances of fading a topdeck from them is better so I feel better to going to 7 before ulting.
Anyway, in that game, as @FlyingDelver pointed out, I would have won or had a much higher chance of winning had I shut him off red instead of the piles I chose. it was the kommand rebuying tasigur that did me in. oh well.
Sorry for double posting, but today I played 20 games with 24 lands. I get mana screwed / unable to hit 4 lands on turn 4 in at least 7 of these games. I am beginning to agree that 25 lands is the correct configuration, given the clunky 8 3-CMC spells and 4 bloodbraids. Extremely frustrating to see a control opponent developing his mana while you have 2 Elves stranded in hand and unable to apply pressure. you get put on the back foot instead.
Sorry for double posting, but today I played 20 games with 24 lands. I get mana screwed / unable to hit 4 lands on turn 4 in at least 7 of these games. I am beginning to agree that 25 lands is the correct configuration, given the clunky 8 3-CMC spells and 4 bloodbraids. Extremely frustrating to see a control opponent developing his mana while you have 2 Elves stranded in hand and unable to apply pressure. you get put on the back foot instead.
You had a raging ravine attacking him. All you had to do was uptick. He can't surprise you with an ambush viper, he can't target a spell that kills ravine, and your LOTV would have survived an attack from snapcaster and bolt.
You super misplayed and it sounds like this is a mistake you make a lot. Raging Ravine and LOTV lock is almost a combo synergy minus a very good topdeck.
If you didn't have raging ravine disregard what I wrote, if not, you need to reconsider your strategy of getting overexcited to blow up a few lands from a fair deck.
EDIT: It isn't clear if you had the raging ravine on board before you had LOTV on 6. If you did, then yeah, this looks like inexperience or sloppy play. Snap can't surprise push the ravine if you just keep ticking up. At worst your lotv takes some hits and he's forced to block a gigantic ravine.
I ulted on 6 lands so my LOTV hit the bin. My line of reasoning is that - against control decks playing red and snaps, i try to ult LOTV as soon as I can given that they have many ways to damage LOTV (bolt, helix, kommand, cryptic bounce etc). I knew he was on the Burkart 8 command grixis list with 4 snaps so he had many live topdecks. Even an Opt or serum visions is scary as he can filter into an answer. If I was greedy and went to 7 before ulting, I run the risk of him drawing an answer to LOTV. Therefore I ult immediately.
If I play against pure UW control, they have less answers to LOTV ult. I can only think of 3-4 cryptics (depending on JTMS density), 1-2 D sphere, 1-2 celestial purge, 1-2 snaps. the chances of fading a topdeck from them is better so I feel better to going to 7 before ulting.
Anyway, in that game, as @FlyingDelver pointed out, I would have won or had a much higher chance of winning had I shut him off red instead of the piles I chose. it was the kommand rebuying tasigur that did me in. oh well.
Ok My Reasoning would be that if he is on 0 Cards in Hand, the only real bad spell for us from grixis would be dreadbore or Cryptic in dreadbore mode(Bounce in respone to discard), snap bolt leaves us with a liliana on 3 (Taking 5 Loyality), but we have 2 Draws in the mean time and still have a Liliana to downtick, it is safe against kolaghans command (if he does not have snap and bolt in the grave). Evrything Else she can handle very well. Or is there a line of play i did not see?
Even if we screw him on red, he can just draw a fetch and find another red source and his deck opperats nearly fully on 4 Mana
In a situation, where both players are out of cards and we have a Liliana out on 6 loyalty, I personally happily ulti her, especially if I get to take my opponent off a colour like in the situation described. I do not value the +1 of LoTV anyway, since both players are out of cards. Her -2 is not something I would save for a Snapcaster, since that 2/1 body is not what we are scared of, it is the flashbacked cards. And if I get to put my opponent back on lands I do not only prevent red spells at least next turn, but also Snapcaster + Cryptic and Snapacaster + KCommand for example. My opponent would need to topdeck a red source AND then an impactful spell. I think that given that LoTV is generally not doing much (except for ulting, which we did) I don't mind sacrifing her to set my opponent back on so many levels. We could even more or less safely start attacking with manlands that way. I think we would be quite far ahead at this point, and a greedy play in going up to 7 is more often than not punished.
I did see that a couple of times from GBx players at my LGS. In topdeck wars, they tend to be greedy with LoTV, but unless the -2 matters, its not worth it most of the time because the ulti is soo strong and we could easily get punished by that.
That being said, ofc there is an upside to ticking up Lili to 7. However, my experience has shown, that most of the time, we should just ulti her.
IIRC I drew the ravine either on the turn I ulted LOTV, or the turn after that. My notes are unclear. I know that I had no cards in hand at that point in time though.
Be that as it may, was I prioritizing his lands too much? Against control I get antsy when they get to a high land threshold so I wanted to bring his land count down. Probably a better idea to keep the LOTV ticking up. On an empty board, I should be keeping the LOTV around instead, I agree.
If I already have a Ravine in play, the correct play is to keep her around for sure.
Live and learn, I was punished with a loss so at least it helps me remember.
I got destroyed by a 5 color aggro deck. Noble Hierarch, voice of resurgence, kitchen finks, mantis rider, tribal flames, lingering souls, and Blood-braid Elf was just too much aggression and value for me to handle.
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Modern
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Tribal Zoo is very legit right now, I was playing it last night on MTGO. There's been some kind of list in almost all of the 5-0 League dumps since BBE was unbanned.
// 5 Sorcery
SB: 2 Collective Brutality
SB: 1 Anger of the Gods
SB: 1 Thoughtseize
SB: 1 Maelstrom Pulse
So a few things; yes I'm playing 5 basics. I think basics are extremely good right now and I haven't missed the eighth fetch. The mire is there to help balance the W from godless shrine. Lingering souls has made up sooooo much ground in certain matches and has already won me multiple games by itself. The drawbacks are mainly just that I am down a LOTLH, bolt, and I moved the seizes to the board. But I don't miss any of that too much. So far, I am 10-5 in competitive MODO leagues. I've actually faced a fair amount of rough matchups and I've been winning them. I don't think I could go back to regular jund again honestly.
v. Kiki Evo 1-0
v. mono u tron 1-0
v. Bant Knightfall 1-0
v. GR Ponza 0-2
v. Jund 1-1
v. Grixis Control 1-1
v. eldrazi tron 1-0
v. UB Mill 1-0
v. G Tron 1-0
v. burn 1-0
v. goblins 1-0
v. Storm 0-1
Doesn't this just fall apart to blood moon and all the field of ruin decks? Having to rely on LOTV or collective brutalities to discard lingering souls seems loose.
that's why you play 5 basics. So far, I have had 0 issues with field of ruin. Moon has hurt but it always does when it comes down on T2 from Ponza. Souls makes up for being slightly weaker against Moon. Try it before you judge it mang
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Standard: Bant Approach, Grixis Control
Modern: Mono U Tron, Ajundi, Ad Nauseam, TITI Moon, GR Ponza, 5C Humans
Legacy: Lands, Mono Red Sneak, 4C Loam
Tribal Zoo is very legit right now, I was playing it last night on MTGO. There's been some kind of list in almost all of the 5-0 League dumps since BBE was unbanned.
Zoo sounds legit, I wonder what the best creature base. Nacatl, Goyf, BBE, bolts, tribal flames. It looks gross. It also looks like it's actually fast.
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Yes, please. I cut the sideboard Liliana, the Last Hope for a third Kolaghan's Command.
BRGJUNDGRB---BRHOLLOW ONERB---BGELVESGB---BRGLIVING ENDGRB---GWBOGLESWG
EDH:
BRGKARRTHUS, TYRANT OF JUNDGRB
Would be very awesome But, if you do it, make sure to use Steve Argyle's art
Aside from that. In the past I've played some number of Slaughter Games in the sideboard as a catch all/I dont know what else to put in this slot kind of card if I'm going into a blind meta. Now with BBE being able to cascade into lost legacy the card has crossed my mind. Anyone tried it yet?
Modern // Burn (main) and Living End (secondary) now Jund.
For fun check out my janky combo primer: Turn 3 Grixis Combo
"Can't beat em' Jund em'!"
If I play against pure UW control, they have less answers to LOTV ult. I can only think of 3-4 cryptics (depending on JTMS density), 1-2 D sphere, 1-2 celestial purge, 1-2 snaps. the chances of fading a topdeck from them is better so I feel better to going to 7 before ulting.
Anyway, in that game, as @FlyingDelver pointed out, I would have won or had a much higher chance of winning had I shut him off red instead of the piles I chose. it was the kommand rebuying tasigur that did me in. oh well.
You had a raging ravine attacking him. All you had to do was uptick. He can't surprise you with an ambush viper, he can't target a spell that kills ravine, and your LOTV would have survived an attack from snapcaster and bolt.
You super misplayed and it sounds like this is a mistake you make a lot. Raging Ravine and LOTV lock is almost a combo synergy minus a very good topdeck.
If you didn't have raging ravine disregard what I wrote, if not, you need to reconsider your strategy of getting overexcited to blow up a few lands from a fair deck.
EDIT: It isn't clear if you had the raging ravine on board before you had LOTV on 6. If you did, then yeah, this looks like inexperience or sloppy play. Snap can't surprise push the ravine if you just keep ticking up. At worst your lotv takes some hits and he's forced to block a gigantic ravine.
In a situation, where both players are out of cards and we have a Liliana out on 6 loyalty, I personally happily ulti her, especially if I get to take my opponent off a colour like in the situation described. I do not value the +1 of LoTV anyway, since both players are out of cards. Her -2 is not something I would save for a Snapcaster, since that 2/1 body is not what we are scared of, it is the flashbacked cards. And if I get to put my opponent back on lands I do not only prevent red spells at least next turn, but also Snapcaster + Cryptic and Snapacaster + KCommand for example. My opponent would need to topdeck a red source AND then an impactful spell. I think that given that LoTV is generally not doing much (except for ulting, which we did) I don't mind sacrifing her to set my opponent back on so many levels. We could even more or less safely start attacking with manlands that way. I think we would be quite far ahead at this point, and a greedy play in going up to 7 is more often than not punished.
I did see that a couple of times from GBx players at my LGS. In topdeck wars, they tend to be greedy with LoTV, but unless the -2 matters, its not worth it most of the time because the ulti is soo strong and we could easily get punished by that.
That being said, ofc there is an upside to ticking up Lili to 7. However, my experience has shown, that most of the time, we should just ulti her.
Be that as it may, was I prioritizing his lands too much? Against control I get antsy when they get to a high land threshold so I wanted to bring his land count down. Probably a better idea to keep the LOTV ticking up. On an empty board, I should be keeping the LOTV around instead, I agree.
If I already have a Ravine in play, the correct play is to keep her around for sure.
Live and learn, I was punished with a loss so at least it helps me remember.
I'm not that excited to ult LOTV for their lands unless either
-They're a ramp deck or have very expensive threats
-There's a manland/search for Azcanta I need gone
-Blowing up all lands or all creatures
I'm not super thrilled cutting people off color if I have the Ravine and LOTV lock.
Decks like Grixis and Jeskai topdeck just fine if they have four lands against us.
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
// 60 Maindeck
// 14 Creature
4 Dark Confidant
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Bloodbraid Elf
// 8 Instant
1 Fatal Push
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Terminate
2 Kolaghan's Command
1 Abrupt Decay
// 24 Land
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Blood Crypt
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Forest
1 Overgrown Tomb
3 Raging Ravine
1 Stomping Ground
2 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Mountain
1 Godless Shrine
1 Twilight Mire
// 4 Planeswalker
4 Liliana of the Veil
// 10 Sorcery
1 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Thoughtseize
1 Dreadbore
1 Collective Brutality
3 Lingering Souls
// 15 Sideboard
// 2 Artifact
SB: 2 Nihil Spellbomb
// 5 Creature
SB: 3 Fulminator Mage
SB: 1 Grim Lavamancer
SB: 1 Kitchen Finks
// 2 Instant
SB: 2 Ancient Grudge
// 1 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Liliana, the Last Hope
// 5 Sorcery
SB: 2 Collective Brutality
SB: 1 Anger of the Gods
SB: 1 Thoughtseize
SB: 1 Maelstrom Pulse
So a few things; yes I'm playing 5 basics. I think basics are extremely good right now and I haven't missed the eighth fetch. The mire is there to help balance the W from godless shrine. Lingering souls has made up sooooo much ground in certain matches and has already won me multiple games by itself. The drawbacks are mainly just that I am down a LOTLH, bolt, and I moved the seizes to the board. But I don't miss any of that too much. So far, I am 10-5 in competitive MODO leagues. I've actually faced a fair amount of rough matchups and I've been winning them. I don't think I could go back to regular jund again honestly.
v. Kiki Evo 1-0
v. mono u tron 1-0
v. Bant Knightfall 1-0
v. GR Ponza 0-2
v. Jund 1-1
v. Grixis Control 1-1
v. eldrazi tron 1-0
v. UB Mill 1-0
v. G Tron 1-0
v. burn 1-0
v. goblins 1-0
v. Storm 0-1
Modern: Mono U Tron, Ajundi, Ad Nauseam, TITI Moon, GR Ponza, 5C Humans
Legacy: Lands, Mono Red Sneak, 4C Loam
Modern: Mono U Tron, Ajundi, Ad Nauseam, TITI Moon, GR Ponza, 5C Humans
Legacy: Lands, Mono Red Sneak, 4C Loam
Zoo sounds legit, I wonder what the best creature base. Nacatl, Goyf, BBE, bolts, tribal flames. It looks gross. It also looks like it's actually fast.