I really want at least 6 one-mana instant kill spells in the main to deal with mana dorks and high speed decks like Affinity. If they play a turn 1 Arcbound or Overseer, it's a really tough time if you don't answer it immidiately.
Lavamancer comes in when bolt is already good, meaning I'll still retain the 6 1-mana answers and also have access to Lavamancer post board.
Plus in heavy killspell matchups such as the mirror, I'd much rather have Bolt for reach instead of Lavamancer who usually is just killed instantly.
Hello! I'm new to both mtgsalvation and modern Jund, having recently picked up the final pieces I needed within the past month or so. I understand, both from personal experience and through watching others play, that lightning bolt is poorly positioned right now, due to rather large creatures dominating the format. I was wondering, is it possible to create an aggressive form of Jund where lightning bolt can transform from a spot removal spell in the poorly positioned match-ups to an excellent finisher? I'd really like to play more than the odd 1 or 2 I've been running with.
Hello! I'm new to both mtgsalvation and modern Jund, having recently picked up the final pieces I needed within the past month or so. I understand, both from personal experience and through watching others play, that lightning bolt is poorly positioned right now, due to rather large creatures dominating the format. I was wondering, is it possible to create an aggressive form of Jund where lightning bolt can transform from a spot removal spell in the poorly positioned match-ups to an excellent finisher? I'd really like to play more than the odd 1 or 2 I've been running with.
I think this would then just be a bad version of burn. aggressive decks either need enough reach or have something unusual (like CoCo/Chord in elves) to be effective. DS decks can be quite fast. Jund would then just be a slower aggro deck with some reach and overall you loose consistancy. I think this would not be viable. Jund is made to grind.
Hello! I'm new to both mtgsalvation and modern Jund, having recently picked up the final pieces I needed within the past month or so. I understand, both from personal experience and through watching others play, that lightning bolt is poorly positioned right now, due to rather large creatures dominating the format. I was wondering, is it possible to create an aggressive form of Jund where lightning bolt can transform from a spot removal spell in the poorly positioned match-ups to an excellent finisher? I'd really like to play more than the odd 1 or 2 I've been running with.
That's what Flayer Jund and Traverse Jund are supposed to be. It changes what you're susceptible to though so it's a "buyer beware" sort of deal. You trade one set of problems for another.
Hello! I'm new to both mtgsalvation and modern Jund, having recently picked up the final pieces I needed within the past month or so. I understand, both from personal experience and through watching others play, that lightning bolt is poorly positioned right now, due to rather large creatures dominating the format. I was wondering, is it possible to create an aggressive form of Jund where lightning bolt can transform from a spot removal spell in the poorly positioned match-ups to an excellent finisher? I'd really like to play more than the odd 1 or 2 I've been running with.
I think this would then just be a bad version of burn. aggressive decks either need enough reach or have something unusual (like CoCo/Chord in elves) to be effective. DS decks can be quite fast. Jund would then just be a slower aggro deck with some reach and overall you loose consistancy. I think this would not be viable. Jund is made to grind.
I don't mind the grind, I was just wondering if there was a way to make bolt good again, such that we could easily turn the corner in those slightly unfavorable match-ups and starting bolting upstairs. Maybe aggro is not what I meant, but more tempo?
I find myself increasingly at a loss as to why I should still have Fulminators in my 75. Tron is gone and any Scapeshift player worth his salt plays around them anyway.
ETron doesn't give a ***** about them, they're slow against Affinity (which I'm not worried about to begin with), they're dead against Dredge and occasionally alright against Burn. That doesn't warrant three slots, in my opinion. Am I supposed to just bring them in for rogue Townships?
I find myself increasingly at a loss as to why I should still have Fulminators in my 75. Tron is gone and any Scapeshift player worth his salt plays around them anyway.
ETron doesn't give a ***** about them, they're slow against Affinity (which I'm not worried about to begin with), they're dead against Dredge and occasionally alright against Burn. That doesn't warrant three slots, in my opinion. Am I supposed to just bring them in for rogue Townships?
I find myself increasingly at a loss as to why I should still have Fulminators in my 75. Tron is gone and any Scapeshift player worth his salt plays around them anyway.
ETron doesn't give a ***** about them, they're slow against Affinity (which I'm not worried about to begin with), they're dead against Dredge and occasionally alright against Burn. That doesn't warrant three slots, in my opinion. Am I supposed to just bring them in for rogue Townships?
Why do you guys still play them?
I don't.
I stopped using them a long time ago when I realized that most times that I brought them in it was just because I had too much to board out and needed to have 15 cards in my sideboard.
Hello! I'm new to both mtgsalvation and modern Jund, having recently picked up the final pieces I needed within the past month or so. I understand, both from personal experience and through watching others play, that lightning bolt is poorly positioned right now, due to rather large creatures dominating the format. I was wondering, is it possible to create an aggressive form of Jund where lightning bolt can transform from a spot removal spell in the poorly positioned match-ups to an excellent finisher? I'd really like to play more than the odd 1 or 2 I've been running with.
I think this would then just be a bad version of burn. aggressive decks either need enough reach or have something unusual (like CoCo/Chord in elves) to be effective. DS decks can be quite fast. Jund would then just be a slower aggro deck with some reach and overall you loose consistancy. I think this would not be viable. Jund is made to grind.
I don't mind the grind, I was just wondering if there was a way to make bolt good again, such that we could easily turn the corner in those slightly unfavorable match-ups and starting bolting upstairs. Maybe aggro is not what I meant, but more tempo?
Hm, yeah Traverse Jund could be such a thing, but bolt does not quite fit in here since slots are limited. Can't think of a Tempo Jund version that could solve our problems.
Concerning Fulminator, its a good question to ask. According to goldfish, Tron is still pretty high on that list though. As soon as I can I am going to cut them for sure though.
I find myself increasingly at a loss as to why I should still have Fulminators in my 75. Tron is gone and any Scapeshift player worth his salt plays around them anyway.
ETron doesn't give a ***** about them, they're slow against Affinity (which I'm not worried about to begin with), they're dead against Dredge and occasionally alright against Burn. That doesn't warrant three slots, in my opinion. Am I supposed to just bring them in for rogue Townships?
Why do you guys still play them?
I think exactly like you mate.
I've already cut one of them, and I'll probably going to cut the remaining 2.
The only match that he seems a bit better imo is against Grixis DS, which operates on low land..even then..i'm not totally sold.
Right, I feel like it's just a concession against big mana so you don't feel completely hopeless in the matchup - but let's be fair, you are. Maybe the Fulminators can change a 25-75 matchup into a 30-70 matchup. That's not enough for me.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
Also able to kill Reality Smasher without needing to discard or pitch it to Smasher's discard clause and take out a TKS, etc. Is it a straight up replacement for Terminate? On paper, no - but given the overall meta, its not a terrible card to think about.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
Also able to kill Reality Smasher without needing to discard or pitch it to Smasher's discard clause and take out a TKS, etc. Is it a straight up replacement for Terminate? On paper, no - but given the overall meta, its not a terrible card to think about.
I'm using it in place of Terminate #3 in my list currently and loving it. It also has given me a great awkward traverse target against DS decks where they can't make you discard or you get to kill their creature for B but if they let you have it, you kill their creature anyway.
The synergy might be nice but overall and most of the time, this card will just be a worse terminate for 3 mana. If I would want more hard removal I would probably play a fourth terminate over BGH.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
Also able to kill Reality Smasher without needing to discard or pitch it to Smasher's discard clause and take out a TKS, etc. Is it a straight up replacement for Terminate? On paper, no - but given the overall meta, its not a terrible card to think about.
I'm using it in place of Terminate #3 in my list currently and loving it. It also has given me a great awkward traverse target against DS decks where they can't make you discard or you get to kill their creature for B but if they let you have it, you kill their creature anyway.
Lavamancer comes in when bolt is already good, meaning I'll still retain the 6 1-mana answers and also have access to Lavamancer post board.
Plus in heavy killspell matchups such as the mirror, I'd much rather have Bolt for reach instead of Lavamancer who usually is just killed instantly.
I think this would then just be a bad version of burn. aggressive decks either need enough reach or have something unusual (like CoCo/Chord in elves) to be effective. DS decks can be quite fast. Jund would then just be a slower aggro deck with some reach and overall you loose consistancy. I think this would not be viable. Jund is made to grind.
That's what Flayer Jund and Traverse Jund are supposed to be. It changes what you're susceptible to though so it's a "buyer beware" sort of deal. You trade one set of problems for another.
I don't mind the grind, I was just wondering if there was a way to make bolt good again, such that we could easily turn the corner in those slightly unfavorable match-ups and starting bolting upstairs. Maybe aggro is not what I meant, but more tempo?
ETron doesn't give a ***** about them, they're slow against Affinity (which I'm not worried about to begin with), they're dead against Dredge and occasionally alright against Burn. That doesn't warrant three slots, in my opinion. Am I supposed to just bring them in for rogue Townships?
Why do you guys still play them?
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
I don't.
I stopped using them a long time ago when I realized that most times that I brought them in it was just because I had too much to board out and needed to have 15 cards in my sideboard.
Hm, yeah Traverse Jund could be such a thing, but bolt does not quite fit in here since slots are limited. Can't think of a Tempo Jund version that could solve our problems.
Concerning Fulminator, its a good question to ask. According to goldfish, Tron is still pretty high on that list though. As soon as I can I am going to cut them for sure though.
I think exactly like you mate.
I've already cut one of them, and I'll probably going to cut the remaining 2.
The only match that he seems a bit better imo is against Grixis DS, which operates on low land..even then..i'm not totally sold.
UR Twin - RIP
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
It has good synergy with Lilliana, collective brutality and can be pitched when you get hit with a kcommand.
Has anyone done extensive testing with it?
I think it can work even outside of a traverse list by replacing your weak removal (bolt) in a matchup.
Good point. Perhaps it would be better suited in a BG Rock deck as a sub for terminate.
Both Kolaghan's Command and Liliana, the Last Hope improve Big Game Hunter's value.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
This is also true. Have you done any testing with it?
Also able to kill Reality Smasher without needing to discard or pitch it to Smasher's discard clause and take out a TKS, etc. Is it a straight up replacement for Terminate? On paper, no - but given the overall meta, its not a terrible card to think about.
I'm using it in place of Terminate #3 in my list currently and loving it. It also has given me a great awkward traverse target against DS decks where they can't make you discard or you get to kill their creature for B but if they let you have it, you kill their creature anyway.
Can you share your list?
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Grim Flayer
3x Dark Confidant
2x Scavenging Ooze
1x Big Game Hunter
1x Huntmaster of the Fells
Spells(22)[S:14 I:7]:
4x Traverse the Ulvenwald
4x Fatal Push
2x Terminate
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
3x Thoughtseize
3x Claim // Fame
1x Abrupt Decay
1x Maelstrom Pulse
3x Liliana of the Veil
Artifact(2):
2x Nihil Spellbomb
Lands(19):
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Bloodstained Mire
1x Wooded Foothills
2x Blooming Marsh
2x Overgrown Tomb
2x Swamp
1x Forest
1x Stomping Ground
1x Blood Crypt
2x Raging Ravine
This is still what I am testing out as I tweak and adjust for the PPTQ season. So far it's been running pretty well in my meta.