Disenchant, Celestial Purge, and EE are the ones I go to. Otherwise, playing 6 lands and casting sower is pretty solid. Their fetches become your mountains. Blood Moon typically always hurts both sides. You can sometimes just let it hurt them more than it hurts you with the right draws.
In a BWC deck, EE will not deal with Blood Moon unless you already have a basic Swamp and Plains. It would probably be a good idea to fetch those first if you're expecting Blood Moon. At least then you can still cast all your spells.
What's the common way of dealing with Blood Moon? My meta is crawling with it.
Discard it out of their hand I'd say. Celestial Purge from SB where Blood Moon comes in as well? I haven't really been hurt by a Blood Moon though. I still get to 6 mana and Oblivion Sower makes their fetches Mountains instead of needing an Urborg for Swamps.. win win.
Ok I had my Tuesday night tournament to give yall a brief report. Smallest tournament of my week, only 20 people and it's a very midrangey creatureish meta (I'd say very typical to small shop FNM where you have a couple people on Jund, a good chunk of tier 2 creature and midrange decks, couple burn decks and the occasional combo or control):
Round 1 Burn (0-2)[0-1]: Besides the obvious bad matchup this is.. he completely fooled me after game 1 and then god absurdly dumb luck for game 2. I couldn't confirm he was burn until game 2 either. Game 1 on the play he fetches swiftspear swings and passes. Looks burn so far but bear with me. I started with me looking at his hand (with duress because I don't have the full 3 Inquisitions I want to play main.. I just have the one, most times not too relevant) and seeing Goyf, Nactal, Swiftspear, Boros Charm. So seeing no real burn other than Boros Charm, he looks like Zoo at this point. He ends up top decking a goblin guide and kills me before I could stabilize (I was like a turn or two shy of stabilizing if he was Zoo, hindsight knowing he is burn I'd have to dodge a ton of topdecks). I brought in my Zoo Sideboard, kept a decent hand to kill the early creature and this was how his turns went. T1 Lava Spike (I knew now he was on burn and could be screwed.. sideboard isn't too different but enough so), T2 Swiftspear -> Lava Spike and I path the swiftspear to set up a Strangler if he grabbed another creature and I'd be at 8-12 life with Vault in play and creatures onboard, his T3 Bolt -> Bolt -> Bolt... well I am at 3... fuuuuuuuuuuuuuu... ok play a topdecked spellskite and pass. He paths the spellskite and then boros charms me to the face (no idea why he waited for me to search out another basic but whatever). Whatever.. bad matchup but 15 damage over their first 9 cards including lands isn't how you want that matchup to go.
Round 2 Naya Kiki Chord 1-1-1 [0-1-1]:
Game 1 was a problem with me being unable to find anything reasonable. I cast an early Blight Herder which ate a Path but he ended up being able to cycle Chord -> E-witt -> Chord and eventually got to the combo. I started off kind mana screwed (had the 2 temples and another land for 5 mana though so it was fine) but then drew 4-5 lands in a row when I couldn't afford too. Hindsight I think I could have played this game quicker and maybe we would have had enough time for game 3. Qualms of playing a newish deck I suppose as I am usually a pretty expedient player (I play Lantern Control as well which requires that). Game 2 I had him dead to rights on board and he rips a Worship. I eventually draw into Newlamog and finish him off after yanking his Kiki's with a surgical (baller play, saw it on top of his library due to Courser of Kruphix. Played Oblivion Sower -> Blight Herder -> Surgical Extraction to get his 2nd copy) and using Vault to put me WAY out of reach if he could swing around me. Unfortunately when Game 2 ended we were 30 seconds from time in round.
Round 3 Dega Tokens (2-1) [1-1-1]:
This guys list was essentially BW Tokens with Bolt and Young Pyromancer and I boarded the same as I would for that matchup. Game 1 consisted of me getting no Relic and he got to fire 3 Spectral Processions in a row and a Sorin. I could have easily come back in it but some badly timed bricks (2 lands topdecked in a row) and he got there for lethal. Game 2 was all about me though and included my baller play of the night bar none. He played a turn 2 windbrisk heights which I countered with a turn 3 Blight Herder to burn the card exiled with it and a fetch I exiled with my T1 relic to jump out large early. He played pyromancer and pathed the Blight Herder. I followed up with another Blight Herder and every spell he played there after was immediately used to chump block my massive array of swingers (I hit 2 lingering souls over the next 2 turns). I didn't have removal for the Pyromancer and it's free tokens really are what kept him from straight up dying. I used Vault to gain a ton of life on the first swing so if he found an answer I'd have a couple turns. The turn he started to out value me (He cast a spectral Procession into a Sorin on turns I hit lands and most of my tokens were dead) I ripped a Zealous Persecution off the top and board wiped him and killed sorin with my 3 remaining tokens. This gave me enough turns to tutor up Ulamog and then kill him with it. Game 3 was decided in my mind by a single play exceedingly early in the game. He opted to play a windbrisk heights and bolt me turn 3 (because I had a T1 relic in play), this allowed me to turn 3 play Lingering souls, he played his own copy after a fetch thinking his was safe from relic unless I lose my own, I think there were 3 cards in the yard), turn 4 I flashbacked mine and cracked relic to get rid of his souls. Having those couple extra spirits kept me ahead the remainder of the way because he was once again forced to chump my guys rather than crack back and cast the intangible virtue under Windbrisk heights. This matchup was the definition of grindy. It was very fun and interesting and I felt like I honestly out tokened the token deck for the most part. Being able to take away the value off Windbrisk Heights as you cast your own 3 mana "Spectral Possession" but ours comes with the attached 4/5 body instead of the tokens being fliers.. Oh yeah and they are ramp mana... Too good.
Round 4 Abzan Company (0-2) [1-2-1]
My opponent was 1-2 coming into the match so he conceded to me and we split the prize pool because he and I play at all the same tournaments and he is a cool guy. Plus $2.50 to play modern is more than fine for me. We did play for fun but I really drew the wrong side of the deck both games. I got T1 relics which was nice but saw 0 midrange Eldrazi and 0 discard either game and he was able to aggro beat me down eventually. I was winning game 2 but he played a Archangel of Thune out of hand and then chorded for Spike Feeder. I kept him at bay for like 3 turns chumping with Spirit tokens but drew an Eye of Ugin and an Urborg on my last 2 draws.. I already had both in play. Had I draw any 2 other lands... I had vault online and enough chump blockers to clear away the combo if he tried to swing in. Really bad luck on the draws in those games but this is a very smart player. He avoided fetching as much as possible to give me as little exile food for my things. I think we should be fine as long as we make them play more defensive. When they can just keep swinging in because we have lingering souls tokens and a spellskite... they'll probably end up winning.
Anyway, that was my night. Side note on the new Eldrazi Charm. It has a lot of practical applications.. I really like that it kills both Deceiver Exarch and Pestermite. Take that Twin! It also let's us counter Scapeshift (though typically the have counterspell backup). Card seems alright in my book. No idea if it'll make the 75 though. We are just getting wrecked with riches.
In a BWC deck, EE will not deal with Blood Moon unless you already have a basic Swamp and Plains. It would probably be a good idea to fetch those first if you're expecting Blood Moon. At least then you can still cast all your spells.
All is Dust will though. I am running my 1x mainboard and it's just stupid how lopsided it can be when timed right.
I must say I'm a fan of the new "eldrazi charm" Warping Wail, puts in a lot of work early against the majority of moderns top creatures: Spellskite, Snapcaster, a reduced Goyf, Hierarch, Exarch/Pestermite, Bob & Swiftspear. It can help with a chump or ramping, and provides a solid answer late against Scapeshift/Scrying/***. I like it and can see myself replacing GFtT with two of these possibly.
I must say I'm a fan of the new "eldrazi charm" Warping Wail, puts in a lot of work early against the majority of moderns top creatures: Spellskite, Snapcaster, a reduced Goyf, Hierarch, Exarch/Pestermite, Bob & Swiftspear. It can help with a chump or ramping, and provides a solid answer late against Scapeshift/Scrying/***. I like it and can see myself replacing GFtT with two of these possibly.
I don't think I could replace GFtT because we still need to kill big things. I might totally replace my Mainboard Slaughter Pact as this lets me tap out as well and still kill things in Twin. I really see this as a sideboard card in our decks rather than a mainboarded answer to things.
Absolutely core. He is your inevitability when combined with Eye of Ugin.
He is also an answer to pretty much anything. I have never really had a boardstate late in a game where he wouldn't make an impact. Auto 2 for 1 on cast just feels too good. (I was playing against a friend using the UB version and he delayed him... he couldn't draw a processor in time and I was able to cast him again with haste... felt good).
Let me ask this, what "big things" do we need to kill mid game? the majority of this deck is at parity or outclasses the competition handily. After reading and seeing PhReSHTinGZ handle the largest open in history to the tune of a 10th place finish I feel confident we can move beyond Go For the Throat and open those slots up to other options. I've always loved versatility, Izzet Charm is one of my favorite cards of all time and this "charm" offers a lot of it.
I'm personally very excited about the new charm, and even more excited about this deck in general. The NicFit player in me is so excited about dropping bomb creatures in modern.
Sorry for all the short posts, but is 4 Eye of Ugin too much? I have this paired with 3 Urborg, but something feels off
Let me ask this, what "big things" do we need to kill mid game? the majority of this deck is at parity or outclasses the competition handily. After reading and seeing PhReSHTinGZ handle the largest open in history to the tune of a 10th place finish I feel confident we can move beyond Go For the Throat and open those slots up to other options. I've always loved versatility, Izzet Charm is one of my favorite cards of all time and this "charm" offers a lot of it.
For me it's partially the quantity of kill spells in the deck that it aids and yes, even if our stuff does outclass other midrangyish creatures, sometimes it's still nice to be able to kill away a blocker so you can get in more damage and close the game out quicker. Key thing to note about GFtT is that it can't be redirected to spellskite while both Path and Eldrazi Charm can. That is a bigger deal when trying to kill off a combo creature in Twin and Abzan CoCo as examples. It's great against Affinity (which we already have a decent time with given Lingering Souls, Stony Silence and the like), but I am unsold that it will be a staple in the main deck as of yet. It is very versatile so it does have that going for it.
I'm personally very excited about the new charm, and even more excited about this deck in general. The NicFit player in me is so excited about dropping bomb creatures in modern.
Sorry for all the short posts, but is 4 Eye of Ugin too much? I have this paired with 3 Urborg, but something feels off
4 Eye is definitely too much. I run 3-2 split between Eye and Urborg and last night I tested a 2-2 split (and still had a game where I got all 4 in the same game).
3 Eye of Ugin then. I feel like this charm has huge potential, if not just for its wide applicability. I mean all 3 modes will be relevant at some point in most matchups. I would personally love to see Spellskite get hated out of the format.
Let me ask this, what "big things" do we need to kill mid game? the majority of this deck is at parity or outclasses the competition handily. After reading and seeing PhReSHTinGZ handle the largest open in history to the tune of a 10th place finish I feel confident we can move beyond Go For the Throat and open those slots up to other options. I've always loved versatility, Izzet Charm is one of my favorite cards of all time and this "charm" offers a lot of it.
For me it's partially the quantity of kill spells in the deck that it aids and yes, even if our stuff does outclass other midrangyish creatures, sometimes it's still nice to be able to kill away a blocker so you can get in more damage and close the game out quicker. Key thing to note about GFtT is that it can't be redirected to spellskite while both Path and Eldrazi Charm can. That is a bigger deal when trying to kill off a combo creature in Twin and Abzan CoCo as examples. It's great against Affinity (which we already have a decent time with given Lingering Souls, Stony Silence and the like), but I am unsold that it will be a staple in the main deck as of yet. It is very versatile so it does have that going for it.
Thats fair, I just see the ability to stop a crumble / molten as very nice insurance or ramp into a t3 sower when we don't have three sol lands / no land drop as a huge advantage, plus turning on processing is always nice. Again it'll have to tested extensively but I think it'll make the cut MD.
Let me ask this, what "big things" do we need to kill mid game? the majority of this deck is at parity or outclasses the competition handily. After reading and seeing PhReSHTinGZ handle the largest open in history to the tune of a 10th place finish I feel confident we can move beyond Go For the Throat and open those slots up to other options. I've always loved versatility, Izzet Charm is one of my favorite cards of all time and this "charm" offers a lot of it.
For me it's partially the quantity of kill spells in the deck that it aids and yes, even if our stuff does outclass other midrangyish creatures, sometimes it's still nice to be able to kill away a blocker so you can get in more damage and close the game out quicker. Key thing to note about GFtT is that it can't be redirected to spellskite while both Path and Eldrazi Charm can. That is a bigger deal when trying to kill off a combo creature in Twin and Abzan CoCo as examples. It's great against Affinity (which we already have a decent time with given Lingering Souls, Stony Silence and the like), but I am unsold that it will be a staple in the main deck as of yet. It is very versatile so it does have that going for it.
Thats fair, I just see the ability to stop a crumble / molten as very nice insurance or ramp into a t3 sower when we don't have three sol lands / no land drop as a huge advantage, plus turning on processing is always nice. Again it'll have to tested extensively but I think it'll make the cut MD.
I completely agree. It is versatile enough that it might be good enough against every matchup but currently I am feeling like it's mostly good against things we are already good against. I also don't think this card will hate spellskite out of the format. It's just too good and this can still be redirected to that.
Disenchant, Celestial Purge, and EE are the ones I go to. Otherwise, playing 6 lands and casting sower is pretty solid. Their fetches become your mountains. Blood Moon typically always hurts both sides. You can sometimes just let it hurt them more than it hurts you with the right draws.
In a BWC deck, EE will not deal with Blood Moon unless you already have a basic Swamp and Plains. It would probably be a good idea to fetch those first if you're expecting Blood Moon. At least then you can still cast all your spells.
How on earth do you get EE to take care of Blood Moon? How is it possible in CBW to get X=3 for Engineered Explosives? What am I missing?
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW
Discard it out of their hand I'd say. Celestial Purge from SB where Blood Moon comes in as well? I haven't really been hurt by a Blood Moon though. I still get to 6 mana and Oblivion Sower makes their fetches Mountains instead of needing an Urborg for Swamps.. win win.
Ok I had my Tuesday night tournament to give yall a brief report. Smallest tournament of my week, only 20 people and it's a very midrangey creatureish meta (I'd say very typical to small shop FNM where you have a couple people on Jund, a good chunk of tier 2 creature and midrange decks, couple burn decks and the occasional combo or control):
Round 1 Burn (0-2)[0-1]: Besides the obvious bad matchup this is.. he completely fooled me after game 1 and then god absurdly dumb luck for game 2. I couldn't confirm he was burn until game 2 either. Game 1 on the play he fetches swiftspear swings and passes. Looks burn so far but bear with me. I started with me looking at his hand (with duress because I don't have the full 3 Inquisitions I want to play main.. I just have the one, most times not too relevant) and seeing Goyf, Nactal, Swiftspear, Boros Charm. So seeing no real burn other than Boros Charm, he looks like Zoo at this point. He ends up top decking a goblin guide and kills me before I could stabilize (I was like a turn or two shy of stabilizing if he was Zoo, hindsight knowing he is burn I'd have to dodge a ton of topdecks). I brought in my Zoo Sideboard, kept a decent hand to kill the early creature and this was how his turns went. T1 Lava Spike (I knew now he was on burn and could be screwed.. sideboard isn't too different but enough so), T2 Swiftspear -> Lava Spike and I path the swiftspear to set up a Strangler if he grabbed another creature and I'd be at 8-12 life with Vault in play and creatures onboard, his T3 Bolt -> Bolt -> Bolt... well I am at 3... fuuuuuuuuuuuuuu... ok play a topdecked spellskite and pass. He paths the spellskite and then boros charms me to the face (no idea why he waited for me to search out another basic but whatever). Whatever.. bad matchup but 15 damage over their first 9 cards including lands isn't how you want that matchup to go.
Round 2 Naya Kiki Chord 1-1-1 [0-1-1]:
Game 1 was a problem with me being unable to find anything reasonable. I cast an early Blight Herder which ate a Path but he ended up being able to cycle Chord -> E-witt -> Chord and eventually got to the combo. I started off kind mana screwed (had the 2 temples and another land for 5 mana though so it was fine) but then drew 4-5 lands in a row when I couldn't afford too. Hindsight I think I could have played this game quicker and maybe we would have had enough time for game 3. Qualms of playing a newish deck I suppose as I am usually a pretty expedient player (I play Lantern Control as well which requires that). Game 2 I had him dead to rights on board and he rips a Worship. I eventually draw into Newlamog and finish him off after yanking his Kiki's with a surgical (baller play, saw it on top of his library due to Courser of Kruphix. Played Oblivion Sower -> Blight Herder -> Surgical Extraction to get his 2nd copy) and using Vault to put me WAY out of reach if he could swing around me. Unfortunately when Game 2 ended we were 30 seconds from time in round.
Round 3 Dega Tokens (2-1) [1-1-1]:
This guys list was essentially BW Tokens with Bolt and Young Pyromancer and I boarded the same as I would for that matchup. Game 1 consisted of me getting no Relic and he got to fire 3 Spectral Processions in a row and a Sorin. I could have easily come back in it but some badly timed bricks (2 lands topdecked in a row) and he got there for lethal. Game 2 was all about me though and included my baller play of the night bar none. He played a turn 2 windbrisk heights which I countered with a turn 3 Blight Herder to burn the card exiled with it and a fetch I exiled with my T1 relic to jump out large early. He played pyromancer and pathed the Blight Herder. I followed up with another Blight Herder and every spell he played there after was immediately used to chump block my massive array of swingers (I hit 2 lingering souls over the next 2 turns). I didn't have removal for the Pyromancer and it's free tokens really are what kept him from straight up dying. I used Vault to gain a ton of life on the first swing so if he found an answer I'd have a couple turns. The turn he started to out value me (He cast a spectral Procession into a Sorin on turns I hit lands and most of my tokens were dead) I ripped a Zealous Persecution off the top and board wiped him and killed sorin with my 3 remaining tokens. This gave me enough turns to tutor up Ulamog and then kill him with it. Game 3 was decided in my mind by a single play exceedingly early in the game. He opted to play a windbrisk heights and bolt me turn 3 (because I had a T1 relic in play), this allowed me to turn 3 play Lingering souls, he played his own copy after a fetch thinking his was safe from relic unless I lose my own, I think there were 3 cards in the yard), turn 4 I flashbacked mine and cracked relic to get rid of his souls. Having those couple extra spirits kept me ahead the remainder of the way because he was once again forced to chump my guys rather than crack back and cast the intangible virtue under Windbrisk heights. This matchup was the definition of grindy. It was very fun and interesting and I felt like I honestly out tokened the token deck for the most part. Being able to take away the value off Windbrisk Heights as you cast your own 3 mana "Spectral Possession" but ours comes with the attached 4/5 body instead of the tokens being fliers.. Oh yeah and they are ramp mana... Too good.
Round 4 Abzan Company (0-2) [1-2-1]
My opponent was 1-2 coming into the match so he conceded to me and we split the prize pool because he and I play at all the same tournaments and he is a cool guy. Plus $2.50 to play modern is more than fine for me. We did play for fun but I really drew the wrong side of the deck both games. I got T1 relics which was nice but saw 0 midrange Eldrazi and 0 discard either game and he was able to aggro beat me down eventually. I was winning game 2 but he played a Archangel of Thune out of hand and then chorded for Spike Feeder. I kept him at bay for like 3 turns chumping with Spirit tokens but drew an Eye of Ugin and an Urborg on my last 2 draws.. I already had both in play. Had I draw any 2 other lands... I had vault online and enough chump blockers to clear away the combo if he tried to swing in. Really bad luck on the draws in those games but this is a very smart player. He avoided fetching as much as possible to give me as little exile food for my things. I think we should be fine as long as we make them play more defensive. When they can just keep swinging in because we have lingering souls tokens and a spellskite... they'll probably end up winning.
Anyway, that was my night. Side note on the new Eldrazi Charm. It has a lot of practical applications.. I really like that it kills both Deceiver Exarch and Pestermite. Take that Twin! It also let's us counter Scapeshift (though typically the have counterspell backup). Card seems alright in my book. No idea if it'll make the 75 though. We are just getting wrecked with riches.
All is Dust will though. I am running my 1x mainboard and it's just stupid how lopsided it can be when timed right.
Really like All is Dust, totally forgot about it.
I don't think I could replace GFtT because we still need to kill big things. I might totally replace my Mainboard Slaughter Pact as this lets me tap out as well and still kill things in Twin. I really see this as a sideboard card in our decks rather than a mainboarded answer to things.
He is also an answer to pretty much anything. I have never really had a boardstate late in a game where he wouldn't make an impact. Auto 2 for 1 on cast just feels too good. (I was playing against a friend using the UB version and he delayed him... he couldn't draw a processor in time and I was able to cast him again with haste... felt good).
Sorry for all the short posts, but is 4 Eye of Ugin too much? I have this paired with 3 Urborg, but something feels off
For me it's partially the quantity of kill spells in the deck that it aids and yes, even if our stuff does outclass other midrangyish creatures, sometimes it's still nice to be able to kill away a blocker so you can get in more damage and close the game out quicker. Key thing to note about GFtT is that it can't be redirected to spellskite while both Path and Eldrazi Charm can. That is a bigger deal when trying to kill off a combo creature in Twin and Abzan CoCo as examples. It's great against Affinity (which we already have a decent time with given Lingering Souls, Stony Silence and the like), but I am unsold that it will be a staple in the main deck as of yet. It is very versatile so it does have that going for it.
4 Eye is definitely too much. I run 3-2 split between Eye and Urborg and last night I tested a 2-2 split (and still had a game where I got all 4 in the same game).
Thats fair, I just see the ability to stop a crumble / molten as very nice insurance or ramp into a t3 sower when we don't have three sol lands / no land drop as a huge advantage, plus turning on processing is always nice. Again it'll have to tested extensively but I think it'll make the cut MD.
I completely agree. It is versatile enough that it might be good enough against every matchup but currently I am feeling like it's mostly good against things we are already good against. I also don't think this card will hate spellskite out of the format. It's just too good and this can still be redirected to that.
Is this landbase consistent enough for this B/W Eldrazi deck? I do not have access to Marsh Flats.
If not, any improvements greatly appreciated.
also not sure how essential shambling is.
Looks alright, although I would max out on Caves of Kolios before Bloodstained Mire
[EDIT] NVM, figured it out