I've cutted Tidehollow Sculler totally, which has been absolutely right.
Placed 5th and won and Aether Vial in Foil + Store Credit.
Congrats Polymorph! Can you post your deck list? Can you give a brief synopsis of your matches and sideboarding? Which cards were all-stars? thanks
My decklist is attached to this reply.
Thanks Polymorph. While I have always liked Sculler for the curve, I do agree with your analysis and will give your creature configuration a try. Thanks for the write up. Always great to see match-ups. I will try a league this week and submit my own write up.
Thanks for the report, Polymorph. Your posted list looks similar to what I was running before I started trying out the Scullers again. It's definitely running a more aggressive, creature-beats gameplan, and I think Matter Reshaper is amazing in that shell. As you say, not so sure about 2x Cavern of Souls though. Question: How is Sea Gate Wreckage playing out for you? Has it fed Collective Brutality for you at all?
I think the two-drop slot in an Eldrazi deck is a little unusual. With a Temple in play, either Reshaper or Eternal Scourge are excellent T2 plays. The Sculler build suffers for not having that option since Strangler is far, far weaker on T2 than either, if it can't process.
Hey guys, have continued to play variants of this deck online and in paper when I can. I've been playing a Sculler + processor-heavy control build for a bit now, and I've picked up the pieces to make the more popular aggro variant. I've been playing it to great success online (XMage), and I'll be running it at my store's Monday night modern:
Thanks for the report, Polymorph. Your posted list looks similar to what I was running before I started trying out the Scullers again. It's definitely running a more aggressive, creature-beats gameplan, and I think Matter Reshaper is amazing in that shell. As you say, not so sure about 2x Cavern of Souls though. Question: How is Sea Gate Wreckage playing out for you? Has it fed Collective Brutality for you at all?
I think the two-drop slot in an Eldrazi deck is a little unusual. With a Temple in play, either Reshaper or Eternal Scourge are excellent T2 plays. The Sculler build suffers for not having that option since Strangler is far, far weaker on T2 than either, if it can't process.
Wreckage was good.
It shined in the super-long grind games were every player is in topdeck-mode.
Latest Testing I have been testing a list, which is along the lines of Polymorph's latest posts, and I am very happy with it. I have only tested in MTGO Tourney Practice Room, but I have gone 7-0 over last matches going 14-2 in games. I have beaten Affinity, Jeskai control, Grixis DS, Grixis Control twice, Jund, Mono-W. I find not having to struggle to get WB on T2 helpful and I am still exiling enough cards for Strangler or Herder. So far Matter Reshaper has been just okay, but I don't think any other card fits. I might try going back to 2 Scullers, but only after I run a few leagues, which I hope to do soon. I am happy with the land package. Sea Gate Wreckage has been relevant as have Mutavaults. I think numbers are just right.
So a just disappointing 1-4 Drop for me at yesterday's 68 player tournament.
Sadly there were a huge amount of bad matchup decks.
Either it was Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, GW Tron, Burn, Affinity, Merfolk - Every Deck i saw looked like a mediocre to bad opponent.
Hi all, been a lurker on this forum for awhile, and this is my first post. Been playing the deck for a couple weeks now at FNM after changing over from EldraziTron. I've had really good success with my build (3-1, 3-0-1, 4-0) against a wide range of decks. My lgs gets about 16/18 players a week, and everyone plays different decks ranging from GDS to ETron to Elves to Eggs, so I've been able to play the deck against competitive builds and more off the wall builds. Once I figure out how to post decks correctly, I'll share my list.
One question I did want to ask, more for the players that have matter reshaper in their decks, would a singleton or two Bitterblossoms be good in the deck? The deck has great disruption, but I sometimes feel like I'm lacking threats (either because I can't draw them, or they get picked off). Just wondered if anyone has tried this already with any success?
Played the list I posted a few posts up (also in my signature) to 1-3 finish tonight. Lost 1-2 and 2-0 to Abzan (Flayer/Tracker and Reliquary/Rhino variants respectively), won 2-0 against an Orzhov lifegain brew, and lost 2-0 to Burn.
The deck felt like it was doing what it was supposed to against Abzan, but my threats / answers just never out-valued theirs. Almost turned the corner against Burn both games but just fell short. Two Blessed Alliance and two Collective Brutality failed to make an appearance in game two and would almost certainly have won it for me.
I felt that the right approach to sideboarding against Abzan was to cut discard (2x Thoughtsieze, Liliana, one Tidehollow Sculler) for hate and more efficient removal (Pithing Needle, Zealous Persecution, Ratchet Bomb, Surgical Extraction). GW value cards have given me fits, but that might be my inexperience rather than a weakness of the deck.
Ben Katz aka "Ridetheiguana". I really like the deck that you've played in Qualifier Bernardsville. Can you post your Sideboard Guide vs Grixis Deaths Shadow and Eldrazi Tron please?. or someone has an idea how to sideboard? Im gonna bring this deck this coming PPTQ in my area. Thank you so much.
League Result 2-3
So I played a league with the deck I listed in the post #2453 earlier on this page. I really feel the deck is competitive despite the end result. I beat Grixis DS twice, but lost to Gifts Storm, Dredge and Scapeshift.
Match 1 vs Gifts Storm L(0-2) This was a tough match-up. I was able to get in beaters and bring life total down, but never drew a Relic in either game or any of sideboard cards Cage to stop graveyard, nor Wrath nor Ratchet Bomb in second game to deal with his Warrens. Sideboarding: -2 Path, -1 Herder, -1 Strangler; +1 Wrath, +2 Ratchet Bomb, +1 Cage.
Match2 vs GDS W (2-0) I really feel this deck is made to beat GDS. Star was Souls for sure. In Game 2, Cage shut down Snapcaster and Blessed ALliance forced sac of Gurmag Angler. Sideboarding: -1 Shaper, -2 Strangler, -2 Brutality; +2 Blessed Alliance, +1 Wrath, +1 Cage, +1 Fulminator Mage.
Match 3 vs GDS W (2-0) Much like previous match, but was a grind. Sorin helped. Souls still the stars. A late game Herder created too many creatures for his low life total (was stuck with a 11/11 DS).
Match 4 vs Dredge L (1-2) This was a tough loss. Both games I lost I never saw a Relic or and PtE for his creatures. I still made it a game with Vault keeping life total up while removing his creatures, and Matter Reshaper was useful replacing itself. But couldn't get there without the graveyard hate. Game 1, I flooded (ended with 13 lands on field). Game 2, I successfully kept dredgers out of graveyard with Relic and PtE and Thought-Knot Seer. Got there with beaters. Game 3 was much like game 1 with no relic or cage showing up. I could have won on my last play if I drew a Relic as I had Wrath in hand and enough mana to cast relic, wrath and then exile all with Relic with triggers for recursion on stack. But it didn't come. I can see how Kalitas could be useful in this MU. Sideboarding: -2 Strangler, -2 Fatal Push; +2 Blessed Alliance, +1 Cage; +1 Wrath.
Match 5 vs Scapeshift L (0-2) Game 1 I drew few lands and could have Ghost Quarter'd his Valakut, but I didn't as I was hoping for one maore land to cast my 2 Smashers. Never saw the Temple. Game 2, was overwhelmed as he ramped and went off, also with benefit of playing a Tracker that could trade with my smasher. Just didn't get there before he went off.
All in all, happy with the deck, tho Sorin wasn't much of a factor overall. Also not sure if this aggro plan is better than Sculler. There were times where I definitely wished I had a sculler over the Reshaper or 1 Scourge, so will tinker some more.
I am playing the smasher version with 2/2/2 scullers, reshapers, eternal scourge. Liking it overall, sculler Is a great card against all combos we have around. Although you can side him out on the draw.
Yesterday I lost to a taking turns deck where I was processing an ancestrall vision to -3-3 my TKS, and he just bounced the TKS with cryptic, drew a card from TKS, a card from cryptic, a card on the draw and 3 from vision by fizzling the strangler... Felt awkward... U.u
Running wiht Tidehollow Sculler today, still not happy wiht teh build - 2:1.
Really believing that Matter Reshaper is teh way to head on!
Hey Polymorph. After my last go in the league with Matter Reshaper I am back testing Tidehollow Sculler. So far, can be really good, or really bad. Wondering about a 2/2 split of the two cards rather than 4-of. Will do some more Tourney Practice Room on MODO and then jump into a league Monday. So far today with 4 Scullers, I have beaten Lantern, WG Coco, and Elves. Lost to Taking Turns, Eldrazi Tron, and W.
He would get the card from Cryptic and the Thought-Knot Seer, but since putting the card from exile into an opponents graveyard is the way to activate the 2nd condition of the trigger, his Ancestral Vision would still be in his graveyard.
Not sure what the official rules lingo is on that, but that's how it works.
He would get the card from Cryptic and the Thought-Knot Seer, but since putting the card from exile into an opponents graveyard is the way to activate the 2nd condition of the trigger, his Ancestral Vision would still be in his graveyard.
Not sure what the official rules lingo is on that, but that's how it works.
But the second hability have a target upon trigger. I have to choose the target before starting the resolution. When the TKS is bounced, the entire hability is countered. Had a lvl2 judge at the time watching the match... But it sure is a strange situation.
Guys, if the deck is going a more aggressive path with mutavaults and increased creature density, why not running 4 of eldrazi mimic? I know he is a lightning rod, but i'd rather have a push or path aimed at him than my opponent saving it for TKS/smasher. What do you think?
I recently changed my D&T to processor eldrazi after seeing the Japanese GP result and finding this thread. Props on getting push to "developing competitive" btw, was surprised wasn't there earlier.
I tried sleeving up the list with the Matter Reshaper and the TKS/Smasher. Occasionally the ability to turn 2 Reshaper felt good but without the Eldrazi Temple it didn't feel as good. More importantly looking over the list I immediately started to think "hmm...opponent plays Bloom Moon and I scoop". You end up with all your threats aside from Wasteland Strangler being unplayable (well and LS). It seems way too greedy. The problem this exposes is Wastes can't be fetched for, a clear failure in the mechanic for eternal formats when was introduced. Should they print more colorless cards in future they need to make new fetches that can get wastes (and another color). Yes path can get you a waste but decks hoping to BM you won't play PoE. Overall I think the better 3 drop eldrazi becomes Eternal Scourge, seems like a fun 1-2 of either MB or SB (esp. after realizing if it gets Path'd can just replay, or even exile from graveyard with relic ).
So while not super crazy about it I agree that Blight Herder is better 5CC eldrazi here. It fits theme, can be great against edict effects, and hell it's just funny using a card not good enough for standard play and sleeving it up in modern lol.
As per Tidehollow Sculler I feel worst problem is the chances of not being able to cast turn 2 (btw shout out to @schuppius running the math on that). Its a card using in the Bob based Dead guy ale and in D&T. The fact we can still process the card on it I think makes it a solid card and on theme. Take threat/removal turn 2, then play Strangler turn 3 exiling the card and removing a creature on opponents side is great tempo. For matchups its weak against can SB them out. I think running 3 makes more sense than 4 though, we can't abuse as much as D&T without extra flickering. Also I think mutavaults should get cut in lists using it to increase chances for turn 2 drop. Honestly...never really got the idea of the mutavaults in this deck as we have no lord like effects for the eldrazi. The 4 caves seems automatic as a sort of tri-land for the deck.
Thanks for the reply, and mutavault explanation. So its more of a incremental damage card. I figured with the 4x lingering souls and 3-4 Shambling Vents that it was just redundant in that regard but it does have a cheap activation and can swing on early turns. I guess the problem as I see it is this is really a 3 color decks that looks like a 2 color deck and has worse fetch options...making the mana base a frequent area of debate. Btw is that deck on deckstats you linked close to what you're still using for reference? See you have 2 mutavaults there and 4 scullers. I can see 2 mutavaults being a good number.
Yeah I also see Eternal Scourge as a SB 1-2 of. I like it in principle vs. something like U/W control which is likely going to go long anyway and due to Snapcaster going to keep Relic's in. Plus they use path's for removal, and seems good along with Souls to keep swinging into their PWs. It also could come in vs Blood Moon decks to have more castables.
Btw has there already been a conversation on Cavern of Souls for the more eldrazi heavy lists? I recall Bant-drazi used it, guess it can be a meta call.
I've been playing around with 1 Ifnir Deadlands. I don't think it's a game changer but it is another untapped "dual" and the sac effect has won me one game so far.
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Thanks Polymorph. While I have always liked Sculler for the curve, I do agree with your analysis and will give your creature configuration a try. Thanks for the write up. Always great to see match-ups. I will try a league this week and submit my own write up.
I think the two-drop slot in an Eldrazi deck is a little unusual. With a Temple in play, either Reshaper or Eternal Scourge are excellent T2 plays. The Sculler build suffers for not having that option since Strangler is far, far weaker on T2 than either, if it can't process.
1x Cavern of Souls
4x Caves of Koilos
4x Concealed Courtyard
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Godless Shrine
3x Marsh Flats
2x Mutavault
1x Plains
1x Shambling Vent
1x Swamp
Artifact (4)
4x Relic of Progenitus
1x Liliana of the Veil
Creature (15)
1x Eternal Scourge
3x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
3x Tidehollow Sculler
4x Wasteland Strangler
Instant (7)
1x Anguished Unmaking
2x Fatal Push
4x Path to Exile
Sorcery (9)
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Lingering Souls
2x Thoughtseize
1x Anguished Unmaking
2x Blessed Alliance
2x Collective Brutality
1x Disenchant
1x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Pithing Needle
1x Ratchet Bomb
2x Stony Silence
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Wrath of God
1x Zealous Persecution
BWCBW Eldrazi ProcessorCWB
Wreckage was good.
It shined in the super-long grind games were every player is in topdeck-mode.
Green @ it's best
So here's the list:
3 Caves of Koilos
2 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Marsh Flats
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Shambling Vent
2 Mutavault
1 Sea Gate Wreckage
2 Plains
1 Swamp
Creatures
1 Blight Herder
3 Matter Reshaper
3 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Wasteland Strangler
1 Eternal Scourge
4 Path to Exile
2 Fatal Push
3 Thoughtseize
2 Collective Brutality
4 Relic of Progenitus
4 Lingering Souls
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Disenchant
3 Stony Silence
2 Anguished Unmaking
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Wrath of God
2 Blessed Alliance
Welcome any thoughts/comments/suggestions.
Sadly there were a huge amount of bad matchup decks.
Either it was Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, GW Tron, Burn, Affinity, Merfolk - Every Deck i saw looked like a mediocre to bad opponent.
Green @ it's best
One question I did want to ask, more for the players that have matter reshaper in their decks, would a singleton or two Bitterblossoms be good in the deck? The deck has great disruption, but I sometimes feel like I'm lacking threats (either because I can't draw them, or they get picked off). Just wondered if anyone has tried this already with any success?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_YohjfFfag
He discusses the deck here:
https://www.channelfireball.com/videos/modern-monday-bw-eldrazi/
CBW midrange deck
CBW eldrazi processor deck
CBW bw eldrazi shadow midrange
The deck felt like it was doing what it was supposed to against Abzan, but my threats / answers just never out-valued theirs. Almost turned the corner against Burn both games but just fell short. Two Blessed Alliance and two Collective Brutality failed to make an appearance in game two and would almost certainly have won it for me.
I felt that the right approach to sideboarding against Abzan was to cut discard (2x Thoughtsieze, Liliana, one Tidehollow Sculler) for hate and more efficient removal (Pithing Needle, Zealous Persecution, Ratchet Bomb, Surgical Extraction). GW value cards have given me fits, but that might be my inexperience rather than a weakness of the deck.
BWCBW Eldrazi ProcessorCWB
Creatures
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Blight Herder
3 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Wasteland Strangler
Spells
4 Relic of Progenitus
2 Fatal Push
4 Path to Exile
2 Collective Brutality
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lingering Souls
2 Thoughtseize
Planeswalkers
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Lands (24)
1 Plains
2 Swamp
4 Caves of Koilos
3 Concealed Courtyard
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Fetid Heath
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Godless Shrine
4 Marsh Flats
3 Shambling Vent
Sideboard
1 Pithing Needle
1 Aven Mindcensor
3 Fulminator Mage
1 Stony Silence
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Zealous Persecution
2 Liliana of the Veil
2 Damnation
1 Flaying Tendrils
1 Fragmentize
So I played a league with the deck I listed in the post #2453 earlier on this page. I really feel the deck is competitive despite the end result. I beat Grixis DS twice, but lost to Gifts Storm, Dredge and Scapeshift.
Match 1 vs Gifts Storm L(0-2) This was a tough match-up. I was able to get in beaters and bring life total down, but never drew a Relic in either game or any of sideboard cards Cage to stop graveyard, nor Wrath nor Ratchet Bomb in second game to deal with his Warrens. Sideboarding: -2 Path, -1 Herder, -1 Strangler; +1 Wrath, +2 Ratchet Bomb, +1 Cage.
Match2 vs GDS W (2-0) I really feel this deck is made to beat GDS. Star was Souls for sure. In Game 2, Cage shut down Snapcaster and Blessed ALliance forced sac of Gurmag Angler. Sideboarding: -1 Shaper, -2 Strangler, -2 Brutality; +2 Blessed Alliance, +1 Wrath, +1 Cage, +1 Fulminator Mage.
Match 3 vs GDS W (2-0) Much like previous match, but was a grind. Sorin helped. Souls still the stars. A late game Herder created too many creatures for his low life total (was stuck with a 11/11 DS).
Match 4 vs Dredge L (1-2) This was a tough loss. Both games I lost I never saw a Relic or and PtE for his creatures. I still made it a game with Vault keeping life total up while removing his creatures, and Matter Reshaper was useful replacing itself. But couldn't get there without the graveyard hate. Game 1, I flooded (ended with 13 lands on field). Game 2, I successfully kept dredgers out of graveyard with Relic and PtE and Thought-Knot Seer. Got there with beaters. Game 3 was much like game 1 with no relic or cage showing up. I could have won on my last play if I drew a Relic as I had Wrath in hand and enough mana to cast relic, wrath and then exile all with Relic with triggers for recursion on stack. But it didn't come. I can see how Kalitas could be useful in this MU. Sideboarding: -2 Strangler, -2 Fatal Push; +2 Blessed Alliance, +1 Cage; +1 Wrath.
Match 5 vs Scapeshift L (0-2) Game 1 I drew few lands and could have Ghost Quarter'd his Valakut, but I didn't as I was hoping for one maore land to cast my 2 Smashers. Never saw the Temple. Game 2, was overwhelmed as he ramped and went off, also with benefit of playing a Tracker that could trade with my smasher. Just didn't get there before he went off.
All in all, happy with the deck, tho Sorin wasn't much of a factor overall. Also not sure if this aggro plan is better than Sculler. There were times where I definitely wished I had a sculler over the Reshaper or 1 Scourge, so will tinker some more.
Hope this helps. Comments welcome.
Yesterday I lost to a taking turns deck where I was processing an ancestrall vision to -3-3 my TKS, and he just bounced the TKS with cryptic, drew a card from TKS, a card from cryptic, a card on the draw and 3 from vision by fizzling the strangler... Felt awkward... U.u
Running wiht Tidehollow Sculler today, still not happy wiht teh build - 2:1.
Really believing that Matter Reshaper is teh way to head on!
Green @ it's best
Round 1 vs Bogles 0-2
Round 2 vs Elves 1-2
Round 3 vs U/W Control 1-2
Round 4 vs Grixis Shadow 2-1
Round 5 vs Living End 2-0
Round 6 vs Tron 2-1.
Knight of Glory is pretty good vs Grixis Death Shadow.=)
Not sure what the official rules lingo is on that, but that's how it works.
But the second hability have a target upon trigger. I have to choose the target before starting the resolution. When the TKS is bounced, the entire hability is countered. Had a lvl2 judge at the time watching the match... But it sure is a strange situation.
Guys, if the deck is going a more aggressive path with mutavaults and increased creature density, why not running 4 of eldrazi mimic? I know he is a lightning rod, but i'd rather have a push or path aimed at him than my opponent saving it for TKS/smasher. What do you think?
I tried sleeving up the list with the Matter Reshaper and the TKS/Smasher. Occasionally the ability to turn 2 Reshaper felt good but without the Eldrazi Temple it didn't feel as good. More importantly looking over the list I immediately started to think "hmm...opponent plays Bloom Moon and I scoop". You end up with all your threats aside from Wasteland Strangler being unplayable (well and LS). It seems way too greedy. The problem this exposes is Wastes can't be fetched for, a clear failure in the mechanic for eternal formats when was introduced. Should they print more colorless cards in future they need to make new fetches that can get wastes (and another color). Yes path can get you a waste but decks hoping to BM you won't play PoE. Overall I think the better 3 drop eldrazi becomes Eternal Scourge, seems like a fun 1-2 of either MB or SB (esp. after realizing if it gets Path'd can just replay, or even exile from graveyard with relic ).
So while not super crazy about it I agree that Blight Herder is better 5CC eldrazi here. It fits theme, can be great against edict effects, and hell it's just funny using a card not good enough for standard play and sleeving it up in modern lol.
As per Tidehollow Sculler I feel worst problem is the chances of not being able to cast turn 2 (btw shout out to @schuppius running the math on that). Its a card using in the Bob based Dead guy ale and in D&T. The fact we can still process the card on it I think makes it a solid card and on theme. Take threat/removal turn 2, then play Strangler turn 3 exiling the card and removing a creature on opponents side is great tempo. For matchups its weak against can SB them out. I think running 3 makes more sense than 4 though, we can't abuse as much as D&T without extra flickering. Also I think mutavaults should get cut in lists using it to increase chances for turn 2 drop. Honestly...never really got the idea of the mutavaults in this deck as we have no lord like effects for the eldrazi. The 4 caves seems automatic as a sort of tri-land for the deck.
Thanks for the reply, and mutavault explanation. So its more of a incremental damage card. I figured with the 4x lingering souls and 3-4 Shambling Vents that it was just redundant in that regard but it does have a cheap activation and can swing on early turns. I guess the problem as I see it is this is really a 3 color decks that looks like a 2 color deck and has worse fetch options...making the mana base a frequent area of debate. Btw is that deck on deckstats you linked close to what you're still using for reference? See you have 2 mutavaults there and 4 scullers. I can see 2 mutavaults being a good number.
Yeah I also see Eternal Scourge as a SB 1-2 of. I like it in principle vs. something like U/W control which is likely going to go long anyway and due to Snapcaster going to keep Relic's in. Plus they use path's for removal, and seems good along with Souls to keep swinging into their PWs. It also could come in vs Blood Moon decks to have more castables.
Btw has there already been a conversation on Cavern of Souls for the more eldrazi heavy lists? I recall Bant-drazi used it, guess it can be a meta call.