I feel like eternal scourge fits the role as a manland for the BW processor deck and is a much need low cmc drop that avoids blood moon shenanigans. I would cut blight herder for the eldrazi horror and try out the deck that I said earlier.
Other than eternal scourge, I feel like there are two new cards that are pretty good sideboard options for us:
I feel like there are valid arguments for both of those cards in our sideboard instead of rest for the weary or other cards that help out with the burn/zoo matchup. What are everybody else's thoughts?
Hi guys, been gone for a while and haven't been playing. I am thinking Eternal Scourge is worth serious testing for sure. I love my Blight Herders but maybe Scourge is a way to bring down the curve while still making double use of Relic as graveyard hate as well as power for our Eldrazi. More Scourges also make Matter Reshaper better. Extraction on our own Scourge might be a little too tricky, though, except in special circumstances.
If Lingering Souls weren't so unbelievably good I would be thinking hard about a 3-4 Rest in Peace plus a 3-4 of Scourges plus another Reshaper or two in the spots freed up by four Souls and four Relics. But Souls IS so unbelievably good. Losing the Spirit tokens would destroy our Affinity/Infect/midgame-stalling line which is key to the deck's performance. And Scourge turns on Bolt, Decay, and Inquisition, all of which Souls is extremely strong against. Rest in Peace plus Lingering Souls is a terrible nonbo and is not an option. And Rest is not better in multiples, while Relic can be, and of course Relic cantrips when needed, which is crucial.
My guess is that Scourge may find a home as a one-of in a Relic/Souls Processor build. The deck already has several of one-of's that open up different angles, cf. Vault, Caverns, Sorin, Batterskull etc. I'm not sure what an optimized Scourge/Rest in Peace Processor build might look like, but I think it would be pretty different from where we are at. Maybe a GW Ramp/Aggro build more along the lines of Bant Eldrazi? A BW or Abzan Aether Vial build with Displacer and Strangler and a ton of 3-drops plus TKS?
I just recently stood this deck up as a reasonably priced 2nd modern deck.
In early playtesting (around 10 games), I have some early observations. A lot of games this deck just runs out of steam with no way to keep the momentum going. I'm going to try cutting my 2x main Ghost Quarters for Sea Gate Wreckage. Also, I know the primer says run a singleton, but I feel like going up to 2x Sorin SV is the way to go, as he really makes spirit tokens and pretty much everything else in the deck into huge life swings. With just one, you pretty much never see him (most of all since this deck lacks card draw) so he might as well not be there. I'm also running Displacer over Reshaper as I feel the former is just a way better mana sink for when the game goes long. I'd love to run 2x if I can find the room, I already cut to 3x Proggy Relics as I run a playset of Tidehollow and double O Ring which equal a lot of incidental exile.
I also feel like if you draw the parts out of order, the deck also gets really clunky. The bright spot I've seen is the manabase works very well with its current ratios. I'm running 13 w / 13 b and 11 <> with 2 mind stones. 23 lands total instead of 24. I just kept flooding.
I'll post my list once I refine it a bit more, but I was just a bit disappointed with my results vs all of the positive outcomes I've read on this thread. I know YMMV and all, but maybe you can fill me in on what this deck is supposed to do if the game goes long or if you draw your curve out of order, as the deck doesn't feel terribly consistent.
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Modern ------------------------- WU Azorius Titan Midrange
Commander ------------------- WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
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Recently I've been thinking about how, to the extent that so many newer cards improve the utility and attractiveness of the graveyard (e.g., Mini-Jace, GDD, Prized Amalgam, New'mrakul, the delirium mechanic, etc.) (EDIT: Chaos Reveler, Noose Constrictor, and on and on), the better positioned our maindeck Relics become. That trend is an aspect of recent sets that I hadn't fully appreciated, but that looks to be extremely favorable for this deck going forward.
I just recently stood this deck up as a reasonably priced 2nd modern deck.
In early playtesting (around 10 games), I have some early observations. A lot of games this deck just runs out of steam with no way to keep the momentum going. I'm going to try cutting my 2x main Ghost Quarters for Sea Gate Wreckage. Also, I know the primer says run a singleton, but I feel like going up to 2x Sorin SV is the way to go, as he really makes spirit tokens and pretty much everything else in the deck into huge life swings. With just one, you pretty much never see him (most of all since this deck lacks card draw) so he might as well not be there. I'm also running Displacer over Reshaper as I feel the former is just a way better mana sink for when the game goes long. I'd love to run 2x if I can find the room, I already cut to 3x Proggy Relics as I run a playset of Tidehollow and double O Ring which equal a lot of incidental exile.
I also feel like if you draw the parts out of order, the deck also gets really clunky. The bright spot I've seen is the manabase works very well with its current ratios. I'm running 13 w / 13 b and 11 <> with 2 mind stones. 23 lands total instead of 24. I just kept flooding.
I'll post my list once I refine it a bit more, but I was just a bit disappointed with my results vs all of the positive outcomes I've read on this thread. I know YMMV and all, but maybe you can fill me in on what this deck is supposed to do if the game goes long or if you draw your curve out of order, as the deck doesn't feel terribly consistent.
Well, careful of going too budget with this. Duress is not a great substitute for Thoughtseize or Inquisition, and Tragic Slip is certainly no Path to Exile. Sea Gate Wreckage is a great idea but personally I would sooner cut Cavern of Souls than a single Ghost Quarter. In my experience, GQ is an absolute all-star. Sorin is very strong and I too have considered running two. But ultimately he is not threat, only a threat magnifier. Sculler can be tough to cast on curve, and dies to a lot of things our other creatures resist.
There is some learning to do about sequencing, mull/keep decisions, etc. that will smooth things out for you. Keep playing and building up the deck and I predict you will have success.
Yeah all those cards are just placeholders for now, just so I can start enjoying the deck and getting used to the play lines.
Duress is going to be Thoughtseize or IoK, and Tragic Slip / Journey is going to be a 2/1 Split with Path and Declaration in Stone (meta card) (I will also up the budget on my tappedout list accordingly - aiming for $200)
So far I've had no problem casting Sculler on curve, I really believe the manabase is actually pretty solid with the 13/13/11-13 + 2 stone split
Thank you for the feedback! I plan to be active in this thread and hopefully pick up some deck ideas.
I should also add during today's games during lunch, the deck ran a little smoother. Though I'm still at a loss for how to fix the late game w/o cutting the 2x Ghost Quarters for 2x Sea Gate Wreckage
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BUDGET DECK BUILDER SINCE 93'
Modern ------------------------- WU Azorius Titan Midrange
Commander ------------------- WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
***Are you looking for cards priced below TCG NM "LOW" and with FREE SHIPPING? - Click HERE! for my sales thread - 485 Feedback 100% positive!***
well I can state that I think there is a few new angles that new set brings.
Firstly old cards that are brought to a better light. relic of proginitus I think was well positioned even before this set was revealed. Now that it is oh good lord, I can use it to be aggressive surgical extraction is also a key deck wrecker. Problem was it is only truly useful against combo or with a good T1 hand discard.
eternal scourge...... where to begin. Firstly, it gives an outlet for removal. Bolts we could care less about (make the scourge blinky) but seeing a terminate, path, or anything similar blown on it is awsome (make TKS stick better). Now to the craziness part. With relic it is a ever returning wall. target yourself and remove/recast. So much gravy. Or dump it to your grave (or however you need to stick it in there) surgical it out of your deck and you have a 3/3 mana dump. Now something like heartless summoning with it is .......... (if we can brew in this forum I will come up with a hybrid idea, but I feel it is worth pursing).
Elder deep-fiend oh good lord, this card is insane. It can soak another removal and grant tempo of a TKS being killed, but requires blue to be used. I am still unsure of where it belongs, but I think that a blue black processor does have potential.
Have you considered to remove a Herder to add 1 more Reshaper ? I liked the MR, kid is good, and i find myself a lot without 2 cards in exile so that BH can be good.
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned using Distended Mindbender from the new set. With a Temple out, you can T2 Matter Reshaper or Eternal Scourge, sac either for value on T3 (so to speak) and T4 cast this 5/5 guy w/ a double-dip into opponent's hand. Seems good...what am I missing? Does that just get too far away from the processor theme of the deck? I guess you'd have to cut Lingering Souls (which would hurt) and Blight Herder to make it all work.
I'm on the fence, I've enjoyed playing BW processors since BFZ first came out, then emerge made me want to try U/G Eldrazi tempo, and now Delirium and madness is making our baby BW processors look soooo well positioned. I think the big add for our deck from EMN (if there is one) is eternal scourge although I'm still not completely sold on him. My current list is running 3 scullers which (alongside TKS and IOK/TS) wrecks the opponent's hand. But I could see dropping the to try the scourge. I may still dip into U/G for a test though. Moving away from processors during what looks like an impending age of GY decks may be dumb but I love brewing, and Elder deep fiend, wretched gryff, and lashweed lurker all look sweet alongside matter reshaper and ancient stirrings
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My Decks:
UG Merfolk RG 8-Whack BWG Abzan midrange GRB Living End UWB Spirit Control
GU Kruphix's "Hug Assassin" RW Kalemne's "Play Fatties and Hope for the Best!" BUGW Atraxa's "All counters, all the time"
I think with some of the new cards spoiled, mono-black eldrazi processors can be a thing.
We would lose Lingering Souls, Path, Sorin but gain the new 3 drop, distended mindbender, and we can replace path with any number of black removal spells. I will certainly consider this once I start playtesting with the new stuff.
Also Vault, Vent, and O-Ring and Anguished Unmaking, aka all of our lifegain plus our best spot-removal spells for troublesome non-creature permanents. Not saying it won't work, but white does a lot for us beyond giving us Souls and Path.
I am starting to feel that a deck which includes eternal scourge, relic, and lingering souls should seriously consider running collective brutality in the main 60.
Collective brutality it would help out against: burn, merfolk, zoo, collective company decks, elves, scapeshift, and 8-whack. It has a relevant mode against most decks in modern and we could discard lingering souls or eternal scourge for value. The ability for the card to either be a kill spell, discard spell, and/or a life gain spell is pretty amazing. Especially since we take so much damage with our mana base.
Anyone go with an Esper Version? It seems on paper to be pretty strong with access to Drowner of Hope and Delay
It would be pretty difficult since an esper version is basically a 4 color deck. Having negate or stubborn denial against tron and serum visions for some added consistency would be nice though. I would start by replacing mind stone with a few talisman of dominance.
I beat Affinity, UB mill, Jeskai Control (no Nahiri), and Grixis Delver, and I tied with Blue Moon. I have written a lot of tourney reports for this thread over the past couple of months, not so sure that people really find any benefit from them though.
I am happy to write reports if some readers like them enough to let me know. Would side in/out notes be useful? More detail about key cards? But maybe just coming by every few days to report more reliable success with the build--which is what I continue to find at my LGS--isn't really the most productive way to use our time and bandwidth.
Anyway, still super surprised that this deck is not on anyone's radar. I'm making like $20-30/week in credit at my local FNM type events. I'm convinced that the new EMN cards will further shift the overall near-term meta towards graveyard utility, making our Relics (etc.) even better. Might as well enjoy riding this dark horse as far as we can, I suppose.
Yeah, I like matter reshaper a lot but I feel that eternal scourge fills the role of a re-occuring threat that will help out the longer matches. The ability to play eternal scourge and draw a random card when we are top-decking is pretty powerfull. This all could change once I get my hands on it though, I have been wrong many times before.
...
I am happy to write reports if some readers like them enough to let me know. Would side in/out notes be useful? More detail about key cards? But maybe just coming by every few days to report more reliable success with the build--which is what I continue to find at my LGS--isn't really the most productive way to use our time and bandwidth.
...
I would like to hear the under and over performers during your night and what types of deck you played against. If everybody had a similar format it would be easy to compile a list to determine the best 60 cards for the deck and how to fine tune the deck for specific metas. Something of the form:
Deck name (type of deck: aggro, midrange, brew, etc.)
Record
Over performers (OP) :: Thought-knot
Under performers (UP) ::
Notes :: A one or two sentence summary explaining the matchup. Something along the lines of if anybody had any bad draws, somebody mulled down to 3, I couldn't find the right removal or sideboard cards, etc.
Other than eternal scourge, I feel like there are two new cards that are pretty good sideboard options for us:
collective brutality
blessed alliance
I feel like there are valid arguments for both of those cards in our sideboard instead of rest for the weary or other cards that help out with the burn/zoo matchup. What are everybody else's thoughts?
CBW midrange deck
CBW eldrazi processor deck
CBW bw eldrazi shadow midrange
Maybe that version of the deck will play Scrabbling Claws too
A card's CMC is always what is in the top right corner. Like kicker, escalate is an additional cost, not it's CMC.
RWBMardu artifacts
Modern
GInfect
GWUCEldrazi
Commander
RPurphoros
RWBKaalia
Legacy
RBurn
If Lingering Souls weren't so unbelievably good I would be thinking hard about a 3-4 Rest in Peace plus a 3-4 of Scourges plus another Reshaper or two in the spots freed up by four Souls and four Relics. But Souls IS so unbelievably good. Losing the Spirit tokens would destroy our Affinity/Infect/midgame-stalling line which is key to the deck's performance. And Scourge turns on Bolt, Decay, and Inquisition, all of which Souls is extremely strong against. Rest in Peace plus Lingering Souls is a terrible nonbo and is not an option. And Rest is not better in multiples, while Relic can be, and of course Relic cantrips when needed, which is crucial.
My guess is that Scourge may find a home as a one-of in a Relic/Souls Processor build. The deck already has several of one-of's that open up different angles, cf. Vault, Caverns, Sorin, Batterskull etc. I'm not sure what an optimized Scourge/Rest in Peace Processor build might look like, but I think it would be pretty different from where we are at. Maybe a GW Ramp/Aggro build more along the lines of Bant Eldrazi? A BW or Abzan Aether Vial build with Displacer and Strangler and a ton of 3-drops plus TKS?
In early playtesting (around 10 games), I have some early observations. A lot of games this deck just runs out of steam with no way to keep the momentum going. I'm going to try cutting my 2x main Ghost Quarters for Sea Gate Wreckage. Also, I know the primer says run a singleton, but I feel like going up to 2x Sorin SV is the way to go, as he really makes spirit tokens and pretty much everything else in the deck into huge life swings. With just one, you pretty much never see him (most of all since this deck lacks card draw) so he might as well not be there. I'm also running Displacer over Reshaper as I feel the former is just a way better mana sink for when the game goes long. I'd love to run 2x if I can find the room, I already cut to 3x Proggy Relics as I run a playset of Tidehollow and double O Ring which equal a lot of incidental exile.
I also feel like if you draw the parts out of order, the deck also gets really clunky. The bright spot I've seen is the manabase works very well with its current ratios. I'm running 13 w / 13 b and 11 <> with 2 mind stones. 23 lands total instead of 24. I just kept flooding.
I'll post my list once I refine it a bit more, but I was just a bit disappointed with my results vs all of the positive outcomes I've read on this thread. I know YMMV and all, but maybe you can fill me in on what this deck is supposed to do if the game goes long or if you draw your curve out of order, as the deck doesn't feel terribly consistent.
BUDGET DECK BUILDER SINCE 93'
Modern ------------------------- WU Azorius Titan Midrange
Commander ------------------- WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
***Are you looking for cards priced below TCG NM "LOW" and with FREE SHIPPING? - Click HERE! for my sales thread - 485 Feedback 100% positive!***
Well, careful of going too budget with this. Duress is not a great substitute for Thoughtseize or Inquisition, and Tragic Slip is certainly no Path to Exile. Sea Gate Wreckage is a great idea but personally I would sooner cut Cavern of Souls than a single Ghost Quarter. In my experience, GQ is an absolute all-star. Sorin is very strong and I too have considered running two. But ultimately he is not threat, only a threat magnifier. Sculler can be tough to cast on curve, and dies to a lot of things our other creatures resist.
There is some learning to do about sequencing, mull/keep decisions, etc. that will smooth things out for you. Keep playing and building up the deck and I predict you will have success.
Duress is going to be Thoughtseize or IoK, and Tragic Slip / Journey is going to be a 2/1 Split with Path and Declaration in Stone (meta card) (I will also up the budget on my tappedout list accordingly - aiming for $200)
So far I've had no problem casting Sculler on curve, I really believe the manabase is actually pretty solid with the 13/13/11-13 + 2 stone split
Thank you for the feedback! I plan to be active in this thread and hopefully pick up some deck ideas.
I should also add during today's games during lunch, the deck ran a little smoother. Though I'm still at a loss for how to fix the late game w/o cutting the 2x Ghost Quarters for 2x Sea Gate Wreckage
BUDGET DECK BUILDER SINCE 93'
Modern ------------------------- WU Azorius Titan Midrange
Commander ------------------- WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
***Are you looking for cards priced below TCG NM "LOW" and with FREE SHIPPING? - Click HERE! for my sales thread - 485 Feedback 100% positive!***
Firstly old cards that are brought to a better light. relic of proginitus I think was well positioned even before this set was revealed. Now that it is oh good lord, I can use it to be aggressive
surgical extraction is also a key deck wrecker. Problem was it is only truly useful against combo or with a good T1 hand discard.
eternal scourge...... where to begin. Firstly, it gives an outlet for removal. Bolts we could care less about (make the scourge blinky) but seeing a terminate, path, or anything similar blown on it is awsome (make TKS stick better). Now to the craziness part. With relic it is a ever returning wall. target yourself and remove/recast. So much gravy. Or dump it to your grave (or however you need to stick it in there) surgical it out of your deck and you have a 3/3 mana dump. Now something like heartless summoning with it is .......... (if we can brew in this forum I will come up with a hybrid idea, but I feel it is worth pursing).
Elder deep-fiend oh good lord, this card is insane. It can soak another removal and grant tempo of a TKS being killed, but requires blue to be used. I am still unsure of where it belongs, but I think that a blue black processor does have potential.
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
RG 8-Whack
BWG Abzan midrange
GRB Living End
UWB Spirit Control
GU Kruphix's "Hug Assassin"
RW Kalemne's "Play Fatties and Hope for the Best!"
BUGW Atraxa's "All counters, all the time"
We would lose Lingering Souls, Path, Sorin but gain the new 3 drop, distended mindbender, and we can replace path with any number of black removal spells. I will certainly consider this once I start playtesting with the new stuff.
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
Collective brutality it would help out against: burn, merfolk, zoo, collective company decks, elves, scapeshift, and 8-whack. It has a relevant mode against most decks in modern and we could discard lingering souls or eternal scourge for value. The ability for the card to either be a kill spell, discard spell, and/or a life gain spell is pretty amazing. Especially since we take so much damage with our mana base.
3 Eternal Scourge
3 Wasteland Strangler
2 Matter Reshaper
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
2 Collective Brutality
3 Path to Exile
1 Anguished Unmaking
4 Lingering Souls
2 Mind Stone
4 Relic of Progenitus
Lands (24):
24x Lands
CBW midrange deck
CBW eldrazi processor deck
CBW bw eldrazi shadow midrange
Modern Tallowisp Spirits - A Modern Tallowisp Deck UW
Eldrazi Ninjas - Summoning Octopus Jutsu YYYYAAAHHHH!
STANDARD
Naban Wizards
It would be pretty difficult since an esper version is basically a 4 color deck. Having negate or stubborn denial against tron and serum visions for some added consistency would be nice though. I would start by replacing mind stone with a few talisman of dominance.
CBW midrange deck
CBW eldrazi processor deck
CBW bw eldrazi shadow midrange
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
I beat Affinity, UB mill, Jeskai Control (no Nahiri), and Grixis Delver, and I tied with Blue Moon. I have written a lot of tourney reports for this thread over the past couple of months, not so sure that people really find any benefit from them though.
I am happy to write reports if some readers like them enough to let me know. Would side in/out notes be useful? More detail about key cards? But maybe just coming by every few days to report more reliable success with the build--which is what I continue to find at my LGS--isn't really the most productive way to use our time and bandwidth.
Anyway, still super surprised that this deck is not on anyone's radar. I'm making like $20-30/week in credit at my local FNM type events. I'm convinced that the new EMN cards will further shift the overall near-term meta towards graveyard utility, making our Relics (etc.) even better. Might as well enjoy riding this dark horse as far as we can, I suppose.
Yeah, I like matter reshaper a lot but I feel that eternal scourge fills the role of a re-occuring threat that will help out the longer matches. The ability to play eternal scourge and draw a random card when we are top-decking is pretty powerfull. This all could change once I get my hands on it though, I have been wrong many times before.
I would like to hear the under and over performers during your night and what types of deck you played against. If everybody had a similar format it would be easy to compile a list to determine the best 60 cards for the deck and how to fine tune the deck for specific metas. Something of the form:
Deck name (type of deck: aggro, midrange, brew, etc.)
Record
Over performers (OP) :: Thought-knot
Under performers (UP) ::
Notes :: A one or two sentence summary explaining the matchup. Something along the lines of if anybody had any bad draws, somebody mulled down to 3, I couldn't find the right removal or sideboard cards, etc.
Then have the deck list within spoiler tags.
Example:
Affinity (aggro)
2-0
OP :: Lingering souls, stony silence
UP :: Matter reshaper
Notes :: My opponent had a slow start game 1 and I found my silver bullet game 2.
RG Tron (it's tron, ugh...)
0-2
OP :: -
UP ::
Notes :: Natural tron turn 3 both games.
3 Eternal Scourge
3 Wasteland Strangler
2 Matter Reshaper
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
2 Collective Brutality
3 Path to Exile
1 Anguished Unmaking
4 Lingering Souls
2 Mind Stone
4 Relic of Progenitus
Lands (24):
24x Lands
CBW midrange deck
CBW eldrazi processor deck
CBW bw eldrazi shadow midrange