Why Faith's Shield over Emerge Unscathed ? "Rebound" seems more useful than "Fateful Hour".
Also playing 4x spells (Faith + TBR) that require creatures a relatively creature-lite decks seems too much.
yeah ,i tried them , and they were fine . but that is the problem. all of the changes i made , didnt make an actual improvement. i´d argue , most games still came down to variance and Luck. there were some moments , where i could certainly see that some changes i made were wrong , some cards were just plain bad , or either didnt fit right or conflicted with the overall strategy of the Deck. to be honest , the best card in the entire Deck might be gurmag angler . seriously. gurmag is that good. bolt proof , push proof, Huge butt , good attacker , good blocker , works PERFECT with slayers stronghold.
I've liked Angler, but I'm struggling to find room for more. I'm hovering between 1 and 2. It's been an issue with card advantage vs card quality balancing Ranger vs Angler.
The cases where the "Fateful Hour" ability on Faith's Shield is useful seem rather corner case.
Using Emerge Unscathed as protection on the opponent's turn and then "rebounding" it to make your Death's Shadow unblockable seems much more straightforward imho.
The cases where the "Fateful Hour" ability on Faith's Shield is useful seem rather corner case.
Using Emerge Unscathed as protection on the opponent's turn and then "rebounding" it to make your Death's Shadow unblockable seems much more straightforward imho.
Is anybody else into Nahiri? I see a lot of completely different lists are being posted here.
A lot of folks here were playing nahiri (including myself). I gave up (as many others) because the list felt too reactive.
The better option is to put 4 Bob's, if you dare.
I don't know how good gideon is in this shell but seems to be promising.
Looking forward to hear your feedbacks from actual gameplay.
The cases where the "Fateful Hour" ability on Faith's Shield is useful seem rather corner case.
Using Emerge Unscathed as protection on the opponent's turn and then "rebounding" it to make your Death's Shadow unblockable seems much more straightforward imho.
If we're talking about a DS deck, is Fateful Hour really a corner case?
I didn't mean that triggering "Fateful Hour" is a corner case but rather that giving protection to all your permanents and yourself is rarely useful over just giving protection to the creature you are targeting (twice).
Gideon felt decent when I played him, he just doesn't feel like he fits into my list. Never got to play him against Eldrazi but against other decks it felt best to play him turn 4 after a turn 3 Souls and preferably with Bolt/Path/Push in hand, and depending on board state go for his +1 first to neutralize a threat then next turn stick the emblem.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Collecting Timbermare, hit me up if you have any for trade
I like @TheAller list a lot. I'm a good player but there;s too many hard decisions in his deck, do you want to just be aggressive or save burn for defense. If I were to play super friends on friday (which I might) I would play a list like this:
Good ol' fashioned walker midrange. I used to play mardu superfriends a lot and to pretty good success pre-kaladesh with a similar list minus gideon of the trials obviously. Lately I've been playing a myriad of other things but I might switch back to something like this. It goldfishes well and has just so much removal. The SB I'm sure needs tweaks as do some cards in the main. Guaranteed I'm missing something for the guaranteed bad matches like tron and combo or go wide aggro.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Current Decks:
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange BWG Abzan value evolution BUG BUG Midrange
If you were to tweak this deck for the current meta, what would you change? I'm playing something similar to this deck and I plan to use to for an upcoming GP.
First modern event in years, won't know the meta too well but I think this is a fairly stock list that should get me wins.
Event didn't go well but that is to be expected after playing the format for the first time in a while. I also wasn't fetching correctly and that left me open to color denial.
Played my DS variant again this week. It didn't go well, mulliganed just about every hand. Lost a good matchup in R1 (Affinity), lost a 50/50 in R2 (Junk), won R3 (mill) and R4 (taking turns). Overall, I wasn't too happy with those results. I think 6 Bushwhackers is one too many and another Gurmag Angler is probably where I want to be. Those I will point out that I won a game in each round on the back of Souls/Bushwhacker. The interaction is very powerful, in my game against Junk that I did win, I had 7 lands after we played draw/go and killed everything for awhile. Empty board on both sides, I go Souls, Flashback, Angler, Bushwhacker and hit for 16. The opponent had 18, and next turn played a Lingering Souls of his own but it wasn't enough thanks to that big push.
Something I've really been wanting to play is Squadron Hawk+Collective Brutality. That might end up coming in over a Bushwhacker, the Eidolons, and something else.
One of the problems (beside others) with the Mardu DS shell is that the shell is light on threat most of the times.
It is not rare to find yourself without cards in hand.
Eidolon is great but you will "never" play him mid to endgame.
Bushwhackers are not great by they own.
Ranger of Eos as 2-of isn't a tutor that we can always count with.
Considering that I'm wondering if a list like this could be more reliable:
Asylum has menace, hits for 3, and can potentially draw for 1 mid-game and 2 end-game.
The two times that I felt bad about playing this deck: empty hand and light threats. I know that is a pretty obvious statement for any deck in magic but DS Mardu constantly fall in this category.
Why not bob? Dies too fast (lightning magnet), hit for less, and kill us faster then anything.
Eidolon is great but you will "never" play him mid to endgame.
Bushwhackers are not great by they own.
Ranger of Eos as 2-of isn't a tutor that we can always count with.
Eidolon is fine mid to end game. It will still get in for damage which is something no other 2 drop option can really do.
Bushwhackers are good, but I'm not counting them as threats.
Ranger of Eos is a threat, you don't have to count on it either. It's just another card in the threat category.
Considering that I'm wondering if a list like this could be more reliable:
I think 4 Bushwhackers is minimum, I actually see the deck as more of a Bushwhacker deck than a DS deck. DS is just something big that I can haste.
Why not bob? Dies too fast (lightning magnet), hit for less, and kill us faster then anything.
Bob is too slow. The CMC of the deck is too low. Bob doesn't deal worthwhile amounts of self damage. I've got a total CMC of 72, with Anglers in the deck not to mention the 3 mana Bushwhackers. That's 1.2 damage/turn, and unfortunately really spiky rather than smooth so Bob becomes unreliable. Plus, I think Bob just doesn't enable you fast enough.
I think Squadron Hawk might help things out as far as cards in hand go, but it's not really a strong threat without equipment or Stronghold but I'm open to ideas to abusing it. I love the idea of Hawk+Brutality (which another poster also mentioned a page or two back) and Hawk+Sunscour might be something in a slower build too.
Eidolon is fine mid to end game. It will still get in for damage which is something no other 2 drop option can really do.
Bushwhackers are good, but I'm not counting them as threats.
Ranger of Eos is a threat, you don't have to count on it either. It's just another card in the threat category.
How many life you usually have when casting Eidolon mid to end game?
Most of the time I had 6 to 3 life. Too dangerous. Besides that...from t2 to mid-game eidolon is awesome.
I think 4 Bushwhackers is minimum, I actually see the deck as more of a Bushwhacker deck than a DS deck. DS is just something big that I can haste.
If you're playing a version with 4 Souls I definitely agree with you. Besides that you will, most of the time, cast 2 bushwhacker for RRR and hitting for 4 ihmo.
Gideon can stop Valakut with his +1, the emblem deals with "Ad-Naus" because they can't split the damage with Lightning Storm
(like "Valakut" and "Storm" can).
It does nothing against "Storm" though (unless attacking them for 4 counts).
Neat deck, though I think you're missing a card in the main. Any idea what that might be?
Minor observation: I think 8x tapped lands might be too much. For turn 1 Bolt you want 14x untapped red sources while you have 12x, and for turn 1 Inquisition/Thoughtseize you need 14x untapped black sources while you only have 8x. If you have to mull a bunch to get a keepable hand with early interaction you're losing cards, which IMO could hurt you more than the cycling helps. Here's where I'm at with the manabase right now:
How many life you usually have when casting Eidolon mid to end game?
Most of the time I had 6 to 3 life. Too dangerous. Besides that...from t2 to mid-game eidolon is awesome.
6-12 life. It depends on if I let any damage through and how much I take from my mana. It's easy enough to play around.
If you're playing a version with 4 Souls I definitely agree with you. Besides that you will, most of the time, cast 2 bushwhacker for RRR and hitting for 4 ihmo.
I use 4 Lingering Souls. But even just going Angler into Bushwhacker is pretty nice.
Sorry for the misunderstanding, I wasn't alluding to Lily. Your list added up to 59 cards when I counted and I was curious what the 60th card was supposed to be.
Also playing 4x spells (Faith + TBR) that require creatures a relatively creature-lite decks seems too much.
Also, what about Sin Prodder in this deck as a Dark Confidant alternative ?
I've liked Angler, but I'm struggling to find room for more. I'm hovering between 1 and 2. It's been an issue with card advantage vs card quality balancing Ranger vs Angler.
Using Emerge Unscathed as protection on the opponent's turn and then "rebounding" it to make your Death's Shadow unblockable seems much more straightforward imho.
Btw, here is an interesting take on Mardu as a "Superfriends" list with the "Madcap Emperion" combo thrown in.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/modern-mardu-madcap
If we're talking about a DS deck, is Fateful Hour really a corner case?
A lot of folks here were playing nahiri (including myself). I gave up (as many others) because the list felt too reactive.
The better option is to put 4 Bob's, if you dare.
I don't know how good gideon is in this shell but seems to be promising.
Looking forward to hear your feedbacks from actual gameplay.
I didn't mean that triggering "Fateful Hour" is a corner case but rather that giving protection to all your permanents and yourself is rarely useful over just giving protection to the creature you are targeting (twice).
4 wall of omens
1 emrakul, the aeons torn
spells
4 inquisition of kozilek
2 thoughtseize
4 lightning bolt
4 path to exile
1 collective brutality
1 terminate
3 lingering souls
walkers
3 gideon of the trials
3 liliana of the veil
4 nahiri, the harbinger
2 gideon jura
2 arid mesa
2 bloodstained mire
4 marsh flats
2 concealed courtyard
2 blackcleave cliffs
1 bloodstained mire
1 sacred foundry
1 godless shrine
2 mountain
2 plains
1 swamp
3 shambling vent
1 ghost quarter
2 rest in peace
2 stony silence
2 timely reinforcements
2 anger of the gods
1 kolaghan's command
1 blessed alliance
1 pithing needle
1 engineered explosives
1 crumble to dust
2 fulminator mage
Good ol' fashioned walker midrange. I used to play mardu superfriends a lot and to pretty good success pre-kaladesh with a similar list minus gideon of the trials obviously. Lately I've been playing a myriad of other things but I might switch back to something like this. It goldfishes well and has just so much removal. The SB I'm sure needs tweaks as do some cards in the main. Guaranteed I'm missing something for the guaranteed bad matches like tron and combo or go wide aggro.
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
If you were to tweak this deck for the current meta, what would you change? I'm playing something similar to this deck and I plan to use to for an upcoming GP.
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Nahiri, the Harbinger
4 Fatal Push
4 Path to Exile
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
1 Collective Brutality
1 Lightning Helix
2 Terminate
1 Hero's Downfall
2 Kolaghan's Command
4 Lingering Souls
2 Painful Truths
1 Blood Crypt
3 Bloodstained Mire
4 Concealed Courtyard
1 Godless Shrine
3 Marsh Flats
1 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Sacred Foundry
4 Shambling Vents
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Fragmentize
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Thoughtseize
1 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Damnation
First modern event in years, won't know the meta too well but I think this is a fairly stock list that should get me wins.
(246-174-26)
Event didn't go well but that is to be expected after playing the format for the first time in a while. I also wasn't fetching correctly and that left me open to color denial.
Changes for next week
-3 Arid Mesa
-2 Painful Truths
-1 K Command
-1 Fatal Push
+1 Blood Crypt
+1 Bloodstained Mire
+1 Lightning Helix
+4 Lightning Bolt
(246-174-26)
Something I've really been wanting to play is Squadron Hawk+Collective Brutality. That might end up coming in over a Bushwhacker, the Eidolons, and something else.
It is not rare to find yourself without cards in hand.
Eidolon is great but you will "never" play him mid to endgame.
Bushwhackers are not great by they own.
Ranger of Eos as 2-of isn't a tutor that we can always count with.
Considering that I'm wondering if a list like this could be more reliable:
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Arid Mesa
3 Blood Crypt
2 Godless Shrine
3 Marsh Flats
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Slayers' Stronghold
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Fatal Push
2 Path to Exile
4 Orzhov Charm
4 Thoughtseize
2 Kolaghan's Command
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Collective Brutality
2 Anger of the Gods
4 Death's Shadow
2 Ranger of Eos
4 Street Wraith
2 Goblin Bushwhacker
2 Gurmag Angler
2 Asylum Visitor
Asylum has menace, hits for 3, and can potentially draw for 1 mid-game and 2 end-game.
The two times that I felt bad about playing this deck: empty hand and light threats. I know that is a pretty obvious statement for any deck in magic but DS Mardu constantly fall in this category.
Why not bob? Dies too fast (lightning magnet), hit for less, and kill us faster then anything.
Eidolon is fine mid to end game. It will still get in for damage which is something no other 2 drop option can really do.
Bushwhackers are good, but I'm not counting them as threats.
Ranger of Eos is a threat, you don't have to count on it either. It's just another card in the threat category.
I think 4 Bushwhackers is minimum, I actually see the deck as more of a Bushwhacker deck than a DS deck. DS is just something big that I can haste.
Bob is too slow. The CMC of the deck is too low. Bob doesn't deal worthwhile amounts of self damage. I've got a total CMC of 72, with Anglers in the deck not to mention the 3 mana Bushwhackers. That's 1.2 damage/turn, and unfortunately really spiky rather than smooth so Bob becomes unreliable. Plus, I think Bob just doesn't enable you fast enough.
I think Squadron Hawk might help things out as far as cards in hand go, but it's not really a strong threat without equipment or Stronghold but I'm open to ideas to abusing it. I love the idea of Hawk+Brutality (which another poster also mentioned a page or two back) and Hawk+Sunscour might be something in a slower build too.
How many life you usually have when casting Eidolon mid to end game?
Most of the time I had 6 to 3 life. Too dangerous. Besides that...from t2 to mid-game eidolon is awesome.
If you're playing a version with 4 Souls I definitely agree with you. Besides that you will, most of the time, cast 2 bushwhacker for RRR and hitting for 4 ihmo.
(like "Valakut" and "Storm" can).
It does nothing against "Storm" though (unless attacking them for 4 counts).
Minor observation: I think 8x tapped lands might be too much. For turn 1 Bolt you want 14x untapped red sources while you have 12x, and for turn 1 Inquisition/Thoughtseize you need 14x untapped black sources while you only have 8x. If you have to mull a bunch to get a keepable hand with early interaction you're losing cards, which IMO could hurt you more than the cycling helps. Here's where I'm at with the manabase right now:
4x Arid Mesa
3x Blackcleave Cliffs
1x Blood Crypt
2x Concealed Courtyard
1x Godless Shrine
4x Marsh Flats
1x Mountain
2x Plains
2x Sacred Foundry
3x Shambling Vent
1x Swamp
6-12 life. It depends on if I let any damage through and how much I take from my mana. It's easy enough to play around.
I use 4 Lingering Souls. But even just going Angler into Bushwhacker is pretty nice.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/instant-deck-tech-madcap-gideons-modern
What do you think about this kind of a Mardu list ?
It has plenty of hard to deal with win-cons but is a bit top-heavy (and the SB is rather weird).
Personally I'd rather tweak it like this:
-3x Faithless Looting, -3x Asylum Visitor, -1x Kolaghan's Command.
+2x Night's Whisper, +3x Wall of Omens, +2x Fatal Push.