Im happy for this guy taking down a tourney with dragons deck
But I dont think thats a good deck
Control and Combo should be a pain
Looks like the only good way to beat these is timely Blood Moon. Stormbreath can be hard for control and Ratchet Bomb sometimes slows combo but thats too little. All this removal becomes dead cards.
Also this sideboard doesnt have enough options against combo and control
Also these 4-ofs look like untuned list. 4 Draconic Roar? Even a guaranteed Searing Blaze isnt good if you dont play aggro. 4 Glorybringer? He has a lot of removal, why not use generally stronger Stormbreath Dragon? 4 Blood Moons without acceleration, when they are bad they are going to be very bad.
I don't think the issue is his removal being dead, since Sarkhan can loot dead cards away. It's actually the greatest strength of that specific PW. I think the issue is that he really doesn't have the saturation of haymakers necessary to bust through the countermagic most UWx decks bring to the table. I'd be curious how he succeeded, and who he played against that day.
Control in Modern is generally 3 colors** and depends on Cryptic Command and manlands to win, making it soft to Blood Moon. They also generally do not pack removal for Planeswalkers, and don't have enough creatures able to beat those, so the ultimate of Sarkhan and the incremental damage of Chandra, Thunderbreak Regent and Draconic Roar are the way for this version to win.
The dragons are also resilient to immune to the three 1-mana removal spells (Fatal Push, Lightning Bolt and Path to Exile) and, in a long game, Sarkhan will be able to dig for the cards you need.
**Not applicable to UW Control, but that deck is weaker to creature decks that are popular in Modern at the moment, unlike Jeskai and Grixis Control.
As for Combo decks... Yeah, this deck appears weak to Storm (though its non-damaging manabase makes it longer for them to combo off), but 4x Blood Moon is good against Valakut, and 4x Anger of the Goods is good against Hollow One and great against dredge. I'd still keep a couple of Relics in the sideboard.
CThey also generally do not pack removal for Planeswalkers, and don't have enough creatures able to beat those, so the ultimate of Sarkhan and the incremental damage of Chandra, Thunderbreak Regent and Draconic Roar are the way for this version to win.
They pack counterspells, burn, bounce, manlands besides snapcasters which are gonna die probably but can still deal damage
A lot of that is basic Skred principles. The only thing that's a big deviation is the use of Sarkhan, Fireblood. I get that looting is good, but it just feels like a slow PW in an otherwise fast format, at the cost of one of the fastest ways we have to lock up the game against control (Koth). This is why I'd like to know more about the deck particulars. If he frequently accelerated a dragon out which actually resolved, or looted four times, or even ultimated, I may have to re-evaluate the card. Otherwise, right now I feel like I'd rather just play more threats or copies of Faithless Looting.
I want to analyze Ozzy Kelly's recent winning list, because I think it contains important lessons in its unconventionality. Breaking it down, in the 60 it has:
Kelly might not be playing classic Skred Red in that the deck lacks Relics and Koth, but it has the same principles of beating creature decks and quickly closing the game after turning the corner. Against control, he has a ton of good threats.
Because this is a control deck, many cards perform amazingly in some matches and quite poorly in others. The addition of card selection is not all new, but is very powerful.
It's also clear Kelly's largely not trying to beat combo. This build cannot outrace it, and devotes almost nothing to actually beating it. Instead, it hopes to mostly dodge it. With combo being less than 20% of the metagame over the last few months, this is a prudent risk, far better than than contorting the deck to hope to bring those matchups to merely unfavorable rather than awful.
Skred Red has always been a metagame-dependent deck, and that idea is fully embraced here. While Kelly certainly must have had good matchups and a lot of luck, that's true for anyone who wins. Where the genius comes in is the Kelly built to maximally exploit that luck should it happen, which it did.
I'm not adopting Sarkhan yet, but I am certainly taking lessons from this approach. My next build may be quite different.
Count me part of the unconvinced crowd. Impressive win, congrats to the originality, but Sarkhan... just doesn't seem that good. The deck looks super clunky. It's maybe a few pieces away to be really slick though.
The only thing I could see myself do with my regular Skred deck : maybe let go of the 4x Relics 2x Scourge main deck like he did. I mean... it's a slight edge against control, but are the slots really worth it ? I'm less and less sure. That's 10% of the deck we can free.
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French Commander : Yisan Liliana Kytheon Kari Zev Grenzo Karlov Tajic Gitrog Prossh Turboramp Najeela Modern : Solemnity Prison Martyr Proc Devotion to Green 8 Whacks Eldrazi Processor Bogles Landfall Aggro Legacy : Goblins
I finished 4th at a 63 man pptq yesterday with Dragon skred. First time ever playing the deck or even playing skred. Beat Mardu in the quater final and lost 2-1 to U/w in the semi. I mostly used the same list as the original, but cut the ratchet bombs and 2 draconic roars for 4 SSG. I had 2 relic 2 chalice in SB.
My matchups were
U/W enduring ideal 2-1
Burn 2-0
Grixis deaths shadow 2-1
Mefolk 2-0
ID
ID
Mardu 2-0
U/W Lost 2/1
Hey folks, just featured Skred Red on my YouTube channel. It was the old school build with Eternal Scourge and Relic of Progenitus. I felt like cheap red removal and maindeck graveyard hate seems to be reasonably well positioned right now with Humans on the uptick and the new Bridgevine decks running all over MTGO.
Check out some Magic Gameplay and Commentary videos here, including Modern Grixis, Jeskai, and Esper videos as well as some Standard and Drafts too: My YouTube Channel!
Oh, wow, thanks for the thoughts, Cavalry! I hadn't considered that, and the only matchup where I really wanted the cycle over Anger was against Control, which isn't our worst matchups or anything to begin with. Given that setup, do you favor Kozi's Return or something else for extra sweepers in the Board?
Sorry for the extremely late response, I've been busy. I actually run no other sweepers in the side, but I also play Magma Jet over Mind Stone, so ymmv.
As for Dragon Skred, I've played a little bit of it, but I'm playing my own version. I won't share a list yet because I'm still really tinkering with it, but I think Draconic Roar is a lot better than we're giving it credit for. While it looks really odd, one thing I like about it is it burns the opponent incidentally. Keep in mind every creature in the deck has 4 power, translating to 5 hits from our creatures to kill the opponent. Dealing damage while killing something means we get to move the clock while also controlling the game. Combined with a fetch/shock or a Chandra plus, it's one less hit to worry about. The ability is more impactful than one would think. That said, I cut them to test maindeck Abrade, but this is more for experimentation than because I thought Roar was bad. I'm still messing with it, but I'll get back to y'all soon.
One of these days I'll be more active here...
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"Don't believe everything you read on the internet." - Abraham Lincoln
does anyone have a guide or match up sideboarding?
Kind of straight forward. Side out the cards that don't do much in the matchups, and side in the good ones. Anger isnt good vs control, blood moom is bad vs mono color decks, etc.
Side out some threats and Koth if they're fast decks, and stick in rabblemasters if you need higher threat density.
does anyone have a guide or match up sideboarding?
I'm working on this, but I just moved and college is starting soon so this may take longer than I thought. What matchups do you have questions about?
u/w control seems to be pretty hard vizier humans elves and jund arent too bad but i played against u/w control and basically did nothing just wondering what to do
Yesterday I make Top8 on PPTQ, Sadly I lost on the first round (2-1) of top against mardu pyromancer in a really good match (both games I lost I needed one turn and I could win )
Games:
R1: Mono G Tron / lost 0-2
R2: Jeskai control / Win 2-1
R3: 8-Rack / Win 2-0
R4: Grixis Shadow / Win 2-0
R5: Affinity / Win 2-0
R6: Rakdos something / Win 2-0
With this I ended the rounds on first place from 52 players so even when I lost after it I was really happy !
Hi, this Sunday I played Skred Dragons on a PPTQ. Basically the default list, cutting 2 Draconic Roar for Abrades and the sideboard completely different:
4 Relic of Progenitus
3 Dragon's Claw
1 Alpine Moon
2 Molten Rain
2 Damping Sphere
1 Anger of the Gods
2 Shattering Spree
R1 - Eldrazy taxes 2-0
Most valuable cards: Anger of the Gods and Skred
On This match TKS was unable to disrupt my hand, containing 2 Skred and 1 Anger of the Gods
The 2nd one I only removed a lot of creatures and won deploying a single dragon
R2 - UW Control1 - 1-2
Most valuable Cards: Sarkhan and Relic Of progenitus
Lost to Gideon Jura, unable to double bolt him, and he won after 4 attacks on both games
R3 - Scapeshift - 2-0
Most valuable Cards: Blood moon won both games
Deployed blood moon, some dragons and gg
R4 - Humans - 2-0
Most valuable Cards: Anger of the Gods, Skred, Blood Moon and Ratchet bomb
Easy match, the removal diversity helps a lot against Meddling Mage
R5 - UB Mill (this was the 1st place swiss) - ID
Then I was at the top8 as 4th
R6 - UW Control2 - 2-0
Most valuable Cards: Sarkhan, Scrying sheets, Chandra Torch and Ratchet bomb
I was able to put early the ratchet bomb to break the PWs, Sarkhan filtered the deck a lot and the Thunderbreak Regents dealed a lot of damage being removed. Finished with Stormbreath both games
R7 - Merfolk
Most valuable Cards: Anger of the Gods, Skred, Ratchet bomb
This match we can't let the Aether Vial work, as he will use open mana to counter our spells and play creatures with Vial.
Obviously I did not have Abrade on hands to avoid that, but the Dragons being flying and a lot of removal give us a faster clock.
On 2nd match he finished with 3 vials on hand, then was out of luck with no real resources to play
Final - UW Control1 - 0-2
Most valuable Cards: Sarkhan and Relic of Progenitus
This time I was able to remove Gideon with Ratchet bomb, but a lot of Cryptic Commands and removals did not allow me to keep a threat in field for more than 2 turns. I was always behind a lot of open mana to respond to anything I would do.
It's not a bad match, I won "easily" the other UW, but on this match I could not.
After playing a lot both Skred versions (Scourge/Koth and now Dragons) I think Dragons is better as we can finish earlier and with all flying creatures. We can't play without at least 3 Relic of Progenitus. The original Dragons sidebord is a mistake.
Draconic Roar seems bad but 2 of them is good. I would play 4 but we can't play without artifact removal main deck otherwise the Aether vial decks outrun our removals. There are also decks using Ensnaring Bridge.
After playing a lot both Skred versions (Scourge/Koth and now Dragons) I think Dragons is better as we can finish earlier and with all flying creatures. We can't play without at least 3 Relic of Progenitus. The original Dragons sidebord is a mistake.
Draconic Roar seems bad but 2 of them is good. I would play 4 but we can't play without artifact removal main deck otherwise the Aether vial decks outrun our removals. There are also decks using Ensnaring Bridge.
That's it.
would you recommended building dragon skred? im currently on eternal/koth and been enjoying it quite a bit was wondering if its worth buying into dragon skred
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But I dont think thats a good deck
Control and Combo should be a pain
Looks like the only good way to beat these is timely Blood Moon. Stormbreath can be hard for control and Ratchet Bomb sometimes slows combo but thats too little. All this removal becomes dead cards.
Also this sideboard doesnt have enough options against combo and control
Also these 4-ofs look like untuned list. 4 Draconic Roar? Even a guaranteed Searing Blaze isnt good if you dont play aggro. 4 Glorybringer? He has a lot of removal, why not use generally stronger Stormbreath Dragon? 4 Blood Moons without acceleration, when they are bad they are going to be very bad.
G Green Stompy
RG Shamans
UB Mill
UG Infect
WUBRG Slivers!
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
The dragons are also resilient to immune to the three 1-mana removal spells (Fatal Push, Lightning Bolt and Path to Exile) and, in a long game, Sarkhan will be able to dig for the cards you need.
**Not applicable to UW Control, but that deck is weaker to creature decks that are popular in Modern at the moment, unlike Jeskai and Grixis Control.
As for Combo decks... Yeah, this deck appears weak to Storm (though its non-damaging manabase makes it longer for them to combo off), but 4x Blood Moon is good against Valakut, and 4x Anger of the Goods is good against Hollow One and great against dredge. I'd still keep a couple of Relics in the sideboard.
WBC Eldrazi & Taxes CBW
UR Keep on Cantripin' (UR Phoenix) RU
WU Surprise! It's not UW Control! (UW Midrange) UW
BG The Rock, Straight BG
U Mono-Blue Fish U
RBW Mardu Pyromancer BWR
RG Rabble! Rabble! (GR Blood Moon Aggro) GR
Legacy
W Death & Taxes W
G Green Stompy
RG Shamans
UB Mill
UG Infect
WUBRG Slivers!
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
24 lands
16 threats
8 one-shot player-burn effects
22 ways to kill creatures
8 card-selection/advantage effects
4 Blood Moon
Kelly might not be playing classic Skred Red in that the deck lacks Relics and Koth, but it has the same principles of beating creature decks and quickly closing the game after turning the corner. Against control, he has a ton of good threats.
Because this is a control deck, many cards perform amazingly in some matches and quite poorly in others. The addition of card selection is not all new, but is very powerful.
It's also clear Kelly's largely not trying to beat combo. This build cannot outrace it, and devotes almost nothing to actually beating it. Instead, it hopes to mostly dodge it. With combo being less than 20% of the metagame over the last few months, this is a prudent risk, far better than than contorting the deck to hope to bring those matchups to merely unfavorable rather than awful.
Skred Red has always been a metagame-dependent deck, and that idea is fully embraced here. While Kelly certainly must have had good matchups and a lot of luck, that's true for anyone who wins. Where the genius comes in is the Kelly built to maximally exploit that luck should it happen, which it did.
I'm not adopting Sarkhan yet, but I am certainly taking lessons from this approach. My next build may be quite different.
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
The only thing I could see myself do with my regular Skred deck : maybe let go of the 4x Relics 2x Scourge main deck like he did. I mean... it's a slight edge against control, but are the slots really worth it ? I'm less and less sure. That's 10% of the deck we can free.
Modern : Solemnity Prison Martyr Proc Devotion to Green 8 Whacks Eldrazi Processor Bogles Landfall Aggro
Legacy : Goblins
My matchups were
U/W enduring ideal 2-1
Burn 2-0
Grixis deaths shadow 2-1
Mefolk 2-0
ID
ID
Mardu 2-0
U/W Lost 2/1
You can check out the video here: Eternal Skred vs. GW Company. Hope you enjoy!
Sorry for the extremely late response, I've been busy. I actually run no other sweepers in the side, but I also play Magma Jet over Mind Stone, so ymmv.
As for Dragon Skred, I've played a little bit of it, but I'm playing my own version. I won't share a list yet because I'm still really tinkering with it, but I think Draconic Roar is a lot better than we're giving it credit for. While it looks really odd, one thing I like about it is it burns the opponent incidentally. Keep in mind every creature in the deck has 4 power, translating to 5 hits from our creatures to kill the opponent. Dealing damage while killing something means we get to move the clock while also controlling the game. Combined with a fetch/shock or a Chandra plus, it's one less hit to worry about. The ability is more impactful than one would think. That said, I cut them to test maindeck Abrade, but this is more for experimentation than because I thought Roar was bad. I'm still messing with it, but I'll get back to y'all soon.
One of these days I'll be more active here...
Kind of straight forward. Side out the cards that don't do much in the matchups, and side in the good ones. Anger isnt good vs control, blood moom is bad vs mono color decks, etc.
Side out some threats and Koth if they're fast decks, and stick in rabblemasters if you need higher threat density.
u/w control seems to be pretty hard vizier humans elves and jund arent too bad but i played against u/w control and basically did nothing just wondering what to do
Yesterday I make Top8 on PPTQ, Sadly I lost on the first round (2-1) of top against mardu pyromancer in a really good match (both games I lost I needed one turn and I could win )
Games:
R1: Mono G Tron / lost 0-2
R2: Jeskai control / Win 2-1
R3: 8-Rack / Win 2-0
R4: Grixis Shadow / Win 2-0
R5: Affinity / Win 2-0
R6: Rakdos something / Win 2-0
With this I ended the rounds on first place from 52 players so even when I lost after it I was really happy !
My list:
https://goo.gl/vMfSB1
R Skred
4 Relic of Progenitus
3 Dragon's Claw
1 Alpine Moon
2 Molten Rain
2 Damping Sphere
1 Anger of the Gods
2 Shattering Spree
R1 - Eldrazy taxes 2-0
Most valuable cards: Anger of the Gods and Skred
On This match TKS was unable to disrupt my hand, containing 2 Skred and 1 Anger of the Gods
The 2nd one I only removed a lot of creatures and won deploying a single dragon
R2 - UW Control1 - 1-2
Most valuable Cards: Sarkhan and Relic Of progenitus
Lost to Gideon Jura, unable to double bolt him, and he won after 4 attacks on both games
R3 - Scapeshift - 2-0
Most valuable Cards: Blood moon won both games
Deployed blood moon, some dragons and gg
R4 - Humans - 2-0
Most valuable Cards: Anger of the Gods, Skred, Blood Moon and Ratchet bomb
Easy match, the removal diversity helps a lot against Meddling Mage
R5 - UB Mill (this was the 1st place swiss) - ID
Then I was at the top8 as 4th
R6 - UW Control2 - 2-0
Most valuable Cards: Sarkhan, Scrying sheets, Chandra Torch and Ratchet bomb
I was able to put early the ratchet bomb to break the PWs, Sarkhan filtered the deck a lot and the Thunderbreak Regents dealed a lot of damage being removed. Finished with Stormbreath both games
R7 - Merfolk
Most valuable Cards: Anger of the Gods, Skred, Ratchet bomb
This match we can't let the Aether Vial work, as he will use open mana to counter our spells and play creatures with Vial.
Obviously I did not have Abrade on hands to avoid that, but the Dragons being flying and a lot of removal give us a faster clock.
On 2nd match he finished with 3 vials on hand, then was out of luck with no real resources to play
Final - UW Control1 - 0-2
Most valuable Cards: Sarkhan and Relic of Progenitus
This time I was able to remove Gideon with Ratchet bomb, but a lot of Cryptic Commands and removals did not allow me to keep a threat in field for more than 2 turns. I was always behind a lot of open mana to respond to anything I would do.
It's not a bad match, I won "easily" the other UW, but on this match I could not.
After playing a lot both Skred versions (Scourge/Koth and now Dragons) I think Dragons is better as we can finish earlier and with all flying creatures. We can't play without at least 3 Relic of Progenitus. The original Dragons sidebord is a mistake.
Draconic Roar seems bad but 2 of them is good. I would play 4 but we can't play without artifact removal main deck otherwise the Aether vial decks outrun our removals. There are also decks using Ensnaring Bridge.
That's it.
would you recommended building dragon skred? im currently on eternal/koth and been enjoying it quite a bit was wondering if its worth buying into dragon skred