Had a GP trial today and scored a 4-1 with my traditional list (no garagadons)
Played 2 times agasint affinity and barely noticed there was another player there. This deck overhelms affinity so much is not even funny, specially after you bring ancient grudges.
Played a hard match agasint burn, lost first game, but gnaw to the bone was king on the other games.
The 4th match... against Eldrazi and Taxes went very interestingly.. won first game easily. Secong game I had a Nut draw.. at end of my second turn I had 1 narco 1 prized 4 ghasts in play. He went to drop a rest in peace and managed to defeat me with 1 life point left. At the third game he did not draw the RiP and I won easily THat tought me that no, you cannot defeat RiP unless your opponent plays very badly.
5th match my deck self destructed against merfolk.. mulligan to 4 to find a land.. and find 1 fast land with 3 faithless looting.. tought that shoudl be good enough to fix my hand... but NOPE. Did nto got ANY land until 5th turn and by then was too late (even while using the lootings to try find one)
Second game agaisnt merfolk.. again mulligan to 4.. but then I get Only lands only lands. .nothign else for 4 turns... well I hate when I lose because I could not play magic. Got so angry that I went home without doing the Top 8....
The deck is working fine.. but it still folds to RiP.
I'm having a bit of trouble cutting that last card from my deck. Could you who've been playing the deck more than me be so kind to help a fellow dredger out? I'm taking this deck to a tournament this Sunday, hoping to get as far as I can.
You can cut a land. 20 lands is all you need to almost always have 2 mana by turn 2 (source). You can get your 3rd land by dredging loam/dakmor or on the draws provided by Looting or Tormenting Voice.
You can also cut Vengeful Pharaoh to the sideboard. You already play Darkblast and Haunted Dead to provide some defense. I would only play a maximum 2 out of 3 these cards. Darkblast and Haunted Dead are better in meta with a lot of small attackers like elves, infect and affinity. Vengeful Pharaoh is better against big attackers like Grixis and Jund.
Instead of Vengeful Pharaoh, the 3rd Life from the Loam or 4th Tormenting Voice seems much better.
Tournament report @ FNM: Only 10 people, but the most hardcore crowd I could expect of modern experts.
Round 1 against Affinity: Both of us played this matchup the previous day when I played the deck for the first time, and it ended badly for me. I tuned the deck and studied it a lot before the FNM, I felt much more ready.
I expected a good game 1 but got blown out when I tried to clean his Master and Vault Skirge with Conflagrate and he activated a man-land in response. Game 2 was a freebie where he drew 4 Ornithopters but no lands. Game 3 I cast a total of 4 Ancient Grudge while he drew no sideboard cards nor Etched Champion. (2-1)
Round 2 against UW control: Game 1 was done by about turn 5. I'm not sure he got to cast spells, maybe a Supreme Verdict on turn 4 that prolonged the game by a turn. Game 2 he Surgically Extracted my Grave-Trolls and it took a while to find Imps to fill my graveyard. He defended well using Walls of Omens, Finks and Restoration Angel, almost managed to kill me, but the pressure of 6+ creatures and Conflagrate was too much for him. (2-0)
Round 3 against Grixis Control: I faced the local hero/pro tour participant in the finals. Losing to him was almost a habit but I tried to manage the pressure. Game 1 was a steamroll of zombies where I could only see that he played Grixis color lands and Serum Visions. Game 2 he boarded in Grafdigger's Cage while I had nothing in my deck able to handle that. I fetched blue source to cast a few creatures, but my huge turn 5 Grave-Troll got spot removed and Kalitas quickly ended my game. Game 3 started great for me, but Anger of the Gods stopped the first wave. He didn't manage to find a Snapcaster and his Kalitas died multiple times to Conflagrate. (2-1)
Round 4 against Elves: Turns out that a final round was needed even though I was the only undefeated player. Game 1 I took out his board with a turn 3 Conflagrate and that was the end for him. Game 2 he gained millions life with Essence Warden but didn't find anything beyond 1/1 and 2/2 and I could still race faster by threatening a lethal Rally the Peasants and wiping the board with Conflagrate. (2-0)
Went undefeated, even after an extra match!
Final notes:
I did not miss Hunted Dead once even though I cut him. Conflagrate did about the same thing, maybe better.
The deck often has a lot of decisions at every point in the game and can be overwhelming at times. I went close to time every round. Definitely needs a lot of practice to mulligan faster/sequence late game Loam actions.
I got lucky no one played Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void.
The deck is definitely very good and fast. Feels unfair like affinity, but more consistant and resilient, though hardcore hate cards also wreck you.
Tournament report @ FNM: Only 10 people, but the most hardcore crowd I could expect of modern experts.
Round 1 against Affinity: Both of us played this matchup the previous day when I played the deck for the first time, and it ended badly for me. I tuned the deck and studied it a lot before the FNM, I felt much more ready.
I expected a good game 1 but got blown out when I tried to clean his Master and Vault Skirge with Conflagrate and he activated a man-land in response. Game 2 was a freebie where he drew 4 Ornithopters but no lands. Game 3 I cast a total of 4 Ancient Grudge while he drew no sideboard cards nor Etched Champion. (2-1)
Round 2 against UW control: Game 1 was done by about turn 5. I'm not sure he got to cast spells, maybe a Supreme Verdict on turn 4 that prolonged the game by a turn. Game 2 he Surgically Extracted my Grave-Trolls and it took a while to find Imps to fill my graveyard. He defended well using Walls of Omens, Finks and Restoration Angel, almost managed to kill me, but the pressure of 6+ creatures and Conflagrate was too much for him. (2-0)
Round 3 against Grixis Control: I faced the local hero/pro tour participant in the finals. Losing to him was almost a habit but I tried to manage the pressure. Game 1 was a steamroll of zombies where I could only see that he played Grixis color lands and Serum Visions. Game 2 he boarded in Grafdigger's Cage while I had nothing in my deck able to handle that. I fetched blue source to cast a few creatures, but my huge turn 5 Grave-Troll got spot removed and Kalitas quickly ended my game. Game 3 started great for me, but Anger of the Gods stopped the first wave. He didn't manage to find a Snapcaster and his Kalitas died multiple times to Conflagrate. (2-1)
Round 4 against Elves: Turns out that a final round was needed even though I was the only undefeated player. Game 1 I took out his board with a turn 3 Conflagrate and that was the end for him. Game 2 he gained millions life with Essence Warden but didn't find anything beyond 1/1 and 2/2 and I could still race faster by threatening a lethal Rally the Peasants and wiping the board with Conflagrate. (2-0)
Went undefeated, even after an extra match!
Final notes:
I did not miss Hunted Dead once even though I cut him. Conflagrate did about the same thing, maybe better.
The deck often has a lot of decisions at every point in the game and can be overwhelming at times. I went close to time every round. Definitely needs a lot of practice to mulligan faster/sequence late game Loam actions.
I got lucky no one played Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void.
The deck is definitely very good and fast. Feels unfair like affinity, but more consistant and resilient, though hardcore hate cards also wreck you.
may I see your decklist? I'm really in the mood to build this, it looks ridiculously fun.
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Currently playing:
Modern: Affinity, Mono-White Hatebears.
Legacy: Death and Taxes, Mono Red Sneak Attack, Dragon Stompy.
Iwould arguee that the deck is NOT fun. THe majority of time either you are crused by grave hate , or you crush them with an explosive start that is larger than any other deck can handle, and from one in a while your deck simply willdecide to forc eyou tomulligna so much to find a keepable hand that you will get angry.
The ammount of interesting games where you need to think and plan are few
Well infect is one of the few decks that you NEED to interact to win (because it is even faster than us). But agaisnt most decks MOST of the matchs you go as nuts as possible. and there is no need for anything more complex.
The "interesting" plays only appear when enemy side in their hate (Then you need to think about being fst vs conservative) but I have played few decks where game 1 is less eventful than this. That said.. it works wonders when the mulligan god does not decide to kick you.
Iwould arguee that the deck is NOT fun. THe majority of time either you are crused by grave hate , or you crush them with an explosive start that is larger than any other deck can handle, and from one in a while your deck simply willdecide to forc eyou tomulligna so much to find a keepable hand that you will get angry.
The ammount of interesting games where you need to think and plan are few
Strongly disagree, the deck offers a lot of decisions and it's not only a matter of your opponent seeing his hate pieces or not, because the deck have many ways to play around hate cards (for example casting dredgers against cage) or you can use your cantrips to find answers to whatever piece of hate they board in instead of start dredging. Moreover conflagrate (and darkblast/lightning axe/collective brutality) gives the deck a meaningful way to interact with your opponent's creatures. It may surprise you that one of the most interesting match i recently had in modern was dredge vs infect (two supposed uninteractive decks).
Yeah, Id disagree with that too. Dredge takes alot of thought. I was consistantly feeling tired by round 4.
Well infect is one of the few decks that you NEED to interact to win (because it is even faster than us). But agaisnt most decks MOST of the matchs you go as nuts as possible. and there is no need for anything more complex.
The "interesting" plays only appear when enemy side in their hate (Then you need to think about being fst vs conservative) but I have played few decks where game 1 is less eventful than this. That said.. it works wonders when the mulligan god does not decide to kick you.
every deck will just have to mulligan to crap every once in awhile. There are also a lot of decks out there where 1-2 sideboard cards will just wreck you.
Dredge IS a different kind of deck though. There are a lot more sequencing decisions than there are interactive decisions. If you don't like it, play a different deck.
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Big thanks to DarkNightCavalier from heroes of the planes studios for the sig!
Where you managed to find any evidence I did not LIke the deck? Just being fair and saying it is NOT the type of deck that brings the gameplay that people can fun is not the same as not liking it.
Fantastic how people can be rude and jump to conclusions by ignoring what other people are saying and isntead putting their own words into their mouths (or keyboards..)
Funny for Me I felt the opposite, I do not remember pilotinga modern deck that taxed me as little as this one. SIcne the decisions are sequential you get them quite "pre scripted" after two dozen matchs. The decisionson this deck are less related to readign your opponent and more related to statistical decisions.
I find it much easier to deal with statistical decisions tahn trying to read and opponent and at same time hide signals on my behavior.
Where you managed to find any evidence I did not LIke the deck? Just being fair and saying it is NOT the type of deck that brings the gameplay that people can fun is not the same as not liking it.
Fantastic how people can be rude and jump to conclusions by ignoring what other people are saying and isntead putting their own words into their mouths (or keyboards..)
so you like the deck, but don't think it's fun. you say it's boring to play and makes for few interesting decisions. I'm starting to think you're either just a troll or some bitter person looking to spew negativity.
Generally speaking, if you don't find the deck fun or mentally stimulating to pilot, then play a different deck. Try lantern control. That deck should be right up your alley.
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Big thanks to DarkNightCavalier from heroes of the planes studios for the sig!
Hi! Sorry if it was discussed, but I didn't find it. What about River Kelpie in the deck?
It's too slow and susceptible to the same hate as the core gameplan. You'd be better off running something like The Gitrog Monster if you were trying to get some incremental value.
In general with the deck you want it to either do something from the graveyard or be something that is stocking your graveyard.
Hi! Sorry if it was discussed, but I didn't find it. What about River Kelpie in the deck?
It's a 5 CMC card that needs to be cast since you can't cheat it from the grave and is useless on the grave, the only cards you want to be casting are the enablers, not the payoffs. Not to mention the UU on it's cost
Mixed feeling about Dredge not making any showings this weekend, I think it's mostly because people are afraid to play it. I'm still packing it to SCG Orlando in a few weeks.
Hi! Sorry if it was discussed, but I didn't find it. What about River Kelpie in the deck?
It's too slow and susceptible to the same hate as the core gameplan. You'd be better off running something like The Gitrog Monster if you were trying to get some incremental value.
In general with the deck you want it to either do something from the graveyard or be something that is stocking your graveyard.
Ok, ok, sorry! That old legacy dredge tech confused me! There's no way to put it into play!
Ok, ok, sorry! That old legacy dredge tech confused me! There's no way to put it into play!
Legacy dredge can reanimate dudes for no mana with dread return, wich makes cards that can't reanimated themselves doable. Modern don't have this luxury, payoff creatures that don't work from the grave will not work here.
I'm pretty sure people were afraid to play the deck/were packing the grave hate this weekend. It looked like affinity was going strong this weekend which makes me believe modern is going to start the cycle legacy had a some years ago. Dredge would do well, then people pack grave hate, then affinity does well, then people pack artifact hate, wash rinse repeat.
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Played 2 times agasint affinity and barely noticed there was another player there. This deck overhelms affinity so much is not even funny, specially after you bring ancient grudges.
Played a hard match agasint burn, lost first game, but gnaw to the bone was king on the other games.
The 4th match... against Eldrazi and Taxes went very interestingly.. won first game easily. Secong game I had a Nut draw.. at end of my second turn I had 1 narco 1 prized 4 ghasts in play. He went to drop a rest in peace and managed to defeat me with 1 life point left. At the third game he did not draw the RiP and I won easily THat tought me that no, you cannot defeat RiP unless your opponent plays very badly.
5th match my deck self destructed against merfolk.. mulligan to 4 to find a land.. and find 1 fast land with 3 faithless looting.. tought that shoudl be good enough to fix my hand... but NOPE. Did nto got ANY land until 5th turn and by then was too late (even while using the lootings to try find one)
Second game agaisnt merfolk.. again mulligan to 4.. but then I get Only lands only lands. .nothign else for 4 turns... well I hate when I lose because I could not play magic. Got so angry that I went home without doing the Top 8....
The deck is working fine.. but it still folds to RiP.
You can cut a land. 20 lands is all you need to almost always have 2 mana by turn 2 (source). You can get your 3rd land by dredging loam/dakmor or on the draws provided by Looting or Tormenting Voice.
You can also cut Vengeful Pharaoh to the sideboard. You already play Darkblast and Haunted Dead to provide some defense. I would only play a maximum 2 out of 3 these cards. Darkblast and Haunted Dead are better in meta with a lot of small attackers like elves, infect and affinity. Vengeful Pharaoh is better against big attackers like Grixis and Jund.
Instead of Vengeful Pharaoh, the 3rd Life from the Loam or 4th Tormenting Voice seems much better.
Round 1 against Affinity: Both of us played this matchup the previous day when I played the deck for the first time, and it ended badly for me. I tuned the deck and studied it a lot before the FNM, I felt much more ready.
I expected a good game 1 but got blown out when I tried to clean his Master and Vault Skirge with Conflagrate and he activated a man-land in response. Game 2 was a freebie where he drew 4 Ornithopters but no lands. Game 3 I cast a total of 4 Ancient Grudge while he drew no sideboard cards nor Etched Champion. (2-1)
Round 2 against UW control: Game 1 was done by about turn 5. I'm not sure he got to cast spells, maybe a Supreme Verdict on turn 4 that prolonged the game by a turn. Game 2 he Surgically Extracted my Grave-Trolls and it took a while to find Imps to fill my graveyard. He defended well using Walls of Omens, Finks and Restoration Angel, almost managed to kill me, but the pressure of 6+ creatures and Conflagrate was too much for him. (2-0)
Round 3 against Grixis Control: I faced the local hero/pro tour participant in the finals. Losing to him was almost a habit but I tried to manage the pressure. Game 1 was a steamroll of zombies where I could only see that he played Grixis color lands and Serum Visions. Game 2 he boarded in Grafdigger's Cage while I had nothing in my deck able to handle that. I fetched blue source to cast a few creatures, but my huge turn 5 Grave-Troll got spot removed and Kalitas quickly ended my game. Game 3 started great for me, but Anger of the Gods stopped the first wave. He didn't manage to find a Snapcaster and his Kalitas died multiple times to Conflagrate. (2-1)
Round 4 against Elves: Turns out that a final round was needed even though I was the only undefeated player. Game 1 I took out his board with a turn 3 Conflagrate and that was the end for him. Game 2 he gained millions life with Essence Warden but didn't find anything beyond 1/1 and 2/2 and I could still race faster by threatening a lethal Rally the Peasants and wiping the board with Conflagrate. (2-0)
Went undefeated, even after an extra match!
Final notes:
may I see your decklist? I'm really in the mood to build this, it looks ridiculously fun.
Modern: Affinity, Mono-White Hatebears.
Legacy: Death and Taxes, Mono Red Sneak Attack, Dragon Stompy.
The ammount of interesting games where you need to think and plan are few
The "interesting" plays only appear when enemy side in their hate (Then you need to think about being fst vs conservative) but I have played few decks where game 1 is less eventful than this. That said.. it works wonders when the mulligan god does not decide to kick you.
Yeah, Id disagree with that too. Dredge takes alot of thought. I was consistantly feeling tired by round 4.
every deck will just have to mulligan to crap every once in awhile. There are also a lot of decks out there where 1-2 sideboard cards will just wreck you.
Dredge IS a different kind of deck though. There are a lot more sequencing decisions than there are interactive decisions. If you don't like it, play a different deck.
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema
Fantastic how people can be rude and jump to conclusions by ignoring what other people are saying and isntead putting their own words into their mouths (or keyboards..)
I find it much easier to deal with statistical decisions tahn trying to read and opponent and at same time hide signals on my behavior.
so you like the deck, but don't think it's fun. you say it's boring to play and makes for few interesting decisions. I'm starting to think you're either just a troll or some bitter person looking to spew negativity.
Generally speaking, if you don't find the deck fun or mentally stimulating to pilot, then play a different deck. Try lantern control. That deck should be right up your alley.
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema
It's too slow and susceptible to the same hate as the core gameplan. You'd be better off running something like The Gitrog Monster if you were trying to get some incremental value.
In general with the deck you want it to either do something from the graveyard or be something that is stocking your graveyard.
A huge thanks to Argetlam and the guys at Hakai studios for this awesome banner
Pretty happy with that, this shows that the deck, while strong, is not the monster people were afraid off. This should keep away the banmania dudes.
UR Storm
RBG Dredge
EDH:
UR Mizzix
GB Gitrog
WB Daxos
Ok, ok, sorry! That old legacy dredge tech confused me! There's no way to put it into play!