Also went to a PPTQ. 52 players, looked like the room had a bunch of players on fair decks. Still wanted to try my luck.
Round 1 vs. Grixis ?. Some odd deck that did Rise/Fall to me on turns 2 and 3, taking my only non-land cards. I had kept a 4 land hand and peeled land after land. I get some damage through, as he doesn't seem to have as many Fatal Push/Lightning Bolt as one would think. I draw all my Birds of Paradise and 2 of 3 Noble Hierarch. He is low on life. I have 5 lands left in my deck - 3 fetches and 2 Gavony Township. He cast a Nicol Bolas, the Ravager. I discard a land. The guy took a long time, so we have around 15 min. left. I didn't take that long because I mostly played land, go or land/bird, go. I am considering scooping since I can't draw ***** and I have a better game 2 and 3. I draw Gavony Township and swing for lethal with Devoted Druid, Duskwatch Recruiter, and 3 Birds of Paradise. In the next game, I keep a weak 4 land hand, weaker than the first game. I play the Scavenging Ooze, then Sin Collector, then Chord of Calling for Voice of Resurgence in reponse to Cryptic Command tap/draw. He gives me some tokens and can't win now. He does Rise/Fall to get my "win-con" in Walking Ballista, but he does something that gets me a Voice Elemental token to go with the other token and now I have lethal. 2-0.
Round 2 vs. Burn. He is on the play. I play a tapped land. I draw a BoP for turn 2. I play Devoted Druid instead. He makes me sacrifice it in response to Lightning Helix. I draw another BoP next turn. I play Kitchen Finks instead. I then do Eternal Witness into the Devoted Druid, but he has lethal burn next turn. The next game is similar. I do get Kitchen Finks, but he has 2 Goblin Guides, a Monastery Swiftspear, and an Eidolon of the Great Revel. He does a Boros Charm to put me to 4 life. But he's tapped out. I have Vizier of Remedies in hand and Devoted Druid out, so I need Chord or Collected Company for Duskwatch Recruiter. I draw...Duskwatch Recruiter. How lucky! I am at 4 life with an Eidolon of the Great Revel in play. Will he miss his triggers? Probably not. I play for the long game, but just draw 3 Birds of Paradise, a Duskwatch Recruiter, and a Noble Hierarch. Eidolon trigger much? 0-2.
Round 3 vs. Tron. I get to play against a guy who I usually give a ride to FNM with. He's played 2 PPTQs and I've played him in both. In the first game, I have Chord, BoP, Devoted Druid, and lands. I need to get a 3rd piece. I don't and he gets turn 4 Tron with Wurmcoil Engine. I was on the play, so this shows how painful this game was. I scryed infinite life to the top so I could scry my deck to a possible win, but I end up not doing crap. None of the Collected Companies had any good hits and he Karn exiled, O Stone cracked, and then rinse repeat until he got Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. In the next game, I mulligan and am missing just Vizier of Remedies. When he gets turn 4 O Stone and cracks it, my next draw is Vizier of Remedies. I had done a Duskwatch Recruiter activation for Chord, land, Chord to miss. He gets some stuff and I just get mismatching bears that don't have any combo. GGs. 0-2.
I left before the next 3 rounds, so 1-5 on the day for me. This was my roughest tournament that I can remember. I remember going 1-5, then 2-5 before dropping at a Los Angeles PTQ back in the days with UR Swans during BW Tokens Standard. This brought back memories.
Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
So do you want start a serious discussion about this question "GW or abzan ?" or is it useless to spend time on that ? (no offense, serious question to you because i don't care of what version i play).
Perfect, I actually came here to ask about the pros and cons of Abzan vs. GW. I'm returning to the format after two years off, and I think I've decided to pick this deck up, but I'm not sure which version I wanna put together first. I've seen a lot of GW lists recently, so I'm thinking there must be something to it.
So my question to you all is: What's your reasoning for playing GW instead of Abzan, or Abzan instead of GW? What are their pros and cons relative to each other, and which one do you think is the best one right now?
Any and all input is greatly appreciated, these deck threads are such a good resource.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
My main LGS has a bi-annually "Players Championship" which is a 24 player invite only tourney and you get there by a point system from playing events. First place was free events for a year, and second place was free events for a year but you had to pick week days or weekends. It was a three format tournament of Standard, Modern, M19 draft. I hadn't touched Standard cards since ~2012, but managed to go 1-2 and made the cut to the Modern round. Continuing my hot streak lately, I went 3-0 in the Modern portion (putting my record at 13-1 match wins in the last 4 events since a guy dropped to me round 3) to make top 8 and drafted a pretty average BW Lifegain deck that was pretty weak individually, but had a billion synergies in it. Had a super grindy 3 games against RW Aggro, and then lost to the most disgusting UB deck I've ever seen. He curved Walking Corpse into Death Baron, into Skeleton Archer which killed my only creature, and then into Bone Dragon. Game 2 wasn't much different and I lost that one real fast. Still ended up with $100 in credit which was a good result for a free tournament.
Played this deck for the first time in a while since I've been on GTron for PPTQ season. I got my Buglers which I've been itching to try out as I talked about here, and sailed to a 4-0 for the night! The deck felt super powerful, possibly the most powerful iteration of the deck I've played yet. My sample size is only 4 matches mind you, but I had some crazy games which are explained below. List for reference:
Some notes about the deck before the games:
- Yes that is a 14 card sideboard. I must have forgot one at home, but it didn't seem to matter at all.
- Omitting the Finks + Seer package for Bugler + KotR. This allows Bugler to hit every card in the deck.
- 1 Courser of Kruphix compliments the KotR's. Because of it's inclusion I am playing 7 dorks and 22 lands, as opposed to my normal 8 dorks and 21 lands. Yes I like to cheat on the lands, but not here.
- KotR even acts as a dork in some cases, especially if you play it turn 2, so you are playing what is essentially 15 "dorks" not even inducing EWit getting fetches back. I never had mana problems.
- Only 3 Eternal Witness. I always like 4, but I figured with Bugler I could drop one to make the deck a little less reliant on the graveyard.
- I played before with 6 land destruction lands, but found that against the majority of decks they didn't do what I wanted them to do. Because of this I dropped to 3. This lets me still kill stuff like the random Inkmoth/Mutavault while also slowing down Tron and Valakut enough to win those matchups (in theory). With the 3 extra "utility land" slots I was able to include a second Horizon Canopy to help out the combo and flooding in general, and a Gavony Township for when the deck goes real wide.
Onto the games:
Round 1 vs Grixis Death's Shadow:
Game 1 was a grind fest with him removing my Druids, but not having a fast start himself. Once I accepted that I wasn't going to combo I went all in on the KotR plan. The game was decided with him using a Temur Battlerage on his 8/8 Shadow to kill my 10/10 Knight. I then Companied into Knight + EWit, using the company again to hit another Knight and win the game since he ran out of blockers. Game 2 was more of the same with me boarding out the combo and into a midrange deck (everything but Kataki, Rec Sage, and Eidolon). I overwhelmed him with value and won with 2 11/11 Knights while destroying his lands thanks to Path removing his only two basic lands. Bugler kept on finding Knights or EWits that Companies couldn't and kept the value train going. 2-0
Round 2 vs Mardu Pyromancer:
More of the same as round 1. The dude went Lootings into Pyromancer and I won some turns after with the combo by casting some Companies and Bugler finding what I wanted. Boarded the same as against Death's Shadow since I figured I couldn't combo again through all of the removal. The game this time went pretty long with him killing my turn 2 druid and resolving a LotV which I had to then throw away a Knight and Ewit to. I eventually got there though as he couldn't discard my companies, and I started chaining them to fill up the board. I found my Scooze and kept his graveyard out of relevant stuff while I had a Spellskite and Forge-Tender as backup. The Scooze then went on to continually attack him and win. 2-0
Round 3 vs UG Infect:
This was the guy I lost to in the top 8 of the PPTQ on Sunday. Game 3 was the only relevant one and super intense with him on the play. Turn 2 he has a Blighted Agent while I have a Temple Garden and Horizon Canopy to play a Devoted Druid. His turn 3 he hits me for 7 infect, and will hit me for a guaranteed 3 more the next turn so I have to win. I untap, and my hand is Vizier, Ghost Quarter, Bugler, and some other not relevant stuff. I play the Vizier with the Temple Garden since I can draw a card with Canopy. This is only better than playing Bugler if I draw a Chord or Company, so I figure I'll Bugler instead sine I can hit 2 Recruiters and 1 Ballista in 4 cards. I miss, but hit another Bugler. It then dawned on me that I could Ghost Quarter my land to get an untapped Plains and cast the second Bugler to tray again. Lo and behold it hits a Recruiter and I get a clutch win! You can watch the video of the match here. 2-1
Round 4 vs Eldrazi Tron:
This is the guy I beat in round 5 of the PPTQ. Games were grindy with me eventually using a Chord to get through his Chalice on 2 and win the game. It was weird since he know the Chord was coming but didn't Dismember the Druid... Game 2 was won off of the back of KotR and some land fetching shenanigans to block Reality Smashers after the wiped my graveyard. Again a misplay on his part as he should have waited and he would have won. Re-watching the footage I also missed a Duskwatch trigger, so I'll have to remember that for the future. It didn't matter though as it died the turn after. You can watch the video of the match here. 2-0
---
Thoughts on the deck:
- I really really liked Bugler. The deck has been getting away from the graveyard more and more, but is still dependent with Eternal Witness and Knight of the Reliquary. It's not the worst is hate is brought in for it, but it certainly is annoying. Bugler helps get away from this (replacing Finks).
- Hitting a Bugler off of a Company almost guarantees hitting something that you need since you get to keep digging. I found if I was ever wanting a card I could always find it within the next 1-2 turns. It also makes the combo much more consistent meaning you will fizzle less when getting infinite mana.
- A downside with Bugler is that you are more dependent on W during the combo, so you have to be mindful to fetch it out.
- KotR is a beast, and is often the biggest thing on the battlefield. With Finks I found I was using it to chump and stay alive until I could squeak out a combo. Now for the same mana cost I am winning combats, ramping, and thinning my deck. You lose life gain in the deck, and if anything take more damage from fetches, so I can imagine the Burn matchups is suddenly harder.
- The plan of going super-combo maindeck and transitional value-midrange deck in the sideboard worked out well. I was able to race things like without interaction like Infect (and Affinity in pre-event games) while absolutely destroying the opponent with value post-board.
- I'm not sure what I want sideboard card #15 to be. Perhaps a Pridemage, or another Scooze...?
I will hopefully play this again Wednesday and see if I can replicate the results.
Took the deck to a 3-1 tonight, which puts Bugler version at 7-1 overall. Only changes were +1 Selfless Spirit MD, +1 Courser of Kruphix & +1 Qasali Pridemage SB so I had 15 cards this time. List for reference:
Wins were 2-0 vs taking Turns. I won the match in about 10 mins total with a turn 3 combo each game. 2-1 vs G Devotion. I kept a slow hand game 1 hoping I could just get there, whereas games 2 and 3 I forced the combo and blew him out of the water. 2-1 vs Scales Affinity, with game 3 him mulling to 5 while I had the turn 3 win. He didn't have removal on his turn 2 so I won.
My loss was to UW Control, 0-2. Game 1 I kept a 1 land hand with Hierarch, Druid, Druid, Vizier, Chord, EWit, Forest. On turn 2 I drew a second Chord, and he Logic Knotted my Druid for 1. If I had drawn a land it would have resolved and I was pretty confident in my chances, but alas I didn't. I went on to draw Chords for 2 more turns, so I had all 4 in hand before I got my second land. Wasn't winning that one. Second game was more of the same, with a T2 Bugler finding Druid, playing the Druid T3, and him wrathing the board on his T4. From there he stabilized with a Teferi and then Jace, so I was lost at that point. I hoped to see a Company so I could start trying to flood the board with it and EWits, but never saw either card and was grinded out.
The control matchup was pretty bad, especially with them playing Terminus now. My strategy was to force the combo and hope they can't Logic Knot for enough on Turn 2, as we aren't going to win the long game. Their Planeswalkers out value us, unlike other midrange decks that we can play the grindy-value game with. Perhaps adding a Breeding Pool and 3 Unified Will to the sideboard is the best bet for this matchup. Countering their first wrath or PW will give us a window to try and win. Thoughts on the matchup?
My list was unchanged from the one I played when I went 3-1. Matchups went as follows:
2-0 vs Eldrazi Tron, 2-1 vs Infect, 2-0 vs Hardened Scales Affinity, 2-1 vs Bant mirror (he played Queller's instead of Bugler's). Not a ton to talk about since the games are really playing out the same each time. With the addition of Militia Buglers I can slam the combo pretty much whenever I need too since digging for it is really easy, and this was a night of playing very uninteractive decks allowing me to combo as fast as I wanted. Pretty much every match I was sideboarding out the Knights and bringing in Spellskites and Paths, among other things. I didn't really get to play vs any midrange decks which my sideboard is tuned for. The good thing about that is that it means the maindeck is good enough to combo at the speed of some the best. Only changes to the deck I would do would be the addition of another Militia Bugler since that card has been insane and helps the deck be less graveyard dependent.
If you want to watch the Infect match you can here, and the Bant Company match here.
I have a player of the year championship on Saturday I may take this too since it's been doing so well, but I'm expecting a lot of UW Control to show up. At the last PPTQ at this store there was 6/47 pure UW Control which is scary. This will be an invite only tourney though, so possibly more KCI and Humans (less pet decks) which I'm fine with. I guess there are no haymaker cards that can beat UW Control while staying pure GW eh? Something like Pharika, God of Affliction vs GB decks.
I played UW Control winning 2-1, and Boggles winning 2-0. List was slightly changed and optimized:
There are 2 Field of Ruin and 1 Ghost Quarter maindeck now because FoR keeps your lands and you have lots of basics so it's fine, and you can still hit Tron before they Tron you but you have that 1 Ghost Quarter in case you reeeally need it. Sideboard is the same since the combo is so damn fast game 1 now I want to just side into an unbeatable midrange deck.
I beat UW Control in a super grindy game 1 where he just bricked after his first miracled Terminus. Game 2 he brought in Spell Quellers (??? why???) and they caught me off guard and beat me down. Game 3 was super grindy and I eventually out-valued/outplayed him to win on Turn 4 of turns since we went to time.
The second round against boggles was quick since I combo'd on turn 3 each game. They don't have any interaction to stop it. And my third round never happened because the person wanted to go home.
I'm sticking with this list for a while as it's been doing great, and I liked the land change. Now if only they printed Sumala Woodshaper at 1GW it would have broken the format in half (I can dream).
In continuation of my hot-streak lately, I went 4-0 at last nights Modern putting my record at 11-1 in the last three events I've played. Old write ups for completion sake:
Played this deck for the first time in a while since I've been on GTron for PPTQ season. I got my Buglers which I've been itching to try out as I talked about here, and sailed to a 4-0 for the night! The deck felt super powerful, possibly the most powerful iteration of the deck I've played yet. My sample size is only 4 matches mind you, but I had some crazy games which are explained below. List for reference:
Some notes about the deck before the games:
- Yes that is a 14 card sideboard. I must have forgot one at home, but it didn't seem to matter at all.
- Omitting the Finks + Seer package for Bugler + KotR. This allows Bugler to hit every card in the deck.
- 1 Courser of Kruphix compliments the KotR's. Because of it's inclusion I am playing 7 dorks and 22 lands, as opposed to my normal 8 dorks and 21 lands. Yes I like to cheat on the lands, but not here.
- KotR even acts as a dork in some cases, especially if you play it turn 2, so you are playing what is essentially 15 "dorks" not even inducing EWit getting fetches back. I never had mana problems.
- Only 3 Eternal Witness. I always like 4, but I figured with Bugler I could drop one to make the deck a little less reliant on the graveyard.
- I played before with 6 land destruction lands, but found that against the majority of decks they didn't do what I wanted them to do. Because of this I dropped to 3. This lets me still kill stuff like the random Inkmoth/Mutavault while also slowing down Tron and Valakut enough to win those matchups (in theory). With the 3 extra "utility land" slots I was able to include a second Horizon Canopy to help out the combo and flooding in general, and a Gavony Township for when the deck goes real wide.
Onto the games:
Round 1 vs Grixis Death's Shadow:
Game 1 was a grind fest with him removing my Druids, but not having a fast start himself. Once I accepted that I wasn't going to combo I went all in on the KotR plan. The game was decided with him using a Temur Battlerage on his 8/8 Shadow to kill my 10/10 Knight. I then Companied into Knight + EWit, using the company again to hit another Knight and win the game since he ran out of blockers. Game 2 was more of the same with me boarding out the combo and into a midrange deck (everything but Kataki, Rec Sage, and Eidolon). I overwhelmed him with value and won with 2 11/11 Knights while destroying his lands thanks to Path removing his only two basic lands. Bugler kept on finding Knights or EWits that Companies couldn't and kept the value train going. 2-0
Round 2 vs Mardu Pyromancer:
More of the same as round 1. The dude went Lootings into Pyromancer and I won some turns after with the combo by casting some Companies and Bugler finding what I wanted. Boarded the same as against Death's Shadow since I figured I couldn't combo again through all of the removal. The game this time went pretty long with him killing my turn 2 druid and resolving a LotV which I had to then throw away a Knight and Ewit to. I eventually got there though as he couldn't discard my companies, and I started chaining them to fill up the board. I found my Scooze and kept his graveyard out of relevant stuff while I had a Spellskite and Forge-Tender as backup. The Scooze then went on to continually attack him and win. 2-0
Round 3 vs UG Infect:
This was the guy I lost to in the top 8 of the PPTQ on Sunday. Game 3 was the only relevant one and super intense with him on the play. Turn 2 he has a Blighted Agent while I have a Temple Garden and Horizon Canopy to play a Devoted Druid. His turn 3 he hits me for 7 infect, and will hit me for a guaranteed 3 more the next turn so I have to win. I untap, and my hand is Vizier, Ghost Quarter, Bugler, and some other not relevant stuff. I play the Vizier with the Temple Garden since I can draw a card with Canopy. This is only better than playing Bugler if I draw a Chord or Company, so I figure I'll Bugler instead sine I can hit 2 Recruiters and 1 Ballista in 4 cards. I miss, but hit another Bugler. It then dawned on me that I could Ghost Quarter my land to get an untapped Plains and cast the second Bugler to tray again. Lo and behold it hits a Recruiter and I get a clutch win! You can watch the video of the match here. 2-1
Round 4 vs Eldrazi Tron:
This is the guy I beat in round 5 of the PPTQ. Games were grindy with me eventually using a Chord to get through his Chalice on 2 and win the game. It was weird since he know the Chord was coming but didn't Dismember the Druid... Game 2 was won off of the back of KotR and some land fetching shenanigans to block Reality Smashers after the wiped my graveyard. Again a misplay on his part as he should have waited and he would have won. Re-watching the footage I also missed a Duskwatch trigger, so I'll have to remember that for the future. It didn't matter though as it died the turn after. You can watch the video of the match here. 2-0
---
Thoughts on the deck:
- I really really liked Bugler. The deck has been getting away from the graveyard more and more, but is still dependent with Eternal Witness and Knight of the Reliquary. It's not the worst is hate is brought in for it, but it certainly is annoying. Bugler helps get away from this (replacing Finks).
- Hitting a Bugler off of a Company almost guarantees hitting something that you need since you get to keep digging. I found if I was ever wanting a card I could always find it within the next 1-2 turns. It also makes the combo much more consistent meaning you will fizzle less when getting infinite mana.
- A downside with Bugler is that you are more dependent on W during the combo, so you have to be mindful to fetch it out.
- KotR is a beast, and is often the biggest thing on the battlefield. With Finks I found I was using it to chump and stay alive until I could squeak out a combo. Now for the same mana cost I am winning combats, ramping, and thinning my deck. You lose life gain in the deck, and if anything take more damage from fetches, so I can imagine the Burn matchups is suddenly harder.
- The plan of going super-combo maindeck and transitional value-midrange deck in the sideboard worked out well. I was able to race things like without interaction like Infect (and Affinity in pre-event games) while absolutely destroying the opponent with value post-board.
- I'm not sure what I want sideboard card #15 to be. Perhaps a Pridemage, or another Scooze...?
I will hopefully play this again Wednesday and see if I can replicate the results.
Took the deck to a 3-1 tonight, which puts Bugler version at 7-1 overall. Only changes were +1 Selfless Spirit MD, +1 Courser of Kruphix & +1 Qasali Pridemage SB so I had 15 cards this time. List for reference:
Wins were 2-0 vs taking Turns. I won the match in about 10 mins total with a turn 3 combo each game. 2-1 vs G Devotion. I kept a slow hand game 1 hoping I could just get there, whereas games 2 and 3 I forced the combo and blew him out of the water. 2-1 vs Scales Affinity, with game 3 him mulling to 5 while I had the turn 3 win. He didn't have removal on his turn 2 so I won.
My loss was to UW Control, 0-2. Game 1 I kept a 1 land hand with Hierarch, Druid, Druid, Vizier, Chord, EWit, Forest. On turn 2 I drew a second Chord, and he Logic Knotted my Druid for 1. If I had drawn a land it would have resolved and I was pretty confident in my chances, but alas I didn't. I went on to draw Chords for 2 more turns, so I had all 4 in hand before I got my second land. Wasn't winning that one. Second game was more of the same, with a T2 Bugler finding Druid, playing the Druid T3, and him wrathing the board on his T4. From there he stabilized with a Teferi and then Jace, so I was lost at that point. I hoped to see a Company so I could start trying to flood the board with it and EWits, but never saw either card and was grinded out.
The control matchup was pretty bad, especially with them playing Terminus now. My strategy was to force the combo and hope they can't Logic Knot for enough on Turn 2, as we aren't going to win the long game. Their Planeswalkers out value us, unlike other midrange decks that we can play the grindy-value game with. Perhaps adding a Breeding Pool and 3 Unified Will to the sideboard is the best bet for this matchup. Countering their first wrath or PW will give us a window to try and win. Thoughts on the matchup?
My list was unchanged from the one I played when I went 3-1. Matchups went as follows:
2-0 vs Eldrazi Tron, 2-1 vs Infect, 2-0 vs Hardened Scales Affinity, 2-1 vs Bant mirror (he played Queller's instead of Bugler's). Not a ton to talk about since the games are really playing out the same each time. With the addition of Militia Buglers I can slam the combo pretty much whenever I need too since digging for it is really easy, and this was a night of playing very uninteractive decks allowing me to combo as fast as I wanted. Pretty much every match I was sideboarding out the Knights and bringing in Spellskites and Paths, among other things. I didn't really get to play vs any midrange decks which my sideboard is tuned for. The good thing about that is that it means the maindeck is good enough to combo at the speed of some the best. Only changes to the deck I would do would be the addition of another Militia Bugler since that card has been insane and helps the deck be less graveyard dependent.
If you want to watch the Infect match you can here, and the Bant Company match here.
I have a player of the year championship on Saturday I may take this too since it's been doing so well, but I'm expecting a lot of UW Control to show up. At the last PPTQ at this store there was 6/47 pure UW Control which is scary. This will be an invite only tourney though, so possibly more KCI and Humans (less pet decks) which I'm fine with. I guess there are no haymaker cards that can beat UW Control while staying pure GW eh? Something like Pharika, God of Affliction vs GB decks.
For straight GW one card that used to see play for the control match up and mid-range grind was Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. This 5-0 GW List has 3 Gideon in the side.
Ok I may have to try that out. It does add another weird angle of attack which I like.
In continuation of my hot-streak lately, I went 4-0 at last nights Modern putting my record at 11-1 in the last three events I've played. Old write ups for completion sake:
Played this deck for the first time in a while since I've been on GTron for PPTQ season. I got my Buglers which I've been itching to try out as I talked about here, and sailed to a 4-0 for the night! The deck felt super powerful, possibly the most powerful iteration of the deck I've played yet. My sample size is only 4 matches mind you, but I had some crazy games which are explained below. List for reference:
Some notes about the deck before the games:
- Yes that is a 14 card sideboard. I must have forgot one at home, but it didn't seem to matter at all.
- Omitting the Finks + Seer package for Bugler + KotR. This allows Bugler to hit every card in the deck.
- 1 Courser of Kruphix compliments the KotR's. Because of it's inclusion I am playing 7 dorks and 22 lands, as opposed to my normal 8 dorks and 21 lands. Yes I like to cheat on the lands, but not here.
- KotR even acts as a dork in some cases, especially if you play it turn 2, so you are playing what is essentially 15 "dorks" not even inducing EWit getting fetches back. I never had mana problems.
- Only 3 Eternal Witness. I always like 4, but I figured with Bugler I could drop one to make the deck a little less reliant on the graveyard.
- I played before with 6 land destruction lands, but found that against the majority of decks they didn't do what I wanted them to do. Because of this I dropped to 3. This lets me still kill stuff like the random Inkmoth/Mutavault while also slowing down Tron and Valakut enough to win those matchups (in theory). With the 3 extra "utility land" slots I was able to include a second Horizon Canopy to help out the combo and flooding in general, and a Gavony Township for when the deck goes real wide.
Onto the games:
Round 1 vs Grixis Death's Shadow:
Game 1 was a grind fest with him removing my Druids, but not having a fast start himself. Once I accepted that I wasn't going to combo I went all in on the KotR plan. The game was decided with him using a Temur Battlerage on his 8/8 Shadow to kill my 10/10 Knight. I then Companied into Knight + EWit, using the company again to hit another Knight and win the game since he ran out of blockers. Game 2 was more of the same with me boarding out the combo and into a midrange deck (everything but Kataki, Rec Sage, and Eidolon). I overwhelmed him with value and won with 2 11/11 Knights while destroying his lands thanks to Path removing his only two basic lands. Bugler kept on finding Knights or EWits that Companies couldn't and kept the value train going. 2-0
Round 2 vs Mardu Pyromancer:
More of the same as round 1. The dude went Lootings into Pyromancer and I won some turns after with the combo by casting some Companies and Bugler finding what I wanted. Boarded the same as against Death's Shadow since I figured I couldn't combo again through all of the removal. The game this time went pretty long with him killing my turn 2 druid and resolving a LotV which I had to then throw away a Knight and Ewit to. I eventually got there though as he couldn't discard my companies, and I started chaining them to fill up the board. I found my Scooze and kept his graveyard out of relevant stuff while I had a Spellskite and Forge-Tender as backup. The Scooze then went on to continually attack him and win. 2-0
Round 3 vs UG Infect:
This was the guy I lost to in the top 8 of the PPTQ on Sunday. Game 3 was the only relevant one and super intense with him on the play. Turn 2 he has a Blighted Agent while I have a Temple Garden and Horizon Canopy to play a Devoted Druid. His turn 3 he hits me for 7 infect, and will hit me for a guaranteed 3 more the next turn so I have to win. I untap, and my hand is Vizier, Ghost Quarter, Bugler, and some other not relevant stuff. I play the Vizier with the Temple Garden since I can draw a card with Canopy. This is only better than playing Bugler if I draw a Chord or Company, so I figure I'll Bugler instead sine I can hit 2 Recruiters and 1 Ballista in 4 cards. I miss, but hit another Bugler. It then dawned on me that I could Ghost Quarter my land to get an untapped Plains and cast the second Bugler to tray again. Lo and behold it hits a Recruiter and I get a clutch win! You can watch the video of the match here. 2-1
Round 4 vs Eldrazi Tron:
This is the guy I beat in round 5 of the PPTQ. Games were grindy with me eventually using a Chord to get through his Chalice on 2 and win the game. It was weird since he know the Chord was coming but didn't Dismember the Druid... Game 2 was won off of the back of KotR and some land fetching shenanigans to block Reality Smashers after the wiped my graveyard. Again a misplay on his part as he should have waited and he would have won. Re-watching the footage I also missed a Duskwatch trigger, so I'll have to remember that for the future. It didn't matter though as it died the turn after. You can watch the video of the match here. 2-0
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Thoughts on the deck:
- I really really liked Bugler. The deck has been getting away from the graveyard more and more, but is still dependent with Eternal Witness and Knight of the Reliquary. It's not the worst is hate is brought in for it, but it certainly is annoying. Bugler helps get away from this (replacing Finks).
- Hitting a Bugler off of a Company almost guarantees hitting something that you need since you get to keep digging. I found if I was ever wanting a card I could always find it within the next 1-2 turns. It also makes the combo much more consistent meaning you will fizzle less when getting infinite mana.
- A downside with Bugler is that you are more dependent on W during the combo, so you have to be mindful to fetch it out.
- KotR is a beast, and is often the biggest thing on the battlefield. With Finks I found I was using it to chump and stay alive until I could squeak out a combo. Now for the same mana cost I am winning combats, ramping, and thinning my deck. You lose life gain in the deck, and if anything take more damage from fetches, so I can imagine the Burn matchups is suddenly harder.
- The plan of going super-combo maindeck and transitional value-midrange deck in the sideboard worked out well. I was able to race things like without interaction like Infect (and Affinity in pre-event games) while absolutely destroying the opponent with value post-board.
- I'm not sure what I want sideboard card #15 to be. Perhaps a Pridemage, or another Scooze...?
I will hopefully play this again Wednesday and see if I can replicate the results.
Took the deck to a 3-1 tonight, which puts Bugler version at 7-1 overall. Only changes were +1 Selfless Spirit MD, +1 Courser of Kruphix & +1 Qasali Pridemage SB so I had 15 cards this time. List for reference:
Wins were 2-0 vs taking Turns. I won the match in about 10 mins total with a turn 3 combo each game. 2-1 vs G Devotion. I kept a slow hand game 1 hoping I could just get there, whereas games 2 and 3 I forced the combo and blew him out of the water. 2-1 vs Scales Affinity, with game 3 him mulling to 5 while I had the turn 3 win. He didn't have removal on his turn 2 so I won.
My loss was to UW Control, 0-2. Game 1 I kept a 1 land hand with Hierarch, Druid, Druid, Vizier, Chord, EWit, Forest. On turn 2 I drew a second Chord, and he Logic Knotted my Druid for 1. If I had drawn a land it would have resolved and I was pretty confident in my chances, but alas I didn't. I went on to draw Chords for 2 more turns, so I had all 4 in hand before I got my second land. Wasn't winning that one. Second game was more of the same, with a T2 Bugler finding Druid, playing the Druid T3, and him wrathing the board on his T4. From there he stabilized with a Teferi and then Jace, so I was lost at that point. I hoped to see a Company so I could start trying to flood the board with it and EWits, but never saw either card and was grinded out.
The control matchup was pretty bad, especially with them playing Terminus now. My strategy was to force the combo and hope they can't Logic Knot for enough on Turn 2, as we aren't going to win the long game. Their Planeswalkers out value us, unlike other midrange decks that we can play the grindy-value game with. Perhaps adding a Breeding Pool and 3 Unified Will to the sideboard is the best bet for this matchup. Countering their first wrath or PW will give us a window to try and win. Thoughts on the matchup?
My list was unchanged from the one I played when I went 3-1. Matchups went as follows:
2-0 vs Eldrazi Tron, 2-1 vs Infect, 2-0 vs Hardened Scales Affinity, 2-1 vs Bant mirror (he played Queller's instead of Bugler's). Not a ton to talk about since the games are really playing out the same each time. With the addition of Militia Buglers I can slam the combo pretty much whenever I need too since digging for it is really easy, and this was a night of playing very uninteractive decks allowing me to combo as fast as I wanted. Pretty much every match I was sideboarding out the Knights and bringing in Spellskites and Paths, among other things. I didn't really get to play vs any midrange decks which my sideboard is tuned for. The good thing about that is that it means the maindeck is good enough to combo at the speed of some the best. Only changes to the deck I would do would be the addition of another Militia Bugler since that card has been insane and helps the deck be less graveyard dependent.
If you want to watch the Infect match you can here, and the Bant Company match here.
I have a player of the year championship on Saturday I may take this too since it's been doing so well, but I'm expecting a lot of UW Control to show up. At the last PPTQ at this store there was 6/47 pure UW Control which is scary. This will be an invite only tourney though, so possibly more KCI and Humans (less pet decks) which I'm fine with. I guess there are no haymaker cards that can beat UW Control while staying pure GW eh? Something like Pharika, God of Affliction vs GB decks.
Beside the fact that you mismatching Arts and foil/non foil are tilting me very hard (:D) I have some Questions:
1. What is your Decklist at the Moment? Couldn't find Razorverge Thicket but you played it a few times in the Video.
2. Do you think Spellskite it necessary? I played him Maindeck in the Abzan Version cause you had more flex slots, but he wasn't a must have.
3. Is Eidolon against Infect that good? I always thought he was too slow but seemed very good in your Games. Besides the fact that the Infect Player could've played better.
1. The Razorverge Thicket was missing from the list so thanks for seeing that. Fixed it, and actually cut it from the deck lol.
2. I like Spellskite to randomly have protection to feel good enough about trying to combo vs reomval heavy decks. It also saves a KotR or something that can give you an extra attack to win with. My meta is also very heavy with Boggles and Infect right now and it's a house against them.
3. I thought it would be cute and maybe buy me an extra turn or something. It did end up winning me the game but it was such a high-risk play that I probably wouldn't do it again.
4. You think I'm made of money‽ I can't afford foil lands and I don't have enough foil basics so I am using some sweet white boarder ones.
Yeah, Knight of Autumn is a slam-dunk for Company decks. It also gets hit by Militia Bugler which is just icing on the cake. I can see cutting the Kataki, Reclamation Sage, and Qasali Pridemage I usually play in the board for 3 of these. It fills all of those roles while also helping out the Burn matchup which is worse for me now since I cut Finks for KotR and Bugler. With KotR the beatdown plan is better than ever, so this just adds to it as the worst option. Super stoked for this card! There is one downside though, which is being able to cast REc Sage off of only infinite G mana to destroy something important. However, this almost never comes up so I'm not worried about that super corner case.
Also it being a rare means there will be a foil-date stamped version, making it meet all criteria for inclusion in the deck.
I think Kataki might be worth retaining. Hardened Scales Affinity can make a swarm of dudes that point and click removal does not handle.
I've found that that matchup is lost as soon as they get a Walking Ballista out with 2+ counters on it. You can't beat them in combat since they can keep blocking with modular dudes to fuel their shenanigans, and Hangerback Walker blocks forever. You have to go the combo route to win, and luckily they don't play much removal. Their only out to the T3 combo is a T1 Hardened Scales into T2 Walking Ballista, or a timely Dismember. Postboard I have Spellskites and blowing up a Ballista with something before playing your Druid is usually a route to win unless they can find another within one turn. So far I'm 2-0 in sanctioned matches, and in jamming games inbetween rounds it's been 50/50 on if they have a Ballista or not. We are more likely to combo than they are to have a pumped Ballista so I would say the mathucp is in our favor.
Round 1 vs. Bogles The more I play this matchup from either side, the more I am convinced that the matchup is even worse for Bogles than I originally thought. Dating back to Birthing Pod, I was over 60% win ratio vs. Pod decks. Then it got banned and Company came out. I felt like the matchup was 40/60 for Bogles. More recently, I've believed it to be 30/70. After today, I am convinced it's even worse than that for Bogles. I combo on turn 3 after he puts a fairly serious clock on me in Game 1. In the next game, he mulls to 5 and it's a slow grind, as I cannot find something to go with infinite mana. I get there with some Finks and a Tracker, as he can't get his dude big enough in time and then I go wide on him, also drawing Gavony Township to make it easier. Better lucky than good. 2-0.
Round 2 vs. Infect. This guy lost in a PPTQ finals the previous day, so he's out for blood. Lost in the first game to the turn 1 Noble Hierarch, turn 2 Blighted Agent with probably protection, and turn 3 kill. Won the next game on turn 3 before he would kill me on turn 3 with the same type of kill. In the last game, he mulliganed to 6 and I comboed out pretty quickly again after I did Path to Exile and Abrupt Decay on dudes. 2-1.
Round 3 vs. UW Control. This guy had some super nutty draws the last time I played him; 4 months ago with a similar deck and me on GW CoCo. I think he used up his luck then because he cast 0 Terminus this match. Had a really gassy hand in game 1, getting Tireless Tracker to draw 6 extra cards this one. He couldn't find Terminus in time and Gavony Township on the final turn made sure it's lethal. I find some hate in the next one with Voice and Sin Collector. He can't find Terminus again and I get there. Semi-long game, but I'm pretty tired right now to discuss or even remember every play. You get the gist of it. :X 2-0.
Round 4 vs. Infect. This play is just a very common play. Turn 1 Noble Hierarch into turn 2 Blighted Agent with mana up, turn 3 kill you all on the play. I'm not sure if this happens to YOU 50% of the time, but it happens to ME 50% of the time. But it was not to be in this match. I play Path to Exile on turn 1 Glistener Elf in game 2 right away, then Devoted Druid into turn 3 E Witness Path to Exile on Blighted Agent all while he was tapped out. Then I got Sin Collector and he drew a late Noble Hierarch, which almost got him there with a bunch of pump spells, but me knowing what he had from Sin Collector was big. In the final game, he mulls to 5 and plays Inkmoth Nexus turn 1. He misses his 2nd land drop and it gives me time to set up the combo a little slower than usual. No Dismember BABY! I dodged Dismember in 4 games vs. Infect today. The nuts. Got there with a huge Ballista. 2-1.
Round 5 vs. Burn. We ID because double ID gets us there and this locks us for Top 8. 0-0-3.
Round 6 vs. UR Breach. I play it out because I have a friend at X-2 that wants to try to make it in. I win, but the Breach player still gets 6th place (three 4-2s made the top 8, but NOT my friend; he got 11th). The Breach player is also a former teammate and cool guy, so it was a tough decision that I had to make, drawing or playing it out. The first game is really drawn out with me putting a lot of pressure early, but he kept burning and Snapcaster Maging to stay alive. I get a late game Collected Company, which gets me Devoted Druid AND Vizier of Remedies and I win next turn. He was close to lethal anyway, but I could not get those last points. It was hell from 9 life on. He also discarded 2 Through the Breach, so I knew he had at least 1 in hand and was looking for Emrakul, the Aeon's Torn and I was only at 17 life. But he was pretty much drawing off the top and doing Desolate Lighthouse late game. In the next game, I just pushed the combo too much and he did not have enough burn early to stop me. Since I took out Walking Ballista during the SBed games, I had no win-con, but I got Viscera Seer and every Green creature in my deck in play so that if he drew Anger of the Gods, I sacrifice every creature and pump 3 Scavenging Oozes for lethal next turn since he didn't have enough mana to Anger of the Gods AND Cryptic Command. It was an odd game, me having the Druid, Vizier, Recruiter Combo, but not winning on the spot. 2-0.
Top 8 vs. 4 Color Shadow. I drew and had too much gas in land light hands while he made me discard some cards. He played very well, especially saying it was his first PPTQ top 8 ever, but took a Chord of Calling instead of Collected Company (only mistake in 4-5 discard spells) and I won with that very Company next turn effectively. I did not attack for a while because I wanted to play around removal, which I'm assuming he didn't have anyway since Scavenging Ooze was causing havoc. I just had no reason to rush since I have more inevitability, but the Judge did tell us to speed up our play, which mostly was fine. I just played suuuper safe. In the next game, he had a lot of 1 for 1 removal, but Sin Collector nabbed one and I just gummed up the board too much. I had way too much gas against him, including 3 Birds of Paradise, lol. 2-0.
Top 4 vs. Jeskai Queller. In the first game, it takes forever, but I eventually get there with some by comboing out after he put pressure with Queller and Obstructionist. I had too much gas, something like 3 Companies and 2 Chords in hand with an E Witness at 1 time. Just needed time to play all that around Mana Leak, Remand, and Dispel. Got there eventually. In the next game, he mulled to 6 and seemed unsure if he should keep. My hand was combo centric, so this bode well for me. I do in fact get the combo on turn 5 or 6 and he is out of plays, having only 1 more card in hand. Whew! I hate playing against Jeskai with this deck because I usually draw terribly, but I drew the nuts on him. Turn 2 Voice of Resurgence, he eventually killed it with Electrolyze on his turn because I WOULD NOT attack with it, but after he tapped out for ScM/Electrolyze, I did Chord for E Witness for Voice of Resurgence and replayed him all on the very next turn. Had some mana dorks. 2-0.
Finals vs. Burn. The same player from Round 5 who I ID'd with at 4-0. He got out double Eidolon of the Great Revel and I could not draw Collected Company. I did get a Finks and a Chord of Calling, but got stuck on 4 lands with mana dork after mana dork in hand after he played the 2nd Eidolon. The next game, he comes out blazing with Monastery Swiftspear. He Searing Blazed my Birds and I missed some 2nd land drops, but eventually peeled lands to get triple Kitchen Finks while I was at 5 life at one point. He just had all lands in hand and I had to play like that or else he would have already killed me. He drew 2 more Monastery Swiftspear and only 1 burn spell and I got there. In the final game, it is super close, but he ended up playing 3 Searing Blazes on me and had an active Grim Lavamancer. If he had drawn Searing Blood, I probably would have won because I had Viscera Seer out, which makes Searing Blood not do damage if I don't want it to. I did have the infinite life combo in my opener and a mana dork with enough mana to do stuff. I died with 2 Scavenging Ooze in hand when he did exact lethal on the final turn with Searing Blaze after fetch, then draw a card for turn and play Lava Spike and Lightning Helix with his last card when I was at 9 before the Searing Blaze. I responded to the Searing Blaze on my Viscera Seer with sacrifice Kitchen Finks to go to 9, but it was enough. 3 + 3 + 3. Damn, next turn I would untap with Scavenging Ooze and a BoP in play. The reason I didn't play Scooze that turn was because I'd have to tap Horizon Canopy and I had just played Temple Garden tapped. This was a mull to 6 because my 7 just didn't do enough against him - 5 lands too. 1-2.
It freaking sucks losing in the finals of a PPTQ. Still, I can't help but realize that I drew better than 7 of my 8 opponents today, so there's that. Lost 5 die rolls today, but got to be on the play throughout the top 8. 5-0-1 does that!
P.S. - Also realized that I have yet to draw Kor Firewalker, have a Chord available for 2, or Company into it in my last 3 SBed games vs. Burn. Well, scratch the last one - I've cast 1 Company in these games, as well as teh other 2 non SBed games. I don't get to cast Company much. I just know that the first time I get Firewalker against Burn, my opponent is going to be pretttttty pissed though.
Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Hey guys, made the finals (2nd) of a pptq on counters company. Warning: Article length post ahead:
I've been playing this deck for a year now and have stayed on the top of the leader board at my store with it: eg. https://hobbymaster.co.nz/season/points/3
So I do have a lot of experiences & thoughts to share.
//Sideboard
SB: 1 Auriok Champion
SB: 1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1 Kambal, Consul of Allocation
SB: 3 Leyline of the Void
SB: 2 Maelstrom Pulse
SB: 3 Path to Exile
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 1 Sin Collector
SB:1 Worship
My deck is a bit of a mix between the 9th place decklist from gp prague & classic Abzan.
I think after testing that tracker is too good not to play, but feel that having black removal and seer combo/finks stalling power is too useful to stay pure GW.
Here are my thoughts on card choices:
Tracker is 'fantastic', and neccessary in a world where UW exists. It requires a little play style adjustment - it's often better to spend t4 cracking 2 clues instead of casting more stuff.
If you treat it less like a 3/2 with no time to crack instead of a 5/4 suspend that also drew you two cards, it will perform better for you in a lot of spots. But the card is just insane and if you're not playing at least 2 you're doing yourself a disservice. It's much more powerful than bugler - it will win games by itself.
Rhonas, no ballista: Rhonas is a more powerful card. It wins me SO many games that ballista never could and I think it's a mistake not to play it. Leave up activation mana on defense then chord when they either can't attack or rejoice that they used removal on a bad creature: if they don't have an answer they can't attack, making this great on defense.. and it's awesome on offense. You can attack freely with this card and big trackers with trample. Rhonas also makes our bad creatures into good threats- a vizier suddenly attacking for 4 is a big deal that a 2 powered ballista just doesn't have the same impact on. Yes, ballista is a better combo piece, but I prefer to build decks around high card quality and the big death-touch body/ability on the card is much more useful when you don't have infinite mana.
Shalai: Looks medium on paper but I find in testing I am consistently happy to draw it. Hoses on random decks like shift, burn, mill, gifts ungiven and I regularly use it as a chord target to counter settle the wreckage.
Ooze: Bad on turn 2, great on turn 12. Excellent chord target in response to snap. Deserves the main deck slot, good vs random gy decks if they don't nut draw you.
Witness: I like running 3, but needed to make room for tracker. Relying less on the gy has been a boon and witness just doesn't kill people like tracker does.
2 field of ruin: this is pretty free in a deck with this many dorks and it fixes itself for you if needed. Makes the Tron and control matchups way, way better at a low cost. Can randomly screw people off a colour they need or a sideboard splash.
Sb: Auriok champion is good vs mardu, dredge and burn. I was expecting all 3 of those decks.
Forge tender was some more burn hedge and for rg valakut.
Teeg! I'm well aware that this card shuts off chord and coco. It's here for the UW matchup. UW actually doesn't have many outs to teeg, especially when they need to kill shalai first too, which is what I try to assemble. I don't think this plan is amazing, the matchup is horrible, but I believe this to be the best bullet against them.
Kambal: storm/kci are on the down tick lately, this card let's me hedge further vs burn while still having some hate.
Leylines are because I was expecting dredge, which I consider to be a bad matchup. Dark blast and conflagrate are both extremely effective against us and they have more removal for druid after board. I bring this card in vs Jeskai as well because with snap/logic knot / sfa they are now quite gy reliant.
Maelstrom pulse I'll say little about, trophy invalidates the conversation - but decay doesn't kill Teferi/Jace. Pulse fixes target problem.
Finally, worship: go look at all the coco decks that made top 16 in all events in the last year: 90% of them run worship, and that's statistically very interesting, no? Yuya from 9th at Prague ran 3 and praised them very highly.
I think it's meta dependent, but it's also a very, very busted card that will often win an otherwise unwinnable game on the spot that you don't want to ever draw 2 of. For this reason, I think 1 is a very reasonable number.
For the tourney!:
R1 vs Tron: W - g1, druid t3 kill. G3, field of ruin bought time to chord for a late druid and then kill.
R2 vs Mardu pyro - L - I mulled and died mostly.
R3 vs infect - W - won the die roll, race.
R4 vs Jund Shadow - W - lost g1, turned into control deck after board. Didn't ever attack, just drew cards and played removal spells. Fun stuff. Finks was great at stalling here and invalidated a key liliana of the veil.
R5- living end - W: t3 kill g1, leyline g2.
R6: Draw into top 8 at 4-1-1.
T8 mardu rematch: I drew much better and buried him with trackers. Didn't board in leylines, only removal & auriok. Can't dilute deck too much.
T4: BW Eldrazi: G1 loss, wasteland strangler is brutal, dude was good at killing druids. G2 I kept a hand with worship, which completely stole the game. Rhonas plus shalai finished him off while he couldnt damage me. G3 went super midrange - I saw zealous persecution so boarded out all my dorks, then beat him with infinite tracker plus witness value. W.
Finals: Died to UW. G1 I mulled to 5 and got terminused, G2 I made a subtle error that I think cost me the game. At one point in the midgame I cocoed into witness and got back company - but I had a maelstrom pulse I used on SFA in the gy. Creatures matter much less vs UW, and I couldn't kill the Teferi he slammed the next turn. That game went super long and was close, but that Teferi won the game. Vs UW, heed this: their walkers are more powerful than coco, so prioritize killing them over generating card advantage.
On that note, don't be afraid to board out your mana creatures and turn into a slow midrange deck in some matchups (like Mardu, Jund). You have a better late game than they do and a druid is more useful than a hierarch when you are grinding out their removal. This configuration grinds very well and with this much card draw & blocking power, your 5 removal spells go a long way. Moving forward I think I will play 4 trophy & 2 path.
Congratulations on your finish! Looks like we both were the bridesmaids in these tournaments, not the brides.
There were a lot of things I was curious about.
Tireless Tracker - I love the card! It is my favorite Modern legal creature. I could see going up to 2, but any more than that seems really clunky. The current meta is filled with decks that just don't care if you make 2 clues on turns 3 or 4 (mana dork for 3) because they kill you the next turn or are about to. I do see how good it is vs. Control though and haven't seen that big of an impact of UW Control locally. (probably underplayed)
Rhonas vs. Ballista. I actually think that Ballista is a better card because it kills X/1s on the play if you turn 2 it. Then to combo off, you just get E Witness and then kill them. I would hate to play Rhonas when my opponent plays turn 1 mana dork, Glistener Elf, Champion of the Parish, Steel Overseer, and a few more.
I tried Shalai for 2 weeks, but didn't side it in once, so I ditched it. I still think there's potential.
Field of Ruins - This is an interesting one. I play 2 Gavony Township, but this is definitely a possibility and purely a meta choice. I wonder which is better in the current "global" meta, not that it matters since people care about what they play against locally.
I like the extra burn hedging in BfT, Kambal, and Auriok Champion. I wish I had those when I lost to Burn in the finals!
I don't run Leyline. I run 2 extra Scavenging Ooze in the SB. I do realize that it is WAY worse graveyard hate, but it does most other things a lot better and is a monster in some matchups. Kill my combo pieces and watch an Ooze grow to mythic proportions while nuking your graveyard, lol.
It's interesting to cut mana dorks. This is always something I have wondered. It's tough cutting them because you want mana acceleration, but then they are pretty "meh" in some matchups. I don't think I've ever cut more than 2-3 mana dorks before and I'm not sure ever if I relied on a 3 drop more than a 2 drop vs. an opponent. I still to this day don't know what is the right decision. I am assuming that the right decision depends on how you want to face the matchup?
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Played this deck for the first time in a while since I've been on GTron for PPTQ season. I got my Buglers which I've been itching to try out as I talked about here, and sailed to a 4-0 for the night! The deck felt super powerful, possibly the most powerful iteration of the deck I've played yet. My sample size is only 4 matches mind you, but I had some crazy games which are explained below. List for reference:
Some notes about the deck before the games:
- Yes that is a 14 card sideboard. I must have forgot one at home, but it didn't seem to matter at all.
- Omitting the Finks + Seer package for Bugler + KotR. This allows Bugler to hit every card in the deck.
- 1 Courser of Kruphix compliments the KotR's. Because of it's inclusion I am playing 7 dorks and 22 lands, as opposed to my normal 8 dorks and 21 lands. Yes I like to cheat on the lands, but not here.
- KotR even acts as a dork in some cases, especially if you play it turn 2, so you are playing what is essentially 15 "dorks" not even inducing EWit getting fetches back. I never had mana problems.
- Only 3 Eternal Witness. I always like 4, but I figured with Bugler I could drop one to make the deck a little less reliant on the graveyard.
- I played before with 6 land destruction lands, but found that against the majority of decks they didn't do what I wanted them to do. Because of this I dropped to 3. This lets me still kill stuff like the random Inkmoth/Mutavault while also slowing down Tron and Valakut enough to win those matchups (in theory). With the 3 extra "utility land" slots I was able to include a second Horizon Canopy to help out the combo and flooding in general, and a Gavony Township for when the deck goes real wide.
Onto the games:
Round 1 vs Grixis Death's Shadow:
Game 1 was a grind fest with him removing my Druids, but not having a fast start himself. Once I accepted that I wasn't going to combo I went all in on the KotR plan. The game was decided with him using a Temur Battlerage on his 8/8 Shadow to kill my 10/10 Knight. I then Companied into Knight + EWit, using the company again to hit another Knight and win the game since he ran out of blockers. Game 2 was more of the same with me boarding out the combo and into a midrange deck (everything but Kataki, Rec Sage, and Eidolon). I overwhelmed him with value and won with 2 11/11 Knights while destroying his lands thanks to Path removing his only two basic lands. Bugler kept on finding Knights or EWits that Companies couldn't and kept the value train going. 2-0
Round 2 vs Mardu Pyromancer:
More of the same as round 1. The dude went Lootings into Pyromancer and I won some turns after with the combo by casting some Companies and Bugler finding what I wanted. Boarded the same as against Death's Shadow since I figured I couldn't combo again through all of the removal. The game this time went pretty long with him killing my turn 2 druid and resolving a LotV which I had to then throw away a Knight and Ewit to. I eventually got there though as he couldn't discard my companies, and I started chaining them to fill up the board. I found my Scooze and kept his graveyard out of relevant stuff while I had a Spellskite and Forge-Tender as backup. The Scooze then went on to continually attack him and win. 2-0
Round 3 vs UG Infect:
This was the guy I lost to in the top 8 of the PPTQ on Sunday. Game 3 was the only relevant one and super intense with him on the play. Turn 2 he has a Blighted Agent while I have a Temple Garden and Horizon Canopy to play a Devoted Druid. His turn 3 he hits me for 7 infect, and will hit me for a guaranteed 3 more the next turn so I have to win. I untap, and my hand is Vizier, Ghost Quarter, Bugler, and some other not relevant stuff. I play the Vizier with the Temple Garden since I can draw a card with Canopy. This is only better than playing Bugler if I draw a Chord or Company, so I figure I'll Bugler instead sine I can hit 2 Recruiters and 1 Ballista in 4 cards. I miss, but hit another Bugler. It then dawned on me that I could Ghost Quarter my land to get an untapped Plains and cast the second Bugler to tray again. Lo and behold it hits a Recruiter and I get a clutch win! You can watch the video of the match here. 2-1
Round 4 vs Eldrazi Tron:
This is the guy I beat in round 5 of the PPTQ. Games were grindy with me eventually using a Chord to get through his Chalice on 2 and win the game. It was weird since he know the Chord was coming but didn't Dismember the Druid... Game 2 was won off of the back of KotR and some land fetching shenanigans to block Reality Smashers after the wiped my graveyard. Again a misplay on his part as he should have waited and he would have won. Re-watching the footage I also missed a Duskwatch trigger, so I'll have to remember that for the future. It didn't matter though as it died the turn after. You can watch the video of the match here. 2-0
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Thoughts on the deck:
- I really really liked Bugler. The deck has been getting away from the graveyard more and more, but is still dependent with Eternal Witness and Knight of the Reliquary. It's not the worst is hate is brought in for it, but it certainly is annoying. Bugler helps get away from this (replacing Finks).
- Hitting a Bugler off of a Company almost guarantees hitting something that you need since you get to keep digging. I found if I was ever wanting a card I could always find it within the next 1-2 turns. It also makes the combo much more consistent meaning you will fizzle less when getting infinite mana.
- A downside with Bugler is that you are more dependent on W during the combo, so you have to be mindful to fetch it out.
- KotR is a beast, and is often the biggest thing on the battlefield. With Finks I found I was using it to chump and stay alive until I could squeak out a combo. Now for the same mana cost I am winning combats, ramping, and thinning my deck. You lose life gain in the deck, and if anything take more damage from fetches, so I can imagine the Burn matchups is suddenly harder.
- The plan of going super-combo maindeck and transitional value-midrange deck in the sideboard worked out well. I was able to race things like without interaction like Infect (and Affinity in pre-event games) while absolutely destroying the opponent with value post-board.
- I'm not sure what I want sideboard card #15 to be. Perhaps a Pridemage, or another Scooze...?
I will hopefully play this again Wednesday and see if I can replicate the results.
Took the deck to a 3-1 tonight, which puts Bugler version at 7-1 overall. Only changes were +1 Selfless Spirit MD, +1 Courser of Kruphix & +1 Qasali Pridemage SB so I had 15 cards this time. List for reference:
Wins were 2-0 vs taking Turns. I won the match in about 10 mins total with a turn 3 combo each game. 2-1 vs G Devotion. I kept a slow hand game 1 hoping I could just get there, whereas games 2 and 3 I forced the combo and blew him out of the water. 2-1 vs Scales Affinity, with game 3 him mulling to 5 while I had the turn 3 win. He didn't have removal on his turn 2 so I won.
My loss was to UW Control, 0-2. Game 1 I kept a 1 land hand with Hierarch, Druid, Druid, Vizier, Chord, EWit, Forest. On turn 2 I drew a second Chord, and he Logic Knotted my Druid for 1. If I had drawn a land it would have resolved and I was pretty confident in my chances, but alas I didn't. I went on to draw Chords for 2 more turns, so I had all 4 in hand before I got my second land. Wasn't winning that one. Second game was more of the same, with a T2 Bugler finding Druid, playing the Druid T3, and him wrathing the board on his T4. From there he stabilized with a Teferi and then Jace, so I was lost at that point. I hoped to see a Company so I could start trying to flood the board with it and EWits, but never saw either card and was grinded out.
The control matchup was pretty bad, especially with them playing Terminus now. My strategy was to force the combo and hope they can't Logic Knot for enough on Turn 2, as we aren't going to win the long game. Their Planeswalkers out value us, unlike other midrange decks that we can play the grindy-value game with. Perhaps adding a Breeding Pool and 3 Unified Will to the sideboard is the best bet for this matchup. Countering their first wrath or PW will give us a window to try and win. Thoughts on the matchup?
My list was unchanged from the one I played when I went 3-1. Matchups went as follows:
2-0 vs Eldrazi Tron, 2-1 vs Infect, 2-0 vs Hardened Scales Affinity, 2-1 vs Bant mirror (he played Queller's instead of Bugler's). Not a ton to talk about since the games are really playing out the same each time. With the addition of Militia Buglers I can slam the combo pretty much whenever I need too since digging for it is really easy, and this was a night of playing very uninteractive decks allowing me to combo as fast as I wanted. Pretty much every match I was sideboarding out the Knights and bringing in Spellskites and Paths, among other things. I didn't really get to play vs any midrange decks which my sideboard is tuned for. The good thing about that is that it means the maindeck is good enough to combo at the speed of some the best. Only changes to the deck I would do would be the addition of another Militia Bugler since that card has been insane and helps the deck be less graveyard dependent.
If you want to watch the Infect match you can here, and the Bant Company match here.
I have a player of the year championship on Saturday I may take this too since it's been doing so well, but I'm expecting a lot of UW Control to show up. At the last PPTQ at this store there was 6/47 pure UW Control which is scary. This will be an invite only tourney though, so possibly more KCI and Humans (less pet decks) which I'm fine with. I guess there are no haymaker cards that can beat UW Control while staying pure GW eh? Something like Pharika, God of Affliction vs GB decks.
My main LGS has a bi-annually "Players Championship" which is a 24 player invite only tourney and you get there by a point system from playing events. First place was free events for a year, and second place was free events for a year but you had to pick week days or weekends. It was a three format tournament of Standard, Modern, M19 draft. I hadn't touched Standard cards since ~2012, but managed to go 1-2 and made the cut to the Modern round. Continuing my hot streak lately, I went 3-0 in the Modern portion (putting my record at 13-1 match wins in the last 4 events since a guy dropped to me round 3) to make top 8 and drafted a pretty average BW Lifegain deck that was pretty weak individually, but had a billion synergies in it. Had a super grindy 3 games against RW Aggro, and then lost to the most disgusting UB deck I've ever seen. He curved Walking Corpse into Death Baron, into Skeleton Archer which killed my only creature, and then into Bone Dragon. Game 2 wasn't much different and I lost that one real fast. Still ended up with $100 in credit which was a good result for a free tournament.
I played UW Control winning 2-1, and Boggles winning 2-0. List was slightly changed and optimized:
There are 2 Field of Ruin and 1 Ghost Quarter maindeck now because FoR keeps your lands and you have lots of basics so it's fine, and you can still hit Tron before they Tron you but you have that 1 Ghost Quarter in case you reeeally need it. Sideboard is the same since the combo is so damn fast game 1 now I want to just side into an unbeatable midrange deck.
I beat UW Control in a super grindy game 1 where he just bricked after his first miracled Terminus. Game 2 he brought in Spell Quellers (??? why???) and they caught me off guard and beat me down. Game 3 was super grindy and I eventually out-valued/outplayed him to win on Turn 4 of turns since we went to time.
The second round against boggles was quick since I combo'd on turn 3 each game. They don't have any interaction to stop it. And my third round never happened because the person wanted to go home.
I'm sticking with this list for a while as it's been doing great, and I liked the land change. Now if only they printed Sumala Woodshaper at 1GW it would have broken the format in half (I can dream).
Skipped a week of Modern and played for the first time last night to a garbage fire 2-2 record, dropping the deck winrate from 92.8% to 83.3%
Lost round 1 to Hardened Scales Affinity. I won game 1 when he couldn't find a Ballista, and lost game 2 when I untapped with infinite mana and only a Company which missed big time. I then went on to draw 3 lands in a row while he grew his team and beat me down. Game 3 my Druids met 2 Dispatches before I could get some protection down, and then he landed a Ballista which locked me out. I've been having such a good run of Company and Bugler flips recently my luck was bound to run out eventually.
Round 2 was vs Mardu Pyromancer in which KotR's and Scavenging Ooze beat him down both games.
Round 3 I beat Revolt Zoo in some close-ish games. I just threw chumpblockers infront of his guys until I could combo off. Post-board, my Knights and Spellskites, and Buglers were able to stall and widdle down his board while keeping me at a reasonable life total the whole time.
Round 4 I lost to Humans. Won game 1 when he drew all 4 Vials and 3 Hierarchs. Games 2 and 3, I mulled to 6 and never had a turn 1 dork but wasn't about to push it further. Missed some landdrops and got overrun pretty bad.
Still like the configuration of the deck, but I was thinking about dropping Knight of the Reliquary from the main once Knight of Autumn is legal. It does a bit of everything but nothing great. Moreso, it would open up 3-4 sideboard slots for other things that I can play which is big. I could even drop the 2 Voice of Resurgence I have for midrange matchups and have lots of space for Tireless Trackers to grind out midrange harder.
If you treat it less like a 3/2 with no time to crack instead of a 5/4 suspend that also drew you two cards, it will perform better for you in a lot of spots. But the card is just insane and if you're not playing at least 2 you're doing yourself a disservice. It's much more powerful than bugler - it will win games by itself.
Between Torpf (with 4x KotR and 0x Tracker) and JoshhAvatar with (0x KotR and 4x Tracker) both having great success, I'm really really tempted to try the 4x KotR and 4x Tracker build.
@Torpf What about 1x Kessig Wolf-Run to make your Knights trample? Also, do you really not miss the lifegain combo?
Between Torpf (with 4x KotR and 0x Tracker) and JoshhAvatar with (0x KotR and 4x Tracker) both having great success, I'm really really tempted to try the 4x KotR and 4x Tracker build.
@Torpf What about 1x Kessig Wolf-Run to make your Knights trample? Also, do you really not miss the lifegain combo?
The 4x KotR are only there because I'm playing Militia Bugler and it's a 2-power creature I can grab with it. It's just the most useful 2-power creature around as it is both really large, and can act as a manadork if I need it. I'm not even taking full advantage of KotR right now with stuff like Bojuka Bog in the Sideboard. If I find Knight of Autumn can block/trade as well as KotR then I'll swap them out since KoA is more flexiable.
1 Kessig would mean also playing 1 Stomping Grounds. I've done that before but I've found I don't really need it. If you have infinite mana there is 9 times out of 10 a way to win with Ballista. Without Wolf Run I can play more Field of Ruin effects which makes Tron and Control slightly better matchups.
I don't miss the infinite life combo. Pretty much all top decks have a way around it and blocking with a huge KotR or even Bugler buys just as much time as Finks would. Even Burn/super aggro is manageable with my sideboard. Only thing I really miss is Viscera Seer getting me value off of removal.
It seems like our only answer to the fast decks is our fast combo. No matter what 3 drops you play, they'll be dead. Might as well pick 3 drops that are FANTASTIC vs control and midrange. However, Torpf's comment is insightful. I'll try Trackers first and Knights as an experiment.
It seems like our only answer to the fast decks is our fast combo. No matter what 3 drops you play, they'll be dead. Might as well pick 3 drops that are FANTASTIC vs control and midrange. However, Torpf's comment is insightful. I'll try Trackers first and Knights as an experiment.
I think what he's saying is that you're dropping maybe Duskwatch Recruiter to less than 4, Eternal Witness less than 3, or possibly something else (although I'm assuming that everyone runs 4 Devoted Druid, 4 Vizier of Remedies, 4 Collected Company, and 4 Chord of Calling in every list now).
Dropping any of those cards lowers the chances of the Combo, even if it gives many points against Midrange and Control. It would purely be a metagame choice because you face a lot of Control/Midrange and would give you fewer chances to goldfish KCI or Tron for example.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
i played this deck at a large PPTQ last weekend and didn't represent the deck too well. made a few noobie mistakes which i'd chalk up to lack of practice with the deck recently.
also, worth noting that about half of the whole room was on some kind of blue control deck, and later in the tournament, the top tables were a mishmash of UW control and very little else. The meta was extremely hostile to this type of deck.
also rather amusing, near the middle/bottom tables (where I was) towards the final rounds, it was all Tron mirror matches! clearly not a good day for Tron. After facing control three times in the early rounds I got Tronned in the later rounds.
I reckon the GW Value Town deck may be better positioned as a CoCo strategy in my local meta (UK, Midlands and South West) where everyone seems to want to play control.
either way, i'm gonna put the deck down in paper, just for the moment, in order to run something a bit more deterministic in its gameplan, that's not so soft to endless creature removal. I'm thinking RUG Scapeshift might be a decent option in this weird meta. Or I could just go TRON and see what happens.
wish me luck!
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
It seems like our only answer to the fast decks is our fast combo. No matter what 3 drops you play, they'll be dead. Might as well pick 3 drops that are FANTASTIC vs control and midrange. However, Torpf's comment is insightful. I'll try Trackers first and Knights as an experiment.
I think what he's saying is that you're dropping maybe Duskwatch Recruiter to less than 4, Eternal Witness less than 3, or possibly something else (although I'm assuming that everyone runs 4 Devoted Druid, 4 Vizier of Remedies, 4 Collected Company, and 4 Chord of Calling in every list now).
Dropping any of those cards lowers the chances of the Combo, even if it gives many points against Midrange and Control. It would purely be a metagame choice because you face a lot of Control/Midrange and would give you fewer chances to goldfish KCI or Tron for example.
Ah yes, that makes sense. I'm tinkering with the numbers of certain cards to make sure I don't impact the combo's consistency. I agree that it in the current overall metagame, the combo is the priority.
I reckon the GW Value Town deck may be better positioned as a CoCo strategy in my local meta (UK, Midlands and South West) where everyone seems to want to play control.
I believe Todd Stevens shifted to Bant Midrange recently in large part due to GW Value Town’s inability to handle Terminus and Walkers, so if UWx Control is a major motivator for shifting to V Town I would reconsider.
Round 1 vs. Grixis ?. Some odd deck that did Rise/Fall to me on turns 2 and 3, taking my only non-land cards. I had kept a 4 land hand and peeled land after land. I get some damage through, as he doesn't seem to have as many Fatal Push/Lightning Bolt as one would think. I draw all my Birds of Paradise and 2 of 3 Noble Hierarch. He is low on life. I have 5 lands left in my deck - 3 fetches and 2 Gavony Township. He cast a Nicol Bolas, the Ravager. I discard a land. The guy took a long time, so we have around 15 min. left. I didn't take that long because I mostly played land, go or land/bird, go. I am considering scooping since I can't draw ***** and I have a better game 2 and 3. I draw Gavony Township and swing for lethal with Devoted Druid, Duskwatch Recruiter, and 3 Birds of Paradise. In the next game, I keep a weak 4 land hand, weaker than the first game. I play the Scavenging Ooze, then Sin Collector, then Chord of Calling for Voice of Resurgence in reponse to Cryptic Command tap/draw. He gives me some tokens and can't win now. He does Rise/Fall to get my "win-con" in Walking Ballista, but he does something that gets me a Voice Elemental token to go with the other token and now I have lethal. 2-0.
Round 2 vs. Burn. He is on the play. I play a tapped land. I draw a BoP for turn 2. I play Devoted Druid instead. He makes me sacrifice it in response to Lightning Helix. I draw another BoP next turn. I play Kitchen Finks instead. I then do Eternal Witness into the Devoted Druid, but he has lethal burn next turn. The next game is similar. I do get Kitchen Finks, but he has 2 Goblin Guides, a Monastery Swiftspear, and an Eidolon of the Great Revel. He does a Boros Charm to put me to 4 life. But he's tapped out. I have Vizier of Remedies in hand and Devoted Druid out, so I need Chord or Collected Company for Duskwatch Recruiter. I draw...Duskwatch Recruiter. How lucky! I am at 4 life with an Eidolon of the Great Revel in play. Will he miss his triggers? Probably not. I play for the long game, but just draw 3 Birds of Paradise, a Duskwatch Recruiter, and a Noble Hierarch. Eidolon trigger much? 0-2.
Round 3 vs. Tron. I get to play against a guy who I usually give a ride to FNM with. He's played 2 PPTQs and I've played him in both. In the first game, I have Chord, BoP, Devoted Druid, and lands. I need to get a 3rd piece. I don't and he gets turn 4 Tron with Wurmcoil Engine. I was on the play, so this shows how painful this game was. I scryed infinite life to the top so I could scry my deck to a possible win, but I end up not doing crap. None of the Collected Companies had any good hits and he Karn exiled, O Stone cracked, and then rinse repeat until he got Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. In the next game, I mulligan and am missing just Vizier of Remedies. When he gets turn 4 O Stone and cracks it, my next draw is Vizier of Remedies. I had done a Duskwatch Recruiter activation for Chord, land, Chord to miss. He gets some stuff and I just get mismatching bears that don't have any combo. GGs. 0-2.
I left before the next 3 rounds, so 1-5 on the day for me. This was my roughest tournament that I can remember. I remember going 1-5, then 2-5 before dropping at a Los Angeles PTQ back in the days with UR Swans during BW Tokens Standard. This brought back memories.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)So my question to you all is: What's your reasoning for playing GW instead of Abzan, or Abzan instead of GW? What are their pros and cons relative to each other, and which one do you think is the best one right now?
Any and all input is greatly appreciated, these deck threads are such a good resource.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
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StaffOld write ups for completion sake:
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Birds of Paradise
4 Devoted Druid
4 Vizier of Remedies
2 Duskwatch Recruiter
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Selfless Spirit
3 Eternal Witness
3 Militia Bugler
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Walking Ballista
4 Collected Company
4 Chord of Calling
Lands (22)
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Temple Garden
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Gavony Township
1 Ghost Quarter
2 Field of Ruin
5 Forest
1 Plains
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Spellskite
2 Voice of Resurgence
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
3 Path to Exile
1 Worship
I beat UW Control in a super grindy game 1 where he just bricked after his first miracled Terminus. Game 2 he brought in Spell Quellers (??? why???) and they caught me off guard and beat me down. Game 3 was super grindy and I eventually out-valued/outplayed him to win on Turn 4 of turns since we went to time.
The second round against boggles was quick since I combo'd on turn 3 each game. They don't have any interaction to stop it. And my third round never happened because the person wanted to go home.
I'm sticking with this list for a while as it's been doing great, and I liked the land change. Now if only they printed Sumala Woodshaper at 1GW it would have broken the format in half (I can dream).
Ok I may have to try that out. It does add another weird angle of attack which I like.
1. The Razorverge Thicket was missing from the list so thanks for seeing that. Fixed it, and actually cut it from the deck lol.
2. I like Spellskite to randomly have protection to feel good enough about trying to combo vs reomval heavy decks. It also saves a KotR or something that can give you an extra attack to win with. My meta is also very heavy with Boggles and Infect right now and it's a house against them.
3. I thought it would be cute and maybe buy me an extra turn or something. It did end up winning me the game but it was such a high-risk play that I probably wouldn't do it again.
4. You think I'm made of money‽ I can't afford foil lands and I don't have enough foil basics so I am using some sweet white boarder ones.
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Legacy: Strawberry Shortcake, Aggro Loam, DnT+b
Modern: Devoted Karn
Vintage: Survival
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
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StaffAlso it being a rare means there will be a foil-date stamped version, making it meet all criteria for inclusion in the deck.
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Legacy: Strawberry Shortcake, Aggro Loam, DnT+b
Modern: Devoted Karn
Vintage: Survival
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StaffMTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Round 1 vs. Bogles The more I play this matchup from either side, the more I am convinced that the matchup is even worse for Bogles than I originally thought. Dating back to Birthing Pod, I was over 60% win ratio vs. Pod decks. Then it got banned and Company came out. I felt like the matchup was 40/60 for Bogles. More recently, I've believed it to be 30/70. After today, I am convinced it's even worse than that for Bogles. I combo on turn 3 after he puts a fairly serious clock on me in Game 1. In the next game, he mulls to 5 and it's a slow grind, as I cannot find something to go with infinite mana. I get there with some Finks and a Tracker, as he can't get his dude big enough in time and then I go wide on him, also drawing Gavony Township to make it easier. Better lucky than good.
Round 2 vs. Infect. This guy lost in a PPTQ finals the previous day, so he's out for blood. Lost in the first game to the turn 1 Noble Hierarch, turn 2 Blighted Agent with probably protection, and turn 3 kill. Won the next game on turn 3 before he would kill me on turn 3 with the same type of kill. In the last game, he mulliganed to 6 and I comboed out pretty quickly again after I did Path to Exile and Abrupt Decay on dudes. 2-1.
Round 3 vs. UW Control. This guy had some super nutty draws the last time I played him; 4 months ago with a similar deck and me on GW CoCo. I think he used up his luck then because he cast 0 Terminus this match. Had a really gassy hand in game 1, getting Tireless Tracker to draw 6 extra cards this one. He couldn't find Terminus in time and Gavony Township on the final turn made sure it's lethal. I find some hate in the next one with Voice and Sin Collector. He can't find Terminus again and I get there. Semi-long game, but I'm pretty tired right now to discuss or even remember every play. You get the gist of it. :X 2-0.
Round 4 vs. Infect. This play is just a very common play. Turn 1 Noble Hierarch into turn 2 Blighted Agent with mana up, turn 3 kill you all on the play. I'm not sure if this happens to YOU 50% of the time, but it happens to ME 50% of the time. But it was not to be in this match. I play Path to Exile on turn 1 Glistener Elf in game 2 right away, then Devoted Druid into turn 3 E Witness Path to Exile on Blighted Agent all while he was tapped out. Then I got Sin Collector and he drew a late Noble Hierarch, which almost got him there with a bunch of pump spells, but me knowing what he had from Sin Collector was big. In the final game, he mulls to 5 and plays Inkmoth Nexus turn 1. He misses his 2nd land drop and it gives me time to set up the combo a little slower than usual. No Dismember BABY! I dodged Dismember in 4 games vs. Infect today. The nuts. Got there with a huge Ballista. 2-1.
Round 5 vs. Burn. We ID because double ID gets us there and this locks us for Top 8. 0-0-3.
Round 6 vs. UR Breach. I play it out because I have a friend at X-2 that wants to try to make it in. I win, but the Breach player still gets 6th place (three 4-2s made the top 8, but NOT my friend; he got 11th). The Breach player is also a former teammate and cool guy, so it was a tough decision that I had to make, drawing or playing it out. The first game is really drawn out with me putting a lot of pressure early, but he kept burning and Snapcaster Maging to stay alive. I get a late game Collected Company, which gets me Devoted Druid AND Vizier of Remedies and I win next turn. He was close to lethal anyway, but I could not get those last points. It was hell from 9 life on. He also discarded 2 Through the Breach, so I knew he had at least 1 in hand and was looking for Emrakul, the Aeon's Torn and I was only at 17 life. But he was pretty much drawing off the top and doing Desolate Lighthouse late game. In the next game, I just pushed the combo too much and he did not have enough burn early to stop me. Since I took out Walking Ballista during the SBed games, I had no win-con, but I got Viscera Seer and every Green creature in my deck in play so that if he drew Anger of the Gods, I sacrifice every creature and pump 3 Scavenging Oozes for lethal next turn since he didn't have enough mana to Anger of the Gods AND Cryptic Command. It was an odd game, me having the Druid, Vizier, Recruiter Combo, but not winning on the spot. 2-0.
Top 8 vs. 4 Color Shadow. I drew and had too much gas in land light hands while he made me discard some cards. He played very well, especially saying it was his first PPTQ top 8 ever, but took a Chord of Calling instead of Collected Company (only mistake in 4-5 discard spells) and I won with that very Company next turn effectively. I did not attack for a while because I wanted to play around removal, which I'm assuming he didn't have anyway since Scavenging Ooze was causing havoc. I just had no reason to rush since I have more inevitability, but the Judge did tell us to speed up our play, which mostly was fine. I just played suuuper safe. In the next game, he had a lot of 1 for 1 removal, but Sin Collector nabbed one and I just gummed up the board too much. I had way too much gas against him, including 3 Birds of Paradise, lol. 2-0.
Top 4 vs. Jeskai Queller.
Finals vs. Burn. The same player from Round 5 who I ID'd with at 4-0. He got out double Eidolon of the Great Revel and I could not draw Collected Company. I did get a Finks and a Chord of Calling, but got stuck on 4 lands with mana dork after mana dork in hand after he played the 2nd Eidolon.
It freaking sucks losing in the finals of a PPTQ. Still, I can't help but realize that I drew better than 7 of my 8 opponents today, so there's that. Lost 5 die rolls today, but got to be on the play throughout the top 8. 5-0-1 does that!
P.S. - Also realized that I have yet to draw Kor Firewalker, have a Chord available for 2, or Company into it in my last 3 SBed games vs. Burn. Well, scratch the last one - I've cast 1 Company in these games, as well as teh other 2 non SBed games. I don't get to cast Company much. I just know that the first time I get Firewalker against Burn, my opponent is going to be pretttttty pissed though.
The Deck...
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Misty Rainforest
2 Temple Garden
2 Overgrown Tomb
3 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Plains
2 Gavony Township
2 Horizon Canopy
4 Birds of Paradise
3 Noble Hierarch
1 Viscera Seer
4 Devoted Druid
4 Vizier of Remedies
4 Duskwatch Recruiter
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Kitchen Finks
3 Eternal Witness
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Walking Ballista
4 Chord of Calling
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Kor Firewalker
1 Orzhov Pontiff
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Voice of Resurgence
1 Sin Collector
3 Path to Exile
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Kataki, War's Wage
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
I've been playing this deck for a year now and have stayed on the top of the leader board at my store with it: eg. https://hobbymaster.co.nz/season/points/3
So I do have a lot of experiences & thoughts to share.
This was my list:
4 Chord of Calling
4 Collected Company
2 Birds of Paradise
4 Devoted Druid
2 Duskwatch Recruiter
2 Eternal Witness
4 Kitchen Finks
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Rhonas the Indomitable
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
4 Tireless Tracker
1 Viscera Seer
4 Vizier of Remedies
2 Field of Ruin
4 Forest
2 Gavony Township
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Temple Garden
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
//Sideboard
SB: 1 Auriok Champion
SB: 1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1 Kambal, Consul of Allocation
SB: 3 Leyline of the Void
SB: 2 Maelstrom Pulse
SB: 3 Path to Exile
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 1 Sin Collector
SB:1 Worship
My deck is a bit of a mix between the 9th place decklist from gp prague & classic Abzan.
I think after testing that tracker is too good not to play, but feel that having black removal and seer combo/finks stalling power is too useful to stay pure GW.
Here are my thoughts on card choices:
Tracker is 'fantastic', and neccessary in a world where UW exists. It requires a little play style adjustment - it's often better to spend t4 cracking 2 clues instead of casting more stuff.
If you treat it less like a 3/2 with no time to crack instead of a 5/4 suspend that also drew you two cards, it will perform better for you in a lot of spots. But the card is just insane and if you're not playing at least 2 you're doing yourself a disservice. It's much more powerful than bugler - it will win games by itself.
Rhonas, no ballista: Rhonas is a more powerful card. It wins me SO many games that ballista never could and I think it's a mistake not to play it. Leave up activation mana on defense then chord when they either can't attack or rejoice that they used removal on a bad creature: if they don't have an answer they can't attack, making this great on defense.. and it's awesome on offense. You can attack freely with this card and big trackers with trample. Rhonas also makes our bad creatures into good threats- a vizier suddenly attacking for 4 is a big deal that a 2 powered ballista just doesn't have the same impact on. Yes, ballista is a better combo piece, but I prefer to build decks around high card quality and the big death-touch body/ability on the card is much more useful when you don't have infinite mana.
Shalai: Looks medium on paper but I find in testing I am consistently happy to draw it. Hoses on random decks like shift, burn, mill, gifts ungiven and I regularly use it as a chord target to counter settle the wreckage.
Ooze: Bad on turn 2, great on turn 12. Excellent chord target in response to snap. Deserves the main deck slot, good vs random gy decks if they don't nut draw you.
Witness: I like running 3, but needed to make room for tracker. Relying less on the gy has been a boon and witness just doesn't kill people like tracker does.
2 field of ruin: this is pretty free in a deck with this many dorks and it fixes itself for you if needed. Makes the Tron and control matchups way, way better at a low cost. Can randomly screw people off a colour they need or a sideboard splash.
Sb: Auriok champion is good vs mardu, dredge and burn. I was expecting all 3 of those decks.
Forge tender was some more burn hedge and for rg valakut.
Teeg! I'm well aware that this card shuts off chord and coco. It's here for the UW matchup. UW actually doesn't have many outs to teeg, especially when they need to kill shalai first too, which is what I try to assemble. I don't think this plan is amazing, the matchup is horrible, but I believe this to be the best bullet against them.
Kambal: storm/kci are on the down tick lately, this card let's me hedge further vs burn while still having some hate.
Leylines are because I was expecting dredge, which I consider to be a bad matchup. Dark blast and conflagrate are both extremely effective against us and they have more removal for druid after board. I bring this card in vs Jeskai as well because with snap/logic knot / sfa they are now quite gy reliant.
Maelstrom pulse I'll say little about, trophy invalidates the conversation - but decay doesn't kill Teferi/Jace. Pulse fixes target problem.
Finally, worship: go look at all the coco decks that made top 16 in all events in the last year: 90% of them run worship, and that's statistically very interesting, no? Yuya from 9th at Prague ran 3 and praised them very highly.
I think it's meta dependent, but it's also a very, very busted card that will often win an otherwise unwinnable game on the spot that you don't want to ever draw 2 of. For this reason, I think 1 is a very reasonable number.
For the tourney!:
R1 vs Tron: W - g1, druid t3 kill. G3, field of ruin bought time to chord for a late druid and then kill.
R2 vs Mardu pyro - L - I mulled and died mostly.
R3 vs infect - W - won the die roll, race.
R4 vs Jund Shadow - W - lost g1, turned into control deck after board. Didn't ever attack, just drew cards and played removal spells. Fun stuff. Finks was great at stalling here and invalidated a key liliana of the veil.
R5- living end - W: t3 kill g1, leyline g2.
R6: Draw into top 8 at 4-1-1.
T8 mardu rematch: I drew much better and buried him with trackers. Didn't board in leylines, only removal & auriok. Can't dilute deck too much.
T4: BW Eldrazi: G1 loss, wasteland strangler is brutal, dude was good at killing druids. G2 I kept a hand with worship, which completely stole the game. Rhonas plus shalai finished him off while he couldnt damage me. G3 went super midrange - I saw zealous persecution so boarded out all my dorks, then beat him with infinite tracker plus witness value. W.
Finals: Died to UW. G1 I mulled to 5 and got terminused, G2 I made a subtle error that I think cost me the game. At one point in the midgame I cocoed into witness and got back company - but I had a maelstrom pulse I used on SFA in the gy. Creatures matter much less vs UW, and I couldn't kill the Teferi he slammed the next turn. That game went super long and was close, but that Teferi won the game. Vs UW, heed this: their walkers are more powerful than coco, so prioritize killing them over generating card advantage.
On that note, don't be afraid to board out your mana creatures and turn into a slow midrange deck in some matchups (like Mardu, Jund). You have a better late game than they do and a druid is more useful than a hierarch when you are grinding out their removal. This configuration grinds very well and with this much card draw & blocking power, your 5 removal spells go a long way. Moving forward I think I will play 4 trophy & 2 path.
There were a lot of things I was curious about.
Tireless Tracker - I love the card! It is my favorite Modern legal creature. I could see going up to 2, but any more than that seems really clunky. The current meta is filled with decks that just don't care if you make 2 clues on turns 3 or 4 (mana dork for 3) because they kill you the next turn or are about to. I do see how good it is vs. Control though and haven't seen that big of an impact of UW Control locally. (probably underplayed)
Rhonas vs. Ballista. I actually think that Ballista is a better card because it kills X/1s on the play if you turn 2 it. Then to combo off, you just get E Witness and then kill them. I would hate to play Rhonas when my opponent plays turn 1 mana dork, Glistener Elf, Champion of the Parish, Steel Overseer, and a few more.
I tried Shalai for 2 weeks, but didn't side it in once, so I ditched it. I still think there's potential.
Field of Ruins - This is an interesting one. I play 2 Gavony Township, but this is definitely a possibility and purely a meta choice. I wonder which is better in the current "global" meta, not that it matters since people care about what they play against locally.
I like the extra burn hedging in BfT, Kambal, and Auriok Champion. I wish I had those when I lost to Burn in the finals!
I don't run Leyline. I run 2 extra Scavenging Ooze in the SB. I do realize that it is WAY worse graveyard hate, but it does most other things a lot better and is a monster in some matchups. Kill my combo pieces and watch an Ooze grow to mythic proportions while nuking your graveyard, lol.
It's interesting to cut mana dorks. This is always something I have wondered. It's tough cutting them because you want mana acceleration, but then they are pretty "meh" in some matchups. I don't think I've ever cut more than 2-3 mana dorks before and I'm not sure ever if I relied on a 3 drop more than a 2 drop vs. an opponent. I still to this day don't know what is the right decision. I am assuming that the right decision depends on how you want to face the matchup?
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)-
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StaffLost round 1 to Hardened Scales Affinity. I won game 1 when he couldn't find a Ballista, and lost game 2 when I untapped with infinite mana and only a Company which missed big time. I then went on to draw 3 lands in a row while he grew his team and beat me down. Game 3 my Druids met 2 Dispatches before I could get some protection down, and then he landed a Ballista which locked me out. I've been having such a good run of Company and Bugler flips recently my luck was bound to run out eventually.
Round 2 was vs Mardu Pyromancer in which KotR's and Scavenging Ooze beat him down both games.
Round 3 I beat Revolt Zoo in some close-ish games. I just threw chumpblockers infront of his guys until I could combo off. Post-board, my Knights and Spellskites, and Buglers were able to stall and widdle down his board while keeping me at a reasonable life total the whole time.
Round 4 I lost to Humans. Won game 1 when he drew all 4 Vials and 3 Hierarchs. Games 2 and 3, I mulled to 6 and never had a turn 1 dork but wasn't about to push it further. Missed some landdrops and got overrun pretty bad.
Still like the configuration of the deck, but I was thinking about dropping Knight of the Reliquary from the main once Knight of Autumn is legal. It does a bit of everything but nothing great. Moreso, it would open up 3-4 sideboard slots for other things that I can play which is big. I could even drop the 2 Voice of Resurgence I have for midrange matchups and have lots of space for Tireless Trackers to grind out midrange harder.
Them be fighting words!
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
@Torpf What about 1x Kessig Wolf-Run to make your Knights trample? Also, do you really not miss the lifegain combo?
Legacy: Strawberry Shortcake, Aggro Loam, DnT+b
Modern: Devoted Karn
Vintage: Survival
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Staff1 Kessig would mean also playing 1 Stomping Grounds. I've done that before but I've found I don't really need it. If you have infinite mana there is 9 times out of 10 a way to win with Ballista. Without Wolf Run I can play more Field of Ruin effects which makes Tron and Control slightly better matchups.
I don't miss the infinite life combo. Pretty much all top decks have a way around it and blocking with a huge KotR or even Bugler buys just as much time as Finks would. Even Burn/super aggro is manageable with my sideboard. Only thing I really miss is Viscera Seer getting me value off of removal.
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Legacy: Strawberry Shortcake, Aggro Loam, DnT+b
Modern: Devoted Karn
Vintage: Survival
I think what he's saying is that you're dropping maybe Duskwatch Recruiter to less than 4, Eternal Witness less than 3, or possibly something else (although I'm assuming that everyone runs 4 Devoted Druid, 4 Vizier of Remedies, 4 Collected Company, and 4 Chord of Calling in every list now).
Dropping any of those cards lowers the chances of the Combo, even if it gives many points against Midrange and Control. It would purely be a metagame choice because you face a lot of Control/Midrange and would give you fewer chances to goldfish KCI or Tron for example.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)also, worth noting that about half of the whole room was on some kind of blue control deck, and later in the tournament, the top tables were a mishmash of UW control and very little else. The meta was extremely hostile to this type of deck.
also rather amusing, near the middle/bottom tables (where I was) towards the final rounds, it was all Tron mirror matches! clearly not a good day for Tron. After facing control three times in the early rounds I got Tronned in the later rounds.
I reckon the GW Value Town deck may be better positioned as a CoCo strategy in my local meta (UK, Midlands and South West) where everyone seems to want to play control.
either way, i'm gonna put the deck down in paper, just for the moment, in order to run something a bit more deterministic in its gameplan, that's not so soft to endless creature removal. I'm thinking RUG Scapeshift might be a decent option in this weird meta. Or I could just go TRON and see what happens.
wish me luck!
Ah yes, that makes sense. I'm tinkering with the numbers of certain cards to make sure I don't impact the combo's consistency. I agree that it in the current overall metagame, the combo is the priority.
Does GW ValueTown beat UW Control?
Legacy: Strawberry Shortcake, Aggro Loam, DnT+b
Modern: Devoted Karn
Vintage: Survival