MTG Salvation

What do you guys think about Shalai, Voice of Plenty?

Quote from daviusminimus »

@ FoodChainGoblins - I'm not saying I'm a great amulet player, but i'm certainly better at that deck than HolyShamgar! I stream on twitch (user daviusminimus) and have a youtube for some, but I dont always record my streams (twitch keeps them for 14 days).
Elves is actually a tough match-up. They're pretty fast, and our interaction isn't all that good actually. Firespout can miss, and it can actually be a little slow on the draw. Ignoring all that, only 2 pieces of interaction in a racy match-up isn't good. Elves is my nemesis, they put me out of contention at my 1 and only GP! Dont worry about being 40/60 against that deck, it won't be much better than 50/50 for anyone at a guess.

Thanks. I will check those out.

It's not just that. When Summer Bloom was legal, I was around 50/50 vs. Jund players at my LGS, most of whom are very solid players. I always heard from Bloom players talking about how Jund was a "Bye," so I realized something was going wrong when I played them. Part of it was that I didn't side out Amulets in the beginning, but I learned to do that and it only helped slightly. I still never had the win percentage that I saw others have vs. Jund.

https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/how-to-play-modern-amulet-titan-2nd-place-at-grand-prix-hartford/ Michael Mapson wrote an article about his Amulet Titan list for GP Hartford!

Quote from daviusminimus »

@ FoodChainGoblins - I'm not saying I'm a great amulet player, but i'm certainly better at that deck than HolyShamgar! I stream on twitch (user daviusminimus) and have a youtube for some, but I dont always record my streams (twitch keeps them for 14 days).
Elves is actually a tough match-up. They're pretty fast, and our interaction isn't all that good actually. Firespout can miss, and it can actually be a little slow on the draw. Ignoring all that, only 2 pieces of interaction in a racy match-up isn't good. Elves is my nemesis, they put me out of contention at my 1 and only GP! Dont worry about being 40/60 against that deck, it won't be much better than 50/50 for anyone at a guess.

No, you are a very good Amulet player. I know you have super high expectations for yourself, just like I do, so I realize that you can be harder on yourself than most other people. I only watched 2 Leagues so far, but I have enjoyed them!

(I should also say that I don't like watching someone who is worse than myself at Amulet. It doesn't really help me much. So, that's why I enjoy watching your vids! No offense to HolyShamgar - he plays lots of decks - but I don't enjoy the vids much.)

Quote from daviusminimus »

Ah I see, so your winrate in general is a little on the low side. That's nothing to worry about, the deck is really tough to play. I can give you a few pointers to help you gain a few % here and there:
1. I have a sideboard and mulligan guide, which I linked a few pages back but I've just added it to the primer. I would recommend taking the sideboard guide with you for now. It might not be 100% the best way to approach every match, but it'll be close, and it means that you don't have to worry about sideboarding - you can use your energy to think about other things!

2. Try to plan your next turn whilst your opponent plays theirs. It can be quite overwhelming to see all the options you have and have to work them out there and then. Lets say your in a grind-fest. You have a titan in play and you hope to untap with it. You know what mana you have and the cards in your hand. You can make a plan for "if titan dies, this is what I want to do" and "if titan lives, I want to do this". That may dictate how you want to pay for your pact, and it's just saved you some time. Then when you draw for the turn, you can fairly quickly analyse whether or not that has changed your best play.

3. Play more. I know this is a bit rough, but it is honestly the best way to learn. I'd recommend MODO very highly if you have the spare time and money.

4. This is true for every deck, but it feels more relevant in amulet than anything. Play to your outs. Often your outs aren't that obvious, but it can be something like "If I draw amulet, this azusa will make me enough mana to pact up hornet queen". Or "If I draw stirrings and it finds amulet" etc. Those sort of lines are not quite as obvious as "if I draw firespout, I want to cast it". But plan ahead, as it'll dictate your land drops. Other decks don't necessarily need to plan quite as much because they can just run out their lands and it'll probably be ok. It's not the same for us.

That's all I can really say to help. Hopefully the sideboard guide and mulligan guide can help a touch too!

No, it's not rough. It's the truth. I wanted to respond to let you know that I am thankful. You have given me the confidence to try Amulet for the first time at a tournament since Summer Bloom was banned. I don't really want to get into MODO, mostly because I don't want to be on the computer more than I already am (I need to lay off, as I'm averaging 6 hrs a day). Don't ever worry about being overly harsh with me. I know that I am wrong quite often and I think I am realizing more and more how much I need to improve playing this deck. Easy lines and knowing others' decks is not enough. I need to learn the average to much tougher lines. Being 1 mana short of doing something is DEATH for this deck sometimes. I remember during Bloom, I made a huge mistake of not fetching up a Ghost Quarter because my opponent literally needed 2 specific cards after his draw step (had 1 card in hand) to win. I lost that match against Infect (Inkmoth Nexus after I left EE to destroy a Blighted Agent if needed) 1-2. I finished that FNM 3-2, which was the 2nd of two 3-2s that made me quit the deck for a while (I'm not used to doing that poorly, or at least wasn't used to it at the time, lol).

Quick question:

If I have 3 Amulets out and a simic in my hand, what is the correct way to declare how you as the active player want things to stack in order to get 6 mana out of simic by playing it only once.

I think it's

Simic bounce effect first, then each amulet trigger. Then stack resolves in reverse order and you tap for land as a state based action between each amulet trigger and finally bounce simic (or another land) to hand.

That's correct right?

Quote from daviusminimus »

That’s right. I tend to explain it to the opp. So I’ll say something like “play simic, I get 3 amulet triggers and 1 bounce trigger. Stack bounce 1st so it comes off last. 1st amulet trigger untap and add 2” etc etc.

Hey davius, looking at your sideboard plan (thanks for sharing it by the way) do you have tips for when amulets are sided out. What are the major changes to account for when playing this deck without amulet, are there any major changes in lines of play that need to be noted?

Hey there!

I've been reading this thread and many other primers the last few days and this deck looks really sweet! I've decided to buy into it since there are some pieces that I already own. Only issue is I do not own any copies of Engineered Explosives and don't have the money to shell out for them right now. Since I'll be going with the Slaughter Pact replacement until I can afford EE what lands are best to swap out for the Golgari Rot Farm? Thanks!

I'd probably replace the 3rd Gruul Turf. If you do that you may want to swap a Forest for a Grove of the Burnwillows so you have enough red sources to cast sideboard stuff. Since you don't have Explosives you're definitely going to want Kozilek's Return/Firespout in the board.

I see spell pierce as a constant in every sideboard, but I've never played it. Maybe because it's light in control decks here. What games does it comes in?

In addition to the points above, Spell Pierce / Swan Song are also our best answers to an on-curve Blood Moon or Damping sphere, since you can stop it ever hitting the table.

Quote from 0oSunnYo0 »

In addition to the points above, Spell Pierce / Swan Song are also our best answers to an on-curve Blood Moon or Damping sphere, since you can stop it ever hitting the table.

Sounds fair, so Swan Song or Pierce are the way to go? Or is it prudent to take them out?

Does anyone have a non-expiring (or recent) invite to the Amulet Titan Discord? Thanks.

Edit: Eventually I found a link in Reddit. Here it is for posterity https://discord.gg/EcDdJJr

Went 2-2 at a 17 person WNM.

Round 1 vs. RW Enduring Ideal. Turn 1 exile double Simian Spirit Guide, Blood Moon. I get 2 Forest, but without Amulet, my draw is too slow because I didn't draw accelerants. He gets turn 4 Enduring Ideal after Lotus Bloom comes off suspend. He tells me that he top decked a land later on. He gets too much stuff and Engineered Explosives can only get a 2, while Rec Sage is nowhere to be found. I cannot put counters on Walking Ballista, so I can't do the last 5 damage and Form of the Dragon kills me after Phrexian Unlife + Solemnity hit. In the next game, it's more of the same. I have close to a nut hand, but miss some accelerants. He does turns 2, 3, and 4 Runed Halo, then Ensnaring Bridge, O Ring on a late Amulet, and Phyrexian Unlife. No cards in hand, but draws Enduring Ideal. The Runed Halos are naming Titan, Ruric Thar, and more. I scoop because there's nothing I can do. He gets an enchantment every turn and Engineered Explosives comes into play with no counters because of Solemnity. Ugh. 0-2.

Round 2 vs. BUG. Game 1, I do Prime Time, but he does Slaughter Pact. He later does a ScM/Slaughter Pact. I eventually string enough Prime Times to win, after an Engineered Explosives kills a bunch of his creatures. In the next game, I mull to 6 and keep on 2 lands. I don't draw a single land this game until I'm about to be dead. I try to rally, killing a bunch of his creatures, but he has enough to get through for lethal. In the final game, he just has all of the answers and I barely have any threats. A bunch of Tarmogoyfs get damage through after I peel a million lands. My next card was Hornet Queen, lol. 1 Dark Confidant in game 1 and 2 in games 2 and 3, revealing all lands, except 2 Thoughtseize, 2 Abrupt Decay, and a Maelstrom Pulse in these games. 1-2.

Round 3 vs. Jeskai Control. I get enough Prime Times to make him scoop eventually. It took 3 of them. In the next game, it is similar, but I kept using Cavern of Souls to cast Tireless Tracker, then Prime Times, then Hornet Queen, and finally a lethal Walking Ballista. I don't think it actually mattered, as his only counterspell was Dispel on a Summoner's Pact and he had 0 cards in the end. I also made a mistake of not copying Cavern of Souls with Vesuva, which could have save me turns to kill him. He did get Settle the Wreckage and ScM Settle the Wreckage, but I only played enough creatures to put some pressure. Got there. 2-0.

Round 4 vs. Death and Taxes. Game 1, I ramp out super quickly. I do an Engineered Explosives to blow up a pair of creatures, but eventually he gets there. I don't find Summoner's Pact, Prime Time, or Tolaria West to get them. I can't win with just Azusa and Sakura Tribe-Scout. In the next game, he mulls to 6 and I do Kozilek's Return to get his creatures, then Tireless Tracker, which gets big. Then I draw a Prime Time and it's over soon after that. In the final game, he mulls to 6 again and I literally keep drawing the hits. I have Prime Time, the Tracker, and get more stuff after that. It's more than enough. I crack an Engineered Explosives on 0 to get 2 Blade Splicer Golem tokens and 2 of my own Plant tokens after I crack 3 Clues so they won't also get destroyed. Big creatures and he scoops. I also did a Ghost Quarter, getting his only White source after he played Leonin Arbiter, but he found another Plains the next turn. 2-1.

I finish 2-2. I made a lot of mistakes. I'm not sure I could have done better, but I had a bit of variance too. Oh well. I may play this more because it seems like it's become a fair meta again.

Decided to play it at FNM too. 33 people.

Round 1 vs. Grixis Shadow. He mulled to 6. He made me discard some cards, but I got a Prime Time and attacked him to 4 life. He attacks me with a Death's Shadow and I am scared of Temur Battle Rage and a Street Wraith, so I block since I have Tolaria West and after paying for a Pact, I can do Walking Ballista to win. I Transmute Tolaria West for Engineered Explosives instead and kill the Shadow. Then I use the other Tolaria West after not having to pay Pact to get Walking Ballista for lethal. Even had the Cavern of Souls. 2-0.

Round 2 vs. BUG. In the first game, I get Inquisitioned, then Grim Flayer, then discard for every good card I get before I can play a Prime Time. He gets there with that original Grim Flayer after I try to resolve Summoner's Pact and a late Prime Time. Didn't work. There was another play I could have done, but didn't do it. In the next game, he kills some of my smaller creatures. I am thinking about doing Ruric Thar, but I draw Summoner's Pact. I feel that he will Logic Knot the Pact, considering I could have Cavern of Souls in hand. He doesn't and I don't. I make the mistake of casting Prime Time since I feel it WILL resolve, but the Logic Knot comes out. Since I forgot that Summoner's Pact didn't get countered, I don't pay for Summoner's Pact the next turn and lose. I actually asked him if I could take it back and he said no. 0-2.

Round 3 vs. Jund. I Transmute Tolaria West and he doesn't have a discard spell for 1 turn, which allows for Prime Time to take over. Even drew Amulet that turn. In the next game, I got discarded a million times and drew a few too many lands, losing to LotV, Scooze, and Tarmogoyf. The next game is similar to Game 2, but no LotV. But he used 5 removal spells on 3 Sakura Tribe-Scout and 2 Azusa. I finally draw Prime Time and get there pretty easily after that. EE for 2 also cleared the Goyf and Scooze and I kill a Liliana the Last Hope after he milled, but got no creature. Prime Time makes way for other cards. 2-1.

Round 4 vs. Bant Company/JtmS. He mulled to 5 and got stuck on 3 land. He was representing Spell Queller, so I didn't cast Summoner's Pact. I just kept swinging with Tribe-Scout and Azusa until he drew and tapped out for Knight of the Reliquary. I then did Pact, Titan, and even got Double Strike and won easily after REMEMBERING TO PAY PACTs. In the next game, he got stuck on 2 land and mana dork. He literally didn't draw a land, but beat me down with Tireless Tracker and then Courser of Kruphix until I did Titan and got mana to do Engineered Explosives on 3 to blow those and a fresh Knight of the Reliquary. He had a Worship that showed on top, but he didn't get a 4th mana source. I sided out Rec Sage, so my only out was Walking Ballista, which I had Tolaria West for in hand though. He literally didn't draw a single land in either game. 2-0.

I finish 3-1, which wasn't bad for the punt. This deck is really tough to play! I even misplayed during wins, not to mention all of the misplays that I didn't notice. Lulz.

How do you beat scapeshift and all its variante?

Go off on turn 3-4? Main deck GQ? Not much going on in the match up besides that

Quote from Click5 »

Go off on turn 3-4? Main deck GQ? Not much going on in the match up besides that

I cant win vs titanshift..they are always faster :/ especially vs temur i have hard times..

Quote from Exylia »

Quote from Click5 »

Go off on turn 3-4? Main deck GQ? Not much going on in the match up besides that

I cant win vs titanshift..they are always faster :/ especially vs temur i have hard times..

Red Green Titanshift should be fairly easy. They are just a much slower, albeit possibly more consistent deck. Make sure you have a hand that can go off fairly early, try to play around Lightning Bolt with land drops with no triggers from Azusa and hope you get there quickly. Once they get to a number of lands, there isn't much you can do. But I have to tell you that as an Amulet player, I wouldn't be scared of Titanshift, although I've only played against it once before (1-0). As a Titanshift player, I am terrified of Amulet. I'm 1-4 vs. it with Titanshift.

Now, Red Blue Green ("RUG") Scapeshift or Bring to Light variants can be tough because they can Remand or Cryptic Command into Scapeshift to win. I think you just have to acccelerate as normal, but be wary of countermagic. I feel like this could be a somewhat poor matchup, but it's theoretical because I've never been on either side of the matchup, despite playing RUG Scapeshift for 3 months straight a couple of years ago and playing Amulet or Bloom off and on.

Lots of 'shift decks are running 2-3x Damping Sphere in the board now actually. I think the match up gets much, much worse games two and three for Amulet.

It feels like there is a lot of incidental hate hitting Amulet right now and in some cases, like Damping Sphere, it hits us harder. Rough times

I don't understand why Titanshift would run Damping Sphere in the side, but I haven't run Titanshift in a while. The only plus for the card is the matchup against Storm and from what I've heard, it's just a minor inconvenience for them. Titanshift should already be good vs. Tron - it's not guaranteed, but it's certainly favored for Titanshift. I can't think of much else that Titanshift would care enough to do Damping Sphere. The SB slots are already too packed. I personally had to cut grave hate all together for a while. Surprisingly, I didn't miss it much, lol.