It seems to me that with B/R Roulette, for any "bad matchups" like Bogles, or Humans or whatever, that you just hope to EXPLODE out of the gate and run them over before they stabilize. Winning the "long game" can be a bit much for any of these bad matchups, so you hope that Burning Inquiry helps your game plan, and hopefully mangles theirs.
I am no expert on this deck. I have just tested it for the past 2 weeks. But, this is my take on it as well.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
I think the only card that even raised an eyebrow was The Flame of Keld... but discarding and drawing on *separate* turns is really a non-starter. Bomat Courier is more viable and even it doesn't generally get used.
A lot of decks might want to use Damping Sphere in sideboard, and some of our boards might consider it. But the bigger impact is that a lot of people will be boarding it against us! Particularly Vengevine and Bushwhacker variants, that by definition count on casting multiple spells in a turn.
Hi, im new to the deck BR Hollow one deck. Been a jund/death shadow player my whole life. I have a few questions about the deck:
1. Why doesnt the deck run liliana of the veil in the side? I havent seen any lists running it.
2. I understand the single stomping ground is for the side decked ancient grudge. Given that we have abrade which fills a similar role, and might even be better in the current Humans/Hollow one meta, is it viable to run a Godless shrine instead, for Lingering souls out of the side? This is of course for the grindy matchups, and the flashback has the same discard synergy as ancient grudge.
New poster to this thread but I've been grinding out leagues with the deck with an above average win rate. Playing pretty close to the pro tour list.
@jund em in
1. It seems anti game plan. Lili is a grindy card, and I'm not sure the slot it would fill. 3 mana cards, especially 2 black sources, can be hard to manage in many games. Liliana looks like it fits, but the deck is most successful when it maintains explosiveness. Liliana is opposite that. What matchups would you want it for?
2. Sacred foundry would be better because it can be main decked. Turn 1 red is critical. There are 12 1 drop red cards. I think this also might be good against graveyard hate.
3. Again, what for? There's not a lot of, "this card wrecks this deck." That we would need turn 1 discard for that can't be answers by other things. Example, ensnaring bridge can be answered with ancient grudge and can be cast with flashback. Holding cards until that third land drop is unreliable at best. Brutality and ancient grudge seem to answer the same things but with more synergy.
New poster to this thread but I've been grinding out leagues with the deck with an above average win rate. Playing pretty close to the pro tour list.
@jund em in
1. It seems anti game plan. Lili is a grindy card, and I'm not sure the slot it would fill. 3 mana cards, especially 2 black sources, can be hard to manage in many games. Liliana looks like it fits, but the deck is most successful when it maintains explosiveness. Liliana is opposite that. What matchups would you want it for?
2. Sacred foundry would be better because it can be main decked. Turn 1 red is critical. There are 12 1 drop red cards. I think this also might be good against graveyard hate.
3. Again, what for? There's not a lot of, "this card wrecks this deck." That we would need turn 1 discard for that can't be answers by other things. Example, ensnaring bridge can be answered with ancient grudge and can be cast with flashback. Holding cards until that third land drop is unreliable at best. Brutality and ancient grudge seem to answer the same things but with more synergy.
Hey Frenchfryninja, thanks for taking the time to reply, most of it makes perfect sense.
1. I was thinking about LoTV in the side, because it can help grindy matchups, anything midrange and control. Anything that just plays 1 or 2 threats. Although maybe im looking at it wrong since im so used to playing grindy and value games and this deck isnt about that. How do we side against midrange decks and control?
2. Youre correct about Sacred foundry, do you think this can be a viable option along with the lingering souls plan against grave hate or grindy games? Or is this idea just too cute?
The double black mana to cast LOTV can be difficult, and LOTV won't enter the battlefield until the 3rd turn; when I play the B/R Roulette deck, I really need to kill someone by turn 4, most times, so playing Lili on Turn 3 won't have much effect and won't advance my game plan. I'm either already winning, at which point LOTV becomes a "win-more" card, or I'm behind and LOTV probably can't save me... It seems to me that the Roulette deck is sort of difficult to effectively sideboard with; of the popular "pro" list, the flex spots are 4 Lightning Bolts and 2 Collective Brutality. All 6 of those cards are useful and powerful, and in many instances, the exact tool we need... Diluting the game plan for sideboard cards is not advisable, as you want to maintain explosiveness.
1. I bring a 3rd collective brutality in against control, and I've thrown a couple blood moon in the side. Typically the 3 brutalities and a turn 1 inquiry are enough to make control stumble and get in there before they turn the corner. The moons are probably too cute, but in the long games cryptic command is back breaking. Once they get snap-cryptic the game is over. Blood moon is not anticipated, and usually keeps them off cryptic mana. It was won me a couple games. I take out 1 delver critter and 1 goblin lore for 2 moons.
2. I haven't tried them, but lingering souls was played at GP... Hartford? I think? With some success. I watched the deck go to 4-0 off the back of lingering souls and a sacred foundry. Seems solid and not cute at all. White helps counter grave hate, but be careful not to fight grave hate too much and over board. If I'm expecting yard interaction the delve guys get cut first since I'll never get to 6 or 7 mana.
3.
Also, I just finished jund. I'll probably be asking you for advise there. I tend to play too aggressively with that deck. I'm used to just turning guys sideways.
Hello! I just finished building this deck (minus Cliffs), and I'm wondering how I should split my sideboard. Last time I was at FNM, it was filled with creature decks (Elves, Affinity, Spirits), combo (1 Eggs player, 1-2 Storm), and a splattering of midrange. My current sideboard looks like this:
Note: I can't afford LOTV, Leyline, or EE. I decided to run Revelry in place of EE to have an answer to enchantments because I'm scared of RiP/D-sphere. However, it doesn't answer a wide board-state like EE. Should I run Kozilek's Return or Sweltering Suns as a replacement board wipe for EE? Is it worthwhile to have Thoughtseize against combo? What happened to Blood Moon; was it just too clunky?
Howdy all, I play in a large and competitive LGS twice a week. Mondays see 30-40+ players and Fridays regularly exceed 60. Lately my shop has been absolutely soaked in Blood Moon and Ensnaring Bridge--like, half the matches I play lately run these cards, often in the main. There's also plenty of Affinity and Humans as well as a cross section of just about anything else you might expect to see at a spiky FNM scene.
I tweaked the standard build with Bridge, Moon, and go-wide aggro in mind. Here's what I'll try tomorrow:
4x Grudge because f*&% Ensnaring Bridge, for real. I am SO sick of Bridge.
Verdant Catacombs gives me another tool to fetch a Swamp if I'm worried about Blood Moon--though the primary goal is for Moon to be bad against me anyway, due to the deck choice itself. Catacombs can get Stomping Ground if I needed it to and didn't have any Bloodstained Mire left to fetch.
EE main for maindeck Bridges, and the aggro matches. It also hits Chalice if that card turns up.
How about the Leylines side? They hedge against the mirror, KCI, Goryo's, etc. Are players here still supporting this card?
The Catacombs may be too cute, I suspect, right? I guess we're pretty near mono-R, but I've never actually played this deck before so I'm not sure how important having B is in a meta that has a TON of Blood Moon in it. I'm also not familiar enough with the deck to know how much I can lean on Looting etc. to find answers like Grudge, which may not need to be a playset. But again, F*&% ENSNARING BRIDGE.
Which card is better in the side board for Rakudos style deck. gnaw to the bone or feed the clan ? or do we not care about either card?
My meta is full of Burn, aggro, storm at the moment.
Hi guys, new to the deck, playing a grixis version. It’s essentially -4 lore, -1 land, -1 flex, -2 bolt and plus 4 amalgam plus 4 Izzet charm. In my meta I face burn, humans, storm, affinity, and tron. My current sideboard is 2 brutality, 2 fatal push, 2 Lavamancer, 2 stub, 2 ceremonious rejection, 2 hurkyls recall, 3 leyline if the void. What do you guys think does that sound okay or should I pack more humans hate?
My current version,
I will be adding 4 street wraith in the near future.
So far the deck has been polarizing, either really good or WTF. I find it hard to play sometimes. The randomness can be frustrating. I have had better luck when I play it straight without shenanigans.
I have tried playing in earlier lists hell's thunder over LBolt, and more blue spells but the results where inconsistent.
Currently I am at a 50/50 ratio of win/loses. Any advice on a better way to play the deck would be welcome.
When I first started creating the deck I was in blue, red, black. The Black was a very light splash. I also do not own street wraith (ordered a few in the mail this week), when I was looking into buying wraith it was priced too high for me around 8$. Deathshadow players were buying them out.
So the zombie card is a left over of the original build.
I will be reluctantly switching him out with wraiths.
I too run Amalgams (without blue lands) and that often proves to be a head-scratcher to my opponents in the shop, but I like the added layers of graveyard inexorability that the Amalgam offers; but I run 3 Amalgams and 1 Scourge Devil. I like having a few extra cards I actually "want" in my graveyard, and the Amalgams, Phoenixes, Bloodghasts and 1 Scourge Devil all fill that bill. I am still not running Lightning Bolts, and I still haven't felt that I really ever needed them. When Hollow One EXPLODES out the starting gate, I'm usually so far ahead that I just win. My win/loss ratio is considerably better than 65 to 70% in FNM matches, so I'm surprised your build is having such issues. Street Wraiths are pretty much mandatory though.
Swampwalk on Street Wraith is more useful than I ever imagined originally; there seems to be lots of swamps in my meta. If it gets to the long game, Street Wraith has won me games on the battlefield, although this is a real weird, corner-case scenario.
Why don't you just run Vengevine version of Hollow One then? It still uses Wraiths, but it definitely adds more explosiveness. This is my current list. Sorry I don't know how to link decks yet.
Creatures 32ea
x4 Hollow One
x4 Vengevine
x4 Flamewake Phoenix
x4 Flameblade Adepts
x2 Bloodrage Brawler (great to discard Vengevine & then trigger him when he is the 2nd creature cast. Not to mention triggers Flamewake Phoenix)
x4 Insolent Neonate
x4 Burning-Tree Emissary (Quiet MVP)
x4 Street Wraith
x2 Reckless Bushwhacker (Wish I could play more... Awesome combos with Burning-Tree alone)
I have not played the deck in over 2 months, the meta then was heavy with humans, jeskia control, burn. I Armageddon myself my last game turn 1 and 2. I got fed up with the deck after that lol. Now I'm willing to try again.
I will also confess that I miss played a lot, along with only a small sample size of playing about 12 games I think.
I side boarded incorrectly on a couple of match-ups, and got hurt badly with GY hate,
All this drives my win/loss ratio way down.
Amalgams have been good, I also ran them with 2 Scourge Devil, I found that I really wanted a card that gave everyone haste with ETB. But I never explored it (Reckless Bushwhacker).
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I am no expert on this deck. I have just tested it for the past 2 weeks. But, this is my take on it as well.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)What Warcry Phoenix does, Flamewake Phoenix already does better.
A lot of decks might want to use Damping Sphere in sideboard, and some of our boards might consider it. But the bigger impact is that a lot of people will be boarding it against us! Particularly Vengevine and Bushwhacker variants, that by definition count on casting multiple spells in a turn.
Also for the deck single handedly making goblin lore a $40 card.
1. Why doesnt the deck run liliana of the veil in the side? I havent seen any lists running it.
2. I understand the single stomping ground is for the side decked ancient grudge. Given that we have abrade which fills a similar role, and might even be better in the current Humans/Hollow one meta, is it viable to run a Godless shrine instead, for Lingering souls out of the side? This is of course for the grindy matchups, and the flashback has the same discard synergy as ancient grudge.
3. Why doesnt the deck run any number of thoughtseize, inquisition of kozilek or kolaghans command.
And any tips for a new player to the deck are greatly appreciated. Thanks!
@jund em in
1. It seems anti game plan. Lili is a grindy card, and I'm not sure the slot it would fill. 3 mana cards, especially 2 black sources, can be hard to manage in many games. Liliana looks like it fits, but the deck is most successful when it maintains explosiveness. Liliana is opposite that. What matchups would you want it for?
2. Sacred foundry would be better because it can be main decked. Turn 1 red is critical. There are 12 1 drop red cards. I think this also might be good against graveyard hate.
3. Again, what for? There's not a lot of, "this card wrecks this deck." That we would need turn 1 discard for that can't be answers by other things. Example, ensnaring bridge can be answered with ancient grudge and can be cast with flashback. Holding cards until that third land drop is unreliable at best. Brutality and ancient grudge seem to answer the same things but with more synergy.
Modern: Bogles // 8-Whack/Goblins // UW Titan // Hollow One // Affinity // Dredge
EDH: Nissa, Vastwood Seer // Atraxa, Praetor's Voice // Meren of Clan Nel Toth
Hey Frenchfryninja, thanks for taking the time to reply, most of it makes perfect sense.
1. I was thinking about LoTV in the side, because it can help grindy matchups, anything midrange and control. Anything that just plays 1 or 2 threats. Although maybe im looking at it wrong since im so used to playing grindy and value games and this deck isnt about that. How do we side against midrange decks and control?
2. Youre correct about Sacred foundry, do you think this can be a viable option along with the lingering souls plan against grave hate or grindy games? Or is this idea just too cute?
3. Got it!
1. I bring a 3rd collective brutality in against control, and I've thrown a couple blood moon in the side. Typically the 3 brutalities and a turn 1 inquiry are enough to make control stumble and get in there before they turn the corner. The moons are probably too cute, but in the long games cryptic command is back breaking. Once they get snap-cryptic the game is over. Blood moon is not anticipated, and usually keeps them off cryptic mana. It was won me a couple games. I take out 1 delver critter and 1 goblin lore for 2 moons.
2. I haven't tried them, but lingering souls was played at GP... Hartford? I think? With some success. I watched the deck go to 4-0 off the back of lingering souls and a sacred foundry. Seems solid and not cute at all. White helps counter grave hate, but be careful not to fight grave hate too much and over board. If I'm expecting yard interaction the delve guys get cut first since I'll never get to 6 or 7 mana.
3.
Also, I just finished jund. I'll probably be asking you for advise there. I tend to play too aggressively with that deck. I'm used to just turning guys sideways.
Modern: Bogles // 8-Whack/Goblins // UW Titan // Hollow One // Affinity // Dredge
EDH: Nissa, Vastwood Seer // Atraxa, Praetor's Voice // Meren of Clan Nel Toth
2x Big Game Hunter
1x Collective Brutality
2x Destructive Revelry
2x Fatal Push
2x Grim Lavamancer
2x Nihil Spellbomb
2x Thoughtseize
Note: I can't afford LOTV, Leyline, or EE. I decided to run Revelry in place of EE to have an answer to enchantments because I'm scared of RiP/D-sphere. However, it doesn't answer a wide board-state like EE. Should I run Kozilek's Return or Sweltering Suns as a replacement board wipe for EE? Is it worthwhile to have Thoughtseize against combo? What happened to Blood Moon; was it just too clunky?
I tweaked the standard build with Bridge, Moon, and go-wide aggro in mind. Here's what I'll try tomorrow:
4x Bloodstained Mire
3x Wooded Foothills
1x Verdant Catacombs
2x Blood Crypt
1x Stomping Ground
3x Blackcleave Cliffs
3x Mountain
1x Swamp
Creature (24)
4x Flameblade Adept
4x Hollow One
4x Bloodghast
4x Flamewake Phoenix
4x Street Wraith
3x Gurmag Angler
1x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
4x Faithless Looting
4x Goblin Lore
4x Burning Inquiry
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Collective Brutality
1x Engineered Explosives
4x Ancient Grudge
3x Leyline of the Void
2x Collective Brutality
2x Grim Lavamancer
2x Blood Moon
1x Dismember
1x Terminate
Thoughts?
Which card is better in the side board for Rakudos style deck. gnaw to the bone or feed the clan ? or do we not care about either card?
My meta is full of Burn, aggro, storm at the moment.
4 flameblabe Adept
4 flamewake phonix
3 gurmag Angler
4 hollow One
1 Tasigur, the golden Fang
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Burning Inquery
4 Faithless looting
4 Goblin Lore
2 Collective Brutality
4 Lighting Bolt
3 Blackcleave cliffs
3 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstain Mire
2 Wooded foothills
1 stomping Ground
2 Mountain
1 swamp
2 ancient Grudge
2 fatal push
1 terminate
2 big game hunter
1 grim lavamancer
1 collected brutality
2 nihil spellbomb
My current version,
I will be adding 4 street wraith in the near future.
So far the deck has been polarizing, either really good or WTF. I find it hard to play sometimes. The randomness can be frustrating. I have had better luck when I play it straight without shenanigans.
I have tried playing in earlier lists hell's thunder over LBolt, and more blue spells but the results where inconsistent.
Currently I am at a 50/50 ratio of win/loses. Any advice on a better way to play the deck would be welcome.
So the zombie card is a left over of the original build.
I will be reluctantly switching him out with wraiths.
Swampwalk on Street Wraith is more useful than I ever imagined originally; there seems to be lots of swamps in my meta. If it gets to the long game, Street Wraith has won me games on the battlefield, although this is a real weird, corner-case scenario.
Creatures 32ea
x4 Hollow One
x4 Vengevine
x4 Flamewake Phoenix
x4 Flameblade Adepts
x2 Bloodrage Brawler (great to discard Vengevine & then trigger him when he is the 2nd creature cast. Not to mention triggers Flamewake Phoenix)
x4 Insolent Neonate
x4 Burning-Tree Emissary (Quiet MVP)
x4 Street Wraith
x2 Reckless Bushwhacker (Wish I could play more... Awesome combos with Burning-Tree alone)
Spells 12ea
x4 Goblin Lore
x4 Faithless Looting
x2 Lightning Axe
x2 Lightning Bolt
Lands 16ea (Main list just needs Mountains, but the SB has a lot of Green, so duals, and fetches are needed)
I will also confess that I miss played a lot, along with only a small sample size of playing about 12 games I think.
I side boarded incorrectly on a couple of match-ups, and got hurt badly with GY hate,
All this drives my win/loss ratio way down.
Amalgams have been good, I also ran them with 2 Scourge Devil, I found that I really wanted a card that gave everyone haste with ETB. But I never explored it (Reckless Bushwhacker).