In case people didn't pick up on this subtlety (it slips past some people at first glance where they think Vines is just an obsolete wording of Hexproof), Vines can cause your opponents' spells that target their own creatures to fizzle.
The original list I ran had a playset of Blossoming Defense because the fast hexproof and pump seemed the most important, but then I met Infect. So came the 2/2 split. As for the firespout I have no play time on them yet, none of the fairy or Spirits decks showed up this weekend. But as soon as I have some input I'll let you know how they felt for me.
2-2 tonight playing that regionals list with fetches. Good start 2-0 against u/r prison and amulet titan but then got my dick beat into the dirt against u/w and esper control. Pretty much can't beat terminus.
I haven't tested it myself, but I think it would be better to run more Vines of Vastwood/Blossoming Defense/Heroic Intervention or something like Shapers' Sanctuary. Defense Grid also makes the cost of our Vines/Blossoming Defense in response to their removal cost 3 more if they cast removal during their own turn, which is pretty bad for us.
I know it also forces them to Opt during their own turn, but I think it's not worth it.
In response to the post about losing to terminus. Vines, defense, heroic intervention etc do nothing to battle terminus. Defense grid at least makes them do it on their turn, most likely. Sideboard our some of the cards mentioned above and bring in hexproof threats like Thrun so you don’t have to save creatures with spells. Still loses to terminus, but gives another angle for Stompy.
I've played a number of times against a friend who used to play a lot of UW control (before they played Terminus), and what I learned is that you basically always have to hold back a little bit, just apply pressure bit by bit until they find it too much and wipe you, and then you play more creatures.
I don't know how much of this applies to the current UW decks, especially since it doesn't cost 4 mana like most wipes, but I thought I'd share it anyway. Maybe Evolutionary Leap will help? Also works well with Strangleroot Geist.
Maybe phyrexian revoker is better, because with body for pressure too if they dont have jace in Hand. They play only 2 jace, neans Chance they dont have it is big, so needle can be useless. It is not important it cost more mana, because we have time till jace. Another reason is, it stops mana abilitys like kci too, but needle not...same vs ad naeseum artefacts. Sorry for my english
The downside to revoker is that besides being hit by detention sphere and cryptics, just like needle, it also gets hit by Path, Terminus, Teferi, Oust and Jace itself if you didn't name it.
I personally think it's too much of a downside to even be considered an inclusion, at least in my deck.
Also against kci and ad nauseam you're better off with Unravel the Aether against them, since shuffling the card on the deck makes it harder for kci to get it back. It also gets rid of phyrexian unlife as a plus.
Unravel the aether has nothing to do with preventing abilitys. Unravel you have too in your side, no matter if needle or revoker. If i play revoker and they path it, so i am happy, 1 path less means 1 creazure is safe more...but if i needle and they dont have jace, so its useless and you spend a card and gain nothing. again, they have 2 jace only and this is not a solution against terminus. Siding out creatures vs. Control for narrow Cards is Bad in a creaturedeck like stompy. We need pressure
Here's my attempt at making a minimal white splash stompy. Also wondering if Razorverge Thicket can replace the last two fetches of ten since Zendikar fetches are $$$. Also based on cards I already own.
Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
After a few weeks. Not a big fan of pelt collector. Reduce him down to a one of purely for manacurve sakes. Too many of him plus exp 1 leads of insufficient creatures to evolve exp 1.
The lack of big butt evolve also comes up a bit. Turn one e1 into turn two dryad+rancor is made sweeter when u can further evolve with a big butt tusker, avatar, or steel leaf.
Lastly I feel that Regen @ 2 counters > trample @3.
Doing my final prep for GP Portland so just want to put my thoughts out there. Last GP I made it to day 2, unsure if that is possible his time around but we will try our best again.
Here's my attempt at making a minimal white splash stompy. Also wondering if Razorverge Thicket can replace the last two fetches of ten since Zendikar fetches are $$$. Also based on cards I already own.
You can use 2 Flooded strand as fetch 9-10, as they can also find temple gardens. Just remember how many temple gardens are left in your deck, so that you don't run out of temple gardens to fetch with the strands.
Went 5-3 Saturday, sadly losing win and in but my goal was just to simply go even. So a personal success overall. Then went 3-3 today (Sunday) at the mordern PTQ.
Yet again deck proved itself to be a good modern deck that can wrestle with the big boys and keep it head up high.
This is what i ran with, sadly not the actual list I planned to run the even with. I was doing some testing during the week and in my rush to pack I forgot my maybe-board at home. I would have actually replaced the Pelt Collector with Wasteland Viper and replaced Natural State with Gut Shot.
As for the matches, probably not 100% accurate but to the best of my notes/memory:
GP Main Event
Round 1 VS Devoted Druid
Game 1 I curve out nicely, E1, Pelt into, Tusker, he shocks down to 13, I finish with Aspect + Kicked Vines
Game 2, he mulls to 5, I keep a hand with E1, Scooze, Dismemberx2. Slow start with 2 power E1 chipping in, he Cocos turn 3 into
double finks. Dismember and Scooze make easy work of both Finks.
1-0
Round 2 VS Pelt Collector/Vexing Devil Zoo
Game 1 I keep E1, Dryad,Treetop,Steel leaf x 2, I take 4 damage from vexing devil punisher, he takes 6 damage from fetch/shocks. While my boys hold the ground and steel leaf bashes.
Game 2 He opens fast and strong, I just keep running out blockers turn after turn. He gets me down to 4 life, I draw Scooze and take over game.
2-0
Round 3 VS Hardened Scales
Game 1 we both keep slow hands, I get him down to 5 life, sadly no removal, eventually he draws and pleay Overseer and Scales and takes over.
Game 2 I draw the nuts, E1, E1, Dryad, Tusker,Deglamer, double aspect. he has Welding jar to protect his turn 2 overseer, but deglamer punches through
Game 3 He goes double hardened scales, into double overseer, my single unravel the aether is no match.
2-1
Round 4 VS Amulet Titan
Game 1 I keep mediocre hand with a critical dismember. he keeps a durdle hand with just an azuza and what seems like 0 bounce lands. I kill azuza, he skates for another 2 turn and dies.
Game 2 I dismember azuza once again, get him down to 10, he plays a second azuza goes off and drops/finishes with Zacama.
Game 3 I curve out and finish with double vines.
3-1
Round 5 VS Dredge
Game 1 I go E1, He goes Shriek Hord, turn 2 i cast Dryad militant, he doesnt read it and lets it resolve before using shriekhorn. Shriek horn mills Creeping Chill, and Loam, opponent = Sad face, and says "I guess i Have to draw now" lol. This moment made the whole trip worth it. Keeps milling lands and spells so cant dredge, I keep bashing in for easy win.
Game 2 I keep hand with Scooze. He nuts me, turn 2 = 3 x almagam, kills scooze, I die.
Game 3 I keep Dryad x3, Steel Leaf x 2. Kills my turn two dryad but is sad dark blast is exiled, Double dryad follow up, he then trophies one guaranteeing me my third land, double Steel Leaf follow up is unstoppable.
4-1
Round 6 VS GB Elves
Game 1 He turn 3 nuts me
Game 2 He turn 3 nuts me
4-2
Round 7 Boros Burn
Game 1 I keep, E1, Avatar, Steel leaf, Aspect, He Swift spear, and Eidolon. We trade blows, he double blocks, I keep Eidolon alive cause hes really team green MVP in this matchup. unblocked Steel leaf + aspect finishes the job.
Game 2 We keep trading blows, but hes only play so I'm one attack phase short.
Game 3 Dryad Neuters Lavamancer and blocks a 4 power swift spear, Geist swings and blocks for a turn, Steel leaf kills him.
5-2
Round 8 VS Humans
Game 1 We trade damage for a bit, but double reflector mages ends me
Game 2 We stall the board, steel leaf drops and bashes in unblocked for 3 turns.
Game 3 He Nuts, Champion, into 2x Thalia's lieutenant, into image copying Lieutenant. I die.
5-3 Overall.
Sunday PTQ London @ GP Portland
Round 1 VS Humans
Game 1 he goes Champion, into Noble into double phantasmal copying my Steel leaf, I dismember champion, vines and aspect to remove the phantasmal and steel leaf takes over.
Game 2 plays almost the same as game 1, He nobles, phantasmal copies my E1, freeboots taking a vines, I vines the phantasmal, he phantasmal my Steel leaf, he draw steps me a vialed 2nd Freebooter, i draw dismember to take out second image, steel leaf finishes job again.
1-0
Round 2 VS Hollow One
Game 1 Turn 1 Burning Inquiry = 2x hollow one, turn 2 Burning inquiry adds a Gurmag angler = dead Stompy.
Game 2 I curve out, his Inquiry does nothing, Dismember his first angler, win.
Game 3 We trade blows and stall, he finally loots 2x phoenix into yard and wins in the air.
1-1
Round 3 VS UW control
Game 1 - I get him down to 1,He finally stabilizes, flips Azcanta, wins with snap beats + Colonnade.
Game 2 - I keep E1, Dryad with pithing needle. Punch in with E1 and Dryad and stop casting, before his 4th land drop i bait counter with Geist, pithing needle naming Jace, opponent frowns :). Drop an avatar down, he supreme verdicts, I regen E1, he asks to read the card again. E1 swings for one dmg for 4 turns, i refuse to cast into counters. he finally relents and condems it. I keep droping one threat at a time until he deals with it. Drop Relic to clear yards to further reduce his ability to 2-for-1. Teferi comes down to tuck a Steel leaf, i drop second pithing needled on teferi. keep droping single threat and chipping in every so often, dung grove elder lands as an 9/9 and he taps out.
Game 2 - He mulls to 6, goes land into serum visions, missing 2nd land drop. I smell blood in the water and dump my hand.he goes tap land, Paths ramps me into Steel leaf mana and i Finish the job.
2-1
Round 4 VS RG Eldrazi
Game 1 - He has a very slow start, Stirs for 2nd land, then drop mana dork followed by Reshaper. I build my board and punch through reshaper with e1+rancor+kicked Vines. Smasher comes down too late on blocking duty, finish with Aspect.
Game 2 - he goes turn 2 thoughknot, turn 3 smasher, bolts my guys and i fold.
Game 3 - we both curved decently,E1, dryad, Tusk, Scooze, he goes dork, reshaper, thought knot.swing past each other for two turns,he finally decides to trade with reshaper. He goes to angers, forgets about graveyard and scooze eats to survive. Suit up Scooze with rancor and start swinging, have vines kicked back up. he is finally forced to block with thoughtknot. goes to Pulse of Murasa back the thoughtknot, Scooze foils that plan and he scoops.
3-1
Round 5 VS Izzet Pheonix/Drakes
Game 1, off to slow start with no 1 drop, but so is he. he drops thing in the ice, i draw dismember for it and apply pressure. He tries to bolt things down but vines and aspect keep the board safe. he loots but doesnt find any action, and dryad prevents the flash back. I close the gates.
Game 2, He nuts me, loots, drops 2 drakes into yard, follows with thing in the ice,I dismember it,gets birds back with back to back mana morphose into bolts.he finishes with unblock swiftspear, and double gutshot+birds.
Game 3, We trade back and forth a bit, flips thing, im force to put back to back geist on blocking duty to buy time. hard cast a bird and start getting in. I drop scooze and make an attempt to get back in, but scooze came back too late. so close though.
3-2
Round 6 VS Dredge
Game 1 I keep slow hand with 0 graveyard hate, and 0 beef, so i cant attack into his amalgamsx2. keep drawing E1 and lands and pump spells. he double creeping chillds builds a large board and swings in for kill.
Game 2 I mull to 4, 0 graveyard hate 1 land. miss 2nd land drop on turn 2, finally get land on turn 3, but its too late. he runs away with game.
That's some great results and a very detailed Report, thank you for the insights!
I see a pattern which I already saw when Golgari Grave-Troll was legal, which is: Dredge is actually a pretty good matchup for us. Bloodghast can't block, Amalgam Comes into Play tapped, Narcomoeba is just a chump-blocker, and with Dryad and ooze we have quite decent graveyard-interaction in the maindeck.
Since the deck is now on the rise again, can you confirm this based on your tournament? I actually haven't played the matchup in a while.
I am also very interested in the UR Drake/Phoenix matchup, which seems to be the new Thing in Modern - how is that one going?
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In case people didn't pick up on this subtlety (it slips past some people at first glance where they think Vines is just an obsolete wording of Hexproof), Vines can cause your opponents' spells that target their own creatures to fizzle.
I know it also forces them to Opt during their own turn, but I think it's not worth it.
I don't know how much of this applies to the current UW decks, especially since it doesn't cost 4 mana like most wipes, but I thought I'd share it anyway. Maybe Evolutionary Leap will help? Also works well with Strangleroot Geist.
I totally agree on pithing needle being the right approach vs UW control.
I personally think it's too much of a downside to even be considered an inclusion, at least in my deck.
Also against kci and ad nauseam you're better off with Unravel the Aether against them, since shuffling the card on the deck makes it harder for kci to get it back. It also gets rid of phyrexian unlife as a plus.
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
4 Narnam Renegade
4 Pelt Collector
1 Rhonas the Indomitable
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Steel Leaf Champion
4 Strangleroot Geist
Lands
5 Forest
2 Horizon Canopy
4 Temple Garden
2 Treetop Village
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Aspect of Hydra
2 Blossoming Defense
2 Path to Exile
3 Rancor
2 Vines of Vastwood
1 Bow of Nylea
2 Gut Shot
2 Life Goes On
2 Loxodon Smiter
2 Natural State
2 Path to Exile
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
The lack of big butt evolve also comes up a bit. Turn one e1 into turn two dryad+rancor is made sweeter when u can further evolve with a big butt tusker, avatar, or steel leaf.
Lastly I feel that Regen @ 2 counters > trample @3.
Doing my final prep for GP Portland so just want to put my thoughts out there. Last GP I made it to day 2, unsure if that is possible his time around but we will try our best again.
You can use 2 Flooded strand as fetch 9-10, as they can also find temple gardens. Just remember how many temple gardens are left in your deck, so that you don't run out of temple gardens to fetch with the strands.
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Want to play a UW control deck in modern, but don't have jace or snaps?
Please come visit us at the Emeria Titan control thread
Went 5-3 Saturday, sadly losing win and in but my goal was just to simply go even. So a personal success overall. Then went 3-3 today (Sunday) at the mordern PTQ.
Yet again deck proved itself to be a good modern deck that can wrestle with the big boys and keep it head up high.
What does your deck look like, and are you able to give a report on the tournaments?
04 Experiment One
04 Dryad Militant
01 Pelt Collector
04 Strangleroot Geist
04 Avatar of the Resolute
02 Kalonian Tusker
03 Scavenging Ooze
04 Steel Leaf Champion
04 Aspect of Hydra
04 Rancor
03 Vines of Vastwood
02 Dismember
Lands x 21
19 Forest
02 Treetop Village
03 Damping Sphere
02 Dismember
02 Pithing Needle
02 Relic Of Progenitus
01 Guttural Response
01 Natural State
01 Deglamer
01 Unravel the Aether
01 Dungrove Elder
01 Skylasher
This is what i ran with, sadly not the actual list I planned to run the even with. I was doing some testing during the week and in my rush to pack I forgot my maybe-board at home. I would have actually replaced the Pelt Collector with Wasteland Viper and replaced Natural State with Gut Shot.
As for the matches, probably not 100% accurate but to the best of my notes/memory:
GP Main Event
Round 1 VS Devoted Druid
Game 1 I curve out nicely, E1, Pelt into, Tusker, he shocks down to 13, I finish with Aspect + Kicked Vines
Game 2, he mulls to 5, I keep a hand with E1, Scooze, Dismemberx2. Slow start with 2 power E1 chipping in, he Cocos turn 3 into
double finks. Dismember and Scooze make easy work of both Finks.
1-0
Round 2 VS Pelt Collector/Vexing Devil Zoo
Game 1 I keep E1, Dryad,Treetop,Steel leaf x 2, I take 4 damage from vexing devil punisher, he takes 6 damage from fetch/shocks. While my boys hold the ground and steel leaf bashes.
Game 2 He opens fast and strong, I just keep running out blockers turn after turn. He gets me down to 4 life, I draw Scooze and take over game.
2-0
Round 3 VS Hardened Scales
Game 1 we both keep slow hands, I get him down to 5 life, sadly no removal, eventually he draws and pleay Overseer and Scales and takes over.
Game 2 I draw the nuts, E1, E1, Dryad, Tusker,Deglamer, double aspect. he has Welding jar to protect his turn 2 overseer, but deglamer punches through
Game 3 He goes double hardened scales, into double overseer, my single unravel the aether is no match.
2-1
Round 4 VS Amulet Titan
Game 1 I keep mediocre hand with a critical dismember. he keeps a durdle hand with just an azuza and what seems like 0 bounce lands. I kill azuza, he skates for another 2 turn and dies.
Game 2 I dismember azuza once again, get him down to 10, he plays a second azuza goes off and drops/finishes with Zacama.
Game 3 I curve out and finish with double vines.
3-1
Round 5 VS Dredge
Game 1 I go E1, He goes Shriek Hord, turn 2 i cast Dryad militant, he doesnt read it and lets it resolve before using shriekhorn. Shriek horn mills Creeping Chill, and Loam, opponent = Sad face, and says "I guess i Have to draw now" lol. This moment made the whole trip worth it. Keeps milling lands and spells so cant dredge, I keep bashing in for easy win.
Game 2 I keep hand with Scooze. He nuts me, turn 2 = 3 x almagam, kills scooze, I die.
Game 3 I keep Dryad x3, Steel Leaf x 2. Kills my turn two dryad but is sad dark blast is exiled, Double dryad follow up, he then trophies one guaranteeing me my third land, double Steel Leaf follow up is unstoppable.
4-1
Round 6 VS GB Elves
Game 1 He turn 3 nuts me
Game 2 He turn 3 nuts me
4-2
Round 7 Boros Burn
Game 1 I keep, E1, Avatar, Steel leaf, Aspect, He Swift spear, and Eidolon. We trade blows, he double blocks, I keep Eidolon alive cause hes really team green MVP in this matchup. unblocked Steel leaf + aspect finishes the job.
Game 2 We keep trading blows, but hes only play so I'm one attack phase short.
Game 3 Dryad Neuters Lavamancer and blocks a 4 power swift spear, Geist swings and blocks for a turn, Steel leaf kills him.
5-2
Round 8 VS Humans
Game 1 We trade damage for a bit, but double reflector mages ends me
Game 2 We stall the board, steel leaf drops and bashes in unblocked for 3 turns.
Game 3 He Nuts, Champion, into 2x Thalia's lieutenant, into image copying Lieutenant. I die.
5-3 Overall.
Sunday PTQ London @ GP Portland
Round 1 VS Humans
Game 1 he goes Champion, into Noble into double phantasmal copying my Steel leaf, I dismember champion, vines and aspect to remove the phantasmal and steel leaf takes over.
Game 2 plays almost the same as game 1, He nobles, phantasmal copies my E1, freeboots taking a vines, I vines the phantasmal, he phantasmal my Steel leaf, he draw steps me a vialed 2nd Freebooter, i draw dismember to take out second image, steel leaf finishes job again.
1-0
Round 2 VS Hollow One
Game 1 Turn 1 Burning Inquiry = 2x hollow one, turn 2 Burning inquiry adds a Gurmag angler = dead Stompy.
Game 2 I curve out, his Inquiry does nothing, Dismember his first angler, win.
Game 3 We trade blows and stall, he finally loots 2x phoenix into yard and wins in the air.
1-1
Round 3 VS UW control
Game 1 - I get him down to 1,He finally stabilizes, flips Azcanta, wins with snap beats + Colonnade.
Game 2 - I keep E1, Dryad with pithing needle. Punch in with E1 and Dryad and stop casting, before his 4th land drop i bait counter with Geist, pithing needle naming Jace, opponent frowns :). Drop an avatar down, he supreme verdicts, I regen E1, he asks to read the card again. E1 swings for one dmg for 4 turns, i refuse to cast into counters. he finally relents and condems it. I keep droping one threat at a time until he deals with it. Drop Relic to clear yards to further reduce his ability to 2-for-1. Teferi comes down to tuck a Steel leaf, i drop second pithing needled on teferi. keep droping single threat and chipping in every so often, dung grove elder lands as an 9/9 and he taps out.
Game 2 - He mulls to 6, goes land into serum visions, missing 2nd land drop. I smell blood in the water and dump my hand.he goes tap land, Paths ramps me into Steel leaf mana and i Finish the job.
2-1
Round 4 VS RG Eldrazi
Game 1 - He has a very slow start, Stirs for 2nd land, then drop mana dork followed by Reshaper. I build my board and punch through reshaper with e1+rancor+kicked Vines. Smasher comes down too late on blocking duty, finish with Aspect.
Game 2 - he goes turn 2 thoughknot, turn 3 smasher, bolts my guys and i fold.
Game 3 - we both curved decently,E1, dryad, Tusk, Scooze, he goes dork, reshaper, thought knot.swing past each other for two turns,he finally decides to trade with reshaper. He goes to angers, forgets about graveyard and scooze eats to survive. Suit up Scooze with rancor and start swinging, have vines kicked back up. he is finally forced to block with thoughtknot. goes to Pulse of Murasa back the thoughtknot, Scooze foils that plan and he scoops.
3-1
Round 5 VS Izzet Pheonix/Drakes
Game 1, off to slow start with no 1 drop, but so is he. he drops thing in the ice, i draw dismember for it and apply pressure. He tries to bolt things down but vines and aspect keep the board safe. he loots but doesnt find any action, and dryad prevents the flash back. I close the gates.
Game 2, He nuts me, loots, drops 2 drakes into yard, follows with thing in the ice,I dismember it,gets birds back with back to back mana morphose into bolts.he finishes with unblock swiftspear, and double gutshot+birds.
Game 3, We trade back and forth a bit, flips thing, im force to put back to back geist on blocking duty to buy time. hard cast a bird and start getting in. I drop scooze and make an attempt to get back in, but scooze came back too late. so close though.
3-2
Round 6 VS Dredge
Game 1 I keep slow hand with 0 graveyard hate, and 0 beef, so i cant attack into his amalgamsx2. keep drawing E1 and lands and pump spells. he double creeping chillds builds a large board and swings in for kill.
Game 2 I mull to 4, 0 graveyard hate 1 land. miss 2nd land drop on turn 2, finally get land on turn 3, but its too late. he runs away with game.
3-3 final
I see a pattern which I already saw when Golgari Grave-Troll was legal, which is: Dredge is actually a pretty good matchup for us. Bloodghast can't block, Amalgam Comes into Play tapped, Narcomoeba is just a chump-blocker, and with Dryad and ooze we have quite decent graveyard-interaction in the maindeck.
Since the deck is now on the rise again, can you confirm this based on your tournament? I actually haven't played the matchup in a while.
I am also very interested in the UR Drake/Phoenix matchup, which seems to be the new Thing in Modern - how is that one going?