Hello, I've played Burn for a bit and I get OK results. One question I have about Goblins/8 Whack - I guess we are assuming more of a control role here, particularly on the draw? Obviously one's hand will guide what style of play you take, but overall we're looking to keep the board under control and make our spells count in the long run?
Yes, but you can't really afford to just bolt creatures until their board is empty and then try to kill them. If this deck is a common one for you to see, you should load up on Searing Blaze/Searing Blood and possibly consider Anger of the Gods/Pyroclasm/Volcanic Fallout. Kor Firewalker should do a lot as well, and they'll likely bring in Dragon's Claw themselves. Prioritize what can get big and be happy to use your creatures as kill spells by blocking. Eidolon should do a lot of work as well. Be mindful that Goblin Grenade might kill you after an attack.
So if I go to a big event... Is it still reasonable to board s. Blood? I know I've asked this in the past but a lot of what I watch on YouTube makes me feel like it's not worth it in the sb. I feel things grow out of 2 dmg range too quickly now and to have the spot wasted on a card that isn't rly doing much feels bad. Also have the same reason on lavaman... is he still something to main as a 1-2 of or is he just not putting in the same work? I'm working on 3 sb spots atm and 2 are bloods. Outside of watching YouTube, it's been awhile since I've really gotten to play modern so I'm just looking at those who have more time on their hands to play for justification on them. Im currently also on dega burn but slowly am going rakdos with dega/boros sb options. Also trying to stay at 8-10 2 drops. Also, has palm still have enough uses to keep in in the sb? I read an article by Ari lax who feels path isn't right either... How does everyone feel on path? I personally think it's an necessary evil between wurmcoil and firewalker but that's just my thought.
Here's the thing with searing blood: it hoses humans. The only lord they have in the deck is thalia's lieutenant, so unless that comes down blood kills the following:
hierarch
kitesail
both thalias
champion of the parish on turn 2 vast majority of the time
meddling mage
sin collector
knight of autumn
this also means you can hold your searing blaze for mantis riders, reflector mages, etc. Path also matters still because of auriok champion, which is usually a 2 or 3-of in a humans SB. Champion slows the game down to a painful crawl, and I personally like having the out. I have contemplated splitting between path and ensnaring bridge or even engineered explosives. Never tried either, but they certainly have their uses. Then again, if you have a full playset of skullcrack in the 75 that helps too. I might be overthinking.
Think about the top decks in modern right now overall: tron, humans, uw, phoenix. Path is good in all of those matchups, as you have to contend with wurmcoil, various big humans, lyra or baneslayer out of the uw sideboard, and thing/drake. If you hate giving up the land and want to play chained to the rocks, fine I'll give you that. I just think there are too many creatures that have more than three points of toughness that spell "game over." Palm is nice, but my issue with palm is the extra mana plus narrower window of use. I think I've had one big swing from palm ever steal a game.
I think expecting to bank on having five mana is a tall order, to be honest. I'm hopeful that we get something in this set, but I'm not sure Firebolt is it.
Firebolt is an interesting one that I've been thinking "what if it was in Modern" about for a while. I feel like it would have been in Modern Burn if it had been legal several years ago, but I think it would have been replaced by now. I don't know what you'd pull for it. If it was a 3 mana flashback, it could make it, but 5 is a bit steep.
I hope the red one in the Force cycle is a Burn spell, but it would need to be absurdly strong to want to discard a red card to cast it. We might be approaching the max number of burn spells in the set and have no chance of PoP, Fireblast, or Flame Rift, anymore.
Is Diabolic Edict enough to cut Path from decks, for those wanting to eschew White? Can you think of a time when we need targetted removal versus decks that would have multiple creatures on the board?
Humans will sac whatever is smallest. Phoenix will sacrifice a Phoenix and it's coming back, you could get rid of TitI after it triggers. Titan sacs a land enabler, but Primeval Titan remains. Infect sacrifices Noble. If there's a Kor Firewalker in play, something else is dying.
Tron probably only has one creature on board anyway. Shadow might only have one as well.
Also, you don't have to wait for Modern Horizons for that effect. You can play Liliana's Triumph already.
maybe 4 of is too painfull, I will start to try 2 of them,
in your opinion how strong do you think the red card of the "force cycle" must be, for example would you play a 1RR 4 damage to any target card?
I think the red force would have to be RR for 4 damage, maybe 3. I would only want it if it's playable without pitching anything, and RR for 4 damage would be fine.
The problem with the pitch mode is that you can only use it on your opponent's turn, which means their lands are all open. You can't have any Bolt, Bolt, Fireblast style endings on your turn, where you've bottlenecked your opponent's lands. If you use the pitch spell to set that up around counters, it has to be on your opponent's turn and then you finish on your next one, at which point you're probably just better off casting it outright rather than pitching anything. Of course, you could pitch for the win against anything that doesn't have counters.
The RW canopy is huge. This thread had the discussion with experimental frenzy, light up the stage, and risk factor: do these cards help when burn runs out of gas and loses longer games? My answer, and several others, has always been that card draw makes no sense when you are giving up redundancy by way of removing cards that deal damage. This is definitely a 3-4 of, which will also probably warrant more frequent use of lightning helix to mitigate the damage. However, more important is how it could impact other matchups.
If other fast decks start to incorporate these painlands, they will start taking more damage, which in turn helps burn. I can specifically recall beating Humans in games where they had to start with a horizon canopy and ended up with an effective starting life total of 17.
It's the kind of card draw I was never thinking about, it's stapled as a bonus to something you're already playing by being on a land and that makes it playable. Going out of your way to draw isn't good enough, cutting lands to play cards that draw isn't good enough, but playing a land that draws is good enough.
Sunbaked Canyon feels more than welcome. I'll run 3 of those and I'll be glad to have a natural source of card draw in the deck. It will be very effective for us! Rejoice!
I personally feel it's not. In total you're paying 6 Mana for the 4 damage. Not a great rate and we hardly play let alone flashback bump. Another card I'm personally interested in for my rakdos list is the new ball elemental. Getting damage in and making them discard 2 seems pretty good but not sticking is eh but I live the art too. I just don't know if I want a 3 cost creature that doesn't stick on the board that makes me cry if it gets removed in response but I feel it could be very strong bc of the discard... Probably still a terrible card but just my thoughts. Haha
I think the answer is probably 4, cutting 2 Vantage and 2 fetches.
If you cut fetches, you're trading life loss for life loss. You open yourself up too the new life loss being heavier, but you buy yourself card draw in a place that doesn't require you to alter your game plan.
hierarch
kitesail
both thalias
champion of the parish on turn 2 vast majority of the time
meddling mage
sin collector
knight of autumn
this also means you can hold your searing blaze for mantis riders, reflector mages, etc. Path also matters still because of auriok champion, which is usually a 2 or 3-of in a humans SB. Champion slows the game down to a painful crawl, and I personally like having the out. I have contemplated splitting between path and ensnaring bridge or even engineered explosives. Never tried either, but they certainly have their uses. Then again, if you have a full playset of skullcrack in the 75 that helps too. I might be overthinking.
Think about the top decks in modern right now overall: tron, humans, uw, phoenix. Path is good in all of those matchups, as you have to contend with wurmcoil, various big humans, lyra or baneslayer out of the uw sideboard, and thing/drake. If you hate giving up the land and want to play chained to the rocks, fine I'll give you that. I just think there are too many creatures that have more than three points of toughness that spell "game over." Palm is nice, but my issue with palm is the extra mana plus narrower window of use. I think I've had one big swing from palm ever steal a game.
I think that playing 4 Blazes is correct now, and I'm ok with adding a few extra via Blood to shore up Humans and for the mirror.
I hope the red one in the Force cycle is a Burn spell, but it would need to be absurdly strong to want to discard a red card to cast it. We might be approaching the max number of burn spells in the set and have no chance of PoP, Fireblast, or Flame Rift, anymore.
Tron probably only has one creature on board anyway. Shadow might only have one as well.
Also, you don't have to wait for Modern Horizons for that effect. You can play Liliana's Triumph already.
Sunbaked Canyon
in your opinion how strong do you think the red card of the "force cycle" must be, for example would you play a 1RR 4 damage to any target card?
The problem with the pitch mode is that you can only use it on your opponent's turn, which means their lands are all open. You can't have any Bolt, Bolt, Fireblast style endings on your turn, where you've bottlenecked your opponent's lands. If you use the pitch spell to set that up around counters, it has to be on your opponent's turn and then you finish on your next one, at which point you're probably just better off casting it outright rather than pitching anything. Of course, you could pitch for the win against anything that doesn't have counters.
If other fast decks start to incorporate these painlands, they will start taking more damage, which in turn helps burn. I can specifically recall beating Humans in games where they had to start with a horizon canopy and ended up with an effective starting life total of 17.
Aggro: Naya Burn RWG
Combo: Scapeshift RG
Control: Jeskai Control UWR
Legacy
Control: Miracles UW
Aggro: Burn R
8 fetchlands
2 shocks
3 fast
3 mt
3 canyons
I like having the third basic. If I were to up the canyon count to four I'd drop a fastland. I used to be on ten fetches, four fasts.
If you cut fetches, you're trading life loss for life loss. You open yourself up too the new life loss being heavier, but you buy yourself card draw in a place that doesn't require you to alter your game plan.