I think 3 sweepers is all I would take with me against humans in the sideboard.
Mainboard I already have one big Thalia and I'm always happy when I draw her.
One final question to all of you: Why shefet dunes? I really don't see the upside to give my dudes +1/+1 with sorcery speed. Am I just a noob?^^
I don't get Shefet Dunes either, played 2-3 alongside 1 Scavenger Grounds for a while before getting Canopies, but it didn't really add anything to the deck besides tapping for life or being more suspecible to Blood Moon. I suppose if you play eldrazis the colorless may seem nice, but I see people here playing Dunes without eldrazi too. I suppose it's a budget option? I'd rather just run more plains tbh.
I'm a bit torn on Big Thalia. A lot of people here praise her effectiveness, but in my experience the only times I'm happy to draw her is when I'm already ahead. If my opponent got a board of big bodies she doesn't really do anything, and costs 3 at that. Now, if you can ram her turn 2 I suppose she could cripple manabases just as well as Arbiter, so a GW shell (or 5c humans) may have better use of her, but imo it's too slow in mono-white. The exception is eldrazi-tron. She wrecks eldrazi-tron.
...they can win you games you had no business winning.
This alone makes them worth it. They are also less painful then canopy, work better with Eldrazi and don't need to replace canopy but can be run along side it. I have seen 3-3, 3-2, 2-3 and 2-2 splits with them in MTGO lists.
So, as a complete newbie to this deck, I'm wondering: what would you say is the main difference in performance and feel between the mono white and the Eldrazi version? Eldrazi version is considered a little more competitive, I'm guessing?
Sorry if this gets asked a lot around here, heh.
I don't have much experience with E&T but the most basic difference is E&T has more disruption and better top end but worse land destruction and worse mana base. Mono white has better land destruction, mana base and more flyers. One is not on its own more competitive as all D&T decks are meta decks, so which ever one lets you attack the current meta better is the more competitive one. Currently I think the extra LD is better.
I just played vs 5c humans with a version of WU D&T 2x and went 1-2, 2-1. I have also played a decent amount of the humans list recently myself as well as against it with various colors of D&T. Mind you all, my SB is very spot removal heavy, but I don't find the matchup that much in favor of either side. I haven't played enough vs them yet to give an exact percentage (partly because it seems like a lot of the MODO humans players don't always make the best plays at this point in time so I don't feel good about the data I have), but it feels like it might be 45-55 in their favor g1 and the reverse postboard. The older company versions of humans felt much better vs us than this one because every game that I could grind out that humans list, they'd just find a coco and crush me while still having the possibility of getting a quick kill like the current version does.
Having played with the list and against the list, the part about it that has my interest for us at the moment is the card meddling mage, which I had tested previously, but dismissed. I'm not sure the card does the same thing for us as them in that we don't have team pump effects or the same clock, but I will be testing it again in WU.
When I was testing Trophy Taxes just after AER release I was surprised how often I wouldn't grab crucible on account of a mix of Thalia tax, no GQ in yard, aggro boardstate, etc. Field of Ruin adding another playset of LD that can be activated at low land count looks pretty promising though, so I'm definitely up for some retesting now.
I'll probably run more Etched Champs alongside some Inspectors though, that robot was always pretty clutch for me in those games.
Hey all, I apologize if this has been asked but how do you feel about flagstones in monowhite? Does the arbiter become a problem that often?
I would run canopies but at $80 a piece they are out of my price range.
I play two flagstones and until now no problems appeared.
The flagstones are there to provide some sort of cover against things like smallpox or ponza, to fix the double white if it's necessary and to be broken with GQ in order to improve the late game draws by reducing the quantity of lands that still are in the deck.
I was thinking of running BW eldrazi taxes and was wondering if anyone has any thoughts on using Glint-sleeve Siphoner over Dark Confidant as an alternative card draw option. With the blink it shouldn't be too hard to get enough energy to get multiple draws mid game and it is pretty likely to swing in safely turn 3 thanks to menace against most decks. It also doesn't drain as much and gives better control on when to draw.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I was thinking of running BW eldrazi taxes and was wondering if anyone has any thoughts on using Glint-sleeve Siphoner over Dark Confidant as an alternative card draw option. With the blink it shouldn't be too hard to get enough energy to get multiple draws mid game and it is pretty likely to swing in safely turn 3 thanks to menace against most decks. It also doesn't drain as much and gives better control on when to draw.
Glint-sleeve siphoner is much worse. The two biggest issues are that it does not require an answer from the opponent since it is so slow and it doesn't draw you a card on your next turn (have to wait 2 turns).
Of course then there is the less but still important issues that you are wasting flicker effects on it instead of on more valuable cards and it draws half as many cards. The only benefit is the less life lost and that's minor when you are running them down with reality smashers and or thought-knot seer.
All in all it is very sub optimal unless you have other energy sources. I can definitely see the possibility of it being good in some deck, but not this one.
I was thinking of running BW eldrazi taxes and was wondering if anyone has any thoughts on using Glint-sleeve Siphoner over Dark Confidant as an alternative card draw option. With the blink it shouldn't be too hard to get enough energy to get multiple draws mid game and it is pretty likely to swing in safely turn 3 thanks to menace against most decks. It also doesn't drain as much and gives better control on when to draw.
Glint-sleeve siphoner is much worse. The two biggest issues are that it does not require an answer from the opponent since it is so slow and it doesn't draw you a card on your next turn (have to wait 2 turns).
Of course then there is the less but still important issues that you are wasting flicker effects on it instead of on more valuable cards and it draws half as many cards. The only benefit is the less life lost and that's minor when you are running them down with reality smashers and or thought-knot seer.
All in all it is very sub optimal unless you have other energy sources. I can definitely see the possibility of it being good in some deck, but not this one.
I guess when I was using it I was able to get card draw on turn 3 since it gives you one energy on entry and one on attack. The problem I kept running into was turn 4. Still, you're probably right. Poor gal will have to wait a bit.
Still deciding if I want to run Orzhov Pontiff or Zealous Persecution, though. I guess it depends on if the decks I'm running into aren't impacted by Thalia or not.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
@MilkIsMYPotion I think Choke is the better card for that purpose. Thrun is good no doubt, but I feel it is only good vs Uw and UWr control. It doesn't match up well vs BGx or GDS for example, since their creatures grow bigger and leaves Thrun on perpetual chump blocking duties. It is also hard to fit in mana wise, since it requires 18 green sources to cast on turn 4 or 20 green on turn 6 with regen up.
A better card which suits DnT more is actually Choke. Choke requires fewer green sources (12 green sources on turn 3). Choke is also good vs Uw and UWr, but also excellent vs GDS, merfolk (a premium hate card here) and Storm (fetch version). Plus choke really plays well with the mana denial suite of DnT.
For a better understanding of my thought-process, i'll go into more detail here:
Manabase: This Manabase seem to be much better than BW, another upgrade could be to add a 2nd Horizon Canopy.
I couldn't find a good Manland in white (the only Downside in running Mono-White), so i grab Mutavault.
Thraben Inspector - this one looks great on paper. A potential Turn 1-play, can be vialed in with a single counter, nets cards, can be flickered for value.
8 2-Drops seems solid because Inspector Clueso gives a 2-Mana-Draw, gumming up the turn 2 plays to 12 total.
Thalia, Heretic Cathar is a flex spot. Teh deck is not super-well equipped to fight EldraziTron, so i thought it's better to fill that spot with a Card to fight the Eldrazi's. Could be a Crusader or Finks too.
For the sideboard i sat down and created plans that fit to fight the top-dogs in the Meta: Affinity
I know that this is a atrocious matchup, so i've dedicated plenty of slots for it. I'm not a fan of slamming more and more Stony Silence into my side because they take away slots against other fringe-strategy decks.
Explosives and Stony are a non-bo, but if either one resolves they are devastating. Displacer is a bit slow (maybe i'm wrong here since he can flicker everything), maybe taking out TKS is better. The rest of my cards are basically to chump-block (FAmiliar, Mindcensor), remove (Fragmentize, Settle the Wreckage) or shutting down important cards (Needle, Stony).
None of my Cards is particularly good against fishes. Thalia is easily outclassed and doesn't tax anything important, Arbiter is 2/2 (No real offensive or defensive power) and Blade Splicer shares the same issue. This is the Matchup that i got no idea about, what Cards could break it. Needle shuts down Mutavault (Or Vial at worst), fragmentize hits spreading seas, Engineered Explosives on 2 wipes half there board and Settle means GG.
Eldrazi Tron
A matchup that is not super-common, but i face it regularly.
+1 Needle
+1 Fragmentize
+1 Settle the Wreckage
+1 Aven Mindcensor
-2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
-2 ???
I'm hesitant to put in Stony Silence because Vial is important enough for trying to screw them.
Thalia is a bit underwhelming as it's easily outclassed by giant Spaghetti Monsters and doesn't tax a lot of things.
Discard and plenty of removal are annoying to play against. Therefore i believe a single Aether Vial is ok because it's a horrible topdeck, but great in my opener. Crusader and Finks are hard to come by, RiP shuts there graveyard things down (maybe bring a 2nd copy???) and Purge hits allthere threats.
Cutting Vial means that [card]Flickerwisp[card] becomes worse (Sorcery-Speed flickering is way too predictable and less effective). Big Thalia can tempo them out, but at 3 Mana it's way late i think.
Jund
Basically the same as above, an Engineered Explosives can hit them pretty hard. Pithing Needle is a solution for Liliana, which can be a pain.
My assumption is, that the Value-package is way too slow and mana-intensive to be reliable.
Therefore i cut some pieces, add Purge as removal, Familiar for countering important spells and Finks for lifegain.
There is an argument that Displacer and Wisp flicker Kitchen Finks is too good to stray away from. In my experience Burn has plenty of problems to deal with the deck (Thalia gave Burn-players headaches for days) and my maindeck is already great against them.
Thalia is the biggest shot against them. They can go off with her in play if Baral is on the table, so the Value-package / 3 Drop-Slot is kinda slow to prevent that. Rest in Peace shuts off Past in Flames, Purge exiles Baral / Electromancer, Familiar counters Manamorphose or sth. else.
Mindcensor could be brought against Gifts Ungiven, Explosives as an additional removal.
Engineered Explosives is a flex spot too as 2 colors with only 5 duals is hard to come by. Ratchet Bomb is another offender to fight against Merfolk and Jund / Junk (killing Lingering Souls Tokens).
I think UW is viable in the archetype. In general the idea is to punish the opponent for being too greedy on lands and making their game plan horribly inefficient. The only downside to going any color on the side is that it makes the deck a bit less consistent. I've played legacy D&T and that is how that works at least. Wish we had Stoneforge Mystic as that would really help on some matches even without Umezawa's Jitte.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think UW is viable in the archetype. In general the idea is to punish the opponent for being too greedy on lands and making their game plan horribly inefficient. The only downside to going any color on the side is that it makes the deck a bit less consistent. I've played legacy D&T and that is how that works at least. Wish we had Stoneforge Mystic as that would really help on some matches even without Umezawa's Jitte.
Do you that will be less consistent because of the mana base?
I never play with D&T but I think this deck is very cool!
I want to build a UW D&T because O can use Spell Queller, Meddling Mage, Reflector Mage and counter spell (if counter is q good thing in this type of deck).
I will post my deck list before to get your oppinion.
Thanks!
I think UW is viable in the archetype. In general the idea is to punish the opponent for being too greedy on lands and making their game plan horribly inefficient. The only downside to going any color on the side is that it makes the deck a bit less consistent. I've played legacy D&T and that is how that works at least. Wish we had Stoneforge Mystic as that would really help on some matches even without Umezawa's Jitte.
Do you that will be less consistent because of the mana base?
I never play with D&T but I think this deck is very cool!
I want to build a UW D&T because O can use Spell Queller, Meddling Mage, Reflector Mage and counter spell (if counter is q good thing in this type of deck).
I will post my deck list before to get your oppinion.
Thanks!
Funny you mention it, because that was the other direction I wanted to go with the deck since blue has plenty of good tempo type plays and does provide plenty of looting options to help shore up card draw issues. Mono colored taxes isn't impacted as much by this, but part of the reason you end up needing Dark Confidant or Thraben Inspector in the Eldrazi taxes list is that it's basically a 3 color deck without fetches.
For reference, here is the Legacy version that modern bases it's strategy on...
The important part to take away from the legacy list is that Death and Taxes focuses on 3 things:
1) Land destruction and literally throwing everything one can at your opponent to make their deck less efficient.
2) Creatures as spells. The primary reason is that most effects that "tax" the opponent are symmetrical, so to get around this the deck plays Aether vial.
3) Meta dependent answers. The deck must be tuned to play against the meta you play in. Lots of elf decks? Use Orzhov Pontiff or Merciless Persecution. Lots of creature based value decks that love their Tarmogoyf? Run creatures that trade like Wasteland Strangler and cards like Restoration Angel. Also get Mirran Crusader. Burn? Run Auriok Champion or burrenton forge-tender.
Another point to take into account is that the LD focus varies depending on meta. Sometimes it's a really good strategy and other times it's not as effective. Generally, the land hate works best when dealing with three or four color decks and is less effective if the meta has a lot of two color decks.
In any case, D&T is beloved by a lot of people, including myself, because it feels like playing magic and it's one of the few decks that other modern players enjoy playing against as well.
Basically:
Your typical go big control deck = Steven Seagal using Akido to toss people around.
Your typical modern aggro deck = The cool aid man has broken through the wall and is trying to kill you with a tire iron.
The typical D&T deck = Bruce Campbell reprising his role as Ash from the Evil Dead series and putting together his improvised plan of action once he figures out the situation (and probably got tossed around a bit... maybe a lot).
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Hey everyone, it might seem obvious, but i've just noticed that mirran crusader is now amazing vs merfolk, due to the fact that 1/3 of their creatures is now green. Double strike was a winning point in the past, but i think that now that most lists dont play master of waves, the matchup is now very balanced in my opinion.
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Modern: RBW Mardu Pyro X Eldrazi
Pauper: X Affinity G Stompy
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I'm a bit torn on Big Thalia. A lot of people here praise her effectiveness, but in my experience the only times I'm happy to draw her is when I'm already ahead. If my opponent got a board of big bodies she doesn't really do anything, and costs 3 at that. Now, if you can ram her turn 2 I suppose she could cripple manabases just as well as Arbiter, so a GW shell (or 5c humans) may have better use of her, but imo it's too slow in mono-white. The exception is eldrazi-tron. She wrecks eldrazi-tron.
Legacy: Death'n'Taxes
It is definitely more then "just" a budget option. As you pointed out yourself...
This alone makes them worth it. They are also less painful then canopy, work better with Eldrazi and don't need to replace canopy but can be run along side it. I have seen 3-3, 3-2, 2-3 and 2-2 splits with them in MTGO lists.
I don't have much experience with E&T but the most basic difference is E&T has more disruption and better top end but worse land destruction and worse mana base. Mono white has better land destruction, mana base and more flyers. One is not on its own more competitive as all D&T decks are meta decks, so which ever one lets you attack the current meta better is the more competitive one. Currently I think the extra LD is better.
Having played with the list and against the list, the part about it that has my interest for us at the moment is the card meddling mage, which I had tested previously, but dismissed. I'm not sure the card does the same thing for us as them in that we don't have team pump effects or the same clock, but I will be testing it again in WU.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
When I was testing Trophy Taxes just after AER release I was surprised how often I wouldn't grab crucible on account of a mix of Thalia tax, no GQ in yard, aggro boardstate, etc. Field of Ruin adding another playset of LD that can be activated at low land count looks pretty promising though, so I'm definitely up for some retesting now.
I'll probably run more Etched Champs alongside some Inspectors though, that robot was always pretty clutch for me in those games.
The deck worked surprisingly well (not what I expected). My biggest criticism is that he should have named the deck U/W Strip Club.
Also I wonder if thraben inspector would have been better then judge's familiar.
Trophy Taxes pt. I
Trophy Taxes pt. II
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
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WWCatmix on Youtube
I would run canopies but at $80 a piece they are out of my price range.
I play two flagstones and until now no problems appeared.
The flagstones are there to provide some sort of cover against things like smallpox or ponza, to fix the double white if it's necessary and to be broken with GQ in order to improve the late game draws by reducing the quantity of lands that still are in the deck.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Glint-sleeve siphoner is much worse. The two biggest issues are that it does not require an answer from the opponent since it is so slow and it doesn't draw you a card on your next turn (have to wait 2 turns).
Of course then there is the less but still important issues that you are wasting flicker effects on it instead of on more valuable cards and it draws half as many cards. The only benefit is the less life lost and that's minor when you are running them down with reality smashers and or thought-knot seer.
All in all it is very sub optimal unless you have other energy sources. I can definitely see the possibility of it being good in some deck, but not this one.
I guess when I was using it I was able to get card draw on turn 3 since it gives you one energy on entry and one on attack. The problem I kept running into was turn 4. Still, you're probably right. Poor gal will have to wait a bit.
Still deciding if I want to run Orzhov Pontiff or Zealous Persecution, though. I guess it depends on if the decks I'm running into aren't impacted by Thalia or not.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
A better card which suits DnT more is actually Choke. Choke requires fewer green sources (12 green sources on turn 3). Choke is also good vs Uw and UWr, but also excellent vs GDS, merfolk (a premium hate card here) and Storm (fetch version). Plus choke really plays well with the mana denial suite of DnT.
i've ran BW E&T half a year ago and dropped it finally because the Manabase killed me a couple of times.
I want to take another shot with White Eldrazi and TAxes in december (after GP Madrid) and would like to have your oppinions on my list:
1 horizon canopy
4 eldrazi temple
4 ghost quarter
1 mutavault
4 battlefield forge
6 plains
4 thraben inspector
4 aether vial
4 path to exile
4 leonin arbiter
4 eldrazi displacer
4 flickerwisp
4 blade splicer
1 thalia, heretic cathar
4 thought-knot seer
2 stony silence
2 kitchen finks
2 mirran crusader
2 rest in peace
1 pithing needle
1 settle the wreckage
1 judge's familiar
1 fragmentize
1 celestial purge
1 engineered explosives
1 aven mindcensor
For a better understanding of my thought-process, i'll go into more detail here:
For the sideboard i sat down and created plans that fit to fight the top-dogs in the Meta:
Affinity
I know that this is a atrocious matchup, so i've dedicated plenty of slots for it. I'm not a fan of slamming more and more Stony Silence into my side because they take away slots against other fringe-strategy decks.
+1 fragmentize
+2 stony silence
+1 pithing needle
+1 judge's familia,
+1 settle the wreckage
+1 aven mindcensor
+1 engineered explosives
-4 aether vial
-2 leonin arbiter
-1 thalia, heretic cathar
-1 eldrazi displacer
Explosives and Stony are a non-bo, but if either one resolves they are devastating. Displacer is a bit slow (maybe i'm wrong here since he can flicker everything), maybe taking out TKS is better. The rest of my cards are basically to chump-block (FAmiliar, Mindcensor), remove (Fragmentize, Settle the Wreckage) or shutting down important cards (Needle, Stony).
Merfolk
A deck i commonly ran into.
+1 Settle the Wreckage
+1 Explosives
+1 Needle
+1 Fragmentize
-2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
-1 Leonin Arbiter
-1 Blade Splicer
None of my Cards is particularly good against fishes. Thalia is easily outclassed and doesn't tax anything important, Arbiter is 2/2 (No real offensive or defensive power) and Blade Splicer shares the same issue. This is the Matchup that i got no idea about, what Cards could break it. Needle shuts down Mutavault (Or Vial at worst), fragmentize hits spreading seas, Engineered Explosives on 2 wipes half there board and Settle means GG.
Eldrazi Tron
A matchup that is not super-common, but i face it regularly.
+1 Needle
+1 Fragmentize
+1 Settle the Wreckage
+1 Aven Mindcensor
-2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
-2 ???
I'm hesitant to put in Stony Silence because Vial is important enough for trying to screw them.
Thalia is a bit underwhelming as it's easily outclassed by giant Spaghetti Monsters and doesn't tax a lot of things.
Needle is here for shutting down Karn, Endbringer, Walking Ballista and Collar. Fragmentize for Ratchet Bomb, Collar or Ballista, Settle the Wreckage can be a total Blowout for them. Eldrazi Displacer is the most important thing as it effectivly flickers every dude of them.
Death's Shadow
Annoying Thoughtseize come along there way.
+2 Kitchen Finks
+2 Mirran Crusader
+1 Rest in Peace
+1 Celestial Purge
(+1 Explosives)
-3 Aether Vial
-2 Flickerwisp
-1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Discard and plenty of removal are annoying to play against. Therefore i believe a single Aether Vial is ok because it's a horrible topdeck, but great in my opener. Crusader and Finks are hard to come by, RiP shuts there graveyard things down (maybe bring a 2nd copy???) and Purge hits allthere threats.
Cutting Vial means that [card]Flickerwisp[card] becomes worse (Sorcery-Speed flickering is way too predictable and less effective). Big Thalia can tempo them out, but at 3 Mana it's way late i think.
Jund
Basically the same as above, an Engineered Explosives can hit them pretty hard. Pithing Needle is a solution for Liliana, which can be a pain.
Burn
+1 Judge's Familiar
+2 Kitchen Finks
+1 Celestial Purge
-2 Eldrazi Displacer
-1 Flickerwisp
-1 Blade Splicer
My assumption is, that the Value-package is way too slow and mana-intensive to be reliable.
Therefore i cut some pieces, add Purge as removal, Familiar for countering important spells and Finks for lifegain.
There is an argument that Displacer and Wisp flicker Kitchen Finks is too good to stray away from. In my experience Burn has plenty of problems to deal with the deck (Thalia gave Burn-players headaches for days) and my maindeck is already great against them.
Storm
+1 Familiar
+2 Rest in Peace
+1 Purge
(+1 Explosives)
(+1 Aven Mindcensor)
-2 Blade Splicer
-1 Displacer
-1 Flickerwisp
Thalia is the biggest shot against them. They can go off with her in play if Baral is on the table, so the Value-package / 3 Drop-Slot is kinda slow to prevent that. Rest in Peace shuts off Past in Flames, Purge exiles Baral / Electromancer, Familiar counters Manamorphose or sth. else.
Mindcensor could be brought against Gifts Ungiven, Explosives as an additional removal.
Aven Mindcensor is a flex thing, only really shutting down Gifts, Expedition Map and Chord of Calling.
More likely this will become a Grafdigger's Cage for dealing with Collected Company.
Engineered Explosives is a flex spot too as 2 colors with only 5 duals is hard to come by. Ratchet Bomb is another offender to fight against Merfolk and Jund / Junk (killing Lingering Souls Tokens).
Green @ it's best
What do you think avout UW taxes? Is it a good version of deaths and taxes?
Thanks!
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Do you that will be less consistent because of the mana base?
I never play with D&T but I think this deck is very cool!
I want to build a UW D&T because O can use Spell Queller, Meddling Mage, Reflector Mage and counter spell (if counter is q good thing in this type of deck).
I will post my deck list before to get your oppinion.
Thanks!
Funny you mention it, because that was the other direction I wanted to go with the deck since blue has plenty of good tempo type plays and does provide plenty of looting options to help shore up card draw issues. Mono colored taxes isn't impacted as much by this, but part of the reason you end up needing Dark Confidant or Thraben Inspector in the Eldrazi taxes list is that it's basically a 3 color deck without fetches.
For reference, here is the Legacy version that modern bases it's strategy on...
2 Cavern of Souls
3 Karakas
10 Plains
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
CREATUREs
4 Flickerwisp
2 Mirran Crusader
4 Mother of Runes
3 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Recruiter of the Guard
1 Sanctum Prelate
2 Serra Avenger
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Swords to Plowshares
OTHER SPELLS
4 Aether Vial
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Containment Priest
2 Council's Judgment
1 Dismember
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Faerie Macabre
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Path to Exile
2 Rest in Peace
1 Sanctum Prelate
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
The important part to take away from the legacy list is that Death and Taxes focuses on 3 things:
1) Land destruction and literally throwing everything one can at your opponent to make their deck less efficient.
2) Creatures as spells. The primary reason is that most effects that "tax" the opponent are symmetrical, so to get around this the deck plays Aether vial.
3) Meta dependent answers. The deck must be tuned to play against the meta you play in. Lots of elf decks? Use Orzhov Pontiff or Merciless Persecution. Lots of creature based value decks that love their Tarmogoyf? Run creatures that trade like Wasteland Strangler and cards like Restoration Angel. Also get Mirran Crusader. Burn? Run Auriok Champion or burrenton forge-tender.
Another point to take into account is that the LD focus varies depending on meta. Sometimes it's a really good strategy and other times it's not as effective. Generally, the land hate works best when dealing with three or four color decks and is less effective if the meta has a lot of two color decks.
In any case, D&T is beloved by a lot of people, including myself, because it feels like playing magic and it's one of the few decks that other modern players enjoy playing against as well.
Basically:
Your typical go big control deck = Steven Seagal using Akido to toss people around.
Your typical modern aggro deck = The cool aid man has broken through the wall and is trying to kill you with a tire iron.
The typical D&T deck = Bruce Campbell reprising his role as Ash from the Evil Dead series and putting together his improvised plan of action once he figures out the situation (and probably got tossed around a bit... maybe a lot).
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
RBW Mardu Pyro
X Eldrazi
Pauper:
X Affinity
G Stompy